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Ballot Bowl '08

Aired January 27, 2008 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Welcome back to "Ballot Bowl '08." I'm Jim Acosta standing on the banks of the Mississippi River in front of downtown Memphis. Over the next couple of hours, you're going to hear the candidates in their own words, unfiltered, and unscripted. And while we are standing on the banks of the Mississippi. Barack Obama who is riding a strong current at this hour. But my colleague, Dana Bash, is down in Orlando, Florida, where she is also watching a couple of candidates who are riding waves of their own hoping to make a big splash coming up here on super Tuesday and more importantly on Florida -- in the Florida primary coming up this Tuesday evening. Dana, how are things looking down there?
DANA BASH, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: Well, you're right. Tuesday is the big day here in Florida. It is going to be the primary day for republicans. That is the key focus. That is what we're watching here in Florida. But as you mentioned, Super Tuesday is not that long after. It's February 5th. 24 states, two dozen states will have primaries and caucuses that day. But as you said, what we're trying to do here in "Ballot Bowl" is bring our viewers the candidates themselves as they are speaking to these voters in all of these states and let me tell you the game plan for what we're going to have this hour and then, of course, later over the next two hours.

First of all, Barack Obama. He's speaking in one of those super Tuesday states. He is in Alabama. And also John McCain, he is speaking in Lady's Lake, Florida. That is not too far from where I am here in Orlando. But first, I want to go to Barack Obama who again is speaking in Birmingham, Alabama, a day after his huge, huge win in South Carolina's primary yesterday. Let's listen to Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're going to go after the terrorists. We're going to lock down nuclear weapons but we're also going to lead by helping countries build schools that teach math and science instead of hatred of Americans. We will lead by helping poor countries build a public health infrastructure to deal with HIV AIDS. We are going to lead by bringing an end to the genocide in Darfur because we're not a nation that turns a blind eye to slaughter. We are going to lead by closing Guantanamo and restoring habeas corpus because we're not a nation that locks people up without charging them. That's not who we are.

Ultimately, that's what this election is about is who are we as a people. And for those democrats who are watching this contest for the democratic nomination, who are we as democrats? You know, I started talking about change at the beginning of this campaign. I talked about change when we were up. I talked about change when we were down. This change thing must be catching on because everybody is talking about change now.

Everybody is talking about it. You know, the Clintons are talking about change. Mitt Romney is talking about change. George Bush - he's talking about change. And we're going to change you, George Bush. No Bush. But the question is, who can bring about change? You know, there are some people who throughout this campaign have been saying, look, I know you like Obama's ideas. He may have some good plans. I know that maybe he gives a pretty good speech once in a while. And I know you all like his wife, you know, everybody likes Michelle. But don't be grinning that much, brother.

But here's the argument. The argument is that, you know, he hasn't been in Washington long enough. So and so, we need to season and stew him a little bit longer. We've got to boil all of the hope out of him. And then maybe he'll be ready for president when he sounds just like us. That's what they want. You know, that's what happens. You're in Washington long enough, you just learn certain habits of mind. They start teaching you how to talk like folks in Washington talk.

So, we had a debate in Las Vegas a couple of weeks ago and Tim Russert asked what's your biggest weakness? I thought about it and I said, you know, I'm not very good at managing paper. I'm always losing stuff. Can't find where I put my, you know, so I got to ask somebody around me to help keep track of where I kept my files and my speech and so then they asked Senator Edwards. He says well, my biggest weakness is I'm just so passionate about dealing with poverty so then they asked Senator Clinton and she said, well, I'm just so impatient to help the American people. I'm thinking, well, you know what, can I answer that over again because I thought you all said what your biggest weakness is but I haven't been in Washington long enough so I still think you mean what you say and you say what you mean but I guess that's not how it works in Washington D.C.. Tell the truth. I told you I tell the truth. I haven't been in Washington long enough not to tell the truth.

Yes, we had a debate about social security. And you know, there are a lot of people here who are concerned about social security. People ask me all the time. And so I try to explain to people what's going on. The system is not in immediate crisis but we got a long- term problem because our population is getting older and so you've got the same or fewer workers supporting more retirees. If you don't do anything about it, the benefits are going to start diminishing.

Now, there are three ways we can fix it. You can cut benefits but seniors are already having a tough time. You can raise the retirement age, but if you've been working since you were 15 and you're 67, that's rough. Now, there's a third way we can fix it which would be to raise the cap on the payroll tax. I don't think a lot of people understand that you only pay payroll tax up until you are $97,000 and then you stop paying. So only 4% of the population makes more than $97,000. Most of the people here, for every dollar you earn you pay payroll tax. But if you got a friend like Warren Buffet, he made $46 million last year, he only pays payroll taxes on the first $97,000, and after that he's free and clear. That's not fair. Even Warren Buffet says it's not fair. So what I've said is let's raise the cap. And then people who are well to do can pay a little bit more. Everybody can enjoy social security. Now, the reason I'm telling you this...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: As democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama speaks to voters in the super Tuesday state of Alabama, we're going to bring you back here to where I am in Florida. We're actually going to go to Lady Lake, Florida. That is where republican presidential candidate John McCain is doing what he does virtually in every stop, no matter what state he is in. He is answering questions from voters.

Today, he's actually joined on the stomp by democrat turned independent Senator Joe Lieberman and the Florida Senator Mel Martinez who endorsed John McCain just a couple of days ago. Let's listen to this Q & A session with voters.

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The Iranians continue to pursue the development of nuclear weapons but the problem, the situation, in my view, is if that if we left Iraq and if we had set a date for withdrawal, a date for surrender. Then, I think the whole thing would have collapsed and all of the entire region. When you look at where Iraq is geographically. When you look at the size of it. When you look at everything about it that Iraq remains the central battleground. Joe, what do you...

SEN. JOE LIEBERMAN (IND.): As John said it, Iraq is the essential battleground because we're engaged in really a death struggle with Al Qaeda and Iranian-backed extremists. That's why this man was such a hero in saying to the Secretary of Defense after we had overthrown Saddam Hussein what you're doing is not working and we cannot afford to turn this country over to Al Qaeda and Iran because they will go from there to the next countries in the Middle East and then of course being emboldened to strike us again. Thank god that with this new strategy that John advocated we're doing better. But I want to say, we call Iraq a war. It is a war but it is also the central battleground in a world war and our enemy happens to have headquarters in the mountains between Pakistan and Afghanistan and in Tehran but they're fighting all over. They have attacked in the Middle East, in Africa, in Asia and Latin America and here in the United States. And so I would say to say that they got their headquarters between Pakistan and Afghanistan is the world headquarters but it doesn't deny the reality that the main battleground and the one on which we got them on the run now is Iraq and we better keep them on the run until they're done.

SEN. MEL MARTINEZ (R), FLORIDA: If I may just add that these two gentlemen are as talented as anyone on foreign policy in our nation. But let me just add that these terrorists and Al Qaeda particularly go where there is open ground, where there is ungovernable areas or where there is chaos. If we were to precipitously withdraw from Iraq as Senator Clinton has advocated and as Senator Obama has advocated and frankly even a timetable for withdrawal as Governor Romney has suggested, that would be very dangerous because then Al Qaeda would be emboldened in Iraq where they would have the fertile ground with an ungovernable and a failed state.

This same thing is true in Africa. The same thing is true in parts of Asia. The same thing is true frankly in the tri-border region in Paraguay, Argentina and Brazil and southern hemisphere. The bottom line is that's why we need a man of John McCain's judgment because this is a complicated war. This isn't just one front. We got to be fighting one way in Iraq, another way in Pakistan and Afghanistan and another way in all these other fronts. It requires someone who has been tested, who understands these issues and that's why I trust him with a national security of our country in these very complicated times.

MCCAIN: Thank you. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would like to know can you bring prayer back into our schools again?

MCCAIN: Yes, ma'am. I think it should be voluntary. I've always believed that we should. Yes, ma'am. Could you move right there? Yes. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would like to know how far we can trust the Saudis?

MCCAIN: You know, I think the Saudis are riding a tiger and they can't get off and they can't stay on. They made an alliance with the (Wahabis) in return for their stewardship of the holiest sites in all the world to people who are of the Muslim faith. And I have no doubt - I have no doubt, I have no doubt that some of that $400 billion a year that we are now spending on imported oil that some of that money ends up in the hands of terrorist organizations. I also believe that there is Madrasas, which take these young people off the street and indoctrinate them into this hate filled beliefs that are funded by the Saudis and I also am appalled as you are when we hear that a woman is going to be flogged because of an apparent, of a charge of that she has been raped, I believed was the charge So I think it's very difficult. Joe, do you want to --

LIEBERMAN: Well, I'm supporting you for president because you get to answer the hard questions.

BASH: There you see, really, a key example, a key illustration of what we try to do it and why we try to do it here on "Ballot Bowl" on the weekends. What you're seeing there is John McCain, the republican presidential candidate with two of his colleagues in the Senate who have endorsed him. One the republican senator from the state of Florida and also the democrat turned independent Joe Lieberman from Connecticut. They were answering some tough questions particularly about the war in Iraq. The war that all three senators very much support. A question about why the United States is trying to go after Al Qaeda in Iraq when this voter at least thinks that the focus really should be back in Afghanistan. And you saw the senators trying to answer that voter's question. This is again part of the reason why we try to bring this to you. These candidates, democrats and republicans, on the stomp as they interact with the voters that they are trying very, very hard to sway in order to become the next president of the United States.

Speaking of that, on the other side of the break, we're going to talk about a democratic candidate for president and the fact that he has picked up some very, very important endorsements from a famous name in politics, perhaps one of the most famous names in politics, Kennedy. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Welcome back to CNN's "Ballot Bowl." I'm Dana Bash in Orlando, Florida. Right before the break we were showing you a live event with John McCain. He is joined with two of his Senate colleagues, the republican Senator Mel Martinez from Florida and democrat turned independent who has become John McCain's sidekick on the campaign trail that, of course, is Joe Lieberman. And we're going to continue to monitor that as the men take questions from voters.

Some pretty tough questions in fact. On the other side, we also have, you see, Barack Obama. He is continuing to speak live to voters in the super Tuesday state of Alabama and as we watch and monitor Barack Obama, I want to bring in my colleague, Jim Acosta, who is in Memphis, Tennessee. And Jim, on the issue of Barack Obama, he obviously had a huge win yesterday in South Carolina. And if people this morning perhaps opened up their "New York Times," they saw a pretty interesting name endorsing Barack Obama, didn't they?

ACOSTA: That's correct. Barack Obama almost picked two victories this weekend. You can say winning the South Carolina primary but also in essence winning the Kennedy primary because as we found out this morning in "The New York Times," the daughter of the late president John F. Kennedy, Caroline Kennedy, she has endorsed Barack Obama writing in that piece in "The New York Times" that not since her father has she encountered a politician who can really inspire the American people in the way that Barack Obama does.

And speaking of Kennedys, CNN has learned through various sources that the Senator from Massachusetts, Ted Kennedy, is also about to endorse Barack Obama. So, those are two critical endorsements from the Kennedy clan which should make the state of Massachusetts, which is a super Tuesday state coming up in February, a very important contest in that not only has Ted Kennedy endorsed or has apparently endorsed Barack Obama but Senator John Kerry has also endorsed Barack Obama, which makes for a formidable duo out there on the campaign trail if Barack Obama is going from town to town with those two senators in tow. That's not a bad lineup.

So, yes, I think that Barack Obama is, you know, essentially in the driver's seat in that state if he can ride this momentum coming out of South Carolina and with these endorsements there. Now, Barack Obama was asked about these endorsements earlier today on his campaign plane leaving Georgia heading into Alabama. And here's what the senator from Illinois had to say about the Kennedy endorsement.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: I have had ongoing conversations with Ted since I got into this race. And at the point where he is clear about what he's doing and wants to make it public, I will let Ted Kennedy make it public. Caroline's support and endorsement obviously is an extraordinary honor. I thought the piece she wrote in the "Times" today which I didn't get a chance to see it until last night was deeply moving and gratifying And so for somebody who, I think has been such an important part of our national imagination and who generally shies away from involvement in day-to-day politics, to step out like that is something that I'm very grateful for.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And so while some have compared including Caroline Kennedy, Barack Obama to John F. Kennedy, he's also been compared to Robert Kennedy and we should note that RFK Jr., Robert Kennedy's son has endorsed Hillary Clinton. So, we shouldn't totally put the Obama camp squarely in the Kennedy clan there. So, it's not quite cinch up for Barack Obama there. But speaking of Barack Obama, right now, he is in Alabama campaigning and he has just wrapped up an event there where he's been talking to supporters in that state which is also a key state here in super Tuesday. He's campaigning across what is not just the bible belt but the barbeque belt, hitting Georgia and (inaudible) and also in Birmingham, Alabama.

But we're going to go on a quick break here on "Ballot Bowl." And on the other side of that break, we're going to be going back to hear more from the senator from Arizona, John McCain, who would like to see another primary notch on his belt as he campaigns for votes down in the sunshine state. So, stick with us. This is "Ballot Bowl" on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Welcome back to CNN's "Ballot Bowl." I'm Dana Bash in Orlando, Florida. What we try to do on "Ballot Bowl" is bring you the candidates as they run for president, as they interact with voters in an unscripted way. So, we're going to bring you back to John McCain who is actually right now answering a question from a teacher in Lady Lake, Florida.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So I can put my own daughters through school.

MCCAIN: Let me just say that I thank you. I thank you for your dedication and your involvement in the profession. I would like to mention that Cindy McCain was a teacher of special education when I first knew her and took her from that very honest and decent line of work.

Look, we've got to do everything we can to help you educate your children to get the scholarships and the funding that's necessary. I am a great admirer of the education reform here in the state of Florida. I think that Governor Jeb Bush in the A plus program and now Charlie Crist has really improved things. I think we're seeing competition between schools. I think we're rewarding good teachers and good principals. And I hope they're rewarding you for your wonderful work but we got to make sure that education is available and affordable for all Americans particularly at state institutions. And there are people here who are more familiar with these specifics of the Florida system but I think it's a terrible tragedy in America if someone as dedicated as you are not able to educate their kids but I would also like to finally say choice and competition, charter schools work here. Charter schools work in Arizona. Charter schools are good. Home schooling works in this country. And we can reward good teachers and take no child left behind and we can reauthorize it and we can do a lot of the lessons learned in the state of Florida here.

MARTINEZ: Let me say by the way that I am so proud that you are a teacher in our state and I thank you for doing it as your senator. I'm so proud of the villages for the charter schools that they have here and they're doing a terrific job. You know, I went to Florida State. I had to put myself through school. No one was there to provide me with what I needed. And you know, Bright Futures does do a great deal but of course, the increasing cost of tuition is making it harder each and every year. And I was speaking with the dean of the law school in the law school of Florida State last week. He was telling me that he's holding the legislature given the window to be able to raise tuition so they can stay, you know, with a the competitiveness that they need. But the bottom line is that, you know, we started the lottery to fund education and the fact is that's not the way to fund education.

At the end of the day, we got to make a commitment to quality schools and that includes not only funding but it also includes accountability. So, I thank you for what you're doing. Please stay in teaching. We need someone like you as committed.

LIEBERMAN: Thanks. Your question leads me to say something broader. John was asked before why has his candidacy surged and have momentum. And he says it's because he's told people the truth. And of course, that's part of what is so captivating and inspiring about him. Unfortunately, it's a little bit unusual in our line of work, too, but I would say there's something else here which is experience. You said something before maybe it's not so bad that he doesn't have as much hair as some of the other candidates. You know, he's got experience. He's been through a lot. He's been tested. And here's what I want to say having worked with him in the Senate for 20 years, he wants to get things done and he's learned how to get things done.

Remember when I said when I had the honor to say some opening marks here, there's too much partisanship in Washington. It's stopping our government from working for you, right. This is the man to break through it. And the reason that I say that, you know a lot of candidates can give you a good answer on education or on health care or on any of the other things that you worry about. Tax systems, spending, every day. After it is all said and done, you need to have a president who will pull people in both parties together and say, OK, you're a Democrat. I'm a Republican. But you know what's more important? We're Americans. We have a responsibility to deliver for the American people. John McCain will.

MCCAIN: Thank you.

BASH: There you heard Senator Joe Lieberman campaigning of course there with Senator John McCain who is the candidate for president. Joe Lieberman has run for president before on the Democratic ticket but now he has endorsed a Republican, which is certainly riled some of the members of his former party, the Democratic Party.

You heard them answering a question from a voter on the topic of education, which of course is a big, big issue for voters across the board, Democrats and Republicans. One of the other things that you heard Senator Joe Lieberman mention there is the I-4 corridor. All politics is local. We're in Florida. We want to point out to you why he and others are talking about the I-4 corridor. I'm in Orlando. The I-4 corridor cuts across the state east to west. It goes from Daytona Beach to Tampa. The reason we point this out to you is because this is a key population area and key area that will probably determine how the Republicans -- how they fare in this Republican race.

You talk to any Republican expert on voting here and they say that the primary will likely be won or loss where I am right now, in Orlando. Again, along that I-4 corridor. You saw Senator McCain and his fellow senators campaigning north of the I-4 corridor but he and every other candidate spent a great deal of time where I am.

I want to bring in Mary Snow who has been with Senator McCain throughout the day today. I know that, Mary, you had a chance to speak to someone who has give Senator McCain a boost in his race here in Florida. That's the sitting Governor Charlie Chist. What did he say to you about why he's endorsing Senator McCain?

SNOW: Well you know Dana; he said that he only decided yesterday that he was going to endorse Senator McCain. There was a lot of speculation about who he would back because Rudy Giuliani had been courting him. It was an endorsement that Romney and Mike Huckabee all wanted but Governor Crist said that he spoke to Senator Mel Martinez who endorsed John McCain on Friday and he said that he decided it was his responsibility to back Senator McCain.

He pointed out his leadership and echoed what Senator Lieberman just said there about his integrity. We caught up with him this morning when the two men were campaigning in Tampa, Florida. Here's a little bit about what they had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHARLIE CRIST, (R) FLORIDA: I made the decision yesterday thinking about whom I would vote for personally is what it would come down to. I made that decision this week to vote for Senator McCain and I thought the right thing to do as the governor of this state is to share my thoughts with the people that I serve. I decided to do that last night in my hometown.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: As for what exactly it will mean, the primary is on Tuesday. He plans to campaign with Senator McCain. When asked if he would make commercials or anything like that, he wasn't quite sure because it just happened so quickly. The big question is how much does an endorsement help? He's seen as a very popular governor. Senator McCain obviously welcoming that endorsement and really touting it and as you saw in the event we just heard from, Senator McCain has been touting those endorsements. He's showing support that he has gotten in this race, which is so tight right now.

BASH: Mary, you're absolutely right. Always unclear how much an endorsement means as you said for somebody as popular as Governor Crist it could mean a lot to Senator McCain given the fact that pretty much every Republican candidate campaigning in Florida were eager to have that endorsement. Mary thanks. We'll get back to you in a bit about the race between Senator McCain and his chief rival here in Florida, Mitt Romney. We'll see you in a bit.

Stay with us. On the other side of the break we are going to go back to the Democratic race and talk about Hillary Clinton. She had a big loss yesterday in South Carolina. She's trying to dust herself off and focus on the next contest states particularly the Super Tuesday states. She spoke earlier today in Memphis, Tennessee. We'll bring that to you on the other side of the break. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Back in Memphis, Tennessee. I'm Jim Acosta with BALLOT BOWL 08 covering the Democrats. And Hillary Clinton was in town earlier today addressing supporters at a church here in Memphis. This is the town of Elvis Presley, the king of rock n roll and Hillary Clinton reminded the crowd that no one has been crowned the nominee the Democratic Party in the race for the White House but as you can hear and see, it was a very enthusiastic group of folks there listening to Hillary Clinton. Let's take a listen now to the senator from New York as she tries to pick herself up and dust herself off after what happened in South Carolina. Here's Hillary Clinton.

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Think about Nelson Mandela of whom there are a number of pictures in the pastor's study. One of the most transformative experiences I have had was getting to know him and watch him and listen to him. I helped to lead our delegation to South Africa for his inauguration. I started the morning with vice president and Mrs. Gore at the official presidential residence. It was still in the power of the outgoing regime.

We drove up this long driveway to this stately brick house and had breakfast with those who were peacefully turning over power. Then we went to the inaugural celebration and President Mandela gave a generous and extraordinary set of remarks about how far his country had come and yet what he hoped together could be done going forward. We got back into the car and we drove back to where we had started only this time as we turned into the gate and went down that long driveway on both sides were south Africans dancing and singing, making it clear that this day had been a day of both liberation and reconciliation.

We went into a big tent that had been set up in our absence in the yard. It was filled with VIPs, leaders from around the world. Some of whom are not exactly on the most favored list of our own country. You know, when I used to have to travel in official capacity like that I had to take directions from the state department and they would say for whatever you do, do not get pictured with Fidel Castro. So here I was at the reception before lunch and President Castro was determined to meet me and I was determined to keep moving.

So he would get closer and he was tall so I could see him coming and I would say to whomever I was talking to, I remember speaking to a group of Africa leaders and I felt like I was being rude, I said excuse me, gentlemen, I must leave. I spent an hour dodging Fidel Castro and then we went into the beautiful tent. It was packed with some names of many whom you would recognize. And after lunch President Mandela got up to thank his guests and he said something that I have thought about and meditated on for so many years since. He said he was so proud to welcome all of the dignitaries to the president's home.

But there were three people in particular that he had personally invited, that he wished to thank and wanted them to stand. He proceeded to introduce three of his jailers from Robbins Island. He went on to say that these three men during such times of darkness and despair showed a human connection and kindness that kept him going that reminded him that despite our circumstances there is always an opportunity for us to see one another as fellow human beings.

As he spoke about these three jailers, I could not help but think about those people in our history as a human race who have transcended race and gender and every other category we use to define us and sometimes to divide us. And Dr. King was paramount in my mind then and in my thoughts now. What he did for us was to make it clear that we have no boundaries we cannot the overcome. He recognized as the great Frederick Douglass so memorably enshrined on the north star in the paper he published in upstate New York, right is of no sex and truth is of no color and we are called to go beyond and to understand the essence, the purpose that god has put each of us on this earth to achieve.

ACOSTA: And so that was Hillary Clinton campaigning not too far away from the banks of the Mississippi River where we're standing now in Memphis, Tennessee, trying to encourage the congregation not to get swept away with Obama mania and as you could hear in that address to the Monumental Baptist Church in Memphis really talking about Nelson Mandela and her encounters with historical figures in Africa and essentially telling the crowd there that she's planning to campaign hard for the African-American.

Last night they handed out bumper stickers African-Americans for Hillary. Despite the lopsided loss to Barack Obama, she's not giving up that part of the vote as this race moves forward. We want to take a break on BALLOT BOWL. On the other side of the break there's another former governor from Arkansas who is campaigning out there. It's Mike Huckabee. He's looking for a surprise win in Florida. He probably needs one down there in the sunshine state so we'll hear more from Mike Huckabee coming up after the break here on BALLOT BOWL on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BASH: Welcome back to CNN's BALLOT BOWL. I'm Dana Bash in Orlando, Florida. What we do on BALLOT BOWL is we bring you the viewer as what we as political reporters get to see and hear on the campaign trail as we follow these candidates who want to be your next president around every one of these early contest states. The I'm in Florida because this is a contest state that will have its primary in just 48 hours on Tuesday.

It will be a critical state, a critical test for these Republican candidates, 57 delegates are at stake. That's a huge number for these candidates who have really pretty much split up the delegates as early contests states have gone on. Whether it is Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, but speaking of Iowa, the man who at the beginning came from absolutely nowhere to win Iowa, it was a real upset in Iowa is the former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee.

He was here today in Florida talking about an issue that really does differentiate him from every other candidate in the race even his Republican rivals and that is the issue of the fair tax. His plan to abolish the IRS and replace it with a consumption tax. Let's listen to what he told voters about that idea.

MIKE HUCHABEE, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: All across the country when people hear about the fair tax, they are smart enough to understand that there's a reason why Congress is reluctant to pass the fair tax because it would empower ordinary Americans rather than empower Congress. It would give you a chance to direct where your money goes rather than having somebody in Washington, D.C. figure that out for you.

But what would happen, just think about and imagine, the incredible consequences of seeing $12 trillion of U.S. capital that's currently parked offshore and not doing one thing to help the American economy, imagine what would happen if that $12 trillion came back to the United States and helped to bring jobs to America that we've lost to China. One way to do that is to make the fair tax a reality in the United States of America and I pledge to help make that happen.

My involvement in the fair tax started when I was first launching my campaign. As I was going through Iowa I kept running into people saying are you for the fair tax? I said I don't think taxes ought to be fair, sure. I like a flat tax. That would be a much better proposal than what we have. What about the fair tax? I kept saying, well, I mean I think a flat tax would be more fair than what we have. Finally someone put the book in my hand and said this is the fair tax. I read it. It made so much sense I said nobody from Washington could have had anything to do with this. This is really common sense. I read the book a second time.

By then I said, this is not only the flat tax, but this tax -- this approach to the economy is fair, it's flat, it's family friendly. It does not penalize people for getting married and raising their own kids and believing that mothers and fathers raise better kids than governments do. I wished that I had been smart enough to come up with the concept of the fair tax all my by self. What a lot of the critics don't understand is this is not something that was cooked up by a politician as a campaign theme. It was created by the leading economists of the country. They were commissioned and given several million dollars to study the most efficient, effective and the most productive way to create a system to fund the government that distributed the burden but more importantly that would revive the American economy. And the people who commissioned the fair tax honestly thought that when they got the study back they would see a version of a flat tax. They were surprised when in fact the economists came back and said if you really want to change the future of America and if you want to revive the American economy and keep jobs in this country instead of losing the three million manufacturing jobs that we've lost, here's what we need to do and they proposed a consumption tax and ending all the current taxes on our productivity. It makes sense.

Today what we do is we penalize productivity. The harder you work, the more the government wants out of your paycheck. That's a bad idea. I tell the story that happened to me in Manchester, New Hampshire, a few months ago when I was campaigning and I was visiting a machine shop. In talking to one of the guys who work there, he's a machinist; he says I'm working two shifts here at the machine shop. He said the problem is I'm working this second shift because I'm trying to help my daughter. She's in grad school and it costs $54,000 a year.

My thought was like yours. My second thought was thank you, god that my daughter does not want to go to grad school at Cornell University. And then he said, you know, because I'm working the second shift I'm in a new tax bracket and being in a new tax bracket means instead of paying what I was paying, I'm paying a higher rate and most of what I'm making working the second shift is going to pay the government not to get my daughter through school.

I didn't want to break the news to him that if he saved that money, we would tax the savings. If he invested in the stock market, we would tax his dividends. If he bought and sold something, we would take the capital gain and if the guy got so tired from working so hard he keeled over and died, we would tax him with the inheritance tax. There is no way the poor guy could survive this. I said there's one way you could get your daughter some federal assistance. Quit both shifts and sit at home and watch ESPN every day and if you don't work at all then she would qualify for some federal help.

I've asked people across America can anybody look me in the eye and tell me that that's any sensible way to run a government and I have yet to have the first person say that makes perfect sense to me. It's insanity. The fact is that we can change that.

BASH: That's former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee talking about his plan and his fair tax plan that would abolish the IRS but also talking about his populous message about the plight of the working man and woman and one of the many things that makes Mike Huckabee very, very different from his other Republican rivals in this Republican race for president and we'll see all of the Republican candidates for president on CNN in a very important debate you won't want to miss. That's this coming Wednesday. It will be in California. One of the big Super Tuesday states. That's on Wednesday.

The very next day you will want to tune in for the Democrats. That will be their debate also in the state of California in Los Angeles. Tune in for that next week. Just ahead after the break, we'll have a lot more of CNN's BALLOT BOWL and the candidates running for president. Stay with us.

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ACOSTA: Welcome back to Memphis, Tennessee. I'm Jim Acosta with BALLOT BOWL 08. Coming up in just a few moments we'll have some live events from John McCain and Rudy Giuliani but first we want to take a quick look at the news after this break on BALLOT BOWL here on CNN.

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