Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Newsroom
What Happened to Marvin Driver?; Shooting at Savannah State; 'Greed Is Good' Is Back?
Aired November 21, 2008 - 15:01 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Coming at you right now, unemployment on the rise, the market is in the tank, and we all love to point the finger at those greedy CEOs. But maybe, just maybe, it is time we consider...
MICHAEL DOUGLAS, "GORDON GEKKO": Greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right.
HOLMES: Could he be right?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't like it. And I wish I had known who it was. I probably would have confronted him.
HOLMES: Handing out hate. Is door-to-door the new M.O. of the KKK?
And an evil that has to be eradicated. Not talking about al Qaeda here or the Taliban, talking about pirates on the high seas.
Plus, not so harmonious, a popular dating service forced to help same-sex couples find a match. But hold on, is that fair?
It is lunchtime in Phoenix, 2:00 in Omaha, your comments, unfiltered on Twitter, Facebook, and more like no where else. Your newscast starts right now.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Hey there, everybody. How are you doing? I'm T.J. Holmes, don't adjust your television set, I'm not Rick Sanchez. My man is taking a much-deserved day off. I am going to try to fill the seat. And don't adjust your sets either, no tie thing, John Roberts has started now, I might have to re-knot that during the commercial break.
But we've got a lot of stuff to talk about here today. So hold on to your Twitter boards, we are going to start this morning -- or this afternoon, rather. I'm a morning guy usually on the weekends, so forgive me.
But this afternoon with the story we have been keeping an eye on out of Houston, Texas. This involves a family member of NFL player Donald Driver. Now you might know that name because he is a young man that plays wide receiver for the Green Bay Packers. Well, what has happened? His father now is in the hospital. Father in the hospital Marvin, after an alleged beating at the hands of police.
Now what happened earlier this week. There you see Marvin Driver Jr., again, that is the father of Donald Driver, in the hospital. Ended up in the hospital, in the ICU, actually, after he was allegedly beaten by police. What his family says happened, he was actually pulled over for traffic warrants, for things that had not been resolved.
Well, from some point between him getting in the police cruiser and before he got to the jail, he ended up in this condition. And that is according to his family. Now, a statement has been released by police now and the officers involved in this, we do now know have been put on administrative duty. They have been taken off of the street.
This is the statement we got from the police a short time ago that says following a briefing late Thursday of an internal affairs investigation into this matter, they now have concluded that temporarily, they have reassigned officers B. Guzman, G. Cruz, and M. Marin.
Now I do have those first names, I'll get those for you here in a second. But they have been taken to administrative duties pending the outcome of the investigation. Now Mr. Marvin Driver was arrested, the statement goes on to say, during a traffic stop and placed into custody on outstanding traffic warrants at about 1:30 a.m. on Monday, November 17th.
Mr. Driver was transported to the Southeast Jail where a jail doctor found him to be unresponsive. The doctor advised officers to contact paramedics who then transported him to the hospital. So there is the issue now. People trying to figure out exactly what happened between the time he was put into that police car and the time he got to the jail.
The family alleging that he -- actually, the police stopped and he was beaten. Blunt force trauma is what they are claiming now and that is what doctors, they say, are saying to them. We heard from the family and other representatives a short time ago. Let's take a quick listen to what they had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUANNELL EVANS, FAMILY SPOKESMAN: Chief Harold Hurtt took a positive step in the right direction today by removing those officers from streets. We believe it is in the best interest of this community until the conclusion of this IAD investigation, that these officers not be allowed to patrol this area.
And let me make this very crystal clear the doctors have clearly stated to us that Mr. Driver's injuries are from blunt force trauma.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are.
EVAN: That's what his injuries are from. Not from a slip and fall, not from a diabetic attack, not from him taking drugs and having some comatose-state and hitting the ground, the doctors say that his injuries are from blunt force trauma.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Blunt force trauma, what the family now claiming. And I told you about those officers, do have their names here, Bacilio Guzman, Gilberto Cruz, and Matthew Marin. Those are the three officers involved who have now been taken off patrol duty at least, again, and not suspended right now, they're still getting. But they're taken off patrol and put on administrative duty right now. Let's bring in now Lisa Bloom, a friend of our show here from truTV.
Lisa, how do you explain? I guess, is it going to come down to who saw him and in what condition he got into that police car and how in the world he ended up in the condition, unresponsive, by the time he got to the jail?
LISA BLOOM, HOST, "IN SESSION": Well, this case is going to come down to couple of things. One is the eyewitness. There was an eyewitness at the time that Mr. Driver was picked up by the police, and that is his own brother. And his brother says the police were already acting in a hostile manner towards him, calling him an epithet which I won't repeat on air.
So that's going to be important. And of course, the victim himself has been able to say what happened to him. He says that they took behind a gas station. He wrote this out, by the way, on a paper towel from the hospital. He says they took him behind a gas station, they gave him a liquid, and told him he was going to see Jesus, and he was then beaten.
So that's his story. The police, of course, are denying the assault. But really what this is going to come down to is the medical testimony that the family is saying, because we have a sharp divergence of fact. The family says this man was beaten. The police officers say he had some kind of a medical problem and that's why he went into critical condition.
Well, there is a very clear distinction that medical examiners are going to draw between blunt force trauma and some kind of natural medical problem...
(CROSSTALK)
HOLMES: Essentially, is that a done deal? How do you say this guy had a medical condition, he ends up with blunt force trauma. Is that the case, essentially, against these officers, and if that's proven as blunt force trauma, guilty.
BLOOM: Yes, it's going to be absolutely clear from the medical testimony, there's no two ways about it. I mean, blunt force trauma is going to result in abrasions, contusions, bruising externally and internally if indeed this man was beaten. We are going to see multiple contusions all over his body, not just one incident, as you would see for example, in a slip and fall.
A slip and fall would very rarely result, by the way, in a brain hemorrhage which is the injury that this man has sustained, and him being in critical condition. He is now in good condition, by the way, so he is improving, ultimately should be able to speak further. So that is what this case is going to come down to. I think the facts are going to become very clear in the days to come.
HOLMES: In the days to come, still a lot to come. It sounds like he is doing better already in the hospital. That is good news. We'll have many more details to come. Lisa, we have got to move to a story here out of Savannah State that we got a short time ago. Thank you.
But an update, we had a campus shooting we were reporting about in the last hour. This is at Savannah State University. We do have Loretta Heyward now on the line with us.
Ms. Heyward, we appreciate you giving us some time. For our viewers who did not stick with us the past hour, who may not have known what happened, you tell us, what happened and when it happened down there at your campus?
LORETTA HEYWARD, SAVANNAH STATE UNIVERSITY: Earlier today, we received a report of a campus shooting at one of our residential complexes, University Commons. We know that a student was transported to a local hospital where I am told he is undergoing emergency surgery. Officers from Georgia Bureau of Investigation, Savannah Metro and others are on the scene here at the campus.
HOLMES: What do you know about the alleged shooter? Do you have at shooter running around on your campus?
HEYWARD: I do not believe we have a shooter running around on our campus, but the investigation is ongoing by the officials that I have mentioned.
HOLMES: Well, what are you telling your students right now if in fact the police don't have anyone in custody? You don't know if this person who was doing the shooting possibly a student, someone who came from off the campus, but what are you doing to protect your students?
HEYWARD: Our campus is on lockdown and has been ever since about 12:00 today. That means that nobody comes in and nobody leaves. We are telling our students to remain inside their residential rooms, complexes, with the doors locked, and the same really goes for our employees. They have been given the same instructions.
HOLMES: All right. (INAUDIBLE) again, Loretta Heyward, again, spokesperson for the Savannah State University where they had a school shooting there a little while earlier. Ma'am, we thank you for your time. Thank you for the update.
But again, as we heard there, one student had to go through emergency surgery at the hospital and maybe still going on right now according to Ms. Heyward, but a shooting at a residential complex, don't know right now about a suspect, if that suspect was a student, what this was all about, what the motive was, and if that shooter is still on campus possibly, or has left campus. So that investigation continues right now.
As always, on Rick Sanchez's 3:00 show here, the audience, you all, a big part of this show with your Twitter board. I'm not a Twitter expert, but I have got a crash course in it. So there we go. Going -- some people starting to respond about this. There is one from Ramano: "More school shootings just another reason why the general public does not need guns."
So a debate there that is certainly raised in this country for some time about guns, about who should have them, who shouldn't have them. But that is a debate that will continue to go on. But we are just getting started here, this 3:00 hour.
Coming up here, we have been talking a lot the past few days, few weeks about greed, corporate greed. We see so much, you know, the juxtaposition between Wall Street and Main Street. Oftentimes people pit them against each other, it's one versus the other.
Well, so many CEOs we have seen getting these huge exorbitant salaries while every day Americans are suffering, calling some of those CEOs greedy for what they do. Got a guy coming up who says greed is a good thing. And you know what, you are probably greedy, too. Stay here.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: I had to just be reminded we are going to MySpace now. You all know I am new at this whole thing. I do a little Facebooking, but the Twitter and the MySpace thing, I am new to. But this is what I'm learning about MySpace, getting comments in from folks who are paying attention to the last story we did.
One here from "Afinney (ph)," is it? It says: "When will the use of brutal force by police be a sense of guideline? I can understand brute force when dealing with a violent situation, but with a simple traffic stop? Some restraint by professionals should be a requirement."
Again, that comment from the story about Marvin Driver Jr., the father of Donald Driver, the Green Bay Packers star, father actually ended up in the hospital after that traffic stop. Still trying to figure out right now difference of opinion here between the family and the police officers of what happened to him after he was put in that police cruiser and the time he got to the jail.
He was unresponsive and now in the hospital. So we will get on with that, certainly keep up with that story. Keep your comments coming, again, all over the place, Facebook, MySpace, and Twitter as well.
I want to get to the economy now. How are your finances looking these days, you know? The Dow right there you see on the board, 240 points up, that sounds like a good thing. We will take anything right about now. No reason to pop open the champagne, but still, we will take any upside right about now. The S&P actually we know has hit on its lowest point that we have seen in 11 years. The Dow, Nasdaq closed at their lowest levels, the lowest levels we have seen since 2003. Now you may remember, it was not that long ago the Dow was being celebrated after hitting 14,000, hitting that point for the first time. We are at 7,000-plus now.
So essentially we've lost half of the wealth. Many people out there lost half of their wealth. Well, a big thing going on right now. We have got the $700 million bailout. We all talked about that.
Now it is time to talk about bailing out GM, Chrysler, and Ford. The automakers want a bailout as well. They went up to pretty much -- tin cup in hand is how some people described it on Capitol Hill this week, begging for a bail out of their own. They didn't get it, not yet. They could possibly get it.
There you go, you see a picture of them right here. And you remember, part of this story, a big part of it was that these guys came up begging for $25 billion-plus, they showed up. They didn't fly coach. They didn't take a cab, I am sure, to Capitol Hill.
Corporate jets, folks, that is how they arrived, in their own corporate jets, and they were certainly gotten on to by some members of Congress there. I want to bring in a couple of guests right now. I have got Jeff Rosensweig on set here, an economist from Emory University.
Always good to have you here. Always good to see you. I have watched you a lot, haven't gotten the chance to work with you, but I know you and Rick go round and round and back and forth.
But I also want to bring in, first here, Representative Sander Levin from Michigan. He is on Capitol Hill.
Sir, thank you for being here. They have been given the task. You have given these automakers homework, if you will, for the holiday weekend, or for the holiday week next week, come up with a plan, come up with a package that we know is going to be viable, come up with something that will work, and maybe we will give you the money.
What do you need to see in that homework assignment before you say, OK, we should bail them out?
REP. SANDER LEVIN (D), MICHIGAN: This is a bridge loan really, not a bailout. It is an effort so that they can survive these next months, but we have to see if we give them this money what they would do with it, how they would handle the credit crunch that affects them, but really the global automobile market.
Throughout the world these companies are feeling the pinch of a credit crunch. So they have to show us what they would do with the money and also how they would participate in a discussion, and more than a discussion, action in terms of the long term.
HOLMES: And, sir, even when they show you, what do they need to show? It sounds like you haven't really told them what you want that plan to look like, you just want them to show it to you, but are there some things that need to be in there in your opinion, there are some things that are deal-breakers in your opinion?
LEVIN: Well, there is a short term and a long term. In the short term, they have to show us what they would do with the $25 billion or whatever they drew from it. They would have to show us their assumptions. They would have to show us how much they need and what they would do with it.
In the long term, they would have to sit down and tell us they are going to come up with a plan that addresses the long-term needs as they transform. And they have begun this transformation into a totally modern company with ultimately electric vehicles.
They are now producing hybrids and they are on their way to an electric vehicle, and several of the companies, and the U.S. companies.
HOLMES: All right. Representative Levin, I'm going to have you stand by for here one second, because we are just getting word of something that has really not been a well-kept secret, New York Times now reporting Hillary Rodham Clinton will be Secretary of State Clinton.
Just getting this word, again, this coming to us from The New York Times is that she has in fact accepted the nomination for secretary of state after additional discussions with President-elect Barack Obama about the nature of her role. This being reported by The New York Times, saying it comes from two confidants of Mrs. Clinton, saying it came from those confidants today on this day, and she will actually give up her Senate seat.
Now we have been seeing word and talk about this for the past several days, when this leaked out. She actually has been going through a vetting process, much of that vetting has been about her husband, President Bill Clinton, and his philanthropic work and where -- and a lot of speaking engagements, where his money has been coming from, if you will.
He has agreed to -- he did, he opened up all of his books, if you will, letting himself be vetted. And it appears now at least according to The New York Times she has accepted. Again, this coming to us from The New York Times. She still would have to get approval from the Senate, a Senate that will full of many of her fellow Democrats, as we know, after the election we just saw.
But Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, a lot of debate about, you know, whether or not she would want this position, what it would mean, would she be out there, you know, pushing her own foreign policy, or would she be speaking for Barack Obama. These two, of course, went at it head-to-head despite this Kumbaya moment we're seeing right here.
This was after the primary season, when the two got together for their first big rally, but they did. They had a lot of difference of opinion and it was heated during the primary season, but they kissed and made up. And it now it appears that he is handing her what a lot of people would say a very prestigious position, secretary of state of the United States, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton.
That news coming to us from The New York Times. We will continue to follow that story, bring you any updates as we get them. We will continue here with our discussion about the economy here in just a moment. And talking about greed. You're greedy, I didn't say that, somebody else did. Stick around.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: That's the support I get? The floor director tells me she's highly amused by me today. That's no good. This is actually a part of the show that a lot of people find amusing. This is usually where Rick tells you what the blogs are saying about this program, saying about him, whether it's critics, whether it's compliments, he wants you to know he is actually reading what you have to say.
So we will continue with that for the next week, actually, every day, 3:00 Eastern. I will be right here doing exactly what Rick does. We're not going to change the show much at all. There won't be much Spanish-speaking, because I can't speak a lick. I am going to be reading your blogs and sharing your comments, your criticism of my interviews, they are going to criticize me? I thought we were sticking with Rick.
Me too? OK. My stuff is going to be critiqued. I don't have that thick a skin. You all please be careful, please be nice. I will be joining your conversation on Twitter, MySpace, Facebook, and be sure to check out cnn.com/ricksanchez -- or /rick, actually, for what we'll be doing behind the scenes to keep the program chugging along.
Again, that is /ricksanchez. I am going to keep studying Twitter here. Stick around.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: And there's the young lady who says she was amused by me by the way. We are going to go back to the Twitter board here. We are talking about greed and I have been waiting to say this part for weeks now, Johnny B. Good, show us the screen. He just loves calling you Johnny B. Good, doesn't he?
Well, there it is, this is from 'billbald," actually, who said: "Greed is probably good for the greedy. Not so good for the victims however." "Billbald," thank you for the comment. I am not sure how you are going to feel about it after our next guest possibly says you might be greedy yourself. That next guest I am talking about is Walter E. Williams from George Mason University.
Mr. Williams, thank you for being here with us. I want to go through this again with some of our viewers here talking about the greed. And we just I guess saw another stark illustration of it, if you will, with the CEOs, the General Motors, the Chrysler, Ford guys, they took private jets up to the Capitol Hill and begged for money.
How do you hop off of a private jet and then ask for money? So, sir, you tell me, are we all a bit greedy? WALTER WILLIAMS, GEORGE MASON UNIVERSITY: Well, if you say greed, it means that people want more than they have, well, then, we are all greedy.
HOLMES: We are all greedy!
WILLIAMS: And we are not going to end greed, because greed has been going on since the Garden of Eden. But you know, when you talk about -- before you talk about the CEOs and their salaries, I mean, consider that -- you know, would you say that Oprah Winfrey is greedy?
HOLMES: I am not going to say nothing bad about Oprah.
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: I know you don't want to. But comparing her salary -- I mean, in 2004, she made $260 million, Tiger Woods made $100 million. And it turns out that according to Forbes magazine, the top 10 celebrities and athletes, they earn an average of $116 million. And the top 10 CEOs earned $59 million. So who is the greediest?
HOLMES: So who is the greediest? Let me bring in a guy I certainly would not accuse of being greedy, Jeff Rosensweig from -- economist from Emery University.
You are here, what does -- and he has theory there, and don't go anywhere, Mr. Williams, coming right back to you here. But what role do you think greed is playing in our society? What role has greed played in our whole economic downfall?
JEFF ROSENSWEIG, EMORY UNIVERSITY: Well, interesting in that regard, the auto companies are almost the side show. I was thinking today, recently how many people are hurting, whether they are going to be foreclosed, unemployment rate is going to go up. This week we got bad news about people losing their jobs.
A lot of it goes to the greed of certain people on Wall Street, not all of them. But even compared to what the professor was saying, some hedge fund people have been making $1 billion a year, so Oprah is just out there serving the public.
(LAUGHTER)
ROSENSWEIG: But what are these people doing? A lot of them put a lot of people out of their home, they don't maybe do it explicitly, but their greed has just about put our entire economy in trouble. And of course, we don't buy as many cars if we are losing our jobs. So all of this is cascading down from the greed, really, of very few, putting $300 million at risk.
HOLMES: Now you talk about on a grander scale there. Mr. Williams, just on our day-to-day lives, do we all need to take a good look, we all -- I mean, if you break it down, and there were some things you said here, I mean, about simple things, like, do you really need that microwave, do you really need that dishwasher? I mean, so many things. I have got four phones. People give me a hard time about that all of the time.
But you know, I don't need this stuff, we can get by without. So in a sense are we all guilty of being greedy?
WILLIAMS: Well, I think greed is a poor explanation of human behavior. I mean, for example, I would love to have a Gulfstream jet. They start at $31 million. And I have been trying to be greedy. I go to bed greedy, I dream greedy dreams, I wake up in the morning greedy and proceed through the day greedy, and I still don't have it.
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: I mean, so, what does greed -- OK, so if you hear people talk about, well, we have got to do something about greed, well, what is the policy recommendation? Now, mankind has been -- you know, if you want to use the term greed, he has been greedy all throughout his existence.
And as a matter of fact, I trust greed very much. That is, you have some -- the snow crab, these guys who fish for king crab legs, I mean, they are risking their lives and -- to make sure that Walter Williams has king crab legs. Do you think they are doing that for me because they care about me?
HOLMES: Lord, no, they are trying to make money.
WILLIAMS: Yes, they want more for themselves. And as a matter of fact, that is what makes the world go around, that is people seeking more for themselves. Now, as Professor -- what is it, Rosensweig?
HOLMES: Rosensweig, yes, Jeff sitting here next to me.
WILLIAMS: Well, I mean, if somebody did something illegal, well, then they ought to be arrested, but if people are trying to use legal means to get as much as they can for themselves, I don't see anything wrong with it.
HOLMES: What do you think about that last comment? I think -- yes, you can hear him here, what he is saying.
ROSENSWEIG: One problem is, let's look at this in a bigger context -- snow crabs, people that are losing their homes.
It could be that some things they did were legal, but on the shade of the law.
HOLMES: Yes.
ROSENSWEIG: Some people I respect, for instance, a lot of people who are business leaders -- and most are honest -- say you shouldn't even be in the gray area. Obviously, a lot of these people on the Wall Street were very in the gray area or over the line.
And the bigger context is we needed better reg -- government regulation. In the early 2000, Alan Greenspan at the Federal Reserve -- who was on his own ego trip -- some people in Congress and in the administration let things occur that maybe very greedy people would do -- things right on the edge of being illegal.
But the real point is did that hammer the rest of us?
And it did. So if someone is greedy, it's like go work hard or go start a business and put people to work.
HOLMES: Yes.
ROSENSWEIG: So they can make a profit. That's wonderful. That's what economics is all about and I would agree with Professor Williams on that...
HOLMES: But the...
ROSENSWEIG: But there is greed that puts other people at risk and or that is too close to the line, because there's legal and there's ethical.
HOLMES: Some of those ethical...
WILLIAMS: But, you know, most of...
HOLMES: There it is.
Go ahead. Wrap it up for me there.
WILLIAMS: Most of the big financial problems is caused by government. The Community Reinvestment Act, Fannie Fay and Freddie Mac -- these are -- these are things caused by government and we're asking the government to come help us out. I mean that's like seeing a building on fire and calling the arsonist to help you put it out.
(LAUGHTER)
ROSENSWEIG: There is some truth to that.
HOLMES: There's some truth to that.
Walter Williams at George Mason University.
Sir, good luck getting that jet.
When you get it, let me know, come pick me up and we can head out to Vegas (INAUDIBLE)...
ROSENSWEIG: Just think of what you're doing to the environment.
HOLMES: Oh.
ROSENSWEIG: Think about your carbon footprint.
HOLMES: Why do you have to put a damper on the parade?
Jeff Rosensweig, good to see you, as well. ROSENSWEIG: Good to see you, too.
HOLMES: Thank you, guys.
We will continue here.
Let's go to the board over here. We're talking about Oprah's money. I can't say anything bad about Oprah now. "Oprah's money comes from success."
Yes. MySpace.
What is -- what is that picture over there on the left?
Why don't you just pan over for me a little bit there?
What is that?
That's who sent it?
OK. Again: "Oprah's money comes from success. Their money comes from greed.
When you are cutting jobs and giving yourself a raise and bonus, that is greed."
Let's go right to the left, to the Twitter board now. "The greed you speak of is when one profits at the ruination of others -- failed companies, fired workers and tired taxpayers."
Good point there made, as well, by kill meister (ph) I believe.
All right, thank you all for your comments. Keep them coming. Thank you for having them coming right now.
Stick around with us.
We're going to turn to a story that has taken kind of a nasty turn -- a few hate crimes to keep an eye on around the country.
And one situation, at least, we're keeping an eye on -- you know, all kinds of people knock on your door to solicit you, but knock- knock, it's the KKK?
Stay here.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: OK. That's funny.
All right. "The New York Times" says Clinton has accepted the post of secretary of State.
Whoa, Nellie. A statement now coming to us from Hillary Clinton's office. And let me read this to you. And let me quote. It's a very short statement. Quote: "We are still in discussions, which are very much on track. Any reports beyond that are premature."
"The New York Times" says she's accepted. Hillary Clinton said not so fast.
However, from her statement, it does sound encouraging, at. Least. And things are going in the right direction, but says it's premature, any reports.
But, again, attribute those to "The New York Times," which is saying she has accepted the post.
More to come, I'm sure, on that.
Right now, we want to move on to a couple of disturbing stories we've been keeping an eye on in this country -- a couple out this week.
First, out of Long Island, New York, where police say seven teenaged boys went pretty much on a rampage -- just went out targeting Latinos. And they're all charged now with various crimes, including gang assault. One of the men now accused of murder because he allegedly stabbed an Ecuadorian immigrant this month. That immigrant died.
But again, seven of them altogether. Again, according to police, they just went out to "find Latinos and assault them."
They said they were actively seeking victims. That, again, coming to us out of Long Island.
Another story we're keeping an eye on, out of St.
Mary's, Georgia, where pamphlets have been showing up at people's doors saying the KKK has been sending out flyers, going door-to-door. There's a video of one of them: "White and Proud" -- sending these to people's homes.
Now, police are looking into this and they've already looked into this and say you know what, no crime is actually being committed with these pamphlets, it's a freedom of speech issue. You can throw it out if you want to, but they're not doing anything illegal.
I want to bring in Mark Potok from the Southern Poverty Law Center.
Mr. Potok, thank you for being with us here.
What do you think...
MARK POTOK, SOUTHERN POVERTY LAW CENTER: Thanks for having me.
HOLMES: What do a lot of people think -- but you tell me what you think when you hear that stuff like this is still going on -- and not just going on, but blatantly happening like this?
POTOK: Well, in the case of the Klan leafleting, I mean that is absolutely common. That happens more or less every couple of weeks somewhere in this country.
HOLMES: Is that right?
POTOK: So...
HOLMES: Do you think -- maybe a lot of people would be surprised to hear that. The KKK is out there handing out -- I mean, I don't want to -- you know, yes, I'll call them illegitimate.
POTOK: Yes.
HOLMES: They're handing out stuff like they're a legitimate group, like anybody else that's coming to your door trying to sell you a vacuum cleaner.
POTOK: Yes. I mean you won't quite see them as often as you see the Salvation Army. I mean they're not all over the country. And it's really in particular kinds of communities that you tend to see them.
But, yes, they are out there. They're small. They're weak. They're scattered. And, to a large extent, this is what they really do. But the fact is, is, yes, they leaflet rather frequently.
HOLMES: Do...
POTOK: You know, speaking of the Long Island case I think is an entirely different kind of case.
HOLMES: Now, do we see -- I mean are we seeing more of these?
You said it happens every couple of weeks with something like these
But are we starting to see more of this stuff?
Do we have any evidence that they are growing in numbers, that there is more of an audience and young men out there who -- who want this stuff?
POTOK: I would not say that the Klan per se is growing. But white supremacist groups in general, yes...
HOLMES: OK.
POTOK: Over the last seven or eight years, they've been growing quite a bit.
HOLMES: Growing.
Why?
POTOK: Well, really, the truth is, is that over the last seven years, they've grown entirely on the basis of the immigration issue. In other words, the Klan, neo-Nazi groups and so on, it's that -- you know, they've made a lot of hay out of the idea that these are immigrants with brown skin, people who are coming to destroy our country, you know, to rape our daughters, to bring leprosy to our people and so on. And, you know, basically, it's an issue with a lot of resonance in the public out there and these groups have realized that and taken advantage of it.
HOLMES: And wrap up by giving me your comments. And as you give us these comments, we're going to put up a statement, actually, we got from the Ku Klux Klan, talking about the situation up in Long Island. Again, this is a situation where seven -- well, actually, this situation -- this one comes out of Georgia, actually.
But the Klan is distancing itself from those fliers out of St.
Mary's, Georgia, saying that they're not involved or associated with this literature drive. It says they're also "not involved or associated with any other Klan group or groups. We do not advise them. And they work autonomously from us."
So what does that mean when the Klan is even disowning itself from pamphlets that are being put out?
POTOK: Well, there is no "The Klan."
HOLMES: No?
POTOK: This particular Klan that put out the statements...
HOLMES: Yes?
POTOK: ...was one tiny little group based in Arkansas. It's probably got no more than 10 or 15 people in it. You know, there are 34 named Klan organizations out there. And, you know, many of them are involved in this kind of activity. So there is no central Klan office that speaks for "The Klan."
You know, nevertheless, these groups are growing. They are growing on the basis, as I said, of propaganda against immigrants. And in the end, especially when that propaganda is picked up, makes it into mainstream talk radio, on certain cable television shows and so on, those kinds of venues. It sometimes comes out of the mouths of politicians. It is not a surprise when you get teenagers like the teenagers on Long Island, who went out and allegedly murdered this man.
HOLMES: All right. Well, we wish there's a day, sir, we don't have to have you on to talk about this stuff.
But we appreciate your time. Mark Potok from the Southern Poverty Law Center.
Sir, thank you so much for your time.
POTOK: Thanks for having me.
HOLMES: We will continue here with our -- with our viewers, talking about, you know, trying to fill some cabinet positions. We got word from "The New York Times" that one had been filled, but Hillary Clinton said not so fast. We'll talk about that a little more.
But now, word from "The Wall Street Journal" that Timothy Geithner -- that's his name -- will be nominated to be the new Treasury secretary. This is certainly a very important position right now, a position held by Hank Paulson currently. Much speculation out there about whether or not he would stay on for a while, of course, trying to oversee this whole $700 billion bailout package and where those funds are going to go.
But a lot going on in our economy that needs to be fixed. Paulson is on the job. Timothy Geithner is the name.
We will find out more -- learn more about Timothy Geithner, certainly, in the minutes, the hours, the days, the weeks ahead. And we'll continue to bring that to you.
But we wanted to bring you that bit of news as we got it here.
We're going to take a quick break. We're going to regroup, take a breather.
We'll be right back.
Don't you go anywhere.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: All right.
Have you seen this story this week about eHarmony?
They're expanding. Actually, they're being forced to expand a bit, you might say. You may have heard the popular online dating site was sued by a gay man in New Jersey. He claimed the site discriminated because they wouldn't provide him with a same-sex match.
eHarmony, instead of going through in court with this thing and fighting it, decided to settle and has now agreed to set up Compatible Partners, is the name of it. That's another dating service for same- sex couples.
Now, eHarmony will pay $50,000 to the New Jersey Division on Civil Rights and $5,000 to the man who filed the complaint.
But this opens up a whole new can of worms.
What does this case do now?
What are the possibilities, what other consequences have been created?
Well, there are dating Web sites out there that cater to black people.
Can somebody sue because they can't be matched with a white guy or a white gal? There are dating Web sites for Jewish people.
Can someone be sued because they want to be matched with a Christian or any other religion?
Yes. There are sites out there dedicated to gays and lesbians.
Can a heterosexual now sue those sites for not providing them a straight match?
Beyond that, can you now sue a steak house if they don't have chicken on the menu?
Can a woman who wears a size two sue Lane Bryant because nothing in the store fits her?
Can I sue a Lamborghini dealership because they don't offer an affordable four-door alternative to the Mercialargo (ph)?
Stay tuned.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Karen Daniel is in a hot air balloon thousands of feet in the air above the Arizona desert -- who would have thought?
Certainly not her.
KAREN DANIEL, LOST 200 POUNDS: I was -- I was 67 inches around on my butt and 65 inches tall. So I was two inches wider around than tall. So I think -- oh, I don't know. I think I'd be pretty -- I'd probably feel bad.
GUPTA: Two years ago, her fitness trainer, Bill Crawford, remembers seeing a woman in desperate need of help.
BILL CRAWFORD, TRAINER: When Karen first walked in the door, she weighed 375 pounds and she could barely make it from the car to the front door. And I knew that just making it to the front door of the fitness center, someone that presented like Karen, it was a big deal.
GUPTA: After a strict diet and a grueling workout routine, she's now 200 pounds lighter. And it was time for Karen to live out her dream.
DANIEL: Oh, my God, this is awesome.
GUPTA: And she allowed to us come along for the ride.
DANIEL: It's so...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can't even get a good picture.
DANIEL: It's so neat. It's so -- words can't even describe this.
I dedicated and committed myself that I would change my life. And every ounce of sweat, every ounce of pain, every crying session is worth a hundred times that.
GUPTA: A life-changing adventure in so many ways.
DANIEL: If they came out with a pill today, would I go back in time and take that pill, you know, to lose the weight?
And I honestly don't think I would, because I've learned so much.
GUPTA: Karen hopes to lose 50 more pounds. And when she does, watch out -- she'll be taking to the skies again -- this time in a helicopter.
DANIEL: It's so worth it. So worth it.
GUPTA: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, New York.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: All right. Take a look there. We'll take it -- up 35 points now, the Dow. That is good news, possibly. We see a lot happen in the last hour, oftentimes, on the trading day. And we are in that last hour.
Could we possibly break back into the 8000 territory?
We shall see. Closing here in about 10 minutes.
Let's go back to the Twitter board over here.
Somebody -- yes, Johnny B. Good -- I've been waiting to say that.
Johnny, do you even like that?
No, not really.
Johnny doesn't even like that.
OK. Well, Johnny, thank you.
We're taking a look here at bethbangert, who is showing us here -- she's talking about the Dow, talking about the economic situation we were talking about with our guests earlier. She says: "I am getting dizzy watching the Dow go up, then down, then up, then down. Whew."
We feel you, Beth.
We will turn to another topic here. You've been hearing a lot about pirates. And we're not talking about Johnny Depp type characters. We're talking about the nasty guys off the coast of Africa, the Horn of Africa, over in Somalia now. They've been holding the latest right now we know of is a Saudi-owned tanker. A hundred million dollars worth of oil on this thing being held right now, offering -- or asking for a ransom, these pirates are.
Now, these pirates have actually seized some 90 plus -- or attacked at least 90 plus vessels over the past 12 months, do have about 17 right now that they're still holding.
Our David McKenzie has an interview now with a man who was actually held captive by pirates for over 100 days. This is an look into the behind-the-scenes of what really goes on.
Let's take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So what was it like?
Tell me what happened when you were hijacked.
THUMANI SAID, KENYAN SEAMAN: It was about 7:30 evening time. I was asleep and waiting on stand-by. Then I heard shouting: "Stop, stop, stop, stop." I opened my eyes. I was at gunpointed. "Want money, money, money," sounding. Tell me, "Money, money, money."
OK. I opened my cupboard. When I opened my cupboard, they snatched my wallet. They found some about -- Kenyan shilling, about 4,000, 5,000. They took it. My passport, my watch, they take it.
MCKENZIE: What was it like for you?
Were you afraid when the pirates...
SAID: I was afraid. I was afraid. At a gunpoint not a good position -- with an AK-47 rifle.
So they say if the company bring money, (INAUDIBLE) now. But now stay here until forever. They speak like that.
Up until now, they are still there. They're not -- we are going to Somali, but not (INAUDIBLE). Yes, yes. Every time (INAUDIBLE) -- another ship is captured by pirates every day, because I do it for the money. I have no other job, so the only job I know is this job. So I can work only on this job. And even if I get another job, I can work, but it's not possible to get.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
HOLMES: So one of the lucky ones there.
We'll keep you updated on that latest situation with that Saudi- owned vessel.
We showed you a lot this week. And today, we're going to show you next what we didn't get a chance to show you.
Stick around for that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) SANCHEZ: All right. Time for to us check in with the man, Wolf Blitzer.
He's standing by -- a show coming up at the top of the hour -- Wolf, good to see you, sir.
Are you going to be talking about this Hillary, is she or is she not and all this good stuff?
WOLF BLITZER, HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": Yes. We've got a lot of breaking news coming up at the top of the hour.
Barack Obama's cabinet -- it seems to be getting into shape -- Hillary Clinton, Bill Richardson, perhaps. Also, there might finally be a pick for Treasury secretary.
And you'll also see the markets that are already reacting to all of this. We have live coverage from the best political team on television here in Washington and Chicago. All the angles of this developing story as you only can see them on CNN.
Plus, financial adviser Suze Orman, she's standing by to join us live with some clear advice on what you should be doing as these markets go through a roller coaster. She's going to tell us who's most likely to get laid off, which types of jobs, right now, are the safest.
And John McCain like you rarely see him -- our own Dana Bash getting ready to give us a behind-the-scenes look at his first week back on Capitol Hill.
All that and a lot more coming up right here in "THE SITUATION ROOM."
HOLMES: All right. And The Mac just keeps coming back.
Wolf Blitzer, we'll see you at the top of the hour.
Thank you so much, sir.
And stay here. A lot of stuff we did today -- all week. We'll show what you will we missed.
Also, the closing bell.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How much money do you need...
HOLMES (voice-over): Bailout, pleas and al Qaeda guys talking terror, American churches and their less than churchy messages -- Rick's show had so much ground to cover this week, but just an hour a day?
There's no way he had time to bring you everything happening in the world.
Like Senator Ted Kennedy -- he actually went back to work this week.
He looks pretty good, doesn't he?
He says he feels on top of his game and ready to fight.
Guantanamo Bay -- five men, all from Algeria, will be free again after nearly seven years locked up. A judge says there's not enough evidence to prove they're "enemy combatants."
And so you missed seeing Bolivian President Evo Morales on Rick's show.
How do we know you missed it?
Because he wasn't there.
We had him booked, Rick promoted the guy for two days. Then, President Morales canceled five minutes before show time.
Thanks, Mr. President.
But still, the invitation is open.
Also, fellows, Madonna soon to be single again. She and her movie Guy husband received a preliminary decree of divorce from a British court. Sorry, we failed to cover this big breaking news story adequately.
And watch this. No, this is not a Madonna concert. It's not her divorce celebration, either. It's the grand opening of some fancy pants resort in Dubai. The party costs $20 million -- the fireworks visible from space. No need for a bailout in the fancy pants resort industry.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
HOLMES: The closing bell. We're out of time -- hey, Susan.
(STOCK MARKET REPORT)
HOLMES: We'll head over to Wolf Blitzer now.
He's going to have a whole lot more on that cabinet being filled out -- Wolf.
