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Terror in Mumbai; Iraq-U.S. Security Pact
Aired November 27, 2008 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: And good day, everyone. It is 12:00 noon in the eastern United States, 10:30 p.m. in Mumbai, India.
I'm Tony Harris. And you are in the CNN NEWSROOM.
It is a fluid situation in Mumbai, India, this hour. New explosions and more gunfire. The terrorist siege of Mumbai is not -- is not over. Here is what we know.
At least 125 people have been killed in 10 separate and well- coordinated attacks on popular spots for westerners. At least 327 people are hurt. Reports indicate as many as 50 people are being held hostage. World leaders are condemning the attacks. India's prime minister promises to find those responsible.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MANMOHAN SINGH, INDIA PRIME MINISTER: We will go after these individuals and organizations and make sure that every perpetrator, organizer and supporter of terror, whatever his affiliation or religion may be, pays a heavy price for these cowardly and horrific acts against our people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: These terrorist attacks took place in several locations. The targets stretch across Mumbai's southern peninsula, from a hospital and train station in the north, to a cluster of restaurants to the south, and upscale hotels on the east and west coasts. Witnesses say the attackers were armed with assault rifles, hand grenades and explosives.
CNN's team is all over this story. Sara Sidner is outside the Taj Hotel. Andrew Stevens is at the Oberoi. We also have correspondents and analysts in London, New York and Washington. Our Ed Henry is checking in with the Obama camp in Chicago.
On the phone with me right now is Anthony Rose. He is an Australian film director who was forced to flee the Oberoi Hotel when the first blast went off.
And Anthony, thanks for your time. If you would, turn back the hands of time for a moment and take us back to those terrifying first moments, and describe the situation, if you would, please.
ANTHONY ROSE, AUSTRALIAN FILM DIRECTOR: About 10:00 last night, I checked into my hotel, and basically the -- I walked upstairs to the third floor, and no sooner had I stepped into a restaurant to have a meeting, then gunshots started erupting all in the lobby, and apparently they were shooting people there, very much execution-style. One Australian guy was executed, shot in the leg first, and then shot in the head.
We heard the gunshots, they came closer to us, started barricading the door. Gunshots shattered part of the door, and then we kind of were moving all our crew back through various ballrooms to try to barricade ourselves in. They were using hand grenades to try to blow in doors, and then they seemed to retreat from that, and in other areas of the hotel you could hear people, it seemed like, being dragged up to the roof of the hotel.
HARRIS: I believe we just lost Anthony as he was describing the situation that he went through last night, and he is on his way out of the area right now. And pardon me for just a moment as you're watching.
Kelly (ph), give me a little guidance. Should we go with this story now?
All right.
We are just getting wire reports, and can you not believe what I'm about to report to you. We are just getting wire reports that an Air France A-320 passenger jet on a training flight -- thank you, Kelly (ph) -- has crashed in the Mediterranean with five people on board just off the coast of France right now.
We have no word on the condition of the people who were onboard this plane, this jet, but according to the AFP news source, the news wire, AFP, an Air France 320 jet on a training mission, I understand, has crashed into the Mediterranean. Five people on board. No word yet on their conditions.
We are working to get additional information. You cannot believe this additional story when you factor in what is happening on the ground now in Mumbai. We will work to continue to get more information on that.
And now let's get to our Andrew Stevens as we continue to cover the story of the siege in Mumbai. And Andrew Stevens is just outside of the five-star Oberoi Hotel.
Where, Andrew, I believe there is a fire still burning there. Is that correct?
ANDREW STEVENS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: From where we are, where the media is at the moment, Tony, we can't actually see that fire. But there's certainly no smoke in the air around the hotel, which would obviously (INAUDIBLE), compared with the Taj last night, which was well and surely ablaze on the upper floors.
There was an explosion several hours ago, and there was -- there were pictures on local media showing flames shooting out of a couple eof the lower floor windows, the fourth floor, I believe. But again, we are scooted (ph) out where we are here. But it doesn't appear at this stage to be a significant fire, if there is a fire at all.
But what I can tell you is that we are still awaiting the outcome of this hostage crisis. There are people still in the hotel. Again, very difficult to get proper numbers here. Getting a lot of conflicting reports.
The consensus seems to be that about 30 people are still inside of that hotel. There are gunmen in there as well. The military is in there.
I have been told by one local journalist here that she's been hearing there could be news of a conclusion fairly soon. But that was just from one person who heard from a source in her contact.
So it's very difficult to ascertain exactly what's going on. But certainly, I heard an explosion about -- probably about 10 minutes ago, quite a small explosion. It looked like it came from near the ground floor of the hotel. But again, very difficult to know exactly what's going on -- Tony.
HARRIS: And Andrew, as we speak with you, I just want to remind the people viewing at home, you are clearly looking at pictures from earlier in the day. It is 10:30 -- just past 10:30 p.m. in the evening in Mumbai right now.
And Andrew, I guess my next question to you is, since it is so difficult to get information right now, it's a similar situation for Sara Sidner outside of the Taj Hotel, if you would, please, would you describe the scene? What is happening in front of, around the Oberoi, as you see it now?
STEVENS: The Oberoi Hotel is about 200 meters away from where I'm standing. It's being cordoned off. There's a lot of contingence of press here. There's an even bigger number of onlookers.
As I look down, I see a number of rapid response vehicles filled with people. Several army buses, fire trucks and ambulances as well. Looking further down the road, I see military figures adopting -- they're fairly lax, I'd have to say. There doesn't seem to be activity going on. It really is -- there's a big scrum of people about 200 meters away, in front of the emergency trucks, and we are waiting.
Every now and then there's a ripple through the crowd. About four or five hours ago, huge cheering broke out when commandos came through, heavily-armed commandos came through the crowd on their way down to the Oberoi. It brought a lot of cheers here.
I've been speaking to people, Tony, who have people -- who have friends or relatives still inside the hotel, and hearing some pretty horrific stories like we heard from that Australian director. One lady I spoke to said she was in a restaurant with her husband, the gunmen came in one end of the restaurant, but she managed to get out the other end with about 30 other people.
They were chased up the stairs, shots of fire. And an old man running next to her fell down. She thought he'd been killed. She didn't stop to look.
She said absolute panic. She managed to hide on a balcony for about four hours, and managed to get her way out. But she was separated from her husband during that time, and her husband is still in there, and she's had no contact with her husband at all. But there's a lot of people down here whose family and friends still in this hotel, and just getting no word. And it's just very difficult for them as well to get any information about what's going on in there at the moment.
HARRIS: My goodness.
Terrific reporting from Andrew Stevens.
Andrew, we appreciate it. Thank you so much.
For the Bush administration's reaction to the events in Mumbai, we go to Brianna Keilar. She is at the White House.
And Brianna, what have we heard from the Bush administration?
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, President Bush was on the phone this morning with the Indian Prime Minister Manmohon Singh expressing his condolences, but also offering U.S. assistance in not only restoring order, but also in investigating these attacks. President Bush is not here at the White House today. He's at Camp David for the Thanksgiving holiday with family and friends, but it's turned into a bit of a working holiday, of course.
He's keeping an eye on what's going on in India. And according to the White House, he's been receiving regular updates as this story continues to develop.
The White House said that last night, a number of officials in the Bush administration from different areas of the administration convened to discuss what is going on in India. This included the president's top national security advisers, the National Security Council, as well as counterterrorism and intelligence officials, and officials from the State Department and the Defense Department -- Tony.
HARRIS: All right. Brianna Keilar for us at the White House.
Brianna, appreciate it. Thank you.
President-elect Barack Obama is watching the situation in India from his home in Chicago, where he and his family are celebrating Thanksgiving.
Let's get to our White House Correspondent Ed Henry, who is with the transition team.
And Ed, let's circle through some of this information. What's been the reaction from the president-elect?
ED HENRY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Tony, I think Brianna put it well, a working holiday for President Bush. The same for the president-elect.
HARRIS: Yes.
HENRY: He had gone to a local church here yesterday in Chicago with his family to hand out Thanksgiving meals. He was planning to just have a quiet day at his residence here for Thanksgiving with family and friends today. But since yesterday afternoon, and through today, we're told he's getting up-to-the-minute briefings as often as he can from his national security staff to keep on top of the situation, and it's important to note a lot of that information, of course, is coming from the Bush administration. In fact, directly from Secretary of State Condoleezza rice.
She had a phone call last night with Barack Obama to try and keep him in the loop. We're seeing coordination, communication on this national security crisis just as we've seen on the financial security crisis in recent weeks as well.
A statement was put out not by Barack Obama himself, but his chief national security spokeswoman last evening. Brooke Anderson said the following: "These coordinated attacks on innocent civilians demonstrate the grave and urgent threat of terrorism. The United States must continue to strengthen our partnerships with India and nations around the world to root out and destroy terrorist networks. We stand with the people of India, whose democracy will prove far more resilient than the hateful ideology that led to these attacks."
Obviously, all week we've been covering here in Chicago the economic team's rollout from the Barack Obama transition. Next week they're supposed to do the national security team rollout. Obviously, these dramatic events that we're seeing, the horrific images that are playing out here on CNN, a stark reminder of the many security challenges ahead for this incoming president -- Tony.
HARRIS: You said it. All right.
Ed Henry for us this morning from Chicago.
Ed, appreciate it. Thank you.
And our Sara Sidner has been outside the Taj Hotel for several hours now.
Sara, if you would, I'm wondering if you're -- and we talked about it just a moment ago -- if you're receiving any kind of information that you would consider reliable from authorities or someone as to where we are in this siege/standoff?
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You'd be surprised. The only person that we're getting information from, frankly, Tony, is a woman from Chicago who happens to be holed up in her room with her husband, her best friend, and her brother-in-law, who are next door, and that's where we're getting some of our information at this point, frankly, because we're not getting it from authorities.
Obviously, they have a job to do, and we have to give them a break on that. They do have a very important job to do. But again, there are people outside of this hotel who want to know what's happening with their family members. Obviously, there are consulates across the world wanting to know whether some of the members of their countries are stuck in these hotels and what they need to do to assure their family members that they're OK.
But the latest thing that's happened here is that fire has erupted once again. And that obviously poses a major threat to anyone's health and well-being. If you're locked up in your room and there's smoke coming in, you have to make a decision as to whether or not you leave your room and face terrorists, possibly, or you stay and deal with the smoke and smoke inhalation.
It really is a nasty situation still going on here, and it has now been just over 24 hours that these people who have been holed up in their rooms or that possible hostages have been taken. Twenty-four hours ago, just around this time, this hotel was taken by storm by men with AK-47s and grenades -- Tony.
HARRIS: Wow. All right. Sara Sidner for us.
Sara, appreciate it. Thank you.
And probably in part due to the work of Sara Sidner, joining me on the phone right now is a woman who was having dinner with her husband inside the Taj Hotel when the terrorists struck. After six hours locked up, they both managed to get out by breaking a window. And she -- and this will make sense to all of you watching -- she not giving her name because she wants to remain anonymous.
To you on the phone, how are you now? And I'm assuming that you're in a safe place now?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm in a really safe place. I'm home, and I'm absolutely fine now.
HARRIS: OK. Great.
If you would, take us back, oh, close to 24 hours ago now, and would you describe this scene, the events of this attack as it unfolded, as you were having dinner inside the Taj with your husband?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Actually, we had almost finished around 9:30. And we were meeting some people, and then at that time we were on our own at 9:30, and my husband just got up to go to bathroom, and I heard -- a big noise outside the restaurant lounge.
And I couldn't understand why there was so much noise. And five minutes later, just as he returned, there was a -- you could make out that there was fighting happening in the hotel. And we naturally started moving, you know, backwards, because the lounge has glass doors, and it felt very unsafe to just sit right there opposite the doors.
And as we moved backwards, we could see -- we could hear -- not see anything, but we could hear the sound coming closer and closer, and we couldn't really understand (INAUDIBLE) where they were hiding (ph) from. But I personally felt that they were right in the (INAUDIBLE) outside of restaurant (INAUDIBLE).
And so then we realized that, and we wanted to get out. And there are no other exits, except one which was blocked. And I guess we -- from there we managed to go into a smaller room where we were waiting.
HARRIS: Tell me about the decision to kick out a window and get out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Actually, this happened about six hours later. And practically, there was no other choice that we had. It was the wisest thing that could have been done, because we could hear firing and shooting all around us.
We were in this room which was closed on all sides, and there were a few of us, quite a few of us, and including some of the hotel staff, which was extremely helpful. And some people realized that the dome in the Taj Hotel had caught fire.
So we were not very far from the dome, and we also saw, you know, some of those ashes, and we could see flames coming -- you know, we could see just coming towards us. So on one side we had fire going on.
Sorry?
HARRIS: I'm just sort of curious, what are your thoughts now as you take in the entire scope of this attack?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Frankly, I did not realize the enormity of what was happening yesterday. I think I am realizing it today much more, after I'm seeing everything and I'm watching everything, because yesterday we kept hearing that the army is coming in, and, you know, commandos are coming in.
So I thought that the situation would get under control. And it's really now that I'm realizing what we really escaped. And, I mean, we didn't really have much of a choice.
There was fighting happening on one side. There was water dripping because some part of the ceiling had caved in, so there was water on the other side. And the third side, there were flames coming in.
So we had to -- that was our only sensible way. The people with us had a lot of presence of mind. They broke the windows with the chairs, and luckily the fire brigades also came on time. And we were rescued by them and we got down the ladders, and just in time.
HARRIS: One final question. One final question. How inconceivable is it for you to think of yourself one moment sitting in a restaurant having a wonderful dinner, in a beautiful hotel, with your husband, and the next moment, there are rockets, you've got bullets.
Is it inconceivable to you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely. I mean, something that we have practically grown up coming to these places, that we spend all our special occasions in these hotels, and it's just absolutely devastating to even -- like even now I think understand how anyone (ph) lives with this. And I think it's the biggest thing that's happened not only -- I mean, (INAUDIBLE), I would say in the world, because this continuity of attack which is going on, and people are still being unsafe, I think it's the first time that it's happened.
HARRIS: Well, thank you so much for your time. Thank you so much for your time.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
HARRIS: And we are so happy that you and your husband are safe.
We've been speaking to a woman who was inside the Taj Hotel having dinner in a restaurant in that hotel with her husband when the attack began. She and her husband were able to kick out a window and escape.
What a news day. I want to update the other bit of breaking news for you this hour.
This is an Air New Zealand jet. All right. Let's correct a little and give you the very latest.
Just a few minutes ago we were telling you that an Air France passenger jet had gone down in the Mediterranean. Our understanding now -- and these stories -- as the developments come in, these stories often change -- that this was, in fact, an Air New Zealand.
Is that -- is that the best, the latest information that we have?
OK.
An Air New Zealand passenger jet has gone down in -- and this is -- this is the model of the jet. Certainly a file photograph, not the actual -- yes, debris has been found on the water in the Mediterranean.
An Air New Zealand jet. I believe this is the 320 passenger -- A-320 passenger jet has gone down in the Mediterranean. Debris has been spotted. Our understanding now, that seven -- there were actually seven on board. Five to seven on board.
We are going to work to get the very latest information on this and bring you an update in a moment.
We're back in just a moment. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Fire, explosions and gun battles. It is day two of a terrorist siege on India's commercial capital, Mumbai. Here's what we know.
At least 125 people have been killed in 10 separate attacks on popular spots for westerners. Britain confirms at least one of its citizens is among the dead. At least 327 people are hurt. As many as 50 people are being held hostage. One family tells CNN they've been holed up in their room at the Taj Hotel for several hours.
President Bush and President-elect Barack Obama are among a chorus of world leaders condemning the attacks. India's prime minister headed to Mumbai, promising to find and punish those responsible.
A significant development. Iraqi lawmakers say yes to a U.S./Iraq security pact. Under the deal, U.S. forces will withdrawal from Iraq by January 1, 2012.
CNN's Arwa Damon is live in Baghdad.
And Arwa, this is a very significant development.
ARWA DAMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It most definitely is, Tony. That agreement passing. Despite the opposition chanting, "No! No" in parliament, undoubtedly a very hard one moment for Iraq.
Under this agreement, the security portfolio is effectively handed over to the Iraqis and the Iraqi government. Under the agreement, the U.S. military's role here is greatly restricted.
The military no longer has a right to conduct operations unless approved by the Iraqis. They can no longer detain individuals unless they have an arrest warrant, and they can no longer hold detainees in the U.S. military facility for more than 24 hours.
Here's what's interesting, though, is that that was actually part of the problem. The Sunnis, who were opposing not the agreement, but what they were opposing was handing over that much power to the predominantly Shia government.
We have heard a lot of talk about concerns that the Iraqi prime minister has been acting unilaterally. There were a lot of fears not just from the Sunnis, but from some of the other political blocs that that abuse of power would only increase as the U.S. military's roles decrease. So today, not only did they pass the security agreement, but they also passed what they're calling a political reform agreement. Essentially, it guarantees power sharing, trying to diminish what they fear could be power abuse by the Shia government.
Most definitely, it was a challenge. There were last-minute negotiations taking place. I saw copies of the bill being run back and forth moments before parliament went into session. But what is really going to be challenging, and the true test, is going to come once that security agreement goes into effect in just over a month -- Tony.
HARRIS: OK. Arwa Damon for us in Baghdad.
Arwa, appreciate it. Thank you.
Anti-government protests in Thailand come to a head, and actually could come to a head pretty soon here. Thousands of protesters -- take a look at the latest pictures -- occupy Bangkok's two main airports. The Thai parliament went into emergency session today and declared a state of emergency. Thailand's prime minister says police and military personnel will begin clearing the airports. No word when, though. Demonstrators say the prime minister is a puppet for the former Thai leader who was convicted of corruption. They want him to resign.
About 11:00 in the evening in Mumbai right now. Let's give you a look at some of the latest pictures that we have and the latest on this story.
The siege of Mumbai continues. The latest, at least 125 people known killed in 10 separate attacks on popular spots. Four westerners, at least 327 people injured.
We will update this story with the latest, best information that we have in just a moment.
You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
YASMIN WONG, CNN EMPLOYEE, MUMBAI (on phone): There's smoke everywhere and the only option I have is to run down this atrium where I guess a lot of the gunfire had gone on, and I passed bodies people with bullet wounds and I guess an old man had passed out from the flames. It was just like something out of a movie. I don't think you ever imagine anything like that to happen. I guess the main thing is I thought it was going to end, and it just never ended.
HARRIS: The terrorist siege of Mumbai is nearly 24 hours old. There have been more explosions and gunfire and a third fire has broken out at the Taj Hotel. Here is what we know. At least 125 people have been killed in 10 separate and well-coordinated attacks. Most of those attacks on spots popular with Westerners. At least 327 people are hurt. Reports indicate as many as 50 people are being held hostage. World leaders are condemning the attacks. India's prime minister is promising to find those responsible.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MANMOHAN SINGH, INDIAN PRIME MINISTER: We will go to these individuals and organizations and make sure that every perpetrator, organizer and supporter of terror, whatever his affiliation or religion may be, there is a heavy price of these cowardly and horrific acts against our people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Several CNN employees were attending a sales meeting in inside the Taj Hotel when the terrorists struck. Here's how they described the assault.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SONALI CHATTERJEE, CNN SALES DIRECTOR: One explosion practically knocked me off my feet, the first big one. And that's when I started to feel there was an explosion on the roof. I got a phone call, and I decided -- everything shook. So that was very, very scary.
WILLIAM HSU, CNN AD SALES: Someone from the outside saw that the fire was very near our room, and told us that, you know, if you can't, don't get out. We have some fire problems that are terrorist problems and we took the risk and just went out through the door, a lot of smoke, could barely see anything. Had to use a light on my phone to see anything. Eventually found exit and just ran.
WONG: I was sort of in my room in the dark for, I don't know, six hours under my bed. We didn't really see very much. We basically just heard a lot of, just gunfire and crackers and all sorts of things, and then towards the end of the six hours, I heard there was a fire on the fifth floor, which is above my room. So that's basically what I heard for six hours.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Joining me on the phone now is Micah Green, he is the author of "American Hostage." Micah was held hostage for 10 days while working in Iraq on a documentary back in 2004. He explains what hostages can do to survive an attack. Micha, thanks for your time. You certainly can put yourself in the place of these hostages. Describe for us what they're likely going through right now.
MICAH GREEN, AUTHOR: You know, first off, it's an extraordinarily terrifying experience, and for them, even more so because they've seen the ability of these hostage-takers to kill people at whim.
So what must be going through their minds, what went through my mind is what are the hostage-takers -- I think for most of the people still being held, they can be fairly certain that it's -- it's a very, very difficult situation.
When I was taken, one thing that runs through your head is how do you get out of this? At the same time you try to appeal to your captors. I think that situation, seeing the magnitude of it, and the horrors that have unfolded, I think that anybody being held is probably focused entirely now on how to get out rather than how to negotiate.
HARRIS: What did you do? What should -- what should hostages do?
GREEN: Well, the most important thing, for anyone in a situation like this is to maintain your thinking and composure, and it's extraordinarily difficult, because you begin to panic, and if you're thinking clearly, you may be able to find ways to escape.
You can also -- you should never not try to appeal to hostage-takers, because you don't know who they are. I mean, if these are children, maybe some of them are recruited by Islamic militants.
In my case, that was, the ones who were guarding me were actually children, some of them 17, 18-years-old and I could open a dialogue. So you don't know if this stretches on, then that's something you very much want to do. But in this initial day, initial few hours when you're put into the situation, you definitely want to try to find a way to escape if possible.
HARRIS: How do you handle it for hours on end, particularly in this situation where there is clearly so much going on around you? It is the feeling of claustrophobia. How do you handle the hours of waiting for some kind of resolution?
GREEN: Well, you know, your entire time frame collapses. Normally things go in terms of hours or days, but literally when you're in a hostage situation you think only in terms of minutes and seconds, because you know that at any second, you could be killed.
And so you're running purely on adrenaline, and in my case, I didn't sleep for the first maybe four days. It was just constantly thinking, how do I get out of this, how do I save myself? Can I appeal to my captors? Can I escape?
HARRIS: And Micah, are you still there?
GREEN: Yes.
HARRIS: You mentioned the idea that you could be killed at any moment. You really -- if you focus -- seems to me if you focus on that, if that thought becomes front and center in your mind, it becomes difficult to function?
GREEN: It's true, and that was one thing, that was the most important thing for me is I focused on trying to maintain my composure.
For me, it was a little easier, because I had my translator with me, who was also taken hostage. So we communicated and basically kept each other calm. And in this situation, several people held together, you know, hopefully they can do that among themselves.
They can maintain their composure and find that way out. If there's a police unit that's coming to help them, then they need to maintain their composure and keep their head down, you know, when things happen. If there's other ways to get out, if the kidnappers are distracted, that's something.
It there's ways to appeal to them. Because again, everyone's human at some point and you have to be able to try to reach out and see if there's any way to communicate with these people.
HARRIS: Does your thinking change at all if you were holed up in a room and you're not sure of the activity going on outside of that room? Obviously, you barricade yourself in as best as possible, but you don't know who's on the other side of the door at any given moment.
GREEN: Well, it's very difficult for people who are just trapped in their rooms and who are not necessarily hostages but who are trapped in that situation.
HARRIS: Yes.
GREEN: And unless they're being immediately threatened with fire, I think they need to just stay exactly where they are and try to keep hidden and wait until authorities can help them, because going out into a situation like that is extraordinarily dangerous.
HARRIS: OK, Micah Green on the phone with us. Micha, appreciate it. Thank you so much for your time.
GREEN: You're welcome.
HARRIS: And we will bring you the very latest on the siege, the standoff in Mumbai in just a moment. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HSU: Someone from the outside saw that the fire was very near our room, and told us that, you know, if you can't, don't get out. We have some fire problems that are terrorist problems and we took the risk and just went out through the door, a lot of smoke, could barely see anything. Had to use a light on my phone to see anything. Eventually found exit and just ran.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Another fire, the third so far, breaks out at the Taj Hotel in Mumbai, India. It's day two of a terrorist siege on India's commercial capital.
Here's what we know right now. At least 125 people killed in 10 separate attacks on popular spots for Westerners. At least 327 people are hurt, as many as 50 people are being held hostage. President Bush and President-elect Barack Obama are among, of course, the world leaders condemning the attacks. India's prime minister indicates the terrorists are foreigners but he doesn't say which country they might be from.
So why did the terrorists hit Mumbai and what do they hope to achieve by taking hostages? Chris Voss is back with us. He dealt with several difficult hostage situations when he was a lead international kidnapping negotiator for the FBI. He joins us from Washington. Chris, good to see you again. Thanks for sticking around for us. Let's sort of recap where we are here.
You've been watching this, boy, for the last day, talking 24 hours here. I'm wondering where you think we are in this process now? The kidnappers, the terrorists holding hostages, the authorities trying to end this situation peacefully and I'm wondering if you're thinking this will end peacefully through negotiations, or perhaps through an assault to end it?
CHRIS VOSS, FORMER FBI INTL KIDNAPPING NEGOTIATOR: Well, the question of whether it will end with the use of force or finesse, if you will. Ideally it's a combination of both that's the most effective use.
Negotiations support any tactical action that are necessary. As far as where we are, the terrorists took hostages for a reason, and they had some sort of a timeline. They're going to be doing the best that they possibly can to conceal that from authorities. So the difficult part for authorities is to try to figure out what that timeline is and then figure out if there's an effective way to interdict that, if what it is that they're pointing at is some sort of devastating lethal finality to it.
And not doing that too early is the difficult part for them as well.
HARRIS: Are negotiations going on now?
VOSS: They're -- I would guarantee that they're talking through intermediaries. Probably that's the best they can do at this point in time. There's going to be people, in these cases there are always people that present themselves as intermediaries and some of them have a possibility of being effective. So they'll try to work with those people and see if there's a way that they can establish communication through them.
HARRIS: Chris, we know some of the attackers were actually captured. What do you suspect we've learned or the authorities have learned from those attackers who were captured?
VOSS: Well, there are probably some of them have been willing to speak. And the terrorists, of course, would like to hope that none of their compatriots or their comrades would talk. But some of them probably will.
And either through their direct statements or what can be implied by the things that they say, or don't say, they can probably develop a clearer picture of what the terrorists overall intention is for the ending of this.
HARRIS: Tactically, what's the approach here? Is it just a bottom up, floor by floor, room by room, and obviously I don't want you to give away something that might be useful to anyone in this group who might be watching, but in vague terms, what's the approach tactically here?
VOSS: Well, to try to contain it. To try to contain it, what seems obvious, by they have to do it in a careful fashion without revealing their positions and actually the negotiators can help contain it as well.
HARRIS: All right, and any advice for folks who are in these rooms holed up right now? We were just talking to Micah Green, who was a hostage himself for 10 days. Any advice from you to anyone who might find themselves in this horrible position of being holed up in one of these rooms?
VOSS: Well, the idea of staying put to start with until you have a better idea of where things are is a good idea, and at same time, you've got to try to make yourself as aware of the surroundings as possible. Because if you get a chance to get out of there, you want to get out of there. There's still a possibility of a fire. And the fire doesn't discriminate. So you need to become aware as possible of the surroundings so you can get out. HARRIS: Chris, would you actually turn the television set on?
VOSS: Yes, absolutely. And I can guarantee you that if there's televisions in front of the terrorists, they've got them on as well.
HARRIS: Chris Voss. Chris, thank you, thank you so much for your time today.
VOSS: You're welcome, Tony.
HARRIS: It has been an entire day now since the initial coordinated attacks rocked Mumbai. Kaushal Patel has the time line.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KAUSHAL PATEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: An attack like never before seen in the heart of India's financial center. Mumbai, a city of about 19 million, targeted by terrorists Wednesday night.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I spent the last, I would say like, five hours in a dark room underneath my bed.
PATEL: At least 100 are dead and 300 wounded. Among those killed, the head of Mumbai's anti-terror squad.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Again, we heard gunfire and we heard grenades and there was a lot of panic. People running, people getting trampled.
PATEL: Around 10:00 p.m. local time, gunmen began a series of coordinated attacks on popular tourist spots, like the Oberoi Hotel, the Taj Mahal Hotel and the Leopold Cafe. But locals were also targeted at the Shivaji Terminus train station, the Cama Hospital and the Colaba Market. The terror didn't stop there.
SAJJAN GOHEL, TERRORISM ANALYST: I have very close family friends who were in the Taj Hotel when the incident happened. They phoned me literally minutes afterwards to say that gunmen had come into the building. They were screaming out loudly that they wanted Americans and Britons.
PATEL: Hostages were also held for hours. By mid-morning, most had been rescued. You can see the toll taken on their faces as they walked to freedom.
GOHEL: This year in 2008, India faced more terrorist attacks in more parts of the country than any other previous period.
PATEL: Security at the Taj had been increased after the J.W. Marriott in Pakistan was bombed in September. Just last week, we are told security was relaxed.
It's still not clear how many terrorists took part in this plot. At least one is reported to be in police custody. As authorities try to piece together this chaotic puzzle, a lockdown is in place. All residents are being asked to stay home. Schools and colleges are also closed. Kaushal Patel, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: All right, Andy David is on the line with us. He is the deputy spokesman for the Israeli Ministry. And Andy, I'd like to first ask you, what can you tell us about the situation right now? We understand that there are some Israelis who are held right now?
ANDY DAVID, ISRAELI MINISTRY OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS: Yes. We have information of Jewish -- the Nariman House, a place of gathering for Jews and Israelis who want to pray. We know that rabbi and his wife and maybe a few others were taken hostages. We have a lot of concern for their lives. We don't know exactly what the situation is there. It's very difficult to get accurate information.
HARRIS: Andy, where are you getting the information that you have so far? Have you been able to make any kind of contact at all with the family?
DAVID: We have information from our official representative there in Mumbai. We have a consulate there. So our consulate general and his staff, they're trying to get as much information, but it's very difficult to get accurate information.
HARRIS: That seems to be the story. Andy, we will be in contact with you often as we try to get every angle of this story to cover it. Andy David on the line with us.
Here's another ongoing question here we're trying to get answers to. Is there any linkage between these attacks and the United States? CNN's Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr joining us now from Washington. Barbara, what are you learning?
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well Tony, U.S., British and Indian intelligence services have been communicating about this for now some 24 hours trying to look at all of the possibilities. No information confirmed, really, and still they are looking at a wide- ranging scenario here.
We've talked to a number of U.S. counterterrorism officials and other senior administration officials about this over the last day. What they're telling us is that while there was this claim of responsibility from a group called Deccan Mujahedeen, the U.S. is not so sure that are was really the group behind it. They don't know a lot about that group. That may be a name, a cover, if you will, for a much deeper, much more sophisticated effort here.
There are two groups that the U.S. is now looking at as possibly, possibly, being behind this. One is a group called Jaish-e-Mohammed. The other is one we've been talking about for several hours now, the LET, Lashkar-e-Taiba.
These are both groups that have been very active in South Asia in the past. Islamic militant groups basically, their attacks in the past have been aimed at ending Indian rule in, say, Kashmir area. But and here's what the real focus is. This attack that we have seen unfold in Mumbai over the last 24 hours, very sophisticated. Well- planned, well-coordinated, well-executed against multiple targets over a wide-ranging area.
It requires people, sophistication, money, communications, coordination, recruitment, training. Who would be capable of doing it? So certainly if it is one of these two groups that they're looking at, it then takes them to the next step.
Would these groups that have been protesting the Kashmir situation possibly have had additional outside help? Could there have been any time of al Qaeda or al Qaeda-inspired involvement in these attacks?
It's important to say again there is no confirmation, Tony, but these are the kind of threads today that intelligence services are looking at. The U.S. actually hopes at this point that the Indians can learn more fairly quickly. They are said to have nine people in custody in Mumbai. They have these crime scenes that are very wide ranging. They will be able to look at them and assess the types of explosives that have been used, the types of weapons, where those explosives and weapons might have come from.
So they will start piecing all of this together. But right now what has U.S. officials perhaps most concerned, most disturbed about it is this new apparent tactic of targeting Westerners by nationality. Targeting U.S., British and now possibly Israeli citizens, and other Westerners.
This would be a tactic they have not seen from this anti-Kashmiri groups in the region before and a tactic that would be considered even a step in the al Qaeda or the al Qaeda-inspired groups, if you will.
That's the thing that -- all of this, very upsetting, very concerting, but it's these targeting of Westerners, Tony, that our sources keep telling us has them most concerned. The bottom line is, 24 hours, the U.S. has no real answers on this. They really don't know what has happened here, and what it all means. Tony?
HARRIS: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon for us, and let's sort of dovetail on this question of who might be responsible, the changing tactics here.
Let's get to Paula Newton. Paula is CNN's international security correspondent, and Paula, maybe a place to start here is, what do we know now about how this plot may have unfolded?
PAULA NEWTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: What we know is that earlier this afternoon, British officials were briefed on what the Indian government believes they know so far, and what they believe is that this attack was launched from the water.
That from some ship, they don't know which one, they actually, three speedboats approached Mumbai from the water. Those boats were ladened with weapons, ammunition, grenades, you name it, and several dozen militants. They still don't know how many. Also, we are hearing information that there were wreckage done weeks beforehand and they had even figured out a way to set up control rooms in these hotels.
This really is, in terms of coordination, unprecedented for India and of course, as Barbara just mentioned, the hostage taking again, unprecedented.
HARRIS: OK, CNN's Paula Newton for us. Paula, thank you.
And as the violence in Mumbai unfolds, people have been using the Internet to share their stories. Our Veronica de la Cruz has been online, and she joins us now with more. Veronica, what are you finding?
VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Tony. I want to go ahead and start with this article that's on CNN.com right now. It basically chronicles the way that various news organizations, bloggers, people in general, Tony, the way that they've been using the Web to stay connected. Also to get the word out as the situation unfolds. Using devices like Twitter.
So some of the sources in the article have been vetted. But we want to show you what it talks about. NDTV.com, that is New Dehli Television Limited, the Web site has been showing images as it unfolds. You're looking at them here. Also sharing first hand accounts.
Take a listen to this. London businessman Rakish Patel (ph) talking about his experiences as a hostage. He says they came from the restaurant and took us up the stairs. They had bombs. There was something because there was a lot of smoke. They wanted anyone with a British or American passport. So I guess they were after foreigners.
Another witness account, Tony. Take a listen to this. I was just sitting and reading the paper. I started seeing the sound was increasing and bodies started falling and all the bloodshed. People were cry, limping, we were frightened, we started to run. That is NDTV.com.
This is Flickr, a photographer in Mumbai by the name of Venu (ph) has been posting these images. Dozens of images to his Flickr account. Here you see a lot of the destruction cast.
People here in Mumbai coming together in unity as well. So Twitter, again, is another way people have been communicating, and we've actually been asking for your comments. You can reach me at veronicadlcruz. Also log onto Facebook, search Veronica de la Cruz and in CNN NEWSROM with Tony Harris. We want to hear your thoughts. Tony?
HARRIS: OK Veronica, appreciate it, thank you.
And we want to update one more story on what has been an unbelievable news day. We are getting the latest information now on the crash of an Air New Zealand A-320 passenger jet. We believe on a training mission right now with five to seven people onboard. Debris has been spot in the Mediterranean Sea. We will keep you posted on that story throughout the afternoon right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.
And recapping the terror attacks in Mumbai, now nearly 24 hours old. Here is what we know, at least 125 people have been killed in 10 separate attacks. Witnesses say the attackers apparently sought out American and British citizens. At least 327 people are hurt. Reports indicated as many as 50 are being held hostage. One of our correspondents has been talking with a Chicago woman who is holed up in the Taj Hotel with her family in a room there. She says she has seen armed men still roaming the halls. We will continue to cover this story with CNN's Kyra Phillips right after the break.
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