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Nightmare in Mumbai; Rising Tensions over Pakistan; Barack Obama Filling Some High Profile Cabinet Posts; Thailand Political Turmoil Grows; Flight Delays in Midwest and East Coast; Black Coaches in the NCAA; Black Friday Tragedies
Aired November 30, 2008 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Inside Obama's cabinet. The men and women who will help shape his presidency. The president-elect poised to make a big announcement.
Three days of hell. Terror attacks not just committed but sustained, and CNN reporters in the middle of it all.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: ...long hours, and --
(LOUD EXPLOSION)
SIDNER: -- OK. All right. We're -- another loud bang you heard there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: And tonight the big question, who did it? And will they do it again? This hour you'll hear from senior international correspondent Nic Robertson with new information on the only surviving gunman. Also, CNN correspondents Sara Sidner and Andrew Stevens both at the center of the siege.
Plus, black athletes running the plays but not running the show.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I guess that still tells us that in this country where we elected a black man for the first time that we still have some room to grow.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: A college football player speaks out about diversity in sports all while facing a very tough decision -- a Rhodes Scholarship or millions of dollars in the NFL? The news starts now.
And good evening everyone. The India terror attacks of the past few days are exactly the type of crisis that could await the new administration. Now with the upheaval in the economy and overseas, even Barack Obama has said that he has to be ready on day one when he takes office in just under two months. So, in an announcement that couldn't be more timely, hours from now the president-elect will reveal his choices for a national security team. Some of the names you may already know and some will likely surprise you.
Let's get right to it now with Lynn Sweet, the Washington bureau chief for "The Chicago Sun-Times."
Lynn, we start with Hillary Clinton as secretary of state nominee.
LYNN SWEET, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, "THE CHICAGO SUN-TIMES": Well, by now, no surprise. A superstar picking another superstar. It means that all the campaign rhetoric of the past is just the past, and it means that both of them now are looking towards making this a historic administration. Both of them have legacies in mind.
LEMON: All right. Lynn, let's get to Bob Gates now as a secretary of defense. It was reported that he'd only stay on for a year. Has that at all changed?
SWEET: Well, as far as I know, that's still the game plan. He's not meant to be somebody who I think will be talking about two years now. He's the Republican in the cabinet so far. He also brings continuity. And with Obama, he has a game plan to try and get the troops out of Iraq on a date certain, especially with the new status agreement that's been negotiated within the Iraqi parliament.
LEMON: OK, Lynn, speaking of Iraq, Iraq General James L. Jones, national security advisor. A year ago after studying the situation in Iraq he informed Congress that there were serious deficiencies in the Iraq Interior Ministry and with the Iraqi National Police, which in some ways people believe helped justify the surge which Obama was opposed to. So this isn't surprising to you at all either?
SWEET: No, it's not. This brings gravitas to the cabinet. Again, it's another heavyweight. Enormous credibility and in the end the surge does seem to work. I don't know if Obama wanted to acknowledge it as forth rightly as some did within the campaign but, remember, the campaign's gone. Obama won with an overwhelming vote, and he's just looking to put in the right people in the right places. That's why you'll see who you're seeing tomorrow being appointed.
LEMON: OK, Lynn, let's move on to a few more names that we're going to hear about. We think Janet Napolitano, Homeland Security secretary.
SWEET: Early, early supporter of Senator Obama, now President- elect Obama -- border state, knows the issue, female. Good pick.
LEMON: All right. Eric Holder Jr., attorney general?
SWEET: Eric Holder has a -- is a basketball playing buddy of Obama.
LEMON: Yes.
SWEET: And he has been in the Justice Department. He knows the -- no surprise at all. Early supporter of Obama. Helped vet his vice presidential candidate.
LEMON: OK. Susan Rice, U.S. ambassador to the United States.
SWEET: Susan Rice, like Eric Holder, another alumni of the Bill Clinton administration, was a very early supporter of Senator Obama and has just been critical in briefing him from the earliest days. You know, she's been around early and she is supposedly headed for the U.N. ambassadorship.
LEMON: OK. So those are the names that we know about. Any names that are not on there? Any surprises? I mean, I was surprised Bill Richardson's name is not on there. John Kerry's name is not on there either, Lynn?
SWEET: One, there are still other positions to be given. There is a lot of stories, and the Obama people are always aware of stories and coverage. There is a week's worth of news that's going to come out at 9:40 Central Time, Chicago.
And by the way, I don't know why it's 9:40 and not on the hour or the half hour, but that's how the scheduling went. I did ask. I think they understood that if you -- you have a lot going on tomorrow, underscored by the crisis in India. So I think they just wanted to dole it out.
Also, if Richardson is headed for commerce as some think, you know, that would be another group of people for another day.
LEMON: OK. Lynn, we're going to bring you back and talk about the mess that the president-elect is inheriting here when it comes to foreign policy, when it comes to what's happening overseas right now. So we'll see you in a little bit. Thank you very much for that, Lynn.
SWEET: Thank you.
LEMON: And of course, you can see President-elect Obama's news conference live tomorrow morning right here on CNN. He'll announce his national security team at 10:40 a.m. Eastern in Chicago.
We turn now to India where there are a lot of developments tonight in the Mumbai terror attacks investigation. First, there is word that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice will be traveling to India on Wednesday. It is the latest and most dramatic sign that the U.S. plans to be closely involved in both the findings and the potential fallout from the investigation.
Now, the Rice announcement came just hours after President Bush spoke by phone with India's president and assured him of U.S. help with the probe. Meantime, there is word that India's home minister has resigned amid criticism that Indian forces reacted too slowly as the Mumbai attacks unfolded.
As the Indian government's response comes under criticism at home, it's Pakistan's potential role that's causing new concerns. CNN's Nic Robertson reports from Mumbai.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): Could this gunman hold the balance of regional peace in his hands? He is the only attacker to be captured alive. India's police say he is Pakistani. And what he tells investigators could shape the rising tensions between these two nuclear neighbors.
(on camera): Government officials here were quick to blame Pakistan, Pakistan's ministers deny their country's involvement, have offered to help with the investigation but are now considering bolstering their troops along the border. The two countries have fought three wars in the past 60 years. Getting this investigation right could not be more critical.
(voice-over): At a commemoration ceremony, the police killed in the terror attack, Mumbai's police commissioner wanted to cool speculation.
(on camera): Commissioner, Hi, Nic Robertson from CNN. How are you doing?
COMMISSIONER HASAN GAFOOR, MUMBAI, INDIA POLICE: OK.
ROBERTSON: Sir, how is the investigation going at the moment?
GAFOOR: This is a condolence meeting that we run. I can't talk right now. Please, understand that sentiments.
ROBERTSON: Absolutely.
(voice-over): It is indeed a tough time for the city, but India's maze of new, independent media outlets have a steady stream of leaks from investigators. They vary widely. Few can agree on the captured gunman's name. Our sister network, CNN-IBN has sources inside India's intelligence community. They're being told the gunman was trained and helped by Lashkar-e-Toiba, a Pakistan based al-Qaeda terror group.
Indian officials allege in the 1990s, Lashkar-e-Toiba was a state sponsored terror group used by the Pakistani government to get control of the disputed northern Kashmir region, as well as being responsible for many more recent attacks here.
Pakistan banned Lashkar-e-Toiba in 2002. CNN-IBN has also been told the captured gunman says he and his fellow attackers were told to memorize Google Earth maps of Mumbai Streets so they could find their targets.
(on camera): As a measure of how seriously the attack and rising tensions are being taken in Western capitals, the FBI is sending a team to help. British investigators are also expected. And Interpol, the international policing group, are also in negotiations with Indian authorities to send in their teams.
(voice-over): While the country mourns its fallen heroes, an undercurrent of anti-Pakistan sentiment is growing. Managing that while conducting a thorough and open investigation may be this country's biggest challenge in the coming weeks.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Nic Robertson joins us now from Mumbai tonight.
Nic, as everyone looks to Pakistan, the question is, could there be other possibilities of responsibility here?
ROBERTSON: Well, certainly, we haven't heard a huge amount of discussion about Indian Mujahideen, the group has been behind some of the other attacks that have come, the various bombing attacks over the past few years in India. Just a couple of months ago here, Indian authorities rounded up five leading members of that Indian Mujahideen Group. They were found in some of that premises to be ready to make more bombs. They had 30 pounds of high explosives, about 16 pounds of ball bearings, detonators.
So this group is known to be behind some of the other bombings in the country recently, but they're not getting a lot of discussion about their potential involvement. That a lot of people here will tell you it's quite possibly that they were essentially the foot soldiers in all of this.
But today, we're hearing more information about how the Pakistan angle may be getting bigger. Sister network, CNN-IBN says that the e- mail of responsibility that was sent out was created on a Russian server that's done using voice recognition circuitry that shows Pakistani dialects being used and that this e-mail was opened in Lahore, in Pakistan. That's been found from the IP address. So, again, more information that is being leaked out that points again towards Pakistan, Don.
LEMON: All right. Nic Robertson, our senior international correspondent with the latest on the investigation tonight. Thank you, Nic.
And as Nic just mentioned, Pakistani officials are pledging cooperation in the fight against terrorism.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YOUSUF RAZA GILANI, PAKISTANI PRIME MINISTER: I think this is a heinous crime and we condemn it. And I think this terrorism is a menace for the whole world and, therefore, we have to work jointly to combat terrorism and extremism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. Let's bring back in Lynn Sweet, who is a Washington bureau chief for "The Chicago Sun-Times," which happens to be Barack Obama's hometown paper. And she is also in Washington, where he will be for the next four years.
OK, so Lynn, you see with all of this unrest that's happening overseas right now in India and also in Thailand as well, you see that Barack Obama is really inheriting quite a mess here. SWEET: Well, he is. This also does not help his idea of trying to look for regional solutions to problems. Certainly, he wanted to not have an escalating situation with India and Pakistan of all places.
One of the things that people might not remember about President- elect Obama is that one of his specialties has been nuclear proliferation and he is going into potentially his first crisis with two nuclear super powers here, so that does not help.
I don't think necessarily that this was a test aimed at President-elect Obama but, certainly, it will be a crisis for him to deal with when he gets into office particularly if he does not have any -- he won't know and as he's trying to I suppose map his scenarios, whether or not India is going to escalate its response or whether or not they will not have a response as he'll have to grapple within his first day or two in office.
LEMON: Let's talk about his history and what he has said on record at least about Pakistan, about the Taliban, as it relates to that region. He has said a number of times; he has spoken out about this issue a number of times. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D), PRESIDENT-ELECT: There are terrorists holed up in those mountains who murdered 3,000 Americans. They are plotting to strike again. It was a terrible mistake to fail to act when we had a chance to take out an al Qaeda leadership meeting in 2005. If we have actionable intelligence about high valued terrorist targets and President Musharraf will not act, we will.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: He received a lot of criticism about this on the campaign trail.
SWEET: Well, he did. And in the end, it seems in some ways the Bush administration was not all that far apart. But here is the thing to think about, Don. If that is the viewpoint of President-elect Obama, then what is to keep India from making a unilateral move into Pakistan if they believe they have good intelligence to go after a target responsible for the terror attacks in Mumbai?
So there is -- once you set down some kind of Obama doctrine like that, there is a consequence that he might have to reap as soon as he comes into office.
LEMON: Yes. Now, you did say that you don't believe this is a test. Because even if his own VP said, he is going to be tested early on when it comes to foreign policy. You don't believe this is his test.
SWEET: I don't think so partly because -- here's why I don't think it fits in the equation. If you wanted to send that message to Obama, you would have waited a few weeks until he is inaugurated. LEMON: OK.
SWEET: Because then, you would have it. So, I don't think it's directed towards him. Britain, United States, yes.
LEMON: All right. Washington bureau chief for "The Chicago Sun- Times" Lynn Sweet, who has an article tomorrow about Hillary Clinton in her paper as well that she wrote herself, and we appreciate her joining us late on this Sunday evening. Thank you.
SWEET: Thank you, Don.
LEMON: Mumbai was the site, but the targets were international. At least six Americans are among those killed in those attacks. They include Alan Scherr. He is a 58-year-old American from Virginia. He was with the about 20 other members of a community called synchronicity which promotes meditation. His 13-year-old daughter Naomi was also killed. Three others from that group were wounded.
29-year-old Rabbi Gavriel Holtzberg was killed at the Mumbai Jewish Center. He held dual Israeli and American citizenship. His wife, Rivka, also was killed. But their 2-year-old son was smuggled out of the house to safety by a central worker.
Well, the people of Mumbai are taking time out to remember the victims of those terror attacks. These images were sent to us by an iReporter, Aaron Kadri, who lives in Mumbai. Hundreds of people came out Sunday night to pay their respects. Most of them gathered on Mumbai's boardwalk which overlooks the Arabian Sea.
Of course we want to know what's on your mind tonight as it concerns this story and any others that we have reported or haven't reported yet. Logon to Twitter, to Facebook, MySpace or ireport.com and tell us what you're thinking and we'll get your responses on the air. As a matter of fact, they are scrawling right there on the crawl.
Those who survived those Mumbai terror attacks and siege are reliving it tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We didn't realize the extent of the devastation until we were there and saw basically they trashed the hotel. It looks as if we came much closer to danger than we realized.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Tonight, our exclusive interview with a Chicago couple who lived through three days of hell.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Well, more than 180 people died in the Mumbai terror attacks including at least six Americans. Our Ed Lavandera sat down with a couple from Chicago. They were guests in the Taj Mahal Hotel and in their rooms when all hell broke loose. Here's CNN's Ed Lavandera with this exclusive.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In an instant Carol and Benjamin Mackoff knew they were trapped in a violent siege.
BEN MACKOFF, TAJ HOTEL SURVIVOR: As soon as the first two shots were fired.
CAROL MACKOFF, TAJ HOTEL SURVIVOR: Ben said, that's not firecrackers, that's gunfire. And then we immediately -- we didn't know where it was coming, but we locked the door to our room.
LAVANDERA: Benjamin looked through the door's peep hole and saw three men carrying guns dressed in the same colored jackets.
B. MACKOFF: They looked like young men probably in late teens, early 20s, slim, athletic-looking. Talking to each other. One was talking on a cell phone after they passed by, after that -- so, you know, the face of evil doesn't -- isn't necessarily evil looking.
LAVANDERA: They would spend nearly 48 hours locked inside their room on the third floor of the Taj Hotel rationing cookies from the mini bar, drinking water from the bathroom faucet, gunfire and explosions erupting just outside the door, smoke filling the hallway, and in the darkness they heard a desperate cry for help.
C. MACKOFF: We heard an American male voice yelling, help, help me, please help. Please help me. And --
B. MACKOFF: Then shots and then quiet.
LAVANDERA: Nearby, the Mackoff say gunmen were opening doors and throwing grenades into rooms. Then twice the attackers rang the door bell to their room and simply walked away.
C. MACKOFF: For whatever reason, they did ring our door bell twice, two different occasions. But they didn't shoot the door down. And I don't know why. I don't know why. I'm just grateful they didn't.
B. MACKOFF: As the chair that was thrown out to break a window.
LAVANDERA: As they waited, Benjamin Mackoff snapped these photographs from their window. It shows bed sheets tied together. Another captive preparing an escape from the hotel. There was even a mattress outside their window. The Mackoffs think someone was going to use it as a landing pad.
Through the entire ordeal, the Mackoffs say they never felt fearful. In fact, Benjamin read a 400-page novel.
B. MACKOFF: There wasn't much else to do so I started a book and finished it.
LAVANDERA: Carol Mackoff could not sleep. Attached to her cell phone, text messaging family, officials from the U.S. Consulate and Indian army, even CNN to get the latest information.
Then Thursday morning, they were told an Indian Commando Unit was coming to their rescue. More gunfire, an explosion, then the knock on their door and the commandos quietly escorted them out of the hotel.
C. MACKOFF: Everything in with hand motion and marched us to a service stairway on which there was a lot of broken glass and there was a lot of blood, and as my husband recalled to you, one puddle of blood and one shoe off to the side which is a picture we'll never forget.
LAVANDERA: The Mackoff say it was only when they saw the destruction inside the Taj Hotel that they realized how lucky they were to escape alive.
C. MACKOFF: As we were evacuated, we realized that we had come this close to real danger or loss of life because the rooms across the hall from us on that ocean side separated by the atrium, they had been blasted open.
LAVANDERA: Just days after escaping, Carol and Benjamin Mackoff say this ordeal won't keep them from traveling the world.
Ed Lavandera, CNN, Chicago.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: We're going to continue our coverage of the terror attacks in Mumbai, India, and the ongoing investigation.
We've talked about the violence there but there is so much more to India than that. Our correspondents Sara Sidner and Andrew Stevens, they will join us live as we take a deeper look at a complex country and a diverse people.
Also tonight, if you were on your way home, well, you might be facing a very long trip because the weather could be working against you. Our Jacqui Jeras is keeping an eye on the skies for us.
Jacqui?
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Hey, Don. Yes, a real ugly day today. 50 flights canceled out of O'Hare. Three-hour delays out of New York City. Well, the holiday stragglers and business travel seem more troubled tomorrow. We'll let you know coming up in your forecast.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SIDNER: ...long hours, and --
(LOUD EXPLOSION)
SIDNER: -- OK. All right. We're -- another loud bang you heard there. Now, if you listen probably in the next few minutes there will be --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Boy, that was our international correspondent Sara Sidner in the thick of that conflict at the Taj Mahal Hotel in Mumbai. And I want to bring her in now along with CNN's Andrew Stevens. He was at the Taj Hotel at the time as well when those explosions went off. And I want to talk to both of you about that.
Sara, you're standing there and watching some of the reporting, many of the reporters thought that the situation was under control and then all of a sudden another round would go off. What was that like?
SIDNER: It was a bit of a shock the first time it happened, but then after that we sort of gotten used to it if you can get used to explosions going off behind you. One of the part that we found quite frustrating was that every time you'd get these loud explosions and then you get gunfire, there would be a couple of hours blow in which authorities would say OK, this is winding down. It looks like this is just about over. And then you'd get another round of huge explosions and another round of gunfire and it was very apparent that it was nowhere near over. So, that was on the ground. You sort of got used to this roller coaster ride so to speak, Don.
LEMON: Yes. And Sara, I want to bring in Andrew Stevens now.
Andrew, as I understand, you were there, as well, at the Taj Hotel during this siege. What was your feeling about that? Was it a coincidence that you were there? Or did you go to the scene because you heard something was going to happen?
ANDREW STEVENS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We were there when the siege was going on. We've been pretty much came here -- Sara and I, both for the 60 hours of the siege here at the Taj Hotel.
What struck me is that a lot of the bangs seemed to be coming from the building which was closest to us here with the windows actually looking out on to a huge place back here. Security wasn't that tight at all. We were getting quite close and a lot of local press are getting much closer.
In fact, a couple of the Indian reporters got hit by shrapnel, by brick work from bricks being basically exploded around window frames and coming out across out here. So once -- I remember looking out, we sought cover behind our car. We have ducked down behind our car. And then finally there were about 200 or 300 people just lying flat and the media were lying flat there. And we were just wondering was a fire fight going to start up? And if there was a fire fight, we looked like we could have been in direct line, just right behind us, Don.
LEMON: And Andrew, yes, I want to talk to you about that region. And it is a very volatile region. And for years, experts have been saying that something was bound to happen in that area because of its relation to Afghanistan and also to Pakistan. In your years of covering these attacks there, not quite as coordinated, did you expect somewhere in the back of your head that something like this might happen, unfortunately?
STEVENS: Well, I don't think you can travel in this region when you have Pakistan and India, two countries that have been to war against each other twenty times, throw Afghanistan into the mix. There's a lot of mistrust, there's a lot of suspicion on either side and there had been just relentless numbers of terror attacks.
I was looking at some figures the other day. Some had written, it was being said 70 attacks or bomb blasts in India in the past seven months. Some are not very big, some of them bigger. What was not expected, though, Don, was to attack targets like this. I mean, no, you come to Mumbai, this is the commercial heart.
LEMON: Right.
STEVENS: You're aware it can get very dangerous, but these places for some reason didn't seem to carry that same level of concern.
LEMON: Yes. And Sara, I'm going to end with you. I'm wondering if this, if we go now from covering the booming economy in India to covering these sorts of stories now and more of a focus on terrorism as it relates to that area.
SIDNER: Yes, absolutely. And Don, you know, we should mention on the international side of CNN, we have been covering a lot of bombings lately here that haven't gotten much international press so to speak. But I've covered six of them in the past seven or eight months, but nothing quite like this. And that should be put out there that there is sort of a simmering feeling that something is going to happen. You get that sort of feeling.
Now, also because elections are coming up for the central government in the next couple of months, and so a lot of people speculate that for the attacks that happened before this one, that it may have some political ties. But, certainly, this is different and, certainly, this was a lot larger. I mean, the whole world took notice. And now, I think you're right. The coverage of India will go, will shift a bit from something of a business story where a lot of people are trying to come into this country to try to make money to a story about safety, security and international terrorism.
Don?
LEMON: Sara Sidner and Andrew Stevens, we appreciate your reporting tonight.
Barack Obama filling some high profile cabinet posts, but is his team equipped to tackle the new challenges facing them? And you know these guys. They will be all over this story. You better check your radios and you better check your TV, too because we've got your drive time buzz, coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right. It has been a very busy weekend. You can say it's been a very busy week with the attack in Mumbai and President- elect Barack Obama's transition team about to be announced and those major cabinet appointments as well.
Now speaking of elect, there is a run-up election happening this week in Georgia. The outcome will certainly impact Barack Obama's reach in the Senate. That's why it's important.
All the above will certainly be fodder for talk radio. On the left, Warren Ballentine. Nationally syndicated radio host, Warren Ballentine. And on the right, joining us for the very first time, and get ready, Michael, it is -- it's kind of crazy, Michael Medved, from the "Michael Medved Show."
Hey, guys, thanks for joining us. Hope you both had a good Thanksgiving.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, certainly.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Yes, you did. OK. Let's talk about President-elect Barack Obama. Some very big appointments that he is planning to do tomorrow. What are your viewers saying about Hillary Clinton, Warren?
WARREN BALLENTINE, HOST, "WARREN BALLENTINE SHOW": They absolutely love this appointment. They think this is brilliant on Barack's part for a couple reasons. One, it's going to ensure that he is -- he's president for the next eight years as far as the Democratic Party is concerned because his chief rival isn't going to be there.
Two, they're happy because they believe Hillary can be president after Barack is finished because of the experience that she's going to get to further her career as secretary of state.
And three, it's showing that he really does want to unite. He doesn't want to divide. So, a lot of people are happy about it.
LEMON: Michael, on the conservative side, on the right, I should say, I asked Warren, what is yours? What are your listeners saying about this? Are they weighing in on this appointment?
MICHAEL MEDVED, HOST, "THE MICHAEL MEDVED SHOW": Well, they are. I think that generally this is reassuring to people on the conservative side of things. It is one of many indications that Obama is not going to be some kind of left-wing radical, that he wants to be a centrist Democrat, that he is trying to appoint someone as secretary of state, who was more moderate, more hawkish than he was.
The interesting thing is, I like the appointment because not -- in spite of the fact that Hillary will have continued political ambitions, but because she does.
For instance, one of the concerns about Barack Obama was putting all kinds of pressure on Israel to make suicidal concessions. Now, Hillary's power base -- and she does want to be president after Obama. I think Warren is right. Her power base is the state of New York. I think it's very, very unlikely that she's going to lead any kind of anti-Israel policy for the new administration.
LEMON: OK. Let's talk terror now. Because a lot of people have been tuned out and, you know, it is the Thanksgiving -- it was the Thanksgiving holiday. Let's talk about India. Some people are surprised, really, they've asked me why is this story getting so much attention because there's unrest in India all the time and we never hear about it.
Who wants to take that? Michael or Warren?
MEDVED: Well, I think that the reason that this is getting so much attention is because the level of killing with 10 perpetrators...
BALLENTINE: Exactly.
MEDVED: ...was so spectacular and it was so coordinated and what it shows is how we cannot take the war on terror for granted.
LEMON: OK.
MEDVED: One thing that I do think we have to give some credit to the outgoing president, no matter how much you may hate his guts. He's kept this country safe from this kind of attack over the last seven years and yet we do have to worry about it and President-elect Obama has to be concerned about it.
LEMON: Warren, go ahead. Warren, I know that you want to weigh in on this. But I really want you, can you please talk, I'll give you the last word on Saxby Chambliss and Jim Martin. That really is going to talk about the balance of power in the Senate here and I know people are listening. They are listening to what you're talking about.
BALLENTINE: Well, when it goes for the issue of terror here with India, I got to say this, Don.
LEMON: OK.
BALLENTINE: I think it's getting so much attention not only because of what Mike just said, but also because you have a President- elect coming in and a lot of people are already putting this on Obama's desk when it should be on Bush's desk.
Now, when you look at what's happening in Georgia, I'm just going to tell you, I've been talking about this for two weeks on my show. I don't know if the Democrats are going to turn out the way they did for the general election for Barack Obama for Jim Martin. Now, if they do, I think he has a very good chance of winning this. If they don't, I think Saxby Chambliss is going to be retaining that seat.
LEMON: Wow. OK. Warren Ballentine, Michael Medved, you know, who is new, he's a newbie. You did OK, though, Michael. We appreciate it. We'd love to have you back.
BALLENTINE: I was easy on him tonight.
LEMON: Yes. All right, thank you both. We'd love to have you on for another segment. But we have so much news tonight that we can only do one with you, but thank you both very much for joining us. OK.
BALLENTINE: Thank you, Don.
MEDVED: Thank you. Happy holidays.
LEMON: All right. Thanks. Same to you.
And from the Midwest to the East Coast, if you're trying to get home tonight, you're going to have some problems. We're going to get to our Jacqui Jeras in just a bit. But you saw that up there. Make sure you send us your comments. We'll try to get some on the air.
Jacqui Jeras in our extreme weather center, that what we're calling it tonight, with an eye on the forecast for you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: You know, we've been doing a lot of talking about the terror attacks in India, but we're also following another international crisis, one that's virtually shut down an entire country. And tonight, that crisis is growing.
We're hearing that government supporters and government opponents are on the streets of Thailand right now. The anti government protestors have seized Bangkok's two major airports, leaving about 100,000 passengers in limbo.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TONY HORNER, BUSINESSMAN FROM ENGLAND: I was on the -- virtually on the aircraft ready to go home on Tuesday night when Thai authorities stopped us going on board the plane.
TERRY GANNON, ON HONEYMOON FROM CALIFORNIA: It's just stressful. It's taken away everything. It's stressful, you know, going home. I'm set for job interviews. I missed them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Can you imagine you can't get home and you're stuck in an airport in a country where there's upheaval? Well, we're learning tonight that some planes have been able to fly out and officials hope the protestors will allow more of them to follow.
Now here at home, post-Thanksgiving travelers are facing all kinds of delays tonight. Our Jacqui Jeras is monitoring it all from the CNN severe weather center.
Jacqui, I said this to you earlier. We have a captive audience because we know there are delays. So, they're probably watching us in the airport on television and we thank them.
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes, we do thank them and hopefully they're hanging in there because it's been a real rough go today. We've had a lot of flight cancellations. At least 50 of them out of Chicago O'Hare alone. Delays, hours long.
Now, they have dwindled down and improved a little bit. There are fewer planes in the air right now. We've got about 3400 of them at this time. That's down from about 5800 earlier today. Part of that has to do with the time of day; part of it does have to do with the weather. Still keeping things slow going here.
Newark, you're looking at delays still over three hours. Philadelphia, over three. Chicago O'Hare, down to 40 but some of that has to do with, yes, your flights were canceled. And JFK, looking at delays around 25 minutes. That's down from three hours at the peak this afternoon and this evening.
Storm system still going to continue to be a real problem here. We're concerned about some real slick conditions on the New York thruway. There have been a number of accidents reported there. Also some accidents reported in Indiana and also Wisconsin.
The heavier snows will be coming down around Milwaukee and into northern parts of Illinois and the wrap-around moisture and windy conditions with this will keep you socked in for the most part. We think in the Northeast and the Midwest for tomorrow. Southeast, we'll start to see some improvements. And out West will just have morning delays in San Francisco and San Diego due to low clouds and fog.
So, one more day to get through. And you know, the later the day you travel tomorrow, Don, the better off you're going to be.
LEMON: Oh, so you know what? Just postpone.
JERAS: If you can.
LEMON: Just postpone and go tomorrow. OK. Thank you, Jacqui Jeras. Always appreciate it.
Shooting for the stars, on the field and in the classroom.
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LEMON (on camera): Barack Obama, Oprah Winfrey, Robert Johnson. I mean, you think very highly of yourself, right?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I like to set my goals for the stars, you know. And I reach as high as I can.
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LEMON: My conversation with a Rhodes Scholar, Myron Rolle, straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) LEMON: Florida State's Myron Rolle is one of the best college football players in the country. He's also a Rhodes Scholar. That's him pursuing Florida's quarterback yesterday. Now, he faces the unusual challenge of choosing between an almost certain career in the NFL or studying medicine at Oxford University. When I spoke to him just two days ago, we talked about the responsibility that comes with his amazing achievements.
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LEMON (on camera): You realize that there are a whole lot of people who are, you know, just fans in general, people all over the world who are very proud of you, but African-Americans in general. I mean, specifically, I should you say. African-Americans specifically are extremely proud of you and are saying, oh, my gosh, this guy is not only excelling in football and sports but he's a Rhodes Scholar. Do you get -- do you get that? Do you understand what that means?
MYRON ROLLE, FSU FOOTBALL PLAYER: A little bit, a little bit. I've gotten a lot of Facebook messages. I'm a big Facebook user. So, I've gotten a lot of messages, a lot of e-mails from people telling me how much of an inspiration I am to them as a fellow African-American.
Even youth who write me and say that I inspire them to be something greater, not just be an athlete or rapper or something else that they see a lot of their role models or popular figures in the African-American community doing.
LEMON: That's a -- that's a big responsibility.
ROLLE: It is, it is.
LEMON: Are you ready for that?
ROLLE: I am certainly ready for it. There are others who have done it. Barack Obama has done it. You know, Robert Johnson has done it. There are certainly others who are -- Oprah Winfrey has done it. People who have succeeded with their academics, with their brain, with their mind, with their intellect and with their power of speech and their influence. And I think I can follow that same path. The path has already been blazed. And now, it's just up to me to execute and follow it.
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LEMON: Oprah, Robert Johnson, man, he certainly is trying to blaze a trail with some big heavy hitters. All right, Myron Rolle talked about African-American role models in sports, but here's what's interesting. There are only three black college football coaches currently working in the NCAA's Division 1. That's the lowest number in 15 years. I asked our sports business analyst, Rick Horrow, why that is.
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LEMON: Sylvester Croom's resignation from Mississippi State. It doesn't really bode well for diversity in college football. What are we down now, to three head football coaches in college football?
RICK HORROW, CNN SPORTS BUSINESS ANALYST: Started with six Division 1 coaches. Now, there are three, which by the way, Don, is the lowest in 25 years.
LEMON: The lowest in 25 years. What do you -- how do you account for that because many of the players on these teams, quite frankly, are African-American. The teams are very diverse but the coaching and the coaching staffs aren't very diverse. What do you attribute this to?
HORROW: Well, you know, a lot of people say it's institutional. But the stat, which is interesting, is that 55 percent of the student athletes are minorities. So, it is clear they want to see the faces in authority that look a little more like them. It is maybe systematic. Some people say it's cyclical. There has been a lot of improvement as well. There's a rule in the NFL called the Rooney rule, where you have you to interview minority coaches on the way to hiring. It's not that way in college, though. It is a program that needs a little bit of improvement to be sure.
LEMON: Here's something that's very interesting. And I spoke with Myron Rolle who is a Rhodes Scholar now.
HORROW: Yes.
LEMON: Just yesterday. And we talked about this diversity not only in college football, but also in the NFL. And he said that it may be incumbent on some of the players to take matters into their own hands.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROLLE: I guess that still tells us that in this country where we elected a black man for the first time that we still have some room to grow, and we still have some places to go, and we still have to look beyond color in that sense and really look for someone who can -- has leadership qualities, has the right character to be front office personnel, to be head coaches, and to represent universities as football coaches.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: If the players, who are being recruited both in the NFL, both in college football, if they suddenly decide, you know, I want to be with a team where there is a diverse head coach. Can they make a difference in that way?
HORROW: Well, clearly, the leverage on where you choose to go to school, and, of course, Myron Rolle, being one of the best defensive backs in the country as well as his mind with the Rhodes scholarship, has that leverage. Not too many people and players do.
The problem is that once you get out in the real world, you can unionize, you can strike, you can combine. But these are players who are going to be in college two, three, four years and then they become professionals. So their leverage is diminished by their aspirations to succeed on the professional level.
LEMON: OK. You said there are no systems in place to help with recruiting a diverse college or NFL head coaching staff. What are the improvements? What can be done in order to improve this?
HORROW: Well, of course, there are moral suasions. There are rankings the colleges are looking at every year. There are organizations which do rate. And again, it's like at the ballot box. If you don't like the diversity, then you go to another school.
But there are systems in place that the NCAA is looking at to try to increase education, to try to increase minority hiring and we have come a long way. There just have to be a long -- a larger set of strides in order to get to anywhere near equality. And maybe with the president-elect, there will be that persuasion.
LEMON: With all the attention that's being raised about this with Myron Rolle and other players and with Croom's resignation, do you think that people are paying attention now, especially owners, especially university leaders? Do you think there will be differences to come early on now?
HORROW: High schools, colleges, and remember, two-thirds of the NFL players are African-American. So, it's a tip of a very large iceberg. And I think we all understand that it is a very important issue to be resolved at the college, high school, and clearly, Don, the professional level as well.
LEMON: Rick Horrow, we appreciate it. Thank you, sir.
HORROW: All right.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Here's the immediate question tonight facing Myron Rolle. Should he go to the NFL and make millions of dollars or does he take a Rhodes scholarship? Well, we find out from him and you can catch much, much more of my interview with Myron Rolle, FSU football player and Rhodes Scholar, tomorrow night, "AC 360," 10:00 p.m. Eastern, only here on CNN.
A big deadline for the Big 3. They're due back on Capitol Hill this week looking for a bailout.
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ANGELA STUECKRAD, MOTHER: My name is Angela Stueckrad and my hero's my son Andrew Stueckrad. He's only 15 and he has organized a toy and item drive for teenagers in our area. He's the kind of child that has always puts the others first. And when you say, oh, I'll give you the shirt off my back. He literally gives you the shirt off his back. He's seen others where they've been in need, and he has given.
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LEMON: All right. Just looking at some of your responses here tonight on those platforms that we've been talking about.
Here's what CT guy says, CT2675. "Obama seems to be assembling his dream team. I think his picks should satisfy many on the right and on the left."
KMiley says, "I'd love to be a fly on the wall with Clinton, Gates, Biden and Jones in the room. What a group. Who takes the lead?"
BarbRat says, "I fear the Mumbai attacks were practiced for U.S. attacks."
Please keep your comments coming. We'd love to get as many of them on the air as possible. And check the bottom of your screen. They are scrolling there as well.
Trampled and crushed. The holiday shopping season gets off to a deadly start. A Wal-Mart worker is killed in a crowd of customers. Now, police are looking at the tape.
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LEMON: You know what? Hold on to your wallet because $25 billion, that's right, that's the price you and I may be paying to keep the Big 3 from going belly up. This week, General Motors, Ford, Chrysler will present a recovery plan to Congress. The deadline is Tuesday and hearings are scheduled later on in the week.
We usually talk about numbers at the start of the holiday shopping season, but tonight we're talking about lives. Long Island police are looking at surveillance video from a Wal-Mart store, where a surging crowd trampled a worker to death on Black Friday. A 34- year-old man was run over in a stampede of about 2,000 early shoppers. Police admit it might be tough to bring charges here.
Now let's talk numbers. Stores and online merchants were actually busier this weekend than they were last year. But analysts say they think the rest of the shopping season will suffer amid the struggling economy.
Now let's take a closer look at what shoppers are thinking. Our Stephanie Elam "Gets Down to Business."
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STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN BUSINESS NEWS CORRESPONDENT (on camera): Shoppers flock to stores in search of black Friday deals last week, but they weren't prepared to spend like previous years.
A recent survey from the Consumer Federation of American and the Credit Union National Association shows nearly 90 percent of holiday shoppers plan to spend the same amount or less than last year. Of those cutting back, more than a third blame the economy. Cyber Monday is just around the corner. Traditionally a big day for online retailers as shoppers return to their computers at the office. According to a survey from Shop.org, nearly 73 million workers will look for deals on the Web that day. Not a bad idea. Shop.org also says there will be more online promotions offered this year than last. So, expect to see lots of free shipping offers.
Holiday motorists are getting lots of help from falling gas prices. AAA reports the national average for a gallon of unleaded gasoline is under 2 bucks. That's a dollar less than we saw last Thanksgiving.
Next week, we'll get the Labor Department's November jobs report. Some analysts expect the unemployment rate will climb to 6.8 percent from 6.5 percent last month.
That's this week's "Getting Down to Business." Stephanie Elam, CNN, New York.
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LEMON: Certainly hope you had a great Thanksgiving. I'm Don Lemon. We thank you for joining us tonight. We'll see you back here next weekend, Saturday 5:00 p.m. and 11:00 p.m., and Sunday 6:00 p.m. and now we're back on at 10:00 p.m. on Sundays. Have a good week, everyone.
