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White House Says it's Ready to Handle Bailout; Illinois Attorney General to Hold News Conference; UAW's Position
Aired December 12, 2008 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: And hello, everyone. I'm Tony Harris in the CNN NEWSROOM. Here are the headlines from CNN for this Friday, the 12th day of December, 2008.
A rescue package for Detroit automakers. Congress says no, but the White House could still step in to save the industry.
How the collapse of the automobile industry might impact one town. I will talk live with the mayor of Lansing, Michigan.
And this...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The way that the financial sector is functioning right now and the way our entire government is functioning is with such high levels of debt and such high levels of risk, it's so unsustainable. And I think that in the long term, we will suffer the consequences of this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: And our Friday series, "Class in Session." High school kids looking at life down the road.
Detroit looking for a new lease on life today. It won't come from the U.S. Congress, but there are other avenues.
Here's what we know right now.
The White House is signaling President Bush could tap money from the $700 billion financial industry bailout. It was approved by Congress, as you'll remember, in October. Last night the Senate rejected a standalone rescue package for Detroit. The 52-35 procedural vote was pretty much along party lines.
Senate Republicans demanded the United Auto Workers union agree to wage concessions by a date certain. This morning, the UAW painted it as an attempt to undercut the union.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RON GETTELFINGER, UAW PRESIDENT: We've already stepped forward and made enormous concessions, but as we made it clear last night, we were prepared to make further sacrifices. But we could not accept the effort by the Senate GOP caucus to single out workers and retirees for different treatment and to make them shoulder the entire burden of any restructuring.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: And let's begin our coverage of Detroit at a crossroads with our Kathleen Koch. She's at the White House.
Kathleen, good to see you again.
What's being discussed there? What's in the works?
KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Tony, alternatives are being discussed, and right now, according to the White House, the only alternative that they will actually name is TARP, that Troubled Asset Relief Program that you just mentioned. It was passed by Congress back in October and was supposed to be there to help rescue the financial services sector. And the White House has long said we are not going to use this money to help Detroit.
Well, with the failure of this legislation in the Senate, they really have no choice. Press Secretary Dana Perino, in a statement, saying, "A precipitous collapse of this industry would have a severe impact on our economy and it would be irresponsible to further weaken and destabilize our economy at this time."
Now, the White House has access to about $15 billion of the first $350 billion that was authorized by Congress to use. So it could go ahead and devote that to Detroit. Sort of a short-term bridge loan kind of a measure. This is a real turnabout for the White House, and it comes only after fiscal conservatives up in the Senate were unable to craft a compromise that they felt would actually turn things in Detroit around.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BOB CORKER (R), TENNESSEE: If the White House puts TARP money in on top of GM's $62 billion in debt, OK, and doesn't require all of these things that I'm talking about to happen, OK, all they're doing is throwing good money after bad. I mean, in essence, you're piling a lot of money in debt on top of a company that already has more debt than it can pay back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KOCH: Now, according to Perino, President Bush was briefed late last night that the vote had failed. Obviously, she says the White House is very disappointed. And she said the president right now is in touch with his economic advisers looking at what their options are. She says they don't have a specific time frame right now in which they plan to act.
As to what those other options are, though, Tony, right now it's a bit of a mystery. Reporters asked, and she won't elaborate. But TARP is the one thing they are definitely talking about.
HARRIS: OK. Kathleen Koch at the White House for us.
Kathleen, thank you.
KOCH: You bet.
HARRIS: President-elect Barack Obama weighing in on the collapse of the auto bailout loan and the possibility the White House could step in.
CNN's Elaine Quijano live from Chicago right now.
And Elaine, good to see you.
What is the president-elect saying?
ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, certainly expressing disappointment. Good afternoon to you, Tony.
President-elect Barack Obama released a written statement this morning saying, "I am disappointed that the Senate could not reach agreement on a short-term plan for the auto industry. I share the frustration of so many about the decades of mismanagement in this industry that has helped deliver the current crisis. Those bad practices cannot be rewarded or continued, but I also know that millions of Americans jobs rely directly or indirectly on a viable auto industry, and that the beginnings of reform are at hand."
Now, the president-elect's statement went on to commend lawmakers and the Bush administration for efforts to forge some kind of compromise. The president-elect, though, also made clear that in his view, any short-term help for the U.S. automakers has to also be tied to some long-term restructuring for Detroit -- Tony.
HARRIS: All right. Elaine Quijano for us in Chicago.
Elaine, appreciate it. Thank you.
And our Veronica De La Cruz has her eyes on the Web throughout the morning. And she's gauging reaction there.
Veronica, what are you finding?
VERONICA DE LA CRUZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Keeping track of it all -- Facebook, Twitter, watching the blogs, also watching CNN.com. Namely, "Quick Vote."
And Tony, we've been watching this "Quick Vote" together this morning. It does look like people's opinions are pretty evenly divided on this one.
Taking a look right now, about 50 percent of the people are saying, yes, and exactly 50 percent are saying no. Ninety-four thousand people have voted so far. Remember, this is an unscientific poll.
If you want to cast your vote, you can log on to CNN.com right now.
All right. Let's get you to some of those e-mail comments that have been coming in this morning.
This is from J. Kathol in Hardington, Nebraska. She says, "My opinion is that as much as I hate to say it, they should be thrown a lifeline. I hate to see millions of people lose their jobs. The collapse of GM would be truly monumental and quite likely the most devastating industrial disaster in our country."
"We cannot afford to lose any more jobs. The tax base has eroded greatly this year. Our country is in such peril. Save the last industry we have left."
And then from Rebecca A., who says, "No, they should not get any money from the government. My husband had to give 10 hours a week to help with keeping his plant open, and those overpaid auto workers are no better than he is. After all, what they do is not rocket science. If they don't want to give anything to help keep their jobs, then they don't need them very bad."
All right. Now looking at our Facebook page, this is from Darrell Kahoali (ph). He says, "No, President Bush should not tap into any funds for the bailout. If he does, it will only be to save the downward spiral of his legacy. Let them fail, get rid of the UAW and Gettelfinger, and file for Chapter 11. It is not the end of the world. In order to fix the problem, they need to fail."
All right. So there you go, Facebook. We've also been following it on Twitter.
If you'd like to cast your vote, log on to CNN.com. And if you'd like to e-mail us, you can e-mail us at cnnnewsroom@cnn.com.
Tony.
HARRIS: Veronica, appreciate it. Thank you.
And very quickly, fast-moving developments this year, the last couple of hours right here in the NEWSROOM.
We want to get you to our Drew Griffin. He is in Chicago with the latest developments on the political scandal surrounding Illinois's governor, Rod Blagojevich.
Drew, what do you have?
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: The attorney general of Illinois is expected just in the next few minutes to announce that she is indeed filing a petition with the Illinois Supreme Court, what she called Rule 382, challenging whether the governor, Rod Blagojevich, is fit to serve, is -- or whether he is unfit and should be removed.
I talked to Lisa Madigan, the attorney general, a few days ago. This has never been done before, but she feels it's needed because the governor is not resigning, and there is just a lack of any kind of efficacy on the part of the governor while he's trying to face off these allegations by the U.S. Attorney's Office. Also in the works on Monday, Lisa Madigan's father is the House speaker in Illinois, Speaker Madigan. He and other Democrats expected to take up the issue of whether or not Governor Blagojevich should be impeached.
But immediately, we're expecting a news conference where Illinois' attorney general, Lisa Madigan, will announce she is indeed filing a petition with the Supreme Court to basically ask the Supreme Court to remove Governor Blagojevich from the governor's office because he is unfit.
HARRIS: And Drew, my understanding is that news conference is set to begin in the next 10 minutes or so. Is that your understanding as well?
GRIFFIN: That's right. I'm at the Thompson Center here, the state office building in downtown Chicago, and it's supposed to start at 11:15. But again, from aides, we understand that this is what's going to happen in that news conference, that the attorney general will announce this move on her part to remove the governor.
HARRIS: Yes. OK.
CNN Investigative Correspondent Drew Griffin for us.
Drew, appreciate it. Thank you.
What if there's no deal? I will speaking to a representative of the UAW and a governor who would have to deal with the economic fallout.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Well, some Senate Republicans blaming the Auto Workers union for the collapse of the bailout loan bill. Tennessee Senator Bob Corker says the sticking point was a deadline for the union to agree to pay cuts.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CORKER: We had an arrangement last night that we were just six minutes away from a full agreement that would have really caused these companies to be able to go into the future very healthy -- healthfully. We worked out the capital structure, which is the amount of debt these companies had. We had bondholder exchanges, we had equity cram-downs, we had all kinds of things that were agreed to. And it came down to one thing, and that was just getting the UAW to agree to a date certain that they would be competitive.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Joining us to talk about the union's position, Mike Green, president of UAW Local 652 in Lansing, Michigan.
And Mike, good to see you again. Thanks for your time. Hey, the bottom line from Senator Corker there, and I would have to say from Senator Coburn, who we spoke with last hour, is that the workers, the union, you simply have to give more on compensation. Are you prepared to do that?
MIKE GREEN, PRESIDENT, UAW LOCAL 652: Well, I guess it wouldn't be so much of what they agreed to, as what they want to hold you hostage to. I mean, like Ron's already said, in the '07 agreement, we cut the wage in half. How many companies can say they've cut the wage in half?
Talking about pensions, you don't have a pension unless you pay into a pension. You don't have health care after you retire unless you pay into it. I mean, how many companies can say they've already done that?
HARRIS: Well, Mike, the Republican senators are saying that you're holding, that the union members, the union leadership, that you, as a collective, are holding this deal hostage.
GREEN: No. I wouldn't say that was true. I mean, if anything else, have we learned nothing from the banking system, through predator lending? I mean, do they want to -- what they want to do is set us up to fail from the very beginning?
You know, Ron's not going to agree with that. He's looking out after all the people, not just UAW people, but middle class America.
You know, my home's been flooded with hundreds of calls that are not even UAW people saying keep up the good work. We know you're out there protecting middle class America. Thank you very much and God bless you.
HARRIS: Hey Mike, I want you to listen to President Gettelfinger from last hour, and then I've got a question four.
GREEN: OK.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GETTELFINGER: A union is the only estimate that gives working men and women any form of equity and justice in the workplace. It gives them a voice at the table, and it's very clear that there are those who would do away with that tonight if they could.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Mike, your union leader says the Senate vote, in essence -- I'm paraphrasing here, and maybe adding a couple words that he didn't -- says that the Senate vote was about breaking the UAW. Do you agree?
GREEN: Yes, I agree. I mean, you know, finally somebody comes out and says it.
I mean, if you look at the way the vote goes and what different people are saying, you know, they're all looking after their own best interests, where we're looking after everybody's best interests. Like I was saying, middle class America, all the things that are attached to this and the devastation that's going happen if this doesn't go through.
HARRIS: If you believe that, Mike, if you believe that, you have to tell me why you believe it.
GREEN: I believe it because you just look at the devastation that's going to trickle down if the big three goes under and all the things that are attached to it. People aren't going to have jobs. People are going to be laid off. You know, who's going to build things? Who's going to protect this country?
HARRIS: You would essentially be saying that the Republicans would be in favor of job losses and what kind of impact that would have on this economy overall? Do you really believe that?
GREEN: Yes. I think they just narrowed it down to where this is their chance to try to break the labor unions. And you know, they make it sound like it's all about money in the contracts.
You know, that's not just about money. It's about working conditions, it's about health and safety. You don't hear anybody talking about that part of it. That all goes along with it.
HARRIS: And to break the union because -- let me try this one on you -- because unions have historically been a dependable constituency bloc for Democrats?
GREEN: Yes, you could say that. I mean, if you want to talk about dependent on unions, you can depend on them all the time.
I mean, you know through heavy industry, we're the ones that helped win the war, we're the ones that manufactured things to protect this country. They've met every challenge that's come before them, the people that work at the big three.
HARRIS: You believe the president will authorize the Treasury to cut checks to the automakers through the TARP program?
GREEN: I believe if he's going to do the right thing he will.
HARRIS: All right, Mike. Appreciate it. Thanks for your time.
GREEN: Thank you.
HARRIS: OK. Let's go to John Couwels now. He has an update on the situation with Caylee Anthony and the remains found yesterday.
And perhaps -- we still don't have any kind of positive identification yet, but what's the very latest?
JOHN COUWELS, CNN ALL-PLATFORM JOURNALIST: Hi, Tony.
The latest is coming out of an emergency hearing that was requested by Casey Anthony's attorney, Jose Baez, had asked that for the request to join the investigators as they presented -- as they did the autopsy and did the DNA examination of the body that was found yesterday. Prosecutors did say in the hearing today that, anthropologically, it resembled Caylee Anthony, from the fact of hair color matched and possible eye color matched. But they did say very clearly that they did not have a tentative I.D., and that they were not able to say, you know, absolutely that this was Caylee Anthony.
HARRIS: John, let's backtrack for just a second here. Who is doing the speaking now on the record? Who is giving you this information?
COUWELS: This was inside the -- in the actual courtroom from the prosecutors. Both were discussing generally with the -- during this emergency hearing to Judge Stan Strickland (ph), following the request for this defense to be a part of the autopsy and the DNA testing. They also had asked for the right to go to the crime scene, which the judge ultimately, and the defense and the prosecution, decided that they would allow them the opportunity to go to the crime scene once it was cleared. But they did repeat several times that they could not positive -- they could not even tentatively I.D., and they could not give even a timeline when they would give a positive I.D., because the body is now currently in the possession of the FBI lab.
HARRIS: OK. So we have a long way to go before we get a positive identification.
COUWELS: Yes. The judge even asked, could you even just give me a slight idea of when we could get a tentative? And they said, no, we have no idea. We can't even give you a timeline.
HARRIS: All right. John, appreciate it.
John Couwels is one of CNN all-platform journalists for us following the case in Florida.
John, appreciate it. Thank you.
The chairman of the Senate Banking Committee front and center in the failed effort to pass the bailout loan for the automakers. So what went wrong, and what now?
Democratic Senator Chris Dodd of Connecticut joins us from Capitol Hill.
Senator, thanks for your time.
Maybe let's start with those two questions. What happened? What went wrong?
SEN. CHRISTOPHER DODD (D), CONNECTICUT: Well, there were four of us in the room last night. And unfortunately, the matter came down to a timing question.
The only one of the entities involved in all of this, the entire chain, from dealers, suppliers, manufacturers and labor, was being asked to meet an exact time certain were with the workers. And that was to have you agree to benefits, wages and working conditions, work rules, established for automobile manufacturers in the country.
Now, remember this, they had already agreed to do that. The question is when. And like manufacturers who are asked to determine a time certain for viability, said we can't make that determination.
HARRIS: Yes.
DODD: Obviously we're an economy here that's volatile. It's the worst it's been in maybe 80 years. So I can just tell you flat out, having been in the room, it only came down to whether or not these people would be willing to take a wage cut immediately, almost immediately.
Now, I find it somewhere ironic here. Working people have lost $2,000 in earning capacity in eight years here, and here we are with costs going up everywhere across the country, being laid on. The only demand here, in a sense, in the end was not viability of the companies. We were dealing with that. This only involved maybe 10 percent of the cost.
But the working hour working people are struggling to make ends meet, a handful of Republicans in the Senate, not all of them -- there were 10 or so more Republicans willing to support what the White House, the Bush White House, and ourselves spent eight days negotiating to put together, passed the House the other night. It had more than 50 votes last night in the Senate. But a handful of people decided that unless working people here would take a wage cut in the worst economic circumstances that working people are facing, then they weren't going to go forward with it.
I think it's tragic, but now we ought to go forward.
HARRIS: But Senator Dodd, why? Is it because they just didn't want to do the deal?
DODD: It's politics. Yes, absolutely.
HARRIS: Well, talk -- great. Well, talk us through the politics of this, if you would.
DODD: Well, I think you heard some of it already. This was not about economics, because clearly the wage issues amount to less than 10 percent of the indebtedness of these companies and the costs. The bulk of it is, of course, dealing with bondholders and, of course, these health care costs and the like that have been mentioned earlier.
That we negotiated. Bob Corker came in and said, would you negotiate -- there are three items I cared about that we must have here. And two and three-quarters of the items we agreed on. The one quarter was a time certain when parity between domestic auto workers and foreign-owned auto workers would have to be met. And no one can tell when you that's actually going to happen.
And to walk away from what we did last evening, to demand that particular outcome at a time when people's incomes and wages are declining and costs are rising, went too far. And unfortunately, that's what broke this down.
Now, the good news is, I think the White House will step up, and we ought to look forward. We can spend all our time talking about last night. That's tragic and sad. But I believe the White House will step up, as I urged them to do almost a month ago, and utilize some of these TARP funds to step in and keep this at least alive to see whether or not we can restructure this industry.
HARRIS: Do you believe, Senator Dodd, that Republican senators are on some kind of a mission to break what has been described the Cadillac of unions, the UAW?
DODD: Well, again, I could spend my time doing that. And as I said, there were about 10 Republicans last night who joined us. In fact, Bob Corker voted with me last night to go forward with the debate.
He did a good job, but I think he was sent on a mission that he could never complete because they were never going to allow this -- had we taken just the provisions they were demanding, which you couldn't accept, the House of Representatives would have rejected that offer. I don't think it would have passed the Senate last night.
There were those who wanted to get to bankruptcy immediately. They believed that going into Chapter 11 bankruptcy was the only answer here. And every analyst I've talked to over the last month who has spent a lifetime studying this industry believes that if you went into Chapter 11 bankruptcy, you'd virtually be in Chapter 7...
HARRIS: Yes.
DODD: And that is, you've been sitting, having basically -- selling assets, and we no longer would have an automobile manufacturing sector to speak of in our country.
HARRIS: All right. One final question. The signals are out there that the president wants to do something. What are you hearing in terms of a time frame, timetable, to get something done?
DODD: Well, Tony, pretty quickly I hope. And I'll just share with you, this morning I spoke with my auto dealers in Connecticut this morning, the head of them. We have banks literally calling the mortgages on dealerships as we speak.
We have -- and so the bottom is falling. The banks were watching last night, what happened. Credit is completely gone.
One of my major banks in New England who has been providing credit to dealers has already announced there will be no more credit. So there is a cascading occurring as you and I are talking. So I'm hopeful that this day, before the day ends, the White House will make that decision, send that signal the markets need to hear before even more damage is done. In a matter of hours now. We're not talking days or weeks now, we're talking hours. HARRIS: Yes, it sounds like it.
Senator Dodd, thanks for your time. We appreciate it.
DODD: You bet. Thank you, Tony.
HARRIS: All right. From a crumbling auto industry to America's crumbling infrastructure, our bridges and roads are desperately in need of repair. And President-elect Barack Obama wants to put jobless Americans to the task of fixing them.
Joining me now to talk about how he is going to put his folks to work is the governor of Maryland.
Smile. Behave like we know each other.
GOV. MARTIN O'MALLEY (D), MARYLAND: Tony, how are you?
HARRIS: Stop giving me the stern face there, Martin. Good to see you.
O'MALLEY: Hey, good to see you. It's good to be with you and hear you.
HARRIS: That's right. It's good to see you.
What would be the impact, in your estimation, on the port of Baltimore -- let's just start there -- of a bankruptcy of, say, GM and/or Chrysler?
O'MALLEY: Oh, it would be devastating. It would have a cascading effect.
You know, we have several hundred employees at one of the most productive plants, Allison (ph) Transmission, that makes the new hybrid transmissions. So it certainly would affect them.
It would affect the -- you know, the cargo that moves through the port. I think the second largest roll-on, roll-off port in the United States of America. It would have a huge cascading effect.
It's a real shame that a few people in the Senate and the Republican Party were able to keep this from happening, but hopefully the White House, with the authority they have, will manage to keep the industry on its feet, at least until President Obama can get sworn in and we can start making some more progress.
HARRIS: Martin, the economic stimulus package that we've heard a lot about -- and we know it's coming -- what was your takeaway from the governor's meeting with the president-elect?
O'MALLEY: You know, I had so many takeaways. Let me -- first off, to have a president that actually talks to governors and big city mayors as the colleagues and fellow public servants that we are was refreshing in and of itself. But I really got the impression that President-elect Obama wants to immediately address this sort of deflationary spiral, the lack of employment, the lack of economic demand, by getting America back to work, building infrastructure.
I mean, let's face it, we are going to have to go into some greater debt than we've already incurred over these last eight years to do this, but President Obama -- and the governors agree with him -- believes that if we're going to borrow these dollars, at least we should be doing things like rebuilding our infrastructure, our roads, our bridges, our mass transit systems so that our children will have some legacy benefit from this effort to restart our economy. So we're all focused on this.
We've provided lots of documentation on all of the projects that are ready to go, Tony. They've already gone through planning. They've already gone through design. But they're sitting there on a shelf because we don't have the construction dollars.
HARRIS: Can I ask you to hazard a guess? I mean, you've talked to other governors around the country, obviously. How big of a stimulus package do you think is needed? I mean, if you were designing it, where would you start as minimum?
O'MALLEY: Oh, golly.
HARRIS: $500 billion, $700 billion is what we're heard. Does that sound about right?
O'MALLEY: I would say in the neighborhood of $500 billion and up, depending, again, on how it's structured.
There are many projects that we could get going, you know, within 180 days sort of time frame. But there are other projects that if we knew we had the dollars to complete, we could get those rolling now, and they could come on the follow-on year. So it's hard to pin an actual number down until we sort out what we're talking about.
And in addition to the stimulus and the rebuilding and the bridges, the tunnels, and those sorts of things, there's also the fact that every state finds its safety net of Medicaid and unemployment stretched when people are losing their jobs. So we need to shore up that as well. Otherwise, we could be putting people back to work, but our state governments would be left to lay even more people off in order to make their Medicaid payments and the match, which is a 50/50 match. So it's both of those things.
HARRIS: Yes. And Martin -- and one final question for you.
I'm assuming that you know and maybe you've had conversations with Illinois' governor, Rod Blagojevich. I just have to ask you, what in the criminal complaint was most surprising to you?
O'MALLEY: I find the whole thing surprising. I've never shaken the governor's hand. I know that's hard to believe, but, you know, the Democratic Governors Association, I've never seen him in two years come to one meeting. So the first time I saw him was at that meeting in Philadelphia.
I really don't know the man very well. I guess what was so appalling and shocking and offensive was just the -- you know, the brazenness of this.
You know, the vast majority of elected officials are people that do a good job, they want to do a good job. And there may be differences of opinions on issues, but this sort of behavior was really offensive, I think, to every citizen in the country.
HARRIS: Yes. Martin, great to see you.
O'MALLEY: Good to see you, Tony.
HARRIS: Great to see you. Have a great weekend.
O'MALLEY: Hey, thank you.
HARRIS: We'll talk again soon.
O'MALLEY: See you.
HARRIS: And that provides a bit of a segue to what we're anticipating in just a couple of minutes.
Let's take you to Chicago there, and you see -- at least the location where the news conference is scheduled to begin any moment now. The attorney general of Illinois, Lisa Madigan, set to hold a news conference. The news here is that she has asked the top state court, the Illinois Supreme Court, to declare Governor Blagojevich unable to serve.
When that news conference begins we will, of course, bring it to you right here in the NEWSROOM.
A lot of communities across the country facing very hard times if the auto industry fails. I will speak to the mayor of Lansing, Michigan, that man, in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Lansing, capital city of Michigan, home to a relatively new plant that turns out Cadillacs. What would GM's bankruptcy mean to the city? Verge Bernero is the mayor of Lansing.
Mr. Mayor, thanks for your time. Thanks for making yourself available to us. I first have to ask you, what was your reaction to the vote in the Senate last night?
MAYOR VIRG BERNERO, LANSING, MI.: Well, most of it I can't say on TV. But we were devastated and very disappointed that there seems to be this disconnect, and to have Republican senators on the floor of the U.S. Senate calling for people to take less, to reduce the standard of living. It really make as statement about where we are as country.
But I would say they should lead by example. Let those senators, where they really produce hot air and hysteria along with Wall Street. Let them lead the way. Those Republican senators that wanted to block this thing. Billions for Wall Street, billions, with no strings attached, but they have a real problem with a $15 billion bridge loan for hard-working people. Real people, who make real things, unlike some of these products that are made on Wall Street.
HARRIS: Mr. Mayor, do you believe the UAW could have come up with anything to satisfy the Republican senators last night?
BERNERO: That's a good question, Tony. I don't. I think they wanted this thing to fail, were looking for something to hang a no- vote on. They really wanted to break the back -- this was politics. Break the back of the union. You know, the UAW and the Big Three together helped create the middle class in this country. They've made historic concessions. That's the other thing. They have already made concessions and they were willing to make more.
The question is, I would ask them, how low must we go? They've already exported our standard of living with these trade agreements - bad trade agreements, with bad enforcement of those agreements. And they've sold the American worker down the road, down the river, and now they -- where will it end? Textiles? Electronics? You name the industry that has been hit by this unfair trade. The American workers is the most productive in the world, and they can compete if it's a level playing field.
HARRIS: Why? Why? Why? Explain to you why Senate Republicans would want to essentially break the back of the UAW?
BERNERO: Well, I guess that's because the -- you have to ask them. I assume it is because the UAW is very effective.
HARRIS: The suggestion from some is that the unions in general have been such a loyal constituency group for Democrats that that's the politics involved here. What's your thinking?
BERNERO: I think that's part of it. That's part of it. Let me say my bias, so nobody, in the interests of full disclosure. My dad retired from GM. We were the benefit of UAW/GM benefits. And you know as far as I'm concerned what do the auto companies have to apologize for? They have made great changes, they're cleaner, greener than ever before. General Motors makes more hybrid vehicles than any other company in the world. We make the award-winning Cadillac CTS, "Motor Trend" Car of the Year. Don't tell me they're not making cars that people want. So there's been a marriage of the UAW of the Big Three and it has worked, largely. Even the Chrysler bailout, Chrysler investment 30 years ago, that worked. That paid off. That loan was paid off ahead of schedule and in full. Can Wall Street and Washington point to results like that? I'll stack up the auto industry against them any day of the week.
HARRIS: Mr. Mayor, let me try to sneak one more question in before we get to a news conference in Chicago. Are you heartened by the fact that it appears at least help may be on the way from the White House?
BERNERO: Very much so. And I appeal to President Bush, please, and the Treasury Department, please do the right thing. Think about your legacy. These people deserve the help. Give them this bridge loan to get to the future. We want great cars, green cars made in America by Americans. We can be exporting them to the world. We have American ingenuity. It can work. But we need to buy this time. Please, Mr. President, do the right thing.
HARRIS: Mr. Mayor, thanks for your time, today. Virg Bernero is the mayor of Lansing, Michigan. Thanks again for your time here.
Try to sneak in some weather right now. Reynolds Wolf in the Severe Weather Center.
And, Reynolds, what are you watching, sir?
REYNOLDS WOLF, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, Tony, yesterday we had that big storm system that made its way along the Eastern Seaboard, that brought a combination of rains sleet, snow, ice to a good part of the country. Now we're watching another system begin to ramp up and this one is going to take full aim on part of the Pacific Northwest.
Already, on the map behind me, its colored like a Christmas tree. You've got some red, you've got some green, you even have a few pink spots here and there indicating watches, washings, even a few blizzard warnings in parts of the Cascades. What we anticipate, is for this the storm system out of the Gulf of Alaska, just off the Northwest coast, going to transitioning from a rainmaker to a snowmaker. Also, a lot of wind in the mountain passes that is really going to hampering visibility in places like 90, 84, along I-5, near Longview and Olympia.
Already we're seeing some scattered showers, but in higher elevations where it mixes in with the colder air aloft, we're seeing some snow. As I mentioned, that snow could get especially deep. There are some locations where you could see it stack up in excess of 20 inches of snow. The color code here at the top, lighter precipitation, by the lighter colors, but when it turns that purplish, that is where you see the heavy snow bands. Some of it just to the east of Portland and east of Eugene into parts of the Cascades.
Going to be a big mess. This is what you can anticipated for the next 48 hours. Also with this storm system, it is gong to continue to march its way across the U.S. Later on, eventually affecting places like the Northern Plains.
Meantime, eastern third of the country, after yesterday's crazy day, today and then into tomorrow, it's going to be a much better day. High pressure building in with that, it will have a calming effect on the atmosphere. So pretty decent conditions for you, but it's going to be the Western half of the nation, that is going to be under the gun.
In terms of travel, a lot of people are going to be heading home today. Some may be leaving for a vacation, you will have to be patient at the airport. La Guardia, Newark, Boston, you have delays. Some places, ground delays, thankfully not caused by the weather you're seeing out in the Pacific Northwest.
OK, Tony, you're up to speed. That's the latest forecast.
HARRIS: Sure. Reynolds, appreciate it. Thank you.
Once again, a live picture now, let's take you to Chicago. We are anticipating any moment now a news conference. Illinois's attorney general, her name is Lisa Madigan, is set to hold this news conference. The news here is that Attorney General Madigan is asking the Illinois supreme court to declare Governor Rod Blagojevich unable to serve. When that news conference begins we will bring it to you live right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Breaking news now, standing by for a news conference set to begin any moment now. We saw some movement in the room just moments ago that indicated that we might be very, very close. Illinois' attorney general, her name is Lisa Madigan, ready to make some remarks. Let's listen in.
(BEGIN LIVE FEED)
LISA MADIGAN, ATTORNEY GENERAL, ILLINOIS: Good afternoon.
This morning my office filed pleadings with the Illinois supreme court requesting that Governor Blagojevich be temporarily removed from office. In the alternative we have asked that the Illinois supreme court declare that he is prevented from filling the U.S. Senate vacancy, acting on legislation, directing contracts, directing the activities of the Illinois state finance authority, directing activities of the toll highway authority, and directing the disbursement of state funds.
I have asked the supreme court to appoint the lieutenant governor as the acting governor, pursuant to the Succession Act. I recognize that this is an extraordinary request, but these are extraordinary circumstances. As we learned on Tuesday morning, U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald arrested Governor Blagojevich at his home and charged him with criminal conduct that Fitzgerald described as a political corruption crime spree.
The criminal complaint alleges that in his own words Governor Blagojevich was going to make decisions on official acts based on what was best for his legal situation, his personal situation, and his political situation. As governor, Mr. Blagojevich's duty is to do what is best for the people of the state of Illinois. Not for himself. In light of his arrest and the filing of the criminal complaint, Governor Blagojevich can no longer fulfill his official duties with any legitimacy.
Based on Article 5, Section 6 of the Illinois Constitution, and Illinois Supreme Court Rule 382, we filed with the Illinois supreme court a motion for leave to file a verified complaint for declaratory and conjunctive relief, a brief in support of the motion to file a complaint, and a motion for a temporary restraining order and/or a preliminary injunction.
Let me note that the Illinois supreme court has discretion as to whether or not to hear this case. I would hope that in light of these extraordinary and unprecedented circumstances the court will provide the people of the state an opportunity to present their case. Because while the legislature is scheduled to convene in special session on Monday, and I have encouraged them to move forward with impeachment proceedings, the impeachment process will take time. In the interim, state government is paralyzed by a governor who is incapable of governing.
My actions will not eliminate the need for impeachment and trial and the Illinois Constitution gives the Illinois supreme court the authority to determine the governor's ability to serve. As the attorney general it is my job to serve as the lawyer for the people of the state, and it is my job to present this question to the court.
Let me also be clear that my pleadings are not, they are not, about whether the governor's conduct should result in his criminal conviction. This case is about whether the governor has the ability to legitimately and effectively carry out his duties and exercise his authority as governor. The U.S. attorney has indicated that his office and the FBI will continue to investigate the allegations in the complaint, and will continue to pursue this matter.
This is a question of first impression for the court, and I believe it is necessary and appropriate to present this issue to the court. Let me thank all of the lawyers in my office who have worked tirelessly since Tuesday on this matter.
In addition, we are pleased to have Abner Mikva and Barry Gross serving as special assistant attorneys general on this matter.
Let me now introduce those people whom you may not recognize, who are standing behind me. Alan Rosen, who serves as our deputy - chief deputy attorney general; Michael Scodro, who serves as the solicitor general for the state of Illinois. -- somebody else who is hiding behind you -- Roger Flavin (ph) who serves as the deputy attorney general for civil litigation, Paul Gaynor (ph), serving as the chief of the public interest division, Carl Bugettes (ph), who serves as the chief of Special Litigation Bureau. John Rosenblatt, who serves as an assistant attorney general in the Special Litigation Bureau and Brent Legner, who serves as an assistant attorney general in the Civil Appeals Division.
With that I would be happy to answer some of your questions.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) Time line on this might be --
MADIGAN: We would certainly hope that Illinois supreme court would move forward recognizing these extraordinary circumstances and, therefore, with speed, which is why we filed a TRO. However --
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Yes. We filed a temporary restraining order, and what that would normally do is accelerate the process of a lawsuit.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Correct. Correct, Andy. But let me also state that Illinois supreme court rule 382 is very bare boned. It basically provides the ability to file a pleading with the Illinois supreme court, but does not set out any procedure or process after that for how they will choose to handle this. So the Illinois supreme court could do virtually anything. They could deny us, even the ability to file this complaint. They could grant a TRO. They could say that the governor should be removed immediately. They could say that they want briefing. They could read the pleadings and -- it's hard to say what they will do at this point.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: And if the court gives him that opportunity, yes.
QUESTION: A TRO, in a case as serious as this would seem to be unlikely. Would it not? Given the court wanting to make sure and you make your argument to the court (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Well, we thought it was important to file a TRO, because of the urgency of this. It has been three days since we learned of the criminal complaint, and Governor Blagojevich's arrest, and in those intervening three days, there are matters of state business that cannot be moved forward in a legitimate manner. And so we want to make sure that the court recognizes as do the people of the state of Illinois the urgency for us to have a governor who can legitimately and effectively exercise the duties of that office.
QUESTION: And one follow-up to that, please?
MADIGAN: Go ahead.
QUESTION: Legislative leaders believe that the impeachment process is carried out as quickly as possible would take perhaps one month. Do you believe this could be done a lot quicker than that?
MADIGAN: I do not know how quickly an impeachment procedure would take, and so the legislature will have to make that determination. Probably on an ongoing basis, if they decide to pursue that.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Sure.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: I'm going to give you one example. Short-term borrowing; As you are aware the state of Illinois is behind in paying its bills, in particular to Medicaid providers. I believe we have a backlog of at least a billion dollars in bills. In order to make those payments there was short-term borrowing that was scheduled in the very near future. At this point, they have postponed that, and it may be very difficult, if not impossible, to move forward on short-term borrowing.
Because as part of that process, as the attorney general, I play a number of roles. One is to essentially review and say that the short-term borrowing is legal, but another portion of that requires me to sign a certificate certifying that I am not aware of any proceeding or threatened litigation challenging the authority of the governor to hold his office, and so I at this point would not necessarily be able to sign that. So I'm currently working with OMB to determine how we can proceed and handle that.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Yes.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: I believe we do have that certificate. Roger? We do.
QUESTION: Is this track different (OFF-MIKE) Are you comfortable that this (OFF-MIKE) doesn't have any impact (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Correct.
QUESTION: Did they go along with the need for legislature to take (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Let me stop your question, because I have an answer. I see where you're going. No. With these filings we still think that it is imperative for the legislature to make a decision, and hopefully proceed with impeachment proceedings. But we're essentially saying to the Illinois supreme court, is based on these extraordinary circumstances, we want them to make sure that we put in place the lieutenant governor to serve as the acting governor, so that the business of the state of Illinois can move forward as opposed to having an interim period where we're paralyzed at the state level.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Usually with the TRO there's a 10-day period, for some sort of a response. Mr. Scodro, correct? Or a five-day period? So, obviously one of the reasons for filing the TRO is to shorten that window. Normally when we file a complaint it's almost a month after service until anything occurs.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Correct. As soon as possible, yes.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Say it again? What we have put -
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: That is not contained in our pleadings. What we have delineated are all of the activities that were contained in the criminal complaint filed by the U.S. attorney. So the filling of the U.S. Senate seat, making any state disbursements, and this is based on the apparent refusal to provide Medicaid reimbursement to Children's Memorial Hospital unless he received a campaign contribution from its CEO; the potential to not sign legislation on racing industry subsidies unless he potentially received a campaign contribution, the desire to enter into any business regarding contracts, in particular, the Toll Highway Authority has a plan over $1.8 billion plan for further construction.
So what we have done is to delineated all of those things and say if the Illinois supreme court does not want to put in place lieutenant governor as the acting governor across the board, at least for these categories of activities, he should be placed in that position. Because it is unclear, and obviously we think illegitimate for Governor Blagojevich to undertake any of those activities.
QUESTION: Did you have any - did you have any --
MADIGAN: You haven't had an opportunity.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: I'm in favor of the legislature moving forward with legislation to create a special election, but obviously it will be up to them to make that determination.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: I serve as the attorney general of the state of Illinois, and in that capacity I am the lawyer for the people of the state of Illinois. We are facing an extraordinary situation, and so we want to make sure that this state has a governor who can act legitimately. The law gives the authority to Illinois supreme court to make a determination as to whether or not Governor Blagojevich is able to serve. We think it is very clear that he incapable serving, and we are certainly hopeful that the Illinois supreme court will hear this matter, and appoint Lieutenant Governor Quinn as the acting governor.
QUESTION: In reference to 382 and the restraining order is that something -- just so I understand -- there's nothing that someone only in your capacity to file, or could the average citizen file either one of those?
MADIGAN: It -- Rule 382 does not specify. And so as the attorney general, I serve as the lawyer for the people of the state and because of that I believe it appropriate to go to the state supreme court and file these matters.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: At this point we are purely focused on making sure that state government runs for the benefit of the people of the state of Illinois. Political issues and political matters are not even on my radar screen this week.
QUESTION: How long before the governor -- (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: That depends on what happens. So if the Illinois supreme court would say that they temporarily remove Governor Blagojevich, appoint the lieutenant governor to serve as the acting governor, a number of things could happen. The legislature could move forward on impeachment, and ultimately impeach the governor. In which case the lieutenant governor would become the governor of the state of Illinois. They may choose not to do that.
In addition, obviously, the U.S. attorney's office plans on continuing their investigation, and probably filing an indictment. Governor Blagojevich could lose his position, if he is convicted. In addition, there could be a circumstance where neither of those things occur, and then the Illinois supreme court, Governor Blagojevich could come back to the Illinois supreme court, and ask them to remove this disability status and reinstate him as the governor.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
(CROSS TALK)
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: I do not believe that he should be, but I do not know the answer to that question, no.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: We obviously have that concern, but what we have laid out in our pleadings is that whether or not the impeachment proceeding moves ahead, and let's assume it moves ahead, there is still an intervening time period during which the state of Illinois is without a chief executive who can legitimately exercise the powers and duties of his office.
Craig, Craig.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: Not that we are aware of.
QUESTION: Did you give any consideration to the intent of the law framed by the constitution? (OFF-MIKE) Whether it was meant for a legal crisis like this or simply for some kind of medical or emotional issue?
MADIGAN: I think the question you're getting at is how is disability or is disability defined, correct? And so, yes, we did. It's addressed in our briefs. We would look to the fact that the term disability legally is very broad. That it is not simply isolated to a physical or mental disability, and can you read all about that in our pleadings.
Yes?
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: We have, as you know, had, I should say, because it was a while ago, obviously, initiated an investigation at the time that Alderman Dick Mel (ph) stated that essentially Governor Blagojevich was trading appointments for campaign contributions. At one point, also you are probably aware, the U.S. attorney, Patrick Fitzgerald, asked us to cease our investigation and let them proceed, which we did. But since then, we do have personnel in the office of the attorney general who had provided assistance and information to federal law enforcement authorities. And that's all I can tell you.
Do you have anymore questions for me?
QUESTION: Yes, I have one more.
MADIGAN: But yes, then I will.
QUESTION: Is it fair to say -- is it fair to say, I don't want to put words in your mouth, that the reason you're doing this is you think it's a crises, it's an emergency, and this can be done quicker than impeachment?
MADIGAN: Perfect. Yes.
QUESTION: Has it ever been used for anything?
MADIGAN: Not that we are aware of. Well, stop, yes. Because it can, in addition, to whether or not the governor is able to serve, this rule also provides for redistricting cases to go immediately to the Illinois supreme court. And, yes, it has been used for redistricting purposes.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: No. No. No. My concern is to deal with the extraordinary circumstances the state is facing right now. And obviously, we want to make sure that the people of the state of Illinois have a governor who can legitimately fulfill the duties of that office.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: I have not.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) Are you aware of (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: No. I am not personally aware of that. Obviously --
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) happening? Let the office know (OFF-MIKE)
MADIGAN: We have not. We have provided them with a copy on the 16th floor and we - a copy of the actual complaint is being served on him now.
QUESTION: When do you expect to hear from the Supreme Court?
MADIGAN: Within a short period of time. But we do not know how long that -- pardon me?
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE).
MADIGAN: We may not hear from them today. But they have received it. It has been filed.
QUESTION: You're asking for -- (OFF-MIKE). Is there any other duty that he can perform -- he -- as governor -- (OFF-MIKE).
MADIGAN: Well, the way that we determined what activities we were asking the Supreme Court to enjoin him from performing was based on the information that was contained in the criminal complaint filed Tuesday, and so there may be other things he can do, ceremonial functions, but you're right. This covers the vast majority of what his duties would be, but not all of them.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE). Is that the ultimate request (OFF- MIKE)...
MADIGAN: That is the ultimate request. Both in the TRO, as well as in the complaint.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE).
MADIGAN: Correct. Yes. You guys are...
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE).
MADIGAN: I shall, Andy.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE).
QUESTION: Well, I went over very carefully with the attorney general's staff what they were proposing to do, and had input on it and made suggestions. I think this is the least invasive way of solving the immediate problem. It does not try to take over the legislative function. It invites the legislation to proceed as rapidly as they can.
One of the problems with the legislature proceeding on an impeachment, Ruth, is that this legislature expires at the end of this month, or shortly before that. It's inconceivable to me that any kind of a procedurally proper impeachment and removal could occur between now and the end of the month.
That means that, probably, the legislature would have to start over again, or at least complete its activity sometime after January 4, when the new legislature takes over.
This is, as much as anything, a hold-fast effort by Attorney General Madigan to allow the state to continue to operate during that period. It is -- it is very difficult, if there's nobody in charge of contracts, if there's nobody in charge of the state apparatus, to run the business of the state, and I think...
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE). QUESTION: Sure.
QUESTION: What about (OFF-MIKE).
MADIGAN: I don't think so. If the legislature -- there's no question that the legislature is supreme here. If the legislature decides to act on any of these fronts, I think it supersedes, certainly, the request that the attorney general has made and probably the power of the court.
QUESTION: The legislature (OFF-MIKE)...
QUESTION: On these issues, absolutely.
QUESTION: Why is that? (OFF-MIKE).
QUESTION: Well, on jurisdiction, fine, but on the substance of the matter, there is a removal procedure specifically spelled out in the constitution which the legislature is authorized to conduct. There is the authority in the constitution and in the federal constitution, as well, for the state legislature to decide how the vacancy should be filled. And so if they exercise either of those functions, I think that is entrusted in the power of the court.
QUESTION: In your view, judge, is the action (OFF-MIKE) temporary in nature or permanent in nature?
QUESTION: It's temporary in nature in the sense that, if the legislature acts, or if the governor resigns, it would make this case moot.
QUESTION: He would not in any event be removed permanently and, should the state legislature decide not to (OFF-MIKE) in the future, it would be in kind of a suspension limbo?
QUESTION: I think if the legislature decided not to the remove him -- this is only the first step -- if the legislature decided not to remove him, I can't predict what the Supreme Court would do at that point. But there's nothing in the pleadings that have been filed on behalf of the attorney general which would say that the court must then step in for a permanent removal where the legislature decided not to.
MADIGAN: Let me -- let me follow up for a moment. One of the reasons that we have sought the remedy that we've sought, saying that the governor should be temporarily removed, is that we recognize, again, the court may be reluctant to take up this matter, and to the extent that we can provide a remedy that is narrow, that's what we've tried to do. So instead of requesting permanent removal, we have requested temporary removal from office.
