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President Obama Addresses State Department

Aired January 22, 2009 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

GEORGE MITCHELL, SPECIAL ENVOY FOR THE MIDDLE EAST: But, most of the time, progress was nonexistent or very slow. So, I understand the feelings of those who may be discouraged about the Middle East.
As an aside, just recently, I spoke in Jerusalem, and I mentioned the 800 years. And, afterward, an elderly gentleman came up to me and he said, did you say 800 years? I said, yes, 800. He repeated the number again. I repeated it again. He said, ah, such a recent argument. No wonder you settled it.

(LAUGHTER)

MITCHELL: But -- 800 years may be recent, but from my experience there, I formed the conviction that there is no such thing as a conflict that can't be ended.

Conflicts are created, conducted and sustained by human beings. They can be ended by human beings. I saw it happen in Northern Ireland, although, admittedly, it took a very long time.

I believe deeply that, with committed, persevering and patient diplomacy, it can happen in the Middle East. There are, of course, many, many reasons to be skeptical about the prospect for success. The conflict has gone on for so long and has had such destructive effects that many have come to regard it as unchangeable and inevitable.

But the president and the secretary of state don't believe that. They believe, as I do, that the pursuit of peace is so important, that it demands our maximum effort, no matter the difficulties, no matter the setbacks.

The key is the mutual commitment of the parties and the active participation of the United States government, led by the president and the secretary of state, with the support and assistance of the many other governments and institutions who want to help.

The secretary of state has just talked about our long-term objective, and the president himself has said that his administration -- and I quote -- "will make a sustained push, working with Israelis and Palestinians, to achieve the goal of two states, a Jewish state in Israel and a Palestinian state living side by side in peace and security."

This effort must be determined, persevering and patient. It must be backed up by political capital, economic resources, and focused attention at the highest levels of our government. And it must be firmly rooted in a shared vision of a peaceful future by the people who live in the region.

At the direction of the president and the secretary of state, and in pursuit of the president's policies, I pledge my full effort to the search for peace and stability in the Middle East.

Thank you.

(APPLAUSE)

HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Thank you very much, Senator Mitchell.

I next have the great personal pleasure of introducing the special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan. Ambassador Holbrooke will coordinate across the entire government an effort to achieve United States' strategic goals in the region.

This effort will be closely coordinated, not only within the State Department and, of course, with USAID, but also with the Defense Department and under the coordination of the National Security Council.

It has become clear that dealing with the situation in Afghanistan requires an integrated strategy that works with both Afghanistan and Pakistan as a whole, as well as engaging NATO and other key friends, allies, and those around the world who are interested in supporting these efforts.

It is such a great decision on the part of the ambassador to respond to the call that the president and I sent out, asking that he again enter public service and take on this very challenging assignment. And we are grateful that he has.

Ambassador Holbrooke?

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

RICHARD HOLBROOKE, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UNITED NATIONS: Mr. President, Mr. Vice President, Madam Secretary, Senator Special Envoy Mitchell, I thank you so much.

It's an extraordinarily moving thing for me to return to this building again, having entered it so many years ago as a junior Foreign Service officer.

As somebody whose career was determined in that initial decade of my life in the Foreign Service, I want to tell you, Mr. President, that I know that the Foreign Service and the Civil Service and the Foreign Service officers serving around the world will appreciate and remember the fact that you chose to come to the department on your second day to demonstrate what you have with this fantastic team.

And if I may, on behalf of all Foreign Service officers, active and retired, I want to thank you so much.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE) HOLBROOKE: I'm also honored by the presence of two good and close friends, Vice President Biden and, of course, my boss, immediate boss, Secretary Clinton, and to share the podium with a colleague from the Irish days and many Senate events, Senator George Mitchell.

I thank you for your confidence in offering me this daunting assignment, and all I can do is pledge my best to undertake it. I see -- thinking of my early years in the Foreign Service, I see my former roommate in Saigon, John Negroponte, here. We remember those days well. And I hope we will produce a better outcome this time.

(LAUGHTER)

HOLBROOKE: I also have to thank Kati, my two sons, David and Anthony, and my stepdaughter, my beloved stepdaughter, Lizzie (ph), and her fiance, David, especially for coming down here today. And I hope that I will be able to see you sometime in the next few years.

(LAUGHTER)

HOLBROOKE: Mr. President, Madam Secretary, Mr. Vice President, you've asked me to deal with Afghanistan and Pakistan, two very distinct countries with extraordinarily different histories, and yet intertwined by geography, ethnicity, and the current drama.

This is a very difficult assignment, as we all know. Nobody can say the war in Afghanistan has gone well, and yet, as we speak here today, American men and women and their coalition partners are fighting a very difficult struggle against a ruthless and determined enemy without any scruples at all, an enemy that is willing to behead women who dare to teach in a school to young girls, an enemy that has done some of the most odious things on Earth.

And across the border lurks the greater enemy still, the people who committed the atrocities of September 11, 2001.

We know what our long-term objective is. I hope I will be able to fill out the mandate which Secretary Clinton has mentioned to help coordinate a clearly chaotic foreign assistance program, which must be pulled together, to work closely with General Petraeus, CENTCOM, Admiral Mullen, and the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General McKiernan and the command in Afghanistan, to create a more coherent program.

If our resources are mobilized and coordinated and pulled together, we can quadruple, quintuple, multiply by tenfold the effectiveness of our efforts there.

In Pakistan, the situation is infinitely complex, and I don't think I would advance our goals if I tried to discuss it today. I wish to get out to the region and report back to the secretary, the vice president, and the president.

But I will say that, in putting Afghanistan and Pakistan together under one envoy, we should underscore that we fully respect the fact that Pakistan has its own history, its own traditions, and it is far more than the turbulent, dangerous tribal areas on its western border. And we will respect that, as we seek to follow suggestions that have been made by all three of the men and women standing behind me in the last few years on having a more comprehensive policy.

So I thank you again for your confidence in me. I look forward to working for you, with you closely, and following a joint effort to do better than we have in the past.

Thank you very much.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

CLINTON: Well, we are not only honored and delighted, but challenged by the president coming here on the second day. This puts the pressure on everybody.

And yet, Mr. President, we feel up to that challenge. We want to do our very best work in furtherance of your goals.

You set a high standard in your inaugural address as to what we are aiming toward, and I pledge to you, on behalf of the thousands and thousands of dedicated public servants who serve you on behalf of diplomacy and development, that we will give you our very best efforts. It is an honor to be working to fulfill the goals that you have set for our country.

Ladies and gentlemen, the president of the United States.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Please, everybody. Thank you. Be seated. Thank you so much.

It is my privilege to come here and to pay tribute to all of you, the talented men and women of the State Department. I have given you an early gift, Hillary Clinton.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

OBAMA: You -- in her, you will have a secretary of state who has my full confidence. And I want to thank Chairman Kerry and the Senate for acting swiftly to confirm her, because we have no time to lose.

My appearance today, as has been noted, underscores my commitment to the importance of diplomacy and renewing American leadership. And it gives me an opportunity to thank you for the services that you perform every single day.

Sometimes I think the American public doesn't fully understand the sacrifices that you and your families make, the dedication that is involved in you carrying on your tasks day in, day out.

And I know I speak for Joe Biden, as well as everybody else on this stage, when we tell you that we are proud of you. You are carrying on a vital task in the safety and security of the American people.

And part of what we want to do is to make sure that everybody understands that the State Department is going to be absolutely critical to our success in the years to come, and you individually are going to be critical to our success in the years to come. And we want to send a signal to all kinds of young people who may be thinking about the Foreign Service that they are going to be critical in terms of projecting not just America's power, but also America's values and America's ideals.

The inheritance of our young century demands a new era of American leadership. We must recognize that America's strength comes not just from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from our enduring values. And for the sake of our national security and the common aspirations of people around the globe, this era has to begin now.

This morning, I signed three executive orders. First, I can say without exception or equivocation that the United States will not torture.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

OBAMA: Second, we will close the Guantanamo Bay detention camp and determine how to deal with those who have been held there.

And, third, we will immediately undertake a comprehensive review to determine how to hold and try terrorism suspects to best protect our nation and the rule of law.

The world needs to understand that America will be unyielding in its defense of its security and relentless in its pursuit of those who would carry out terrorism or threaten the United States. And that's why, in this twilight struggle, we need a durable framework.

The orders that I signed today should send an unmistakable signal that our actions in defense of liberty will be just as our cause and that we, the people, will uphold our fundamental values as vigilantly as we protect our security. Once again, America's moral example must be the bedrock and the beacon of our global leadership.

We are confronted by extraordinary, complex and interconnected global challenges: the war on terror, sectarian division, and the spread of deadly technology. We did not ask for the burden that history has asked us to bear, but Americans will bear it. We must bear it.

Progress will not come quickly or easily, nor can we promise to right every single wrong around the world. But we can pledge to use all elements of American power to protect our people and to promote our interests and ideals, starting with principled, focused and sustained American diplomacy.

To carry forward that effort, we are going to be calling on your hard work and perseverance in the months and years to come. Given the urgency and complexity of the challenges we face and to convey our seriousness of purpose, Secretary Clinton and I are also calling upon the two distinguished Americans standing with us today.

It will be the policy of my administration to actively and aggressively seek a lasting peace between Israel and the Palestinians, as well as Israel and its Arab neighbors. To help us pursue these goals, Secretary Clinton and I have asked George Mitchell to serve as special envoy for Middle East peace.

George is renowned in this country and around the world for his negotiating skill. He brings international stature and a lifetime of service. His years in the Senate were marked by strong leadership and bipartisan achievement. His efforts on behalf of peace in Northern Ireland were indispensable in reconciling a painful and protracted conflict.

Time and again, in public service and private life, he has acted with skill and acted with integrity. He will be fully empowered at the negotiating table, and he will sustain our focus on the goal of peace.

No one doubts the difficulty of the road ahead, and George outlined some of those difficulties. The tragic violence in Gaza and southern Israel offers a sobering reminder of the challenges at hand and the setbacks that will inevitably come.

It must also instill in us, though, a sense of urgency, as history shows us that strong and sustained American engagement can bridge divides and build the capacity that supports progress. And that is why we will be sending George to the region as soon as possible to help the parties ensure that the cease-fire that has been achieved is made durable and sustainable.

Let me be clear: America is committed to Israel's security. And we will always support Israel's right to defend itself against legitimate threats.

For years, Hamas has launched thousands of rockets at innocent Israeli citizens. No democracy can tolerate such danger to its people, nor should the international community, and neither should the Palestinian people themselves, whose interests are only set back by acts of terror.

To be a genuine party to peace, the quartet has made it clear that Hamas must meet clear conditions: recognize Israel's right to exist; renounce violence; and abide by past agreements.

Going forward, the outline for a durable cease-fire is clear: Hamas must end its rocket fire; Israel will complete the withdrawal of its forces from Gaza; the United States and our partners will support a credible anti-smuggling and interdiction regime, so that Hamas cannot rearm.

Yesterday I spoke to President Mubarak and expressed my appreciation for the important role that Egypt played in achieving a cease-fire. And we look forward to Egypt's continued leadership and partnership in laying a foundation for a broader peace through a commitment to end smuggling from within its borders.

Now, just as the terror of rocket fire aimed at innocent Israelis is intolerable, so, too, is a future without hope for the Palestinians.

OBAMA: I was deeply concerned by the loss of Palestinian and Israeli life in recent days and by the substantial suffering and humanitarian needs in Gaza. Our hearts go out to Palestinian civilians who are in need of immediate food, clean water, and basic medical care, and who've faced suffocating poverty for far too long.

Now we must extend a hand of opportunity to those who seek peace. As part of a lasting cease-fire, Gaza's border crossings should be open to allow the flow of aid and commerce, with an appropriate monitoring regime, with the international and Palestinian Authority participating.

Relief efforts must be able to reach innocent Palestinians who depend on them. The United States will fully support an international donor's conference to seek short-term humanitarian assistance and long-term reconstruction for the Palestinian economy. This assistance will be provided to and guided by the Palestinian Authority.

Lasting peace requires more than a long cease-fire, and that's why I will sustain an active commitment to seek two states living side by side in peace and security.

Senator Mitchell will carry forward this commitment, as well as the effort to help Israel reach a broader peace with the Arab world that recognizes its rightful place in the community of nations.

I should add that the Arab peace initiative contains constructive elements that could help advance these efforts. Now is the time for Arab states to act on the initiative's promise by supporting the Palestinian government under President Abbas and Prime Minister Fayyad, taking steps towards normalizing relations with Israel, and by standing up to extremism that threatens us all.

Jordan's constructive role in training Palestinian security forces and nurturing its relations with Israel provide a model for these efforts. And going forward, we must make it clear to all countries in the region that external support for terrorist organizations must stop.

Another urgent threat to global security is the deteriorating situation in Afghanistan and Pakistan. This is the central front in our enduring struggle against terrorism and extremism. There, as in the Middle East, we must understand that we cannot deal with our problems in isolation.

There is no answer in Afghanistan that does not confront the al Qaeda and Taliban bases along the border, and there will be no lasting peace unless we expand spheres of opportunity for the people of Afghanistan and Pakistan. This is truly an international challenge of the highest order.

That's why Secretary Clinton and I are naming Ambassador Richard Holbrooke to be special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan. Ambassador Holbrooke is one of the most talented diplomats of his generation. Over several decades, he's served on different continents and as an outstanding ambassador to the United Nations.

He has strengthened ties with our allies, tackled the toughest negotiations, and helped deliver a hard-earned peace as an architect of the Dayton Accords. He will help lead our effort to forge and implement a strategic and sustainable approach to this critical region.

The American people and the international community must understand that the situation is perilous and progress will take time. Violence is up dramatically in Afghanistan. A deadly insurgency has taken deep root. The opium trade is far and away the largest in the world.

The Afghan government has been unable to deliver basic services. Al Qaeda and the Taliban strike from bases embedded in rugged tribal terrain along the Pakistani border. And while we have yet to see another attack on our soil since 9/11, al Qaeda terrorists remain at large and remain plotting.

Going forward, we must set clear priorities in pursuit of achievable goals that contribute to our collective security. My administration is committed to refocusing attention and resources on Afghanistan and Pakistan and to spending those resources wisely. That's why we are pursuing a careful review of our policy.

We will seek stronger partnerships with the governments of the region, sustain cooperation with our NATO allies, deeper engagement with the Afghan and Pakistani people, and a comprehensive strategy to combat terror and extremism.

We will provide the strategic guidance to meet our objectives, and we pledge to support the extraordinary Americans serving in Afghanistan, both military and civilian, with the resources that they need.

These appointments add to a team that will work with energy and purpose to meet the challenges of our time and to define a future of expanding security and opportunity.

Difficult days lie ahead. As we ask more of ourselves, we will seek new partnerships and ask more of our friends and more of people around the globe, because security in the 21st century is shared.

But let there be no doubt about America's commitment to lead. We can no longer afford drift, and we can no longer afford delay, nor can we cede ground to those who seek destruction.

A new era of American leadership is at hand, and the hard work has just begun. You are going to be at the front lines of engaging in that important work. And I'm absolutely confident that, with the leadership of Secretary Clinton, with wonderful envoys like Richard Holbrooke and George Mitchell, with the dedicated team that is before me today, that we are going to be able to accomplish our objectives, keep America safe, and bring better days not just to our own country, but all around the world.

Thank you very much, everybody.

(APPLAUSE)

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: What you are hearing right there is not a polite applause.

What you're hearing right there, as a matter of fact, is a rousing ovation from career diplomats, people who for many years have been waiting to see changes in their department, and seem to be extremely welcoming, as we look at these pictures, still, of the two gentlemen who have just been introduced before them.

Why? Because both of those gentlemen who have just been introduced, George Mitchell, a former Senate majority leader, mother is Lebanese, who knows the Middle East region, has written reports in 2001 about the region, and Richard Holbrooke, also former U.N. ambassador, two men very familiar with the turf, they have now been assigned to.

As you have heard Obama say, Mitchell will handle the Middle East, something Mitchell called volatile himself just moments ago. And Richard Holbrooke, former U.N. ambassador, who said, regarding Pakistan and Afghanistan, it's about the enemy, but just not the enemy in those areas.

So, we're going to be obviously taking you through this.

Let's get back on camera here. And I will tell you exactly -- maybe we can split the frame, if we possibly can, Roger, because I don't want to take the camera away from President Obama. Obviously, this is his day.

Look, the man said that he was going to make changes and that they would be swift. And that's exactly what he has done today. As a matter of fact, let's cut to the change, if we possibly can, and take you through some of the changes that have been taking place.

The first thing we want to tell you about is some of the changes that have taken place by Obama earlier in the day.

Let's just go ahead and get rid of the teleprompter. We obviously don't know exactly where we are.

Let's talk about Obama's four changes, to shut down Gitmo, to shut down secret prison, to shut down secret custody that lasted for years -- this obviously got human rights activists extremely upset -- no torture. And that's the biggie. He must follow Army Field Manual interrogation rules. How different is that? So, as we watch this event close up, let me bring in some of the guests that we're going to be talking through this. We're going to be talking with Patricia Murphy from CitizenJanePolitics.com. We're going to be talking to Frances Townsend, CNN contributor, served the Bush administration as homeland security director, and Jill Dougherty, CNN foreign affairs correspondent at the State Department, all of them joining us now.

Jill, let me begin with you.

Why Richard Holbrooke and why George Mitchell?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think you saw it in the comments by both of those men.

They are highly experienced. They have years and years of experience in dealing with precisely what is needed right now.

Let's begin with George Mitchell. He worked on Northern Ireland. And, in his comments, which were very interesting, talking about an 800-year conflict, but he said there is no such thing as a conflict that cannot be ended. That's his message.

Richard Holbrooke, working on certainly Yugoslavia, the Dayton Accords, another person with a different style, but somebody who said right straight ahead, it's a very, very difficult mission.

SANCHEZ: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: And they're going to be doing it very quickly. And, obviously, Rick, they're going to be on the planes very soon.

SANCHEZ: Joining me now, Jim Clancy from our CNN International bureau here.

Jim, what is the difference between Mitchell and Holbrooke, and the people who had those positions before?

JIM CLANCY, CNN INTERNATIONAL: The difference is in the two men. They're obvious choices here. The difference is in the way that they were presented -- strong and sustained, active and aggressive. The way that President Barack Obama decided how he is going to go forward here. What he's saying is, I'm committed to this.

He understands two things.

Number one, you can't separate out Afghanistan from Pakistan. These two problems coexist. They have to be addressed at the same time and preferably by the same man, somebody as experienced as Richard Holbrooke.

On the other hand, he realizes that in the Middle East, U.S. security interests and U.S. image abroad rests on our ability to tackle a problem that everybody has told us can't be tackled.

And what he's really saying here is those who have told you that -- this the Middle East peace between Palestinians and Israelis is an impossible thing have told you the biggest lie you've ever heard. You heard George so much it. He said, men -- humans, create these conflicts. Men -- humans, can end them.

SANCHEZ: But you can't end them unless you engage both parties.

CLANCY: (INAUDIBLE).

SANCHEZ: But is it fair to say under the Bush administration there was no engagement?

CLANCY: Well, no...

(CROSSTALK)

CLANCY: ...there was engagement, but it was never...

SANCHEZ: Effective?

CLANCY: It was never led from the top in this manner. What we have just seen I haven't seen in years and years -- even under the Clinton -- eight years of the Clinton administration, where on day one you come out and you say these are the two most difficult problems we face. We're taking them on head on, on day two of my administration. Obviously, there was a lot of thought about this, Rick.

SANCHEZ: There's so much to talk about, though. Because it's not just this and the changes that we're now going to see, not only in Pakistan and Afghanistan, but also in parts of the Middle East and you know, with these problems that we've seen in Gaza before.

But when he came out today and he made those four points -- and this is important for those of you watching us now at home. I need to catch you up on this because I think this is probably the most relevant statement that we've received from a president -- especially when it comes to change.

You saw the question that we asked earlier. He says, closing down GITMO, shutting down secret prisons, shutting down the secret custody that lasted for years and no more torture.

In fact, you heard him say that just moments ago.

I want you to hear what the president said today during these -- during that signing statement that he held for reporters earlier in the day.

Let's turn that around.

Roger, have you got it?

Let's play it now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We believe that the Army Field Manual reflects the best judgment of our military, that we can abide by a rule that says we don't torture, but that we can still effectively obtain the intelligence that we need. And this is me following through on not just the commitment I made during the campaign, but I think an understanding that dates back to our founding fathers that we are willing to observe core standards of conduct, not just when it's easy, but also when it's hard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Some would argue that's not just change on this, the second day of his administration, but possibly a repudiation of the previous administration. Someone who was a part of that previous administration is Francis Townsend.

She's good enough to join us now by phone.

How would you react to that?

And how did you react to the statement when you heard the new president say it?

FRANCES TOWNSEND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CONTRIBUTOR: Well, you know, look, the new president is entitled to come in and review policies and make his best judgment. I think it's too soon to say what all this is going to mean. He signed the executive orders. He's made public statements. But when it comes, Rick, to Guantanamo, for example, he set up a task force to make recommendations.

You know, the problem -- the prior president also said he wanted to close Guantanamo. He hadn't because what we found was it's pretty hard to do. You don't know where you're going to send these people. It's going to be very difficult to try some of them under -- in civilian courts here in this country. Members of Congress have said they don't want people housed in their districts.

And, by the way, when the battlefield conditions don't lend themselves to collecting evidence consistent with the way we do here as law enforcement in the United States. And so it makes it very hard to do this.

I -- look, I think we want to close Guantanamo for a whole lot of reasons. We just want to make sure that in its place is a policy that can be implemented effectively to continue to protect the country.

So I -- he's entitled to make changes.

SANCHEZ: But here's the -- but here's the question. I mean I think here's the money question. And I made references to this a little while ago as we watched the president with the secretary of State, Clinton, working the room with those career diplomats that gave him that rousing ovation just moments ago.

On the question of torture, we have a president of the United States who left office just two or three days ago saying we don't torture and now we have a new president saying we won't torture.

How do you reconcile those two?

TOWNSEND: Well, I think that...

SANCHEZ: Somebody -- somebody's not telling the truth here.

TOWNSEND: Well, I mean I think what you've got to ask -- the right question to ask now is what -- how do we define torture -- because that -- they may be defining it differently. I suspect they may be doing that.

SANCHEZ: So you agree that Barack Obama is saying we have tortured and we're going to stop it?

TOWNSEND: Well, no. He hasn't said that. And I find that interesting. I mean I think what we want to know is, what was happening before?

Does the current administration -- the Obama administration -- believe it was legal?

Whether or not it was legal will tell you whether or not they think it was torture. But I -- I mean, you know in a...

SANCHEZ: Do you believe

TOWNSEND: ...in a new administration of transparency, I think we need answers to those questions so we understand the rhetoric.

SANCHEZ: Do you believe that under the administration that you were a part of, the United States tortured?

TOWNSEND: I do not believe that the United States tortured. And -- but I think that we need trans -- the very transparency that President Obama has promised us so that we can have a full and fair debate about it.

I'll tell you, Rick, I was not a part of those policy discussions that put in place enhanced interrogation techniques.

SANCHEZ: I understand.

TOWNSEND: So, I mean I wasn't -- I wasn't a part of it, so it's difficult for me to speak to the specifics of it. I don't believe, based on what I know, that we torture. But I think the American people are entitled to the transparency that has been promised to them.

SANCHEZ: That's a -- you know, you make some interesting points. And to be fair to you, I understand the point you make about not being a part of it.

We're going to come back in just a moment. And we're going to get into the issue of what's going on specifically with the Middle East and how the changes take place there.

Also, she raised a great question, did Frances Townsend -- if we had shut down GITMO as promised by this president, then what? According to my notes here, there are 245 detainees that are still there.

Do you release them?

Do you transfer them?

Do you prosecute them?

And who's going to make these decisions?

Important questions. Important answers -- on the other side of this break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: This morning, I signed three executive orders. First, I can say without exception or equivocation that the United States will not torture.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Boy, and the Middle East is a big part of this.

Welcome back, everyone.

I'm Rick Sanchez here at the World Headquarters of CNN.

Let's go to our Twitter board, if we possibly can. I want to get a couple of responses from you as you're watching this newscast and seeing what some are describing as this tectonic shift in foreign policy in this country.

You say this: "One hundred percent change. The time has come for America to take the lead in not ignoring the violence in the Middle East."

This is to Mr. Clancy's point just moments ago.

And then Tom Mahr says: "The Palestinian Authority will pocket the money and deprive the Palestinians unless they become Fatah members."

All right, we welcome you back.

We also welcome some of our guests.

We've got Patricia Murphy. We've got Frances Townsend. We've got Jill Dougherty. We're also going to be joined now by General David Maddox. We're also going to be joined by Larry Johnson from the CIA. And, of course, Jeffrey Toobin, our legal analyst, because there's a lot of things to get to when it comes to what's going on with GITMO. Let's start there.

Patricia Murphy, if you would, at my count, there are 245 people still there.

What are we going to do with them?

PATRICIA MURPHY, EDITOR, CITIZENJANEPOLITICS.COM: Well, that is the big question. That's why one of the four executive orders that we saw signed today says what are we going to do with these guys?

He's creating a special task force to look into this question, to say, are we going to try them, transfer them back to their own countries or are they going to come to the United States?

It's very, very unclear. And, again, we hear it again and again -- the devil is in the details.

I'll say for this entire day, if you look at the art of the choreography here -- this is all very, very well planned -- first, the executive orders; then Hillary Clinton arrived to a hero's welcome from career diplomats; then these two special envoys.

This is all designed to say the Bush era is over, the Obama era has begun. Full stop.

SANCHEZ: Let me bring in our CIA guy Larry Johnson.

Mr. Johnson, this is what -- was it what Mr. Blair said -- the -- Admiral Blair, director of National Intel. This is what he said about shutting down the secret prisons and about torture. He says: "It is a rallying cry for terrorist recruitment and harmful to our national security."

Do you agree?

LARRY JOHNSON, FORMER CIA AGENT, MANAGING DIRECTOR, BERG ASSOCIATES: Oh, absolutely. That's -- he's right. A friend of mine was the commander down there. And of those 245 left, about 15 are genuinely bad people that we're going to have to figure out some way to prosecute, incarcerate them, bring them to -- literally bring them to justice.

The other 230, they were -- some of them were picked up -- for example, in Afghanistan, we offered a $25,000 bounty for Al Qaeda members. Some people -- a guy named Dostum -- would just grab people off the street, bring them in and say these are Al Qaeda members. Well, there are -- who had absolutely no involvement with terrorism.

And how would you feel if you were taken, forcibly incarcerated?

You can understand that a lot of these people do have some legitimate anger at the United States for holding them as criminals without any due process whatsoever.

SANCHEZ: It sounds like you're saying we've made them more mad and possibly more volatile than they were to begin with.

Jeffrey Toobin, let me bring you into this conversation.

What do you do with these people there?

And can they be prosecuted if they can somehow prove that they have been tortured?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, before we move to the details, I think it's important to emphasize what an important step this is. Guantanamo is a very important symbol of the United States. And it has been entirely a negative symbol. And the fact that we will no longer incarcerate people there is extremely important to the national image.

Likewise, the total rejection of torture. Of course, we've tortured people. We've waterboarded people. There's no doubt about that. That's been acknowledged. And waterboarding is torture.

We're not waterboarding people anymore and that's very important.

As to your question as of how we deal with them, it's going to be difficult and we're going to deal with them in different ways. Some of them will be returned to other countries. That's been a process underway for several years.

SANCHEZ: I'm talking about the 15 that Mr.

Johnson alluded to just moments ago that may be bad guys.

TOOBIN: The Obama administration hopes it's only 15. He says 15. It may actually be more. Certainly, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is there. We know he's going to be tried in some way. Some of them will be tried in American courtrooms under civilian justice. That can be done and it will be done.

The real question is, are they going to create any new programs?

Is there going to be a national security court?

Is there going to be some kind of replacement for the military tribunals -- something that is a justice system, but short of the criminal justice system that we have in place?

That's the hard question at the core of this year long review. But most importantly, Guantanamo will close.

SANCHEZ: You know, there's something else we need to get to, because if there's a new rule, this is what it entails. I mean these are the president's own words. He said that: "We must now follow the Army Field Manual for Interrogations" instead of torture or in place of torture.

Well, what is the Army Field Manual for Interrogations and what does it call for?

When we come back, we're going to be talking to a former general who happens to have in his hand that Army Field Manual.

Go ahead, show it to us.

You got it right there?

GEN. DAVID MADDOX (RET.), FORMER COMMANDER, U.S. ARMY-EUROPE: I've got it right here.

SANCHEZ: There it is. All right. We'll be going through that. Maybe you can explain to us exactly what the new policy is going to be.

We'll be right back.

We're going to take a break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: As we told you just moments ago, there has been so much news on this day. We talk about cutting to the change. There's been a lot of change to cut to on this day, because President Obama has made a lot of changes. And most significantly, on this day, the changes have come -- maybe more of a tectonic shift -- when it comes to the United States foreign policy.

We've got a lot of stuff to get through, but I promised you that we would talk to a general, because as the president described it, no more torture means we now follow the Army Field Manual for Interrogations.

Once again, joining us now is the general who's going to be taking us through this.

General, what -- the former general, I should say. You're not a former general, but you're a retired general, thank you very much.

What is -- what does the manual call for?

MADDOX: The manual, in one section, lays out those things that are clearly identified as torture and says they will not be used. And then there's the entire section that lays out 19 different approaches that can be used by interrogators to gain actionable intelligence.

SANCHEZ: And, you know, I was just reading "The New York Times" briefing and it referred to them as the 19 techniques.

Does it -- could you tell us?

I mean, does it specifically state what you can and can't do or is it -- or is it more nuanced than that?

MADDOX: It is a little more nuanced. It goes into different approaches that you can use in dealing with prisoners. And so there's an entire section that goes through different ways that you can deal with different prisoners at different points in time and based on that particular prisoner's position and attitude. SANCHEZ: Jeffrey Toobin, let me bring you into the mix here.

Is it hard for a prisoner to make a case that they have been tortured?

TOOBIN: Well, it depends. There's no mystery here. The United States has acknowledged that we waterboarded people. Susan Crawford, who is one of the people in charge of the military commissions, just made a finding last week saying we tortured. That's the word that we used. I don't think there's any doubt that we tortured people in the past during the Bush administration.

So, yes, there can be some disagreements about what precisely constitutes torture. But we don't have those disputes. We know that we tortured people in the course of the war on terror.

SANCHEZ: Do you guys -- by the way, Jeffrey, do you believe that this shift today -- this tectonic shift as I alluded to moments ago -- is it a change or a repudiation -- or both?

TOOBIN: A total repudiation. It's a complete rejection of how the Bush administration conducted the war on terror in this regard.

But when it comes to interrogation, Dick Cheney said on "LARRY KING LIVE" and then, among other places, he thinks waterboarding is not torture. It now is American government policy that waterboarding is torture. And it's prohibited.

SANCHEZ: But here's the problem. There are still some within the CIA who are saying, look, we want more options than just those 19 techniques that are presented there.

Let's bring in a CIA man, Larry Johnson.

What would -- what would they want?

SANCHEZ: Hi, Rick.

Rick, that's really not right, because, number one, understand that in the Central Intelligence Agency, you don't have interrogators. The CIA case officers that go out overseas, when they recruit people, it's more like trying to get somebody out for a dinner date. They have never had a training program. In fact, when I went through the training and we were done -- they did what they called the hostage problem. We were taken hostage, we were interrogated and we brought in military interrogators to do the interrogation.

It's also important to note there is an international convention against torture that the United States is a signatory to. And despite what Fran Townsend said earlier, there is no dispute about what constitutes torture. It's laid out in that document very well. It was just the Bush administration chose not to look at it, not to read it and not to enforce it.

SANCHEZ: It seems to me, as we watch what happened today, that President Obama is trying to send a message -- a message to the world, it seems. I mean even in his language, did you notice that he never referred once to this as a war on terror?

He used completely different language. He hasn't even co-opted or used the language that was being used in the prior administration.

General Maddox, I understand you met with the president -- today, yesterday?

MADDOX: We met with him this morning before the signing and then we were actually in the room when he signed the three executive orders.

SANCHEZ: And did you have any conversation about this -- this tectonic change that we would be seeing today?

And what is the president trying to send as a message?

MADDOX: I think the clear point he's trying to make is that this nation has values and our policies will be consistent with your values. And we're not going to torture. We're not going to have two sets of rules. And there are things we -- we do as a nation and things we don't.

And I think that this message is not as much for internally as it is for outside -- that you cannot let terrorists and others use our actions to justify theirs and cannot use it as a means for them to recruit people to work against us.

SANCHEZ: General David Maddox, Larry Johnson, Jeffrey Toobin -- my thanks to all three of you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're very welcome.

SANCHEZ: We're going to be back with GITMO, the oath of office do-over and the issue number one, which is still the economy.

By the way, we watched, just a little while ago, still, with everything going on, the new White House press secretary touching upon all three of those topics.

Stay with us.

We'll have more on that in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: All right. Welcome back.

I'm Rick Sanchez here in the World Headquarters of CNN.

Now this story, breaking news -- a story CNN first brought you nearly one year ago. Soldiers in Iraq being electrocuted -- not on the battlefield, but on their own bases, due to shoddy electrical work allegedly performed or supervised by employees of KBR -- Kellogg, Brown & Root -- as in formerly with Halliburton, the largest U.S. contractor. Now CNN has learned what investigators first thought was an accident is now being called negligent homicide. This is a turn of events, according to the Army investigators.

Special Investigations Unit correspondent Abbi Boudreau is joins us now.

She's got the latest information on that.

What are you learning -- Abbi?

ABBI BOUDREAU, INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is a big development today.

According to an e-mail from the U.S. Army Criminal Investigations Division, two KBR supervisors and KBR itself are now being blamed by an investigator for the death of Sergeant Ryan Maseth. Twenty-four- year-old Maseth was electrocuted on his U.S. base in Iraq last February.

Now, reports show he was taking a shower when he was electrocuted. Later, reports identified there had been problems with the electrical wiring and grounding in his building and that KBR had been notified of work orders involving shoddy electrical conditions months before Maseth's death.

Now, according to the CID e-mail we obtained, the Army investigator assigned to the case says she believes that there's credible information that KBR's negligence led to Maseth's death.

The investigator stated she believed KBR failed to ensure that work was being done by qualified electricians and plumbers. The e-mail went on to say that it's apparent to investigators that KBR's fixes were only temporary and not done to ensure no future problems would arise.

Therefore, according to the CID investigator, the manner of death in Sergeant Maseth's case has been changed from accidental to negligent homicide.

Now, no charges have yet been filed. And in order to actually file the charges, the case must be reviewed by lawyers at the Army's Criminal Investigation headquarters in Virginia. We have calls out to the U.S. Army division in charge of the investigation. We also have calls out to KBR.

And we'll let you know what they tell us.

And big developments in this case. And, of course, we will keep bringing you the latest as we -- as we know about it.

SANCHEZ: And significant, KBR, because -- significant to our viewers because they've received more money -- more tax -- more of your tax money than just about any other contractor that's worked during this war.

BOUDREAU: Absolutely.

SANCHEZ: Good stuff, Abbi.

Thanks so much.

Again, the very first news conference today for the press secretary of the president of the United States. We'll share a bit of that with you.

Stay with us.

We'll be right back.

SANCHEZ: There was so much news going on just as we came on the air, that we didn't even get a chance to bring you up to date on some of the stuff that had happened previously.

And this is Robert Gibbs, the new press secretary for President Barack Obama, having a news conference -- meeting with reporters for the very first time. And at issue today, there was a tussle between him and reporters as to whether or not the president's new oath taking or swearing-in was done properly.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In terms of transparency, why didn't you show the world this?

ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We did show the world this.

HENRY: No, there was no...

(CROSSTALK)

GIBBS: I mean I think it was you who...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ...there's some crackling audio recordings of it. There's some stills. No video. You put your radio address on video.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then why not put it on that video for everybody to see?

GIBBS: Well, I mean -- well, let's be -- but let's be clear that -- you just mentioned there's audio. I've heard that audio. I was there. It was far easier to get tickets for this one.

The -- we took a print pool in there. We released a photograph from the White House. And as -- I think the pool reported it as soon as it happened. We reported it out. So we think it was done in a way -- hold on. We think it was done in a way that was up front and transparent. We think that it -- we also did it in a way that demonstrated, again, this was done out of an abundance of caution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: And we're getting comments on this as we speak, as a matter of. Let's take that if we possibly can, Rog. This is on the Twitter board: "The botched oath was quite a spoiler. I'd be pretty exasperated if I we're Obama."

And then Will_Rhodes on the question that we had asked at the beginning of this newscast -- is this change or repudiation?

Jeff Toobin, our legal analyst, said, by far, this is repudiation. So does Will_Rhodes. He says: " and many more to come by the looks of things. Well done, Barack Obama."

So once again, just to catch you up, if we possibly can, with everything that's been going on, Barack Obama announced today -- essentially to the world -- that the United States will no longer torture. He says that from now on they will use the Army Field Manual instead during any interrogations that are done from either combatants or others that are captured by the United States and deemed to be dangerous to the United States.

The other important information to come out of that news conference and then announcing that there are two new men who are going to be heading his diplomatic effort, along with Hillary Clinton, is that GITMO will be closing down.

Wolf Blitzer is coming up right now.

He's going to be taking you through all of this in THE SITUATION ROOM -- so, Wolf, take it away.

WOLF BLITZER, HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": Thanks very much, Rick.

Happening now, President Obama orders some major changes in the war on terror. But critics say his plan to close the Guantanamo prison camp could be putting America at risk.

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton vows a new era for U.S. diplomacy. This hour, Team Obama takes charge.

But will there really be much change?