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Coverage Of The Deadly Buffalo Plane Crash Continues
Aired February 13, 2009 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news this morning. Plane crash outside Buffalo. Fifty people are dead. What investigators are saying right now. The heartbreaking calls made by a passenger's brother, and how you can send condolences.
It is Friday, February 13th, I'm Heidi Collins. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: After a few seconds of silence, we heard this huge explosion, and the house shook. So we ran toward our back windows, which look out toward the house that was hit, and we could see flames rising high into the sky.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: .. So we look out the window.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Saw some huge red like.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A huge plume of red.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Red smoke.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So we thought we'd check it out, came down here and it was nuts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: A plane plunges from the sky. A house erupts into a fire ball. Fifty people are dead, and the crash of a commuter plane near Buffalo, New York. The specific crash site, a modest neighborhood in the hamlet of Clarence Center, New York.
The doomed plane, Continental connection Flight 3407, it was headed from Newark, New Jersey to the Buffalo Niagara International Airport. It crashed about six miles short of its destination. Let's run down some of the facts now as we know them. The dead, one person on the ground, and all 49 people aboard. Earlier this morning, that death toll increased by one when the airline announced an off-duty pilot was aboard the plane. The cause of the crash, of course, not known, but the weather and the ice on the plane's wings are among the possibilities.
What caused the crash of Continental connection Flight 3407? That question, of course, in the hands of federal investigators who arrived at the crash site just a short time ago. Let's get the very latest now from CNN's Deborah Feyerick at the emergency command center where a news conference was help just last house. So Deb I think the question would be the go-team who has arrived from the NTSB. Have they been able to make their way to the scene now?
Because they have been mentioning that in press conferences of course the crash scene is still too hot.
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is too hot. But they were allowed to get close to the crash scene. Right now, the fire department really has control of it. There's a gas leak, they had to get that under control, just to make sure the entire area is secure. So still very, very hot. So the investigators were able to go over there. They were able to kind of take a walk around, see what pieces of evidence may exist. Interestingly enough, or perhaps ironically enough, the only thing that remains is the tail.
It is in that tail that the two black boxes are expected to be found. So NTSB investigators hopeful that they may be able to get their hands on those black boxes and send them down to Washington for analysis. We spoke earlier with the chief investigator here on the ground.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVEN CHEALANDER, NTSB SPOKESMAN: They've cordoned off the scene. It's still a very hot fire spot, and the incident commander still has control. We don't have primary on the accident scene yet until he clears us to go in. We have, however, been allowed to go in and search the tail section of the airplanes to try to find the cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder and we're hoping to get those out of there this morning.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FEYERICK: Now, there are a lot of witnesses who heard, who saw, who raised to try to help. One of those people, Dave Hartvell, you live not too far from the area. Tell me what you heard, first of all.
Well, the plane came in, and you could tell it had engine problems because it went.
[MAKING PLAN SOUNDS]
And I was sitting on the couch with my wife, and we heard it hit, and there's been a lot of wind around. And when it hit it went, boom! You know? And I said, what was that? And she said, oh, I think it's wind and, I said no, no, I think it's something bigger than that. And I got in my car and drove down and it was just enormous orange flames probably 50 feet high just burning and burning and the wreckage all over.
FEYERICK: Tell me about that. When you saw the wreckage, what did you think it was?
DAVE HARTVELL, WITNESSED PLANE CRASH: Well, I thought it was just the wreckage of a small plane, because there wasn't much left. One of my friends had been an FAA controller, and he said when a plane hit. And so I thought some meat had crashed a Cessna or something you know, because it was little and it looked like nothing was there and they put it out in half an hour and everybody went home. So I thought it was just really small. I was absolutely stunned when I found out there were 50 people there. I couldn't believe it.
FEYERICK: So it really did surprise that you when you found out something large had crashed.
HARTVELL: Oh, absolutely. It looked like just a little plane, because like you said, only the tail is left and thee is nothing is there. And you know, not that not much. From the time it hit to the time they put it out, only half an hour or so nothing there. And when I found out it was 50 people, I said, oh, my god. I know we were stunned.
FEYERICK: OK.
All right. Dave Hartvell, thank you very much, really appreciate you joining us this morning. I don't know. I'm getting a little bit of feedback here in my headpiece. I'm not sure whether you still have us, Heidi, but, again this community is really trying to make sense of everything that went on here. Why this plane seemed to simply have fallen from the sky. I can tell you, Heidi, that we drove from Manhattan overnight. The conditions were treacherous. It was rainy. It was snowy, it was icy, it was freezing. Clearly investigators are going to see whether or not, in fact, all of those elements, those weather elements contributed to this. Heidi.
COLLINS: Of course. All right. Deb Feyerick, sure do appreciate that. Thank you.
Beverly Eckert was one of the passengers on Flight 3407. Eckert's husband, Shawn Rooney was killed on the 9/11 attack on the World Trade Center. Eckert worked with the 9/11 commission as a part of the family steering committee. She was at the White House last week with other 9/11 families. They met with President Obama to discuss how the administration should handle terrorist suspects.
The "Buffalo News" reports Eckert was traveling to Buffalo for a celebration of what would have been her husband's 58th birthday. She had also planned to take part in the presentation of a scholarship award she established in honor of her late husband.
Chris Kausner's sister was on Flight 3407. He was turned away from the crash scene by emergency crews and later talked to reporters.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS KAUSNER, SISTER ON LANE: My parents are on vacation in Florida, and I had to call down there and tell my father what was going on. And I'm just thinking about my mom.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How are they taking it?
KAUSNER: To tell you the truth, I heard my mother make a noise on the phone that I've never heard before.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: In addition to the one person killed on the ground, two other people suffered minor injuries. They were treated and released from the hospital.
The victims' families consoling each other at the Buffalo Airport. Really, really tough pictures to look at here. One woman showing up with her two young sons looking for her husband who was aboard the plane. CNN's senior correspondent Allan Chernoff joins us now live from Newark International Airport where Flight 3407 took off. Allan, good morning again.
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Heidi. And I can say that this airport is just filled with a sense of sobering anxiety. I mean, anybody who steps on an aircraft after such a horrific tragedy has to feel a sense of that. And indeed, the flight this morning, the very first flight this morning, from Buffalo down to Newark was filled with that sense. We spoke with one of the passengers. Let's have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHERNOFF (voice-over): What was the flight? Did you just get back from Buffalo?
MAGGIE LAZA, PASSENGER: I just got back from Buffalo.
CHERNOFF: OK. Did you know about this?
LAZA: I did not know about it. I did not know about the accident last night. I found out when I sat - and my sister-in-law called me while I was just getting into the airline.
CHERNOFF: And how does it make you feel?
LAZA: Nervous. I was really nervous. And some people were commenting about it in the aircraft. I haven't flown for a long time, so when I was looking at the airline, it was such a small airline. So, yes, it made me nervous.
CHERNOFF: What was the mood like in the airplane? Quiet?
LAZA: Quiet. Very quiet. Everyone was very quiet. Which I could - I didn't know what to compare it with. I haven't flown in a long time, so I didn't know what to compare it with. Everyone was really, really quiet.
CHERNOFF: And what was the scene at the airport like? I mean, I know this happened a few miles from the airport. So there wouldn't have been a lot of that at the airport, but -
LAZA: Yes. I didn't notice any, because I didn't know. So, I mean and I had to drive from Rochester, because my flight was cancelled yesterday from Rochester to Newark. So I ad to drive from Rochester to Buffalo in order to come to get in today.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHERNOFF: One passenger from the flight, another passenger just got choked up, couldn't even talk to us after flying in from the flight from Buffalo. Some family members overnight did come here to Newark and Continental says that they helped them out, they provided a room where they could gather. But we have not been able to find any of those family members here at Newark. A very large airport. Heidi.
COLLINS: Boy, it's really, really hard to watch. Really, everyone thinking about those family members today. Allan Chernoff, live for us at Newark, New Jersey Airport. Thank you.
The airline also issued a statement this morning, "Continental extends its deepest sympathies to the family members and loved ones of those involved in this accident. We are providing our full assistance to Colgan Air, so that together we can provide as much support as possible for all concerned. Our thoughts and prayers are with all of the family members and loved ones of those involved in the Flight 3407 tragedy."
Here's a look now at the path of Continental Flight 3407, leaving Newark International Airport last night on the way to Buffalo's Niagara International Airport. The plane crashed, though, just north of the airport in Buffalo. Here's what was heard from the control tower shortly after the plane went off radar.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Colgan 3407, Buffalo Tower, how do you hear? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is ground communication, we need to talk to someone at least five miles north northeast, OK, possibly Clarence. That area right in there, Akron area, either state police or Sheriff's department, we need to find out if anything's on the ground. This aircraft was five miles out, all of a sudden we have no response from that aircraft.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
COLLINS: That was the alert to look for wreckage. Of course, it came just moments after Flight 3407 dropped off radar. Joining me now is a former commercial pilot, John Wiley, who is also a contributing editor for "Business Commercial Aviation" magazine. John, you've been with us all morning long. We really do appreciate your expertise on this.
I want to talk to you a little bit more about auto pilot. And the reason why is because the FAA tells you, as a pilot, that you can only stay on auto pilot for a certain amount of time. Why is that important, and why is that possibly important in this particular scenario?
JOHN WILEY, "BUSINESS COMMERICL AVIATION" MAGAZINE: There are some very, very robust auto pilots out there. We basically divide categories into category one, category two, and category three approaches. Some of the aircrafts that I've flown, you can actually put the auto pilot on takeoff at 50 or 100 feet above the ground and not touch the airplane again until you're rolling out on the runway. That would be called a category three b approach.
COLLINS: OK.
WILEY: You can take on category one, the airplane down to 200 feet on auto pilot and have to click it off. You can take it down to 100 feet on the category two approach. And like I said, on the category three approach, you may not even be able to see very much of the runway. The category three b approaches that I've made, we touched down at Los Angeles, and as we touched down, I as able to see the runway center line markings.
Now, to do this, the auto pilot has to have a sizeable ability to command and control the airplane.
COLLINS: OK.
WILEY: Now, in 1998, Transport Canada said that they wanted the pilots to disengage in icing conditions the auto pilot every five minutes. The FAA in November of 2006 also issued a publication saying that they wanted to do the same thing, especially with turbo prop aircraft.
COLLINS: Especially with turbo prop aircraft, which is what we're talking about today.
WILEY: We are. So they wanted to, because with these robust auto pilots, and we may remember that in the late 1980s, and early 1990s, there was a China Air 747 over the Pacific. They had a problem with the engine, and the crew was trying to work with the problem. The auto pilot held control of the airplane until it reached its limits, and then it let go.
Now you've got an incredible surprise. You don't understand why the airplane has pitched over, pitched down, and has begun rolling.
COLLINS: Because what you're saying is, it acts almost like a Band-Aid. It covers up potential problems that you would normally, if flying hands-on, be able to notice. In fact, quickly, I want to ask you about this, as well. We have some sound from a witness -
WILEY: OK.
COLLINS: Who was actually driving in his car, and he saw some of what happened with this plane. Let's hear that now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TONY TAITRO, LIVES BESIDE CRASH SITE: I was actually driving home from the gym. It was about 10:15 and I was heading east on Clarence Center Road and I saw the plane coming from my right to my left which is northeast. The exact opposite direction that the plane would have been going had it been going to the airport. So I don't know if they were making a swing and just the swing never happened or what had happened but it was heading the absolutely opposite direction of the airport.
The plane was nose down, not as steep as being reported but it was steep enough that it didn't look right. And the left wing was tilted lower than the right. So it was pitched and it was headed down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: All right. So, according to that witness, the plane was flying nose-down, looked like there was what we call a loss of control. You are talking about the auto pilot and this potential icing problems that we have been talking about, as well. We're not really discussing an engine stall here, we're talking about a lift stall, because something was on top of the wings possibly. And we are talking about the ice.
WILEY: We have been talking about the rime ice this morning, the accretion of the rime ice, and as the ice builds up you can lose as much as 30 percent of the lift of the wing. When you come into the area, you go into an approach flap setting, as you get closer to the airport, you slow down to 180 knots. Again all of this is on auto pilot. So the auto pilot may be masking the evolution of a problem.
COLLINS: Wow. All right. John, stick around. We sure do again appreciate all your expertise. John Wiley, a commercial pilot who will be with us all morning long here.
The fatal crash of Continental connection Flight 3407, one of the first responders from the Niagara Frontier Transportation Authority talks with our affiliate WGRZ.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tonight was a perfect example of everyone working together so cohesively from the town of Clarence to where we are today in the town of Cheektowaga, and the state and the county and all the first responders and the emergency personnel. And that's what all the training is for.
You train but you hope you never get to use it. It's one for all, all for one, And that's what is great about our community.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COLLINS: Here's what we know about the crash of a commuter plane near Buffalo, New York. The dead, one person on the ground, and all 49 people aboard. Earlier this morning, the death toll increased by one, when the airline announced an off-duty pilot was aboard the plane. The cause of the crash, not yet known. But weather and ice on the plane's wings are certainly among the possibilities.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ANTHONY TRIGILIO, I-REPORTER: As I was getting closer, I saw people pouring out from all sorts of neighborhoods and stuff like that. And there was tons of fire trucks, tons of sirens, more than I've ever heard in my life. Lots of people all over the place. And it was -- it was pretty chaotic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: One of our I-reporters there talking about the moments just after the crash. If you would like to hear more, you can always log on to I-report.com to hear dramatic accounts of what happened. We have been getting a lot of i-reports about the crash. Our Josh Levs has been monitoring that and is here with us now to share some of them. Josh, good morning, once again.
JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, good morning to you. As what's happening. They're coming in by the minute, and we're grabbing and sharing them with you. Let's go the top of ireport.com right now, we're telling you breaking news. Go ahead and send them.
Take a look at this. We have some from Nicole Komin who ran to the scene at the moment and she is joining us right now. Nicole, are you with us?
VOICE OF NICOLE KOMIN, I-REPORTER: I am.
LEVS: OK. Great. Thanks for being here. As I talk to you, we're going to look at some graphics of some i-reports photos that we've been getting today. Some amazing things. Talk to me. You got pretty close. What did it look like when you were actually there?
KOMIN: I was probably about 100 yards away, I got to the backyard of the houses. It was all smoke. You could just see billowing, billowing smoke coming from behind the houses. I actually got a little glimpse of some of the windows of the airplane, and every time you had a glimpse, all of the smoke was right in front of you again. And there was ambulances, fire trucks, police officers, state troopers, I mean, they were all there right at the moment.
LEVS: My goodness. You are saying you were you able to see burning windows of the airplane itself.
KOMIN: Yes.
LEVS: Did you know - with the pictures we're seeing largely contained to this area, was the fire, was the smoke really widespread along that whole block?
KOMIN: Yes. The smoke was everywhere. I mean, you were even - two miles down the road, you can see the air was just smoke.
LEVS: Really? OK. I want to emphasize with this moment that we did check with people beforehand that you did not put yourself in any serious physical danger in order to get these photos. But when you were there, you told me that it had such an impact on you that you could smell it on you the next morning? KOMIN: Absolutely. My clothes. Yes-my clothes, they smell like jet fuel, actually. Just pure jet fuel and smoke. I can smell it in my house, in my car, everything.
LEVS: You know, Nicole, nature of television, people see it in television and they see it in a box. When you're physically there, was it - did it seem like this giant conflagration that could really impact a large community, or does it feel contained to a relatively small area?
KOMIN: I mean they did the best they can. It is a small area there? They did and they were things that (inaudible) moment. I was there so quickly and so early that I don't know how much they could have done at that time.
LEVS: You don't know how much they could have done. All right. So you've gotten pretty close and we were able to see, you know, video and photos from various i-reporters. You sent them in this morning. Living in that area, being in Buffalo, talk to me quickly and I'll let you go, about the kind of impact this is having on your area today. Is it really shaking the community, as people say?
KOMIN: Oh, absolutely. I mean this thing is shaking the entire nation. But everyone is talking about it. I'm getting phone calls. You know, everything -- everybody is talking about it. It's on every news station. So obviously, it's - a big situation right now that we start to see what really happened. No one knows, and so I guess we just have to see how this all plays out.
LEVS: And I know you have spent time there, it's only a town of 1600 people right outside of Buffalo. And I know that you have gone over there and you got friends who are in that area and you can only imagine the impact it's having right there, right?
KOMIN: Absolutely. I couldn't imagine.
LEVS: Well, Nicole, listen, we really appreciate the images that you sent us, it really helps bring it home for us, and hearing your story helps us understand what it's like if you're physically there. And folks, I will tell you if you have photos, videos, stories of if you just and want to send your thoughts, your feelings, about the victims of this tragedy, go ahead and send them here, I-report.com.
We're going to keep an eye on it throughout the day, and Heidi, we will continue bringing you some of these stories and some of the voices of the people who witnessed the destruction that's taking place over the last little more than 12 hours now.
COLLINS: Yes, it is really, really something to hear. We appreciate it. Josh Levs, thank you.
LEVS: Thank you.
COLLINS: A critical vote expected on Capitol Hill today. One of the other main stories we're following. The House and Senate ready to vote on the president's economic recovery plan. But there may be another delay. President Obama also watching events in Buffalo, responding this morning to the tragedy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was a lot of people who are crying, who were really upset with what was going on. As I got closer, you could start to smell the fire. It was really raging. It was a huge fire, and I could see nothing but the silhouettes of like ten-plus firefighters around, all trying to extinguish it, trying to get crowd control, and it was scary. It was very confusing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: The very latest coming in this morning from Continental Flight 3407, witness accounts just stunning as to what some people saw as the plane went down, just outside of Buffalo. The NTSB is, of course, on scene now, waiting actually for that crash site to cool enough for them to go in and begin their investigation.
The fire actually still burning, 12 hours into this. 50 people in all are dead, including one on the ground where the plane crashed into a home, approximately six miles from the runway at Buffalo. We continue to follow this story for you, of course, here. President Obama has issued a statement expressing deep sadness over last night's crash. You see it there.
"Michelle and I are deeply saddened to hear the tragic accident outside of Buffalo last night. Our hearts go out to the families and friends who lost loved ones."
Obviously, President Barack Obama is responding to the crash this morning. We will continue to follow anymore news that comes by way of him and the crash. But also, we are watching more news in Washington today, and the president's response and comments on the economic recovery plan. The back and forth wrangling seems to be over. So now we are waiting for the votes. CNN congressional correspondent Brianna Keilar joining us now live from Capitol Hill. So Brianna we did hear from the Speaker of the House yesterday, Nancy Pelosi saying that yes there just might be a vote today.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we are expecting this vote in the House here in a few hours, Heidi, and then we are expecting the Senate to follow later in the day. I'm just outside of the House floor where these votes are going to be kicking off today.
And it's important to note that it's House Democrats who have said they didn't get everything they wanted out of this legislation. They felt like too much of the spending was cut out of this bill, in particular for education, specifically for new school construction, completely stripped from this bill.
And it's because of that that we're seeing the vote today, and not yesterday. Could have taken place yesterday. But the actual language of the bill wasn't put out. That formal language, even though the agreement was reached on Wednesday night. House democrats said they wanted to read the bill before they voted. Here's House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's comment on that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: Around here, the language means a lot. It weighs ton and one person's understanding of a spoken description might vary from another's we wanted to see it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: So again, a house veto here in a few hours, and then the Senate is going to follow. And we know that Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has been making some calls to centrist Republicans. Remember, there are three expected to be on board as they have been in the other votes on this legislation. But we've also learned that Senator Ted Kennedy, unlike the last vote on this economic stimulus package, he's not going to be here on the Hill today to vote.
And last time they had one extra vote, that was because of Ted Kennedy. But these three centrists, Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins, and Arlen Specter have indicated that they don't really want to provide that last vote, just number 60 that really squeaks them by, Heidi. And so Harry Reid making some calls to see if he can't win over some other Republicans. A tall order, though.
COLLINS: Yes, probably is a tall order. All right. Very interesting. Brianna Keilar, we sure do appreciate your keeping an eye on that for us today, waiting for that vote a little bit later on. Brianna Keilar on Capitol Hill this morning.
And now it will be some time, of course, before we know what caused this tragedy. Another flight crew about to land in Buffalo at the same time reported ice had been building up on their plane for quite some time. It's known as rime icing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN LUCICH, AVIATION EXPERT: What happens is, ice builds up on the six blades, ice builds up on the leading edge of the airplane, ice builds up on the control surfaces. And over a time, as it gets more and more and more, it destroys the lift. It deforms the wing and that destroys the lift and that component of lift just goes away, and you come down.
And that could play into why do people saw this airplane coming down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: All right. We want to head on over to CNN meteorologist Rob Marciano now to talk a little bit more about the conditions. Because they certainly, Rob, could come into play here. We have been hearing an awful lot about fog, about ice and so forth. We don't have details, of course, yet. But it is certainly something everybody is already talking about. ROB MARCIANO, CNN, METEOROLOGIST: Yes, I mean, you don't want to drive in this stuff, let alone fly a plane. It's pretty obvious that the pilot would rather fly in less of this stuff than anything else. But let's break down what happened last night. This is the radar from about 8:00 until midnight or so. Notice that the blue and the pink, that indicates rain, mixed in with sleet and freezing rain. Then turns to mostly white by the time midnight rolls around, so the atmosphere actually going from a more warm state to a more cold state, top to bottom in the atmosphere, and we get to all snow. But in that transformation, in that transition period, funky things happen, especially at the bottom layers of the atmosphere. So we'll break down exactly what we mean by that.
Let's talk about a cross-section. Showed this earlier. A little bit confusing, but it's easy when you break it down here. This is data from a weather balloon that was sent up at 7:00 last night out of Buffalo. We send them out twice a day all around the world, and it measures the atmosphere vertically, and that is important in this case.
So, we've got temperature, we've got dew point or humidity here. When these are close together, that means high humidity or clouds. But look at these things. This is what actually analyzes this data, and for aviation purposes, it's quite handy.
From here to about here, this is about the -- from about 10,000 feet below. This green indicates the high probability of seeing rime ice develop. And that's what our aviation experts have been talking about. The wider that green, the column is, the greater probability. It's pretty wide.
This blue area, and that's from about 5,000 feet to below, that's where carbeuretor ice may very well form. And that's where ice forms in the carburetor of aircraft engines or fuel injector of aircraft engines, decreasing, obviously, the efficiency of those engines. That's not good, either. And then to couple that, the tank area, that actually measures turbulence, and the bottom 5,000 feet of the atmosphere, a fair amount of turbulence there.
So, conditions not exactly optimal, Heidi, for flying smooth- sailing, so to speak. And certainly it would -- this evidence that we are seeing from what the atmosphere looked like last night and from the reports that we've seen, have been hearing from the pilots that were flying this area.
And historically also, Heidi, I should point out that around the Great Lakes, from, say, Detroit, Cleveland to Buffalo, they get these icings this time of the year greater than 50 percent of the time. So it's no stranger to the folks flying in and out of these places, but that doesn't make the conditions any better.
COLLINS: Absolutely. All right, Rob, certainly something that we are going to be trying to figure out. And, of course, the NTSB investigators who are on the scene are going to be looking at all of these things in sort of a combination. Rob Marciano over in the severe weather center for us today. Want to get back now to John Wiley, who's been joining me all morning long. He's a former commercial pilot, also flew in the Air Force and has many, many hours under his belt. You have brought up many, I think, very interesting points that we may be hearing a little bit more about. One of them that Rob has been mentioning now, turbulence. When we're talking about turbulence, and we're talking about the altitude that they were at, coming in for a landing, give us an idea why that's important.
WILEY: Well, when you're talking about -- we break turbulence down into light, moderate and severe. If you want to think about a way to look at this, think about the coffee in your coffee cup.
If it's kind of jiggling around in your coffee cup, we call that light turbulence. If it's sloshing around in the coffee cup, we call that moderate. If it's severe, you're going to be wearing your coffee. We didn't hear anything on any of the reports of anybody saying anything about the fact that they thought that there was even moderate turbulence out there, which is not to say that the conditions were not there.
COLLINS: Sure.
WILEY: Our meteorologist is telling us, in fact, that he's seeing this from the balloon. But there are no reports. And that would be one of those pilot reports that somebody would want to make. We're getting a bad ride coming into this area. We're getting bounced around. Your fellow pilots are going to want to know about it.
Because lots of times, when you have turbulence, too, you're going to have bumps in your air speed, plus or minus 10 knots. Then we're talking about the possibility of wind shear.
COLLINS: Yes. Well, boy, there is an awful lot to look at in all of this. Another thing that you mentioned to me is the idea of priority handling, because we have been hearing that the first officer, anyway, in communication with air traffic control prior to this incident, there was not stress in her voice. There were no emergency calls.
What does that tell you? Because usually when you say priority handling, you report a problem, and they say, all right, you're going to come down first. You are the priority.
WILEY: You go to the front of the line. If you're having a problem, for example, handling the airplane, which may have occurred if you've got ice on the airplane, which we really don't know if that's a problem yet or not. We don't know if it's attributable to rime ice or not.
But if you have a problem with your systems, if you have a problem because you're low on fuel, you basically just tell the controller, hey, I've got a problem. You've got a box on there called the transponder. You squawk 7700. At that point in time, you go to the front of the line. Everybody else lines up behind you. COLLINS: The transponder, in which you dial in those numbers, 7700, which indicates you have an emergency and they need to get you down.
WILEY: So you're getting priority handling going into the airports.
COLLINS: All right, quickly, before we let you go, because we are hearing President Barack Obama is a short time away from making some comments. We expect him to make comments about this tragedy outside of Buffalo. So we're going to bring that, of course, to you just as soon as it happens.
But before we let you go, John, this whole idea of autopilot and pilot reports, PIREPs, they're called, about the potential for icing and whatever the pilots may have been experiencing that night, very, very important. Could be, anyway, to this investigation.
WILEY: Sure. When you're coming into the area, when you're getting ready to land in the area, you're going to be coming in the area at about 200 knots, 230 miles an hour. And you're going to start changing the configuration of the flaps on the airplane so that you can slow the airplane down.
What we see in this is they are six miles from the end of the runway. They're getting ready to begin their descent. They're only 1,500 feet above the ground. Our eyewitness report about it being nose down and being in a turn, wings don't stall symmetrically.
COLLINS: Forgive me, John. Let's listen in to President Barack Obama now. We expect him to make comments about the plane crash.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Thank you all for being here. Before I begin, I want to say a brief word about the terrible tragedy that took place outside of Buffalo last night. Our thoughts and prayers are with the family and friends who lost loved ones, and as always, our thanks go out to the brave first responders who arrived immediately to try and save lives and who are still on the scene, keeping people safe.
Tragic events such as these remind us of the tragedy I willty of life and the value of every single day. One person who understood that well was Beverly Eckert, who was on that flight and who I met with just a few days ago. You see, Beverly lost her husband on 9/11 and became a tirelesses advocate for those families whose lives were forever changed on that September day.
And in keeping with that passionate commitment, she was on her way to Buffalo to mark what would have been her husband's birthday and launch a scholarship in his memory. So she was an inspiration to me and to so many others, and I pray that her family finds peace and comfort in the hard days ahead.
Welcome to White House. Every president since Franklin Delano Roosevelt has sought the advice of the Business Council. Every president since Lyndon Johnson has sought your audience. And while this is a partnership that is important during periods of relative peace and prosperity, it is a essential partnership during tough economic times. I don't need to tell you that we are in tough economic times.
The challenges we face today, we have not seen in a very long time. Each of you and every American sees them in very specific ways. We've lost 3.6 million jobs since this recession began. Nearly 600,000 just last month. Many of your businesses are under tremendous pressure, with revenues falling and credit drying up. You're feeling directly or indirectly the reverberations of a financial crisis, which has upended the economy.
But I'm not here to repeat a litany of our challenges. We know what they are, we know they are vast, and we know that they are varied. Instead, I'm here to enlist your help, because we have once- in-a-generation chance to act boldly and turn adversity into opportunity. And to use this crisis as a chance to transform our economy for the 21st century.
That's the driving purpose of the recovery and reinvestment plan that I've put before Congress. It's a plan that will ignite spending by businesses and consumers, make the investments necessary for lasting economic growth and prosperity and save or create more than 3.5 million jobs over the next two years. Ninety percent of those jobs are in the private sector.
We've had a spirited debate about this plan over the last few weeks. Not everybody has shared the same view of how we should move forward, and at times our discussions have been contentious. But that's a good thing, from my perspective. Diverse viewpoints are the lifeblood of our democracy, and debating these viewpoints is how we learn from each other's perspective and refine our approaches.
But as we meet, Congress is now poised to act. It's passed the House. It's passed the Senate. We expect a vote on the final version today. And one of the reasons we have come so far is because so many of you have recognized the urgency and necessity of taking action. This plan has won the support of groups such as the Chamber of Commerce and the National Association of Manufacturers. But also, the AFL-CIO.
And the goal at the heart of this plan is to create jobs. Not just any jobs, but jobs doing the work America needs done. Repairing our infrastructure, modernizing our schools and our hospitals, promoting the clean alternative-energy sources that will help us finally declare our independence from foreign oil.
It's a plan that will put people to work building wind turbines and solar panels and fuel-efficient cars. Will upgrade our schools, creating 21st-century classrooms and libraries and labs for millions of children across America. We'll computerize our health care system at last to save billions of dollars and countless lives as we reduce medical errors. We'll lay down broadband Internet lines to connect rural schools and small businesses so they can compete with their counterparts anywhere in the world. And we will rebuild our crumbling roads and bridges and repair our dangerously deficient dams and levees so we don't face another Katrina.
In addition to saving and creating jobs, we'll also ensure that folks who have lost jobs through no fall of their own can receive greater unemployment benefits and continue their health care coverage. It will provide badly needed middle-class tax relief, putting money in the pockets of workers and their families at a time when many of them are experiencing greater distress. It will also provide sensible tax relief to businesses that are trying to make payroll and create jobs. And our focus is not only on large businesses, but also small businesses that are probably feeling the credit crunch most acutely.
Passing this plan is a critical step, but as important as it is, it's only the beginning of what I think all of you understand is going to be a long and difficult process of turning our economy around. To truly address this crisis, we will also need to address the crisis in our financial sector, to get credit flowing again to families and businesses.
And we need to confront the crisis in the housing sector that's been one of the sources of our economic challenges. I'll be discussing that extensively soon. We're going to need comprehensive financial reform in the way government relates to the financial markets in order to deal with the complex of the 21st century, both as a way to restore trust and also ensure that a crisis like this can never happen again.
And finally, we have to approach our budget in a responsible way. It's my strong belief that we are going to have to invest in the short term to get our economy moving again, and that we would be foolish to ignore our current perils. But I also think that it's important for us to think in the midterm and long term. And over that midterm and long term, we're going to have to have fiscal discipline. We are not going to be able to perpetually finance the levels of debt that the federal government is currently carrying.
And that means investing in priorities like energy and health care and education that will grow our economy again. But it also means eliminating those programs that are wasteful and duplicative and that we simply cannot afford. We have to once again live within our means. We're going to have to make some tough decisions that many of you already are making in your companies, but the federal government has not made with respect to our operations.
It will take all of these steps to not only lead to an economic recovery but to lead to a long-term path to economic prosperity. And this work will not be easy. Our recovery will likely be measured in years and not months. All of us -- government, business, labor and citizens -- will have responsibilities to meet. And I will be looking to all of you for your ideas and innovations, for your help not only crafting the policies of the 21st century, but crafting a government for the 21st century that can be a partner with you.
Your best practices should be our best practices. And as we consider the work ahead, we'd all be well-served to reflect on the significance of the partnership that we see here today, how it was forged and why it's been so fruitful. Now, back in the spring of 1933, in the early days of the new administration, President Roosevelt's commerce secretary gathered in Washington the leaders of some of the nation's largest corporations, many of which continue to be represented in this room.
These executives, hailing from General Electric and General Motors and AT&T and Dupont and others formed an advisory panel to assist in the crafting of New Deal policies that in the coming years would transform the American economy amidst brutal and unyielding depression. And the work of these volunteers would inform the inception and implementation of the Securities and Exchange Act, the Banking Act, the Social Security Act and other policies that have served us ever since.
That's how the Business Council was born. It was at a moment when economic turmoil threatened the foundations on which our society was painstakingly built, at a moment when other nations were giving up, as President Roosevelt said, selling their heritage of freedom for the illusion of a living. That's not what we did. We adapted, we changed, we boldly defended our system of free enterprise, even as we enacted policies to transform the ways that it would function.
We did not give into ideologies that dismissed or derided the role of the government, nor those that denied the role of the marketplace. And so, even as our president was leading unprecedented public interventions into the private sector, he did so in concert with private sector's leaders. And even as government built new regulatory structures and weaved a social safety net, these efforts were designed not to confine private industry, but to allow to once again to succeed while ensuring that success was broadly shared.
And President Roosevelt understood the new role of government in this new world, that while extraordinary actions on its part might be the source of recovery, no action on the part of government, no matter how extraordinary, would alone be a source of our prosperity. Now, conversely, these corporate citizens understood their new role, as well, that we all had responsibilities to fulfill, that our survival depended on how well we work together, that, in a more interdependent economy, our fates were and are more interconnected. Our growth, our success as a nation depended on what we did together.
And so, the government could lay the groundwork for an economy in which innovation is prized and hard work rewarded, and in which rules are clear and clearly enforced. And the rest would be up to people like you and the people who work for you to create the incredible products and services that today we enjoy.
That's how we've led the global economy. That's how we've ushered in massive gains in wealth, not just for the few but for the many. That is how we've been and will continue to be a nation that draws on the talents of all our people, a place where generation after generation of bold thinkers and bright minds, innovators and inventors have taken the chance to invest in an idea, to build a new product, to test a new theory, to do their small part to change our world.
That's what's attracted some of the best talent around the world to our shores. That's our promise. And that's the promise that must always be at the heart of our partnership. So, I hope this is the beginning of many conversations. Many of you I know, many of you I've had long conversations with in the past. My door will always be open to you.
And I'm absolutely confident that if we're smart, and if we are bold, if we work together, if we're willing to cast aside some of the theories that have already failed us, and we remain open to new approaches and new ideas, and we think about the problems of our economy the way you think about your businesses -- in practical, hard- headed, clear clear- eyed terms, unclouded by dogmas -- then I'm absolutely confident we can lead this nation through this transformative moment and come out stronger and more prosperous than ever before.
I thank you for your leadership, I thank you for being here and I'm looking forward to having a series of conversations with all of you in the near future. Thank you very much.
COLLINS: President Barack Obama talking about the economy. He's addressing, from the East Room of the White House, the Business Council. But off the top, just in case you missed it, he did, of course, make mention of the tragic plane crash in Buffalo, New York, where 50 people were killed.
He made mention of Beverly Eckert, who's done some work with the 9/11 Commission. She is the -- she was, pardon me -- the widow of her husband who was lost in the September 11 tragedy, as well. He had met with her just days previous.
So, we continue to follow that, and any other developments coming out of the White House today, because, of course, there is a very big story and a vote that could happen on the stimulus bill. So, we're going to keep you posted on that, of course, as well.
Coming up next, though, we want to get back to the plane crash in Buffalo. We have someone who has some unbelievable pictures just moments after it happened. We're going to talk with him in just a moment here. Back in a moment.
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COLLINS: Firefighters still fighting the fire that ignited from the crash of Flight 3407, 12 hours ago. Fifty people are dead. All 49 people aboard the Continental Connection flight, and then one person on the ground. The plane crashed into a Buffalo-area home, and despite the fire, the NTSB is trying to retrieve the plane's voice and flight data recorders.
About 30 relatives and friends who had been awaiting the flight at the Buffalo airport were taken to a family assistance center. The names of all of the passengers have not been released. But one woman on board was identified as September 11 widow Beverly Eckert.
Our next guest has captured some of the most dramatic images of the fiery plane crash scene. He lives two miles from the crash site. Harry Scull is a staff photographer with "The Buffalo News." So, Harry, tell us what you saw as we look at some those pictures you were able to take.
HARRY SCULL, JR., PHOTOGRAPHER, "THE BUFFALO NEWS": Well, Heidi, last night I was sitting on the couch, and I heard the fire alarms go off, and shortly after, my neighbor called me and let me know that a plane had hit a house, and there were some large flames. I took a look out the window, and my worst fears came true. And, you know, the photojournalistic instincts took over, and I grabbed the laptop and the camera and headed right to the scene.
COLLINS: What did you see when you first got there, Harry?
SCULL: I saw a lot of confusion. Flames as high and as wide as you can imagine. And a smell of diesel fuel.
COLLINS: I know you are also at the airport. Tell us a little bit more about how the people on the ground, you know, were responding. I imagine -- you already used the word chaos. I imagine everybody moving really, really quickly here.
SCULL: Well, I'm sure most of those firemen have all been trained for this day, hoping it never comes just because of the proximity to the airport and the fire station, and I think their worst dreams came true or worst fears came true, and they had to go out and try to put out the fire.
COLLINS: Yes, absolutely. In fact, Harry, I want to let people know something that we are just learning now here, because with regard that to that fire, we had been told for quite some time now that the NTSB investigators, the go team, the seven people that are on the ground already, had not really been able to make their way into the crash site because of how hot that fire was burning.
Our understanding now is that they have been able to recover two of the black boxes. Of course, that would be the flight data recorder and the cockpit voice recorder. So, this is very, very good news in order for those investigators to be able to glean the most information that they possibly can regarding all of the information from the plane itself, the aircraft and what it was doing, and also, some of the conversations that may have been taking place between the captain of the aircraft and the first officer, as well.
Harry, we want to quickly get back to you. Obviously, you have lived in the area for some time. Have you ever seen anything like this before?
SCULL: No, Heidi. In my 11 years, I've never seen anything like this before. But, you know, I can tell you that this is one of the worst fears I thought could happen, and it did happen. When darkness appears in Clarence Center, the planes happen to fly lower and lower. Not so much the noise, but the bright lights, and, you know, it's been a fear of us and neighbors around us that sooner or later, one of these planes are going to crash.
COLLINS: Harry Scull, Jr., we sure do appreciate it. Thank you.
The latest information on that Continental commuter plane crash, including detailed accounts from witnesses, coming your way next.
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(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
BRENDAN BIDDLECOM, CRASH WITNESS: It sounded like a plane going down, and really, as soon as that thought registered, a moment later there was a loud crash and an explosion, and the house just shook at the foundation. And, you know, that kind of confirmed for me what my initial inclination was.
And I ran outside, didn't see anything at first, but a few moments later, there was some additional explosions and then flames just started, you know -- huge infernos into the sky, lighting it up. And, you know, it was pretty clear at that point what was going on.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
COLLINS: Neighbors in shock after a Continental commuter plane crashed into a house in Clarence Center, New York. That's right outside of Buffalo. All 49 people on board Flight 3407 are dead. One person inside the house also died.
We did get word just a few moments ago that NTSB investigators who were on the scene have now located the plane's cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder. This will be integral in their investigation. There was a mix of sleet and snow in the area at the time of the crash, but it is unclear at this point if that weather played a role.
I'm Heidi Collins. Join me again Monday morning beginning at 9 a.m. Eastern. For now, CNN NEWSROOM continues with Tony Harris.
