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Afghan-Pakistan Challenges; Switching Parties & Seniority; Cash for Clunkers; Legalizing Online Gambling; Specter To Undergo Democratic Caucus Discussions On Whether He Can Keep His GOP Seniority, Chair Powerful Committees

Aired May 06, 2009 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: We want to move on to politics now because we have a developing story. What happens when you switch parties and you're a senator? Well, you get stripped of your seniority. It can be costly.

CNN's Senior Congressional Correspondent Dana Bash has been talking to Arlen Specter about that, about his seniority, or now lack of it.

Dana, what's going on now?

DANA BASH, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What's going on is that Arlen Specter made very clear when he surprised everybody and switched parties that he believed from the Senate majority leader that he would be able to maintain his seniority. What that means in practical terms, at least we thought, and he thought, was that he would be able to maintain his powerful position or rankings on some of the important committees that he's been touting as crucial to sit on for the people back home in Pennsylvania.

Well, what happened last night, Don, is that the Senate passed a resolution putting Arlen Specter in the very last tier, chair, the very lowest rank on some of these important committees like the Appropriations Committee and the Judiciary Committee that he used to chair when he was a Republican.

So, everybody has been running around trying to find Arlen Specter to try to find out what happened. We caught up with him just outside of his office. He did say he got a commitment from the Democratic leader that he would keep his slots. Listen to what he told us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ARLEN SPECTER (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Senator Reid said that I would maintain my committee assignments and that my seniority would be established as if I had been elected in 1980 as a Democrat.

Now that has to be ratified by the caucus. And I think, in due course, that will be done. It may not -- we did agree that as to committee assignments that would wait until the new election and the caucus action overall, apparently, is going to wait until after the election. But I'm confident that Senator Reid's assurances will be fulfilled. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: What Senator Specter told us is that some of the long- serving Democrats, who already are pretty high up there, in some of these very important committees, they balked. That they pushed back to Senator Reid saying, wait a minute, you know, he shouldn't jump the line and jump ahead of us; because, again, these rankings on these committees really matter, particularly when it comes to the Senate Appropriations Committee.

And the big picture context for this, Don, and this is important, because it may sound like a lot of parlor games inside Congress, but the big picture context is that Senator Specter - I was with him back home in Pennsylvania on Monday. The argument he's making over and over to constituents and the voters back home is that it was critical for him to switch parties in order to stay in the Senate because he is so senior, because he was elected in 1980. And because of that, he has high rankings on these committees and he can bring back, particularly on appropriations, hundreds of millions of dollars to the state. That is the central argument he is making for why the switch was important and why the people of Pennsylvania should send him back.

But now, at least symbolically, he's at the bottom of the wrung in these committees. We did hear him say he is going to try to change things with Senator Reid. We can tell you that Wolf Blitzer is wrapping up an interview with the Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid to see what his side of the story is, and we will get that to you soon. But this is a lot of intrigue. And, again, pretty important when it comes to ramifications of Senator Specter's surprising switch.

LEMON: All right. Dana Bash, thank you very much.

It will be interesting when I come back to talk to you in a little bit to see if there was any sort of precedent set with this, if it has happened in the past, or if it is strictly he thinks it is retaliatory.

Dana Bash, thank you very much for that.

I want to get to our Chad Myers now. Chad has some breaking news when it comes to the weather.

Chad, what do you have for us?

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: It will be a busy day all day, Don.

If you see a weather line coming to you, from the west or from the southwest, take cover. Don't worry -- don't wait for a tornado warning. Literally, there is going to be wind damage with it. We'll have spinning with these storms. Here's Atlanta right here. Here's Gadson, Alabama, Anderson, Alabama. I know we have some video already out of Jasper, Alabama. That tornado that roared through earlier this morning. We don't have official confirmation on was it an F-2, and F- 3, F-4, but this rolled through an overhang which was a bank. Look at this. This is just completely gone. You should be able to drive under there and hand your money to the teller there, or put it in the little tube. There's the reporter there, from WBNA, our affiliate, out there.

This will kind of give -- that's not a big tornado. That could have been wind damage that did that. This will be the kind of stuff that's going happen all day here. It will be all of the way up and down this line. There's a line here. Here's Atlanta, Georgia. Here's Huntsville. Birmingham. We'll get some shots out of Birmingham later in the day as we get permission to use them.

Here's a shot out of Atlanta. That's from -that's about Centennial Park, that is the Centennial Park that you knew from the Olympics back in 1996. Here's a shot actually from the top of our building. Here's what I'm worried about. These gray clouds, really, really moisture laden. There is so much humidity in the air today. We had some sunshine. It is up to almost 80 degrees in Atlanta and Macon and Valdosta, and Mobile. Birmingham, you're kind of in the clear for now but there's more weather to the northwest. This could go on all day. We have watches and warnings posted basically throughout the night already, Don.

LEMON: It takes the same path when it comes through. It did that this weekend. Hey, Chad, thank you very much.

MYERS: You go it, buddy.

LEMON: We have another breaking news story we need to work on.

This is just in to CNN, getting the information, Palm Beach County, Palm Beach County, you're looking at these pictures now live from our affiliate WPTV. This is the Lantana Airport. We're being told that two planes here collided. Rescuers on the scene of an aircraft incident involving two planes at the Lantana Airport.

Unclear what caused the accident at this point. It appears there are two fatalities on the scene. Again, this is according to people there. The Palm Beach County Fire and Rescue are saying that, that two people, two fatalities on the scene.

But these two planes, not sure exactly where they were going, where they were coming from, the circumstances surrounding this. But you can see, there, rescue workers on the scene, as well as them spraying it down.

Again, courtesy of our affiliate WPTV. Look at that. It appears that If you look at these pictures, I don't know if we can drop that banner and look. It looks like this airplane -- one of these airplanes went under a tractor trailer. Is that correct from - yes, from this monitor.

It looks like - I don't know how it got under this tractor trailer or exactly what happened. We're trying to find out the circumstances surrounding this. This is certainly very interesting to see that. You see the tail section of that plane right next to it if not under that tractor trailer. And then another plane very close to it.

The latest information we're getting here is that these two planes collided. Again, not exactly sure of the circumstances. How many people were on board, we're not exactly sure of, but we are being told by fire and rescue there are two people who may have died -who probably died from this incident. We're working on checking more information for you. This coming out of Palm Beach County, Florida. As we continue to monitor those live pictures. We won't miss any of it.

Let's get back to our discussion about Afghanistan and Pakistan . Right now the two countries are a central focus of President Obama's foreign policy. He meets with their leaders today at the White House. The talks take place against a backdrop of intense fighting between the Pakistani military and the Taliban.

And tensions are rising in Afghanistan over civilian casualties from a U.S. air strike. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton met with the Afghan, Pakistani leaders just a short time ago. She talked about the need for a coordinated effort against extremists.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: This distinguished group of U.S. officials from different federal agencies reflects President Obama's and my strong belief that promoting peace and stability in Afghanistan and Pakistan must be an all government effort.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Aides say President Obama is pushing for an alliance against the shared threat from the Taliban and Al Qaeda. Let's get more now on the Afghan/Pakistan summit and what the president wants to accomplish.

Standing by, listening to the secretary of State's press conference or speech this morning was our Suzanne Malveaux. She's at the White House, again, she's our White House correspondent.

What does the administration hope will come of these meetings? Obviously, peace, some sort of effort there, Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Don, according to one senior administration official he says, look, it's a process. This is not precooked. They really just want to get these two leaders together to come up with some sort of shared strategy looking at Al Qaeda as well as Taliban. How do they deal with this?

Don, it's interesting. I covered under President Bush, it was September 2006 when they tried this before. They had the Afghan leader Hamid Karzai who is also here. But also at the time it was Pervez Musharraf of Pakistan. These two guys were blaming each other for everything when it came to the terrorist threat. They wouldn't even shake hands. You may recall that moment. A lot that was made about that, that they wouldn't even shake hands. Certainly the White House is hoping for a different picture this time. You have relatively new leadership in Pakistan, Zardari. Both of these men, earlier today, with Secretary Clinton at least expressing some interest in working together.

But still we hear some of that same language, Don, that there is some blame here that's going back and forth. Karzai saying that he believes that Pakistan has been allowing for the Taliban to have sanctuary inside of that country. President Obama also saying as well that that is a big problem here. So that is one of the things, one of the main issues that all three leaders will be talking about, Don.

LEMON: I heard both leaders this morning thanking President Obama, at least, for trying to make an effort here for peace in those countries. What do you think the presidents - or the leaders of these countries will ask for, from President Obama?

MALVEAUX: Zardari certainly has not been shy about what he wants. A senior European diplomat telling us earlier this morning that he's really -- his hands are stretched out and reached out for anybody who is willing to help him here. He even told our Wolf Blitzer yesterday that he's going to specifically ask President Obama, say, look, there are U.S. drones that are flying overhead, part of going after the Taliban. He wants to own those drones. He wants to own some of the military hardware that the U.S. has been using. He wants to have control over that.

The Obama administration talking about tripling the amount of money when it comes to the economy of Pakistan . He's going to be talking about - I want even more. He says I appreciate it, but I need more help from European allies. I need more help from this administration.

The Afghan leader is going to once again say, look, I want for the Pakistan is to take responsibility in this. That we cannot do this alone. Obviously a very robust military effort to support Afghanistan and going after the Taliban. But both of the leaders, Don, are going to make it very clear that they need more assistance from this president. We believe that the president will actually deliver and give them a lot of what they want because it's in our interest. The president says, look, this is a matter of national security, Don.

LEMON: OK, that's the view from the White House. Suzanne Malveaux, thank you very much.

Want to go now to the Pentagon. As we told you earlier, we are also closely following that deadly U.S. air strike in Afghanistan that is sparking so much anger. We turn now our Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr, who has been working her sources on this story.

Barbara, there is an investigation now under way. What are you hearing there from the Pentagon?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, Don, here at the Pentagon while the diplomacy goes on with all three of those leaders meeting, the issue on the ground is very sensitive. Another case where there are allegations that a U.S. military air strike, yesterday, in southern Afghanistan resulted in the death of several Afghan civilians. A military investigation is under way on the ground; officials from the U.S. and Afghanistan walking the ground trying to figure out what is going on.

The images coming from the scene do show civilians injured and the U.S. says at this point they think it is possible that this air strike might have wounded as many as 11 Afghan civilians. They aren't confirming it. They want to walk the ground. They want to talk to the people in the villages, see exactly what did happen.

At this point, the U.S., the Pentagon not ready to say if any Afghans civilians were killed in this air strike. There are allegations, I must tell you, that dozens of Afghan civilians were killed. Earlier today the General David McKiernan says - he hinted he didn't think that was likely. But how sensitive is this? Secretary of State Hillary Clinton felt it was very necessary to bring it all up at today's meeting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: I want to convey to the people of both Afghanistan and Pakistan that we will work very hard with your governments, and with your leaders, to avoid the loss of innocent civilian life. We deeply, deeply regret that loss.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: And the fact that Secretary Clinton brought it up in such a high-profile situation really tells you all you need to know. The Obama administration knows these issues of potential civilian casualties are absolutely, totally a very crucial matter for Hamid Karzai in Afghanistan. The people of Afghanistan are, understandably, are very upset when these incidents occur.

LEMON: Hey, Barbara, we have a very busy day here. We have the bad weather and then we also have that thing in Florida that we've been following. But I want to get this in, because Secretary Gates is traveling to Afghanistan. The timing is very interesting here. You have two leaders here. Secretary Gates in one of the countries now. What does he hope to accomplish?

STARR: Well, he is there to get a firsthand look on the ground where all these extra 20,000 U.S. troops are going to be going in southern Afghanistan. Even though he's not in Washington this issue is front and center. Civilian casualties are very much hurting Hamid Karzai's reputation with the people of Afghanistan; and Secretary Gates knows the real crisis across the border in Pakistan still has to be dealt with. You should consider all of those issues on the table, Don.

LEMON: All right. Barbara Starr, thank you very much for that.

We want to turn now to the fight against the swine flu. Here's the latest on what we know. A Texas school teacher has become the first U.S. resident to die with the H1N1 virus. Health officials stopped short of saying swine flu killed Judy Trunnell. They say the 33-year-old woman had chronic underlying health conditions.

Meantime the World Health Organization has just updated its swine flu figures. We gave that to you last hour. It now confirms 1,658 people infected in 23 countries. The U.S. has 403 people.

Most of those confirmed U.S. cases are in New York. The city's mayor, Michael Bloomberg, is at the CDC right now learning firsthand about the disease and how to fight it. CDC officials have reversed an earlier recommendation that schools should be closed when a student tests positive for the virus. They now say students who show signs of the flu should be kept out of school just as they should in any flu outbreak.

Turning now to the economy and specifically jobs; the jobs picture is brightening up a bit. That is some good news. Hundreds of thousands of jobs are still being cut each and every month though, but the pace of the cuts, that's what's slowing. Our Stephanie Elam is at the New York Stock Exchange with details on that.

Hello, Stephanie, I guess you have to be optimistic, glass half full. At least it is slowing, not rising, but slowing.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN FINANCIAL CORRESPONDENT: Right, Don.

You know, 491,000 jobs were lost in April. That is still a very large number. However, it's the smallest decline in six months. That's still a recessionary level of job cuts. This is coming to us from payroll processing firm ADP. So, it shows the pace of job losses slowing compared with April losses of more than 700,000 - I should say the April number is slowing compared to March when the number was over 700,000. You can take a look there and what we've been looking at this year so far.

So, look at that cutback on that bar chart right there and you can see this is making a difference. Still, the job losses we definitely widespread; manufacturing, construction, they were hit hard. But the ADP numbers that we got here, they could actually temper estimates ahead of the government's big jobs report. We are going to get that on Friday morning.

The expectation before today was for 620,000 jobs to be lost and for unemployment to rise to 8.9 percent from 8.5 percent. Also, there's another difference, Don, to keep in mind here between this ADP report and the government report. The government counts public sector jobs while the ADP report does not. And the public sector has actually been adding jobs, so that is something to keep in mind, Don.

LEMON: OK, Steph, so Ben Bernanke said the economy is stabilizing. That was just yesterday he said that. This employment report is better than expected. It's a million-dollar question, I don't know if you can answer, or I don't know if he did. When can we start to see the forest through for the trees?

ELAM: If I could tell you that, then I probably wouldn't be here, because I would be sitting on a beach and nice and rich, and glass in hand. That's not the case here.

What we can tell you though, Don, is that we're starting to see signs of stabilization. We have gotten other signs that the economy is starting to get better. But the recovery will take longer than this. The job losses, they're still at recessionary levels, as I was saying.

And analysts point out that employment is likely to fall for at least another few months. Remember that it is kind of a lagging indicator. So, it is one of the last things to turn around when the economy does. The stock market is one of the first things. So, we keep our eyes on that. The bottom line to all of this, Don, is that things are still bad, they're just not as bad as they were a few months ago. So that should give us all a little bit of hope.

LEMON: Thank you. And I know you wouldn't be on a beach because you're a humanitarian. You'd be helping out for the good of all mankind.

ELAM: I can help out on the beach, right?

LEMON: Yes. Stephanie, thank you very much for that.

Stephanie, we have got to get to some breaking news that we just told you about moments ago. We have an update on the story that happening in Florida, specifically Palm Beach, at the Lantana Airport. Hey, take a look at this. This is the runway. Those are amazing pictures.

Here is what we're being told. We're told that two planes collided. We're working to get specific information from Palm Beach County Fire and Rescue. They are saying this happened on takeoff. And that we have seen one plane on the side, there, of a tractor trailer. This is another plane that's on the runway there. It appears to be in parts as well.

Another picture earlier showed us again, as I said, one plane you can see tail section sort of sticking out of the back of a tractor trailer. We know that two planes, at least, are involved in this. It happened on the runway, on takeoff. That's all we're hearing from Palm Beach County Fire and Rescue. Again, this is the Lantana Airport. They are also telling us, Fire and Rescue, there are two fatalities. We're checking on this developing story for you. More news as it comes into here, CNN.

Congress is looking at megabanks today. Those deemed too big to fail. We've heard that term. That was a primary government rationale for taxpayer bailout last fall. FDIC Chairman Sheila Bair told the Senate Banking Committee that "too big to fail" means too big, period. She says the government needs to offer big bank incentives to shrink, so problems at one won't impact the broader economy. Bair looked ahead to tomorrow when the government releases stress test results for the nation's biggest banks.

Listen up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHIELA BAIR, CHAIRWOMAN, FDIC: I think this will be a confidence instilling announcement. There will be additional needs for capital buffers for some institutions. But I think there will be mechanism to do that within the next six months. And yes, we certainly, I would agree, those institutions need to look to nongovernment sources first. The Treasury can be there as a backstop, but they should look to nongovernment sources first and first and foremost, to raise new equity if possible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Sheila Bair. And 19 banks have been undergoing stress tests since February. Reports say Bank of America will be required to raise $34 billion in new capital to guard against future financial turndowns.

We have a new poll on what Americans think about those interrogation memos from the Bush administration. Does the public think anyone should be prosecuted? You'll be surprised by the results.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: We have some new information today about the terror interrogation strategies used during the Bush era. Preliminary Justice Department investigation does not, does not recommend criminal prosecutions. Legal memos by three department lawyers concluded harsh techniques, such as water-boarding, were legal.

President Obama has banned the practice calling it torture. This investigation began under the Bush administration. While prosecution may not develop investigators are likely to recommend state bar associations discipline the lawyers. That could mean disbarment.

A new CNN poll reveals most Americans don't - don't want criminal charges over the interrogations. Senior Political Analyst Bill Schneider is in Washington with the poll breakdown.

OK, so does the public believe the interrogation procedures, like water-boarding, were a form of torture, though, Bill?

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. That's a simple answer to a straightforward question. Yes, they do. In fact, 60 percent of Americans told us that those procedures were in fact a form of torture and 36 percent believe they were not. That's a pretty clear answer.

LEMON: OK. So then they don't believe even though it was a form of torture, they still don't believe that there should be prosecution for this?

SCHNEIDER: No, they don't believe that people should be prosecuted for this. Most Americans oppose the prosecution of those who authorized the use of these methods and they oppose any investigation of those who actually used the methods, even Democrats are split on those questions.

But now here's something interesting. What about the Bush administration's decision to use those harsh interrogation methods, which most Americans think was a form of torture? Do you favor or oppose those? People are split just about down the middle 50-46, on whether the methods should be used.

In fact, what we found is among the 60 percent of Americans we saw earlier, who believe they were a form of torture, almost a third of them say the Bush administration was correct to use those against suspected terrorists. What that means is there are a lot of people out there with a, shall we call them, a Jack Bauer mentality, for those that watch the show "24."

LEMON: OK. Thank you for that, Bill Schneider, our senior political analyst. We appreciate that.

Children caught in the crossfire; and orphanage on the front lines of the fight in Pakistan.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right, more breaking news here to CNN. This is happening in San Antonio, Texas. Look at that fire. You see it behind that structure over there. You can see to the right of your screen firefighters trying to spray whatever it is, retardant or either water on this. This is courtesy of our affiliate KSAT.

Here is what we're being told. As we look at these pictures from our affiliate. That emergency crews were called to the scene here of a 24-inch natural gas line rupture. This is happening on the city of San Antonio's north side. So, obviously, you see the emergency officials blocking off the area around this. A gas line rupture is extremely, extremely serious. They are working on this trying to get this gas rupture sealed, in San Antonio, on the city's north side. We don't have control of these pictures. Again, our affiliate is on the scene and they are most likely reporting live. You can see their chopper there on the scene, as well.

Again, huge gas line rupture, 24-inch natural gas line rupture in San Antonio.

Orphans caught in the crossfire. As fighting rages between Pakistan's military and Taliban militants; We are told about 50 boys and 20 staffers are trapped in a four-story building in Pakistan's Swat Valley. An estimated 40,000 people have fled the area on government orders; half a million civilians are expected to flee that fighting.

Let's get the big picture, here, on the region and what the United States is doing about that. And for that, we turn to CNN's Josh Levs.

Josh, fill us in.

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Don. I actually have something. We were just talking about that orphanage. Let me show you on the screen right behind me, CNN.com/impact, Don. It impacts your world. We are actually talking about that situation right now and ways that people can help people in the region including young people, CNN.com/impact.

All right. We're going to zoom way out. Let's go to this animation. I want to start off looking at America and then I want to take you way over east, and show you the region that we keep talking about today. Pakistan and Afghanistan, obviously, it has been a critical U.S. concern for years right there.

We are going to zoom in a little bit closer. You often hear us say Waziristan, which is along the border area, where it's believed a lot of Taliban militants have been hiding.

I'll show you something that's really important that you rarely hear us say when we talk about this, but it is really critical and that is Iran. Let's zoom over to the board behind me. I want to show you something here. Let's go to this little tiny map here. Sometimes the best way to understand something is the simplest way. Pakistan, India, Afghanistan, is right here and that's Iran. So whenever we talk about issues involving this region, it also affects U.S. relations with Iran. Just something important to keep in mind there.

And one more thing I want to show you, because it's really cool and looks good on TV. Look at this. Don, this is the NATO forces. And I know it looks like a big jumble, but every time you see a U.S. map, that's where U.S. forces are working. So you can see this region right down here. The U.S. forces who are part of NATO, the U.S. is the biggest contributor to NATO forces there. This is where the United States is focusing in Afghanistan, trying to do a lot of work to help improve conditions there -- Don.

LEMON: Yes, and you know the maps, it all look pretty and its colorful, but there are some really dire conditions in Afghanistan right now.

LEVS: Awful. Yes, awful. I mean, in fact, we're seeing some really interesting things here from UNHCR, which is the U.N. Refugee Agency. It's really moving. I pulled out a few factoids for you. Let's go to this graphic so you can get a sense of how tough things are.

Seventy percent of the country living in poverty. A lot of hunger there. Forty percent of children under three are underweight in Afghanistan there. More than 100,000 people are displaced inside Afghanistan. Not including the millions who haven't come back yet to Afghanistan.

A little bit more. U.N. says security is deteriorating. They say the problems have been compounded by -- you've got drought, then you've got snow and flooding.

But, on the flip side, we also don't hear often enough about the improvements. There are important improvements. Twenty-two percent have improved drinking water. Thirty percent have improved sanitation. Most children are now immunized. Most, like 90 percent for some of these illnesses, against numerous illnesses.

And, Don, all that is thanks to you've got refugee agencies, NGOs and the United States. The U.S. military and U.S. civilians who are there working every day to bring more sanitary conditions and better conditions to Afghanistan. There are improvements along with all the awful things they're going through.

LEMON: Hey, Josh, we really appreciate it. Thank you very much for that, sir.

Pakistan and Afghanistan have become a critical area of focus for President Obama's foreign policy team. I'll get some context on the region from those who have played leadership roles there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Take a look now at the big board. Looking at the Dow. The Dow is up 58 points today. Our Stephanie Elam is sitting there at the New York Stock Exchange and she will update us with the very latest information in just a bit on this.

Meantime, we want to take a closer look at what we've been talking about. The challenges in Afghanistan and Pakistan and what's at stake here for the U.S. and those countries as well. I want to bring in two people who are very familiar with the region there. Ashraf Ghani is a chairman at the Institution of State Effectiveness and a former finance minister of Afghanistan. He joins us from Kabul.

Thank you, sir.

And then there's Akbar Ahmed. He's a former Pakistani ambassador to the U.K. and a chair of the Islamic studies at American University in Washington.

Thank you both so much for joining us today.

We heard this morning the secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, talking and she said that it's going to be a joint goal. Both men, both men said that terrorism was a cancer on their country.

Mr. Ghani, do you believe that that's so and can you elaborate on that?

ASHRAF GHANI, CHAIRMAN, INSTITUTE FOR STATE EFFECTIVENESS: Yes. The threat presented by terror is real. There's a tango of terror that involves Afghanistan, Pakistan, India and also presents a wider regional danger. So this is a very real issue and it requires joint coordinated action both on the part of Afghanistan and Pakistan and the larger international community.

LEMON: OK. Mr. Ahmed, this morning, listening to the secretary of state, I want to play this because we know the role that women have in those two countries and the secretary of state spoke about that -- in was in the middle of a sentence, but it was very important about what she said. I want you to listen and then comment on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: That this is not just me speaking, but this is the American government speaking. That we do not believe either Afghanistan or Pakistan can achieve lasting progress without the full participation of all of your citizens, including women and girls. The rights of women must be respected and protected. This is a time for, as we say, all hands on deck. Entire population. The talents of everyone must be engaged.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Now, Mr. Ahmed, in this country it is often perceived that women are treated as second-class citizens there. How do you think the secretary of state's comments will go over with the leaders in that country and how do you feel about what she said? AKBAR AHMED, FORMER PAKISTANI AMBASSADOR TO U.K.: Two questions to be answered. Firstly, the secretary's comments about Pakistan and Afghanistan, I think she has to be a little bit sensitive as not to appear slamming these two countries because these are two key allies of the United States. Early on she had made some comments about Pakistan, which she had to retract very quickly. So she is the chief diplomat and she needs to speak more diplomatically.

The point she makes is valid. The point is that many women, millions of women in both Afghanistan and Pakistan, don't get the rights that they're entitled to under Islam, their religion. Very often tribal rules or feudal rules or Zulu rules make sure that women are deprived of their inheritance, their right to stand for election and so on.

Having said that, let me also say, there's a very large, very vital population segment, both in Afghanistan and Pakistan, of women who are making their impact, who are interpreting modernity (ph) and fighting for their rights. Pakistan has had a female prime minister long before the United States has even thinking of putting up a female presidential candidate.

So we must not forget that women have played a role in Pakistan. They have been ambassadors, ministers, as in Afghanistan, editors of important journals and newspapers, and that they continue to play that role.

LEMON: Right. I want to let Mr. Ghani get in here because I want to ask you about this road, the signing of this agreement for this road, which the secretary of state says will bring new trade to the region. Other countries can sell things there. Do you think that this opening of a road is really the magic bullet that many people think it's going to be?

GHANI: There is no magic bullet. We need to coordinate a regional framework. Transit (ph) and energy are the first step toward creation of a regional framework of cooperation. But every step at this moment that encourages regional trade and mutual economic benefit is a good thing. Afghanistan and Pakistan are indispensably linked. And we need to think about win-win approaches. Unfortunately, during the last years, a lose-lose proposition has been put on the table and we hope that this agreement will start the foundation of a new way of looking at our complementarities rather than oppositions.

LEMON: Mr. Ahmed, it is interesting it see both the leaders there, who will later meet with the president today, thanking the president and in some ways critical of each other but for the most part saying both of them agreeing that they need to sit down and talk, not only with each other, but with the U.S. and with other countries. This is a change in tone.

AHMED: It is. And remember that today for President Obama, his greatest headache is not coming from Rush Limbaugh and the Republicans, it's really coming from Afghanistan and Pakistan. He's staked his reputation and his foreign policy in that part of the world. And the fact that the two presidents are here with him as he's their host and talking to each other in a more amiable (ph) way than when it last happened. You remember under President Bush he also had the two presidents here, President Musharraf and President Karzai. And from the body language you saw how much animosity and hostility there was between the two of them.

LEMON: OK, Ashraf Ghani, who is joining us from Kabul, and also Akbar Ahmed, we appreciate your time today. Thank you.

AHMED: Thank you.

LEMON: Are you stuck driving a gas guzzler? Well, the government wants to help you get more fuel efficient. How are they doing that?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK. We've got some developing news. Dana Bash, who was talking about Arlen Specter, got him on tape talking about losing his seniority since he switched parties. Now the Senate majority leader is speaking out here, Harry Reid. Dana stands by. Dana, you've heard from him as well.

BASH: Well, actually Wolf Blitzer talked to him for an interview for "THE SITUATION ROOM," which will air later today. But specifically Harry Reid was asked about what we reported earlier, that Arlen Specter thought he was promised that he would be a pretty high ranking on these key committees that give him the power -- that important power for the people of Pennsylvania.

So Harry Reid was asked by Wolf about the fact that he put Harry Reid last in line in these committees. This is something that was done last night. So listen to the way Harry Reid responded to this move.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. HARRY REID (D-NV), MAJORITY LEADER: Arlen is a senior member of the Senate. And that's significant. I think also we can try to work something out with individual chairman and I'm certainly doing that. But I think everyone should just kind of relax and understand that he's a Democrat. We're doing our best to make him happy as a Democrat. I think he is. I've talked to him often. And any other situation I think is something that's kind of being made up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: So the basic message from Senator Reid was that this whole issue is being overblown and that Senator Specter is still somebody who is certainly welcome in the Democratic Party. That this isn't some kind of slight to him. That is the message from Senator Reid.

But, you know, that doesn't change the reality, Don. And the reality is that Senator Specter is now effectively just like a freshman, even though he was elected in 1980. He's effectively a freshman on these very important committees, like the Senate Appropriations Committee and the Senate Judiciary Committee. So that hasn't changed.

But Senator Reid, again, according to a spokesman, said there was no miscommunication. This is the way it is. This is the way Senator Specter is going to have to deal with this for the next couple of years. Going to make a tough argument back home when he's running for re-election to say that he still has this kind of power.

LEMON: All right, Dana Bash.

Thank you very much, Dana.

Both sides of the story up there on Capitol Hill. CNN's Wolf Blitzer is going to have that full report tonight, 4:00 p.m. Eastern in "THE SITUATION ROOM." The full report, the interview with Harry Reid. Don't want to miss that.

Chrysler clears two big hurdles in bankruptcy court. First, the judge says Chrysler can tap $4.5 billion in loans from the U.S. and Canadian governments to pay its bills. Second, the judge says Chrysler can begin selling its assets to Fiat through a bidding procedure. A group of dissident creditors was pushing for liquidation, arguing it would give them a greater return on their money.

Ford is plugging in. The company announced just last hour it will build a battery powered Ford Focus for 2011. The electric sub compact will roll of assembly lines at the retooled Ford plant in Wayne, Michigan. Until it closed last November, the factory built the Ford Expedition and the Lincoln Navigator SUVs. Ford says the retooling will protect 3,200 jobs and perhaps create another 1,500. The state of Michigan is chipping in $160 million in tax incentives.

All right. Do you own a gas guzzler? Do you drive one? Would you like to trade it in for a more fuel efficient car? The government could help you foot the bill on that. CNNMoney.com's Poppy Harlow here to tell us about that in our "Energy Fix."

OK, Poppy, this is -- how do you do that?

POPPY HARLOW, CNNMONEY.COM CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's a catchy name, right, cash for clunkers. That's the unofficial title of this portion of a bill in Congress right now.

We told you folks about this a few weeks ago from (ph) the Obama administration. Here's the news. It's signaling support for a deal that has been reached among House Democrats. Part of the larger energy bill that House leaders hope to pass before Memorial Day.

Under this agreement, basically if your old car gets 18 miles per gallon or less, you can get government vouchers toward a new, more fuel efficient one. And they're pretty significant. $3,500 to $4,500 depending on how fuel efficient that new car is. Unlike the previous proposal, Don, both foreign and U.S. made models would qualify, Don. So that could really help pick up sales.

LEMON: OK. So then why are some environmentalists less than thrilled with this idea?

HARLOW: Because of the specifics. Right, the devil in the detail here. The fuel economy requirements, the environmentalists think they're not strict enough. To qualify for $3,500, your new vehicle is going to have to get 22 miles per gallon. It's only 4 miles per gallon more than what you trade in. It's also less than the original bill sought out. The big question is it enough to bring in potential buyers into car showrooms, especially during this deep recession? We headed out of the office yesterday asking people what they think. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My old car is about eight years old and it would definitely help me out to have a new car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The car's about to die. If we could trade it in for anything, we would take it, I think.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If it's something that's going to get high emission vehicles off the road, then it's something that I think is valuable. But if it's just in an effort to stimulate car sales, I have a bit of an issue with that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's a bad use of taxpayers' money.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: All right. That's what he says. Bad use of taxpayer money. We'll see. People disagree on this one.

One last point, though, Don, the program would be authorized for one year. It would be up to a million vehicles. No official price tag, Don. But averaging out a $4,000 credit times a million vehicles, it's $4 billion. Not cheap.

LEMON: Yes. Not pocket change. OK. Thank you, Poppy Harlow. HARLOW: Sure.

LEMON: Hey, an update on our breaking news that's happening in Texas. San Antonio specifically. We're told it's happening in a north part of the city. We have some new video that's just in of that -- we're calling a natural gas line rupture. A 24-inch natural gas line. Boy, look at the flames there. And they are putting some flame retardant chemicals on that to try to get it underway.

Here's what we're told. The incident happened earlier. Again, north part of the city at a construction site. No injuries reported so far, but there are evacuations. And there were reports -- and you can see it there -- reports of some of the construction equipment on fire.

These are pictures now. This is live. You can see that same piece of construction equipment, for the most part, is out. There's still a bit burning right there in the center where the driver sits here.

But again, we're told no reports of injuries at this point. This is in San Antonio, Texas. North part of town evacuations. Twenty- four-inch natural gas line rupture.

We're back in a moment. CNN, the most trusted name in news.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Today in Washington, Congressman Barney Frank is expected to introduce a bill that would make Internet gambling legal. If it's passed, it will reverse a 2006 law which prohibits Americans from betting online. Frank says the current law interferes with personal freedom. Legislation he is unveiling today is similar to a bill that failed in the last Congress.

So what do you think? Should Internet gambling be made legal? And for that we turn to Josh Levs - Josh.

LEVS: Wow, that was quite an intro.

LEMON: Should it be made legal? I'll bet people say -- go ahead, Josh.

LEVS: Yes, that is kind of what they're saying. They're saying, ah.

No, I'll tell you, we're getting a pretty good division here. It's kind of interesting.

At the brand new CNN NEWSROOM blog, here's our question, gambling on your computer. We are wondering what you think. Check it out. Just click on Tony at the top. And here's some examples of responses, Don.

Spring Wolf says it will be "wise for American politicians to tap into this revenue and legalize Internet gambling for the United States" so other countries aren't getting it.

Take a look at this from B.K. "Wall Street's already legalized gambling."

We've got time for a couple more. Steve Dority (ph). "I do not think that online gambling should be endorsed or legal. Many people are compulsive gamblers and cannot manage their money and their family's finances."

Now, Don inspired me. I'm finally on Twitter. Check this out. We asked on Twitter today, Darren Hicks wrote this. "As if we don't have enough issues. Legalized Internet gambling will cause many more families to be in crisis money wise."

And we've got a new discussion page over at my Facebook page, joshlevscnn. Marisa Smith Hubinger (ph) writes, "I believe that gambling is something that should be legal, as long as the person is over the legal age."

So we've got your chance to weigh in. Check out the brand new CNN NEWSROOM blog. We have a cool graphic to show you what it looks like. While you're there, just click on Tony at the top and we're asking you between 11 and 1 to be (INAUDIBLE).

LEMON: The blog looks like Tony?

LEVS: Well, when you get there, you get to see that picture. But it's not quite that big.

LEMON: That's a nice shot of Tony there too, by the way.

LEVS: Yes, it is.

LEMON: There's the blog. That was Tony's face there.

You know, I did a story a couple of years ago, Josh, that was very interesting, about senior citizens online gambling because they're at home. Many of them are in firmed. And so they get into trouble because they go online and they gamble. So, you know . . .

LEVS: Wow. Didn't think about that angle.

LEMON: So we have to look into that. Yes, thank you.

LEVS: Yes.

LEMON: Thanks very much for that.

GM is spinning new hopes on an old looking design.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK. Look at that. Taking me back to my high school days. That is the Camaro. Chevy is rolling out all new -- the new Camaro. That's a 2010 model there. The retro muscle car is modeled after the late '60s version when the Camaro was in its hay day. The '70s and '80s too it was in its hay day. Dealers say demand is good. They also make it, just so you know, in a Z28 model. We love the Z28 with the spoilers and the t-tops.

They're taking pre-orders on this car. GM retired the Camaro brand in 2002, but hopes it will be a big player in its company's comeback. The new Camaro gets 29 miles per gallon and it gets you a whole lot of looks on top of that. Nice car.

CNN NEWSROOM continues right now with Kyra Phillips.

Hello, everyone. I'm Kyra Phillips, live