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Obama Protest at University of Notre Dame
Aired May 16, 2009 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello everyone, I'm Fredricka Whitfield and welcome to the CNN NEWSROOM. In about 22 hours from now, the president of the United States will be the commencement speaker at the University of Notre Dame. Despite President Barack Obama's popularity across the country, there is deep divide in South Bend, Indiana on that campus about his very visit.
Why? Well, his views in part on abortion as well as on embryonic stem cell research. Or are those the issues at the root? Even some graduating students are threatening to boycott. Still some Notre Dame students do indeed plan to embrace the president's arrival. The president, the Reverend John Jenkins says his invitation to Mr. Obama stands and in the next hour we'll hear opinions on all sides on the campus, in the church and from your living rooms.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD (voice-over): Located 90 miles east of Chicago, Notre Dame is one of America's best known Catholic universities. Previous commencement speakers have included President Eisenhower, Carter, Reagan, and both Bushes. But when Notre Dame invited President Obama to be this year's speaker, it touched off a firestorm.
WILLIAM DONAHUE, CATHOLIC LEAGUE PRESIDENT: This is the most polarizing thing I have seen in the Catholic community in sometime.
WHITFIELD: One reason? President Obama's support for abortion rights.
PRES. BARACK OBAMA, UNITED STATES: The reason I'm pro choice because I don't think women don't take that position casually. I think they are in a better position to make these decisions, ultimately than members of Congress or a president of the United States.
BISHOP JOHN DARCY, CATHOLIC DIOCESE OF FORT WAYNE: The Catholic Church's position is that taking a life in the womb is an intrinsically evil act.
WHITFIELD: Bishop John Darcy leads the Catholic archdiocese in northeast Indiana where Notre Dame is located. He won't be attending the commencement. Former St. Louis Archbishop Raymond Burke now a Vatican official says President Obama is promoting an anti-life, anti- family agenda. Burke and other critics are especially angered by Notre Dame's decision to give the president an honorary degree.
DONAHUE: The problem gets kind of sticky when you start giving people awards. That's what really has raised the hackles of a lot of Catholics.
WHITFIELD: More than 360,000 people have signed an online petition calling on Notre Dame to rescind the invitation, some critics are even demanding the resignation of the school's president, Father John Jenkins. Despite the cries of protests, American Catholics don't speak with one voice. Some prominent Catholic politicians support abortion rights, including vice president Joe Biden, 2004 democratic presidential nominee John Kerry and even former republican presidential candidate Rudy Giuliani.
An April poll by the Pew Research Center suggests that nearly half of the country's Catholics think abortion should be legal and even though some priests suggest that voting for Mr. Obama might be a sin, he won 54 percent of the Catholic vote last November.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD: All right. That number is not quieting the critics. They point to a 2004 mandate issued by U.S. bishops. It says "the Catholic community and Catholic institutions should not honor those who act in defiance of our fundamental moral principles. They should not be given awards, honors or platforms which would suggest support for their actions."
CNN's Susan Candiotti is live on Notre Dame's campus with more on the protest, fallout over the president's planned visit. Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Fredricka. On this day before graduation, I think there is a sense of excitement and anticipation. Of course, as you know, the majority of the students here for granting President Obama an honorary degree as many other presidents have received in the past, despite this president's pro choice stand on abortion and his support of stem cell research.
But off campus it's a different story this day. There were 19 more trespassing arrests by anti-abortion activists and protests that really have been taking place (AUDIO GAP) basis. Now, one group of students will be boycotting tomorrow's graduation ceremonies, won't be there, others will be. But they will wear a little cross on their motor boards as they listen to President Obama speak.
Some of the students who are protesting President Obama's appearance aren't entirely happy with some of the tactics from the group that has been demonstrating outside.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EMILY TOATES, NOTRE DAME SENIOR: Everybody has their own way of dealing with these issues. And well that's not the approach we have taken. I know what they are trying to do is the right thing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: Now, Notre Dame student body president said in the main, all the students here agreed to disagree.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRANT SCHMIDT, NOTRE DAME JUNIOR CLASS PRESIDENT: What is the point of commencement? The point of commencement is to give charge to the class of 2009, to welcome them into this real world scenario. I think that's what President Obama will do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: Now those students who will be boycotting the graduation ceremony tomorrow instead plan to attend a prayer vigil that starts tonight and will go all night long and also be attending a rally tomorrow. Fredricka?
WHITFIELD: All right. Susan Candiotti, thanks so much. South Bend, Indiana. Appreciate it.
In the meantime, we want to point out that we did extend an invitation to Notre Dame's president, Rev. John Jenkins, to join us. His office declines but we are joined by Notre Dame history professor, Scott Appleby who supports the Rev. Jenkins' position to maintain that invitation to the president of the United States. Good to see you, professor.
PROF. SCOTT APPLEBY, NOTRE DAME CATHOLIC HISTORIAN: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: So how does the university traditionally make a selection, what's the criteria for who they decide should be the commencement speaker?
APPLEBY: Well, every president since Dwight Eisenhower has been invited to Notre Dame to speak at commencement. So that's a long standing tradition. People nominate commencement speakers and the president and the board consider the nomination and the president makes the decision of the university.
WHITFIELD: So for the most part, the student body express that they embrace as well as other staff and faculty, they embrace the president's decision, the president of the university to have the president of the United States there?
APPLEBY: Yes, I think the large majority of students at Notre Dame support the decision and the seniors are largely, wildly enthusiastic, I would say. There some very strong pro-life students who disagree and have a point of doing so, but the faculty and the staff and the students within the university community are strongly supportive.
WHITFIELD: So you mentioned President Eisenhower and all presidents have been commencement speakers whether they believe in the death penalty, whether they believe in abortion rights, whether they believe in war, which are principles that many Catholics say simply defies their beliefs. So regardless of their beliefs, the president's beliefs on these issues, they would be welcome on campus.
APPLEBY: Well, this is a Catholic university and because it's Catholic, Notre Dame certainly upholds the teachings of the Catholic church about the sanctity of human life. Because it's a university, while we take that strong position and there is no ambiguity for anyone who's listening that we believe in protecting human life and all its phases. As a university we invite a variety of positions and opinions including that of the president of the United States.
WHITFIELD: Was the university really surprised then that there would be some protests whether it would be from outside organizations or even within the student body, people who say this is not appropriate to have President Obama here.
APPLEBY: No, as a university, you would expect a variety of opinions on such an important issue like abortion and the related ethical issues around life. So that was not a surprise about the debate. That's in fact what the university responsibly does. It becomes a variety of responsible opinions, especially on matters of deep disagreement. As a Catholic university, of course, we know where we stand.
WHITFIELD: So given that, you know, being that the case, were you surprised or was the president or even the student body or the faculty surprised to hear that the prestigious award that's awarded every commencement address and it has been awarded for the past 100 years, the recipient of that honor this year said that she does not want to accept the honor in part, in large part because of the president of the United States who will be the commencement speaker.
APPLEBY: Well, that, of course that's Mary Ann Glendon's right and she is a very important and influential Catholic lay woman and professor. And we of course respect that decision. We did inform her, the university did, of our invitation before she accepted the Laetare Award and she chose to wait until pretty late in the day to decide that she wouldn't accept the award so we wondered about that but we respect her and her decision.
WHITFIELD: And does it mean anything to Bishop John Darcy, you know, of the diocese there in that jurisdiction for the first time in 25 years says I'm not going to be in attendance at a graduation at Notre Dame?
APPLEBY: Of course it means something. We respect and admire and in fact love Bishop Darcy and he is teaching as a Catholic bishop should teach. That's his prerogative. We respect that. We're a university and we have to move forward as a Catholic university with respect for his teaching and we uphold the teaching, but we disagree about the prudential act of inviting the president of the United States to speak at commencement.
WHITFIELD: History professor Scott Appleby, thanks so much, of Notre Dame University. And of course, we want to hear what you at home think about this controversy. You can e-mail us at weekends@CNN.com, also on our blog, NEWSROOM, Fredricka Whitfield and join us in the discussion on Facebook page as well. Emotions certainly running very high as President Obama prepares to address the graduating class. Several groups not affiliated with the campus have been protesting outside the prestigious university.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why are you arresting a priest for trying to stop the killing of a baby?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: A reaction from Notre Dame students and Josh Levs with what you're saying about the president's planned appearance.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right. That's tomorrow, 2:00 Eastern time right here on CNN, you will be able to watch. The president will be the commencement speaker at the University of Notre Dame in South Bend, Indiana. And as you have been hearing for probably many days now that there really is, I guess, bone of contention among many students on campus as well as many organizations off campus who were wondering whether he was an appropriate speaker for this mostly Catholic university.
So we are discussing religion, politics and the slash over the plan speech tomorrow at Notre Dame. Some protestors say the president has no business addressing Notre Dame's graduates for at least two reasons. One, President Obama believes in protecting a woman's right to choose abortion and he supports embryonic stem cell research.
Two issues that defy Catholic church principles. The university says this is a campus where 85 percent of the student population and 53 percent of the faculty is actually catholic. We're going to be hearing from some of the students on campus, but for now we have been hearing from a lot of you as well via Facebook and our NEWSROOM blogs. Josh Levs has been keeping track on all of that, what is being said?
JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So much, Fred. And there is a really lot of passion here. And I want to let everyone know what's going to be happening. We're going to be reading some of the responses that we are getting on all those platforms, Fred, that we were just talking about. We're going to be presenting a couple of them to the students. So the messages that you've been sending, we're going to get responses and this can be very interesting.
Let's zoom in on the board. I want to show you some of what's going on. It's our top story here at CNN.com, politics. And you can weight in as Fred was talking about. We got the CNN NEWSROOM blog, we also got our Facebook pages, Fred which is Fredricka Whitfield CNN and mine, Josh Levs CNN and also my twitter page is up here, Josh Levs CNN.
There is a reason that we are putting so much focus on the internet here today. And that is this, check this out behind me. Internet plays a vital role in generating discussion and the debate here. This is a headline. That's in the school newspaper there at Notre Dame. And what they are talking about is this large series of blogs that have been really kind of tackling this. One of the major ones is this one, Ndresponse.com. let me check with our control room. Do we have a little clip of this video. Let's take a look if we have that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bestowing an honor on him is equal to bestowing an honor to those policies. Those are in contradictions with Catholic teachings.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEVS: OK. There you go, you are getting a sense of what that video is like. Now that is a student-run blog there, a student run website, Ndresponse.com. I was expecting to balance it out by showing a student-run website, that is in support of the president coming but the school's own newspaper said this is the only student-run website. That said, there are a lot of websites, Fred, that are on both sides and to give you some balance, I want to show you a quote now from a different website which is a petition to support President Obama coming. Wesupportnotredame.org.
Let's go to this graphic. This is interesting, Fred. They've had thousands of signatures. "For decades, presidents of both political parties have been invited to Notre Dame or this occasion to engage in rigorous discourse about the most pressing issues of our day. Through this invitation, Fr. Jenkins is honoring the best of our nation's democratic and religious values."
So, Fred, as we get responses from our viewers, we are also following what these websites are saying, big fight online. We expect to continue obviously through tomorrow.
WHITFIELD: Well, it's interesting because from that student newspaper, "the Observer," right, it has been made clear by the editor of the paper that they did an informal survey of students on campus and found that 70 percent of student actually support it, welcomed the idea of the president, of his arrival. But it doesn't necessarily mean that they believe in the same things he believes in.
LEVS: Right. I mean, what they're saying is they support him being there.
WHITFIELD: He has place here.
LEVS: They believe that it was the right call to have him there, based on an informal poll. That is accurate.
WHITFIELD: He will be receiving an honorary law degree as well, 2,000 students there at Notre Dame campus that will be among the graduating class.
We're going to be hearing from some of the students you talked about, the Notre Dame website, the opposition group as well as those in support of, we're going to be representing both sides of that debate by some of the students who are going to be joining us from South Bend, from the campus there, after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right. The president is speaking at your graduation, usually an honor, right? Well some are protesting President Obama's appearance at Notre Dame tomorrow.
CNN's Candy Crowley looks at the grads parting lesson in free speech.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): By the time they graduate, American students are well-schooled in free speech.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We do not believe it's right to celebrate a man who has gone so against Catholic principles.
CROWLEY: The man is President Barack Obama, supporter of abortion rights, who will give the commencement address to and get an honorary degree from Notre Dame, a premiere Catholic school, a religion that considers abortion a mortal sin. Let the free speech begin.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We can't afford to be sending a message to people that we value power and fame over our Catholic identity.
CROWLEY: The debate is not confined to campus. It made it to the pulpit of Orlando Bishop Thomas Wenski.
BISHIP THOMAS WENSKI, ORLANDO, FLORIDA: It implies almost an approbation or if not an approbation or approval of the president's position, at least a winking at it, as if it was not that important.
CROWLEY: And it made it to a "Washington Post" column by Father Thomas Reese.
FR. THOMAS REESE, S.J., GEORGETOWN UNIVERISTY: I think when we start banning speakers, we look afraid. We look like we feel we can't come up with convincing arguments. And I think that's a self debating strategy.
CROWLEY: Beyond the church sanctuary, anti-abortion activists, Catholic and non, have gathered in South Bend to make their case. Among them, former presidential candidate Alan Keyes, arrested for trespassing, and conservative anti-abortion activist Randall Terry.
RANDALL TERRY, ANTI-ABORTION ACTIVIST: We push baby strollers peacefully, quietly, prayerfully on campus and in the strollers were baby dolls covered with stage blood and an Obama bumper sticker saying Obama '09 one dead baby at a time, Notre Dame, to make a statement.
CROWLEY: Countering the protests, critics accused republicans of trying to drive a wedge between Catholics and democrats. And they note both President Bush and Ronald Reagan spoke at Notre Dame and they were pro-death penalty. Also against Catholic teaching.
Having won the Catholic vote last year, the president is on firm territory when he takes to that podium. And while at least one Notre Dame honoree is boycotting along with some students, the vast majority of graduates and some parents are expected to show up.
Beginning in the Vietnam era, protests has been a time-honored graduation exercise. At Furman, some faculty members boycotted then President Bush's address, others silently made their case.
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I supported the decision -
CROWLEY: John McCain was interrupted constantly by protestors during his commencement address at New York's New School.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're graduating, not closing.
CROWLEY: No one was disinvited. Everyone spoke, they all survived. The tradition goes on.
ROBERT GIBBS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The president intends to go to Notre Dame, speak, accept the degree and come back to the White House.
CROWLEY: Democracy 101. Everyone gets free speech. Candy Crowley, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD: Understanding the Catholic divide right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NATASHA CURRY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): He towers over Cannes. From the front of the Carlton Hotel to the pages of the newspapers and everyone it seems can't wait to see him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm very excited to see Brad Pitt.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Brad Pitt.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Brad Pitt, I mean, he's a great star.
CURRY: For the third year in a row, Brad Pitt will be stepping out on the red carpet at the Cannes Film Festival.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're all going to be doing one thing and one thing only, killing Nazis.
CURRY: This time to unveil the new movie from Quentin Tarantino in "Inglorious Basterds." Tarantino's trying to earn the second Palme d'Or of his career. Back in 1994, he is there at the festival's top prize for "Pulp Fiction."
KENNETH TURAN, FILM CRITIC, "LOS ANGELES TIMES": Quentin Tarantino had a big success here with "Pulp Fiction," His career really started when "Pulp Fiction" won the Palme d'Or.
CURRY (on camera): When it comes to buzz at Cannes, no film is more highly anticipated than the "Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus." That Terri Gilliam film features the final performance of the late Heath Ledger. (voice-over): Ledger died in the middle of filming the movie. Three stars stepped in to take over his role. Johnny Depp, Colin Farrell, and Judd Law. But Cannes audience is about to see the results.
TURAN: Heath Ledger's last film, I think there's a lot of interest. That's why a lot of people come here. Because interesting films are here. So people show up to see them.
CURRY: Natasha Curry, Cannes, France.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Here's what's happening right now. A new development in the 2008 murder investigation involving two marines. The marine accused of killing Lance Corporal Maria Lauderback does not appear to be the father of her unborn child. Lauderback was eight months pregnant when she die but a source tells CNN there was no match between the DNA of the fetus and the DNA of Corporal Caesar Laurean.
First lady Michelle Obama is at the University of California, Merced where she is about to deliver the commencement address. We will carry that out live as it happens.
And the Atlantis' astronauts are completing the third space walk of their mission. They fixed the camera on the Hubble telescope and installed a device that can detect distant sources of light.
All right. Back to our special here in this hour. Some Notre Dame students plan to boycott President Obama's commencement address tomorrow, but just like Catholics across the country, Notre Dame students are divided.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHELE SAALA, STUDENT NOT ATTENDING COMMENCEMENT: The thing that consoles me in all this is I'm taking a stand for those who were often forgotten.
MICHAEL ANGULO, STUDENT ATTENDING COMMENCEMENT: Don't think less of the University of Notre Dame and don't think that our mission is being corrupted by a president who might have thought on this issue that's different than Catholic though. Be willing to engage in that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: We will talk about Catholics across America, divided, but it's a very narrow or a rather gaping divide though because during the November elections, indicators were that 54 percent of Catholics actually voted for President Obama.
All right. Well, time now to see what many of you think about this topic. CNN's Josh Levs is keeping track of what you are seeing online and people are saying a lot. LEVS: They are, you know, you can think of it as having a discussion and debate online as the show goes on and that continues afterwards. Let's zoom in, I want to show you some of the places people are doing that. We're going to start off at the CNN NEWSROOM blogs. Let's go to CNN.com/NEWSROOM, click on Fred, you get the question. I'm going to show you examples here.
Then over here Janet, "Maybe they should focus more on what they have in common and can agree on with instead of the one thing they don't." Let's go to our Facebook pages, I will show you what's going on here. Jordan, "The Catholic university Notre Dame should be expressing catholic leads and doctrines. This has nothing to do with the Catholic Church being in any way closed minded." On the flip side however, you have Juan who's writing, "President Obama should speak for all graduate students at Notre Dame's ceremony. That's exactly what this president will do."
Let me show you something on my twitter page here, Joshlevscnn. This is interesting contrary wise, "If Notre Dame is to consistently reject speakers who don't fully embrace all their tenets, they may want to stop selecting politicians Fred." And we're also hearing from a lot of people by good old fashioned e-mail. We haven't forgotten about that. We'll show you that one finally then back to Fred. Let's just take a look here.
WHITFIELD: That soon to be obsolete with all the other fancy stuff.
LEVS: The benefit to doing the blog or the Facebook or Twitter is that you get to engage in debate. Here with e-mail, it just gets to us. But throughout the show, you know what, we're keep taking a look at these throughout the show, we'll get in some of these later on.
WHITFIELD: Ok, we will indeed. Thanks so much Josh, appreciate it.
A closer look now at what Catholics as a whole think about Notre Dame's invitation to President Obama. A Pew Research Center poll shows half of all Catholics actually approve and 28 percent disapprove. But when it comes to practicing Catholics, 45 percent think it's wrong to invite the president. We're now joined by Diana Butler Bass and Douglas Kmiec, Diana is an author of "A People's History of Christianity," she joins us from Washington. A look right there at the book cover. And Douglas Kmiec is a law professor at Pepperdine and wrote, "Can a Catholic Support Him?" asking the big question about Barack Obama, joining us from Los Angeles.
Good to see both of you. Diana, let me begin with you, the campus newspaper poll indicates that 70 percent of the student body actually likes the idea of this president being the commencement speaker. And we know the majority of Catholics who voted in the November elections actually supported Barack Obama so if it's not if his principles, whether it be on abortion or stem cell research, then what really is at the root of why there is dissension in the Catholic community as to why to embrace him and why he should be a speaker at Notre Dame?
DIANA BUTLER BASS, BELIEFNET'S "PROGRESSIVE REVIVAL" BLOGGER: Is that one to me, Fredricka I'm sorry? WHITFIELD: Yes.
BASS: It's interesting because I happen to be a protestant so I'm not speaking out of the Catholic community, but I am a historian of Christianity in America. There has been a great deal of tension over the history of Catholicism in the U.S. around how far Catholic doctrine should relate to the practice of individual conscience. So deep within the Catholic community there has always been this divide. When you get into public and when you're dealing with politics is what are the limits of, the (INAUDIBLE) and the authority of catholic tradition versus the freedom of individual expression and individual religious preference.
WHITFIELD: Well professor what do you think really is at the root of the issue here? Is it about abortion, is it about embryonic stem cell research or is there something else?
BASS: I think that it is about American catholic identity. Some of the difficult navigation that Catholics have had over the years and trying to figure out what does it mean to be an American and what does it also mean to be catholic? The flash points of that right now are around abortion, around stem cell research and some issues relate to sexuality. But it's a really deeper issue that goes back quite a ways in American history.
WHITFIELD: Professor Kmiec, how do you see it? Is there something more to this divide? Why is it that 70 percent of the student body on campus at a mostly catholic university said we actually don't have a problem with this, but there are outside organizations who are saying we do have a big problem with this. And the bishop of the diocese in fact in that area says he is even boycotting this graduation for the first time in 25 years.
PROF. DOUGLAS KMIEC, PEPPERDINE UNIVERSITY: Fredricka, I think many people who have a full understanding of the faith have a very positive appreciation for Barack Obama. He's someone who cares greatly about the protection of the average family and the family wage. He is someone who is trying to get us back observing international standards and closing Guantanamo and disavowing torture. Upholding the truth of the human person in that sense. The abortion issue and the life issue is of course a place where Catholics themselves disagree as to what's the best way to approach this. Now the church has always taught that you need to operate on two rails at the same time. One, you should work to abolish abortion in terms of the law, to prohibit abortion altogether. But they also have recognized and John Paul II in his teaching recognized that we live in the real world where people disagree on this subject and it's important to address the economic and social causes of abortion as well. That's where I think many people find Barack Obama to be so appealing because he says let's work where we can find common ground.
WHITFIELD: And you found him appealing, right? You consider yourself a conservative catholic at least that's what I read, you consider yourself as such, but you voted for him?
KMIEC: I voted for him and the reason was because we have been stuck on this issue for a good long time. I think we have failed to recognize how much personal responsibility we need to exercise to intervene in people's lives and to persuade them that the choice for life is the right choice. And the way we can do that is by taking personal action in our local communities, by when people find themselves with an unwanted pregnancy, to encourage that choice by providing them with a job, by helping them stay in school, by helping them work out their conversations with their parents. My wife and I do this as part of pregnancy counseling in our own local community and in South Bend, Indiana there is a wonderful women's care center where that's done as well.
WHITFIELD: All right, Professor Kmiec and Diana Butler Bass. We will talk to you again a little bit more while we are talking about tomorrow's planned commencement address involving the president of the United States at the University of Notre Dame. By the way, this weekend is a big graduation weekend in a lot of places. And at the University of California Merced as well. Guess who's going to be the commencement speaker there. The first lady, Michelle Obama. We understand there are to be no protests there. It's a small university, a start up university, but they were very creative those students on that campus to lure the first lady to be the commencement speaker and she will be speaking there momentarily. We will also take you there.
Meantime, we're going to have much more on the divide involving President Obama's planned speech at the University of Notre Dame tomorrow.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Welcome back. We are focusing on religion, politics and protest. All this just at the prelude of President Barack Obama's planned speech at the University of Notre Dame, a mostly catholic campus that is to take place tomorrow. We're joined again by beliefnet blogger Diana Butler Bass in Washington and catholic writer Douglas Kmiec, also a professor at Pepperdine University, joining us from Los Angeles. All right, thanks so much for sticking around here. Diane this one's for you, you know a lot of folks would say there has been a lot of hypocrisy within the Catholic Church as of recent and now you have the president of the United States who was being invited to the campus just as all presidents have been dating back to President Eisenhower. Yet there have been a lot of views represented by many of these presidents that have conflicted with the catholic teachings. Why is this any different?
BASS: This one strikes me as rather odd because in so many ways, President Obama is supportive of classical catholic teaching on social justice issues. Indeed even abortion he has referred to abortion as a moral tragedy and he thinks that it's a moral issue as well. But as a protestant he has also put his feet down on the choice grounds and he says that he's going to support the law that he believes there should be freedom of choice for people to make their own decisions regarding their reproductive health. So, Obama himself is rather cold about abortion. He doesn't love abortion, he doesn't say he likes abortion.
WHITFIELD: So Professor Kmiec, then what is at the root of all this. What do you see happening here? There is some hypocrisy, is there not? You had President Bush and he supported war and also the death penalty yet there was no outright protest upon either Bush's arrival at Notre Dame. Yet this time we're seeing it in lots of different fashions on campus and outside campus.
KMIEC: Fredricka, it does seem like a double standard because there is always with a politician, not perfect agreement with the faith tradition. But politics is the art of compromise and the politicians themselves are the embodiment of that compromise. But as Professor Butler indicates, President Obama speaks with a catholic vocabulary. He speaks strongly about social justice issues. On the issue of abortion, he was the one who took the initiative for the first time in the democratic convention to add to the platform a specific provision to provide for prenatal and postnatal support for especially poor women who we know are more likely than not to choose abortion because they don't have insurance, they don't know where the next meal is coming from, they lack shelter. So President Obama is really someone who is in many ways calling upon Notre Dame and Notre Dame's catholic commitment to put it to work. Not by waiting for the Supreme Court to change the law or by congress to enact a statute, but by what you can do in your local community. This is the essence of Barack Obama, the community organizer and I think he's bringing that spirit back to Notre Dame and I think we'll hear it tomorrow in the commencement address.
WHITFIELD: And we're getting a lot of reaction from people who are sending in their emails, questions, comments, etcetera, we want to pose many of them to you as well professors. Josh Levs is here in the Newsroom and what are we hearing from folks and what kind of questions can we throw the way of Professor Kmiec or Professor Bass?
LEVS: Yeah, I'll tell you Fred, as you know we're getting a lot of very passionate responses, we will zoom in on the board for a second right behind me, and I'll show you one email that we've gotten. What is interesting, this is an argument against him coming. And what this says is you know what, a school that deeply opposes decisions on abortion and stem cell research, the healthy debating argument that is something we've heard on the air, this says the healthy debate and argument is a joke because commencement is not a forum for debate. Students and those paying tuition have every right to be outraged. So let's toss it at our professors, we're talking about students who were graduating and for all this work they've done, right, parents have paid a lot of money to the school, no matter what has been done in the past, isn't it sensible for some people to be furious at having someone that they don't want for their commencement?
WHITFIELD: Professor Kmiec?
KMIEC: You know I don't think it is. Commencements are about building friendships and the honorary degree and the platform that is given to President Obama tomorrow will build that friendship. I have already seen this work. The president has put out draft regulations on his stem cell question and he has modified them in response to comments that he's received from the catholic community and the hierarchy of the catholic church. He is more friendly now to funding adult stem cell research which doesn't pose the ethical problems of embryonic stem cell research. Now again, there is still disagreement that policy is different than what a complete catholic policy would be, but having this conversation, this friendship, this bond of association with this honorary degree will keep the doors open between the church and the oval office.
LEVS: Let me get one in on the other side. I mean it really is interesting to have this debate. We're getting a lot on both sides. I'm going to zoom back to the board for a second. I want you to see this one which I find very interesting. I'm a pro life middle aged catholic in Indiana. I voted for Obama because I thought he could save America on many levels. I would rather have had Notre Dame not invite the president to speak if it was going to produce this kind of controversy. What do you all think about that? Looking back on this, does it make a lot of sense that this was the right call after all he is the president of the United States? Sounds like the vast majority of students support it or does this kind of create a controversy that doesn't belong there in the first place?
WHITFIELD: That's interesting Professor Bass because we are talking about Indiana, President Obama carried Indiana. That was the first time since 1964 that that state went democrat and that young man was talking about being both a catholic who voted for him and now feeling conflicted about whether this president really should indeed be the appropriate speaker at Notre Dame.
BASS: I thin it's really interesting because at one level we are talking about a school, we're talking about a university. Universities have, even catholic universities or evangelical Christian universities, have considerable amounts of diversity in their students and on their faculties and on the boards of trustees. So schools do not have necessarily full proof doctoral positions. They are places where discussions debate and difference is supposed to happen. If the president was speaking at a catholic cathedral well then I could see why a lot of Catholics would be up at arms and that they should be protesting the way that some people are protesting outside of the university. But this has introduced some level of controversy that Catholics are uncomfortable with. It does distract from his larger agendas of making common ground, although I hope like Professor Kmiec does that tomorrow's speech will demonstrate how much President Obama is deeply committed to the idea of abortion reduction and has been as a democrat a person who has been incredibly open to having a really good discussion about abortion and choice.
WHITFIELD: And we do know that the president is expected to address this controversy during the commencement address, however what we don't know is the content of how he will be addressing it, whether he will be elaborating on his positions on any of those issues, it seems to be stoking the fire so to speak. All right Professor Douglas Kmiec and Professor Diana Butler Bass, thanks so much and thanks to all of you who participated in sending your emails and questions as well.
BASS: Thank you.
KMIEC: Good to be with you.
WHITFIELD: All right, and at the bottom of the screen, you may have been seeing a live image there saying Michelle Obama. Well the first lady Michelle Obama was invited to be the commencement speaker at the University of California Merced. And you're seeing the graduates who are now filing in. Her speech will take place momentarily. We will be carrying that live as it happens as well. Josh Levs will be back with more of your comments and e-mails right after this.
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GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The Wright brothers introduced us to the first flight. The Jetsons allowed us to dream of taking a flying saucer to the local grocery store. If you thought the flying car was just an impossible dream? Think again. Some MIT engineers have done it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That looked beautiful from up here.
TUCHMAN: Introducing the transition, a one-of-a-kind vehicle built to handle rush hour traffic or fly over it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have a steering wheel here, you have a gas pedal and a brake pedal on the floor, you also have a control stick for when you are flying and the throttle for when you're flying.
TUCHMAN: The transition's designers think of it first and foremost as an airplane. But once on the ground --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It converts between flying and driving in 20 seconds.
TUCHMAN: The touch of a few buttons makes it small enough to hit the highway. Even park in a single car garage.
CARL DIETRICH, CEO, TERRAFUGIA: That's something that we're really excited about because it really shows that a vehicle like this has the potential to expand aviation and make it more practical for a larger segment of the population.
TUCHMAN: Testing is under way right now. Inventors say you can see the transition on a runway, a driveway or even Broadway by the end of 2011. Maybe by then we'll each have our own robot maid too. Gary Tuchman, CNN.
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WHITFIELD: Let's take a look at some pretty happy faces there in the crowd. You can hear the music, the pomp and circumstance, the University of California, Merced is what you are looking at right now and it's a full house. They made huge preparations for the first lady, Michelle Obama who is the commencement speaker today. They lured her in a very creative way, sending a pretty expensive campaign via internet and cards and letters to woo her and she said yes to this first graduating class of this start up university at the University of California, Merced. And momentarily when she takes to the stage, every now and then when you look at these live shots, they actually show a picture of her. But for now the concentration is on the graduates who are filing in and as soon as the first lady speaks there at the University of California, Merced, we will taking that live as well.
Meantime, the flip side to that, her husband, the president of the United States, he too, and there she is right there. Michelle Obama there on the stage. Just moments before her speech, her commencement speech. Meantime the flip side to that is the president of the United States, he too has been pretty busy this week at commencement ceremonies. Arizona State University and now tomorrow at the University of Notre Dame. Apparently there is a bit of bone of contention as to his invitation there. From some students on campus and from many organizations outside of campus saying because in part of his views on abortion rights and even embryonic stem cell research that he is not an appropriate guest.
However, we heard from the university at the top of this hour saying that every president of the United States going as far back as President Eisenhower has been invited and has been a guest commencement speaker and they feel very strongly that this is indeed an appropriate forum for the president of the United States. Tomorrow that will be 2:00 eastern time and we'll be carrying that live as it happens. Meantime, Josh Levs has been hearing from you. We have been hearing from you in so many different ways about this planned speech by the president tomorrow.
LEVS: So many different ways, in fact we're going to start off right here with an iReport. Take a look.
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IREPRT FROM EGBERTO WILLIES: Using the pretext of President Obama's pro choice and stem cell research support is at best disingenuous given President Bush being the Texas governor that supported one of the largest numbers of executions in the world even under the pope's objections.
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LEVS: And Fred that's the kind of thing you were talking about during this hour. Before we go I want to zoom in on the board, show everyone where this debate continues. We have it going at the CNN NEWSROOM blog, we're hearing from a lot of people. Fred I just went through about 30 messages, I only saw one that opposes the president coming by far people saying yes, he should be there. This is one from Gail, "Of course he should. It's beyond ridiculous that this is even a controversy." Let's check out my twitter page here joshlevscnn, "I'm pro life and I would love to meet President Obama." On the flip side, you do have a couple in our e-mails that are saying you know what I don't think he should be here. This is one good example from Lynn here. Finally, no issue can be more important to the catholic church than that of the issue of life. So Fred, the debate and discussions continue on all those forums and we will continue this going after the show. WHITFIELD: Very good. Thanks so much. Tomorrow 2:00 eastern time for the president of the United States at the University of Notre Dame and at the bottom of your screen right there, you are seeing the University of California, Merced and that's where the first lady Michelle Obama is to speak momentarily. I'm Fredricka Whitfield, Josh thanks so much and thanks to all of you for sending us your e-mails, your questions and your comments. We'll see you again tomorrow.
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