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Fire Help on the Way in California; Health Care Town Halls Touch Off Broader Debate; New York Air Controllers Suspended; Health Care Not Color Blind; Michael Vick Returns to NFL; Pre-Existing Health Problems; Is the Recession Over?

Aired August 14, 2009 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Firefighters are pouring in to northern California today as residents run from the flames. The wildfires burning in the Santa Cruz Mountains south of San Francisco. Those fires nowhere being contained at this moment. One community at risk, Bonny Doon. More than 3,000 acres are burning. More than 2,400 people evacuated. Winds off the ocean are pushing the fire closer to Bonny Doon, and the fear for homeowners growing with each hour.

Let's get an update on the fires right now, possibilities for some kind of containment. Maybe even just sort of getting a better handle on it, getting more people to the locations to fight the fires.

There he is, Chad Myers, in our Severe Weather Center.

Good to see you, Chad.

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Good so see you, Tony.

The wind shifted a little bit on the firefighters, and I guess that's neither good news nor bad news, really. But I'll take you into the area.

Here's San Francisco. We're talking just to the north of Santa Cruz and San Francisco. If you look at it on the map, there's the bay, the bay area.

But I want you to notice that this area, although it's not the Sierra, you're not talking giant mountains, it is a very topographic area. Notice here the valleys and the creeks and the downhill runs that some of the fires are taking.

And then all of a sudden, you get to where there's a lot of sticks and timber, and you get an uphill run. That's where the fire really gets its energy.

Take a match, if you're an adult or if you want to show a child, take a match and hold it up. Take a match and hold it partly down. Don't burn yourself. You will notice that the match that is pointed down burns a lot faster. That's because it's burning toward the wood, where a match held up is burning away from the wood and takes longer to get there.

So, don't burn yourself, please. But anyway, this is the whole area. This is what I'm trying to say, is that when you get these areas, when the winds are going up the hills, and when the fires are going up the hills, you can really get these things out of containment, and that's kind of what we have.

But the area has been in a fairly unpopulated area here, in this rugged area, but that's when the wind was going that way yesterday. Now the winds have shifted a little bit back toward Bonny Doon.

Let me show you here just in another map what can happen and how this makes such a big difference.

You'll have a fire that's basically doing nothing, burning along the ground. And all of a sudden, you have all of this tinder dry, because there has been a three-or-four-year drought in this area.

And all of a sudden, you have all of this extra energy, all of this extra wood and timber and just brown stuff, and it charges up the hill. It gets to the top of the hill and you can actually get sparks coming off the top. That's not what this is depicting. That's just depicting how quickly some of these fires can go up the hill.

So, I think I have some extra time, so let's just go ahead and take a look at what's going on here. We're going to take -- we're going to go in to the true viewer (ph), and we'll touch this and we'll -- let's find the some winds. Let's find the winds here in San Jose.

Calm. Fresno, calm. That's not going to last all day long. The winds are going to go up to almost 20.

HARRIS: Well, do this. Chad, if you would, stay with me here. And, you know, you're great, you're invaluable in helping us sort of work through the information on these wildfires.

Daniel Berlant is a spokesman for the California Fire Agency. We talk to him often during stories like this.

And Daniel, thanks for your time.

I guess my first question -- and Chad Myers, our severe weather expert, is going to join us as well in this conversation. My first question is, you've got a lot of concerns, it seems to me, after listening to Chad, but what is your chief concern right now?

DANIEL BERLANT, SPOKESMAN, CALIFORNIA FIRE AGENCY: Well, our biggest concern right now is that even though the winds have pretty much died down right now, that this afternoon we are predicting that they're going to pick back up and actually move in a different direction as we get an offshore flow. So, there is that chance that the fire will move into a different direction, possibly, you know, going into some different communities.

HARRIS: Yes. And I think Chad was mentioning just a moment ago that right now, the fire is burning -- and correct me if I'm wrong here -- in a pretty much uninhabited area, but if the winds change, that could mean a little more trouble for Bonny Doon. Is that correct?

BERLANT: Well, actually, yesterday we had a very strong onshore flow. That was moving the fire right towards Bonny Doon.

If the wind shift does occur, it's going to move it into another direction near the community of Swanton, which is a very small community, more towards the western side of the fire. But, really, this fire's moving in multiple different directions. And so there's still a lot of concern. That's one of the reasons we evacuated those residents yesterday.

HARRIS: OK.

Chad, any thoughts?

MYERS: I want -- the evacuations, you haven't done anything with the people of Davenport, yet, right, though? They are still out of the fire's way?

BERLANT: Correct. At this point, nobody from Davenport has been evacuated. Most of the residents that have been evacuated are from Bonny Doon and from the small community of Swanton. Those people were evacuated sometime yesterday.

HARRIS: And Daniel, best-case scenario here, what kind of a handle do you believe you can get on this fire, let's say, by the end of the day?

BERLANT: Well, the best-case scenario is that the wind continues to cooperate, as it is right now. That will allow our firefighters to continue building that containment line around the fire.

If we can continue to get into some of these remote locations, build that line before the wind picks up, we should be in a much better position. But, you know, the good news is that progress was made last night and progress continues to be made this morning.

HARRIS: Terrific update. Yes. Yes.

Chad, you got another thought here?

MYERS: Mr. Berlant, do you have any air help today? Do you have planes and helicopters in the air?

BERLANT: Yes, our aircraft were able to fly successfully yesterday. They are able to go up this morning. We put them up on an early up. Since there's no real wind, it's much easier for them to get into their canyons and strategic locations, drop their water, drop their retardant, to help slow down that fire as ground resources make their way into these remote locations.

HARRIS: Daniel, appreciate it.

Daniel Berlant is a spokesman for the California Fire Agency.

And thank you, Daniel. And Chad, as always, thank you for your help.

MYERS: It's very important to get that air support in there, especially when you have ground crews on the ground. Sometimes they need that air support when a wind shift, the gust comes, and they are in trouble. Those guys are really thankful that there's something up above to come get them if they need some water.

HARRIS: That's a good point. All right, Chad. Appreciate it. Thanks, pal.

The Philadelphia Eagles announced last hour that Michael Vick is joining the team. Vick, as you know, spent about a year and a half in prison after he was convicted in a dogfighting ring.

The Eagles say Vick has aggressively dealt with his wrongs and deserves a second chance. Vick will be eligible to play during week six of the season. He was contrite during his Q&A with reporters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL VICK, FOOTBALL PLAYER: ... part of our culture and, you know, I don't think that's an excuse. You know, I was kind of, you know, abiding by that rule at the time. And, you know, as I grew older and as, you know, things started to kind of transpire, and then once I went to prison, you know, I had plenty of time to think about what I did.

And I've seen people's reactions. And, you know, up until that point, I never really cared. I won't say I didn't care, but I never thought about it.

Now I understand that people care about their animals. They care about the health, the welfare, the protection of animals. And now I do.

So, that's why I say if I can, you know, help more than I hurt, then I'm contributing. I'm doing what I need to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Got to tell you, for a lot of football fans, Michael Vick's return is either the best or worst thing that could happen to the NFL.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The guy has something to bring to the team's that's going to make us better. So what?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's a great football player.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But happen (ph) happens. He's done with it, he's served his time.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm just a little upset with it because I'm such an animal lover.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm not sure where we're going with the team.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A crazy signing. I don't know what they're going to do with the public relations part of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: We've been asking for your comments on Michael Vick on our CNN NEWSROOM blog. Here's what some of you have said to us.

This from Sharon. "His crime is as bad as abusing a child. The dogs cannot protect themselves either. What is wrong with our society when a person can just be forgiven for doing something this horrible?"

And this from Dan. "Good for Mr. Vick. He did a horrible thing, was arrested and jailed. Mr. Vick did his time. Let the man be."

And this from Barney, who writes, "The Eagles showed they are a classless organization."

If you'd like to add your remarks, just go to our blog. The address is CNN.com/Tony.

President Obama takes his pitch for health care reform to Big Sky Country. And it may be a tough sell.

The president is headed to a town hall meeting in Montana. This is a make-or-break month for reform, and he could face a skeptical audience in a region pretty weary of big government.

The president's western swing combines his push for health reform with family visits to national parks. Mr. Obama holds another town hall tomorrow in Colorado.

And you can see the president's town hall on health reform live, right here in the CNN NEWSROOM. It is set for 2:55 p.m. Eastern Time.

The fight over health care reform has touched off a broader debate over the Obama administration's policies. People are venting their spleens about increased debt, government bailouts and health care at the town hall meetings across the country.

The story now from CNN's Lisa Sylvester.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The lines are long. The rooms are packed. The constituents are ready to vent.

UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Hear our voice! Hear our voice!

SYLVESTER: Democrat Ben Cardin has been in Congress for two decades, first as a House member and now a senator. His staff tells us past town hall meetings would draw 100 to 200 people. This one had 1,000 people lining up. MARK KRESLINS, ATTENDED TOWN HALL MEETING OF MARYLAND SENATOR BEN CARDIN: How are you going to look at my children in their eyes and tell them they're going to have a better future?

SYLVESTER: Across the country, another town hall, another lawmaker, but the story is similar.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Congressman...

(APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... we need you to be a statesman, and not a puppet in your party.

SYLVESTER: It's as if a lid has been popped. The object of frustration for many is health care debate, but that's not the only issue that's brought people out to town hall meetings in large numbers. Rising debt, big bailouts, and lost jobs are also on their minds.

Jean Weiler is from a suburb of Des Moines, who attended the town hall meeting of Republican Senator Charles Grassley.

JEAN WEILER, ATTENDED TOWN HALL OF SENATOR CHARLES GRASSLEY: They're losing our trust. I think this is a good movement that people are making to let them know we want to be heard and we want them to represent us, not their personal preference.

SYLVESTER: A recent CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll shows 23 percent strongly favor Obama's health plan, while 33 percent strongly oppose it.

KEN VOGEL, THEPOLITICO.COM: They are using their displeasure with aspects of this plan to kind of express some of their broader misgivings about the Obama administration and what they see as sort of a big government agenda being driven by the Obama administration.

SYLVESTER (on camera): The people are speaking out not only at town hall meetings, but also through the Internet. The House of Representatives' Web site e-mail system has been jammed, overloaded with constituent e-mails.

Lisa Sylvester, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: And CNN has comprehensive coverage of the health care debate and town hall meetings at CNN.com/healthcare.

As part of this make-or-break month for health care reform and our "in focus" coverage, we've added several features. You can learn more about the closest town hall meeting to you, the key players in the debate, different plans, and, of course, the controversial sticking points to the plans.

Is the recession over? The economic numbers we're seeing seem to give some conflicting signals. I'm going to get some answers from one of our favorite economists. That's next in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: New home video shows the deadly collision of a small airplane and a sightseeing helicopter over New York's Hudson River. There is also new information emerging in the investigation.

We get the new details from CNN National Correspondent Susan Candiotti.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As investigators studied this amateur video to find out what led to that terrifying mid-air crash over the Hudson, there is more stunning information.

An air traffic controller who is handling the Piper airplane was on the phone with his girlfriend at the time of the crash, according to a source with knowledge of the investigation. What the FAA in a statement calls "inappropriate conversations."

And there's more. The FAA says the air traffic controller's supervisor was not in the building at the time as required.

JUSTIN GREENE, AVIATION ATTORNEY: They're put in the tower to do a job. And if they're not doing the job, people can die. And in this case, apparently they weren't doing the job.

CANDIOTTI: Our source says the air traffic controller had already cleared the plane for takeoff from Teterboro airport in New Jersey before talking with his girlfriend. The NTSB says the plane had been handed off electronically to the next tower down the line in Newark and then the plane disappeared from radar.

The FAA calls the conduct of the controller and his boss unacceptable but says, "We have no reason to believe at this time that these actions contributed to the accident."

GREENE: We have somebody missing in action. There's someone else who's not doing their job. So the negligence is there. The only question is whether that negligence had a role in this accident.

The FAA is already saying, well, maybe it didn't. But the FAA stands to lose millions and millions of dollars, or the taxpayers do, if the FAA is wrong.

CANDIOTTI: The FAA says the two employees are now on administrative leave. The investigation is not over. Ultimately, the two could be fired.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: That was CNN's Susan Candiotti.

The bomber of Pan Am Flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland, is making another apparent move to get out of prison. He is dropping the appeal of his conviction for the terrorist bombing. It may be part of a deal he is seeking with Scottish authorities to be released on compassionate grounds. The reason being the 57-year-old Libyan man is suffering from terminal prostate cancer.

Two hundred seventy people, as you'll recall, were killed in the 1988 Lockerbie bombing, most of them Americans. Families of the victims are divided over whether he should ever be released.

Americans are passionately debating the future of health care in this country. I am going to take on the issues with former surgeon general Dr. David Satcher, right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: Thousands line the streets of Jacksonville, Florida, today to pay respects to Navy pilot Michael Scott Speicher. A hearse took his remains past his church and high school, then to the city's war memorial for a public ceremony.

Speicher, as you may recall, was shot down on the first night of the 1991 Gulf War. His remains were recovered in the Iraqi desert recently. Speicher is being laid to rest later today in a private service.

In Hyannis, Massachusetts, a funeral mass for Special Olympics founder Eunice Kennedy Shriver concluded this hour. Vice President Joe Biden was there for the administration, along with VIPs Oprah Winfrey, Stevie Wonder and Jon Bon Jovi.

Shriver's brother Senator Edward Kennedy is fighting brain cancer and did not attend. Shriver's son-in-law, California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, and daughter Maria, were among those who gave eulogies.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARIA SHRIVER, EUNICE KENNEDY SHRIVER'S DAUGHTER: Thank you, mummy, for giving me the breath of life. Thank you for giving me a push over and over again. Thank you for doing your best.

Here we are, you and me. Now it's you needing the breath of life. Now it's you needing the push.

You did it for me. Let me do it for you.

Your love has brought me to my knees. I cannot breathe without you. I cannot think without you. I am lost without you.

Here we are, you and me. The clouds are gone. The sky is clear. You are the star in my sky. You are the music in my heart.

Do you hear it? Listen. Listen. Mummy, you are the trumpet of my life.

Amen. (APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Boy, that was something.

Of the nine famous Kennedy siblings, only the two youngest survive, Senator Kennedy and his sister, Jean Kennedy Smith.

So, we are listening to your concerns about health care reform during this make-or-break month.

Chief Business Correspondent Ali Velshi is on the road with the CNN Express, headed to Iowa. And stopping along the way, last night he talked with a group of people in an upper middle class suburb of Kansas City, Missouri, about health care reform.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALI VELSHI, CNN SENIOR BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Do you think that the proposals that are put forward -- and there are many and they are complicated -- but do you think that will somehow affect the quality of care that your daughter will get today?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When this change should occur, I think it will affect it, because my understanding is that Medicare rates will be what all physicians are paid. I don't think that's a sustainable practice. I think, you know, when you start talking about costs and reducing costs of health care, the quality is going to go down with it.

VELSHI: How about you? What do you think about what you've been hearing and how things might change under this health care proposal?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My personal issue is that I think they're pushing too much change on us at once, and I think they're trying to pass it too soon. Quit making such a fast-paced decision and trying to push it on us all as fast as they're trying to do.

VELSHI: Do any of you share that view that it's too fast, or do some of you think it's overdue?

Tell me what you think about that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Way too fast.

VELSHI: Do you think it's too fast?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Too fast.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's way too fast.

Talk about health care, we're talking about what you get when you are sick. I just think that to rush through this, it's the wrong thing. I know that there's something that has to be done. I believe that there is... VELSHI: So, would you say, if I asked for a show of hands, of those of you who think health care does need to be reformed...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VELSHI: Nobody here who thinks it doesn't have to happen?

(CROSSTALK)

VELSHI: Let me put it this way. And again, it may not be a fair question, but we're here to flesh this out.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sure.

VELSHI: If you were all in a different position, and I mean unemployed and uninsured, do you think you would take a different view of this? Do you think you'd be sitting here and saying, this is more urgent and I'm glad that the president is saying it's going to be done in 2009? And I don't mean to be unfair...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

VELSHI: ... but let's just think about that for a second.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think we're saying that there's no sense of urgency here. I think we all agree that changes need to happen, that they all are impending and we have to do it. But even if I'm unemployed, if you're going to give me rotten care with rotten doctors, what good am I getting out of it truly?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you're telling me one percent of my paycheck to get a plan that's going to work, I'll sign on today. You know, and everybody's taken care of. But if I see a $10,000 toilet seat on a CNN special report, you know, it just turns me off. And it's like, oh, you screwed it up again.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: Ali wraps up his road trip at the Iowa State Fair in Des Moines.

If you're looking for more of what you've been seeing here on CNN, check out CNN.com/healthcare. You can even find out about the closest town hall meeting to you, the key players in the debate, the different plans, and, of course, the controversial sticking points to those plans.

And how about this? Wouldn't you like to know what the former surgeon general of the United States thinks about health care reform?

Well, how about that? We have him.

He missed his mark. Put him on his mark.

We have him here. We'll talk to him next. Dr. David Satcher in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: You know, I'm trying to remember whether or not it's not -- the Dow has been down all day. Well, you can see we're about three hours into the trading day, and this is a pretty steep sell-off. Not the way you want to end the week.

The Dow down 150 points. The NASDAQ is down 38 points.

We will be following the numbers throughout the day for you in the CNN NEWSROOM, of course, with Susan Lisovicz.

You know, another bank could be headed for failure, but a buyer may already be lined up.

CNNMoney.com's Poppy Harlow has our "Breakdown." She's in New York.

Good to see you, Poppy.

POPPY HARLOW, CNNMONEY.COM: Good to see you, Tony.

This is a story we've been following since late last night. We're talking about Colonial Bank. It's a southern bank, a regional bank.

Dow Jones now reporting that BB&T -- that's another regional bank in the South -- will buy Colonial Bank. The FDIC, we called them, they won't confirm that. Also, BB&T not commenting on it whatsoever.

BB&T is based in North Carolina. Very similar to Colonial, lots of business in the mortgage sector.

Now, let's go through this.

This comes as a federal judge says Colonial Bank, which, by the way, has 355 branches across the South, is on the brink of collapse. The judge froze assets in a Bank of America dispute with Colonial over about $1 billion in assets. A mortgage dispute there.

And this is really just the latest trouble for Colonial Bank. Its mortgage lending and accounting practices, Tony, right now, also under federal criminal investigation for the past few weeks. It's also one of two banks that was raided earlier this month by federal agents. So lots of questions about the health of this bank and what's going to happen to it.

HARRIS: Well, Poppy, if Colonial collapses, how big of a bank failure will we be talking about here?

HARLOW: You know, Tony, you're exactly right to say if, because we don't want to be alarmists here. This bank has not been taken over by regulators yet. But if we were to see a failure of it, it would be very sizable. As I said, 355 branches across the south. About $25 billion in assets. And if it doesn't survive, it would actually, Tony, be the biggest bank failure so far this year.

We have a graphic. Take a look there. You see from Washington Mutual, which happened last year, at the top there, all the way down to American Savings & Loan. This would come in at number six. But it would be, Tony, the biggest bank failure so far in the United States this year if it does indeed happen.

HARRIS: All right. And what do Colonial customers need to know? And this is the important piece.

HARLOW: That's the important piece. Don't panic yet. We have a system that protects your money in this country. The FDIC. If regulators do shut down Colonial, your deposits are going to be protected up to $250,000 per account. Your ATM card is still going to work. But you've got that $250,000 protection at any bank that is backed up by the FDIC. That limit was actually raised, as you know, Tony, last year, sort of at the height of the financial crisis when it was at $100,000 and now it's up to $250,000.

There's also some important things to note here. There are situations where you can get more insurance if you've got, say, a joint account at one of these banks. That will be insured, as well as your individual accounts.

And use these tools. Let's pull them up for you. You can take a look at the FDIC online calculator. It's myfdicinsurance.gov. Put in your account there. See if you're under the limit so you're fully protected. Got any questions, call that number, 1-877-ASK-FDIC.

We're waiting for a comment on this story. It's moving quickly. So we'll bring you the latest, Tony, when we have it.

HARRIS: It really is. OK, Poppy, appreciate it. Thank you. Have a great weekend.

HARLOW: You too.

HARRIS: Breaking racial barriers. It's what we're talking about today in our "What Matters" segment, in partnership with "Essence" magazine. Sandy Cane, known as Italy's Obama, is making history as the country's first black mayor. The right-leaning Italian American was born in Massachusetts and presides over a small town near the Swiss border. Cane's father was an African-American soldier and her mother an Italian. She moved to Italy when she was 10 years old after her parents divorced.

And another story featured in the September issue of "Essence," hitting newsstands today, the achievement gap between black and white students. The Education Department reports blacks remain about 28 points behind whites on a 500-point achievement scale. Reading and math scores are improving for black students, but white student scores are up, too. So the gap narrowed just seven points from 1992 to 2007. Experts blame the disparity on factors like poverty and a high dropout rate.

Blacks may also be lagging behind when it comes to health care, even though they are more likely to suffer from chronic health problems, such as high blood pressure. Forty-four percent of cardiovascular surgeons say blacks are less likely to receive cardiac diagnostic tests and procedures. Even when minorities have equal access to health care, studies show they're less likely to receive routine procedures than white patients.

What's going on here? Former U.S. Surgeon General Dr. David Satcher joins me to talk about this issue. Dr. Satcher is currently director of the Satcher Health Leadership Institute at Morehouse's School of Medicine.

Dr. Satcher, we've been trying to get you on this program for a couple of weeks now. It's good to see you.

DR. DAVID SATCHER, FORMER SURGEON GENERAL: Good to be here, Tony.

HARRIS: All right. Let's work through this. Forty-four percent of cardiovascular surgeons say blacks are less likely to receive cardiac diagnostic tests and procedures. What's going on here? Why do we have these disparities in health care?

SATCHER: Well, there are several reasons for disparities. But just let me say that the relationship between the doctor and the patient is a critical element of quality patient care.

HARRIS: Yes.

SATCHER: Culture counts when it comes to the quality of patient care. So it's one thing to have access. It's another thing to have access to a provider who really understands your health and understands your communication about your health problems. So there is more than just getting in the door to what happens to you in terms of your health outcomes.

HARRIS: I'm going to ask you a really provocative one here in a second. The second line of the setup to introducing you here, even when minorities have equal access to health care, studies show they're less likely to receive routine procedures than white patients. How much of this is about black people not going to see the doctor as often as we should? How much of this is racism in the system?

SATCHER: Well, I don't know how much of it is racism. That's always . . .

HARRIS: Is it a factor?

SATCHER: It is a factor. It's been shown to be a factor. But sometimes what we call racism represents differences in culture, differences in communication.

HARRIS: What does that mean?

SATCHER: That means that providers don't always understand what people of different cultures say when they talk about their health problems.

HARRIS: Yes.

SATCHER: And, by the same token, patients don't always understand when doctor talks with them about their health problems. So health literacy is a major issue here. Culture is a major issue. And relationship is a major issue.

HARRIS: You say there is more need here than health care reform in the order that we're talking about now in the current debate. You say something that we need health system reform. What does that mean?

SATCHER: It means that health care is responsible for less than 25 percent of variations in health outcomes. Less than 25 percent. So, what's the other? The other relates to environment, and especially human behavior and whether or not you're physically active on a regular basis, whether or not you smoke, your nutrition.

So, we need a health system that deals with all of those things. Right now we're not even requiring children in school to do physical education, K through 12. We are addicting children to sedentary lifestyles, to salt, to sweets and to fat. We need a system that reverses that.

HARRIS: Do you know how difficult -- you're talking about health care reform being the first step. You're talking about this reform to the health system as being important and critical. We can't even get reform. We are fighting now -- you see what's going on across the country now, this debate that's raging over health care. Everybody's saying, we can't even get to step one here.

SATCHER: I believe that getting to step one would be made easier if we look at the system as a whole. For example, one of the major issues is cost.

HARRIS: That's interesting. OK.

SATCHER: It's cost. And we believe that -- and I'm not talking about preventive care. I'm talking about population-based prevention. And I believe if we invest in it, we will reap the benefit.

HARRIS: What does that mean?

SATCHER: Well, let's take businesses like Johnson & Johnson and others where they've invested in work site wellness and are saving, like, $100 million in health care costs because they are incentivizing healthy behaviors.

HARRIS: Yes.

SATCHER: As a nation, we need to incentivize healthy behaviors. And we can. Our system is broken. There's no question about that. It's broken in terms of cost. It's out of control. It's broken in terms of quality. It's broken in terms of access. And there are major health disparities, as you implied earlier.

HARRIS: OK. And I know that -- I know that exercise is a key component to this. And I know that -- we've got some tape here to show everyone of how seriously you take this. Am I correct here? You don't mind me telling everyone your age, right? You're a 68-year-old man, aren't you?

SATCHER: I am, yes.

HARRIS: I'm sorry, 68 years young.

SATCHER: I feel great.

HARRIS: And part of it is that this is a part of your lifestyle. Exercise is very important to you. I mean, what are the takeaways in how active you are for people who are watching us on the program right now?

SATCHER: You know, it was Albert Schweitzer, the great physician, who spent his life in Africa as a physician, who said, let your life be a message. Let your life speak. And I believe what I've tried to do with my life, as surgeon general and as director of the CDC and now, is to give a message to the American people and others that we have an opportunity to improve our health through our activities. And it's not just what's going to happen to you 10 years from now. You feel better. You function better when you're physically active.

HARRIS: Yes.

SATCHER: When you have good nutrition. It eliminates and significantly reduces unnecessary pain and suffering.

HARRIS: Incentivize it.

SATCHER: We need to incentivize it.

HARRIS: And you believe we can do that?

SATCHER: I believe we can do it. Well, businesses have done it.

HARRIS: Yes.

SATCHER: For every dollar that businesses invest in wellness, they save $4.

HARRIS: Dr. Satcher, it's great to see you. Thanks for your time.

SATCHER: It's great to be here, Tony.

HARRIS: And you're here in Atlanta, so there's no reason why we can't have you on the program more often, do you agree?

SATCHER: I agree. It's great to see you.

HARRIS: That's what I wanted to hear you say.

All right. We are going to hear from Michael Vick's mentor, former Super Bowl-winning Coach Tony Dungy. He is with our Larry Smith and he'll be on the air with us next, right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: Michael Vick is back in the National Football League. He will be playing his football for the Philadelphia Eagles. Larry Smith joins us now. He is just outside the Eagles practice facility in Philadelphia. And he is with a man who is credited with being chiefly responsible for intervening in Michael Vick's life and chiefly responsible, many say, for this day coming to pass, that is former coach Tony Dungy.

Larry, take it away.

LARRY SMITH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Tony, thanks so much.

You know, you're right. We talked last hour how in just how I felt the difference in the contrition in Michael Vick's voice and certainly you feel that Tony Dungy's a part of that. For the first time in 35 years, not a part of an NFL training camp.

It's good to see you. You look great. You don't miss it at all is what you're telling me.

TONY DUNGY, FORMER NFL HEAD COACH: I don't miss it, Larry. I'm enjoying life and doing some other things with family and things with youth. And I'm loving it. But it is different, not having that day- to-day grind.

SMITH: Yes. Michael Vick. What's different now for Michael Vick than the Michael Vick you might have known before all this transpired? What's different?

DUNGY: I think a couple of things, Larry. I think he realizes now some of the things he took for granted, like his family, his teammates, being in the National Football League. He realizes that can be gone. And I think his lifestyle is a little different. I think spiritually he's come back in touch with the Lord and I think that's going to make a big difference.

SMITH: Eagles owner Jeffrey Lurie with very clear in his disdain for what Michael Vick had done and said how tough it was to make this decision. And he credited you as playing a role in convincing him that Michael Vick was a safe risk for his team.

DUNGY: Well, I talked to Andy Reid a lot. I talked to the Eagles organization. And I just talked about a lot of young men who make mistakes, who go down the wrong path and what you've got to try to figure out is, if they've changed, if they're different, are they going to be a good teammate, a good person in the locker room, in the community. And I told the Eagles I thought he would be. I thought he'd be very positive and I hope that bears out.

SMITH: Michael Vick, when you look at the chronology of him, when you go through -- I'm sorry, Tony, one more quick question. When you look through his chronology, his big problems began when he signed that big $130 million contract. Will he be able to handle the catcalls, both home and away, and all the negative things that are going to be thrown his way as he tries to rebuild his career?

DUNGY: When you're trained as an athlete like that and you've got to be able to block those things out. He is going to have a lot of people that do not think he should be playing. He's got to prove them wrong by his actions off the field first and then on the field.

SMITH: I think Tony Harris is (INAUDIBLE).

HARRIS: Yes. But, and, Larry, that was part of what I wanted to get at. Coach Dungy, it's great to talk to you. You know, I've got to tell you, you have as much respect as anyone ever in the National Football League. And while I know a lot about the arc of your professional career and the causes you've taken on, many may not be familiar with that and may be asking, why on earth did you get involved with the Michael Vick story? Why did you take an interest and decide to get involved with this young man?

DUNGY: Well, I knew a lot of Michael's teammates in Atlanta. Warrick Dunn played for me in Tampa. He was very close to Michael Vick. So that was part of it.

But it's also part of what I do. For the last 13 years, I've visited a lot of prisons in the Tampa area, in the Indianapolis area, and I've seen hundreds of young men who have made mistakes and are trying to rebound from that. And it's the same thing in this case. I'm just trying to help Michael rebound, as I have hundreds of those young men.

HARRIS: And one more -- one quick follow-up on that. You are aware, as anyone, of the details of these horrible acts perpetrated by Michael and the people that he was associated with. And there are many people who are saying to us on our blog, this is a young man who does not deserve a second crack at the millions in the National Football League. And some are going so far as to say he doesn't deserve a second chance at all, at anything. What would you say to those people?

DUNGY: Well, there's a lot of different types of crimes, and I certainly don't want to minimize this one. I talk to young people all the time that have made mistakes. Players on my team that made mistakes, and you help them bounce back from it. I also think Michael Vick can be a very, very positive element in this. He can reach a segment of our population that I can't reach as a 53-year-old. That Andy Reid can't reach. That Jeff Lurie can't reach. He can reach people in the Philadelphia community, young people, with the right message. If he's got the right message, he can be very positive. And that's what I'm trusting will happen.

HARRIS: Coach . . .

SMITH: Tony, I've got another question.

HARRIS: Yes, yes, very quickly.

SMITH: Michael Vick, at this point -- yes, very quickly, very quickly -- his chance of success, what do you think he'll do in these next couple years?

DUNGY: I think this is the best spot for him. He's got a great player to play under in Donovan McNabb. He's got a great system and a great quarterback coach here with Andy Reid. I think it's all about him fitting in and not necessarily being the greatest player, but putting his life and his career back together. I think it's going to go well.

SMITH: OK. We'll leave it at that. Thanks so much, Tony Dungy, appreciate it.

Tony, back to you.

HARRIS: Larry, appreciate it. Yes, Larry, appreciate it. And Coach Dungy, good to talk to you. And, Larry, thanks for the hustle in getting Coach Dungy to be available for us.

Still to come, you know, it is a big problem in health care. We're talking about pre-existing conditions. In today's "Health Care in Focus Report," we meet a small business owner who can't get insurance to cover the medication and the care she needs. Photojournalist Eddie Cortez has the story for us.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: About nine years ago, I was diagnosed with Crohn's disease. Without my medication, it could -- it gets bad.

DAVID NEUENSCHWANDER, WIFE HAS CROHN'S DISEASE: She's very hard to live with when this Crohn's has flared up.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I can't eat. I don't sleep. My weight starts to drop.

D. NEUENSCHWANDER: Even the kids, when it would flare up, they would -- can we go somewhere? You know, we just need to get away from mom for a little while.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm without medical insurance. I cannot even get prescriptions that I'm supposed to take every single day. I've got doctors' orders right now for different tests that I can't do because there's no way to cover it, you know? We're making ourselves here with the business trying to just stay above float, and it's like the water's at the nose, that's how close it is. So we don't know what to do.

These are the Athicals (ph), 400 milligrams each. These are $450 to $500 a month depending on where you go. In none less than $450 anywhere, except for Canada. I'm supposed to take 12 a day. And this keeps my Crohn's under control.

D. NEUENSCHWANDER: With her having Crohn's disease, it does make it impossible for us to buy insurance that covers anything.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's voodoo. It's like Crohn's is voodoo. They don't want to touch it. It's pre-existing. When I call to get a quote, they say, OK, we won't cover Crohn's, but once they find out you have Crohn's, even though they don't cover it, they rate the policy extremely high because you do have a disease.

It's the one thing we need coverage on and it's the one thing that we can't get. It's just a vicious cycle. It's like a merry-go- round that you never get off of.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: You may not be feeling it yet, but most economists surveyed this week by "The Wall Street Journal" -- hmm -- say the recession is over. Oh, really? That's not official, but their opinion based on the numbers they see on the economy. Thomas Danny Boston is an economics professor at Georgia Tech. He's our friend. We love having him on this program.

Danny, look, you're not one of those ivory tower types.

PROF. THOMAS "DANNY" BOSTON, GEORGIA TECH: I try not to be.

HARRIS: Yes. Is the recession over?

BOSTON: All right, as the saying goes . . .

HARRIS: What do you mean, all right?

BOSTON: Put a fork in it, it's done. It's done.

HARRIS: No, you believe it?

BOSTON: It's done. It's over with. Now, you have, just as you have different intensities of recession, you have different intensities of recovery. So because the recession is over doesn't necessarily mean that we're going to grow like crazy.

HARRIS: By what standard is this recession over in your mind?

BOSTON: Because we found the bottom. The things are not where we want them to be. But if you look at the unemployment numbers, the increase in unemployment, the decrease in housing sales, the decrease in manufacturing production, all of those things have pretty much bottomed out.

HARRIS: But if you're anywhere in this country -- our Ali Velshi is all over the country right now talking to people -- they would like to believe the recession is over, but they look at the circumstances of their own lives and they still feel like they're in a personal recession.

BOSTON: Uh-huh.

HARRIS: When -- what's the disconnect here? We're looking at different sets of data here.

BOSTON: Because they are. They are. All right? And here's the facts. You got 14.5 million people unemployed.

HARRIS: Right.

BOSTON: All right. Now, then you have about 8 million people are who are employed on a half, part-time basis.

HARRIS: Underemployed.

BOSTON: Underemployed, would like to be full-time employed. You have another 2 million people who have given up looking for jobs.

HARRIS: Right.

BOSTON: All right. Now, when the economy turns around, all of those people have to get back into productive employment. And so you will see a gradual increase. You won't see this thing taking off like a rocket, but a gradual turnaround.

HARRIS: Well, you've seen the new numbers from Realty Trac. The number of homes that are in the foreclosure process jumped 32 percent in July. How can economists like you now be telling us that the recession has bottomed out -- essentially, put a fork in it, it's over . . .

BOSTON: It's over.

HARRIS: Your words, when we still have all of these homes in the foreclosure process and we're looking at homes being a depreciating asset at this point?

BOSTON: Absolutely.

HARRIS: In many states.

BOSTON: Absolutely. And everything that you said is correct.

HARRIS: You're darn right it's correct.

BOSTON: And when I say that, I don't mean to suggest that people are not feeling pain. There's still pain there. And it's pain because they've lost jobs. They've lost jobs. They've lost the ability to pay for mortgages. Those things will continue. And that's why the stimulus has to continue at least for a while.

HARRIS: Well, at the corporate level, are you seeing the kind of -- in R&D investment, the investment in infrastructure, the investment in plants, in new projects that will ultimately lead to the jobs for the people who are unemployed right now or underemployed right now?

BOSTON: And that's the problem. No, we're not seeing that. What we're seeing in the corporate sector is simply a response to the fact that they need to finally build up inventories in order to increase sales.

HARRIS: Yes.

BOSTON: They're not doing that research and development.

HARRIS: I'm going to give you one more chance. Do you really mean to say, stick a fork in it, it's done?

BOSTON: Stick a fork in it, it's done. Not the pain, but the recession.

HARRIS: We've got to go, we're so long.

CNN NEWSROOM with Kyra Phillips begins right here on CNN after a quick break.

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