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President Obama Keeping Up Health Reform Push; Health Reform: What Now?; Oudin Ousted in Quarterfinals

Aired September 10, 2009 - 10:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning again, everyone. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM, where we will quickly get you caught up on the day's hot headlines, then take the time to break down the big issues to find out why they really matter.

Leading the way this hour, President Obama keeping up his renewed push for health care reform today. The president made another pitch for overhauling health care just moments ago, hoping to build on momentum from last night's prime-time speech. He spoke to members of the American Nurses Association about new figures showing a rise in the number of uninsured.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Over the last 12 months, it's estimated that the ranks of the uninsured have swelled by nearly six million people. That's 17,000 men and women every single day. And we know that during this period of time, the number of adults who get their coverage at the workplace has dropped by eight million people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: A congressman's angry outburst during President Obama's health care speech condemned by lawmakers from both sides of the aisle. South Carolina Republican Joe Wilson shouted, "You lie!" when the president was refuting claims about his reform plans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: There are also those that claim our reform would insure illegal immigrants. This, too, is false. The reforms I'm proposing would not apply to those who are here illegally.

REP. JOE WILSON (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: You lie!

OBAMA: It's not true.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Wilson apologized in a statement and a call to the White House.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi I believe right now -- do we have a shot of her? -- talking about what happened last night and Representative Wilson. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), HOUSE SPEAKER: Didn't give it any more attention than it deserved.

QUESTION: Did you think about gaveling him out of order though?

PELOSI: No. Well, if he had continued. But the sergeant in arms -- the parliamentarian passed him a piece of paper that said what options were. We're just going to move on.

On that same subject...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Just wanted to give you a bit of the flavor of the weekly get-together with the media that the House Speaker holds, and taking a question about the remarks last night from Representative Wilson.

A newly released tape of swindler Bernard Madoff. He advises a corporate client how to tap dance around questions. Madoff infers SEC investigators aren't too bright.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

BERNARD MADOFF, CONVICTED SWINDLER: You don't want them to think that you are concerned about anything. With them you should -- you're best off, you just be you know, casual.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

HARRIS: And again, that tape from Massachusetts state investigators.

A California state rep quits after he accidentally confesses to a pair of extramarital flings. Republican Mike Duvall, a family values crusader, bragged about his sexcapades in crude detail in front of an open mike. One of the women is a lobbyist with business before one of Duvall's committees.

The tape, later in the NEWSROOM.

Bizarre claims from a religious fanatic accused of hijacking a jetliner. The 44-year-old suspect told reports Christ is coming soon. He allegedly told Mexican officials he hijacked the Aeromexico jet because of the date -- September 9, '09, saying, "09/09/09 is the satanic number 666 turned upside down."

The flight from Cancun landed safely in Mexico City. The suspect claimed he had a bomb and held the plane for more than an hour before passengers and crew were released unharmed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it was controlled fairly quickly, swiftly, and without any incidents.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: One hundred eleven passengers and crew were aboard that flight.

She is out, but, oh, what a wonderful run for young tennis sensation Melanie Oudin. The 17-year-old Marietta, Georgia, teenager lost her U.S. Open Quarter Finals match last night to Caroline Wozniacki, who is a fabulous player. Oudin arrived at the Open pretty much unknown, ranked 70th, but she leaves her celebrity after defeating four opponents, including the world's fourth-ranked player.

Here's what she had to say on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MELANIE OUDIN, TENNIS PLAYER: I'll definitely learn that I have gained confidence this tournament, that I can do this again, hopefully, and that I can compete with the best in the world, no matter how highly ranked they are. I mean, I beat Sharapova, who's a huge champion, has been number one in the world before. So, my confidence has definitely gone up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: CNN's Sports's Larry Smith was at the open, will join us in about 20 minutes.

So, let's go in depth right now.

President Obama made a forceful and passionate plea for health care reform during his prime-time address to Congress. He said fixing the health care system is crucial to the country's future economic health.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Finally, our health care system is placing an unsustainable burden on taxpayers. When health care costs grow at the rate they have, it puts greater pressure on programs like Medicare and Medicaid. If we do nothing to slow these skyrocketing costs, we will eventually be spending more on Medicare and Medicaid than every other government program combined.

Put simply, our health care problem is our deficit problem. Nothing else even comes close. Nothing else.

(APPLAUSE)

Now, these are the facts. Nobody disputes them. We know we must reform the system. The question is, how?

Now, there are those on the left who believe that the only way to fix the system is through a single payer system like Canada's, where we would severely restrict the private insurance market and have the government provide insurance for everybody. On the right, there are those who argue we should end employee-based systems and leave individuals to buy health insurance on their own.

I have said -- I have to say that there are arguments to be made for both these approaches. But either one would represent a radical shift that would disrupt the health care most people currently have. Since health care represents one-sixth of our economy, I believe it makes more sense to build on what works and fix what doesn't, rather than try to build an entirely new system from scratch.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: The pros and cons of last night's speech. We will break it down with members of the best political team on television.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(WEATHER REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: The time for bickering is over. President Obama blasted what he called the partisan spectacle over health care reform during his speech last tonight. He says it is time to seize the opportunity for action.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: We've seen many in this chamber work tirelessly for the better part of this year to offer thoughtful ideas about how to achieve reform. Of the five committees asked to develop bills, four have completed their work, and the Senate Finance Committee announced today that it will move forward next week. That has never happened before.

Our overall efforts have been supported by an unprecedented coalition of doctors and nurses, hospitals, seniors groups, and even drug companies, many of whom opposed reform in the past. And there is agreement in this chamber on about 80 percent of what needs to be done, putting us closer to the goal of reform than we have ever been.

But what we've also seen in these last months is the same partisan spectacle that only hardens the disdain many Americans have towards their own government. Instead of honest debate, we've seen scare tactics. Some have dug into unyielding ideological camps that offer no hope of compromise. Too many have used this as an opportunity to score short-term political points, even if it robs the country of our opportunity to solve a long-term challenge. And out of this blizzard of charges and countercharges, confusion has increased (ph).

Well, the time for bickering is over. The time for games has passed. Now is the season for action.

(APPLAUSE) Now is when we must bring the best ideas of both parties together and show the American people that we can still do what we were sent here to do. Now is the time to deliver on health care.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: OK. So how did the president's speech impact the debate, and what happens next in the battle over health care reform?

Let's bring in our correspondents. Elaine Quijano it at the White House for us. And Congressional Correspondent Brianna Keilar at her post on Capitol Hill.

And Elaine, let's start with you. Let's start with strategy.

What is the president's strategy moving forward? He certainly was out this morning talking health care reform with members of the American Nurses Association.

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, surrounded by members of the American Nurses Association. In fact, the president really basically tried to reiterate his case that health care reform needs to get done now. He said nurses understand full well they are on the front lines, he said, of the health care fight, and they know the urgency of the situation.

The president also repeated that he intends to press ahead with a bill with or without Republican support. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Now is the time to act. And I will not permit reform to be postponed or imperiled by the usual ideological diversions.

(APPLAUSE)

We don't need more partisan distractions. If there are real concerns about any aspect of my plan, let's address them. If there are real differences, let's resolve them. But we have talked this issue to death, year after year, decade after decade, and the time for talk is winding down. The time for bickering has passed. We're not the first generation to take up this cause, but we can and have to be the last.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUIJANO: So, what is next? The president is going to be meeting with members of his cabinet today to talk health care.

At the same time, behind the scenes, Tony, what we're really going to be looking at is when the president is expected to sit down with a meeting of about a dozen or so centrist Senate Democrats who are expected to come here to the White House. Senior officials telling our Ed Henry last night that, really, this will be a chance for the president to get to some of these fence-sitters, get them all in the room together, try to pull them over, of course, and we'll see what comes out of that. And then on Saturday, as you know, there's that public rally in Minneapolis, Minnesota, where he's basically taking his sales pitch on the road once again -- Tony.

HARRIS: All right.

Brianna, let me turn to you here.

The Senate Finance Committee moving ahead on writing and getting a markup on its bill. Are any of the three Republican senators who make up this so-called Gang of 6 on board with this plan? And what are we likely to hear from House Minority Leader John Boehner? I believe that's coming up pretty soon.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, we still don't know if they're on board, Tony. I mean, the negotiations continue, and the chairman of that committee says he's going to move forward. He set a date to go through initial votes there in the committee.

But it was really interesting talking with Democrats on the House side, liberals and conservatives who have really opposing views on this government run insurance option, to see what they thought of that speech last night, Tony. It was really a case of they heard what they wanted to hear, because liberal Democrats who say we want a public option, there has to be a public option -- for instance, Lynn Woolsey, who's the head of the Progressive Caucus, she really zeroed in on President Obama still touting the merits of this government-run insurance option.

To her, she said that was a signal that it will still be in the overhaul. But if you talk with these conservative Democrats, they really pointed to President Obama saying to Congress you have to also be open to other ideas, and they said that indicated some flexibility on his part. But for those Republican senators who are still at the bargaining table there at the Senate Finance Committee, Chuck Grassley and Olympia Snowe, two of the three, they really wanted, ahead of time, they said they wanted the public option, they wanted President Obama to really rule that out.

We knew that he really wasn't going to do that. And they took issue with that afterwards. Chuck Grassley saying it was a missed opportunity. Senator Snowe saying that she would have preferred that it was taken off the table. And obviously it wasn't -- Tony.

HARRIS: Right. Right. Interesting. Interesting.

Brianna, what's the fallout from the representative, Representative Wilson, heckling the president during his speech last night?

KEILAR: Well, there's a whole lot of talk about it. And he was very quick to apologize. But yes, there's still a lot of talk about it today.

And what we just heard from House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, really just minutes ago in her weekly press conference, Tony, she said he apologized, it's time to move on. So, obviously, Democrats aren't going to take -- aren't really going to try to take any action, as we thought there was maybe some talk of, but it's really a distraction for Democrats. It's embarrassing for Republicans.

And it's really kind of a pretty unusual thing. You really don't see a member of Congress sort of yelling out at the president like that during one of these addresses to a joint session, or one of these State of the Union-type speech.

HARRIS: All right.

Brianna Keilar on Capitol Hill, where all of the action is right now.

And our thanks to Elaine Quijano at the White House as well.

You know, our iReporters are weighing in this morning on President Obama's speech and the lawmaker who heckled him. So, let's hear first from a conservative who voted for John McCain, followed by an Independent who voted for Barack Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATY BROWN, IREPORTER: I don't see how anyone can support it. The two things that I will support in this bill is malpractice, which, first of all, should not even be tolerated. That should have been taken care of a long time ago.

And the second thing is the excluding of people with pre-existing issues. I myself have had brain surgery. I had a tumor. If health care companies put me down because of that, I might be pretty mad.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MELISSA FAZLI, IREPORTER: Honestly, he can apologize all he wants. No one will forget this tonight, and how he heckled the president and he called him a liar, and when it came to health care reform for illegal aliens here in America. OK? It's in there.

Did you read it, Mr. Wilson?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Joe Wilson, a Republican House member, shouted, "You lie!" during President Obama's health care reform speech to Congress last night.

Talk about talk of the morning, water cooler and all. Town halls across the country have been heated with passionate voters shouting down politicians, often drowning out the debate.

Here is our question. Has it all just gone too far?

We want to hear from you. Leave us your thoughts right now. Let's get to it, CNN.com/Tony.

And let's get to some of our top stories this morning.

It is a number that's been a central part of the debate over health care this morning. The Census Bureau is reporting there were 46.3 million Americans without health insurance in 2008. That's more than 15 percent of the nation's population. The Census Bureau says there were 45.7 million uninsured in 2007.

Police in California are expanding their search in the neighborhood where Jaycee Dugard was held for nearly 18 years. Police searched his neighbor's home yesterday.

Garrido -- we're talking about Phillip Garrido -- took care of this particular house for a brief period of time when it was vacant. Police are trying to determine if Dugard's accused captor and rapist, Phillip Garrido, is connected to other crimes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHEYVONNE MOLINO, JM AUTOWORKERS: They went through everything. They went thorough my drawers. They went through my garbage. They went through, you know, everything personal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't understand why they came here like that, because there is no link between us and him, other than business and buying his printing products.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Garrido and his wife, Nancy, pleaded not guilty to 29 felony charges related to Dugard's disappearance when she was 11.

A lot of baseball fans can't wait for the Yankees/Orioles game tomorrow night. It could be the game for the captain, Derek Jeter. Last night, Jeter tied Yankee legend Lou Gehrig's 70-year-old record for hits, 2,721, with a single to the right. A two-minute ovation for the Yankee shortstop followed.

What a moment.

It didn't end the way she wanted, but Melanie Oudin's trip taught us all about the power of belief.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OUDIN: It's been hard. It's definitely different than what I am used to.

You know, I'm just used to going out and playing tennis. But these two weeks, it's been so much more than that. It's been lots of media and lots of different things happening, and people knowing who I am now, and just a lot of things. But, you know, all in all, it was good for me and it's a good learning experience. (END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: Oh boy. It was a fairytale run at the U.S. Open for teen tennis sensation Melanie Oudin. She was knocked out of the Quarterfinals last night by Caroline Wozniacki of Denmark.

CNN's Larry Smith joining us live now.

Hey, Larry, here's the thing. We talked about this a bit yesterday. This is -- we love the Oudin story, but the Wozniacki story is a good one, too. She's 19 years old. She's a terrific player.

But in analyzing this match, as we did yesterday, it's not a surprising result given the kind of player Wozniacki is. You have to go after shots against her, and we saw Oudin doing that, and making more errors than we're used to.

LARRY SMITH, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: You're right, Tony. Even if you're not a tennis fan, this is one stat you need to know.

HARRIS: Yes.

SMITH: Forty-three unforced errors by Melanie Oudin. When you have got a player that's a little more seasoned than Melanie is, has a little more experience -- but she's still a teenager, the first Scandinavian teenager to make a Quarterfinal at a Grand Slam event. She's got a bright future, too.

When you have got that kind of player, you can't give that many shots back. And it just caught up to her last night. But what a great run it was.

HARRIS: Yes. What a great run.

And talk about that run a little bit. Who did she beat along the way? Rank 70th coming into this event. She'll take a big jump after the event, obviously.

SMITH: Yes. She's going to be probably next week in the top 50. I mean, what a great year to go from a virtual unknown and a fresh -- just turned pro, to turning 18 here in a few weeks and being in the top 50.

I mean, she beat Maria Sharapova, who has won three Grand Slam events. I mean, she beat a former number one, Elena Dementieva. At Wimbledon, she had the big win over -- she's one of these players that I think, again, you understand why American tennis fans get so excited, because we haven't seen this really since the William sisters came on the scene.

HARRIS: That's right. And I understand she was not even expecting to make it this far. Didn't even have a hotel booked through her quarterfinal match.

SMITH: Right. Got booted out of her hotel. It was one of those things that's too bad, but it's one of those things that happens. They got through it.

But Melanie really learned these two weeks what it's like to have the "C" word attached to her, and that's celebrity. You know, we went last night and watched with her fans and friends at her tennis club, and they said, hey, don't ask about her boyfriend. Don't ask about her routine that she does.

I mean, it's these kinds of things that people want to know everything about Melanie, and that's a good practice. If she's going to be a huge success, you've got to know how to handle those things.

HARRIS: So, one last one.

How bright is the future for this young woman? What's next? I'm thinking about Fed Cup. I think she's already playing Fed Cup.

What's next for her?

SMITH: Yes, Fed Cup is the teen competition. She's already taking part at that. Great at 17 years old.

But Melanie right now, what I loved was afterward. She said, hey, listen, I'm not a celebrity. I'm just a normal kid. I like to play Wii and text on my phone.

But the big thing she said, "I've got to now go back and work harder to get to that next level." That's what you want to hear. She's not satisfied with the Quarterfinal run. She wants to be one of the greats.

And that's the best place you can be. We would think we would see a lot more of her in the future.

HARRIS: Yes. And we're tennis fans, and a lot of folks watching us are as well.

Just needs to add a little more pop to her game. And that's a game where you've got to have a couple of go-to weapons, whether it's your big forehand or your big serve. She has got to add a little more pop. Would you agree?

SMITH: Yes. She's got a good team around her and she's got the work ethic. So, I think that she's probably already thinking about how she can work on that.

HARRIS: Larry, awesome. Great to see you. What a story. What a pleasure to cover it.

Larry Smith in Atlanta for us.

Appreciate it, Larry.

More people in poverty and fewer people with health insurance. Brand new numbers out today, and we will break them down.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) HARRIS: So, here's the big question: Should health insurance coverage be mandatory? President Obama says it should. In his speech last night, he called for assessable and affordable insurance, and he says everyone should be required -- it's a big one here, required -- to have coverage.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Now, even if we provide these affordable options, there may be those, especially the young and the healthy, who still want to take the risk and go without coverage. There may still be companies that refuse to do right by their workers by giving them coverage. The problem is such irresponsible behavior costs all the rest of us money.

If there are affordable options, and people still don't sign up for health insurance, it means we pay for these people's expensive emergency room visits. If some businesses don't provide workers health care, it forces the rest of us to pick up the tab when the workers get sick and gives those businesses an unfair advantage over their competitors.

And unless everybody does their par part, many of the insurance reforms we seek, especially requiring insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions, just can't be achieved. And that's why under my plan, individuals will be required to carry basic health insurance just as most states require you to carry auto insurance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: The lengthy recession pushing millions of Americans into poverty and pushing health care further out of reach for people. CNN's Christine Romans is here.

Christine, we've got new findings from the census out today. First of all, good to see you. Good to see you in your house. Take exception with me, because I've been using a number, and then I will take exception with my team, a number we've been quoting so far this morning reflecting on the census data, talking about the number of people uninsured in the country.

Go ahead, have at it here. Correct me.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, we keep saying, we keep hearing, you'll hear people say 46.3 Americans are without health insurance. It's not 46.3 million Americans. It's 46.3 million people in this country...

HARRIS: Yes.

ROMANS: ... who do not have health insurance. We know some of those people were born in this country. Some of them were not born in this country. Some are here legally. Some are here illegally. But without health insurance, 46.3 million people. That's up 600,000 folks from 2007. Not really a surprise since so many companies have been laying people off. They've been losing their employer-based coverage, and so they are dropping into this group of uninsured. HARRIS: But that's an important distinction...

ROMANS: Absolutely is.

HARRIS: ... as to who is uninsured here, because it is essential to this debate as who we want to cover moving forward. You will hear some Republican senators -- I think of Senator Coburn, who's been on our show a couple of times -- saying, you know, it's not really 46 million people, 46 million Americans who...

ROMANS: Right. Well, if, as the president says, you are not going to include people in the country illegally into the pool, then you are not really covering the uninsured, completely covering the uninsured with what they're talking about here.

HARRIS: Which is tricky because so many people are working in this country illegally. And we know that.

ROMANS: Millions.

HARRIS: And in some way, shape or form are probably getting some kind of coverage.

ROMANS: Well, federal law is that if someone is in the country illegally and they have an emergency or they need emergency life- sustaining health care, they get it at an emergency room.

This is the country we live in. This is the way -- it's federal law already. Insurance coverage, though, insurance coverage is another matter altogether.

HARRIS: Got you. What else are we learning from this census data?

ROMANS: Well...

HARRIS: Some interesting findings on poverty.

ROMANS: Yes. OK, this is what we found out. For the first time in five years, the first significant increase in poverty in this country. The highest poverty rate now since 1997. That's 39.8 million people. That's about 13.2 percent.

In case you're wondering, a family of four, the poverty rate is $22,025 -- $22,025 for a family of four. Very tough to live on that in this country. Also quickly, median income fell -- $50,303 is the median income, down about $1,800.

So, think of that. That's a family making $1,800 less a year last year.

HARRIS: And that's significant.

ROMANS: It hurts.

HARRIS: It really is. ROMANS: It hurts.

HARRIS: Christine, good to see you.

ROMANS: You're welcome.

HARRIS: In your house.

ROMANS: Nice to see you, too, Tony.

HARRIS: Back here tomorrow. Let's play some more.

ROMANS: I'd love to.

HARRIS: All right.

(LAUGHTER)

HARRIS: You know, it's certainly no coincidence that so many people are being pushed into poverty. Unemployment lines remain terribly long these days, and job openings, as you know, particularly trying to find a job, scarce.

Susan Lisovicz on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange with the latest check of the labor market. Good to see you, Susan.

SUSAN LISOVICZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good to see you, Tony. Five- hundred-fifty thousand Americans joined the unemployment line last week. That is a huge number, but it is down from the previous week.

Another huge number, 6.1 million Americans continuing to get unemployment benefits. If you factor in the extended benefits that so many states are doing now in this long recession, that number would be 9 million.

But what we are seeing, Tony, the silver lining here, is that the pace of layoffs is declining, and that's one of the reasons why you are seeing the Dow Industrials, the Nasdaq, S&P 500 higher for a fifth straight day. We're talking about modest gains here. But the Dow, the Nasdaq, the S&P, all basically at their highs for the year -- Tony.

HARRIS: Look, we'll take it. We're following. We're keeping score. And this is positive news. We'll take it. Now, there aren't many, but I understand there are companies actually hiring these days. Help us sort through this.

LISOVICZ: Happy to share that now. The Labor Department, Tony, says there were just under 2.5 million job openings in July. Think about it. Fourteen -- at least 14 million Americans out of work. That's six people applying for every job out there. So, it's tough.

Let's tell you where they are. We basically say this every month. Education, health care, that is a growth area. What kind of jobs? Physical therapist, all those baby boomers who are weekend warriors who throw out their shoulder or knee. There's a demand for those kinds of jobs.

Occupational therapist, registered nurses, the group that President Obama was speaking to earlier this morning. What other kinds of jobs? Professional business services. Specifically, computer and mathematical services. These are high-paying jobs. This is the future. This is -- these are the kind of jobs that are going to replace manufacturing jobs.

Tech opps. Think about them in our own company, Tony. The computer goes down, can you fix the computer?

HARRIS: No.

LISOVICZ: I don't think so. And progress slows down considerably. We're seeing growth. Obviously, the gains there, Tony, not enough to offset the losses elsewhere. But these are areas of growth, and hopefully we'll see these trends accelerate as the economy recovers.

HARRIS: Oh, Christine and I are dying up here right now because somehow or another, I have jacked up my computer here. Christine, I think you did this, and now I can't -- and no, I can't fix it.

LISOVICZ: I rest my case.

HARRIS: You rest -- yes.

ROMANS: Can someone please call tech support for Tony.

HARRIS: Help me! All right.

ROMANS: Tony needs tech support.

LISOVICZ: There you go.

HARRIS: Susan, appreciate it. Thank you.

LISOVICZ: You're welcome.

HARRIS: Christine, thanks.

(LAUGHTER)

HARRIS: You know, it has been a year since the collapse of Lehman Brothers. Read all about it from those who witnessed it. A "SPECIAL REPORT" at CNNmoney.com.

All right. Let's get to some of our top stories. A man wanted for a series of robberies is believed to have struck again. Police suspect 37-year-old Chad Schaffner (ph) of Indianapolis of robbing a bank yesterday in Caseyville, Illinois. Schaffner (ph) is considered dangerous.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Obviously, he's a huge threat to the public, and he's an armed safety threat, so we want everyone to take caution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: We can tell you that Schnaffer (ph) is suspected of ten robberies in at least three states.

At least five girls died in a stampede at a government school in New Delhi, India today. Twenty-nine others were injured. The stampede happened when students packed both ends of a narrow stairway.

Ellen DeGeneres says she has no plans to give up her day job now that she's signed on to replace Paula Abdul as a judge on "American Idol." I heard the rumor. It's fact now. DeGeneres admits having no formal music training, just the passion for tunes, and hopes to bring the people's point of view to the judging table.

Health care choices -- should they be up to your employer, the government or you? HLN's money expert, Clark Howard, joins me next right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: Just want to give you a quick note here before we get to HLN's Clark Howard. We are anticipating getting a piece of tape in from Representative Joe Wilson offering some clarification, explaining his comments during the president's speech last night.

"You lie" was the comment at the heart of the controversy right now. So, we're anticipating getting some comment from him at some point here in the next couple of minutes. We may be talking to Clark when that tape comes in. But we will roll it hot for you as soon as we get it.

OK, let's get to Clark Howard. Are you sick of all of the politics, the back and forth in this health care debate? What if we could take the politics out of it and focus on you, the consumer?

That's exactly what consumer adviser Clark Howard is trying to do. He has a view that you might not have considered.

Clark! Doctor, it's good to see you. Thanks for your time today.

CLARK HOWARD, HLN: I had so much fun pretending I was the president on radio and giving my address to Congress, which was very different than the president's address.

HARRIS: Well, Clark, can I do this? Can I play just before -- I'm going get you to explain some of the points in your plan, but let's have folks hear just a little bit of it from yesterday.

HOWARD: OK.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

If we rely on the government or on our employer to decide what coverage is good for us, or what they will provide and what they won't provide, then we are giving the employer or the federal government the power of illness and health, life and death over us based on the coverages that they provide.

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HARRIS: All right, Clark. I'm teeing it up for you. Take it away. What's your plan?

HOWARD: Well, my plan is actually fairly simple. It's not a revolution. It's a devolution, that we go back to where there's individual responsibility. You know, it's really an accident of history that large employers provide health care for their employees. And it goes way, way back during a time of wage price controls, and it was only as a way of back-door giving employees a pay raise that we have employer-provided health coverage.

And it's loco in an era that so many of us work for small employers, work for ourselves or big companies that used to used to employ us for a long time or a lifetime, send us to a cleaners. You know, they decide they don't need us anymore -- we're out.

So, what I recommend is that even if an employer subsidizes your health care or the government does, that you and I buy health coverage just like we buy auto insurance, homeowners insurance. Anything we buy at a store, we make the decision, we buy the level of coverage that we want.

HARRIS: Do you need some seed capital from the government to get your plan started?

HOWARD: No question that you'd have to take money that the feds are using right now to subsidize Medicaid...

HARRIS:

HOWARD: ... both the states and federal government, because you give people vouchers. I'm a big fan of vouchers. You give people vouchers based on their income, sliding scale, so that people have a subsidy so they can buy their own coverage.

But the key is personal responsibility...

HARRIS: Got you.

HOWARD: ... and personal choice. And my big deal is that you have 12 standardized plans, so that I as an individual can pick. Do I want an HMO? Do I want a PPO? Do I want the simple coverage, the intermediate coverage or the really, really fancy coverage in each category?

And I can easily comparison shop whatever coverage I want because everybody's coverages would be the same for whatever plan I choose. The only difference would be the premium and the reputation of that insurer or provider.

HARRIS: All right. What are the safeguards, then, to keep these insurance companies from dropping when you you get really sick?

HOWARD: That's a great question. You don't let them. I mean, you say to insurers, no more can you pick -- cherry-pick.

HARRIS: Hey, Clark?

HOWARD: Yes.

HARRIS: Let me have you hang on for just a moment. We warned folks that we were getting this statement from Representative Wilson. I believe it's coming in hot now, and then we'll come back to that very question, all right? Don't go anywhere. Let's roll it.

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QUESTION: Has -- what's leadership said to you this morning?

REP. JOE WILSON (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: Well, I, last night, heard from the leadership that they wanted me to contact the White House and say that my statements were inappropriate. I did. Very grateful that the White House, in talking with them, they indicated that they appreciated the call and that we needed to have a civil discussion about the health care issues, and I certainly agree with that.

And so, I'm happy to discuss the health care issues and in particular on the issue which I think is very important, of whether the bills cover -- would include illegal aliens or not. My background in that is that I was aware that there were two different amendments on the bill which would have provided for verification of persons having citizenship.

One was in the Ways and Means Committee. One was on Energy and Commerce Committee. And both of those were defeated overwhelmingly. They were almost party-line votes. On one of the amendments, several Democrats actually voted with us. Also, the Congressional Resource (ph) Services has indicated that indeed, the bills that are before Congress would include illegal aliens, and I think this is wrong.

We need to be discussing issues specifically to help the American people. And that would not include illegal aliens. These are people -- I'm for immigration -- legal immigration. I've been an immigration attorney. But people who have come to our country and violated laws, we should not be providing full health care services.

QUESTION: There is talk on the Internet that you tweeted something that was -- almost this was premeditated. Because your tweet did seem to say, I'll go to D.C. to respond to that, or that's -- how do you (INAUDIBLE)?

WILSON: I will tell you this, that it was spontaneous. It was -- when he stated, as he did, about not covering illegal aliens when I knew we had those two amendments, and I say that respectfully. And we need to discuss the issues, and I'm happy to do that. And I'm going to run go vote.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HARRIS: Representative Wilson addressing the controversy from his own comments yesterday during the president's speech to a joint session of Congress, where he said to the president -- well, we'll deal with it in greater detail with Josh Levs in the next hour.

I want to get back to Clark Howard here. And, Clark, when we broke away from our discussion, you were talking about essentially your idea is for an individual market where we can...

HOWARD: Yes.

HARRIS: ... go, and we can shop for health care insurance. And I was asking you, what provisions are in your plan, your idea here, moving forward, to keep insurance companies from dropping you when you get really sick, and for giving you something that is affordable if you have a pre-existing condition?

HOWARD: That is a wonderful question. If I am covered already, and I get an illness, the insurer can't dump me. If I choose not to have any health coverage, then I get sick, it is unreasonable to expect an insurer to suddenly say, OK, we'll cover you.

HARRIS: Yes.

HOWARD: So, I think it's a reasonable thing that if somebody chooses to go without health coverage, even with the subsidy that would be available to people who are of lower income, and then I get sick, the insurer should be able to put in a waiting period of a year or two before that illness would be covered. Otherwise everybody would wait until they got sick, and then they'd buy coverage.

You know, what we have to look at in America is that we are spending one-sixth of our national wealth on health care. And we have the worst result in the developed world. So, it's like there's all this sand in the gears.

HARRIS: Yes.

HOWARD: And I believe the real cause of the sand is that I, as an individual, am not being put in charge of my own health and welfare.

HARRIS: Got you.

HOWARD: I think the responsibility comes back to me.

HARRIS: One final point here. It is -- and we're running out of time, but I need you to respond to this.

HOWARD: OK.

HARRIS: It is just too radical an approach. Too many gears here would be gummed up trying to do this, to make your plan happen.

HOWARD: Well, you know, change is tough, but if we continue on the path that we're on with health care, we're going to bankrupt the country, and we're going to make ourselves uncompetitive with our competitors around the world. I want America to be in first place in the world, and we've got to get the health care thing working and a market system, or else we put ourselves at a disadvantage against the countries that we compete against.

HARRIS: Yes. I love that you're taking a stab at it. All ideas on the table, all in. Clark, good to see you, sir. Thanks for your time.

HOWARD: Thank you.

HARRIS: And you can see Clark Howard on HLN every Saturday and Sunday at noon and 4:00 p.m. Eastern. And just a reminder, you can get all the information and read the proposed health care bills, all of them, by going to CNN.com/healthcare.

All right, you've heard the shout-out. You've seen the reaction. But what's really behind the "lie" comment. We've just heard it was spontaneous. Our truth squad finds out. That's next.

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WILSON: It was spontaneous. It was when he stated, as he did, about not covering illegal aliens, when I knew we had those two amendments. And I say that respectfully. And we need to discuss the issues, and I'm happy to do that, and I'm going to run and go vote.

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HARRIS: OK. Let's bring in our Josh Levs for a little "Truth Squad" check. You heard the statement there from Representative Wilson.

JOSH LEVS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

HARRIS: And let's talk about it, Josh.

LEVS: Tony, we've got to start off by saying what you and I have talked about before, right? You have multiple bills in various stages.

HARRIS: Yes.

LEVS: So much of this is predictive. Fact-checking health care is never as clean-cut as either side out there claims it to be with some of these statements.

But we do have some really important facts. I can tell you most of what he was just talking about there. Let's start off with this.

You know, at the truth squad we have looked at this issue before. There's one bill that in general you find a lot of people pointing to. That's a House bill. And I'm going to show this to you right here. There is a point here where it specifically talks about subsidies, and it says, "Nothing here will allow federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully president -- present in the United States."

HARRIS: Yes.

LEVS: So, Mr. Obama and some of his defenders and others who like this plan say, wait a second. See, it specifically says this money cannot go to helping people who are illegally here. Now, you also heard Mr. Wilson there refer to this, which is the Congressional Research Service report. I have an important quote for you from there. There's a nonpartisan group -- I know it's tiny type. I can't change that.

But what they say here is that that House bill does not contain any restrictions on noncitizens participating in the exchange, whether they are here legally or illegally. Now, I want you to understand what this means, so let's get straight to this graphic.

There's this thing called an exchange, and part of what they're calling for under Obama's plan is that consumers would have this ability to take a look at this exchange and to choose whether they want this plan or to choose a plan through the exchange. Let's go to the next screen here. What you'll see here is that illegal immigrants, according to the Congressional Research Service, illegal immigrants would be able to buy under this plan.

But they are also saying that millions of illegal immigrants already do buy their own health insurance, Tony. So, when you take a look at this situation, you do have language that specifically says there's some things that would not apply to these illegal immigrants. But what you heard him refer to there is this broader issue, which is how do you enforce any of it, Tony?

And it is true that there were amendments that Democrats rejected. Republicans wanted tougher, stricter rules saying, you know, what, there's no way that they'll be able to get away with this, and Democrats rejected that. That's why you have this back and forth. How will it ultimately play out? We'll have to see.

HARRIS: All right, Josh. Appreciate it. Thank you.

LEVS: Thank you.

HARRIS: We are flying this hour and looking ahead to what we're working on in the next hour for CNN NEWSROOM.

President Obama's address on health care. We watched you watching the president, and we will get reaction from real folks on his ideas to revamp the nation's health care system.

And our Dr. Sanjay Gupta takes a ride with combat flight medics in Afghanistan. Each mission a critical effort to get the wounded to safety before it's too late. It's a story you don't want to miss, right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

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