Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Interview With Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders; Congressman Screams at President Obama

Aired September 10, 2009 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The reforms -- the reforms I am proposing would not apply to those who are here illegally.

REP. JOE WILSON (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: You lie.

(AUDIENCE BOOING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RICK SANCHEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Congressman Joe Wilson of South Carolina has made a name for himself, and for all the wrong reasons.

Today, Congressman Wilson has had some explaining to do because he screamed "You lie" at the president of the United States during a nationally televised address before a joint session of Congress.

As far as we have been able to tell, it has never happened before, at least not under those circumstances. Let me put it into perspective. It was an elected member of Congress aiming an insult president at the president of the United States in the otherwise majestic setting of a joint session.

And because of that, it is causing many members of his own party, mind you, to say enough is enough.

The first to comment, John McCain, who set the tone for all Republicans talking last night immediately after the speech to our own Larry King.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY KING, HOST, "LARRY KING LIVE": What did you make of that congressman doing that and your thoughts on that subject?

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: Totally disrespectful, no place for it in that setting or any other, and he should apologize immediately.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Let me continue to take you through this. Other Republicans are following McCain's lead. But you know who's reaping the biggest windfall from all of this, from this ill-advised and seemingly uncivil moment? Wilson's Democratic opponent, challenger Rob Miller.

Miller has raised $200,000 in donations since Wilson made that comment last night. So, today, a sweaty and seemingly anxious Congressman Joe Wilson addressed reporters. Here's the entire briefing for you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WILSON: Last night, I heard from the leadership that they wanted me to contact the White House and say that my statements were inappropriate. I did.

I'm very grateful that the White House, in talking with them, they indicated that they appreciated the call and that we needed to have a civil discussion about the health care issues. And I certainly agree with that.

And so I'm happy to discuss the health care issues and, in particular, on the issue which I think is very important of whether the bills cover, would include illegal aliens or not.

My background in that is that I was aware that there were two different amendments on the bill which would have provided for verification of persons having citizenship. One was in the Ways and Means Committee. One was on the Energy and Commerce Committee. And both of those were defeated overwhelmingly. They were almost party- line votes.

On one of the amendments, several Democrats actually voted with us. Also, the congressional resource services has indicated that, indeed, the bills that are before Congress would include illegal aliens. And I think this is wrong. We need to be discussing issues specifically to help the American people.

And that would not include illegal aliens. These -- these are people -- I'm for immigration, legal immigration. I have been an immigration attorney. But people who have come to our country and violated laws, we should not be providing full health care services.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: ... on the Internet that you tweeted something that was -- almost this was premeditated. How do you respond to that? Because your tweet did seem to say (OFF-MIKE) How do you respond to that?

WILSON: I will tell you this, that it was spontaneous. It was when he stated, as he did, about not covering illegal aliens, when I knew we had had those two amendments. And I say that respectfully, and we need to discuss the issues. And I'm happy to do that. And I'm going to run and go vote.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: By the way, Wilson says that he is sorry about his behavior. But, as you also heard him say, he's sticking to his guns about illegal immigrants being included in health care reform. Is he right?

I think it's important for you to know. Did the president of the United States then lie if he is right? We spent the entire day fact- checking this for you. And the fact is, what he is referring to is found in defeated amendments. Keyword here is defeated amendments.

So, now let me tell you what is still in the bill. Remember, that's his point of contention, that it's still in the bill, the exact wording of HR-3200 as it pertains to health care coverage and illegal immigrants. I'm going to take you through this. You ready?

Quote: "Nothing in the provision shall allow federal payments on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States." Did you hear that? "Not lawfully present in the United States," pure and simple. That is section 246 of HR-3200 that I just read you.

This is important stuff for all Americans. But let's cover all the bases. Let's make sure that we're being fair and balanced to him, given the assertion that he made again today. The bill's opponents like to point to Section 152, for example.

That provision reads -- and let me quote this there as well -- "All health care and related services covered by this act shall be provided without regard to personal characteristics. So, in other words, without regard to personal characteristics makes you think, aha, see, everybody's going to be covered. Coverage cannot be denied on the basis of personal characteristics, such as let's say race or your weight.

Race, yes. Weight, yes. Or maybe one's legal status, right? Wrong. Wrong. Why? We have checked. Because of this word, "except," which I'm about to read to you again, "except as otherwise permitted by this act," except as otherwise permitted by this act.

What's otherwise not permitted by this act? Well, that takes us back to Section 246. Let me read it to you again. It read, again, "Nothing shall allow federal payments on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States."

It's pretty clear stuff. Now, all the time, we do hear people raising well, what ifs? You know what? Good questions, including this one. I will give you an answer. Suppose you're an illegal immigrant living in the United States. Suddenly, you have an emergency. You got to go an emergency room, you're going to get some kind of treatment, right?

The president can't deny that those people are going to get treatment. Was he trying to suggest that yesterday? We have gone back in the files. Here's what we have found. This is President Obama was asked that very question by the way when he faced off with conservative radio host Michael Smerconish.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) OBAMA: Everybody who's listening out there, when you start hearing that somehow this is all designed to provide health insurance to illegal immigrants, that is simply not true and has never been the case.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: What is their fate, if I might ask? Because there's a 1986 law on the book that says, if show up at an E. R. , you've got to be treated?

OBAMA: Well, that will continue, because we don't want a situation in which some child, even if they're an illegal immigrant, shows up at an emergency room with tuberculosis, and nobody's giving them treatment, and then they're going back to the playground and playing next to our kids.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: So, in essence, anybody who shows up in an emergency room with a gaping hole is going to be treated through indigent care, just as they are right now, but that does not mean that that person is going to be covered with full benefits as being provided under this health care reform proposal.

You get that? It's not that hard to get, right?

Now, back to the issue of what Wilson did last night. We wanted to try and put this whole thing in perspective for you, because there's been a lot said. And we want to be full in our coverage.

So, let's use the British House of Commons, for example, because most of us have seen the rough-housing that goes on there, where politicians are encouraged to take on their prime minister. Here's an example.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Too much of prime minister's questions is taken up by the gladiatorial battle over those dispatch (INAUDIBLE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: There's booing. There's hissing. There's a little of this and a little of that.

And as rough and as different as that is from your system, I began wondering this morning in conjunction with the rest of our staff -- we had an argument about this -- what would happen, even under those circumstances? Let's say if someone there called the prime minister a liar. What would happen?

Well, we checked, went back in the books. Here's what we found that I also want to share with you. While members of parliament get away with accusing prime ministers of such things as having the sensibility of a sex-starved boa constrictor, at least one member of parliament was thrown out not once, but twice. This member of parliament that we checked actually called Margaret Thatcher a liar, was thrown out on the spot by the sergeant of arms, came back, called her a liar again, and was immediately dispatched once again. We thought all this information that I just related to you is something that all of us as Americans should know.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL DUVALL (R), CALIFORNIA STATE REPRESENTATIVE: She wears little eye-patch underwear. So, I call it eye patches. So, the other day she came here with her underwear, Thursday. And? So, we had made love Wednesday a lot!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: That is a California state representative. I don't know if you can tell what they're talking about. But the microphone is hot. He doesn't know the microphone is hot, or maybe he does.

Shouldn't we all know better at this point? And what's more, you will never believe who the woman is that he's talking about or what she does or what it has to do with how much money in this country is being spent by lobbyists to control what politicians do about our rights, about our country, about our policies. The numbers are astonishing.

Also, there's a case now before the Supreme Court that has everything to do with this that could completely wipe away decades of campaign finance regulation. What regulations, you say? What does that mean? That means political finance would become the Wild West, with money serving as the six-shooters. We're all over that and we will continue to be by the way.

And also I have got the most notorious celebrity blogger coming up. He's going to be sitting right here, right next to me. His name is Perez Hilton. And he's going to be joining us to talk about all things, including some very controversial items in the world of entertainment. This will be fun. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Lots of comments, as you might imagine, are coming in on this Joe Wilson, the congressman who made the -- the -- I suppose you could say certainly uncivil, since he's now copped to it, the uncivil remarks about the president of the United States during this speech to both sessions of Congress.

In fact, you're commenting about it. Let's go right to the Twitter board, if we possibly can, real quick.

"Joe Wilson should have been thrown out on the spot. He should resign."

And then we have got another one that comes in right underneath that one just while we were -- during the break. "Thanks for the answers on immigration and H.C. regarding lobbyist influence. That's why I trust the media more than the government to make a difference."

And we thank you for that.

All right, this is important. And it's exactly what we were just talking about. How much is our government beholden to us? And how much are they beholden to the people who try to influence them with campaign contributions in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, in the hundreds of thousands of dollars? And what about those who lobby them and take real good care of them?

In other words, who's got more juice with politicians, them or us? I don't care if you're on the left or if you're on the right. I have some numbers that we at CNN have come up with after doing some digging that will likely shock you. And I'm going to have that for you in just a minute.

But, before I do that, let me show tell just how beholden one California state assemblyman is to his lobbyists. Timing is everything with news stories. Here he is discussing, but not knowing that we're hearing him on camera, what he did with his lobbyist apparently the night before.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DUVALL: She wears little eye-patch underwear. So, I call it eye patches. So, the other day she came here with her underwear, Thursday. And? So, we had made love Wednesday a lot!

So, I have been getting into spanking her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are?

DUVALL: Yes, I liked it. I like spanking her. She goes, "I know you like spanking me."

I said, "Yes. That's because you're such a bad girl."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Yes, you heard it right. Assemblyman Mike Duvall bills himself as a family values Republican -- make that former assemblyman, since he's now resigned after that video came out where he's talking about -- well, you heard it -- doing what he did with his woman who is not his wife.

Again, the woman he was talking about are lobbyists. Both women that he's talking about are lobbyists. And one was lobbying him for a utility company. Duvall, who's married with two children, says what he did was inappropriate storytelling, in his words.

Today, by the way -- there's a caveat to this -- Duvall added to his apology on his Web site by saying that this does not necessarily mean that he's admitting to having an affair.

So, lobbyists and lawmakers in bed together, it's not a figure of speech. Let me keep this theme going, if we can. Question, who holds the power in Washington, you and me or the people who give politicians hundreds of thousands of dollars, literally, hundreds of thousands of dollars? I have got some of the numbers right here for you, as a matter of fact. I brought the documents, so that I can show them to you.

According to some of CNN's own accounting, more now during this health care debate than ever before has been spent. Vermont's Bernie Sanders joins me next because it's time that somebody starts talking about this. It's part of our breakthrough segment when we come back with Bernie Sanders.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We welcome you back.

You heard the president tell us what he wants health care reform to look like. But let me ask you a question. Does it really matter what the president wants it to look like? Or is it really more important what the health industry and lobbyists and even those who back the president, by the way, want it to look like? I'm serious.

I'm actually asking this question, whether the president's power is actually trumped by something that may be even more powerful than the president. And here's why I'm raising this question, numbers, numbers we did a story on yesterday here at CNN.com. You may have read this story. Or maybe it was below the radar because there was so much other more important stuff to talk about, this figure, this number, $375 million.

That's how much has been spent, mostly by the health and insurance industry, to influence this debate, to influence this important debate. It's on track to be the most money ever poured into any one issue in the history of our country at any given time.

Let me break this down for you even a little bit more. This is money mostly spent to stop reform in the last eight months, lobbying efforts, $280 million. Those are the closed-door meetings, the cocktail parties, the perks, large and small, $280 million.

Ads, we have all seen them, $75 million, and, by the way, those are ads on both sides, pro-reform, anti-reform, pro the president, Democrat, GOP. You have got it all there. Campaign donations, $23 million. You think they expect a return on that? You bet they do. And that's today's breakthrough.

Senator Bernie Sanders is an independent from Vermont who is convinced that politics has become way too corporatized, if not controlled.

Good afternoon, Senator.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: Good to be with you, Rick.

SANCHEZ: When someone gives you hundreds of thousands of dollars, they certainly wouldn't want anything in return, right? They have just got some extra money laying around... (CROSSTALK)

SANDERS: Absolutely, absolutely not. They're just interested in democracy and just want to help the democratic process. The idea that maybe they would get something for their money, I'm sure you will agree with me is the furthest possible things from their minds.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: Now, it's interesting. You and I can be tongue in cheek about this and have a lot of fun with it, but I hear Americans screaming over death panels, screaming over immigrant labor. But shouldn't they be also be just as angry, if not more so, about politicians that are getting all this money, which would make me think, why should you love me, if they're giving you all that money?

SANDERS: Well, Rick, you're absolutely right. And thank you for speaking about an issue that far few people do talk about.

Look, we pay the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs, far higher than any other country. You know why? Do you know why? Because the drug companies pour hundreds of millions of dollars into the political process. We're the only country in the industrialized world that does not provide health care for all of its people. You know why?

You're seeing it right now. Because the health industry, the drug companies, the hospitals, all of these organizations are making billions right now. They don't want us to touch their profits. And they're going to influence legislation.

SANCHEZ: And they do. Well, let's name names. Let me go through here. I went to a Web site I invite all of you at home to go to. It's called opensecrets.org.

Do you think that is a good Web site, Senator?

SANDERS: Yes, I do.

SANCHEZ: All right, we have got -- I pulled up three names. I pulled yours up, of course, as well. But let's go with three people who have been very much involved in this health care debate.

I have got Mitch McConnell, Republican, Max Baucus, Democrat, and Chuck Grassley. Let's look at how -- these are the people who are talking about this health care debate, right? Let's see how much money they have gotten from health care.

Let's start with Mr. Grassley over here, all right? Top five industries, health professionals have given him $222,000, insurance $184,000, pharmaceuticals $145 000, lobbyists $137,000, hospitals, nursing homes $137,000. Those are the top five people who have given him money.

Let's go over here to Mr. McConnell. Look at Mr. McConnell. Let's go to the page. OK. Again, this is the top five industries, industries that have given him money, securities and investment $1.16 million, lawyers $918,000.

But let's go down here to health professionals, $713,000. Those are two Republicans.

Here's the big brouhaha Democrat on this, not too far off, by the way, securities and investment, top five industries, $842,000, insurance $552,000, health professionals $497,000, pharmaceuticals $507,000.

Now, $507,000, that's a big nut for someone who is making decisions about how our health care is going to be run to be getting from someone who's very interested in how it's going to be run, isn't it?

SANDERS: Sure it is. And you're not adding into that equation the amount of the money that goes directly to both political parties.

SANCHEZ: Now, yours is -- let's just look at yours real quick here. I want to start doing this all the time. I think Americans need to know who's getting what and what are they then deciding on.

I got you here at top five industries, you got $435,000 from retired, $331,000 from Democratic liberal. I'm not sure what that means. You've got $138,000 from lawyers, $78,000 from transportation, and $75,000 from education.

You don't do as well as those other guys do, by the way.

SANDERS: No, I don't take corporate PACs. Most of that money came from organizations representing working people, representing consumer interests, representing senior citizens. I happen not to take corporate PAC money.

SANCHEZ: So, inform -- corporate PAC is something where corporations are allowed to give money to politicians as if they were persons. And the Supreme Court has said they can do so, right?

SANDERS: Yes.

Well, what we're looking at right now is a major case which if it -- my view, if it goes badly, it's going to open the floodgates for corporate money. This is not PAC money. This is money directly from the largest corporations in the world coming right in to the -- your television screen advertising and telling you who you should vote for. It would be a disaster.

SANCHEZ: But that's interesting, because the First Amendment says I have inalienable rights as a human being, as a citizen of the United States of America. And so do you.

What corporations are trying to argue is, well, they should have inalienable rights, too. They should be no different than John Doe, who's going to send his $10 or $20 or $100 to a politician. So, yesterday, Ted Olson, the former solicitor general under the Bush administration, argued before the Supreme Court. Here's a conversation. Here's a snippet. He's talking to Ruth Ginsburg, trying to convince her that corporations should be treated just like people. She's wondering if that's a good idea. Let's listen to this exchange. And then you and I will talk about it on the backside.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

RUTH BADER GINSBURG, SUPREME COURT JUSTICE: Mr. Olson, are you taking the position that there is no difference in the First Amendment rights of an individual? A corporation after all is not endowed by its creator with inalienable rights.

So, is there any distinction that Congress could draw between corporations and natural human beings for purposes of campaign finance?

THEODORE OLSON, FORMER U.S. SOLICITOR GENERAL: What the court has said in the First Amendment context, "New York Times" vs. Sullivan, and Rose Jean (ph) vs. Associated Press, and over and over again is that corporations are persons entitled to protection under the First Amendment.

(CROSSTALK)

GINSBURG: Would that include today's mega-corporations, where many of the investors may be foreign individuals or entities?

OLSON: The court in the past has made no distinction based upon the nature of the entity that might own a share of a corporation.

GINSBURG: Own many shares?

OLSON: Pardon?

GINSBURG: Own -- nowadays, there are foreign interests, even foreign governments, that own not one share, but a goodly number of shares.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: It just seems to me that what Olson is arguing is that a corporation, even if it's 95 percent owned by the Chinese communist government...

SANDERS: You got it.

SANCHEZ: ... has a right to the same things that I as a citizen of the United States have a right to? That doesn't seem right.

(CROSSTALK)

SANDERS: Yes, far more of a right, because unless CNN is paying you more than I think they are, these guys have hundreds of billions of dollars, and you have a lot less money. We are saying -- what Olson is really saying is, let's let the biggest, wealthiest, most powerful people in this country control the political process. That exists now. You described it now.

If this ruling, if this decision is overturned, and we do what Olson wants, you're just giving over our democracy to the most wealthy and powerful institutions in the world.

And this point about foreign interests, imagine that. All of these big corporations have significant holdings from Saudi Arabia, from China or other countries. Can you imagine these foreign influences over the political process in this country and what it will mean?

SANCHEZ: And it's interesting, because everything I read today seemed to indicate that because this is such a conservative court, they will probably rule for Ted Olson and for corporations in this case.

SANDERS: Rick, let me just add, people are shaking their heads at home. The answer -- and I know many people are not comfortable with this -- the answer, in my view, has got to be public funding of elections.

SANCHEZ: I think you make a great point. You know what, I want to pick up that part of the conversation. I'm going to stay on this thing. This show, this show, this little Sanchez show that we got here every from 3:00 to 4:00, this is a very important topic and we are dedicated to staying on this.

I want to get you back, maybe like a guy like Robert Wright or something. We're going to have a discussion about the possibility of public financing, and if that may end up being cheaper for you and me and other Americans.

Thank you, sir, for being --

SANDERS: A lot cheaper.

SANCHEZ: Thanks, thanks for coming on.

SANDERS: Thank you.

Bye, bye.

SANCHEZ: All right.

This school in Texas wouldn't let students see President Obama's address earlier this week. He said no, but now they're bussing those students to a stadium to listen to former President George W. Bush.

What do you think of that?

First, though, yesterday I translated live developing news for you about a plane hijacking in Mexico. Today, we have new pictures of the suspect and exactly what he said and what he did that caused this crisis to begin with.

You'll see the highlights. You'll see it all.

And, remember, we got an after show coming up today at 4:00 on cnn.com/live, and Perez Hilton is going to be here, and he and I are going to be talking about all kinds of stuff that he knows a heck of a lot more about than I do. The world of entertainment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back.

We've been looking at this story from yesterday. Remember when we were sitting here bringing you everything that was going on with this hijacking in Mexico? We've got information now, as we look at some of these pictures which were quite dramatic I imagine for the folks who were on board that plane. Here's who did this.

According to Mexican officials. This guy was a Bolivian pastor. Bolivian pastor, a former alcoholic and a drug addict. His name is Jose Flores. Or as we would say in this country, Jose Flores.

Investigators say that he told them that he received some kind of word from God because of 9/11, and the dates yesterday, 09/09/09, and that somehow God had told him that an earthquake was about to strike Mexico, and he needed to get that information to the president right away, and then so doing, threatened the pilot and the crew, and that's why they had to bring the plane down. It takes all kinds.

That's what he looks like, by the way.

Now this --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JEAN SCHMIDT (R), OHIO: Ma'am, ma'am --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He have no rights to be a president by --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, I don't think so.

SCHMIDT: Ma'am, ma'am, I agree with you. The courts do not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: I agree with you, the whisperer who revealed something about herself when she didn't think that we could hear.

Did I tell you that she also called this distinguished marine and combat veteran from Pennsylvania a coward?

Also Perez Hilton is going to be paying me an in-studio visit today to reveal what he knows about Ellen DeGeneres, about "American Idol" and about "La Loca."

Who's La Loca? (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Oh, boy, checking social media, and a lot of you guys are riles up today about a lot of the stories that we've been presenting you. We try and bring them to you as fairly and as balanced as we possibly can. Let's continue.

Welcome back, by the way. I'm Rick Sanchez right here in the world headquarters of CNN in Atlanta.

Much has been made about the schools and the parents who chose not to let their kids listen to President Obama recently. But there's a little twist on that. The entire school district in Arlington, Texas chose not to play the president's speech. Not to play the president's speech.

But guess what they're doing now?

They're bussing students to Cowboys Stadium to listen to, among others, former President George W. Bush.

Wayne Slater is a senior political writer for "The Dallas Morning News."

Good afternoon, Wayne.

WAYNE SLATER, SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER, DALLAS MORNING NEWS: Great to be with you, Rick.

Can you explain this to us? I mean to the rest of the country, who maybe don't speak Texan?

Well, you know, there is an official answer by the Arlington School Board, school district, and then there's the real answer. This is Bush country. And a lot of folks don't like Obama, and this district was timid about allowing the students to see Obama, but the idea that you could bus a bunch of kids to Cowboy Stadium, which is a kind of church here in Texas, to hear the former president who still is well-regarded in many parts of Texas and some other, I guess, some cowboy, I guess Dallas cowboy greats, legends, which I guess means folks who haven't been indicted yet or charged with anything, is the kind of field trip that is made in dreams here in Texas.

SANCHEZ: Well, I will tell you this, I will pay to listen to Tom Landry speak. I think he happens to be one of the greatest football coaches who ever lived. The guy is a legend.

SLATER: Yes, no question. And this is actually going to be, I think Roger Staubach and some others.

SANCHEZ: Another good one.

SLATER: Yes.

SANCHEZ: But the fact is, Barack Obama, love him or not, is the president right now of the United States. And by choosing to not let your kids listen to him, but then spend money and actually even endanger the kids by putting them on a bus and taking them across town to listen to a former president, to the rest of the country looks just like it's almost Machiavellian.

SLATER: It looks like what it is, Rick. And you know you wanted to say.

Look, nobody is criticizing the idea that George Bush, that students get a great field trip to see the former president and others, a great field trip. The question is the decision not to allow students in this school district to hear the president of the United States Live, it is appalling; it is extraordinary. We could never imagine this, certainly in recent years if John Kennedy were going to be on television, Richard Nixon, Ronald Reagan were going to be on.

I travelled with Bush a lot. George Bush as governor, as a candidate for president. We went to lots of schools. I guess that disrupted things. As president, you remember where George Bush was when the word came about 9/11. He was in a classroom, totally appropriate. The idea that a school district would say don't listen to this president tells you how polarized we are, how toxic our debate has become.

SANCHEZ: You make good points. And I thank you for them.

Wayne Slater as usual.

By the way, I'm going to go see a little football this week myself. I'm going to see mammoth playing Florida International University. So I suppose I should say to you, "Hook'em Horns?"

SLATER: Hook'em Horns.

SANCHEZ: There you go.

SLATER: Never see a good game. See you later.

SANCHEZ: Thanks. I appreciate it, Wayne.

SLATER: OK.

SANCHEZ: Sometimes a disaster is so impactful that all you have to do is show the pictures.

I'm going to do that next.

Flooding in Turkey. They are amazing. In narrative form or in non- narrative foam.

And remember, the after show, I'm going to have some guy named Perez Hilton on with me. He's going to sit right there, and everybody on our staff says he is quite the showman.

We'll see.

Stay with us. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: A lot of you are responding to that story I just told you about at the Arlington Independent School District. As a matter of fact, let's go to that if we possibly can. This is MySpace. This is Tosh. She's watching.

She says, "Well if my kid couldn't listen to the speech, could I not let him go on the field trip?"

We thank you for the question, Tosh.

We got some new pictures coming in to CNN now from Turkey. This is the major disaster.

Roger, let's roll it, if we can.

It's just amazing to watch what's left after one of these huge flash floods. It happened yesterday morning, suddenly smashing into a waterfront neighborhood.

All right, these are pretty boring pictures. I thought they were better than this, sorry.

Get this, at least 31 people according to reports are dead. And emergency crews had to rescue more than 1,000 people. That's the situation.

You know what? Let's just get rid of this. Let's go ahead and go to the tease if we possibly can, is it there?

The preacher who wants President Obama to die is back in the news, and congresswoman who calls a decorated marine a coward.

Oh, and wait until you hear what she says about the president. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: I brought you the story about the pastor who wants the president to die. Wait, sorry, he doesn't want the president to die. He says God wants the president to die, in case you were wondering.

Let's start folks with Stephen Anderson from Tempe, Arizona. He says he can tell us what God wants. And here is what he says he found out from God. He says, "God, wants Barack Obama's teeth knocked out." He also said, "God wants the president to have brain cancer."

That's just in the last week, by the way. Speaking of last week, we reported to you that Anderson was running what appeared to be a security business. Out of his church, guess what, we checked, the security business Web site, it's been taken down.

This Ohio congresswoman is also no fan of the president, but she's not supposed to let everybody know that. She also needs to understand that when you whisper near a microphone, we are still going to hear it. So when she tells a birther that she agrees that the president was born in Kenya, we now know a little bit more about her.

Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCHMIDT: Ma'am, ma'am --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He have no rights to be a president by --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, I don't think so.

SCHMIDT: Ma'am, ma'am, I agree with you. The courts do not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: I agree with you. Caveat time. Jean Schmidt of Ohio also once called Congressman John Murtha who's a decorated marine, who fought in Vietnam, she called him a coward. A coward.

You know the adage, "You can't take it with you?" Well, guess, what, you can. This man was so materialistic that he actually wanted to be buried in his car when he died. That's right. Not next to his wife, not next to his children, he wanted to be buried in his car. Why? Because he loved his car. And who wouldn't? It was a 1973 Pontiac. He loved it so much, he married it. Who knew?

That is Perez Hilton. The world's most notorious celebrity blogger. He's going to sit down with me in a couple of minutes. And most of you say you love him or you hate him.

Ellen DeGeneres and "American Idol," I know it's all the kind of stuff you never hear me say or talk about because, generally, I don't know much about it. But Perez is a Miami guy, and I promise we'd talk and we will.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: This is a virtual newscast. It's a national conversation, if you will.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Listen to this. This comes on Twitter.com/ricksanchezcnn.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: What do you mean by that?

TONY ALAMO: That means you are the antichrist. Sanchez, I wrote your name here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know what, that is not cool. That is not cool because my kids watch this show.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: No, no, no, Joe. You are no longer just Joe, private person.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rick, we both know who number two is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Who?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The biggest tent of all is the tent of freedom.

SANCHEZ: What the hell does that mean? I mean, the biggest tent is freedom.

Freedom?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JON STEWART, THE DAILY SHOW WITH JON STEWART: Sanchez!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: About a year ago, we created something new. It's the marriage of mainstream and new media. We call it the national conversation. And now we're taking it even a step farther.

I'm inviting any of you who wants to come here to Atlanta to visit us and become part of our show on the air to do so. It's first time we're announcing this. It's called "The V.I.P. Tour."

If you want to come here and hang out with us, call this number. It's 877-4cnn-tour. That's 877-4CNN-tour.

You'll actually be on TV. Like this guy is going to be on TV with me today.

There are so many people, even where I live, friends of my wife who say they can't get through the day without reading your blog. This is Perez Hilton. He calls himself the queen of all media.

PEREZ HILTON, MEDIA BLOGGER: That's Rick Sanchez!

SANCHEZ: The king or the prince.

We'll be right back. Stay right there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Welcome back. I'm Rick Sanchez.

And his name is Mario Armando Lavandeira.

HILTON: Junior.

SANCHEZ: Junior.

HILTON: I'm very proud of that.

SANCHEZ: Perez Hilton, thanks for being here.

HILTON: Thank you for having me.

SANCHEZ: You are a fascination for people all over this country. And I'm not sure how you did this. I want to talk about that a little bit.

But, first, take us through the stuff. You have this blog that's one of the most read blogs in the entire country. And all you talk is about entertainment. Like the latest news, for example. Ellen DeGeneres. She's going to be on "American Idol."

What do you got?

HILTON: I have some exclusive information. Actually, before they approached Ellen, "Idol" producers reached out to me and offered me the job, but I had to turn them down.

SANCHEZ: You're lying, aren't you?

HILTON: No. I wanted too much money.

I'm just --

SANCHEZ: Is this a freak thing. I mean, my wife was disappointed when she heard this news last month.

HILTON: I actually think it's a good thing because I think she deserves it. First of all, Ellen claims to have never missed an episode of "Idol." And she's kind of like the people's voice. Simon is the industry expert. Ellen is the people's person.

SANCHEZ: Is "American Idol" the fascination that it really is? I mean, or is this just a media creation. HILTON: It's going downhill every season. Naturally, it's falling off. But bringing Ellen on board will definitely be a big boost. And really smart, because she'll definitely be promoting it on her show as well.

SANCHEZ: In your blog you refer to somebody as La Loca, which, you know -- as you and I both know, you're from Miami, I'm from Miami. We're both Cubans. You're gay, I'm not.

HILTON: You're not?

SANCHEZ: Well, there you go. You made news.

HILTON: Breaking news.

SANCHEZ: Breaking news.

HILTON: But there's a lot of gay news people in miami. Shhh!!

SANCHEZ: Really?

HILTON: Oh, yes.

SANCHEZ: You'll have to name names later.

Who is La Loca that you always referred to. My producer says that you're not fond of her.

HILTON: Well, I am and I'm not at the same time. It's Lindsay Lohan, who, you know, in addition to being addicted to a lot of things in the past is still severely addicted to drama. She creates it, and is just engulfed in it. And I just don't like that in my own life. But I like talking about it when it's other people.

SANCHEZ: Did you get a lot of flak when you asked Miss California that question? I know we talked about this before. And there's a lot, you know, there's a lot of legs to this story. Let's start at the beginning.

HILTON: OK.

SANCHEZ: What made you decide to ask that very difficult question to answer, because it's a controversial issue?

HILTON: I thought it was an easy question.

SANCHEZ: Why?

HILTON: Because she could have --

SANCHEZ: What was the question again?

HILTON: The question was about, you know, gay marriage, and then states had been passing it little by little. And what her thoughts were on it.

SANCHEZ: OK. So it was an open-ended question?

HILTON: Yes, it was. She could have said, well, my personal opinions don't matter. Miss USA should represent all Americans. She could have given a bunch of different answers.

SANCHEZ: But instead?

HILTON: She gave an answer that revealed her naivety, let's say, calling it opposite marriage. And, you know, it wasn't worded very well. She alienated a lot of people.

SANCHEZ: Well, she did suggest that we already have choice in the United States. That's what she did. The only thing she did wrong other than giving her opinion.

HILTON: She didn't really articulate herself very well.

SANCHEZ: Well, she said, she said, you know what, as for me and my family, we don't think it's the right thing. But it's a good thing I live in a country where everyone has the choice to do what they want.

Well, actually, we don't live in a country where everyone has the choice to get married, right, if you're gay.

HILTON: Right.

SANCHEZ: Is that the problem you have with her?

HILTON: The problem is that her answer alienated me as a voter and as an American. And Miss U.S.A. should not be politically incorrect, which she said, well, I chose to be politically incorrect. Miss U.S.A. should be sensitive to everyone and all of their issues.

SANCHEZ: A Cuban guy who grows up in Miami, just like me, we're down to a minute before we start on "CNN.COMLIVE."

How does a guy like you end up in Los Angeles being the most read --

HILTON: Very simple.

SANCHEZ: What did you do?

HILTON: I've got to thank my parents, Mario and Teresita Lavandeira. It's the Cuban work ethic, Rick. And I'm here in Atlanta, because I have a tour. Everybody go to PerezHiltonPresents.com, I'm doing a tour. Some of my favorite musicians all over the U.S.

SANCHEZ: Where?

How do we do this, tonight?

HILTON: Tonight, it kicks off at The Variety Playhouse in Atlanta. I'm going all over the U.S. PerezHiltonPresents.com for more information.

SANCHEZ: That sounds like a wonderful thing to do.

HILTON: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: All right. Do me a favor.

HILTON: I'm not going anywhere.

SANCHEZ: No, no, just stay right there. I want you now before you and I go live, I want you to say, and here now in "THE SITUATION ROOM" is Wolf Blitzer.

HILTON: Oh, my goodness. Anderson Cooper is so jealous right now.

SANCHEZ: Go ahead, you're on.

HILTON: And here now in "THE SITUATION ROOM," it's Wolf Blitzer.

Woof! Woof!