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Senator Continues to Block Unemployment Benefits; Supreme Court Case Challenges Chicago Handgun Ban; Senator's Blockage of Bill Affects Medicare Reimbursements

Aired March 02, 2010 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Ali Velshi. For the next two hours, I'll be with you. I'm going to try and take every important issue that we cover and break it down for you. I'm going to try and give you a level of detail that will help you make important decisions about your voting, your spending, your safety and security.

Here's what I've got on the rundown for this afternoon. The senator for Kentucky -- from Kentucky not backing down. At this hour Democrats and Republicans want to get the jobless benefits that Jim Bunning blocked back on track. But are they really in much of a hurry? I've been drilling down on this for days now, and I'm not about to stop.

Also on the rundown, it could be one of the biggest tests of the Second Amendment in decades. You may think you have a constitutional right to carry a gun. But you don't in Chicago. Do local bans on handguns violate your rights? One man thinks so, and he's taking his case all the way to the Supreme Court.

And listen to this quote from the Occupational Self -- Safety and Health Administration. It followed a 2006 incident between a whale and a trainer at San Diego's SeaWorld. Quote, "Swimming with captive orcas is inherently dangerous, and if someone hasn't been killed already, it's only a matter of time," end quote. Did SeaWorld deliberately ignore warnings that its killer whales could kill?

Well, first, exactly 24 hours ago, I stood on this spot and told you a million unemployed Americans were facing a premature cutoff of federal benefits because one U.S. senator was taking a stand.

Today those benefits remain cut off. Some 2,000 federal transportation workers are still on furlough. Doctors are still facing deep cuts in Medicare payments, because one U.S. senator was taking a stand.

Democrats aren't exactly racing to end-run the objections of Kentucky Republican Jim Bunning and pass a one-month extension of jobless aid and other vital programs. But both sides are happy to vent, as you may have seen live here on CNN this morning.

I want you to listen to a pointed back-and-forth between the Republican senator, Bunning, and Democrat Senate majority leader Harry Reid on the subject of fiscal discipline. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JIM BUNNING (R), KENTUCKY: It's really hypocritical of the Democratic side of this aisle passing a pay-go bill. What does pay-go mean? It means you pay for the bills as they appear on the floor of the U.S. Senate. And then to present a bill that not only -- not only is not paid for, but just paid for a little bit.

SEN. HARRY REID (D-NV), MAJORITY LEADER: It's interesting that my friend would talk about pay-go. He voted against pay-go. He's talking about pay-go now. He voted against it. He voted against it right here on the Senate floor. If he so liked pay-go, why didn't you vote for it? He voted against it. The senator from Kentucky voted against pay-go.

It has no applicability to the jobs bill that passed, because it was paid for. The doc fix. He talks about having voted for it in committee. He voted against it here on the floor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELSHI: Now, let's just bring you up to speed on this. As you may remember, Bunning says he does not object to the unemployment benefits, the extension of those unemployment benefits. He just wants them paid for up front. He wants to know how these benefits are going to be paid for.

Democrats say this is emergency spending, and they want it passed by unanimous consent instead of a typical roll-call vote. This is what Bunning is objecting to. He's not giving that unanimous consent, which means either he's got to back down or the Democrats have to push this through the Senate.

Helping me break down the politics now and the real-world, real- people impact is senior -- CNN senior political analyst, Gloria Borger, joining me from Washington.

Gloria, two very specific issues culminating in one. The first one is that there are millions of Americans. There are 2,000 Department of Transportation workers and thousands of doctors, who are not getting something because Jim Bunning has chosen this legislation on which to make a point, that we can't just keep on spending without bringing money in. That's problem No. 1.

The problem No. 2 is the politics of it. But let's talk about problem No. 1. How is this playing out?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, look, I think Republicans are furious. I mean, I spoke with one senior Republican in the Senate today, who said, quote, "This plays right into the Democratic narrative that we're obstructionist."

Most of his colleagues want to get this legislation passed. And, you know, Republicans every Tuesday have a lunch in the Senate together. The Democrats have their own lunch. The Republicans have their own lunch. And I'd like to be a fly on the wall --

VELSHI: Right.

BORGER: -- in that lunch right now, because it's not going to be a lot of fun for Jim Bunning. They do not want to draw attention to this. They want to get it over, and they'd like him to be quiet.

VELSHI: How do they reconcile -- how do you think they reconcile the fact that -- and I've gotten a lot of e-mails and Facebook comments and Twitter comments from people who say Bunning is doing the right thing. He's drawing attention to a massive problem in this country, and that is spending without the revenue to match it.

BORGER: Right.

VELSHI: How are the Republicans, who in some cases believe in that concept, of dealing with the fact that they're getting unwanted attention because Bunning's digging in on what a lot of them think is the wrong topic.

BORGER: Well, they do -- they do believe in the concept. A lot of them believe in the concept, this pay as you go, in terms of the budget. I think the senator would like to take the money from the stimulus package. A lot of them would disagree with him on that. If he wants to do pay as you go, then perhaps he could have voted for it.

And also, perhaps say, "Well, here are seven alternatives about how we need to pay for this $10 billion. Let's say we don't use the stimulus package. Let's say we take it out of this defense program or take it out of something else." You know, so I think that Republicans feel that he's got the right idea, but it is the wrong fight for them to wage right now.

VELSHI: Right.

BORGER: They're making a lot of headway on issues like health care, and this kind of just sets them back into the same old, same old arguments that, quite frankly, they don't want to have right now.

VELSHI: Now, buried in all of this, Bunning says a few things that do resonate. Let's listen to what he said the majority should do if they don't like what he's doing. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN KARL, ABC NEWS: How long will this last? When will these people see their -- excuse me. When will these people expect to see their benefits? How long are you willing to keep this going on?

BUNNING: Until we get it settled.

KARL: And when do you think that will happen?

BUNNING: We're working on it.

KARL: Do you think it will be settled today?

BUNNING: Hopefully. KARL: And are you concerned about how this has played out?

BUNNING: No, no, I'm not concerned, except for the people.

KARL: And when will those people begin to see help?

BUNNING: As soon as possible.

KARL: OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELSHI: All right, so he's -- he's concerned about the people, which is where this discussion is about. We're talking about 11.5 million people who are getting jobless benefits right now. A population the size of Ohio.

Here's the issue. Jim Bunning says the majority leader, referring to Harry Reid, can do what he's done 25 times in the past five months, which means move this through the Senate in a traditional vote. Why are the Democrats not doing that? If this is such a serious issue, why don't they do that?

BORGER: He -- he could call for a so-called cloture vote right now, and he would probably get, you know, 70 or 80 votes in the Senate for that.

But in the Democratic political side, you know, you look at them, and they say, "Well, gee, let's milk this a little bit." Whatever they're going to do, though, Ali, we should tell people out there that they will get their benefits, because whatever they do, it's going to be retroactive.

VELSHI: OK, that's good to know.

BORGER: So that if you're missing a few days now --

VELSHI: Right.

BORGER: -- then whatever the Senate passes, whether it's a long- term extension or a short-term extension, it will be retroactive, so they will not miss a day of their benefits.

VELSHI: Do the Democrats risk getting into the trouble that Bunning is getting into --

BORGER: Sure.

VELSHI: -- digging in on something because they're making a point?

BORGER: Yes, yes. And I think, you know, everything is a matter of timing but I -- you know, I wonder what's going on in that Republican Caucus right now.

Jim Bunning, even before this happened, I should tell you -- the Senate is a small club.

VELSHI: Right.

BORGER: Even before this happened, this senator said to me, Jim Bunning was not very much beloved in the Senate.

VELSHI: Right.

BORGER: And so there are a lot of folks up there, up for re- election, who really don't want this kind of an issue. So, I think certainly by the end of the week we're going to have some kind of resolution on this. It's just a question of who blinks first.

VELSHI: Your town is never boring. Gloria Borger, senior CNN political correspondent. Always helping us --

BORGER: Tedious.

VELSHI: -- understand. Yes, well, it's interesting. Keeps us going.

BORGER: Tedious sometimes. Yes.

VELSHI: Thank you so much, Gloria.

All right. The Supreme Court bites the bullet and wades into another Second Amendment case. At issue now, Chicago's very strict handgun ban. We'll have a report for you next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Gun rights is such a loaded issue in this country. Today, the Supreme Court is taking up a huge Second Amendment case, McDonald v. Chicago. It targets the city's 28-year-old handgun ban, one of the most restrictive in the country. The people behind the case hope to build on the Supreme Court's 2008 decision that overturned Washington, D.C.'s, handgun ban. There, if you recall, the court ruled that individual citizens, not just militias, have the right to bear arms.

But D.C. is not like other cities, because it's under federal jurisdiction, meaning that that Supreme Court reeling -- ruling didn't settle things anywhere else when it comes to cities like Chicago that have their own handgun ban.

So here we are. The lead counsel in the Chicago case, by the way, is the same guy who won in D.C. His main plaintiff is a retired grandfather, a liberal Democrat, who's got two legal registered shotguns but says in Chicago, that's not enough.

Let's get more on him, and the other side of this case, from CNN's Kate Bolduan. She joins us live from Washington.

Hi, Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey there, Ali. Well, you said it. This is one of the most important gun-rights cases, possibly in our nation's history, and oral arguments were today. And while this puts the spotlight squarely on Chicago, this case could affect states, cities and people across the country.

Here's a little bit of background on what this case is about.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN (voice-over): -- beyond Chicago.

In one of Chicago's roughest Southside neighborhoods, a rare safe haven for some of the city's most at-risk youth.

DIANE LATIKER, COMMUNITY ACTIVIST: They walk looking backwards. If you would stay here two days, you realize our young people walk looking backwards at every car because of drive-bys.

BOLDUAN: When Diane Latiker opened up her own home to start the nonprofit Kids off the Block, seven years ago, she was fighting to stem the tide of gang activity in her neighborhood.

LATIKER: What's up, dude?

BOLDUAN: Now, Latiker says that she's just fighting to keep the kids alive, up against some of the worst gun violence the city has ever seen.

And it has grabbed headlines. According to city statistics, Chicago has the highest rate of youth homicide in the country: 36 killings in the last school year alone. Thirty-six reasons Latiker supports Chicago's handgun ban.

(on camera) So, why have the ban in place if people are going to get them anyway?

LATIKER: Because I would rather something be in place than nothing be in place.

BOLDUAN (voice-over): That ban is now being challenged in a case that's made its way to the Supreme Court, a case brought by another Chicago community activist, 76-year-old Otis McDonald.

OTIS MCDONALD, COMMUNITY ACTIVIST: We wouldn't want to go down to the right here.

BOLDUAN (on camera): Why's that?

MCDONALD: Because that's a hot area.

BOLDUAN: Hot meaning?

MCDONALD: Pretty (ph) like that.

BOLDUAN: Dangerous a little bit.

MCDONALD: Well, with the drug dealing and stuff that goes on.

BOLDUAN (voice-over): McDonald says, like Latiker, he, too, fears for the safety of the community but argues it's his constitutional right to protect himself and his family against the violence. He wants the handgun ban lifted.

MCDONALD: That's all I want, is just a fighting chance. Give me the opportunity to at least make somebody else think about something before they come in my house on me.

BOLDUAN (on camera): The Supreme Court almost two years ago struck down a similar ban in Washington, but because D.C. is a federal district, the court left largely unanswered how gun laws apply to states and cities.

When it comes down to it, why take on this ban?

MCDONALD: We're in a war, simple as that. The innocent, law- abiding citizens against the drug dealers and gang-bangers. That's -- that's what it is. That's what it boils down to.

BOLDUAN (voice-over): But Diane Latiker fears making handguns legal again will only mean more guns on the streets and more names she'll have to add to this memorial.

(on camera) How many are in there now?

LATIKER: Two hundred and one.

BOLDUAN: And you said you were -- there's five more (ph)?

LATIKER: We're always behind. We're always behind.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: Now, the court's ruling has the potential of overturning decades of gun-control laws, really, across the country. And, Ali, it may finally answer the question -- and this is a big question -- where does the power of the Second Amendment lie? With the individual or with the government?

VELSHI: Right. And, again, some people thought that was answered in that D.C. ruling, but clearly, it wasn't.

The court is not open to cameras. But you were there. Did you get some sense of where this is going?

BOLDUAN: Yes, when you're in the courtroom, because cameras aren't there, you have to understand that these are very smart people, lawyers and the Supreme Court justices, and they get very much into the weeds, into some very complex legal and constitutional issues that I will leave to people much smarter than I am.

But bottom line, when you left the courtroom today, you really -- it does look very much like the Chicago handgun ban is in trouble of being struck down. But the real question going forward is how far will the court go in doing that?

One extreme could be that the justices would say -- could say any gun for anyone at any time is OK. Unlikely that is going to happen, because it seems that there was agreement in the courtroom that reasonable restrictions and regulations on guns is a good thing. So, that question, though, and that will be battled out in courtrooms across the country for years to come.

VELSHI: You know, this issue -- I mean, Chicago is, as you know, one of my favorite cities and it's a great place.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

VELSHI: And this business of the issue of violence really came up during the Olympic bid. This is a real problem for Chicago.

Did you talk to Otis about wouldn't the effort be greater to really try and clamp down on the availability of guns and the enforcement of that? He really thinks that the best fighting chance is for a whole bunch of people to have guns so that -- so that robbers and thugs don't try and attack them. It's an interesting way of looking at it.

BOLDUAN: It is interesting. And I did push him on it. I said, "Well, isn't just having more guns, doesn't that just mean more guns on the street?" I mean, it's an obvious question.

He says in the short term he wants to be able -- for people to at least think before they approach his home, that maybe that person has some of their own protection.

He clearly agrees that there -- that's not a long-term solution.

VELSHI: Right.

BOLDUAN: That there needs to be some serious community, he thinks, ground-up work to really work at the core of what's going on in Chicago, with how much violence there is. But he thinks this is his right and a short-term solution.

VELSHI: Great. Great to see you today, Kate. We don't see you enough on this show.

BOLDUAN: I know.

VELSHI: Let's try and make it a little more regular.

BOLDUAN: Yes, please.

VELSHI: Kate Bolduan for us in Washington.

All right. When we come back, Christine Romans is going to join me. She's going to talk to us a little bit more about this whole situation with Jim Bunning and a matter that we haven't had as much coverage on: health care, Medicare. Jim Bunning's decision is affecting whether some doctors will actually take Medicare. With us when we come back, Christine Romans. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: OK. We've been talking about Jim Bunning, the senator from Kentucky who blocked a move to get unemployment benefits extended for months to people whose unemployment benefits were running out.

Christine Romans is my co-anchor on "YOUR $$$$$." We -- we do that show together on the weekend. She's with me now, because, Christine, there were -- there were really three elements affected by Bunning's decision.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: Sure.

VELSHI: One was unemployment. We're talking a lot about that. Another was the -- the furloughing of 2,000 transportation workers, Department of Transportation workers. And the third one is payments to doctors, Medicare payments to doctors. Tell us about that one.

ROMANS: Well, you heard Senator Harry Reid call it the doc fix.

VELSHI: Yes.

ROMANS: "If he was for the doc fix, why didn't he vote for it here? He says he voted for it in committee."

But the doc fix, what this is, this was a measure to fix what would have been a 21 percent cut in reimbursement for doctors for Medicare. And, in fact, that went effect technically on Monday. Doctors will be paid 21 percent less, reimbursed 21 percent less, for their Medicare costs.

Forty-three million people receive Medicare coverage, Ali, so that means you've got senior citizens organizations, you've got consumer advocates who are very, very concerned about doctors simply dumping patients after maybe giving them a little bit of warning, but saying, "We're not going to be able to take Medicare patients anymore." And there, in fact, already are anecdotes, at least, of that beginning to happen.

The AMA actually advising doctors on whether it makes sense for them or not to keep getting Medicare reimbursements. So, this means that you could find out that your doctor, if you are on Medicare, your doctor is going to stop taking Medicare.

VELSHI: Wow.

ROMANS: Because in some cases, Ali, in some specialties, these doctors are saying that they simply can't stay in business --

VELSHI: Right.

ROMANS: -- with some of these reimbursement rates.

So, look, if your doctor drops Medicare, I just want to quickly tell you what to do, because there are a lot of seniors who are looking at this and saying, "What does this mean for me?"

Ask for a referral. Your doctor probably will give you a referral. Your doctor is probably going to give you four, six, eight weeks time, as well. They're not going to abandon you right away, and there are laws against a doctor just dumping you on the spot. You might -- some of these people, until they figure this out, might have to go to urgent care centers or the emergency room. Ali, we know that that is not the ideal --

VELSHI: No, that's part of the problem.

ROMANS: -- solution, especially for chronic diseases.

VELSHI: You need treatment.

ROMANS: Yes. And -- and even retail clinics, you know, this is someplace else, you know -- a fantastic story on CNNmoney.com about this. And they advise people, if you have to go to a retail clinic, sometimes they can cost a little bit less. The retail clinics are not places for people -- for seniors, in particular, with chronic illnesses that have to be monitored to be taken care of.

VELSHI: Yes.

ROMANS: So this is something that -- that medical professionals and patients are quite worried about. And it seems to be something that's caught up in politics.

Ali, I will point out one last thing. We're told that the federal agencies are slowing things down a bit, if you will, in -- in -- in paperwork and the like, because they are trying to figure out a way to stall.

VELSHI: Right. Until this --

ROMANS: -- until the Senate, in their view, can handle it.

VELSHI: Because we are -- we are trying to figure out how this is going to end. Jim Bunning, moments ago, we had tape of him on CNN saying his legislative director is looking for a fix to his solution. He's at lunch with the Republican senators, many of whom are saying this can't continue.

So, that's an interesting point, that they're just trying to slow down implementation of anything, because this will probably get solved in the next few days, we hope.

ROMANS: You know, and Ali, let me ask you. Do you think Jim Bunning has ever been more well known today than any time since he played baseball?

VELSHI: Not even -- I'm not sure he was so well known when he was a Hall of Famer. This is -- the whole country knows Jim Bunning right now.

Christine, great to see you. And by the way, you can see -- ROMANS: For a guy who is retiring, he certainly is --

VELSHI: He's making waves.

ROMANS: -- he's more in the news today in an election year for someone who's not running for re-election. You're right.

VELSHI: That's absolutely right.

You can watch Christine and me both, by the way, on "YOUR $$$$$" Saturdays at 1 p.m. Eastern and Sundays at 3 p.m. Eastern.

Let me give you a quick check of the headlines that we're following right now.

General Motors is recalling 1.3 million Chevrolet and Pontiac compacts to fix power steering problems. The recall affects models sold in the United States, Canada, and Mexico. GM says the cars are safe to drive but may be harder to steer when traveling under 15 miles an hour.

In Chile, President Michelle Bachelet is threatening to crack down on looters in the aftermath of the earthquake that killed more than 700 people. She says the looting in the hard-hit city of Concepcion and other areas is intolerable. She says all emergency measures should be in place by today.

In Texas, voters are casting ballots in the Republican primary race for governor, between incumbent Rick Perry and U.S. Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison. Fellow Republican Debra Medina, a favorite among many Tea Party voters, could gain enough votes to force a runoff. If that happens, the top two finishers would face off on April the 13th.

And on Capitol Hill, Republican Senator Jim Bunning of Kentucky has done it again, blocking the Senate from extending unemployment benefits to millions of jobless Americans. Bunning today rejected a request by fellow Republicans to pass a 30-day extension of jobless benefits, but he tells CNN he is involved in talks to help end the stalemate.

We're taking a quick break here. When we come back, shopping for a medical procedure, can you actually do it? Does the same procedure cost more place -- more at some places than it does at others? Elizabeth Cohen goes shopping, and you won't believe what she's found.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: OK. You normally know what the weather is going to be by this time of the week for the weekend. What is it now? It's Tuesday, and we've got -- we've got bad weather in the southeast right now.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes.

VELSHI: Chad, what's it looking like? What are we looking at now and what are we looking at in the next few days? MYERS: Well, we've already got 250 Delta departure cancellations out of Atlanta, because of what really should be called the Flurry of 2010. Because, look. Look at all the flurries in the skies. Oh, my gosh. People in Atlanta are panicked; there's no bread to be found. I'm just kidding. It's not that bad.

Actually, we're used to it this time. This time of year, typically it would only be our first snow.

VELSHI: Right.

MYERS: After two or three snows it gets a little bit better. People don't panic quite as much, and they have all that bread leftover from the last time.

Two to four inches across Greenville and I guess Sony (ph) and maybe even toward Charlotte, mainly up toward Asheville, Asheville, North Carolina. A beautiful sight right now. Enjoy it while you can. Just be safe driving in it, because after sunset tonight, that's when the roads are all going to ice up very rapidly.

VELSHI: And you said you've got cancellations at Delta. We've heard AirTran has cancellations out of Atlanta. We've been following those story of those airline cancellations very closely. For those people who are traveling, go to those Web sites, because they've got all those rules about who can reschedule and who can change things.

MYERS: Yes, yes.

VELSHI: Chad, thanks very much. We'll stay on top of that with you.

VELSHI: Let's talk about medical procedures. Elizabeth Cohen has been talking to us about the varying and different costs of different medical procedures. You generally know how much you're going to pay for something, but how do you actually go and shop for a medical procedure?

Elizabeth, this is part of your series that you've got, a new series for us. Yesterday, I mean, the number of responses we had to your story about the difference in the price of Tylenol or a toothbrush that I would pay for, versus a medical procedure. Now you've actually gotten a little deeper in to medical procedures.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Right, because you would think if you got a colonoscopy between hospital A and hospital B, it would cost about the same, but what I found out is that is not always the case.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

COHEN (on camera): Here in Concord, New Hampshire, like any place, when you go shopping, you can do price comparisons, whether you're looking for a car or a pair of shoes. But what I think people here, or anywhere else, fail to realize is that you can also go comparison shopping for health care services and save yourself thousands of dollars.

So, come on. Let's go bargain shopping for a colonoscopy.

Our first stop is Southern New Hampshire Medical Center. They charge nearly $5,000 for a colonoscopy. Let's see if we can get a better deal. Come on.

Here at the Concord Ambulatory Surgery Center, a colonoscopy would only cost me about $2,800. Now, remember, the most expensive place to get a colonoscopy would set me back nearly $5,000, so by coming here I save more than $2,000. See, it pays to bargain shop.

I'm so excited about how well I did with the colonoscopies, that now I'm going to go bargain shopping for a hernia surgery.

Here at St. Joseph's Hospital, they charge $13,400 to repair a hernia. That is so expensive, I'm not even getting out of the car. I'm going to try to find something cheaper.

At Elliot Hospital, they only charge about $4,500 to do a hernia repair. It's the exact same procedure. Why does it cost $9,000 less here?

I'm going to call these high-priced hospitals and ask them, why do you charge so much?

Hi, this is Elizabeth Cohen calling from CNN.

(voice-over): The hospitals wouldn't comment.

So I found someone who can explain these crazy health care prices to us. Her name is Heather Staples, and she analyzes prices of health care for large employers in New Hampshire.

I go shopping for a gallon of milk, and there's a huge price difference, I'm going to see it right there on the shelf. But with medical services people don't know. There's no price tag.

HEATHER STAPLES, CONSULTANT, NEW HAMPSHIRE PURCHASERS GROUP: That's correct. And it's even difficult for consumers to call a facility and ask for the price of services.

COHEN: So it's actually -- the reason for these discrepancies in some ways is pretty simple, which is just that when you go buy a colonoscopy, there's no price tag on it.

STAPLES: That's correct.

COHEN: Give me another example of a procedure where there's wild differences all in the same city.

STAPLES: Sure. The knee scope at Dartmouth South, it's about $5,300. In the same region, at St. Joseph's Hospital, it's about $10,500.

COHEN: So, we all bargain shop for cars and things like that. Does it pay to bargain shop for medical services?

STAPLES: Oh, it absolutely does. I mean, we're talking about a $5,000 difference. It absolutely makes a lot of sense to do it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: All right, if you're talking about a $5,000 difference in a procedure like that, times are tough, you may just take that one. How do we compare quality?

COHEN: What's interesting is price doesn't really correlate with quality. There you see Dartmouth, which is one of the best hospitals in the country, has the lower price. It was $5,000 cheaper at Dartmouth. That should tell you something. These are prices for folks who do not have insurance. If you have insurance, it will be different. Right.

VELSHI: How easy was it to get those prices, those complete prices for surgery, a colonoscopy, the hernia surgery?

COHEN: Right. That is an excellent question. In New Hampshire, it's easy, because they have a Web site. The state of New Hampshire puts up a Web site. In Massachusetts, it's easy. In most other states, it's tough. You have to call the places, and it's difficult to do, I know, I tried it. If you're insured, call your insurance company. You can have wildly different prices even if you're insured, but your insurance company should help guide you.

VELSHI: Is it a question I can ask my doctor or my doctor's --

COHEN: They won't know. Likely, they won't know.

VELSHI: All right. Buyer beware. It's worth making some of those calls.

COHEN: Absolutely, $5,000, you better believe it.

VELSHI: Incredible. We're loving this. Thanks so much, Elizabeth. Good to see you.

All right. She's making history and working to make a difference. In a moment, we'll talk to Rosalyn Brock. She's the youngest chairman of the NAACP.

(COMMERICIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: All right. The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, known as the NAACP, is the nation's oldest and largest and most widely recognized grassroots-based civil rights organization. And the backbone of this group, women.

Since the NAACP's creation in 1909, women have played a pivotal role. Mary White Ovington, daughter of an abolitionist, was the organization's first female chairman from 1919 to 1934. Margaret Bush Wilson was the second female chair, but she was elected -- she was the first elected to the position. The first woman elected to the position, that was 1975. In 1984, Enolia McMillan became the first female elected president of the NAACP. That's a position that is separate from the chairmanship. And in 1995, Meierly Evers Williams was elected the third female chair of the organization.

Today, we're honored to have the fourth female chair of the NAACP, joining us from Washington, Roslyn Brock. Roslyn, thank you very much for joining us and congratulations.

ROSLYN BROCK, CHAIR, NAACP: Thanks, Ali.

VELSHI: We've talked a little bit in the last few months about the NAACP. It's 100 years old, and it sort of has to look at a new mission now. What is the new mission? What are you going to try to achieve as the head of the NAACP?

BROCK: Really, the mission of the NAACP will remain as it was when we started the organization over 101 years ago. The NAACP's mission is still relevant today. We don't live in a postracial society. However, we do recognize that America has made significant strides as it relates to race and ends discrimination in our nation. But for 101 years, we've been on the battlefield trying to ensure equal opportunity and access and dignity and justice for all Americans.

VELSHI: Now, we have sort of a different problem today in that it may not be as closely centered on inequality, but there is inequality, at least economically. We see this in the unemployment numbers and the affect of the recession particularly on African- Americans. Is there some role the NAACP can have in that?

BROCK: Absolutely. We are right now in the process of working with our board of directors in our units across the country to design strategic policy statements legislation to move forward an aggressive agenda to deal with issues Americans have on their minds today. How can I go to work when I'm not feeling well? How can I find a doctor? And, most importantly, do I have to make the decision to pay my mortgage, my rent or a pay-day lender?

No one in American society should have to choose between prosperity and debt --

VELSHI: I'm sorry, go ahead.

The NAACP -- the NAACP is still alive and well and vibrant in our community.

VELSHI: What role does it play? What does it do, though, in answering those questions? Because you've identified the questions that so many people have. I guess my question is, how does it stay relevant in these tough times? When people are having these problems, do they think I'm going to the NAACP, or is there a program in the community that's sponsored by them? What role do you have in those debates?

BROCK: The NAACP has a myriad of programs. We ask individuals who are interested in knowing what we're doing to text NAACP, 62227, to find out what we've been doing. We're on the forefront on issues as it relates to credit card protection laws, the mortgage foreclosure. So, the NAACP is on the front line, and we're looking to make our policies, our programs, and our politics, more relevant for a new generation of civil and human rights advocates.

VELSHI: And relevant is a question that we all struggle with these days. You're the youngest chairman of the NAACP. How do you appeal to a younger generation who, while you make very clear we're not in a postracial world, they may see things differently than somebody growing up in the '60s or the '70s?

BROCK: We have a 37-year-old president and CEO, and we're utilizing, and we're exploiting the value proposition of what makes our organization relevant. So, we're reaching out through various social marketing media, through YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, and blogs, to reach out to a new generation and to those who have been stalwart members of our organization to ask them a question, what do you need from us? And how do we get you to be a strong advocate on behalf of issues most important to you? So, we're excited about what the new century affords for us and the new energy we're capturing as it relates to this transitional leadership.

VELSHI: All right, so, I'm taking away, new century, but same mission. Just tweaking it a little bit to make it more relevant.

BROCK: Absolutely.

VELSHI: Great to -- great to talk to you. Roslyn Brock is the chairman of the NAACP's board of directors, joining me now.

By the way, I mispronounced Mrs. Evers Williams name, it was Merlie Evers Williams who was, I believe, the president of the NAACP -- she was a chair --

BROCK: She was a chairman of the board in the NAACP.

VELSHI: That's right. OK. The chairman of the board of the NAACP back in 1995, she was elected there. She was the third female chairman. Thank you very much, Roslyn. Great to talk to you.

BROCK: Thanks, Ali.

VELSHI: Listen, when we come back, I'm staffing the Stimulus Desk today. The president is visiting Savannah, Georgia, right now. So, I'm going to check in on Savannah and the area around it. I'll going to find out where your stimulus dollars are going to projects there. Stay with us.

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VELSHI: All right. I'm staffing the Stimulus Desk today. The president is in Savannah, Georgia, right now. He was speaking a little earlier talking about jobs. I want to tell you about some money, stimulus money, that's going in to -- in to Georgia. First story I want to tell you about is the Moody's Air Force new child development center. It's under construction right now. Let's just take a look at it.

It's taken -- this is the center, this is the it looks like groundbreaking of it. It's using $10 million in stimulus money. Six construction workers are involved so far, and when it's done, it's going to accommodate 276 children and about 100 staffers. So, that's $10 million worth of stimulus money in the Savannah area.

I want to take, show you another picture -- actually, that might have been it. No, let's just take -- no different picture. Different project. This one is the Youth Build program. It targets high school dropouts. $792,000 in stimulus money.

Let me just tell you. This is an interesting one. These students build homes in the morning, and then they study in the afternoon. So, it's trying to get them back in to studying, but they are doing something sort of useful in the morning, building homes. Right now, they've built three homes, that's $792,000 in stimulus money. It's two projects the president has going on in the Savannah area. That's where the president is today.

When we come back, we'll update you on what's going on in Washington right now. All eyes are on Senator Jim Bunning of Kentucky and his decision to hold up an extension of unemployment benefits to -- up to 1 million people to make the point that government has to stop spending money that it can't pay for. Stop spending on projects that it hasn't otherwise paid for.

When we come back, I'm going to bring you an update on the latest in that story.

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VELSHI: Let's get a check on top stories.

In D.C., a man who refuses to budge so far, Republican Senator Jim Bunning of Kentucky. He's, again, blocking the Senate from extending unemployment benefits for the jobless. He does tell CNN he's involved in talks aiming at -- aimed at ending the stalemate.

Well, your mail carrier works through rain and slow -- and snow and heat, but maybe not through the weekend. The post office is renewing its effort to drop Saturday delivery in an effort to fend off a projected $7 billion loss this year. Another idea on the table, raising postal rates. That's new.

And in Afghanistan, the government is banning news organizations from covering insurgent attacks, as they occur, saying the coverage is unknowingly helping the Taliban. Afghanistan's national security office issued the ban yesterday. It prevents reporting from the site of an attack until security forces give the green light.

And it's billed as the Great Gathering. It's the summit of the nation's three largest African-American Methodist churches. They are seeking long-standing solutions to long-standing problems. Our Don Lemon joins us live from Columbia straight ahead.

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VELSHI: All right. They are calling it the Great Gathering. It is a summit of the nation's three largest black Methodist churches taking place right now in Columbia, South Carolina, and the people participating? Well, the African-Methodist Episcopal Church, the AME; the African-Methodist Episcopal Zion, AME Zion; and the Christian Methodist Episcopal, CME. The focus: seeking solutions to the serious problems facing African-American men, including the large numbers black males in prison and low school graduation rate among black males and black-on-black crime.

Don Lemon is covering it for us. He's in Columbia, South Carolina, and he joins us live. Don, good to see you. First of all, tell us a bit about this. Is this big? Successful? We are right in the middle of it, and are they getting some stuff done?

DON LEMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, here is the thing. We don't know -- it is big. Five million members nationwide, but obviously, five million members aren't all here. It's about 400,000 or 500,000 members. So, we'll see if they can come up with solutions.

But they know it is a big problem, and Ali, you and I have been talking about this and everyone has been talking about it for awhile. This plight that has been facing African-American men, especially. That is why this came about, but I want you to listen to something that Marion Wright Edelman, who is head of the Children's Defense Fund, what she said. She said, this is the worst crisis facing African-American community since slavery.

VELSHI: Wow.

LEMON: And then went on to talk about this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARIAN WRIGHT EDELMAN, PRESIDENT, CHILDREN'S DEFENSE FUND: We have over 80 percent of black children in 4th, 8th and 12th grade who cannot read or compute in grade level. And if you cannot read or compute in this globalizing economy, you are sentenced to social economic death.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: National security crisis, according to Dr. Cornel West, Ali. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CORNEL WEST, PRINCETON UNIVERSITY: We need to cast a limelight on the plight, a limelight on the predicament and recognize it is a state of emergency and a matter of national security. Look at the prisoner complex, you look at the feeble families and the weak communities, bullets flowing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELSHI: That is tough words there.

LEMON: Yes, Ali. There are tough words and let's talk about why the church? Why -- how can they do something it seems Washington cannot do, the NAACP can't do, the National Urban League, how can they do it? They said that the church was once the backbone of the African-American community, and they want to make it happen again, because that is where they believe the strength is and the solution is, Ali.

VELSHI: Don -- so, okay. Cornel West talked about it being a national security issue, because he said that guns and feeble families he is talking at. But the reality though, is that change comes in many cases with a younger generation, a younger generation that studies increasingly show don't turn to the church. They don't look to the church for their solutions, so how do you square that?

LEMON: Well, I don't know if that is the sort of right attitude to have, and the people here don't believe that is right attitude to have, because athletes and singer/entertainers are not necessarily role models just because people see them on television all of the time.

I spoke about this with the person who is heading this, Reverend Staccato Powell. He's from an AME church in Raleigh, North Carolina. And we talked about celebrities and athletes not necessarily being role models and why it should be brought back to the community. Look, Ali.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: We have always said that athletes and role models should be, but that is not true, because they can have skills or can sing well or play a guitar or throw a basketball, but it does not mean that they have the skills that should be transposed on to a role model?

REV. STACCATO POWELL, CHAIRMAN, THE GREAT GATHERING: And obviously, that means they don't have good character, either. You know what I mean? So, we have to let them know that we are looking at the people who have demonstrated character and values that can be transmitted.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: What does that mean, Ali? It means they are going to get role models to be in touch with, professors like Cornel West. People like you in communities where you care where these young men can go to and have actual, tangible people rather than looking up on television and saying, my role model is a basketball player. Doesn't have anything to do with you. That's what they're going to do. It is all about creating connections so that people can --

VELSHI: That is valid. There are churches all over the place and in communities, and if they can make it a place for people to have one-on-one contact. All right, Don --

LEMON: -- universities and community centers, and on and on. Thank you, Ali.

VELSHI: Good to see you, my friend. Don Lemon, he's going incognito in Columbia, South Carolina. That's why he is wearing glasses. He doesn't want people running up to him getting autographs and stuff like that.

(LAUGHTER)

VELSHI: Don Lemon in Columbia, South Carolina.

All right. Did SeaWorld ignore warnings about its killer whales? Our Randi Kaye investigates when we come back.

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