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Poland Mourns President; Pres. Obama Hosts Security Summit; Confederate History Lap; Tea Party Express: Behind the Scenes; Mickelson Won the Masters
Aired April 11, 2010 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, global leaders are in Washington to meet with our president. Who in a bold statement is vowing to rid the world of nuclear weapons. Is it a promise Mr. Obama can fulfill?
A high-ranking Republican takes a Confederate History Month proclamation to a whole new level, saying it doesn't amount to diddling. Democrats have something to say about that, and so does one African-American Civil War reenactor. He is standing up tonight for his confederate pride.
And also tonight, a rare view from inside the tea parties. Are they racist? A man who kept the camera rolling after the big rallies shows us what they're really like, and what they're really saying.
Personal drama overshadows golf at The Masters. And we're not talking about who you think. The winner of today's Masters has his own issues. It's what you'll be talking about with friends and co- workers tomorrow.
Good evening, everyone. Warsaw tonight is a see of flowers and candles. Tens of thousands of Poles have turned out to mourn the loss of their president and first lady who died Friday in a plane crash in Russia. Nearly 100 other Polish dignitaries were also killed. President Lech Kaczynski's body was returned to Warsaw today.
And Secretary of State Hillary Clinton visited the Polish embassy earlier this evening to sign the condolence book. She took the Polish ambassador there today, and she talked to Americans about mourning the loss of the Polish people.
The investigation into the tragedy is just getting under way, and CNN's senior international correspondent, Nic Robertson, visited the debris-filled crash site.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I'm about half a mile from the runway here. It's in this direction through the trees here, and look down here. Debris, twisted and torn apart. Fuselage from the Tupolev 154. And up here across the road, take a look, is the direction the plane was coming in, over this way, coming in across this road here, and this is where it begins to hit the tops of the trees again. And if you look down this bank here, you begin to see all these bits of broken wood from the trees where the plane is beginning to hit as it's coming down. Here's another bit of torn fuselage on the ground. And already, some flowers being laid here. And if you look over here, larger bits of aircraft laying around in the field. And already, people, reporters picking through it. You can see through the trees here. Police as well trying to secure the site and the large tail fin of the aircraft.
But, again, just follow me up here and you can begin to see just the scale and the force with which the plane hit the trees. This is the size of some of the debris here, and this seems to be a part from a wing. You can see that the force of the crash has just broken it away, sheered away from these large mountains. And you can see as well the tree here, just large boughs of tree ripped apart. And looking up at the top, you can really see how the plane cut into them.
And what the investigators are going to focus on are the black box recorders. They say they're still looking at the possibility of human error, the possibility of bad weather. Of course, it's clear visibility now, but when the crash happened 24 hours ago, it was thick fog, and also saying there's the possibility that it could have been mechanical errors. They're not ruling out any of those things right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: That was CNN international correspondent, Nic Robertson.
Now to the big story here in the United States. Not since the birth of the atomic age, 1945, the year of Hiroshima, has a U.S. president hosted a gathering this big. And if President Obama is successful in this two-day Nuclear Security Summit, it could change the future of world warfare. One without the threat of nuclear weapons. Global leaders started arriving late today, and tonight CNN's White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux joins us with what to expect when the summit starts tomorrow.
Suzanne, the president says he wants to get rid of nuclear weapons. That's a tall order.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's a very ambitious goal, but the president feels that he is making some real concrete steps forward. And one of the things, Don, that is happening, is unprecedented scale and scope to have this kind of Nuclear Security Summit. We saw the president today meeting one-on- one with some key leaders and some nuclear powerhouses, if you will. India as well as Pakistan, the leaders of Kazakhstan, Nigeria and South Africa.
And what the president has made clear today as well as the secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, is that the threat is no longer the threat of a nuclear war, when it was back in the cold war days. It is now the threat of nuclear terrorism. The possibility of a terrorist organization like al Qaeda or a criminal gang getting a hold of these nuclear materials and using it to build a bomb and to attack the rest of the world. This is how President Obama put it earlier today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If there was ever a detonation in New York City or London or Johannesburg, the ramifications economically, politically and from a security perspective would be devastating. And we know that organizations like al Qaeda are in the process of trying to secure nuclear weapons or, rather, weapons of mass destruction, and would have no compunction at using them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: So, Don, the president is trying to create a sense of urgency here with these other world leaders that this has to be handled and handled very quickly. He is giving a timetable here. The goal here is to try to secure those nuclear materials, vulnerable nuclear materials, those loose nukes, as he calls them, within the next four years. And what we expect out of this summit is for these world leaders to sign a document, a communique saying, yes, this is a serious threat, nuclear terrorism. They endorse President Obama's plan, and that they have some plans of their own to tackle this -- Don?
LEMON: Suzanne Malveaux at the White House tonight.
Thank you, Suzanne.
The governor of Virginia's comments on CNN about confederate history month ignite a firestorm, but he seems to have at least one supporter among his ranks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CANDY CROWLEY, HOST, STATE OF THE UNION: There's a sort of feeling that this is insensitive, but you clearly don't agree.
GOV. HALEY BARBOUR (R), MISSISSIPPI: To me, it's the sort of feeling that it's a nit, that it is not significant, that it's not -- he's trying to make a big deal out of something that doesn't amount to diddly.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour now in the middle of this debate. What else did he have to say? You'll hear it here on CNN.
And we'll talk to a few confederate reenactors. What do they think of this controversy?
And CNN political editor Mark Preston.
Hey, Mark.
Coming to you in just a few minutes for a big preview of the coming Supreme Court nomination battle. Mark, will join us in just a bit.
Also, time for you to weigh in. Make sure you log on to the social networking sites. We will get your comments on the air.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Mississippi's governor is weighing in over the dustup over Confederate History Month. Virginia Governor Bob McDonald got into hot water when he designated April as Confederate History Month without any mention of slavery. He later apologized. But on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION," Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour called the controversy overblown.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROWLEY: Virginia governor -- New Virginia Governor, Bob McDonald, designated April as confederate month, something that his two Democratic predecessors had refrained from doing. This caused quite a stir, particularly because the governor did not even mention slavery in this proclamation.
Was that a mistake?
BARBOUR: Well, I don't think so. My state legislature has made a legislatively enacted holiday, Confederate Memorial Day. Have done it for years under Republican governors and Democratic governors, and for seven years as governor, I have issued a proclamation, because of what the legislature has done. My Democratic predecessors did so as well. I don't know what you would say about slavery, but anybody that thinks that you have to explain to people that slavery is a bad thing, I think goes without saying.
CROWLEY: There's the sort of feeling that it's insensitive. But you clearly don't agree.
BARBOUR: To me, it's the sort of feeling that it's a nit, that it is not significant, that it's not a -- that he's trying to make a big deal out of something that doesn't amount to diddly.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Doesn't amount to diddly. Barbour is already catching flak for those comments. The Democratic National Committee issued a statement saying slavery is a big deal, and Barbour is defending the indefensible. Straight ahead, we'll hear from a whole panel of civil war reenactors to hear what they think about this controversy.
But, right now, we're going to run the story by CNN political editor, Mark Preston.
Mark, this is getting really political now. It's gone from a blue and gray issue to an issue about red states or, I don't understand why it's becoming political. What is political about this? What is left and right about this issue?
MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICAL EDITOR: You know, Don, it really comes down to politics, right? I mean, whatever you talk about race, you have to be very careful about how you put it in the context you put it. Now if you listen to what Governor Barbour said right there, he said that, look, why should we -- why do we have to explain how bad slavery is? We all know that it was terrible. However, when you use words such "nit," that's when Democrats were able to seize upon that.
And, of course, we saw the Democratic National Committee come out today, Don, and take a really hard swing at Governor Barbour. Now, what I've been told, Don, is that we should expect more in the coming days from Democrats. They plan to try to hit Haley Barbour very hard on this issue. And the reason being, we're going into the midterm elections. Haley Barbour oversees all of the electoral efforts on behalf of Republican governors, and, Don, he's a potential 2012 candidate.
LEMON: Listen, I mean, you know, are there any really political winners in this battle? Can you win politically with this? It doesn't seem like it?
PRESTON: No, it doesn't seem like it, but, you know, again, race is one of those issues. Whenever you tie it to politics, it becomes a very tough issue to deal with. You know, we see this in every election year. Something like this is blown up. And then when we get down to Election Day, we always hear about race. We always hear about getting out the black vote. You know, so race has become such an important part of politics.
LEMON: It's unfortunate, because when you talk about this confederate thing, it's really not about left or right or about Republican, Democrat, it's about common sense, for the most part I should say.
Let's move on, though. Let's talk now about the retiring justice, John Paul Stevens. He announced his retirement on Friday.
What are you hearing about the president's list of replacements tonight, Mark?
PRESTON: Well, Don, of course, he already has a list that was already made, right? Because he just put a justice on the bench just a year ago, Sonia Sotomayor. So he already has a list created. We do know on the list that several of them could be appellate court judges, such as Diane Wood is one. Judge Merrick Garland is another. And his solicitor general, Elena Kagan, as well, is on that list. We suspect that he is looking at. Now, in addition to that, could there be somebody outside the box, Don -- could there be somebody like a governor from Michigan, Granholm. A governor for Massachusetts --
LEMON: What about secretary of state?
PRESTON: Yes. Well, you know, we haven't heard her name floated around, Don, but you know, it's something you and I kind of laugh about, but, you know, there's a lot of truth to that. You know, why wouldn't Hillary Clinton be on the short list? Now, perhaps he thinks that Hillary Clinton is more valuable to him right now as secretary of state, but certainly she should get some consideration. LEMON: All right, Mark Preston, thank you, sir. Always good to have you on.
PRESTON: Thanks, Don.
LEMON: Would you pay more to bring a carry-on on the plane than it costs to buy an airline ticket?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've lowered our fares by $40 or more, and the fee to carry the bag on is either $20 or $30. So you bring the bag and you're still going to save around $10. You don't bring the bag, and you save $40 or more. So that's why we say it's cheaper.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Well, tonight, you're going to hear from the head of Spirit Airlines who is defending the new fee.
Also ahead tonight, a return trip to the top of the leader board at Augusta. It's another green jacket for Phil Mickelson.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Now to the stories you'll be hearing a lot about in the week ahead, from the White House to Capitol Hill to entertainment. We start tonight at the White House.
DAN LOTHIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Dan Lothian at the White House. Two summits for the president this week. One focused on nuclear weapons, the other on space. On Monday and Tuesday, 47 nations will be taking part in the White House's Nuclear Security Summit here in Washington. President Obama says the goal is for these leaders to commit to a process of eventually, quote, "securing all vulnerable nuclear materials around the world within four years."
Then on Thursday, the president heads to Florida, where he will attend a space summit. The focus there will be on the future of the country's space program.
SANDRA ENDO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I'm Sandra Endo in Washington. This week Congress will be back in session, voting on another extension to unemployment benefits, which already ran out last week for hundreds of thousands of out-of-work Americans.
The Senate Judiciary Committee is also gearing up to grill Attorney General Eric Holder on everything from terrorism policy, closing down Guantanamo Bay Prison, to the 9/11 trials.
And the posturing will begin over possible nominees to replace retiring Supreme Court Justice, John Paul Stevens.
A.J. Hammer, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT's" A.J. Hammer, and it's a big week for Tiger Woods. After The Masters, will he be able to put his cheating scandal behind him? And Russell Crowe gets his star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, Monday. Remember, "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT" is now live at 5:00 p.m. Eastern, Monday through Friday, and again seven days a week. You can see us at 11:00 p.m. Eastern and Pacific.
LEMON: All right, what's happening domestically and internationally? We start with our national desk here and Jess Jordan.
Jess, on Monday, what's going on with Ben Roethlisberger?
JESSICA JORDAN, CNN NATIONAL DESK: We're expecting a news conference where they'll announce if they are going to file charges or not. That will be about 2:00.
LEMON: And we've been hearing a lot about the big tax day for tea parties. That's also next week on Monday. What's going on?
JORDAN: The Tea Party Express starts in Buffalo and goes Monday and Tuesday in New York, and then moves on towards D.C.
LEMON: All right. Jess Jordan, thank you very much.
And Christine Theodorou, I just like saying the name, from the international desk.
The First Lady, is she going to Mexico?
CHRISTINE THEODOROU, CNN INTERNATIONAL DESK: She is. She's going to Mexico on Tuesday. This is her first official international trip that she's going out on alone, and she's going to focus on developing youth leadership. And her advisers are telling us that this is going to be part of President Obama's broader vision on global engagement in the United States. It's really exciting.
LEMON: OK, real quickly, what is Red Shirt Protest, what is that in Thailand?
THEODOROU: A group of demonstrators have been growing over the past month. They wear red clothing, that's why everyone's calling them The Red Shirts. But the demonstrations are basically calling for Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva to dissolve parliament and call for new elections. These demonstrations have gotten pretty violent over the weekend, because they clashed with high security forces resulting in 21 deaths, over 800 people injured, and they're growing more and more bold by the day and defiant, and they are seriously challenging the government.
LEMON: Christine, we have seen that video, and it is violent clashes and violent protests.
THEODOROU: It is.
LEMON: We'll be watching that, internationally.
Thanks so much, Jess and Christine for domestic and international stories.
So let me ask you this. When was the last time you saw an African-American man defending the confederacy?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a great thing that the governor of Virginia do it when he declared Confederate History Month, because now we have an opportunity to tell the southern side, which was never told.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Why he's standing behind the controversial confederate history month.
Also tonight on CNN, a security camera becomes a witness to Mexico's drug war. Another view of the nightmare people there are living and dying.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: A huge controversy rising out of Virginia this past week over a war that ended 145 years ago. Governor Bob McDonnell declared April Confederate History month, but left out any mention of slavery in his proclamation. Civil Rights groups blasted him for it, accusing him of twisting history. President Obama called it an unacceptable omission, and it really fired up CNN political analyst, Roland Martin.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROLAND MARTIN, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: These were American terrorists. These were individuals who were committing a scene against humanity, who wanted to keep the system of oppression, degradation, and absolute denial of opportunities for African- Americans.
We're celebrating people, and had they won, Don, you and I would not be sitting here right now. You and I would be in the fields right now, as property as opposed to being free individuals. And so that's like somebody saying, oh, we're going to celebrate the Nazi soldiers by saying, well, they were only doing their job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. That was CNN's Roland Martin. So confederate history month is going on in a number of southern states, and it is prime-time for reenactors who want to bring the battlefield back to life.
And we've got a whole panel of Johnny Revs joining us right now. Tim and Lisa Knight are here with me in Atlanta, and there's H.K. Edgerton, he is live in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Good to see all of you. Don't be nervous. We're just talking. People want to hear from all of you. So thank you very much. What do you guys think about the controversy that's going on with the governor and with the proclamation?
LISA KNIGHT, CONFEDERATE REENACTOR: As far as the state of Georgia's concerned, the proclamation here is to celebrate the confederate heritage month. That's representing everybody who was a part of it, both, you know, whites, African-Americans, Hispanics, Indians. It's not just representing one particular culture. I don't understand exactly as far as Virginia portions of it, about leaving out slavery, but as far as the state of Georgia is concerned, it represents everybody who participated during that event.
LEMON: Do you feel the same way, Lisa?
L. KNIGHT: I understand that it's a very hot-button topic. It's something that strikes a nerve with many people, but it's not something that should be demonized or that should be excluded as part of our history, because it is very much part of our history. And it's the only time where we fought internally, where we had strife of that type. And I think that if we're not careful and don't honor that, and don't think through that and we shuffle it under the rug, then we're neglecting part of our American heritage.
LEMON: As a southerner, believe me, I get southern pride, but do you understand what the civil war means to, especially African- Americans, who were, you know, slaves during that time, and for them and for the people in the north, and I guess in the south, that's what the war was about, to end slavery, and the south did not want to end that.
Do you get that?
T. KNIGHT: I understand that part, but there are a lot of things that our history books, and they leave out. It's not just strictly over the issue of slavery. 93,000 African-Americans participated on the side of the confederacy. You know, they don't bring that up.
LEMON: Those people participated, but they were not necessarily willing participants.
(CROSSTALK)
L. KNIGHT: No, these were --
LEMON: And by the time African-Americans could join the confederacy, join the army, it was too late. It was 1865. So they weren't considered enough of a person to even join the army, to be allowed to join the army and fight in the war.
T. KNIGHT: Well, it's in between 10,000 and 15,000 actually carried arms.
LEMON: Let's bring in H.K. Edgerton now. Again, he is in Charlotte, North Carolina.
H.K., you would know about this because this is what you do. What do you say to this, about African-Americans, especially the slavery part of it. Because you can understand, a lot of people don't like this celebration, because to them it means slavery. They feel that they would be slaves had the south won.
H.K. EDGERTON, CONFEDERATE REENACTOR: Well, now, let's back up some of this. First of all, I would like to talk about, you know, some of the things that Mr. Martin talked about. You know, he called the honorable people in the south, with some of the most honorable people in this country American terrorists. And said that if the south had won the war, we'd be in the fields now. That's just poppycock, and that's just playing on the feelings of people who just want to say slavery and end all dialogue. It is a great thing that the governor of Virginia did it when he declared Confederate History Month, because now we have the opportunity to tell the southern side, which is never told, with the advent of industrial revolution.
And, you know, I'm very surprised in Virginia, because in Virginia, up until the days of the war, those men in the legislatures of Virginia working very hard to try to figure out a way to get real emancipation to that slave. They knew, white folks in the south knew that a man was not free unless he had an ability to take care of himself, unless he had land, a home for shelter and some money, and possibly some slaves of his own.
You know, I resent the fact that this man, like -- I don't know whether Mr. Martin is from the north or where he's from, but it's the same virtuosity that these folks give to the north, that virtuosity does belong in that.
LEMON: Listen, I know Roland, I believe Roland is from the south. And I don't want you to take it too literally. I think what Roland meant was, had the south won, that African-Americans would not be in the same position that they are now, at least when it comes to -- hang on, let me finish. I let you talk, and I'll give you time, at least when it comes to civil rights. Because that's what the civil war was about.
The south, let's just be honest, did not want slavery to end and that was their main focus for the civil war. And that's when succession came about. They wanted to secede, to secede from the union if slavery was abolished. That's what civil war was about.
EDGERTON: No, sir. I absolutely, totally disagree with you because, first of all, let's talk about some real evidence.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Now listen, hang on, hang on, let me ask you this question.
EDGERTON: You said what you had to say.
LEMON: I know, let me talk. I let you talk for a long time, Mr. Edgerton, and I'll give you your choice. Am I to believe the history book, that what I've read about, what the history books say, what every other historian says, my own ears and my own eyes, or am I to believe what you say and what civil war reenactors say.
EDGERTON: Well, let's just go with that. Let's just talk about that. Let's talk about the establishment of the public school system in 1865, and how the northern school teachers came here to demonize and divide and separate black folks and white folks in the south. But more importantly, let's talk about Abraham Lincoln and his court amendment.
If the southern men wanted to maintain the economic institution of slavery, they would have went along with Lincoln's support of the court amendment. And basically what Lincoln said is that if the south would agree to the tax increases that the north was proposing, that Congress would never have the ability to write an amendment to end the economic institution of slavery.
LEMON: OK, right there, hang on a second.
(CROSSTALK)
EDGERTON: No, no, no, let me finish my though.
LEMON: I'm not cutting you off, because I need to get my point in; I'm cutting you off because I need to take a break, and then we'll come back and we'll discuss more.
We're back in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Welcome back, everyone, to our conversation. Virginia's governor opened up some old wounds by declaring April Confederate History Month and leaving slavery out of the equation.
We have been talking with a panel of three civil war reenactors, Tim and Lisa Knight, they're here in Atlanta, and then H.K. Edgerton joins us by satellite.
OK, I'm sorry, I had to take a break there. You were saying?
H.K. EDGERTON, CONFEDERATE REENACTOR: Are you talking to me, sir?
LEMON: Yes.
EDGERTON: Well, here's the thing about it, having Confederate History Month and talking about leaving out slavery. The thing about it is when you have Confederate History Month and we start talking about the kinds of things that took place around here in America, you can't leave out slavery. You have to talk about the place of honor and dignity, that Africans being free to eventually earn, under the Christian cross of St. Andrew. I'm talking about the Confederate flag.
Hollywood don't tell this story. Other folks don't tell this story. And it's one of the reasons why you need to have Confederate History Month. My question is, why are these folks afraid to have the Southern side told. They don't want to tell you about these things. We talk about black history month. I don't know how you can separate black history from Confederate history in the first place.
LEMON: OK. Can I get in here now please?
EDGERTON: Yes.
LEMON: OK. I don't think people -- I don't think people think that it shouldn't be taught in history books or people shouldn't learn about Confederate history.
I think there is a concern when people -- when you celebrate -- when it is believed that people are celebrating Confederate history, because when you celebrate that, you are -- it's an insult to African- Americans, an insult to people who were slaves when one of the main reasons, although you don't believe it was the whole reason, one of the main reasons behind the war was to keep people enslaved. And that's why people think it's insulting.
Black history month is one month out of the year. Go ahead.
EDGERTON: Well, are you still talking to me?
LEMON: Yes. I'm still talking to you.
EDGERTON: OK. Listen, that's another sad part about this thing. The propriety of all these folks, including black folks, who presumed to assume that that slave somehow was just a man, all he did was to pick cotton and beans and sugarcane. He was a very intelligent man. This man could do everything.
LEMON: OK, Mr. Edgerton. Anyway, let's bring back -- I can't let you go on with that because that part is going to upset me when you talk about slavery.
No one wants to be a slave, black, white or whatever.
EDGERTON: I never said that.
LEMON: No one wants to be a slave. And you talk about the intelligence, that's besides the point. To have someone enslaved, to own someone and control someone. It doesn't matter how smart they are, you still own and control them. They're not free. So I don't get your point on that one. I don't know.
(CROSSTALK)
EDGERTON: I'm not talking about them.
LEMON: I want to bring these guys, Lisa and Tim again. And the reason -- I don't think anyone is saying, even Roland, anyone is saying, that we should not learn about the confederacy and not learn about the history of this country. I understand that. I'm a Southerner. I grew up in the South, so I know what it's about. But you don't understand that it's insulting and hurtful to some people when you celebrate this type of event? Go ahead.
LISA KNIGHT, CONFEDERATE REENACTOR: I think your choice of the word "celebrate" is a slanted word. I think we are -- our goal is to educate. We are not celebrating an atrocity where hundreds of thousands of Americans on both sides were killed.
LEMON: All right. Even a -- even a proclamation. Maybe you're right to celebrate. But even a proclamation, some people are still insulted by that.
L. KNIGHT: I'm not sure why that would be because any major conflict, any time where American blood was spilled, that would be something for us to note, something for us to reflect on and say this was something that happened that was significant.
For us to celebrate, no. And that's not what we do, but we do educate. We do relive. We do pull people in and help them understand as much as we can what really happened.
LEMON: So, here's the question. Here's what I think. It should be in the history books and it is. I learned about it in school. And it's in the history books all the way up from elementary schools on up to college. You get the history of this country and you know about slavery.
Having a proclamation, I think, and the whole time to learn about it when you don't include slavery and denouncing slavery, are you saying that we should have had slaves? Do you believe that we should have had slaves? Do you believe that slavery should exist in our country?
TIM KNIGHT, CONFEDERATE REENACTOR: I don't believe slavery should exist anywhere in the world. It still does. But the simple fact of the matter, I'm not trying to, you know, state anybody who owned slaves, they are right or wrong. But for 200 years ago to 2,000 years ago, slavery was a part of the -- not just this country, but every nation on the planet.
LEMON: I absolutely agree with that.
L. KNIGHT: And there were African-American slave owners in the South.
LEMON: Right.
L. KNIGHT: So, it's not a black-white issue. I mean, yes, slavery as an institution is an abomination. We all agree on that and we're not celebrating the institution of slavery.
LEMON: Are there in your group -- are there black reenactors in your group?
L. KNIGHT: Not currently. But we've had --
T. KNIGHT: Not currently. We've had three different members.
L. KNIGHT: But on our roster right now, we don't currently have any. We only have about 40 people on the roster.
LEMON: OK. So, Mr. Edgerton, I'm going to ask you the same question I asked them. Do you think that there should be slavery in this country? Do you agree with slavery?
EDGERTON: Absolutely not. I'm not here to defend the economic institution of slavery. What I am here defending is the fact that you want to take history and paint one side of --
LEMON: No, no, not me. I don't want to paint history anything. I'm just here facilitating the conversation.
EDGERTON: When I say you, I don't mean you personally. What I'm instead is saying is that folks in America -- you see, the North owes the Southern people -- done a great injustice here. The whole world was complicit in the economic institution of slavery. Nobody talked about those Africans who went into my grand mama's village and snatched her out from her mother's arms and put her on the shores of West Africa and put her into slavery. Those Africans were just as guilty. New York, you are --
LEMON: Mr. Edgerton, Mr. Edgerton, I have to go because of time purposes. We only have a few minutes left on the air and there are other things that we have to do. So, I appreciate this and maybe if we can get you back, we'll continue this discussion.
But I also learned about Africa's role in slavery in elementary school, and I'm not that young, it's back in the '70s. So, I disagree with you that we are not taught about that. That's in the history books and we talked about it for.
Thank you all for joining us. And again, as I have said and I think as Roland has said, everyone has the right to protest, to celebrate, to reenact, to do what they want, but to leave out one part of it is disingenuous.
L. KNIGHT: And we would agree with you on that.
T. KNIGHT: I disagree.
LEMON: Thank you, thank you.
T. KNIGHT: I disagree, too.
LEMON: I appreciate -- I appreciate you all joining us.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
And thanks to those guys for joining us.
Very passionate opinions there from people who still love the stars and bars.
You won't see activists, and author Tim Wise putting on a gray uniform, even though his southern roots run deep. His new book, "Color Blind: The Rise of Post Racial Politics and The Retreat from Racial Equality" is coming out in just a few weeks. He says Confederate History Month is a major step backwards. Here's part of a conversation I had with him yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: There are people who are writing me now who are saying, you need to go back and learn history. Slavery was not a point in the civil war. It had nothing to do with it.
TIM WISE, AUTHOR, "COLORBLIND": That's absolutely preposterous. If you look at the declaration of causes that were issued by the states who left the Union, every single time that they explained their decision, they said that the reason, not one of the, but the reason was the fear that the federal government under Lincoln was going to abolish slavery.
That's what they believed. They were worried, for example, that they would not be able to have slaves in the newly acquired territories to the West that had been taken after the war with Mexico. That was the sticking point.
In fact, the vice presidency of the Confederacy Alexander Stevens stood up and said, right after Lincoln was elected, that all the other issues had been resolved. The trade issues, the tariff issues, the tax issues, they have all been resolved. The only remaining factor, according to the vice president of the Confederate government, was the institution of African slavery, which I should point out he said was a wonderful, moral and God-ordained system of government.
For anyone to want to commemorate the Confederacy when its own leaders said that that's what it stood for is an abomination.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Tim Wise, thank you.
The civil war still dividing the country 145 years after we surrendered. It's a conversation that's not going away, and we're going to keep following it for you on this program, so make sure you stay tuned.
If you think carry-on baggage is a cheaper way to fly, your wallet may be in for a rude jolt. The CEO of Spirit Airlines explains why you can fly cheap, but your luggage, well, it pays the full price.
And Phil Mickelson, a golfer who has faced his own personal drama this past year is this year's Masters champion. His emotional victory speech straight ahead here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Want to check your top stories right now. In West Virginia, efforts are under way to ventilate the coal mine where an explosion killed 29 miners last Monday. The blast destroyed the mine's ventilation system, hampering efforts to remove the bodies of 22 miners. Officials estimate it will be two days before all the bodies are recovered. President Obama has urged a thorough investigation into the cause of the explosion.
Shocking surveillance video out of Mexico shows what appears to be drug cartel hit men carrying out a contract in broad daylight. The men are seen opening fire on nearby cars and housing complexes with assault rifles. Eight people were killed in the shooting spree, including a 14-year-old girl. The shootings took place last month, but the video was just released to CNN this weekend. Prosecutors say it is important evidence in their investigation.
One U.S. senator says a fee for carry-on luggage is a slap in the face of air travelers. Spirit Airlines announced this week it will begin charging up to $45 for a carry-on bag. The decision has sparked outrage among some passengers. Last night I spoke with Spirit's CEO Ben Baldanze about the fee. He said it's not as bad as it appears.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEN BALDANZE, SPIRIT AIRLINES: The basic fee to carry on the bag after August 1st is $30, $20 if you're a member of our fare club. The $45 fee is for anyone who decides not to stop at a kiosk at the airport or the ticket counter and go to the gate. And the reason we charge a little more for that is we are going to have to transact that bag at the gate and what we're trying to do is avoid gate delays so we don't want to do that. So no one has to pay the $45.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Well, that argument doesn't fly with Democratic Senator Charles Schumer of New York. Today he said he'll urge government regulators to prevent fees for carry-on bags.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHARLES SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: The decision by Spirit Airlines to charge passengers a whopping $45 for a carry-on bag has crossed the line. Peanuts, peanuts may not be a necessity for air travel, but the ability to carry a bag on to a flight is.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: The new fee takes effect August 1st.
Crossing the country with a group that wants to change the way Washington works. CNN climbs aboard the Tea Party Express for a rare look behind-the-scenes.
And if you live in the southeast, your car is probably covered with this yellow powdery stuff, not just your car, most of everything you own, if you take it outside. Pollen has reached near-record levels in the south, and that's causing a lot of coughing, sneezing, and watery eyes.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Meteorologist Jacqui Jeras joins us now.
Jacqui, I had a friend visiting, and he said, it looks like yellow-powdered snow out there. What's going on?
JACQUI JERAS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes. You know, not just in Atlanta, but across the southeast, all over the place, and really the vast majority of the U.S. dealing with high pollen counts. Our iReporter, you know, shooting some great pictures here from Decatur, Georgia, Erica Myers. And there you can see that yellow haze all throughout the sky.
You know, allergy experts are saying that the levels could be as high as they've been in the last ten years. So it really is extreme. And there you can see the big picture across the U.S. and unfortunately, not a lot of relief in sight. You're probably going to have to wait a couple of weeks.
You know, the pollen level is going down a little bit across the west because of our frontal system that's moving in here. We're looking at some heavy showers, even some thundershowers and then snow into the higher elevations. In fact, the sierras could see over a foot of snowfall by the end of the day tomorrow. We're watching for the threat of some flash flooding in some of those burn areas, too, by the way. The fighter already had your flash flood warning. And we're also watching the station fire burn areas.
Winds will be gusting with this front between 50 and 70 miles per hour at times. The big picture for tomorrow, this is really the big storm system that we'll be watching. It will be moving through the four corners and then kind of fills out across the nation's midsection. So unfortunately, Don, it will not make its way all the way across the U.S. to help relieve those of us in the southeast.
LEMON: Too bad. Have a great week ahead. OK, Jacqui, thank you.
Behind-the-scenes of the Tea Party Express. CNN got some rare access into a day in the life of an activist. You don't want to miss this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: America might be a melting pot, but some say the tea party is all one flavor. White and conservative. But is that the full story? Tonight, we're giving you a deeper perspective.
CNN political producer Shannon Travis gained rare access for an inside look at what it's like for tea party activists to go on the road for weeks at a time. Shannon begins in Michigan.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SHANNON TRAVIS, CNN POLITICAL PRODUCER: We're here in Grand Rapids, Michigan, the latest stop on the National Tea Party Express Tour, where that crowd over there is full of angry protesters, but a lot of protesters who are celebrating the fact that Congressman Bart Stupak will not seek re-election.
How do you feel about Congressman Stupak's decision to not run for re-election?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He could see that he was going to get whipped.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, there!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Freedom!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are a lot of people riled up. And I tell them it's better, turn off cable, unless, of course, they're on CNN, and get out and do something about it. And that's what they're doing.
TRAVIS: You're about to see something that very few people actually get to see. We're actually about to get on board one of the tea party buses and see what goes on inside. It's a rare unfettered access that CNN is getting to see what actually happens behind-the- scenes when these activists go from rally to rally.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, we had to get a new microwave, which is taking up all this counterpace. We do have some bunks back here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There you have it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All the stuff that the media says that we do, so, I mean, we get on the bus and we have brain storming sessions. What kind of racial slur can we come up with this time -- uh, not. Just joking, of course.
Hey, everybody!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, how are you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come November, we are going to vote the bums out. And we're going to do that by voting --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We just thank you for the amount of people that have stepped forward in this movement, and we ask that you'll continue to grow it, Lord.
OK, so it's 6:30 in the morning and I haven't had much sleep. We actually got to bed about 1:00 last night.
Well, the days start to kind of blur together and you feel like, like you can't even remember where you were yesterday.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Got to get it in there somehow.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're headed to Detroit for our first rally, and it's drizzling here, so hopefully we have better weather as we go.
Hurry up and get here. You saw him running by, patting me on the back. The buses are leaving. They're honking their horns. You're trying to sell, and you're trying talk to people. We don't have time. Our schedule is so tight. We have to get to the next rally.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: All right, Texas Stadium.
That was Shannon Travis. He's a CNN political producer. Nice report. Thank you, Shannon.
Hey, listen, we told you about that big explosion. Texas Stadium hasn't seen anything like this since Drew Pearson ran downfield for a bomb from Roger Staubach.
Good-bye, Texas Stadium, and well-done, Casey Rogers.
Casey is the 11-year-old who brought the house down this morning.
And a lot of emotion in Augusta today. A masterful performance by Phil Mickelson. A big win after a tough year for him and his family.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Today's big sports story, guess what, Phil Mickelson wins the Masters. His third win at Augusta, but this one was the most emotional. Mickelson's wife and his mother both diagnosed with breast cancer within the past year.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PHIL MICKELSON, MASTER'S WINNER: I really want to recognize my family. My wife has been -- we've been through a lot this year and it means a lot to share some joy together.
(APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So how did Tiger Woods do in his big return to the game since the scandal broke? Well, he finished fourth. He tied for fourth.
Texas Stadium, now you see it, now you don't. Take a look.
Tom Landry, Roger Staubach, you can't help but think of those guys as their old home, Texas Stadium, came down this morning. The Dallas Cowboys, of course, have some fancy new digs now. Last night I talked with 11-year-old K.C. Rogers who won an essay contest and the chance to blow the place up.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: To the big bang, are you nervous?
CASEY ROGERS, ESSAY WINNER: Well, no, I'm not -- just a little bit.
LEMON: What do you mean, a little bit?
ROGERS: Well, I'm kind of nervous and kind of excited.
LEMON: You been able to sleep?
ROGERS: Well, a little bit.
LEMON: Yes? What do your buds think of you?
ROGERS: Some of them are kind of -- a lot of them are happy for me, but some of them are kind of jealous.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Well done, Casey. By the way, Casey's winning essay was about his charity for the homeless.
I'm Don Lemon. I'll see you back here next weekend. Good night.
