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Insurgents Attack Afghanistan NATO Base; Obama Demands Answers Over Oil Leak; India Crash Kills 158; Tea Party Looks to June 8

Aired May 22, 2010 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: This hour, the oil keeps on gushing in the Gulf, making drastic measures a real possibility to protect the delicate wetlands. Is there an end in sight for this tragedy?

Controversy over students submitting DNA samples as part of the admission's process at a major university? What are they looking for? Some say it is a slippery slope.

And a newly pregnant wife of one of the biggest stars in the planet has many pondering this question: How old is too old to have a baby?

(MUSIC)

LEMON: Good evening, everyone.

A developing story in the Afghanistan to tell you about -- a daring assault by insurgents has the military wonderings what is next. Firing rockets, militants stormed the perimeter of NATO's biggest base in the southern region before being beaten back by troops. Several coalition forces and civilian officials were wounded.

The attack at the Kandahar Airfield should raise alarm since it is the second on a major military base in the past four days.

CNN's Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr, joins us now.

Barbara, what happened?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Well, Don, details are still sketchy at this hour.

But the U.S. military is saying that it all began when insurgents fired five rockets at the Kandahar Airfield in southern Afghanistan and then, indeed, tried to storm the base. Clearly, coalition U.S. firepower overwhelmed them and pushed them back.

But it is concerning, of course -- as you say, the second time in just a few days, you'll remember a few days ago, insurgents tried to storm the Bagram Airfield north of the capital of Kabul. They were also beaten back by U.S. and coalition firepower.

Kandahar, however, is the scene of the next expected major military action. It is the heartland of the Taliban insurgency, the U.S. and NATO had been sending a signal that they're coming after the Taliban. It sure looks like the Taliban sent their own signal trying to get on to that base in Kandahar -- Don.

LEMON: So, the Taliban is taking responsibility for this attack? Are they the only ones?

STARR: Well, it seems clear that it was Taliban-related groups. There's no official claim of responsibility to be clear at this hour. But Kandahar, the whole region really is the heartland of the Taliban insurgency. There are several warlord clans there that often stage attacks. Hard-core Taliban, a lot of the drug trade that is handled by the Taliban comes through that region.

So, it's a real syndicate soup (ph) of the insurgency there. It's hard to know who was exactly responsible for this. But clearly, something that was done at the hands of these insurgents groups.

LEMON: All right. Thank you very much for that. CNN's Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr.

And an impatient Gulf region is watching and waiting tonight as B.P. works out its latest plan to stop the oil gushing underwater. Now, here's what we know right now. Company officials are now preparing to try top kill where they will pump heavy drilling fluids into the well and try to seal it with cement. But it won't happen until early next week, possibly on Tuesday.

Meantime, scientists tell the "Associated Press" that it may be impossible to get the oily mess out of the marshes on the Gulf. The "A.P." says officials are considering drastic measures like burning part of the wetlands or flooding certain areas.

President Barack Obama says he wants answers in this disaster. He is creating a bipartisan commission to investigate the oil leak and offer solutions to keep something like this from ever happening again.

And to lead that commission, President Obama picked former Florida Senator Bob Graham and former EPA head, William Reilly. Graham is a Democrat and Reilly served in the first Bush administration.

And our Kate Bolduan tells us what's expected of these two and their new panel.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Both come with some good credentials when you're talking about this situation -- a former Democratic senator from Florida, Bob Graham, and the former EPA administrator during the first Bush administration, William Reilly. And the goal of this commission is straight forward but it's a huge job: to really get at the root cause of this massive spill and also then make recommendations and figure out how to prevent this from happening ever again in the future. Straight-forward but it's a huge job and they're being tasked with reporting back to the president in six months.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: All right. Kate, thank you very much. And get the very latest updates and full coverage of the impact of the oil spill has had on the Gulf Region at CNN.com/oilspill. I want to tell our viewers that you're looking at live pictures now of that oil gushing underneath the water there in the Gulf of Mexico. It's a great place to see all the reports as they come into us here on CNN.

And tomorrow, "STATE OF THE UNION" with Candy Crowley at 9:00 a.m. Eastern, B.P.'s managing director will respond to the criticism of how the company is handling the Gulf spill. Make sure you tune in for that tomorrow morning 9:00 a.m.

It is early Sunday in India where the investigation is underway into what caused a deadly plane crash in Mangalore. The Air India Boeing 737 overshot the runway, crashed into a ravine and burst into planes. One hundred and fifty-eight people are now dead. But eight of the 166 people on board did survive.

The flight took off from Dubai in the United Arab Emirates and it crashed in what's being described as good weather conditions early Saturday local time. We're told a team from the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board is headed to the crash site to assist the investigators. They are expected to arrive on Tuesday.

In the meantime, let's get more on the survivors. CNN's Liz Neisloss is at the hospital.

Liz, what you tell us at this hour?

LIZ NEISLOSS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, there are eight survivors. All of them have amazing stories. One individual was actually able to walk away from the crash site.

However, as you said, investigators still need to find the black box. It did seem to be a day of good weather. However, some officials have said this plane must have been traveling at a terrific speed because it did land -- did touchdown but then apparently kept going at quite a cliff, crashed through a wall at the end of the runway and continuing on through a sand area that is there intending to slow down planes that may have overshot the runway and then burst through the wall. The right wing of the plane broke off and the plane landed in a ravine below where it burst into flames -- Don.

LEMON: All right. Thank you very much for that, Liz.

An 11-year-old takes her own life, leaving behind a journal describing how she had been bullied. That story is straight ahead on CNN.

Plus this -- after an emotional reunion, the mothers of U.S. hikers being held in Iran come home without their children.

And not your father's history book, right? Conservatives in Texas take an eraser to textbooks, removing key figures and key events and also adding some as well. And those changes could make their way into schools all over the country.

And a controversial test offered incoming freshman at one major university a DNA test. Why? What are they looking for?

And don't just sit there. Make sure you become part of the conversation. I'm reading your messages on Twitter and Facebook right now. Make sure you follow us on Twitter or check out my blog, CNN.com/Don. We want to hear from you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: I'm going to tell you about a heartbreaking home coming in New York for the mothers of three imprisoned American hikers in Iran. While the women did get to meet with their sons and daughter, their mission of bringing them home ended in failure. They ran up against the regime that has no interest in releasing them -- but definitely is trying to send a message to the White House.

CNN's Susan Candiotti is covering the mother's return for us in New York.

Susan, did the women get into the specifics of the meeting with their children? What did they say?

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You know, Don, they really didn't. And they explained that they were very tired after their long trip, really exhausted. And so, therefore, for now, anyway, they are sticking to a written statement. These are the mothers of Josh Fattal, Shane Bauer and Sarah Shourd.

And, of course, this is the first time they've seen them in nearly 10 months. They've only had one phone call with them during that time.

So, this trip, they said, was all about highs and lows -- the thrill of the tearful reunion and the low of having to leave them behind. They said it was excruciating.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CINDY HICKEY, SHANE BAUER'S MOTHER: We are also very disappointed that when we went to the airport to return from Iran, Shane, Sarah and Josh had to go back to Evin prison. The pain we felt at having to leave Tehran without our children is almost more than we can bear.

NORA SHOURD, SARAH SHOURD'S MOTHER: Shane, Sarah and Josh have done nothing to deserve their continued detention, and the lack of movement in their case troubles us greatly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CANDIOTTI: There was no meeting with Iranian officials. This was billed as strictly a humanitarian visit and the question now, of course, is, well, might there be a prisoner exchange? The thing is that the Iranians have said repeatedly that that's what they want -- some Iranian detainees released by the United States. The United States says there will be no prisoner exchange and they are sticking to a path of diplomacy.

But for now, the mothers come home empty-handed in hopes of one day seeing their children free again, Don.

LEMON: So, do they have any plans after this? Where do they go from here, those moms?

CANDIOTTI: I'm not sure that they know for now. Right now, they said they want to get some rest and we hope to hear much more from them when they're scheduled to appear on CNN's "AMERICAN MORNING" on Monday.

LEMON: All right. We will be watching. Susan Candiotti in New York -- Susan, thank you very much.

Rewriting history in Texas textbooks or correcting it, as some see it. How a controversial vote threatens to change how history is taught in other states.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: A little girl hangs herself and Florida police are looking into whether schoolyard bullying may be to blame for that. The parents of 11-year-old Selena Okawone (ph) found her hanging in her closet Thursday night in Port St. Lucie. Her diary says she was frequently bullied at school. In the last year, it was believed more than a dozen kids across the country killed themselves after being bullied.

A scare in West Virginia early this morning. Investigators say a man died after a pipe bomb he made blew up outside a bar. The state police bomb squad diffused two other pipe bombs discovered nearby. No one else was hurt. If police say the dead man is not a terrorist and the explosion is linked to a domestic dispute.

And New York's attorney general is making a bid to run his state. Democrat Andrew Cuomo officially kicked off his campaign for governor today. He faces no primary opposition. Cuomo ran for governor unsuccessfully back in 2002 but won the state attorney general post in 2006. He's the son of former three-term New York governor, Mario Cuomo.

A controversial vote in Texas yesterday as the state school board votes to revise textbooks for history and social studies. The critics say the new books amend the teaching of the civil rights movement, slavery and the separation of church and state. Both sides here have a whole lot to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are some people that have an effort, an agenda to make this seem like there's something going on that's not. And part of that is because there's 10 Republicans on the board and there's five Democrats. They have a political agenda, and they wanted to delay this vote until after our next elections so they could have an impact on the political makeup of our board and then write the standards their way. Come on!

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: Well, some are worried that the rest of the nation follows Texas by the textbooks they buy. But Secretary of Education Arne Duncan tells us that he doesn't believe the new changes by the Texas Board of Education will impact classrooms across the country. We'll continue to follow that story for you.

Some educators believe teacher's unions can be an obstacle to good education. But in California, a system of publicly-funded charter schools called Green Dot is enjoying success with all of the teachers unionized. Our education contributor, Steve Perry, visited with the principal of those Green Dot schools to find out how things were.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEVE PERRY, CNN EDUCATION CONTRIBUTOR: I'm a principal and you're a principal of a very successful school, by the way. One of our challenges is working with the union. How do you work effectively with the unions and Green Dot?

HARRIS LUU, PRINCIPAL, OSCAR DE LA HOYA HIGH: We make sure we have our folks having voices on the decisions we make on campus. And so, in that, you know, day-to-day, we have folks that participate in those functions at school, whether it be, you know, deciding on curriculum, deciding on schedules, deciding on stipends, deciding on the budget. We include our parents as well in those conversations.

ABIGAIL GARCIA, PRES. ASOCIACION DE MAESTROS UNIDOS: Our teacher's union was actually started by the founder of Green Dot and it was because he believed in grassroots organizing. And that's essentially what the union is. The union is going to compliment our organization and not necessarily be an obstacle to progress in our organization.

PERRY: How do you hold teachers accountable?

LUU: Well, aside from making sure that the lessons are proper and our observations are done frequently, providing them with feedback, to say, you know what, you've done this well or you haven't this well.

PERRY: How do you know if they've done it well?

LUU: The kids must be learning. That's the bottom line.

PERRY: And how do you measure that?

LUU: Student achievement.

PERRY: Standardized tests?

LUU: That could be one, the behavior, the whole child. If the child ask adjusting well, if the child is positive, if the child is doing well on their courses in school. Standardized tests are just one measure for that.

GARCIA: We have to work together. I think Dr. Lou said it best that together, we're better.

I wanted to make sure, Ms. Cutler (ph) was on board.

PERRY: Steve Perry, CNN, Los Angeles.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: One university's approach to getting to know its freshman class may be a little too personal. I mean, it doesn't get much more personal than your DNA, does it?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right. Pay attention here because I definitely want you to weigh in on what I'm going to talk about now. This is causing a bit of some controversy. At Berkeley, this fall's freshmen will soon get orientation packets that talk about dorms, dining and their DNA. That's right. The packet will have a cotton swab plus a consent form asking undergrads to participate in what organizers call "The Grand Experiment" -- students will offer their DNA and then a professor will analyze it to help students make decisions about their diet and lifestyle.

Well, tonight, we're talking to the professor. His name is Dr. Jasper Rine. He studies genetics at U.C., Berkeley.

And, Professor, thanks for joining us.

I want you to explain this to me. You're looking at three specific genes and what the students' DNA tell you, right?

PROF. JASPER RINE, UNIV. OF CALIFORNIA-BERKELEY: That's right. And let me put this in a bigger context. We're approaching the age of personalized medicine and the benefits for personalized medicine will require that people have information about their personal genes, the gene variant (INAUDIBLE). This is coming.

Our government has invested large amounts of resources to enable the individual genome sequences to be obtained for the cost of a typical medical procedure, yet the benefits of those tests and that information requires knowledge about the genes. So, we're trying to do this to help our students understand the technology, its impact, the controversy surrounding it, the benefits and risks through a simple experiment in which they have the opportunity to volunteer to provide a DNA sample for which we'll look at three genes -- only three genes -- that have been widely studied and which we really know a whole lot about them.

LEMON: Because in personalized medicine, and what you said, that's why you are choosing genes related to nutrition and not disease, is that right?

RINE: That's right. We think the whole issue about testing for disease genes a very complicated issue. And it's really best done in a medical context. And so, we've chosen genes that have just enough biology associated with them to be interesting but not enough to have any risk of having any kind of a threatening outcome from such a test. LEMON: OK. So let's get down to the meat of this. And you said you're doing it because of personalized medicine and you want kids -- students to start learning to take better care of themselves or at least to know what their personal health might look like in the future.

Here's the question: DNA, that's the most personal thing that you can offer about yourself. It tells you everything about who you are. It's your personal fingerprint, your DNA. There's concern that this may go further. It maybe stored in a data bank and who knows where this information will go from here. It may be used with police. It may be used in future investigations.

How do you answer that?

RINE: Yes. Well, we've designed this project which has been reviewed by our human subject review panel, which is empowered to make sure all such considerations have been well-thought out and protected against.

So, the way the project works is that each student receives with the swab kit two bar codes. They put one bar code on the sample that they send back and they keep the other bar code. The bar code is the only way for them to connect themselves to the results from the tests on them. We receive the tests -- we receive the swabs, rather. And we have the DNA analyzed in a commercial lab, in which the commercial lab has no key to identify who is responding -- who is connected to which sample.

Then after these three tests are done, we destroy all the samples and we put the data on each of the samples indexed to a particular code, in a database so the students have access to it. And then in a lecture in the fall, what I'll do is describe the tests, the genes, the aggregate data for the entire class and help them understand the difference between individual genetic variation.

LEMON: OK. So, the student learns his or her personal information, right?

RINE: That's correct.

LEMON: So, there is a -- there is a -- here's the thing: you're saying you're going to destroy it and that it's anonymous and what- have-you, but there appears to be a track back. Now, are you telling me that if in the future, let's say there's an investigation and by chance, there's someone -- one of your students is being looked into for something in the future. You don't think that police or investigators in some instance may subpoena you and say you have this person's DNA on file. You have to hand it over.

You don't think that there is a possibility of that in this?

RINE: There's zero chance of that. All the samples are destroyed. And we will have no access to any link between the information on any of these three genes and any individual student. Plus, these three genes in the variants that we look at are extremely common. There's millions of people on the planet walking around every day with the variance of genes that we're looking at.

LEMON: OK. So, you don't think this is a slippery slope by any sense? That we're asking for way too much information here from people?

RINE: I don't think so at all.

LEMON: OK. Can we -- do you feel that we can ever have too much information about ourselves?

RINE: Oh, I think it's a big risk. In fact, I'm somewhat surprised at the amount of information that students share about themselves on Facebook and other venues, and I think that genetic privacy is one of the most pressing issues of privacy of our age. So I'm hoping this exercise helps them to become a little bit more alert about the issues of privacy and thinking twice about what they want to disclose, because ultimately, your genome sequence is the most unique thing that you'll ever have.

LEMON: OK. All right. Professor Jasper Rine, thank you so much. We appreciate you joining us.

RINE: You're welcome. Thanks for your interest.

LEMON: It is one of the most reliably Democratic congressional seats in the country and home to the birthplace of President Barack Obama. So, how come everyone expects the Republicans to be celebrating tonight? We'll talk about that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: President Obama addressed graduates of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point praising them for their accomplishments and encouraging them to prepare for the challenges that lie ahead. Mr. Obama reminded his audience that this is the ninth consecutive West Point commencement held in a time of war. He said the U.S. faces more difficult days ahead but that victory is inevitable.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So the threat will not go away soon. But let's be clear. Al Qaeda and its affiliates are small men on the wrong side of history. They lead no nation. They lead no religion. We need not give in to fear every time a terrorist tries to scare us. We should not discard our freedoms because extremists try to exploit them. We cannot succumb to division because others try to drive us apart.

We are the United States of America, adversaries want to divide us but we're united by our support for you. Soldiers who send a clear message that this country is both the land of the free and the home of the brave.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: The state where President Obama grew up is holding a congressional election today. Results will be announced late tonight in Hawaii's vote by mail race. It is a seat that's long been solidly democrat but a lot of people think it's going to go to a Republican tonight.

CNN political producer Peter Hamby joins me now from Washington. So Peter, obviously Republicans are going to pounce on this and say, "hey, look, this is where the guy's from and he can't even hold that seat." So what's going on in Hawaii? Why is a blue state suddenly going red?

PETER HAMBY, CNN POLITICAL PRODUCER: Well, you're exactly right, Don. Republicans are going to point to this as a sign, you know, of a coming victory in November. But the problem for Democrats in this race is, this is a special election. It's a three-way race. You have a Republican candidate and two Democrats, Ed Case and Colleen Hanabusa who are splitting the vote.

And this is a very, very democratic district. Hawaii's first congressional district where Barack Obama was born and spent part of his youth and democrats, national Democrats are basically pulled out. They are basically giving this election to the Republicans but they do say that once this turns into a general election again in November, you know, they have to vote again when it's a race between a Republican Charles Dijou and whoever the Democrat will be. They're confident that they can take it back in November.

LEMON: OK. Peter, let's talk about this because this is going to be an example of this, you know, in this information age and technology age that you should tell the truth because everything is out there for people to see. We're going to talk about Connecticut now. The Democratic attorney general was supposedly cruising towards a victory there in the state's race for the U.S. Senate.

But then "The New York Times" questioned how he sometimes described his military service during Vietnam and he admitted - this is what he said, "misspeaking" but critics used another word or that. They simply say it's lying, Peter. Is he staying in the race? What are his chances? And are Democrats going to stick with him?

HAMBY: He's staying in the race. Connecticut democrats had their convention and they - as did the Republicans - and they gave him their vote of confidence. He'll be the nominee and, you know, despite this scandal about whether or not he misrepresented his military record in Vietnam, one of the most surprising things about this story is that Richard Blumenthal is extremely popular in Connecticut. This just came out of nowhere. So you know, he still has a lot of residual popularity. The problem for him with this story he is running against two Republicans were looking for the nomination and one of them is a military veteran who did serve in Vietnam.

And the other candidate, Linda McMahon, who also got her party's nod at the state convention, she has promised to spend over $30 million of her own money in this race. So it's going to be very tough battle come this fall.

LEMON: Yes and I'm glad you mentioned that. We were talking about Richard Blumenthal who has been the attorney general of Connecticut since 1991.

Let's talk about the tea party now. Tea party activists have their sights on June 8th, that is the day that some key party primaries - the tea party, they're hoping to score some big victories there. So why is this date so important? Tell us about that.

HAMBY: Right. So you saw that Rand Paul won in Kentucky. That was sort of the biggest victory, sort of for the tea party so far. Two names you should keep an eye on for - on June 8th, this next round of big primaries. One is in Nevada. Sharon Engel is running for the Senate nomination, the right to take on Harry Reid in November. She's a little-known assemblywoman from the northern part of Nevada.

She got endorsed by the tea party, several tea party groups and the club for growth. So keep an eye on her. It's really propelled her to the front of the polls there. Also, in South Carolina, they have a gubernatorial primary on June 8th. And Niki Haily, an Indian- American woman, a state legislator there, little know but she has just gotten endorsed by Sarah Palin and the tea party groups are lining up behind her and polls are showing that she has momentum as well. So this could be two big wins for the tea party again on June 8th.

LEMON: OK. So that's June 8th because what we saw, you know, from the elections held just on Tuesday, tea party didn't have a really big impact so on June 8th they're hoping they might make a big difference.

HAMBY: Right.

LEMON: Peter, thank you very much. We appreciate you joining us. OK.

HAMBY: Thank you, Don. Appreciate it.

LEMON: And I want to tell our viewers, tomorrow on CNN's "State of the Union," with Candy Crowley, Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell and Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty will discuss what Tuesday's primaries meant for both parties and their outlook for the midterm election. "State of the Union begins at 9:00 a.m. Eastern only here on CNN.

You know, it sounds cliche but it is anything but. One man going where no man has gone before. Free-falling from 22 miles above the earth?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you step off in the first 30 seconds you accelerate so fast you can break the speed of sound.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Brave or what? Who knows.

And a twitter first we want to tell you about. One man's site that's been turned into a sitcom.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) LEMON: Let's check your top stories right now.

An American team is going to join the investigation into the crash of an Air India Boeing 737 that killed 158 people. Eight people survived when the plane overshot the runway at the airport in Mangalore. The jet which had taken off from Dubai in the United Arab Emirates crashed into a ravine before bursting into flames.

The mother of the three American hikers detained in Iran returned empty-handed today from a visit. During the trip they met with their sons and daughter but couldn't persuade the authorities to release the detained hikers. It was the first time the women had seen their children in 10 months. Before leaving they asked to speak with Iran's president and Supreme leader but both request were rebuffed.

A California boy is sitting on top of the world right now. 13-year- old climber Jordan Romero called from the summit of Mount Everest this morning to say, he made it! "I made it!" He's the youngest climber ever to do it and he plans to scale the highest peaks on all seven continents. Good luck to him.

He's called Fearless Felix. And he's trying to break a free-fall record with an incredible leap of faith. CNN's Brian Todd talks to a man getting ready to jump from the edge of space. It is a stunt where he may plummet faster than the speed of sound.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): He's a 41-year-old Austrian skydiver who works for Red Bull. But with NASA's future so uncertain, Felix Baumgartner might just represent the next frontier of flight exploration.

Later this year, this guy is going to try to jump out of a capsule at the edge of space for what's basically a record-shattering sky dive.

(on camera): SO my first question is a two-parter. Are you nuts and why the hell are you doing this?

FELIX BAUMGARTNER, STRATOSPHERE JUMPER: Well, first of all I'm not nuts. I think it's human nature, you know. Records are meant to be broken. And I'm a very competitive person. I live the challenge and to me there's nothing more challenging than working on this Red Bull Stratus Project.

TODD (voice-over): The Red Bull Stratus Project will test the limits of the body. Baumgartner will try to break some unheard of records. The longest and highest freefall ever. 120,000 feet above sea level, that's more than 22 miles. And he'll try to make the fastest-ever freefall.

BAUMGARTNER: When you step off, within the first 30 seconds you accelerate so fast that you're going to break the speed of sound which is more than 600 miles an hour.

TODD: That's something that no one has ever done outside a plane or a spacecraft. Baumgartner also based jumped from the Petronas Towers in Kuala Lumpur and from the Christ the Redeemer statue in Rio de Janeiro. The man who's record Fearless Felix is trying to break is a consultant on this project. Joe Kittenger who jumped from 102,000 feet 50 years ago.

(on camera): You're the only one who has even come close to be where he is going to go. What is it like up there?

COL. JOE KITTENGER (RET.), 1960 STRATOSPHERE JUMPER: It's distant.

TODD: I'd say so.

KITTENGER: And it's very hostile. It's not meant for a man without the protection.

TODD: What is it about that that feels so hostile? Was it the pressure? The speed? What is it?

KITTENGER: It's the lack of pressure. And you know that right outside of you is a vacuum of space. And without the protection of that pressure suit you cannot live. And that's an interesting thought that you have.

TODD (voice-over): Like Kittenger, Baumgartner will be taken to the stratosphere in a capsule, pulled by a helium balloon and then he steps off. The only thing protecting him, what he called the next- generation pressure suit and three parachutes.

(on camera): Are you afraid of dying on this mission?

BAUMGARTNER: Of course, I'm afraid of dying. Because I worked so hard to reach that level and I'm living a good life and I think the most important thing I'm doing something like this is to come back alive.

TODD (voice-over): The ultimate scientific goal? To advance human knowledge enough so that space tourists will be able to exist outside their vehicles if those space craft break down.

(on camera): How does Felix Baumgartner top this? Well, he probably won't. He says this is going to be his last jump and then he's going to back to being a helicopter pilot. Maybe a bit of a letdown.

Brian Todd, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: I would say that if it works.

OK. So, listen to this. Getting pregnant later in life. We're talking about older women, right? Getting pregnant. 47 isn't too old for Kelly Preston, actress Kelly Preston, the wife of John Travolta. You see here there. But it's sparking a major debate. We're going to talk about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) AMERICA FERRERA, "SAVE THE CHILDREN:": I'm America Ferrera and I'm building a school in (inaudible) Mali with "Save the Children."

They were celebrating us just being there to save their school that was falling apart. So when we told them that we were going to build them a school they were just over the moon.

I just believe in the power of education to its fullest extent. Until you pick one thing that's really important to you and try to make a difference there, then you really can feel empowered.

Join the movement. Impact your world. Go to cnn.com/impact.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: John Travolta and his wife are hearing lots of congratulations and some criticism recently. That's because actress Kelly Preston is pregnant at the age of 47. you know, it sparks the debate. Just how old is too old to have a baby?

Tonight perspectives from two mature mothers. Mature mothers, I should say. Dr. Wendy Walsh is a former journalist and now psychologist who had her second daughter at the age of 41. And that seems, you know, pretty young now because people are having kids older. And Angel La Liberte is a blogger at flower power mom.com, a site dedicated to mothers over 40. She had her son at 41. And then a daughter just before her 45th birthday. Thank you. Is that right, La Liberte?

Did I pronounce it right?

ANGEL LA LIBERTE, BLOGGER: La Liberte, French Canadian.

LEMON: Just like it say, liberte for all.

OK. So listen, Angel, the first question many people think when they hear, you know, Kelly Preston is pregnant, is it responsible to deliberately try to have a child at the age of 47?

LA LIBERTE: Well, I like the use of the word "responsible" and "deliberate" and "intentional" because basically mothers over 40 put the plans into planned parenthood. These women have spent a lifetime exploring their careers, their dreams and, you know, let's face it, it's the modern era. If they're going to do it they've sowed their wild oats and they're ready to settle down and have a child.

And you know, in many cases when they get to that age they've had to jumped through quite a few hoops with fertility treatments and things like that. And when that child comes into the home, that child is going to be very cherished and very loved and, you know, they fought for that child. Additionally, just thinking about it, you know, women over 40 are likely to be more financially secure. So they've got a good foundation on which to build and secure a family future. LEMON: All right, but listen, and I want Dr. Walsh - Wendy, I should say, we're all pals now. Wendy, I want you on jump in here, because when she's going to - Kelly's going to be 50 when the child is three and what does that make, 65, 66 when the child graduates high school. So what's your response to this, is (inaudible).

DR. WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: Right, 70 when the child graduates college. I think that the debate heats up when you think about postmenopausal babies. And we don't know if Kelly's baby is pre or post menopausal by any means because menopause can start from 40 to 55. But they're been plenty of instances using in vitro, where women are sort of - with the help of medicine becoming pregnant later.

Now, the government expects us to basically be responsible for our kids for 18 years. So then you start to look at life expectancy which currently in America is 78.4 years. I think that people get concerned when they see cases like the Spanish woman a few years ago. The tragic case where she gave birth at the age of 67 - a week shy of her 67th birthday to twins and she was a single mother and she'd lied about her age at a fertility clinic and then tragically died of cancer two years later, leaving these babies orphaned. And this is the fear. But you know, there's another thing people post on my blogs too, why are we talking about women? What about all the older guys who have young wives who may drop -

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LEMON: Yes, you used to think that men can have children - as long as they're fertile whatever, they can have kids at any age but it also poses problems as well. Listen, I want to get your response to this, I want to take a look at health risks. Just some points here that I want to tell you about, and then for women, right? Because we talked about men.

A 45-year-old mom is 23 more times likely to have a baby with a chromosome problem than a 20-year-old woman and babies of moms 50 and older, are much more likely to be premature, have low birth weight, diabetes, hypertension and be in a hospital.

And so Angel, you heard what Dr. Walsh said about that. We talked about men, it's a problem with men as well, so how do you reconcile these increased medical risks here?

LA LIBERTE: Well, you know, first of all, modern fertility medicine has come a long way since the test-tube baby in the 1970s, and women have many, many more choices especially post-menopausal women, and you know women in their 40s. I conceived with my own eggs and I have two beautiful babies, I feel very fortunate but other women my age and older may want to look into other methods such as freezing their eggs when they're younger, such as egg donors, they have many choices.

And when it comes to having children with your own eggs, modern technology - medical technology allows you to weigh up, you know, and make educated choices about that. So you know it's very simplistic and linear just to talk about the chromosome risks when it comes to having children when you are older. There are many options. One of the things that has really interested me is the controversy about older women having children. Not just here in the U.S., but in the U.K., there are very strong feelings about whether or not we should be putting a cap on the age in which women can get pregnant.

LEMON: That and -

LA LIBERTE: I find that a very scary, scary notion because that opens up a terrible can of worms.

LEMON: Angel, that was my next question to both of you, you know, should the government legislate this, and Wendy, I know that you and I talked about this a little bit. Britain as you said, the U.K. tried to legislate it so I'm going to ask both of you, should there be a limit? Should the government try to legislate it? Wendy, you first.

WALSH: Well, certainly in France and Italy there were efforts to have the medical community police it a little bit. So that they weren't impregnating women who were so far past menopause that it make it a danger to the fetus, danger to the wife, to the mother, but of course these laws, none of them stuck. And the British secretary of health about 10 years ago, said in her argument for it, that a woman doesn't have a right to have a baby. The child has a right to have a suitable home.

Now myself, my area is psychology, so I want to know who's going to raise the child, what are the multiple attachments, what's the extended family like? It takes a village to raise a child.

LEMON: And, angel, real quick -

LA LIBERTE: Well, I think it does - it does take a village to raise a child but then you're going to have the same issues with younger pregnancies that are perhaps unwanted. The bottom line is if you start legislating a cap on age, you're opening a can of worms for men too. I mean, if you read an article in "The New York Times" that came out last year there's a whole panoply of risk from older fathers with their sperm including miscarriage, autism.

LEMON: Angel, we're going to have to wrap it up here, yes, we've made those points. Sorry to cut you off. This is a conversation that we're going to continue to have here and I find it very interesting even though, you know, and I am still young enough. I'm not - I don't think that those risks apply to me, but I still find it very interesting, so thank you both.

WALSH: Thank you.

LEMON: And I'm sure we want o say good luck to Kelly Preston and to John Travolta with all the controversy and tragedy that they've had. It would be nice for them to have a healthy baby.

LA LIBERTE: Babies are a joy, they are.

LEMON: Thank you, Ms. La Liberte. Wendy Walsh. We appreciate it.

Naomi Campbell back in court this time to help in a war crimes trial. What?

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LEMON: OK. So you know on the weekend, we always want to try to catch you up on some of the news you may have missed this past week, now that you're at home and can kind of sit down. The reason that we're showing you, right there, Naomi Campbell is - because, she could find herself on the witness stand in the war crimes trial of Liberian - of Liberian ex-president Charles Taylor. Prosecutors want to subpoena the super model to testify over a so-called blood diamond that she allegedly received from Taylor back in 1997. They believe that diamond was those that Taylor had obtained from Sierra Leone rebels and later tried to sell or exchange for weapons. Taylor is accused of fueling the war in Sierra Leone by arming rebels in exchange for blood diamonds.

You know, it's going to be a hard sell getting the Senate to pass a bill limiting ATM fees when some U.S. senators have never even used one. During the debate on the floor this week Nebraska Senator Ben Nelson admitted to never having used an ATM. This is 2010, right?

Well Nebraska's other Senator Mike Johann said he's used an ATM no more than five times in his life and it's not just a Nebraska thing. Iowa Senator Chuck Grassley also says he's never used an ATM. And Senator Tom Harkin, who is sponsoring the bill says he only uses an ATM once every couple of weeks.

So there you go.

I'm Don Lemon coming to you from Los Angeles tonight. Thanks for joining us. Make sure you tune in to us tonight at 10:00 p.m. Eastern. "Campbell Brown" starts right now.

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