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Future of Same-Sex Marriage Moves Up Federal Court System; Oil Well Briefing; Missouri School Bus Crash Live Updates
Aired August 05, 2010 - 11:59 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: And hello once again to you, I'm Brooke Baldwin in today for Tony Harris.
Top of the hour here in the CNN NEWSROOM, where anything can happen at any point in time. Here are some of the people behind today's top stories.
First, same-sex marriage. A court victory for supporters, but what's next? We're talking with the plaintiffs, two of the plaintiffs in the case.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KRIS PERRY, PLAINTIFF, PERRY V. SCHWARZENEGGER: With this decision, the system worked. Our courts are supposed to protect our constitutional rights. Today, they did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mark my words, if marriage can mean anything, then marriage will ultimately mean nothing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Also, heroes heading home, more of our exclusive journey with wounded soldiers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I didn't think I was going to have an arm because of the way it was, it was just skin attaching to it. So yes, I was actually really amazed when I woke up and seen it on there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: And many of you guys, you're online right now. Guess what, so are we. Ines Ferre following the top stories trending on the Internet -- Ines.
INES FERRE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Brooke, trending on CNN.com right now, people posing and talking as their pets on Facebook.
Also, she calls herself a secret agent of kindness, and I'll tell you all about her -- Brooke.
BALDWIN: Ines, thank you. Look forward to it.
Also, stopping that oil leak deep, deep down in the Gulf. We expect a live briefing in moments from Admiral Thad Allen.
First, though, to our lead story.
Gay marriage, whether you support it, you oppose it, or just kind of shrug your shoulders, look, the emotional debate clearly growing even louder today. You know the story. A federal judge in California struck down the state's ban on same-sex marriage, the voter-approved measure known as Proposition or Prop 8.
We want to push forward on what that court ruling -- what does it really mean?
CNN's Ted Rowlands covering the story for us in Los Angeles.
And Ted, I think the question, number one, is what does this mean for same-sex couples? They can't just run out and get married today, can they not?
TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: No, they can't, because there's a stay in place. Along with this ruling, the same judge issued a stay.
It is interesting, though. The length of the stay has not been ruled on yet. In fact, the judge is asking both sides to come to court Friday and hash this out.
And the decision he's going to make will obviously impact a lot of people that want to get married now, because this is a protracted process, going through the federal system. It's going to the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals first, probably with a three-judge panel. It may go to a full panel, and then obviously on to the U.S. Supreme Court.
So, some of these couples say, hey, this judge, he ruled so emphatically in our favor, he should allow us to get married, which he says we have a constitutional right to do. So both sides will submit briefs on this, this week, and the judge is expected to put a time limit on the stay that he's issued.
But the answer to your question, right now nobody can get married -- no same-sex couples can get married in California until this stay is lifted.
BALDWIN: At least not yet. That's the issue with the stay.
Let's talk appeal, Ted Rowlands. We know people who support Prop 8, they're already planning this appeal. And that means the Ninth Circuit, this is a court that is perceived with more of a liberal bent, is it not?
ROWLANDS: Yes. And the proponents for Prop 8 are quick to say that they don't expect to win at the Ninth Circuit level. In fact, they say they weren't surprised by Judge Walker's decision because of the way the proceedings were going in San Francisco.
They do believe that they can win at the U.S. Supreme Court level. And that, of course, is still probably conservatively a year away, plus, possibly up to two years before the high court would rule on this.
It depends on the Court of Appeals, the Ninth Circuit, whether it will extend from a three-panel to a full-blown panel after the initial ruling. So we'll have to wait and see. But it's going to be a while before this is decided in earnest at the top level.
BALDWIN: Yes, I think I was reading they may take it up maybe as early as October 2011. But if and when it gets to that point, Ted, let's talk about the national implications here. I mean, depending on how SCOTUS rules, this could be far-reaching beyond California.
ROWLANDS: Oh, absolutely. And, in fact, after the Ninth Circuit rules it could have an effect on the district states that have in place already a definition of marriage between a man and a woman. And then once the Supreme Court weighs in, of course that will trump everything.
It will have to be litigated state by state. However, once that ruling comes in, it will change everything, literally. So what happens in California obviously is being watched very, very closely nationwide.
BALDWIN: All right.
Ted Rowlands for us in Los Angeles.
Ted, thank you.
We want to take you now live where Admiral Thad Allen is talking. He has stepped forward as he has been giving these briefings, giving an update on the static kill procedure.
Let's listen in.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
ADM. THAD ALLEN (RET.), NATIONAL INCIDENT COMMANDER: When that is done, they'll make sure they have all the cement in place where it needs to be. The big conversation yesterday really had to do with whether or not the drill pipe was still intact and how that might impact the cementing plan.
We pretty much came to a consensus on that. So, today's effort into tomorrow will be to finish cementing off the well from the top, down.
Let me state, and I stated this several times, that this is not the end, but it will virtually assure us that there will be no chance of oil leaking into the environment. We will then proceed to finish the relief well.
The relief well is currently four and a half feet away from the Macondo well and about 100 to 110 feet above the point where they would enter the annulus. The end of the casing pipe has been sealed with a cement shoe, and they have a drill pipe down, and they're ready to drill through that cement shoe and continue finishing out the relief well. And that will happen after the cement has been cured for a certain amount of time, and we'll proceed.
Elsewhere in the Gulf, we are starting to take a look at the large vessels offshore, the skimming vessels. And what we need to do is kind of collapse those back in closer to shore.
We need to start focusing on the areas that we already know have impacts. These are places like Barataria Bay, the Chandeleur Islands, Breton Sound, Mississippi Sound, the Barrier Islands of Mississippi, and continue the cleanup back over towards Mobile and the Florida Panhandle.
We will continue to focus our recovery efforts. I will say once again to the people of the Gulf that we are committed to finishing this cleanup, holding BP accountable, and we will continue to do that. But our focus will become more locally focused, looking at the shoreline and making sure the oil marshes, the beaches, and so forth, are properly attended to. And to that end, we will remain and get the job done.
With that, I'd be happy to take questions.
QUESTION: One of the figures that came out yesterday on how many million gallons got out, how did the government arrive at those figures, including the one that says 26 percent of it remains unrecovered? Just to establish the reliability, what was the process and where are these numbers coming from?
ALLEN: There's been a lot of talk about numbers moving forward. Let me just say at the outset, if you don't have a number, that's a bad thing. When you do have a number, that's a bad thing, because they always have to be explained, or why do you arrive at that conclusion? I think we need to walk through the process here.
This really goes back to flow rate, and we know from the start there have been issues about flow rate as we walked through the 1,000, 5,000, 12,000 to 25,000, 35,000 to 60,000. We've gotten to a point now where, based on a lot of input from the scientific community under the direction of Marshall McNutt, we've been able to focus in and get what we think is a fairly reliable estimate on flow rate. And we know that's 53,000 barrels a day, plus or minus 10 percent. And we know earlier in the spill it was probably over 60, and that probably dropped off as the reservoir was depleted.
OK. Once you have a flow rate that's not a range anymore, within a reasonable error rate, which is 10 percent, plus or minus, the logical extension is, how much oil? And once you establish how much oil, which is a little below the five million barrel mark that we've publicized, the question is, where's the oil?
Well, we know certain things happened. We know a certain amount was produced -- that's measurable. We know a certain amount was skimmed -- that's measurable. We know a certain amount was burned -- that's measurable. We also know based on tests and records and data that you have a certain amount of effectiveness with dispersants, and we know a certain amount evaporates and a certain amount is biodegraded. To go back to our basic algebra we all tried to struggle with in school, if you solve for X, that's what's left.
QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE) when you have a 10 percent error in the flow rate, for example, combined with the 10 percent flow rate -- evaporation rate --
ALLEN: I would say yes and no. We know to a virtual certainty how much was produced.
In other words, some of the numbers are absolute. OK? And it's a model.
Models are approximation of reality, and therefore they're never perfect. But I think it's a point of departure to have the discussion to try and understand what actually happened, or what are the implications long term, because we still have to deal with natural resource damage estimates and so forth.
So I would be the first it admit -- and I wasn't the scientists who are taking part in this -- I'm a user of this -- that you can argue at the margins about, is this the proper model or not? The question is, do we think we know what happened? Do we have a starting point to have the discussion. And I think Jane Lubchenko and Marshall McNutt would all say, if we have better information, we could refine find this.
But we've slowly closed in on flow rate. Flow rate leads us to the total amount. And then the total amount, we know certain things happened. There's certain things we can't quantify right now, and right now what we can't quantify, either based on a certainty or some model, allows us to do a model to do an estimate --
BALDWIN: You've been listening to Admiral Thad Allen.
Bottom line, cautious optimism. Final stage of the static kill almost finished. They've pumped the mud. Now they're almost finished with cement. That should happen tomorrow.
It's not all gone yet. People still need to go back to their lives along the Gulf, but at least some good news, at least for now.
But I want to get to this story. And if you've been watching some of the pictures in the bottom right-hand portion of your screen, here's what we're learning. This is a story coming out of Missouri.
State and county law enforcement are confirming -- look at this. They are confirming to CNN they're working on this school bus accident. It looks like two possibly involved, just judging by the pictures.
CNN affiliate KMOV is reporting that these two school buses and a tractor-trailer were involved in an Interstate 44 accident. This is in Gray Summit, Missouri, this morning. You can get a better sense of it now as that helicopter photographer zooming out, and you can see the scene on this interstate.
Here is what we know. And folks, it's not much at this point in time.
But authorities are telling our affiliate there that there are about 50 people involved. But as for injuries, that is still the big variable.
Clearly, though, this is a massive scene given the fact that these fire trucks have set up shop, looking almost like a command center there in the middle of the interstate. Possibly foam down.
We don't know if there was a fire. We don't know much beyond what we're seeing, but this is a huge scene, obviously stopping traffic in this portion of Gray Summit, Missouri, two school buses.
We don't know how they collided with this tractor-trailer. We just clearly know from the pictures that they did collide.
Fifty people involved. We don't know if those 50 people perhaps, presumably, are children. We do not know. We do not know if they were on their way to school, perhaps on a field trip.
There is part of that tractor-trailer -- wow -- with the school bus just over the back of it. Where's the rest of the tractor- trailer? Perhaps it wasn't there. Perhaps it's elsewhere in the midst of this wreckage.
But unbelievable pictures here coming out of Missouri. And again, at some point -- again, to reiterate -- two school buses and a tractor-trailer somehow collided here on this interstate.
And we're going to continue watching this and figure out what exactly happened, and see how those 50 people involved, how they're doing.
Meantime, let's take you to another live event. We have Attorney General Eric Holder. He's holding this news conference on these 12- plus indictments.
Let's listen.
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
ERIC HOLDER, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: -- by either indictment or by criminal complaint. The remaining three defendants had not been charged before.
In the district of Minnesota alone, a total of 19 defendants have now been charged in connection with this investigation. Nine of these defendants have been arrested in the United States or overseas, five of whom have already pleaded guilty. Ten of the charged defendants are not in custody and are believed to be overseas. Additionally, two United States citizens and former residents of Alabama and California, Omar Shafiq Hamami (ph) and Jahad Sirwan Mustafa (ph), have been charged in separate cases with providing material support to al-Shabaab. Both are believed to be in Somalia and fighting on behalf of al-Shabaab.
According to public reports, Hamami (ph) has been appeared in several propaganda videos on behalf of al-Shabaab that have been distributed worldwide, and he is believed to be a ranking member of the al-Shabaab organization, and he has operational responsibilities.
Finally, Amina Ferra Ali (ph) and Haul Mohammed Hassan (ph), both naturalized United States citizens and residents of Minnesota, were arrested by FBI agents earlier today. They have been charged with providing material support to terrorists, among other offenses.
The indictment alleges that these two women raised money to support al-Shabaab through door-to-door solicitations and teleconferences in Somali communities in Minneapolis, Rochester, and other locations in the United States, as well as in Canada. In some cases, these funds were raised under the false pretense that they would be used to aid the needy and the poor.
Now, while our investigations are ongoing around the country, these arrests and charges should serve as an unmistakable warning to others who are considering joining or supporting terrorist groups like al-Shabaab. If you choose this route, you can expect to find yourself in a United States jail cell, or to be a casualty on a Somali battlefield.
As demonstrated by the charges unsealed today, we are seeing an increasing number of individuals, including U.S. citizens, who have become captivated by extremist ideology and have taken steps to carry out terrorist objectives either at home or abroad. This is a very disturbing trend that we have been intensely investigating in recent years and will continue to investigate and will root out. But we must also work to prevent this type of radicalization from ever taking hold.
Members of the American-Muslim community have been and continue to be strong partners in fighting this emerging threat. They have regularly denounced terrorist acts and those who carry them out. And they have provided critical assistance to law enforcement helping to disrupt terrorist plots and combat radicalization.
Now, these individuals have consistently and correctly expressed deep concern about the recruitment of their youth by terrorist groups. Many members of the community have taken proactive steps to stop the recruitment of their youth by terrorist groups. Just recently, a group of prominent American-Muslims joined together in a video to repudiate the tactics employed by radicalized militants to recruit young Muslims via the Internet.
There needs to be more recognition of these efforts and of the losses suffered by the Muslim community here and around the world. Many of the victims of terror attacks by al-Shabaab, al Qaeda, the Taliban, and other terrorist groups are innocent Muslims. They are innocent Muslims.
I want to applaud the tremendous work of the FBI's Joint Terrorism Task Forces in Minneapolis, San Diego and Mobile, Alabama, for their work on these cases. I also want to thank the Dutch KLPD; the Dutch Ministry of Justice; the Justice Department's own Office of International Affairs; the State Department, including the U.S. embassies in the United Arab Emirates and Yemen; The Hague and the Netherlands; and the Department of Defense for their assistance in the Minneapolis cases in particular.
Now, these indictments and arrests would not have been possible without the critical contribution from the national security division led by --
BALDWIN: All right. Want to move away from this and move to Jeanne Meserve, who I know has been listening to the attorney general speaking.
And I know, Jeanne, you and I were talking last hour about these indictments. And I want for you to just explain to me the crux of this. We're talking 12-plus indictments of these people in the United States providing support to this group that the U.S. has deemed a foreign terrorist organization.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: The attorney general announcing four separate indictments, naming 14 individuals, charging them with providing money, services and personnel to al-Shabaab, which is a designated terrorist group in Somalia.
The attorney general said they were part of a deadly pipeline, routing funding and fighters to this designated terrorist organization. Seven of these individuals had been previously charged, he said.
Interestingly, there have been two arrests in Minneapolis that he announced of women. The attorney general alleges that these individuals were going -- raising money for al-Shabaab, sometimes going door to door, sometimes conducting teleconferences, and sometimes raising this money under false pretenses, saying that the money was to aid the needy and the poor. Those two individuals in custody.
Many of the others, however, named in this indictment are not in the United States. Many of them are in Somalia or believed to be in Somalia, where they have been fighting.
Amongst them, Omar Hamami (ph). He is a well-known name now to U.S. authorities, because he, though raised in the state of Alabama, has been over in Somalia, is believed to play an operational role now in al-Shabaab, and has been prominently featured in recruiting videos for that organization.
The attorney general saying here they're trying to send a message: If you want to go over there and you want to fight, you risk ending up either in a U.S. jail cell or being dead on the battlefield. Back to you.
BALDWIN: And Jeanne, one more question. And Eric Holder touched on the fact -- he was talking about the people here with these extremist ideologies, these people who want to be part of these extremist groups, and how it is frightening.
Is it on the rise? Is that safe to say?
MESERVE: Yes. He mentioned, in fact, that there has been an increase in this. And I can say that just within the last couple of weeks, we've seen two individuals arrested who allegedly wanted to go to Somalia to fight.
One of them was Zachary Adam Chesser (ph). He's a Muslim convert, very much a standard American guy through much of his youth, according to those who knew him. And he allegedly tried to go to Somalia not once, but twice to fight.
And then we heard yesterday about the arrest this week of another individual, Shakr Masri. He lives in Chicago, 26 years old. He allegedly was just about to board a flight in an effort to make his way to Somalia, where he allegedly wanted to become a suicide bomber.
So, that's just within the last couple of weeks. Definitely seeing an uptick in these kind of cases, definitely a great deal of concern amongst U.S. authorities about this phenomenon.
BALDWIN: To use the attorney general's word, "frightening." Frightening, indeed.
Homeland Security Correspondent Jeanne Meserve.
Thank you for that, helping me get through what the attorney general was saying there.
Also frightening, this picture, if we can just revisit it, out of Missouri, two school buses and a tractor-trailer.
Again, to reiterate, Missouri state county law enforcement, they're working on this massive school bus accident right now. Our affiliate, KMOV, is reporting, as I said, two school buses, a tractor- trailer involved in some kind of collision.
I-44 is the road you're looking at right now, and clearly some of the rescue personnel working on someone in the middle of that road. Fifty people, according to our affiliate, KMOV, 50 people involved. The extent of the injuries still not known yet.
As soon as we get more information -- everyone wondering how these people are doing, who they were, were they children -- we will bring it to you here in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: All right. Let's get back to those pictures out of Missouri.
Again, you're looking at I-44. This is in Gray Summit, Missouri. And we've been watching -- and we're digging on this -- this accident that happened at some point this morning.
You can see those two school buses. And one of the school buses is almost on top of -- you can see the front one -- on top of a tractor-trailer. All colliding at some point.
We're hearing, according to our affiliate, KMOV, as many as 50 people involved. We don't know if they were children, we don't know if they were on their way to school, and we don't know the extent of their injuries.
Frightening pictures. We're digging, we're making calls. As soon as we get more information, I will pass that along to you.
Meantime, the other big story we are all over today, Prop 8 and the big decision that came out yesterday in California, the legal victory for same-sex couples fighting for the right to marry. It's been less than 24 hours now since a federal judge ruled California's ban on same-sex marriage is unconstitutional.
Now meet two of the key figures in that fight.
Jeff Zarrillo and his partner Paul Katami were plaintiffs in the challenge against California's voter-approved ban known as Prop 8. They're good enough to join me this morning from Los Angeles.
And we should mention Paul and Jeff were aided in their effort to bring this case to light by the American Foundation for Equal Rights.
Gentlemen, thank you for sharing your story with me this morning.
JEFF ZARRILLO, PLAINTIFF IN PROP 8 CHALLENGE: Thanks for having us, Brooke.
PAUL KATAMI, PLAINTIFF IN PROP 8 CHALLENGE: Thanks for having us, Brooke.
BALDWIN: All right. Let's start right out of the gates. Prop 8 deemed unconstitutional.
Waking up this morning, do you believe it, or is it surreal for you?
ZARRILLO: You just said it and I got chills. Yesterday was a great day for us. Yesterday was a great day not only for the LGBT community in California, but it was a great day to be American.
KATAMI: Yes, it still feels like you might want to wake up, because it still feels like a dream to us, because it's been such a long and tough process. But we are so happy, and just letting it digest.
BALDWIN: Letting it digest. Perhaps a little bit surreal. I was talking one of our reporters in L.A., and he was making the point though that this has been a fight, really, since '04, and it will be a fight that will continue potentially until a year, two years from now, if this thing goes all the way to the United States Supreme Court, until you can finally, perhaps, in your case be victorious.
Are you still sort of waiting with bated breath for it to come through for you on the national level?
ZARRILLO: Absolutely. You know, at the end of the day we know this is a long process. We knew from the beginning we would be in it for the long haul. And at the end of the day, you saw the amazing eloquence of Ted and David, not only in the courtroom, but then you saw it yesterday at their press conferences and on their stages in West Hollywood, in San Francisco.
And we're really confident knowing we have Ted and David, and an amazing legal team and an amazing foundation on our side. Because at the end of the day, we just want to get married and we want our legal rights just like every other American.
BALDWIN: And for both of you -- I tried to do a little digging on your background -- you've been together for nine years, you thought about having a civil union performed. But it felt perhaps short of feeling officially official and getting married. But you can't quite run out and get married just yet.
What's your plan?
KATAMI: Well, you know, like Jeff said, this is the long haul. We want there to be a finality to our marriage rights. We want to make sure that we can have those rights and be no longer prohibited from having those rights.
When you get married you make a huge investment emotionally. You're inviting friends and family, you're making a financial investment as well in terms of getting married and putting a celebratory event together.
And with the options we have now, it's not necessarily a celebration as much as it is a partnership, some kind of a business agreement. So, we know that there are further steps that we're going to take. We're so happy that we have the legal team that we do. And we're very confident that very soon, we will be able to be married and happily put that together.
BALDWIN: Now, I have to jump in, because we have to talk about this as part of the conversation. Look, you look back to 2008, on the ballot, Prop 8. Fifty-two percent of Californians voted in favor of Prop 8.
I want to get your reaction to some sound. I interviewed a man, Austin Nimocks. He's with the Alliance Defense Fund, senior legal counsel, and he talks about, look, seven million Californians say they don't believe in same-sex marriage.
Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AUSTIN NIMOCKS, SR. LEGAL COUNSEL, ALLIANCE DEFENSE FUND: It's really disappointing any time a federal judge takes it upon themselves to cancel out the voices of over seven million Californians. We know that Californians turned out for this vote in record numbers after having a full and fair debate, hearing both sides of the issue, and making the decision that they wanted to make. And for a single federal judge to throw out the entire process is really a tragic day for America.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: All right. Jeff and then Paul, I want your responses.
What do you say to those people?
ZARRILLO: Well, at the end of the day, you know, in America, we're about democracy. And we applaud that process. And we wouldn't want that process to change at all.
But when someone goes into a voting booth and votes to take away the rights of a minority, that can't happen. And that's why the courts are there. That's why we have a Constitution. That's why Judge Walker did what he did yesterday, is because at the end of the day, we can't allow the majority to vote on the rights of the minority.
BALDWIN: Paul, Prop 8, people feel very strongly.
KATAMI: You know, and we appreciate people that have convictions. I mean, this isn't -- we're not trying to take something away from anyone.
Jeff and I aren't trying to change the world. What we're trying to do is reiterate what our government has already told us, that this right is a fundamental right for every single American.
And during that fair debate, you know, we were described as less American, that we need to be prohibited from having the same rights as other people simply because we were gay. And being gay doesn't make us less American. It doesn't make us less patriotic. And it doesn't make us less than in the eyes of our government.
Our government is there to protect us, and it should protect those rights that are innately ours, based on our Constitution. It's very simple: those marriage rights are our fundamental rights, and that's what we're fighting for.
BALDWIN: Jeff Zarrillo, Paul Katami, it is nice to hear from both sides, yours included.
Gentlemen, thank you and good luck to you.
ZARRILLO: Thank you, Brooke. KATAMI: Thanks for having us.
BALDWIN: Let's go back to the breaking story, as we are watching this unfold out of Missouri. Unbelievable pictures here.
Again, some sort of accident happening on I-44, in Gray Summit, Missouri. Quite a rescue personnel, fire presence here on this interstate.
Here's what we know. And I've got to be honest, it's not a lot.
Two school buses involved and a tractor-trailer involved in this accident sometime this morning. We are hearing from our affiliate, KMOV, from authorities, that about 50 people were involved in this accident.
Were they children? Were they adults? Where were they headed? What sort of injuries are we talking about?
We don't have any answers to those questions, but we're working on it. We're making some phone calls. And as soon as we get that information, we will pass it along.
Again, happening in Gray Summit, Missouri. Clearly, the incident and the rescue process under way.
Stay here. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Got to tell you, I just got a new piece of information a second ago on this horrific school bus crash in Missouri. I was telling you 50 people were involved. CNN has now confirmed that two people have died in this accident. And we're trying to glean more information.
And as we do so, I want to talk to Jorma Duran, with the Missouri Department of Transportation. He's a spokesperson on the phone with me now to hopefully answer some of these questions. Jorma, et's just start really simply? What happened.
JORMA DURAN, MISSOURI DEPT. OF TRANSPORTATION (via phone): Well we're trying to find that out as well. We're not sure exactly who started it or what transpired. But as we, as you just pointed out, two confirmed fatalities, no word on how many injuries there have been.
The wreck happened, we're told, between 10:15 and 10:30. It happened at mile marker 250 on Interstate 44 heading eastbound sometime between 10:15 and 10:30. We have closed I-44 heading eastbound starting at mile marker 247. So, just three miles about where the accident took place. So I-44 is closed at 247 and it will be closed for about four to five miles.
We do not know how long I-44 eastbound will be closed. When you -- when you involve two school buses, a tractor trailer and a vehicle, I don't think it's going to be a short time it's going to take, to clear this away.
BALDWIN: Jorda, I'm afraid of the answer you may give me, but I have to ask it. Were these school buses full of children?
DURAN: We're trying to find it out as well. It's a situation where when you first hear about it, that's what you think. "Oh, God, how many people were on the bus?" And so we're still trying to track that down as well.
The investigation for the most part has been turned over to the Missouri Highway Patrol. So, really starting after this phone call, it's kind of out of our hands, other than just to make sure that the detours, getting people off I-44, is being done. And we're going to assist the highway patrol in any which way we can. But unfortunately, this has happened. And hopefully, no other horrible news comes out of this.
BALDWIN: Jorma, let me bring in one of our meteorologists, Chad Myers, who has just joined me, watching the scene the last couple of minutes.
CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: I have been. I have been. And Mr. Duran, there is an SUV between the top bus and the tractor of that tractor-trailer. There is a vehicle that you can't even see -
BALDWIN: I didn't see that.
MYERS: Well, I've been watching the video offline here in the satellite feeds area. And the top of the school bus is here, up kind of at a ramp. And then you see the tractor-trailer here, but in between is literally, a mangled SUV. What do you know --
BALDWIN: There is. Let's take a look, take a look.
MYERS: It's under the words "breaking news" --
BALDWIN: It's silver and -- can we pull down the breaking news banner? We can't control the photographer and the helicopter, but I saw it for a second.
MYERS: Do we know where the fatalities came from yet?
DURAN: We, unfortunately, do not. Most times when something like this happens, people don't have time who are on the scene, to give us the details. I have to believe that of that mangled mess, it's not good news. Not only, obviously, for the two people who were pronounced dead, but again when you see a wreck like that, you have to believe there are injuries involved. We're hoping that the injuries don't become fatalities later on as the day continues on. So, it's a horrible situation, it really is.
BALDWIN: We have this picture, this unbelievable picture of two school buses, the rig and as Chad astutely pointed out, this mangled SUV crunched in between the school bus and the rig. Do we know, Jorma, were they all traveling in the same direction? DURAN: Well, as of right now, I've been told they were all traveling eastbound on I-44. I have not been told of any vehicle that crossed the median. So, as of right now, yes, these vehicles were heading in the same direction. We just simply don't know right now what transpired to cause this mangled mess.
MYERS: What hospital are they going to right now?
DURAN: Great question. And I do not know that answer. I am in the Jefferson City area. So, I'm not directly tied into that area to know what hospital is the closest.
MYERS: Haven't seen LifeFlight there yet. Do you know if they've been called?
DURAN: I do not know if they've been called.
MYERS: OK.
BALDWIN: What about -- we've been looking, and I saw in other pictures, it's almost like a tour bus, a larger bus out there as well. Do we know what role that bus is playing?
DURAN: Not sure. I just know that two school buses, a tractor- trailer and that SUV that you pointed out were the, the four vehicles that were directly involved in this. I'm not sure if maybe that bus that you just brought up, may look now like -- it was a tractor- trailer. It now looks like a bus, I'm not sure. But I just do know that two school buses, a tractor-trailer and a vehicle.
BALDWIN: OK, here's what I'm getting. Just checking my email. We have an SUV, a tractor-trailer and two St. James School District buses. Two St. James School District buses involved.
Just to reiterate, we're confirming two people have died. We do not know which vehicle those two individuals were in, or vehicles. But Jorma, I want to let you go. Before I do, though, I want to get more information. Is there anything else I'm missing?
DURAN: No. You guys have got all the information I know of. In fact, you're getting actually information faster than I am right now. So -- I think everything that I know, you know.
BALDWIN: OK. Well, we've got a lot of good people at CNN, I can tell you that. Jorma, thank you for calling in. Get some more information, call me back.
We've got to take a quick break. We'll be right back.
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BALDWIN: I want it take you back to the Missouri story. Of course, we here at CNN making a lot of phone calls, trying to dig deeper on ha caused this horrific crash. Two school buses, one tractor-trailer, and as Chad Myers pointed out, there's actually an SUV wedged in between the school bus and a tractor-trailer, which you can see when the camera shot is zoomed in.
Fifty people, as many as 50 people involved, according to our affiliate, according to authorities. Two confirmed dead.
Want to talk to our CNN medical producer, Matt Sloane, on the phone with me. Matt, I hear you have information as far as medical triage is going. What do you know?
MATT SLOANE, CNN MEDICAL PRODUCER (via phone): We don't know anything specific about this site at the moment. But I can tell you what normally happens on scenes like this is that the fire department is usually in charge of the scene. They'll get inside those buses and inside the tractor-trailer and the first thing they'll do is ask if anybody can get up, get up and walk, get up and walk out. So, you can pretty much guarantee that those people are doing okay. You get them to an area where you can look at them later.
The next group of people you're going to want to look at are the ones that have a little bit difficulty breathing, but are still conscious. You'll want to get them stabilized and get them out as quickly as you can. And then there are people that are left in there that may be deceased. You obviously want get the most seriously injured out as quickly as you can. But the ones that aren't that injured, get them out of the way so you can deal with the most injured people that you can save. Brooke?
BALDWIN: And so, perhaps in the time that has passed, they have removed the people who were able to get up and walk out. And they have removed the people that they've stabilized, we don't know. But I'm telling you I saw some sort of tour bus there, or some sort of other bus, perhaps that's some sort of vehicle they were able to use to get folks out of the way. The folks that are okay.
But I've seen in some of the pictures you don't see right now, some people, Matt, in stretchers there, in the middle of the interstate. Obviously getting some sort of medical attention.
SLOANE: Sure, yes. Most likely what happens is they bring in the tour bus or bring in another school bus even to get the people that aren't that injured, get them as far away from the scene as you can, and get them to treatment facilities. The people that you're seeing on stretchers, they'll want to get them into ambulances or helicopters. They're probably the more injured folks and get them to local hospitals as quickly as they can.
BALDWIN: What else can you tell me about a scene like this? I mean, we know it's a massive amount of people. We're talking as many as 50 -- possibly children. That's the question that I'm sure everyone sitting at home, including myself, wants the answer to. Are these children we're talking about in these school buss? Fifty people, two dead, it's really an awful situation.
SLOANE: Absolutely. One of the things you have to think about with school buss in particular, is most of them don't have seat belts, so that's kind of a scary prospect there. A scene like this is going to be difficult. Like I said, the fire department is often in charge. And you know, they'll be trying to get the people out as quickly as they can.
But one thing they have to think about is how dangerous the scene is for their own safety. Stabilizing those buses that are not going to roll over while the responders are in there. Or there's no gas leak or anything. You see the white foam all over the ground, probably to stabilize fluids that might be leaking from the buses themselves.
BALDWIN: Sure. Some kind of retardant.
Matt Sloane, hey, thanks for calling me in and helping me out. Helping all of us understand what kind of medical triage may be going on.
Again, this happening right around 10:15, 10:30 local time. Gray Summit, Missouri. You're looking at I-44 eastbound. That's the lane on the right side of your screen. Obviously, nobody's moving as they are tending to this two school bus, one SUV, one tractor-trailer accident. As many as 50 people involved, two confirmed dead.
We're getting more information. We want to share it with you, when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: All right, I've just been handed some new information regarding this bus accident in Gray Summit, Missouri. So we have some information as far as the hospitals go. If you know anyone who may have been on a St. James School District bus this morning, here's a heads up for you.
St. John Mercy Medical Center. A PIO (ph) confirming the following. Four patients have been taken to St. John's Hospital. That's in Washington. Five patients taken to St. John's Hospital in St. Louis. Again, two school buses, an SUV and a tractor trailer involved in this accident. I-44 eastbound. Gray Summit, Missouri. As many as 50 people injured. Two confirmed deaths. And, again, those two school buses from St. James School District.
Also, some top stories for you now, including chilling words from the scene of a tragedy. The 911 tapes. They are out now from Tuesday's workplace shooting up in Manchester, Connecticut, that left nine people dead, including the gunman. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CALLER: We need the cops. Omar Thornton is shooting people, and I just got shot.
OPERATOR: OK, I need to know what his name is.
CALLER: His name is Omar Thornton. He's a black guy. Get the cops here right away, please.
OPERATOR: Sir, stay on the line. (INAUDIBLE).
CALLER: I'm bleeding all over the place.
OPERATOR: OK. How many people got shot?
CALLER: I don't know.
OPERATOR: OK, you don't know. And you're shot where?
CALLER: In my head.
OPERATOR: You're shot in the head?
CALLER: Yes.
OPERATOR: And what's your name?
CALLER: My name is Steve Hollander (ph).
OPERATOR: And where are you in the building, sir?
CALLER: I'm hiding in office.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Also today, Elena Kagan could be days away from taking a seat on the U.S. Supreme Court. The Senate expected to confirm her today. She could be sworn in, we're hearing, by week's end.
And how would you like to be with her? Former first lady -- rather First Lady Michelle Obama and daughter Sasha break from the spotlight in Washington. I couldn't help -- I was thinking about where they are. They're in Spain. They're on vacation at this luxury hotel on the Mediterranean coast. Joining them, a group of long-time family friends.
More top stories here in the CNN NEWSROOM in two minutes. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: All right. Out of Gray Summit, Missouri, even more information as our folks have been picking up the phone and calling. This two school bus, tractor trailer and SUV accident there on I-44 eastbound. We now know who was inside those school buses. Here's what I'm getting from KMOV, our affiliate out of St. Louis.
The buses were full of eighth grade students from St. James, Missouri. These were band students headed to Six Flags. Again, full of eighth grade students from St. James, Missouri. We're hearing as many as 50 people involved, as many as 50 injured. The extent of the injuries we don't know. Again, two confirmed fatalities.
I want to go over to Ines Ferre, who I know has been trying to sort through some of the affiliate websites and glean some information and hopefully what are, Ines, some tweets, maybe some information on this horrific, horrific scene. INES FERRE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, some people leaving some comments on the affiliate website, KMOV. And one of them is saying, my prayers are going out for all the children and their families, also to the bus driver, semi driver and the person or persons in the car. May God put his hands on everyone involved. God be with the medical help on and off the scene that will be treating these children. Some people already leaving comments on KMOV's website on this.
Brooke.
BALDWIN: And, all right, Ines thank you for that little note.
Again, just to reiterate if you're just tuning in and looking at these pictures and just, you know, you heart almost skips a beat looking at this. This is -- you can see the school bus almost on top of the rig. And in between there is a crumpled SUV. A silver SUV there in the left side of your screen. This happened, according to a guy from the DOT I talked to on the phone, between 10:15 and 10:30 this morning. Mile marker 250. I-44 eastbound. Presumably, he told me, so far, all four of these vehicles traveling in the same direction.
We were getting some information on area hospitals. Let me get that for you again. Four patients taken to St. John's Hospital in Washington, Missouri. Five patients taken to St. John's Hospital in St. Louis, Missouri. Again, those school buses full of eighth grade students, band students, on their way to Six Flags.
We're making calls. We're getting more information. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: A busy, busy news day here for us on a Thursday. Let me take a look at some of the other top stories. BP, big announcement, moving ahead now on their next step of shutting down its blown-out well. The oil giant began pumping cement way down into that well after they pumped all that mud just to permanently seal this leak. The relief well could get underway in another week or so, they're hoping.
The attorney who spearheaded an international campaign to save an Iranian woman from being stoned to death now seeking asylum in Turkey. Iran's high court will decide within a week if she will be executed.
And with the Missouri bus crash story, two people are confirmed dead, dozens injured after two school buses and a tractor trailer collided on that Missouri interstate this morning. We're talking I-44 eastbound. In fact, there's also an SUV in between the school bus and the rig. We just got this piece of information. Buses full of eighth grade students from St. James, Missouri, they were band students headed to Six Flags. CNN affiliate KMOV says it happened about 10:15 local time. Gray Summit, Missouri.
Stay with us. CNN NEWSROOM will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: And now CNN NEWSROOM continues right now with T.J. Holmes, in for Ali Velshi.
T.J.
