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President Obama Takes Sides on Mosque; The Mosque Already Near Ground Zero; N.Y. Islamic Center Controversy; Usher's New Look on Life

Aired August 15, 2010 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone, I'm Don Lemon. It's almost the top of the hour and you're watching CNN. Thanks for joining us.

It has dominated the headlines this weekend, stealing the spotlight from President Obama's trip to promote Gulf Coast recovery.

This hour we're talking to people and taking an in-depth look at his decision to take sides in this debate over plans to build a mosque near Ground Zero.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Muslims have the right to practice their religion as everyone else in this country. And that includes -- that includes the right to build a place of worship, and a community center on private property, in lower Manhattan.

I was not commenting and I will not comment on the wisdom of making a decision to put a mosque there. I was commenting very specifically on the right that people have, that dates back to our founding.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, in that second remark the President was explaining his position exclusively to CNN while he was down on the Gulf Coast. But it only seemed like to further the criticism against him.

Later this hour, we're bringing you two passionate opposing viewpoints on this explosive issue and we'll also bring you more of the President's original remarks on Friday so you can make up your mind on this on your own.

But first I want to bring in our senior political editor Mr. Mark Preston. Mark, how politically dangerous -- I guess the question should be -- is it politically dangerous for the President to enter this debate?

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL EDITOR: Don, it's very dangerous if you're a Democrat right now because Democrats are trying to focus on talking about job creation, trying to get the economy back on track. And what we've seen over the last 24 hours, 48 hours, and what we're likely to see, Don, over the next week, is talk about the mosque.

And when you're back home campaigning and trying to get re-elected, you don't want to be talking about this mosque.

LEMON: You know, it's interesting, because I have a friend who is -- pays very close attention -- pays very close attention to politics, and he shot me a text this morning and says, I think the President needs a new PR person because -- because people say he could have -- he could have stirred off this debate. He couldn't have gotten into this debate or didn't have to get involved in this debate and they thought it was a bad decision because it's a no-win situation.

PRESTON: You know, Don, I was talking to a House Democratic leadership aide just about a half ago and the person said to me look, we understand why the President would want to talk about this issue, but the timing couldn't have been any worse.

We are in the dog days of August. And not a lot is going on so, whenever an explosive issue like this really takes hold, it really takes hold. And this House Democratic leadership aide said, look, two things. First of all, why didn't he surround himself with leaders of other faiths to get a little bit of cover, whether they be leaders from the Jewish community, from the Christian community, to try to back him up?

And the second thing that this leadership aide said to me was, look, the fact of the matter is, is that we were supposed to be talking about Social Security this weekend in this coming week. This is a really good issue for us. And we're talking about the mosque; so, not a very good weekend for Democrats.

LEMON: It's not -- it's not really a very good focus. And I think Republicans right now are trying to -- trying at least, to keep their focus on the midterms, the Democrats probably feel that they should be themselves should be doing that. So I imagine the Republicans probably smell a little blood in the water here and they're going to take advantage of it.

PRESTON: They do, Don. And what I've been told from a -- from a very senior Republican strategist is that the word from Washington is that candidates, Republican candidates, will be encouraged over the next 24, 48 hours to talk about this issue, to really try to hammer this issue home.

The big question is will this really matter come November? And look, the number one issue, Don, is going to be the economy, and it's going to be jobs. But right now Democrats do not want to be talking about the mosque.

LEMON: All right, Mark Preston, thank you very much. Sir we'll see you back here at 10:00 p.m. Eastern for more talk on this and other political topics.

One year from now the U.S. is set to begin reducing its troop levels in Afghanistan but it ultimately depends on the security situation on the ground.

General David Petraeus, the man now in charge of winning this war, spoke about the target date earlier today on NBC's MEET THE PRESS. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEN. DAVID PETRAEUS, COMMANDER, U.S. FORCES AFGHANISTAN: This is a date when a process begins that is conditions based. And as the conditions permit we transition tasks to our Afghan counterparts and the security forces and in various governmental institutions, and that enables a quote, "responsible drawdown of our forces".

(CROSSTALK)

DAVID GREGORY, NBC NEWS ANCHOR: Let me stop you, I'm just trying to verify this, could you reach that point and say, I know that the process is supposed to begin, but my assessment as the commander here is that it cannot begin now?

PETRAEUS: Certainly. There is --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: A big challenge for Petraeus is to reduce civilian casualties. He recently issued new guidelines for troops that they should avoid engaging enemy fighters if there are civilians present.

U.S. Secretary General Ban Ki-moon is pleading to the international community to come to the aid of flood-ravaged Pakistan. He toured the disaster area today and said he has never seen such devastation. Weeks of monsoon rains have left millions of Pakistanis homeless, and destitute.

Officials say unconfirmed reports of cholera are pouring in. Cholera can spread in flooded areas where the water has been contaminated.

A day of fun in the California desert turned deadly just as the sun was going down. Eight people were killed, when an off-road racing truck lost control and flipped onto the spectators. Nine other people were hurt, four of them seriously. The California 200 is an amateur race that goes on all night in the Mojave Desert on a course that is 50 miles long. Spectators are urged to stay back at least 100 feet. But many ignore that to get as close to the action as possible.

The decision to build a mosque just two blocks away from Ground Zero has everybody talking. Now, President Obama, as we said, has joined the discussion.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: This is America. And our commitment to religious freedom must be unshakable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That is just a short clip of the speech that thrust the President into the middle of the debate. We're going to play it for you next.

And don't just sit there, be part of the show, part of our conversation. Send us a message on Twitter and Facebook. Check out our blog CNN.com/don. And also check in with us at Four Square.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: And as we just told you, President Obama entering the heated debate over the proposed mosque and community center near Ground Zero this weekend. And for those of you who missed his speech, we want to give you a chance to listen to it; an extended clip from Friday night. Take a look. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Our founders understood that the best way to honor the place of faith in the lives of our people was to protect their freedom to practice religion.

In the Virginia act of establishing religious freedom, Thomas Jefferson wrote that all men shall be free to profess, and by argument to maintain, their opinions in matters of religion.

The First Amendment of our Constitution established the freedom of religion as the law of the land and that right has been upheld ever since.

Recently attention has been focused on the construction of mosques in certain communities, particularly New York. Now, we must all recognize and respect the sensitivities surrounding the development of lower Manhattan. The 9/11 attacks was a deeply traumatic event for our country. And the pain and the experience of suffering by those who lost loved ones is just unimaginable.

So I understand the emotions that this issue engenders. And Ground Zero is, indeed, hallowed ground.

But let me be clear, as a citizen and as President, I believe that Muslims have the right to practice their religion, as everyone else in this country. And that includes -- that includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in lower Manhattan in accordance with local laws and ordinances.

This is America. And our commitment to religious freedom must be unshakable. The principle that people of all faiths are welcome in this country and that they will not be treated differently by their government is essential to who we are.

The writ of the founders must endure. We must never forget those who we lost so tragically on 9/11. And we must always honor those who led the response to that attack. From the firefighters who charged up smoke-filled staircases to our troops who are serving in Afghanistan today.

But let us also remember who we're fighting against and what we're fighting for. Our enemies respect no religious freedom. Al Qaeda's cause is not Islam; it's a gross distortion of Islam. These are not religious leaders. They're terrorists who murder innocent men and women and children. In fact, al Qaeda has killed more Muslims than people of any other religion. And that list of victims includes innocent Muslims who were killed on 9/11.

So that's who we're fighting against. And the reason that we will win this fight is not simply the strength of our arms; it is the strength of our values, the democracy that we uphold, the freedoms that we cherish, the laws that we apply without regard to race, or religion, or wealth or status.

Our capacity to show not merely tolerance, but respect towards those who are different from us. And that way of life, that quintessentially American creed stands in stark contrast to the nihilism of those who attacked us on that September morning and who continue to plot against us today.

In my inaugural address I said that our patchwork heritage is a strength, not a weakness. We are a nation of Christians, and Muslims, Jews and Hindus, and nonbelievers. We are shaped by every language and every culture, drawn from every end of this earth. And that diversity can bring difficult debates.

This is not unique to our time. Past eras have seen controversies about the construction of synagogues or Catholic Churches. But time and again, the American people have demonstrated that we can work through these issues, and stay true to our core values, and emerge stronger for it. So it must be, and will be today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So you just heard the President's remarks that stirred up the debate to build a mosque and Muslim community center in the shadows of Ground Zero.

But what if I told you there's already a mosque there just blocks away? Details on that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: You know in all of this controversy over the proposed mosque in Manhattan you may not realize that there already is one just blocks from Ground Zero. Masjid Manhattan has been around since 1970 before construction was even finished on the World Trade Center Towers.

Today our Susan Candiotti paid a visit.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Here we are on the corner of Church and Warren Streets in lower Manhattan and about four blocks in that direction is Ground Zero. You can see where that crane is, that's where construction is going on right now. And about halfway between there and here is the proposed site of that controversial Islamic center.

What most people don't know is about a half block from where I'm standing is the site of another very small mosque that has been here for about 40 years in the neighborhood, without one whiff of controversy. I went over there to kind of check things out. This man worships at Masjid Manhattan and he thinks the new mosque should be built.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lot of people got a bad idea of us because of what happened between the 9/11 and all that. They don't represent our religion. They don't represent the Muslim. We want to show to all the people that our religion can be like other people. We can mix with all others like Christian or Jew. Every religion got its problems, but there seem to be more eyes on us right now because of these things.

CANDIOTTI: His mosque has not taken a formal stand on the controversy but says it opposes terrorism and promotes peace.

LUCAS GONZALEZ, LOWER MANHATTAN RESIDENT: It's never been a problem. People at the mosque have always been very respectful.

CANDIOTTI: Lucas Gonzalez has lived next to the mosque since before 9/11. Unlike nearly 70 percent of Americans and more than half of New Yorkers in recent polling, he approves of the proposed cultural center.

GONZAELZ: It's been hard for us to rebuild. And as it goes up slowly, I think that there's some hope there that we can sort of rebuild and come to terms with what's happened to us and the differences that have set us apart.

CANDIOTTI: As time goes on, will both sides simply harden their positions? Or is there -- can there be a compromise? Susan Candiotti, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: All right. Susan, thank you.

So, there's already a mosque near the World Trade Center and now we have to wonder this, if the people who are against the proposed Islamic center know about it. We're going to ask one of them.

Tim Brown is a retired New York City firefighter who survived September 11th. He's also one of the plaintiffs in the lawsuit against the city's Landmark Preservation Commission, the group that made the way for the center and mosque to be built.

We also have Eboo Patel, he is a Muslim and director of the Interfaith Youth Core out of Chicago.

So, thanks to both of you for joining me tonight.

Mr. Brown I'm going to start with you. Did you know there was another mosque near the World Trade Center and does this change your opinion at all in this issue?

TIM BROWN, RETIRED NEW YORK FIREFIGHTER: Yes, we've known for quite awhile there was another mosque there. That mosque is actually, if you look on their Web site, they have disavowed themselves of any relation or association with Imam Rauf's group. And we don't have a problem with them.

Imam Rauf is not the person he portrays himself to be. He has said publicly that he wants to leverage 9/11 for his own advantage.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: Well, just to explain to our viewers -- Imam Rauf is -- Feisal Abdul Rauf is the imam who is behind the mosque, who wants to build this mosque near Ground Zero. He was also -- they said he was going to be sent overseas to try to bridge relationships between Muslims and Americans and many people are against that.

So I understand that you're concerned about that. Let me ask you this. I was going to go here later but I'll do it now.

If Imam Rauf was not involved in this situation, would you feel differently about it? Would you support this mosque?

BROWN: Well, probably not. You know, our issue with it is that this building is being built on a cemetery of our loved ones. I lost 93 of my friends. This building was actually impacted directly by the landing gear of one of the hijacked planes that was slammed into the tower by radical Muslim terrorists.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: Let me ask you, so what did you think of the President's comments on Friday?

BROWN: Well, I think he -- I think he misses the point. They're trying to couch this as a religious freedom and trying to portray us as bigots. And nothing could be further from the truth.

The family -- what happened to the sensitivity going from the Muslim world to the families? That's been brushed aside, and we're supposed to be sensitive to the Muslim world on this.

LEMON: Ok.

BROWN: It's upside down.

LEMON: All right. Mr. Patel, how did you view the President's comments on Friday?

EBOO PATEL, EXEC. DIR., INTERFAITH YOUTH CORE: You know, we expect our leaders in America to stand up for our highest principles and one of the priest principles of America is that we're a nation of people from different backgrounds living in equal dignity and mutual loyalty. Presidents from Washington and Jefferson to Clinton and Bush have stood up for that. President Obama stood up for that as well. I applaud him for that.

LEMON: Ok, so as a Muslim are you afraid that if the Islamic center moves forward that there will be a backlash against Muslims?

PATEL: I'm an American. And I'm a Muslim. And the stated purpose of the Cordoba House is to help build unity and cooperation. That sounds a whole lot like the motto of the United States of America, e pluribus unum, out of many one.

LEMON: All right. You know, I understand.

(CROSS TALKING)

PATEL: Just as if there was a Jewish hospital or a Catholic university at this site I think we ought to welcome a Muslim group who seeks to build the principles of America.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: Ok, let me ask you this, Mr. Patel because I've heard many people say the same thing that you're saying about this. The mayor of New York City says it's about religious freedom. He doesn't want anyone telling him where he could put a synagogue so he doesn't want to tell people where they can put a mosque.

This situation, though, don't you think it's a bit different considering what happened on 9/11? And the people behind this mosque have said that there is a need for it in lower Manhattan. So that's why it's being built there.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: What about 10, 20 blocks midtown Manhattan and considering the circumstances behind this. That's not understandable to you?

PATEL: Don, you know, in America, we don't tell people based on their race or ethnicity or religion that they are free in this place but not that place.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: I understand but there's always context. Mr. Patel there's always context. I don't think anyone is saying against -- against religious freedom or the freedom of expression or any of that. But there's always context.

This is an extraordinary circumstance, and you understand that it is very heated. Many people lost their loved ones on 9/11. And if --

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: -- if building the mosque is going to cause a controversy like this, when it's supposed to be building relations between Christians, Jews, Muslims, Americans, it seems to be doing the exact opposite. So just considering the context here; that's what I'm talking about.

PATEL: Don, I have to tell you, this seems to me a little bit like telling black people 50 years ago, you can sit anywhere on the bus you like, but just not the front.

LEMON: I don't think --

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: I don't think that black people were behind a terrorist plot to kill people and drive planes into a building.

BROWN: That's right. That's a completely different circumstance.

PATEL: And American Muslims were not behind the terrorist plot either.

LEMON: Ok. Go ahead, Mr. Brown.

PATEL: The vile terrorists who -- the vile terrorists who attacked the United States on 9/11 deserve one name and one name alone. That is vile terrorists.

And the American Muslims who are police officers and firefighters, who coach Little League and serve on the PTA deserve another name, an honored name. And that is fellow American.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: I get that, I understand -- listen, I think most people get that. And I don't think that -- we are Americans and we understand that. But as I said there are always extenuating circumstances and there's always context. And I think people are drawing black and white --

PATEL: And the most important thing --

LEMON: Hang on. Will you let me finish, please? I think people are drawing a line in the sand here. It is not a black and white issue, there is context behind this. This is an extenuating circumstance.

I'm not saying the mosque should not be put there but I think that the people who want to put the mosque there should be a little bit more understanding about the people who lost their lives behind this -- there, and -- and how they -- how the people -- their loved ones might feel about a mosque being there. That's all I'm saying.

Mr. Brown go ahead, I know you want to jump in here.

BROWN: Yes, you know, there are hundreds of mosques already in New York City. New York City is the greatest melting pot in the world.

I was a New York City fireman for 20 years. I never stopped at the front door to ask a race, a creed, a religion, you know, are you gay or are you straight, are you man, are you woman? We never, ever did that. If there were -- if there was a Muslim family in there, we were going in the door and we were saving their lives.

Now, we have a problem with the mosque being built on our cemetery. The landing gear went through the roof of that building. That building has never even been checked for human remains of our loved ones. And there are thousands of families that have not recovered one piece of their loved one.

Let me tell you a story about a woman named Janet Casio who lost her son Paul.

(CROSS TALKING)

LEMON: I hope it's short, Mr. Brown, because we're running out of time. If you can do it quickly.

BROWN: She went in and spoke at the Landmark Preservation Commission here and very passionately against the mosque. When she walked out and went to her car she had a heart attack. This is what is being done to the families of 9/11. And I'm -- I'm ashamed that people are saying we're not sensitive to the Muslim world.

LEMON: Ok.

BROWN: Where is the sensitivity back to us?

LEMON: Ok, thank you Mr. Brown. And Mr. Patel, I'm not beating up on you. I just wanted to get that point across. I'm going to let you have the last word because I understand again, it is about religious freedom and it is America. But I think that point has not been brought up enough in this whole controversy here.

Go ahead, and your final thoughts on -- and your reaction to Mr. Brown.

PATEL: Let's not connect the vile terrorists of September 11th to mainstream American Muslims who are your neighbors, who in this case want to help build a center based on interfaith university and cooperation.

I think that in the course of American history, people have opposed the religious communities establishing their institutions, whether it's Catholics or Jews or Mormons or Baptists. But in the end, the forces of interfaith unity have always won. And history will record that once again, in the United States, on our sacred ground, the forces of interfaith unity will win.

LEMON: Mr. Patel, thank you --

(CROSS TALKING)

BROWN: We believe we'll never build that -- that mosque will never be built at Ground Zero.

LEMON: We appreciate both of you joining us tonight on CNN. Thanks again.

One of R&B's biggest stars giving kids a new look on life.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES HARRIS, MEMBER, THE NEW LOOK FOUNDATION: -- weed at school. My two teachers who were like my favorite teachers turned me in. When they turned me in, I felt betrayed.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEVE PERRY, CNN EDUCATION CONTRIBUTOR (voice-over): A couple of years ago, James Harris was a troubled teen with little direction in life.

HARRIS: I got caught with weed at school. My two teachers, they were like my favorite teachers, they turned me in. When they turned me in, I felt betrayed.

PERRY: But those teachers also steered James towards The New Look Foundation, a non-profit founded by Grammy award winning artist Usher.

Kids learn skills with hands-on training that help them develop into leaders in business and their communities.

(on camera): So, how was it that you get these kids hooked in?

USHER RAYMOND IV, FOUNDER, THE NEW LOOK FOUNDATION: It is ultimately about introducing them to real world experiences.

SHAWN WILSON, PRESIDENT, THE NEW LOOK FOUNDATION: We want to train these youth how to take an issue and for them to lead the change, for them to train their peers and for them to get their friends and families involved in solving some of these key issues.

PERRY: You seem to have found a strategy to meet children where they are and get them to do good things for themselves, and others.

WILSON: That is right.

PERRY: Where did that come from?

WILSON: I think it is ultimately started with Usher. He said we want to work with the youth, and we want to do these things, but more importantly, he said that we need to listen to them. Because we don't do that enough in our society; we don't ask kids, what is it that you want and we don't give them a voice.

USHER: A lot of the kids that we have chosen to motivate come from impoverished homes and broken areas, and we can't even begin to deal with all of the issues. But what we can do is to plant a seed that will allow those children to see the light.

PERRY: Steve Perry, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: I'm Don Lemon at CNN world headquarters in Atlanta. See you back here at 10:00 p.m. Eastern. "CNN HEROES: COMING BACK FROM KATRINA" is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)