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Progress Cited at NATO Summit; Bristol's "Dancing" Controversy
Aired November 20, 2010 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening, everyone. I'm Don Lemon. Thanks for joining us.
You know, it was one of the most talked about moments of the week when Brandy was booted off "Dancing with the Stars." So, tonight, we're asking the question that everyone wants to know -- why is Bristol Palin still on the show?
This goes beyond pop culture, beyond entertainment really. It's too politics. And that's why we have assembled our group of experts of political reporter, a radio host and a writer of one of the best entertainment Web sites on the net. They are going to join us in a bit.
Also, the "Housewives of Atlanta" are also here. And they're -- they know reality show. They live it, reality television every day. And you know they don't hold back. They are going to join us in a just a little bit. They're going to share some secrets as well.
And we are dancing with the Stars ourselves. We have some professional dancers here who are going to critique Bristol Palin's performance and also going to critique Brandy's performance as well.
In the meantime, we have some serious news to get you and we're going to do that first here on CNN.
President Barack Obama today wrapped up his participation in the NATO summit in Lisbon, Portugal. The president said he was pleased with the progress made on several important issues including Afghanistan.
CNN's White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux is covering the president's trip for us tonight -- Suzanne.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Don.
After two days of summits with European allies, President Obama outlined a new timetable for the Afghan war when U.S. and NATO troops will start to come home. Now, the big question is whether or not this plan is realistic.
(voice-over): It's the closest thing to an exit strategy President Obama could get.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We agreed that early 2011 will mark the beginning of a transition to Afghan responsibility and we adopted a goal of Afghan forces taking the lead for security across the country by the end of 2014.
MALVEAUX: U.S. and NATO troops remaining in Afghanistan would be focused on training after Afghan security forces. Afghan Leader Hamid Karzai signed the pact earlier with NATO allies, expressing optimism.
PRES. HAMID KARZAI, AFGHANISTAN: We are confident that the transition will succeed to the Afghan authority, leadership and ownership because I found today strong commitment by the international committee.
ANDERS FOGH RASMUSSEN, NATO SECRETARY GENERAL: I don't foresee ISAF troops in a combat role beyond 2014.
MALVEAUX: But the agreement is at best a goal. Privately, there is real skepticism that the Afghan government will be ready to provide security and services to its people. The new NATO agreement bluntly states, for the Afghan government, "corruption remains a central challenge to be addressed."
BAN KI-MOON, U.N. SECRETARY GENERAL: We must be guided by realities not schedules.
MALVEAUX: Russia's president, Dmitry Medvedev, also suggested Afghanistan may not be ready.
PRES. DMITRY MEDVEDEV, RUSSIA (through translator): While it's feasible that in the forthcoming future, I don't know. I have some doubts there.
MALVEAUX: President Obama himself seemed to leave the door open about whether U.S. troops would still be fighting in Afghanistan after 2014. When asked if he'd keep combat troops there after the proposed deadline, he said --
OBAMA: I will always do what's necessary to keep the American people safe. And maybe that will be the case in 2014.
MALVEAUX: But President Obama is eager to get U.S. forces out of this unpopular war. He's already pledged to start pulling out American troops in July of next year. NATO allies are even less patient.
RASMUSSEN: By the end of next year, we have set the goal to have 300,000 Afghan soldiers and Afghan police.
MALVEAUX: Several countries have already said their troops will not remain in combat indefinitely.
A senior British official said British Prime Minister David Cameron repeated here that no matter how violent Afghanistan is at the end of 2014, the British will end combat operations by the next year.
(on camera): It's clear the Obama administration is a great deal of pressure to defeat the Taliban and try to make sure that Afghanistan is stabilized as quickly as possible. At the same time, the president wants to reiterate that -- (END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Apparently, we're having some trouble with Suzanne Malveaux's story, reporting Suzanne Malveaux on the president's trip.
Checking some of your top stories right now:
Pope Benedict says his new book -- in his new book, that he approves the use of condoms in certain cases, to prevent the spread of HIV and AIDS. Now, this from a pontiff who last year publicly said that condoms worsened the spread of AIDS. The Pope's stance is a surprising shift away from the Catholic Church's outright ban on contraception.
Rescuers are scrambling to figure out how far -- how to reach 29 miners trapped in a New Zealand coal mine. Gas levels inside have been too to attempt a rescue. And now, heat could be another factor. There has been no contact with the miners who were trapped by an explosion two days ago. Most are New Zealanders, but there are two Australians there, two Brits and one South African.
You know, it doesn't look like Sarah Palin will be getting an endorsement from former First Lady Barbara Bush anytime soon. Here's what she said in an inclusive interview with Larry King. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KING, HOST, LARRY KING LIVE: What's your read about Sarah Palin?
BARBARA BUSH, FORMER FIRST LADY: I sat next to her once. I thought she was beautiful. And I think she's very happy in Alaska and I hope she'll stay there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. Well, her face says it all. Former President George Bush and Barbara Bush, they're going to join Larry King for a revealing hour. It's only on CNN. It's going to be Monday night, it's 9:00 p.m. Eastern. So, make sure you tune in.
OK. It's Saturday night, so we thought we'd have a little fun around here and not do so much serious stuff. We're going to get you news but we're going to have a little fun.
So, if you've watched TV, if you've listened to the radio, if you searched the Web even a little bit this week, you just couldn't miss this moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: I can now reveal that the couple with the lowest combined total of judges' scores and viewer votes is Brandy and Max.
(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: It's odd because it's one of those moments where everyone was sort of gathering around the television and the water cooler wondering what is going on. Bristol Palin staying alive on "Dancing with the Stars" over Brandy, even though Bristol consistently racks up low scores from the judges.
Sure, it is just a TV show. We know that. But many viewers are getting dead serious about all of this.
And maybe you heard about the guy in Wisconsin who was so angry about Bristol's performance that he allegedly shot at his television. Everybody is talking about this controversy.
So, let's get into it right now.
Maureen O'Connor, hello. She's a reporter. She joins us -- a reporter for Gawker.com. She's in New York tonight.
Warren Ballentine, the host of "The Warren Ballentine Show." I was on his show. We're supposed to talk about other stuff, and we talked about Bristol Palin and "Dancing with the Stars" most of the time.
And then Karin Tanabe is a reporter for "Politico."
And, Karin, this goes beyond, really, popular culture. I'm going to let you talk for us, Karin. This is beyond -- this goes to politics because Sarah Palin is always in the audience. And then they are saying that the Tea Party is helping Bristol Palin here.
KARIN TANABE, REPORTER, "POLITICO": It is. It has become political.
First of all, it's the most popular show on television and people are also calling it now the best campaign ad on television. Twenty million people are tuning into this and they're seeing Sarah Palin there cheering on her daughter.
And, you know, it's causing a lot of uproar. People -- some people are really mad that Bristol is still there. Other people are trying to push the vote out.
There was a site called HillBuzz that said, vote early, vote often, and vote from as many e-mail addresses as you can. They were encouraging people to start, you know, lots of e-mail addresses so they can vote even more for Bristol.
So, there is some controversy.
LEMON: Yes. Listen, I'm going to talk to you other guys. Let's listen to Bristol Palin's response to this and her mom. It's from E! Online and then we'll talk about it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRISTOL PALIN, SARAH PALIN'S DAUGHTER: And when people say that, oh, it's just because of the Tea Party -- I was thinking of, think of all the people out there that hate my mom, like, why don't we talk about that? Why won't that be another topic of conversation? Like it can work both ways, me being Sarah Palin's daughter, they can either hate me or they can love me. And I'm just thankful that we're still in the competition and I really don't care who's voting for us. But, thank you for voting for us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right, Maureen, you heard that.
MAUREEN O'CONNOR, REPORTER, "GAWKER": Well, every time during the election that anybody criticized Sarah Palin, she would always come back just rallying against her haters. You know, she would have this Facebook post saying that these people are criticizing me, let's show them. That's exactly what Bristol does. On her Facebook on Wednesday, she said, all the haters are out to destroy me, and because of that, people just rally around her even more.
I mean, every person on this show is a star. They have all fan bases that will vote for them a million times if they can. But the difference with Bristol is that Tea Party is an organization that came together specifically to vote for people, to have a message and to relay a message. Thus, if they are good at getting out a vote for their candidates, they're going to be good at getting out a vote for a reality star.
LEMON: So --
O'CONNOR: I mean, you could even argue that they are better at getting out their vote for Bristol than they are for their own candidates because they have 100 percent success rate.
LEMON: Warren, I want to talk about this. The executive producer of the "Dancing with the Stars," his name is Conrad Green. Here's what he says -- he says, "There is a strong popular movement behind Sarah Palin at the moment and she's receiving a lot of support from the Tea Party. It's entirely possible some of those people are behind Bristol for political reasons."
Warren?
WARREN BALLENTINE, HOST, "THE WARREN BALLENTINE SHOW": They are behind her for political reasons. It is almost comical to me, Don, because it's "Dancing with the Stars." Bristol Palin isn't an actor. She's nowhere a star in any way. It's just that she's a daughter of Sarah Palin.
If you don't believe this is political, why is Sarah Palin there every show, rooting her daughter on to try to get the votes? And did you see the other dancers' face when the results came out? The professional dancers face, they had their mouths wide open.
Don, I could take one of the "Atlanta Housewives" and beat Bristol Palin at dancing. She can't dance.
LEMON: We're going to ask one maybe ask the "Atlanta Housewives." OK. But, listen, is it -- is it really about talent, though, or is it just really a popularity contest? And I have to say this, Warren, because I know that Brandy went on an Urban Radio blitz which is mostly to -- urban, and that means black radio, right, to try to drum up support.
BALLENTINE: Right.
LEMON: So, Brandy is drumming up African-American support, support of the black community, what's the difference between Bristol Palin --
BALLENTINE: It's no difference, Don. But this -- but we got to look at the demographics here. Let's just be honest. Urban America is not watching "Dancing with the Stars" the way the Tea Party movement is and urban American does not have that connection of "We have to prove them wrong" like the Tea Party is having when it comes to Bristol Palin.
Look, if you watch this last "Dancing with the Stars," she looked like Elvira sliding across the floor. This girl cannot dance. This is strictly political --
LEMON: Warren, that's a little -- that's -- don't you think that's a little harsh?
BALLENTINE: It's the truth, Don. It is the truth.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Yes, but it's rude. And I don't know if people would be saying that if it were anyone other than Sarah Palin's daughter. I mean --
BALLENTINE: No. No. No.
LEMON: I mean, she's not the best dancer in the world. But to compare her to Elvira, come on, Warren.
BALLENTINE: OK. I take it back. She's not -- she's not as bad as Elvira. But she didn't beat Brandy. So, let's just be honest here.
I'm doing do my Kanye West. I'm sorry, you won. But Brandy had the best audition that day. She should have won.
LEMON: Yes. You did a Kanye West. But guess what? There are a lot of people say that, you know, Bristol Palin deserves to be where she is because she is the underdog and America loves an underdog story.
Stay with us. Stay with us. Stay with us, because we've got another situation at hand, coming up and some dancers here to help us out as well.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right. Thanks for joining us on a Saturday night. Hope you're enjoying it. You got a little beverage and some popcorn.
Warren Ballentine is here from "The Warren Ballentine Show." He is here along with Karin Tanabe, who is a reporter for "Politico." And also, Maureen O'Connor, Gawker.com. I read "Gawker" all the time. Hey, thanks for the article you guys wrote about me.
O'CONNOR: We're glad.
LEMON: It was funny. One writer thought I was mad at him for writing about it.
But I do have say -- I have to disclose this, Maureen, that you're here, that Sarah Palin's publisher is suing "Gawker," by the way, from releasing excerpts from her book. I know that you can't talk about it. You're not a legal representative of "Gawker." But you do work for them. So, we just wanted to disclose that.
Let's talk now about the situation. We have a show here called "THE SITUATION ROOM." Let's talk about The Situation and Bristol Palin. Look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PALIN: I know how hard it is to be a teen parent.
MIKE "THE SITUATION" SORRENTINO, REALITY STAR: You know what? I totally respect that and I totally respect abstinence. I mean, it actually has the word "abs" in it. I mean, come on, I'm The Situation. I love that.
PALIN: Very funny. But I'm worried about you and you practicing safe sex.
SORRENTINO: I actually practice a whole lot. I mean, a whole lot.
PALIN: I'm talking about the safe part of that.
SORRENTINO: The safe part, we got to safe part down pat. Wa-pow, Magnums. You know what?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. So, that is from her foundation, the Candies Foundation. I kept saying you know you could have flipped roles -- Warren, did you remember what I said to you, you could have flipped roles and that could have been Levi Johnston in that ad.
BALLENTINE: Yes.
LEMON: That would have been very effective, don't you think?
BALLENTINE: I think it would have been effective. And, you know, I'm happy to see these guys doing this PSA like this because it's so important to put that message out there about teen pregnancy.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: And, you know, a lot of people, Warren, laughed at that, saying, oh, it was funny, it was goofy. But I actually thought it was a serious, it was a very serious message and that it was important. And they may not be the best actors like they're not the best dancers. Both of them were on "Dancing with the Stars," by the way. Go ahead, Warren, sorry.
BALLENTINE: Yes, I was going to say, you know, I was going to say just that. I don't know if they were the best actors to do this but it's a necessary message. The only thing I wonder, Don, and I have to wonder this out loud, it's been millions of teenage moms and it's just amazing to me how the Republican Party has this hypocritical stance that it's OK to be a teen parent now, now that Bristol Palin is a teen parent. And I'm just a little confuse by that.
But if the message and PSA is to stop teen pregnancy I'm all for it. And I applaud them for doing that.
LEMON: And maybe this is -- maybe this is a look forward.
OK. Back to reality now. Back to "Dancing with the Stars" -- Tom DeLay is a political person and was on "Dancing with the Stars."
Go ahead, Maureen.
O'CONNOR: You know, it's interesting we've seen three prominent or rather, including the Palins, we've seen several Republicans on "Dancing with the Stars." You have Tom DeLay. We have, you know, the whole Palin family out in full force. Tucker Carlson was on "Dancing with the Stars."
Interestingly, and we also, in January, we'll have our first reality star who becomes a politician, Representative Sean Duffy, representing Wisconsin's seventh district, was on the real world, where, of course, he was famous for getting in fights with his party (ph) mates and saying he had never met black people before who was in the real world. And now, he's a politician, too.
(CROSSTALK)
BALLENTINE: Wow.
LEMON: Is this what we've come to, April? I mean, really. April?
TANABE: You know, reality TV --
LEMON: Karin, sorry. I'm sorry, Karin.
O'CONNOR: I'm like, who is April?
LEMON: I have April in my head.
Karin, is this what we've come to?
TANABE: I think this actually is what we've come to. I have talked to image consultants about this recently and they've said this is gold. This is like, you know, Emerald City. They would tell any politician to do this sort of softer TV. It gives a different look at these candidates. It gives them great exposure without, you know, them saying, hey, I want this exposure.
And, you know, 20 million people watch "Dancing with the Stars," plus 5 million people who tuned into to Sarah Palin's reality show, that's 25 million people watching the Palin women.
LEMON: OK.
TANABE: Like three days a week.
BALLENTINE: Don, that's it, Don. That's it. That's it. I can see Russia out the backyard of my house, too.
(LAUGHTER)
TANABE: Well, that's actually -- that's the promo for Sarah Palin's show. You can see Alaska from her living room.
LEMON: She does make -- she makes fun of it on herself, on her show as well. She will make fun of that.
BALLENTINE: I'm a refudiate what you just said to me right there.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: You know, we should stop bashing Sarah Palin. Warren, you're bad. April, wherever you are, I have no idea who April is. April was in my head.
So, my producers were like, who is April? I'm like, I don't know. Oh, someone's waving. April is over there, that's why I had April in my head, someone here in our studio.
Guys, you're awesome. Thank you very much. I really appreciate you being here.
BALLENTINE: Thank you, Don.
TANABE: Thank you.
LEMON: I will be reading and listening to all of you.
TANABE: Thank you.
LEMON: OK.
BALLENTINE: Thanks, Don.
LEMON: Don't go anywhere.
O'CONNOR: Thanks.
LEMON: We have some ball room dancers here in the studio to critique Brandy and Bristol's dance moves and show us some of their own.
Plus, what is it really like to be on a reality show? What's Bristol Palin going through right now? We're going to talk about it with one of the "Real Housewives of Atlanta." She's here and looking gorgeous.
Hi.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right. Welcome back. Everyone, hope you are enjoying your Saturday night.
Hey, how are you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm doing great.
LEMON: Dahlia Ayitiva (ph). That's how you see it, Ayitiva. And your partner is going to join you just a little bit.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
LEMON: So, listen, I want you to take a look at this and we're going to bring your partner and we're going to talk about it.
First up, right, for the critique, because it's Bristol Palin's last performance on "Dancing with the Stars."
(VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. So --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, you can definitely see that she's nervous because you're seeing that -- you know, you can see that she's kind concentrating on her steps which a little bit limits her movements, et cetera. But from my watching "Dancing with the Stars," you can definitely see that she's improving every week for sure. But, you know, it definitely needs a lot of improvement.
LEMON: All right. Rainier come in here. Both of you guys are from Allure Dance Studio here in Atlanta.
RAINIER RICS, DANCE INSTRUCTOR: That's right.
LEMON: So, you are watching the performance as well. What did you think technically about what she has done?
RICS: You know, one of the things we like as dance teachers when we teach our students all the time and when we perform, we want to at least stand up and have this presence and this energy. And as you know in show business, or --
LEMON: Yes.
RICS: -- in show business. But in show business, we want to have this energy that presents outward and performs. And it does look like that she's not a performer.
LEMON: OK. Hang on. Let's look at the Brandy performance. Roll that one for us and we'll talk about it.
(VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: OK. So, here's the thing as you look at that. Obviously -- I mean, it looks good. I don't know because I'm not a dancer nor or a judge or what-have-you. How does she look technically?
RICS: You know, technically, I'd say she looks a little bit better. She looks more comfortable performing.
LEMON: Well, she's a performer.
RICS: Exactly.
LEMON: So, she has an advantage. And the other, the lady who was, was it "Foot Loose." She's a dancer.
RICS: Right. And an actress.
LEMON: So, she has advantage as well. Yes. All right. So
RICS: But, technically, I think they are very close to being the same. I mean, the things that we yell at our students on, I think both improved. But they're doing great considering they have so little time to get ready each week to do a performance.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely.
LEMON: And guess what? You guys are going to do a performance.
RICS: Oh, my good.
LEMON: Are you ready?
RICS: I feel ready.
LEMON: Are you ready?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
LEMON: All right. When we come back these guys are going to do a performance.
And what's it really like to be a reality star? What's it really like? We are going to ask one of the "Housewives of Atlanta" in just a bit here on CNN.
Also, these guys are going to dance for us. Are you going to do the same dance that Bristol and --
RICS: We're going to try a cha-cha for you.
LEMON: A cha-cha. All right. I'll leave it at that.
We're back in a moment. Plus, some other news here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: OK. We're dancing here on CNN. I'm not going to even try because I'm not really that good.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You should try some time.
LEMON: I'll try. I did. Actually, I'll tell you later.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Great.
LEMON: The dancers are back and they're going to perform. Rainer Rics has been teaching dance since 1990. He has competed at the professional level. And Dahlia Ayitiva is a professional dancer. And they are both with Allure Dance Studio in Atlanta. Take it away. We'll be judging.
(MUSIC)
LEMON: Listen, that's the thing. That is a true dancer. Her microphone fell off. You just grabbed it and scooped right it up.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You have to do whatever you got to do.
LEMON: That is exhausting. I can't imagine when people going, people who are not dancers like the people who go on "Dancing with the Stars," just to give -- to cut Bristol Palin some slack, that's a tough thing and to do it in front of the entire country.
RICS: She is doing awesome. She's just being compared to some people who are professional performers. Brandy filled stadiums. Doesn't she fill auditoriums? She performs all the time.
LEMON: So, listen, why what is it about dancing now, especially that the country has caught on to this "Dancing with the Stars" and now we have politicians, vice versa becoming reality stars. What is it about dancing that does that?
RICS: Do you want to take that one?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't have a mic.
RICS: Well, then, you know, one of the things I have heard Erin Andrews say and Kelly Osborne say is one of the things that they find about ball room dancing is that it's a therapeutic thing for them. It gets them over something they just recently had in their lives and it gets something to focus on themselves. You have so much performing energy out that they have to have self-confidence in everything they do. They get taught to have self-confidence in their movements. I think that is the number one thing I have encountered in my own students is after they have been dancing for a few years, they have a certain self-confidence about themselves.
DAHLIA AITOVA, BALLROOM DANCER: And dancing is definitely a form of expression. You know, so you express yourself in different ways.
HOLMES: Hello, doll. How are you? Good to see you. So listen, is that true? Does it give you confidence? You are not dancing but becoming a reality star.
Did you say a reality star?
RICS: Come here, honey. You get in front here.
You know what they are used to performing and they're used to being in crowds and in front of a spotlight even in front of the audience. That's very important. So I'm sure. Like Brandy. Her performance was different because she is an actor.
HOLMES: OK. Hold it right there. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.
AITOVA: You guys were wonderful.
HOLMES: I did a whole "Saturday Night Fever" thing and I came in second.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You did?
HOLMES: Yes, I did. So listen, some secrets from the "Housewives." Let us in.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh.
HOLMES: And what do you think about all this reality. We can call it reality world right now. She is going to join us in a little bit. Stick around behind the scenes. The "Housewives." All right. So listen, don't worry. We haven't forgotten about your daily news.
President Barack Obama has weighed in on all the outrage that's directed at the TSA. We will tell you what he said, coming up here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: You may recognize this beautiful face, not mine, that one right there.
LISA WU HARTWELL, DWTS, REALITY STAR: You are very, very sweet.
LEMON: Lisa Wu Hartwell and she was part of the "Atlanta Housewives." You were the first. You were at the first season, right?
HARTWELL: Yes, first and second.
LEMON: We are going to talk about, we are going to dish, as they say about the "Housewives" -
HARTWELL: Oh, dish.
LEMON: But let's talk about this whole thing. Are you surprised at this whole - I'm shocked that I don't watch "Dancing with the Stars." I'm shocked that it is so huge. It's even everywhere. I went on to talk about serious political show on a radio show and all we did is talk about Bristol Palin.
HARTWELL: Yes, right. So there is a lot of politics in even that show, I mean, or even a lot of the shows. I mean, the popularity. She is very popular. So, you know, I mean people are going to vote for her.
LEMON: Is it shocking - I can only imagine how a teenage girl would react to that much - of course, it happened to her with her mom.
HARTWELL: Right.
LEMON: But still, now it is just on her. That's tough.
HARTWELL: I mean, you know, I think she's had, you know, the thing with having the baby. I think she is kind of used to the attention, you know, but it is just now it is focused on her and she is doing her thing. I mean, it's great. You know but -
LEMON: But there is politics involved, too.
HARTWELL: There is.
LEMON: On your show, that didn't happen. That's the interesting thing.
HARTWELL: Politics.
LEMON: Well, not politics in a way, you know -
HARTWELL: There is politics in everything. Dish huh?
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: I'm listening.
HARTWELL: No. It is crazy. The show, reality shows are crazy. I mean, people love to watch it because they think it is a train wreck, you know, and they love to laugh.
LEMON: I'm glad you said train wreck. Stop right there. Can we run a clip of Lisa in a confrontation with -
HARTWELL: With who?
(CROSSTALK)
HARTWELL: Oh, flip me over the couch, right?
LEMON: Yes. Go for it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I had to invite you out because I feel like there are a lot of things that transpired that I'm uncomfortable with. I'm sure you are as well. I mean, would you like to talk first? UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How would you like to do it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: That was mild.
HARTWELL: That was very mild.
LEMON: But you guys there has been some hair pulling. There has been what you guys call heffa. I mean, come on.
HARTWELL: You've never heard that come out of my mouth. That is probably why I'm not really no longer on the show. I'm doing cameos. Like I peek in, peek out.
LEMON: Is that why? Was enough enough?
HARTWELL: I mean, I don't know. You know, it was a mutual decision but sometimes I think the show - that show is the number one show in our demographics on cable. I mean, really, not to say about the "Real Housewives of Atlanta" and their producers. I'm just saying any producer of reality TV, the pressure to stay on top is there. You know, sometimes it's not even the producers. It is not just the cast mates who want to give that extra because they want to stand out.
LEMON: Cynthia was supposed to join us but she couldn't and she may join us next week or what have you.
HARTWELL: I doubt it.
LEMON: You don't think she is going to join?
HARTWELL: Probably not.
LEMON: Why not? Tell me.
HARTWELL: I just don't think so.
LEMON: I'm listening.
HARTWELL: I'm no longer on the show. I'm doing movies. I'm doing - you know. I'm doing a movie with -
LEMON: You don't you think - we're going to talk about what you're doing now but why don't you think she is going to come?
HARTWELL: Well, I just don't think so. You are afraid to talk and you're afraid to talk about, you know, behind the scenes. It is politics.
LEMON: Like what behind the scenes, Lisa?
HARTWELL: Listen to him, my god. I mean, you know, you are censored. You get slapped on the wrist a little bit. So I mean, I will probably get slapped on the wrist. Really, what am I exposing. Probably what people expect is that reality shows are - yes, they are reality to, you know, I got to tell you the first and second season, the drama was real. People would always ask me that. They were like is that drama really real. Are the fights real? I'm like, you know, unfortunately, yes, and it is sad, right?
But then when the ratings become so huge, you know, the pressure to stay on top, you know, but then the cast mates are willing to do that without the producers edging them on. They do it on their own.
LEMON: And you know, there are some people who say you guys make black people look bad.
HARTWELL: I've heard that.
LEMON: You are a bad representation of black women.
HARTWELL: Yes, I've heard that. My thing is this is that, you know, you have five strong women, now they have six or seven, I haven't really watched the new season but you know, how could we possibly represent all of Atlanta.
LEMON: OK. Since you are not censored, what is going on this season?
HARTWELL: Oh, my.
LEMON: Who really hates each other and what about Nini and the nose job and did she get lipo or -
HARTWELL: I liked her nose before she had the nose job. I did. And if she would have consulted with me I would have told her, you know, you are fine the way you are.
LEMON: Is the weight loss natural?
HARTWELL: Is it natural? She was losing weight before she had some nip and tucks. Yes, she was.
LEMON: But she had some nips and tucks.
HARTWELL: Yes, but there's nothing wrong with that. I commend that. You know, hey, go got to fix it. Go ahead and do it.
LEMON: We have to run. What are you doing now?
HARTWELL: I'm doing an episodic that Charles Duke is writing and directing, it's called "Must be the Music." I'm excited to play his wife on that. And I have a book. "When the Cake is Made." You have to get it. (INAUDIBLE)
LEMON: OK. We are going to dish more.
HARTWELL: I know you want more?
LEMON: We are going to get more. Trust me.
HARTWELL: OK. LEMON: Keep it rolling. Maybe we will put it on line. Yes, we have a lot more coming up. (INAUDIBLE) We have a lot more coming up on CNN. So don't go anywhere.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right. Time now for the news here on CNN.
A look now at some of your top stories. A manhunt is underway for a gunman who shot a park ranger in Utah. The ranger was shot three times and is now in critical condition. He was gunned down Friday night after confronting the suspect in a parking lot just outside of a park trail.
NATO says it will stay in Afghanistan long term beyond 2014. The target date it had set for turning over security to Afghan troops. President Barack Obama who is attending the NATO summit in Lisbon, Portugal says the handover will begin next July. That's when U.S. plans to start reducing its force levels. Right now, the U.S. has about 100,000 troops in Afghanistan. NATO has a security force of about 40,000 troops from 48 countries.
President Barack Obama says he understands a growing protest against full body scans and pat downs at airports but he says, the enhanced security measures are necessary for your safety. The president says TSA has been under intense pressure to tighten pressure after the attempted underwear bombing on Christmas day last year. And right now, he says these measures are most effective.
For the first time in 40 years they played football today inside the ivy covered walls at Chicago's Wrigley Field. Wrigley, of course, is home for the Chicago Cubs. I think it is a beautiful stadium. It needs some repair, but it looks great. It has not hosted a football game since the Chicago Bears moved out in 1971. Northwestern and Illinois played there today but they faced the major obstacle with one end zone flushed against a wall. Now that prompted officials to run all offensive plays toward the other end zone. Interesting. By the way Illinois won 48-27.
Man, we covered this story extensively. Remember the drama, those 33 Chilean miners? Well, they are living it up right now and Hollywood style. The seemingly invincible group got celebrity treatment touring L.A. this weekend. The miners and their rescuers are in town to attend the fourth annual "CNN Heroes All Star Tribute" as special guests.
Their resilient spirit, really the spirit of CNN Heroes. And that's why we brought them there. CNN's Gary Tuchman who covered their harrowing rescue. He joins us now from L.A..
Hey, Gary, I understand you have been watching. Were you dancing and before we get to the miners, were you dancing with the dancers here?
GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I was dancing in the studio in Los Angeles, Don. I hope you invite me when I'm back in Atlanta. Because that is a perfect place for dancing. So if you get a good partner for me, I'm happy to do it on the show.
LEMON: Hey, listen. It's interesting you have been traveling with these guys when they got off the plane. You've been following them. Do people treat them like stars?
TUCHMAN: Well, with all due respect to your previous guest, the ultimate dramatic reality show was last month when those miners came out of the mine. Because of that they are just huge celebrities. Everyone loves them. They're absolutely great guys. They have been touring Southern California. I've been going with them the last three days. It's been a wonderful assignment. We actually went on a double decker bus to tour Hollywood and Beverly Hills.
This great moment came when they started singing and dancing on the bus. We were right outside Grauman's Chinese Theater where celebrities put their handprints. We were five minutes away from Cher, the great actress, singer, showing up to put her handprint at Grauman's Chinese Theater cement. But this is what's so funny. All the paparazzi was there for Cher but they looked up on the bus and said those look like the Chilean miners. They realized it's the miners and they didn't know what to do with their cameras, point toward Cher, point toward the miners. They ended up doing both.
LEMON: All right. So Gary, listen, I know you are a serious news guy but it's when you're out in Hollywood, it is the paps. Not the paparazzi.
TUCHMAN: Oh. I have to get the lingo right. So yes, the pats.
LEMON: Paps.
TUCHMAN: Yes, OK. I'll use the Hollywood lingo for the rest of this. But we left Hollywood, this is important, Don. We left Hollywood and we went to Universal Studios. Actually, it's part - it's closer to Burbank. And we went on this ride. This is more serious. Amazing 3-D realistic thing where dinosaurs and King Kong come to your tram. When we entered it was very dark and it was like the mine and car started shaking back and forth. Seriously, I wanted to see what the reaction of the miners are going to be. In Spanish, a couple of them said here we go again. But they were joking. After it was all over, I said did any you have any flashbacks? Or did it disturb you at all? Well, what they told us, no. We knew this was fun and we just had a great time.
LEMON: It was their first time outside of Chile, which was interesting. It would love to have been, to witness their reaction up close and personal, you know, seeing America that way.
TUCHMAN: Yes, that's the amazing thing. For most of the miners and they all brought family members with them. It was only their second time on an airplane. Their first time was last week. I was down in Chile with them last week. They were on an airplane because they had to fly from Copiaco, near where the mine is to Santiago to get their visas to go on this trip. So for many of them, it's their first plane ride and this was their second plane ride, flew nine hours to Atlanta, connected in Atlanta and four hours to Los Angeles. And they're having the time of their lives. I must emphasize this. They are absolutely great people. We're so happy for them and their families.
LEMON: Well, make sure you give them our his and hellos and tell them congratulations, we're very happy for them. Gary, are you a dancer? Are you a good dancer?
TUCHMAN: No, no. I am a dancer, question one. The second one, no, I'm not a good dancer. Those are the answers to those two questions.
LEMON: You're one of those guys we see at weddings who we say that guy should not dance. Thank you, Gary Tuchman. Enjoy it. Enjoy it.
Nearly two million of you have voted on what Gary Tuchman was talking about and it has come down to this. See who will be the next CNN hero. Watch "CNN Heroes An All-Star Tribute" Thanksgiving night, it's 8:00 p.m. Eastern and of course, it is right here on CNN.
And up next on CNN, kids overwhelmed at school. We'll talk with the documentary filmmaker who found students are anxious, depressed and really cheating their way through high school, leaving them unprepared for what lies ahead in college.
Plus a homeless man discovers a backpack full of cash. He returns it. We'll have details coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Some recent documentaries have focused attention on problems in the nation's school system. Now one of the films, "The Race to Nowhere" looks at how the pressure to succeed maybe creating students who are stressed out and who are unprepared. CNN's education contributor Steve Perry talks with the film's director in this edition of "Perry's Principles."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
STEVE PERRY, CNN EDUCATION CONTRIBUTOR: For Vicki Abeles, the decision to make her first film was personal. Her seventh grade daughter was so concerned about school that she began having panic attacks.
VICKI ABELES, DIRECTOR "RACE TO NOWHERE": I wanted to understand what was going on. I started talking to parents in my community, to students, to experts, and visiting schools across the country.
PERRY: In her work on "Race to Nowhere," she says she discovered many children who were overwhelmed with homework, tests, activities and the pressures to succeed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everyone expects us to be superheroes.
ABELES: We are seeing kids who are anxious, who are depressed, who are and cheating to just get through high school. We are then, in the long term seeing, kids are arriving in college burned out, unprepared to do the kind of thinking that are required at the college level.
PERRY: But for me, what's interesting about the film is hearing some of the suggested ways in which schools can be improved.
(on camera): Some having to do with less or no homework on certain days.
ABELES: We're not saying no homework (INAUDIBLE). Let's see what the research says around homework and let's do quality homework at the right time and the right amount developmentally. We're advocating for is a balanced approach to education and we need to move away from a one size fits all approach. I think we need to look at the individual student. For me, the solution is bringing communities together to have a dialogue
PERRY (voice-over): Since the film was released in September, there's been hundreds of screenings across the country followed by discussions.
ABELES: It's important that you use (INAUDIBLE), it takes time and commitment to do the, but I can't think of anything else more important.
PERRY: Steve Perry, Briar Cliff Manor, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Out of money and living in a shelter, an Arizona man finds a backpack full of cash, so what does he do next? You might be surprised.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: So every weekend we like to bring you some interesting news items that you might have missed during the weak. This one is about the so-called Barefoot Bandit. He has pleaded innocent in Seattle to federal charges stemming from an alleged multi-state crime spree. 19- year-old Colton Harris Moore is alleged to have stolen and crashed as many as five small planes, sometimes while not wearing shoes, while on the run for two years. He was arrested in the Bahamas in July after allegedly crashing a plane and then trying to flee in a boat before police shot out the engine. He is being tried in Seattle on five counts carrying a possible 43 years in prison.
An Arizona homeless man is learning the value of honesty right now. His name is Dave Tally. He's called a shelter, a home now for the past 11 years. While earlier this month he found a backpack containing a lap top and $3,300 in cash. He gave it to the shelter manager who tracked down the rightful owner. Can you believe that? Amazing, that's great. Now Tally is getting lots of publicity, even donations from strangers. So why didn't he keep the backpack? As he put it, "it wasn't my money." See, changes what you think about homeless people, right?
The TSA has been booted out of one U.S. airport, we're talking about Orlando Sanford International Airport, a small airport outside the city. It says the stricter new screening procedures really go too far, look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY DALE, PRES. ORLANDO SANFORD AIRPORT AUTHORITY: The pat down, standard pat down procedures that I have seen demonstrated that I can't do as a law enforcement officer unless I have probable cause to put cuffs on you and take you to jail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So here's what the airport is going to do. It's going to hand over airport screening here, being done by the TSA to a private company. A lot of people are asking, should it be done in the rest of the airports like that too. That is permitted, it is permitted under federal rules. The government still has to approve the new company and the private screeners will have to follow TSA rules, by the way, but the airport thinks a private company will be more responsive to passenger complaints and get the job done and get it done cheaper.
Hundreds of millions of dollars will be divided among ground zero workers in New York City who were exposed to toxic debris after the 9/11 attacks. More than 95 percent of the sum of 10,000 people who worked at Ground Zero had to approve this deal which is worth at least $625 million. Lawyers for the first responders said that they were not outfitted properly for rescuing clean-up efforts leaving them exposed to toxic dust that later caused respiratory problems.
We hope you enjoyed it tonight. I had fun.
See you back here at 10:30. Meantime, "Escape from Jonestown" starts right now.
