Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Newsroom
Sheriff: Gunman Targeted Congresswoman Giffords; Investigators Search for Second Suspect in Today's Shooting
Aired January 08, 2011 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm CNN's Wolf Blitzer. We're here in Washington. We're following dramatic developments in Tucson, Arizona. A killing spree earlier in the day. We're following the breaking news. We're not leaving this story.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Wolf Blitzer, thank you. Wolf, stick around. We're going to need your help during our coverage. I'm Don Lemon in at the CNN mall headquarters in Atlanta. Investigators in Arizona right now are aggressively searching for a second person in today's mass shooting at a supermarket, killing a federal judge and critically wounding a U.S. congresswoman.
Democratic representative, Gabrielle "Gabby" Giffords was meeting with constituents about noon eastern time, 10:00 A.M. local time, when a gunman stepped up and began firing at very close range. Now despite a bullet passing through Giffords' brain -- Giffords' brain, doctors believe that she will survive this.
Six others, however, were not so lucky. Among them, Federal Judge John M. Roll, who was about to mark his 20th year on the bench. Sheriff Clarence Dupnik says Roll had just attended mass nearby and stopped by to say hello to Giffords. The sheriff said it appeared the gunman was targeting Giffords and that the judge was simply in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Twelve people, including the congresswoman, were wounded in that attack. Now bystanders tackled the alleged gunman. He has been identified as 22-year-old Jared Lee Loughner. A nine millimeter handgun was recovered. A second individual is now being sought as a person of interest.
Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DUPNIK: We're not convinced that he acted alone. There is some reason to believe that he came to this location with another individual. And there's reason to believe that the other individual in some way be involved.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: We want to go right to CNN's Ted Rowlands. He is in Tucson outside of the hospital. Ted, you're hearing stories. I just heard you speak with people who are there and are waiting to hear about their loved ones and people who had -- but there were victims of this crime.
TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Don, the scene here, as you might imagine, is -- is a lot of different emotions, a lot of people are very somber. There is a candlelight vigil outside the hospital. Inside the hospital, there are a lot of people that are desperate for news -- desperate for good news, inside the hospital.
One of the folks that is injured -- there are 10 of them in total at this facility -- is the congresswoman. She is out of surgery. She was responding to commands after surgery. Doctors here say that is a great sign. They are very optimistic about her recovery. However, with a -- a brain injury, she suffered one gunshot that went through her head, in one side, out the other, went through her brain. Swelling is a -- a huge potential problem being monitored in the IC unit as we speak.
Her husband is there, and her parents are there. One of the folks that has also been in the hospital throughout the day is Steve Farley. He holds her old state seat here in Arizona. And you've been with the family -- with supporters. Give us first the -- what you've -- what you've been hearing about her condition, again, and -- and set the scene inside that hospital for us.
STEVE FARLEY: Well, we're -- we're very optimistic. We know that she's a fighter. Certainly he last campaign proved that she's a fighter, and we believe she can come through this with flying colors. In the hospital, there's a -- a lot of family members of all the different people who have been injured, in some case, killed here. And a lot of what's happening is we're giving each other support, a lot of hugging, a lot of quiet contemplation, a lot of thinking about what this means for us and our future. And -- and it's -- it's about really taking care of those people that need to be taken care of right now.
ROWLANDS: You have a very complex situation where the congresswoman obviously is fighting for her life. Her chief of staff injured as well, went through surgery also in -- in the ICU unit trying to recover. And you had another staffer who died. A young man that was killed at -- at the scene. Give us a sense of what the people close to the congresswoman are going through right now given all of the complexities of the emotions.
FARLEY: It's been very tough. I mean, we -- when we were in there this morning, it was like a bubble of truth in which we knew the truth about the conditions of people but we kept hearing rumors from the outside of people texting us and saying, for instance, that the congresswoman had died. And it was very disturbing for the family. And -- and that -- that was -- that was very difficult at the time. And we knew the truth. We even started doubting ourselves.
And -- are coming in and saying we heard this stuff all over. But it -- it -- it's hard. What -- the thing that really comes over and above this is this spirit of love that's coming from people. And it's people inside and people outside. And we've had this vigil here on the lawn in front of the...
ROWLANDS: Which has been growing throughout the day, and -- and really...
FARLEY: It's been growing and I think it will continue happening as people hear about it because there is -- Gabby is the sort of person who inspired love and hope in all those around her. And what I was telling the crowd was that you can't stop hope with a bullet. You can't stop love with a bullet. And I think the people of Tucson and the people of Arizona will rise above this.
We are not like this as a people, here or in the rest of the country.
ROWLANDS: Your campaign manager was at the scene of the time of the shooting. He also is a nurse and you say he -- he may have helped save her life. Explain what he did and when you saw him, he apparently was covered in blood. What happened?
FARLEY: He was staffing that event. He was in the back of the room. The shots rang out in the front of the room. He -- he had said actually that he was giving out clipboards to people. One person took it with a very angry, strange, brusque way. And he later saw that person running away. So he -- he kind of knew what happened. There were people all over on the floor. And he went to Gabby's side and kept pressure on the wound, kept her talking and active until the ambulance came about ten minutes later. And then rode with her to the hospital and helped them out along the way in the hospital.
And I really think he is a hero who -- who in many ways saved her life.
ROWLANDS: Her parents are here. Her husband, Mark Kelly, who is an -- a NASA astronaut, flew from Houston. He apparently is also here at her side?
FARLEY: Yes. He is here. He got here mid-afternoon. So he's here by her side as well.
ROWLANDS: When will you hear an update and -- and what are the next 24 hours -- 24 to 48 hours entail for her and her struggle?
FARLEY: Well this type of surgery obviously takes a while to recover from. And then it's a while before you find out details about the prognosis. But the surgeon is very optimistic about this, being able to be a recovery that is -- that is a good one. So we'll find out. There will be different -- there's different things we'll probably hear during the night. But I'm -- I'm really optimistic that Gabby is a fighter and she's going to fight through this one for herself and for all of us.
ROWLANDS: Steve Farley, thanks for your insight on what is happening inside that hospital.
Don, this is the same facility where that 9-year-old girl was brought immediately after the shooting and pronounced dead. So as you can imagine, a lot of pain inside and a lot of hope outside here at this vigil, hoping that the folks that are still injured will recover.
LEMON: Sad to say, but the reality -- it is just beginning. Thank you, Ted Rowlands. Stand by. We'll be getting back to you.
I want to go back to Washington now and CNN's Wolf Blitzer. Wolf, even the president weighing in on this today.
BLITZER: It -- it really has outraged everyone from the president and the vice president on down. Everyone in Washington, all the important Democrats, for sure, and many of the Republicans, they're all weighing in. They're expressing their outrage.
She was really beloved here in Washington. Still is -- Gabrielle Giffords. Everyone seemed to -- to know her as a fighter and she's fighting right now for her life. Earlier, the president made a point of coming out and speaking to the American people.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: As many of you are aware, earlier today, a number of people were shot in Tucson, Arizona, including several who were meeting at a supermarket with their congresswoman, Gabrielle Giffords. We are still assembling all the facts. But we know that representative Giffords was one of the victims. She is currently at a hospital in the area. And she is battling for her life.
We also know that at least five people lost their lives in this tragedy. Among them were a federal judge, John Roll, who has served America's legal system for almost 40 years, and a young girl who was barely 9 years old.
I've spoken to Arizona Governor, Jan Brewer and offered the full resources of the federal government. A suspect is currently in custody but we don't yet know what provoked this unspeakable act. A comprehensive investigation is currently under way. And at my direction, Director Bob Mueller is en route to Arizona to help coordinate these efforts.
I've also spoken to the Democratic and Republican leaders in the house. Gabby Giffords was a friend of mine. She is not only an extraordinary public servant, but she is also somebody who is warm and caring. She is well-liked by her colleagues and well-liked by her constituents. Her husband, Mark Kelly, is a navy captain and one of America's valiant astronauts. It's not surprising that today Gabby was doing what she always does -- listening to the hopes and concerns of her neighbors. That is the essence of what our democracy is all about.
That is why this is more than a tragedy for those involved. It is a tragedy for Arizona, and a tragedy for our entire country. What Americans do at times of tragedy is to come together and support each other. And so at this time, I ask all Americans to join me and Michelle in keeping all the victims and their families, including Gabby, in our thoughts and prayers.
Those who have been injured, we are rooting for them. And I know Gabby is as tough as they come. And I am hopeful that she is going to pull through. Obviously our hearts go out to the family members of those who -- who have been slain. We are going to get to the bottom of this. And we're going to get through this. But in the meantime, I think all of us need to make sure that we're offering our thoughts and prayers to those concerned.
Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: That was the president earlier today. We've also learned the new House Speaker, John Boehner -- he'll be making a statement tomorrow morning 8:30 a.m. eastern. CNN will have live coverage of that as well. The new speaker also ordering the Majority Leader, Eric Cantor, to announce that they're going to suspend, with -- withhold activity at least on the repeal of the health care reform law scheduled for a vote next Wednesday.
That's not going to happen right now because of what's happened out in Tucson. Representative Gabrielle Giffords is relatively new to the capitol but she's certainly no stranger to public service. We'll discuss who she is. That's coming up next.
LEMON: And police have a suspect in custody, Wolf. As you've been reporting. And they are looking for one more person of interest. We're getting new details about the suspect and the investigation. Much, much more ahead here on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Welcome back to our breaking news. Some background now on the young congresswoman who was the object of an assassination attempt today in Arizona. Gabrielle Giffords first went to Capital Hill in 2007. The Democrats took control of both houses of Congress. Now before being elected to the House, she was a state representative in Arizona from 2001 to 2003, and a state senator from 2003 to 2005.
When she won her state Senate seat at the age of 32, she was the youngest woman ever elected to the chamber. But she didn't only excel at politics. She earned a Fulbright to Mexico in 1996 and has a Masters in regional planning from Cornell University. Her husband, Mark Kelly, is an astronaut. They married in 2007. Kelly is going to be the commander of the final planned mission in the space shuttle program. And Kelly's twin brother is also an astronaut who is right now on the international space station.
Just two days ago, congresswoman Giffords took the floor of the house to recite the First Amendment of the Constitution which guarantees the right of people to peaceably assemble. I want you to listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GIFFORDS: The First Amendment -- Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof or abridging the freedom of speech or of the press or the right of the people peaceably to assemble and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Gabrielle Giffords was a guest on "John King USA" in May in the midst of the oil catastrophe in the Gulf of Mexico. From her interview, you can pick up her passion for her beliefs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GIFFORDS: We see the video coverage of the marine wildlife that's being washed up onshore. And to know that particularly during the spawning season that we may lose major parts of our Gulf Coast. It is -- it is really tragic.
Again, the accountability, the oversight, the investigation, all of that really matters. But I think in the broader context, as we've been having very large discussions about -- about new types of energy, renewable energy, being able to pass legislation that transfers our dependency off of foreign oil and also hard-to-reach and find oil. I really I think focuses on the future.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: That was from "John King USA" back in May. Arizona governor, Jan Brewer got to know the congresswoman when Giffords was in the Arizona senate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BREWER: I am just heartbroken. Gabby is more than just a colleague, she is actually a friend. She has always been a noble public servant and my thoughts and my prayers are with congresswoman Giffords and her family, the congresswoman's staff and their families as well as other victims of this senseless and cruel violence.
I've ordered the flags to be flown at half staff in honor of those.
LEMON: Very emotional governor today.
We also have another friend of representative Giffords here with us now. Doctor Matt Heinz is a state representative in Arizona. He joins me now live from Tucson.
Matt, you've been at the hospital, you have been speaking with friends. Tell us what you are hearing there.
DR. MATT HEINZ, ARIZONA STATE REPRESENTATIVE: Hi, Don.
I certainly wish the circumstances were different. But, you know, I'm -- I think we're all thankful that -- that congresswoman Giffords is alive and is responding and has -- has made it through this terrible tragedy. Of course...
LEMON: Now this -- you don't work at this hospital. This -- this is a hospital in which -- which you were trained. So you know a lot of the staff. You're very familiar with the hospital. Can you describe to us the scene inside the emergency room, inside the hospital with people coming in and out to try to figure out if their loved ones who are there are even alive?
HEINZ: Well, you know, Don, the -- the -- I wasn't there when initially everyone -- when everyone collected on the scene. But, you know, it -- it's a -- it's a lot of activity, and -- but it was very orderly. A lot of respectful folks collecting and trying to get information about their loved ones. And it was a very orderly process. And -- and the staff here at UMC have been phenomenal.
Social services and social workers helping people to -- to -- through grieving and through this -- through this very difficult time for everyone.
LEMON: She's a friend of yours. She's a colleague. You said she helped to -- with your political career? And we should note that you are a doctor, you're a physician as well.
HEINZ: That's right. I'm a -- I'm a internist at a different hospital here in Tucson. And I -- you know, I've known Gabby for five years. And I actually lost my first attempts to become a legislator. And on that very night, she came up to me, gave me a hug and said, "I know you're going to do," you know, "I know you're going to do this again. And I look forward to working with you. And let me know what I can do to help you out."
And she's always been a dear friend, and, you know, my heart goes out to her family and all of the families of those who were tragically injured today and -- and who lost their lives.
LEMON: A member of her staff lost his life. And I understand -- did you -- did you get a chance to speak to his fiancee or someone about him at the hospital?
HEINZ: You're talking about -- yes. You're talking about Gabe Zimmerman. And I did. And, you know, my heart goes out to -- to her. my heart goes out to his family. A tremendous advocate for the people of Arizona and a tremendous representative of congresswoman Giffords we lost today, along with many others. He will be missed.
LEMON: The sheriff of Pima county had some pretty -- pretty staunch things to say, pretty tough things to say about the political environment, about why someone might want to do something like this. Saying that Arizona had become a hotbed for bigotry and hate. As a representative, do you -- do you understand where he's coming from? What do you think of his words?
HEINZ: You know, Don, I -- I heard those remarks myself. And I think that he is, you know, very, very correctly calling attention to some of the vitriol and some of the -- the -- the way we're talking about each other in the political system. And how for those with troubled minds, sometimes some of the things that -- that are said are unfortunately taken in the wrong way.
And these kinds of tragedies can happen. I think it's a very important discussion that we have to have as a state and as a country.
LEMON: Physician and representative Matt Heinz, thank you very much.
HEINZ: Thank you, Don.
LEMON: We're covering this story from here in Atlanta and Washington, D.C. as well, as well as Tucson, Arizona. I want to go back to Washington now and my colleague, Wolf Blitzer.
Wolf, it's tough to hear those words. Every time you hear it, it breaks your heart.
BLITZER: It breaks your heart, especially those of us who know her, congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords. And a lot of us do know her and she's an outstanding woman by all accounts. This is a story that none of us really wants to cover but we have no choice. We have to cover it.
Eighteen people shot, as you know, Don. Six now confirmed dead. Police do have a suspect in custody. So who is this individual? How much do we really know about him?
Jeanne Meserve is standing by. She's getting new information. We'll join her after the break. We'll also tell you about some of the other victims, including a beloved federal judge who was murdered today. And could this shooting have a political motive behind it? Gloria Borger is here. Jessica Yellin is here. We're weighing all of the politics of what's exploding right now. Stay with us. Our special coverage will continue right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: We're following the breaking news out of Tucson, Arizona, tonight. A mass killing outside a grocery store. And at the center of it, the attempted assassination of United States congresswoman.
Six people are dead, including a federal judge and a 9-year-old girl. The sheriff's office believes congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords was, in fact, the target of the attack. She was meeting with constituents outside the store when it happened.
Giffords was shot in the head and is now listed in critical condition following surgery. But her doctor says he's optimistic about her recovery. The federal judge, John Roll, was among the six people killed. Authorities say he had stopped by the congresswoman's event simply to say hello.
Police named 2S-year-old Jared -- Jared Lee Loughner as the suspected shooter. This is a picture from his Facebook page which has since been shut down. The sheriff says he may not have acted alone. And tonight, a manhunt in Tucson is under way for another so-called person of interest. Police say they've also recovered a Glock nine millimeter handgun.
We're learning more about the suspect in custody -- this Jared Lee Loughner, but authorities tell CNN he isn't talking to investigators right now. He's invoked his right to remain silent. Let's get some more from our homeland security correspondent, Jeanne Meserve.
Jeanne, what are you finding out about Loughner?
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we do know he was 22 years old. That he had dropped out of Mountain View high school or withdrawn from Mountain View High School in the Marana Unified School District. We also believe that he was a student, according to his Facebook page, at a local community college.
We do know at this hour that according to a law enforcement source, they are seeking to get a couple of search warrants, one for a residence and one for a vehicle. In addition, they are on the lookout for this second individual that you mentioned.
Now, we heard the sheriff of Pima county saying earlier that this was a person of interest. And I have spoken to other law enforcement officials who say they do not know yet how he is connected or if he is connected to today's events or to Loughner. They do not know if he knew him. They do not know if they arrived with him.
I am told by a law enforcement source that there is a piece of evidence that connects this individual who the sheriff described as a white man in his 50s to being nearby the scenes of the shootings. But at this point in time, we do not know exactly what his role may have been, if he had any role at all, even if he knew who this individual, Jared Loughner, is.
But they are eagerly seeking him to try and question him and figure out if there's any connection there. In addition, a little bit of information about the gun. We have been told by a separate law enforcement source that the Glock that was used in his shootings was purchased legally. This law enforcement official didn't know when or where it was bought. But believed that probably the extended magazine that he was using that allowed him to hold so many rounds was probably purchased separately from the gun in question.
We have been looking at the Youtube postings of Jared Loughner. Often these postings give us an insight into an individual and their state of mind. He posted quite a bit on Youtube. One of the things he said -- it was the -- the posting was entitled, "Introduction, Jared Loughner -- said, "My final thoughts Jared Lee Loughner."
"Most people who read this text forget in the next two seconds, the population of dreamers in the United States of America is less than 5 percent." There are a couple of references in these writings to conscious dreamers. But a lot of it is hard for me to make sense of. It appears to be an exercise in some points at deductive reasoning.
He's saying if "a equals b, then b equals c." A lot of it has to do with the currency system in the United States. There's one reference to terrorism. He says, "Terrorists, if I define terrorist, then a terrorist is a person who employs terror or terrorism especially as a political weapon. I define terrorism."
We should say these are his writings. No official we have talked to has said there was any nexus at all that they've discovered thus far between this individual and anybody who would be an international terrorist. In addition, another excerpt from his Youtube page, refers to going to a military entrance processing station in Phoenix. It says he got a mini Bible. "I didn't right a belief on my Army application and the recruiter wrote on the application "none."
We have received via our colleague Barbara Starr a statement from the Army that says, "Indeed he did attempt to enlist in the army but he was rejected for privacy act reasons. They are not telling us why.
Wolf?
BLITZER: A lot to learn about this individual, the suspected shooter, Jared Lee Loughner. All right, thanks, Jeanne. We'll get back to you -- we'll get more information.
Police haven't given a possible motive for these mass killings. But the Pima county Sheriff, Clarence Dupnik, did place some blame. He suggested in his word, and I'm quoting him now, "Vitriol." That's a direct quote, "in politics and the media inflaming the American public to dangerous levels.
Let's bring in our senior political analyst, Gloria Borger, and our national political correspondent Jessica Yellin. They're both working this story for us.
You know, I've covered a lot of these news conferences, Jessica. Normally sheriff comes out, gives us the nuts and bolts. This was extraordinary what we heard from this sheriff in Pima county.
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Because he singled out some of the political rhetoric as you point out in creating the environment that allowed this kind of instance to happen. Even though as you point out, the suspect is not cooperating with investigators so we don't know the motive.
President Obama also delivered that message saying it's partly the political rhetoric that led to this. So that's why we want to bring up one of the themes that's burning up on the social media right now. On Twitter and Facebook there is a lot of talk in particular about Sarah Palin.
And as you might recall, back in March of last year when the health care vote was coming to the floor of the house and when this was all heating up, Palin tweeted out a message on twitter saying, "Common sense conservatives don't retreat, instead reload. And she referred folks to her Facebook page. On that Facebook page was a list of Democratic members she was putting in cross hairs. And Gabrielle Giffords was one of those in the cross hairs. Now Palin has said that she did not mean that literally. It was not meant to be a violent statement. She didn't want anyone to follow through on it. But Gabrielle Giffords was herself asked about this on television and she said she felt targeted. This was Gabrielle Giffords -- March.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GIFFORDS: We're on Sarah Palin's targeted list. But the thing is, the way that she has it depicted as the cross hairs of a gun sight over our district. When people do that, they've got to realize there's consequences to that action.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
YELLIN: Today Palin posted a statement on Facebook saying, "My sincere condolences are offered to the family of Representative Gabrielle Giffords and other victims of today's tragic shooting in Arizona. On behalf of Todd and my family, we all pray for the victims and for their families and for peace and justice."
And I should point out Republican leaders in Washington have said that this is not a partisan issue. This is about violence, as have some tea party groups. But clearly, this is a moment to talk about our political rhetoric.
BLITZER: It certainly is. But -- but the question is, is there any evidence that the suspected shooter in this particular case was a Sarah Palin fan, read Sarah Palin's website...
YELLIN: No, absolutely not.
BLITZER: ... was a member of Facebook, watched her tweets or anything like that?
YELLIN: None at all. And there is no evidence that this was even inspired by rage over healthcare broadly. So there is no overt connection at all between Sarah Palin, health care and this victim in any way.
BLITZER: Talk a little bit, Gloria, about how this is going to impact though...
BORGER: Well...
BLITZER: ... the -- the political environment here in Washington and indeed around the country.
BORGER: Well, I think the sheriff kind of opened the can of worms. And I think it's got to change the tone in Washington. You know, we all talk about politics. There's nothing wrong with being passionate about your politics. In fact, it's great to be passionate about your politics. That's -- that's the tradition in this country. But we've just been through a couple of really contentious years. And town hall meetings at which people threaten members of Congress. There were very heated arguments. There were threats to members of Congress. There was vandalism at members of Congress offices. There are members now who say, "You know what? We're not protected when we go home. And should that worry us?" I mean she was just having a town hall meeting -- a -- a small group of people.
And so I think that we have to have this conversation about tone, as the president said. Not to take the passion out of our politics, but to maybe lower the decibel level just a touch as we discuss what we really care about in this country, whether it's the healthcare or war or anything else.
BLITZER: All these sensitive issues.
Don Lemon is joining us as well.
Don, I know you want to ask these ladies a question as well.
LEMON: Yes. This is -- I've been having this conversation with Dana Bash earlier. And I want to ask either to Gloria or -- or Jessica. The sheriff said vitriol. He said -- he spoke "These groups are people who want to tear down the government." He said, "The anger and hatred is outrageous. Arizona has become the Mecca for prejudice and bigotry.
I've been watching social media all day, guys. And there is this sense that the media and we here, journalists, are dancing around this when the motive is in that Youtube page. And they believe that it is connected and that the sheriff is right. And if you heard the representative who's on who knows Gabby, he says -- and he's also a doctor -- he believes that the sheriff is right.
So what gives here? Gloria, Jessica, either one?
BORGER: Well, you know, it's hard for me honestly to -- to answer that because I can't decipher the Youtube page. There are parts of it that talk about being anti-government, as -- as you -- as you know. But it's very hard to decipher where this person is coming from. Obviously the sheriff knows a lot more about it than we do.
YELLIN: It's not clear, Don, if this person, the suspect was far left, far right, just plain old mentally unstable. But one of the things the sheriff did say is that Arizona itself has become ground zero, in his view, for some of this political rhetoric. And I've spent some time there, for example, covering the immigration wars.
And the kind of tension you sense there, it is -- there is something different. It's not that if you feel -- there's just so much anger in it. And I think that's what he's referring to, because it is just so personal and it feels overheated. BORGER: And people feel their lives are threatened in the immigration debate, very seriously. We heard that in the governor's race. And so Arizona may well be ground zero for that. And it's a very, very tough political environment that she went through. Every Democratic candidate in that state had a tough time. And she managed to win, being very well-liked, but still really, really tough feelings about that immigration issue.
LEMON: Wolf, you hear words like tear down our government. We've heard, take back our government, we want smaller government. Maybe people are putting two and two together and believing that that may be the motivation, and somehow it's possibly connected to the Tea Party or something like that.
BLITZER: Yeah, we don't know what the motivation was. We'll know a lot more, I guarantee you, in the next 24 hours. And the police, you heard the sheriff say they're looking for what they describe as a person of interest, someone who may be an accomplice, who may know more.
I just want to point out, though, that on his website, on his Facebook page, among his favorite books, Don, one book is the "Communist Manifesto." And another is Hitler's "Mein Kampf." So this guy has got from the far, far left, from the far, far right. He's got a lot of favorite books out there. And he's got a lot of weird books and a lot of rambling that is simply -- has no meaning to anybody who is trying to read it.
So obviously this is an individual, as the sheriff says, who's tormented, got some severe mental problems. But he does have, Don, according to the sheriff, a criminal record as well. That raises questions, someone with a mental record and a criminal record can go into a gun store, buy a semiautomatic gun and go ahead and allegedly start killing these kinds of people. I'm sure there are going to be a lot of questions in Arizona about that as well.
LEMON: If someone is unstable, really, it makes no sense. Maybe trying to make sense of it is nonsensical, because he just -- as the sheriff says, he believes this young man has some mental issues.
Wolf Blitzer, thank you. And thanks to Jessica and to Gloria as well. We're going to get back to Wolf Blitzer in Washington in just a bit. Doctors who performed surgery on Congresswoman Giffords are optimistic that she will recover from the gunshot wound to her head.
Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta, who is a neurosurgeon, will share what Congresswoman Giffords likely went through -- what she went through in surgery. That is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Welcome back to our breaking news coverage. Congresswoman Giffords underwent hours of surgery today. But doctors emerged with good news. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DR. PETER RHEE, TRAUMA SURGEON: Gabrielle Giffords' condition was very optimistic. She was following commands.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was she lucid?
RHEE: She was shot one time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where, sir?
RHEE: In the head, through and through.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Front lobe, back lobe?
RHEE: Through and through -- I can't tell you right now for -- obviously for forensic purposes whether -- what direction. But she was shot through and through on one side of the head. It went through her brain.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Our chief medical correspondent is Dr. Sanjay Gupta. He is a neurosurgeon and he shared what Giffords and doctors likely went through.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: They might say something like raise two fingers or something like that to really get an idea, is she able to hear? Is she able to process that information and then able to execute a command based on that.
Obviously, if she can do all those things -- it tells you a lot, if someone can follow commands. It's one of the first things you check when someone comes out of the operating room. So they go there -- she goes to the hospital, probably got a CT scan. Goes to the operating room, has the surgery. And now everyone's sort of trying to figure out how well is she going to do? Well, that obeying commands thing is a very important and good sign in the initial aftermath.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: If anyone should know, it's Dr. Sanjay Gupta. He is a neurosurgeon. Wolf Blitzer, I heard you having a conversation with Sanjay earlier. And doctors, especially surgeons, they don't like to give it away. They sort of hedge a little bit, not to give people false hope.
BLITZER: This surgeon, Dr. Rhee, was very upbeat, relatively speaking. He said under the circumstances, he's about as optimistic as you can get about her eventual recovery. It's almost a miracle, I must say. If a bullet goes through part of the brain, and goes in the head and out of the head, and they managed to keep her alive 00 she's alive and apparently she's responding. As Sanjay pointed out, that is very, very encouraging.
We're all, of course, praying for her. We're praying for all of the others who were seriously injured. Many of them are in critical condition right now. This alleged shooter simply opening up fire at point-blank range and going boom, boom, boom, boom.
You heard one of the eye witnesses say it sounded like firecrackers. One sound, one crack right after another. What a shocking story. Let's hope for the best.
But Sanjay is a neurosurgeon. He knows what he's talking about. So far so good. Let's hope she survives. Not so good for some of the others, including the Federal Judge John Roll who passed away, this nine-year-old who died, and we were also told one of the other victims a senior aide to the congresswoman, Gabe Zimmerman, was shot and killed as well.
Don, stand by. We're going to have much more on this beloved federal judge who was among the victims killed in Tucson. Who was he? Who were some of the other victims as well? More information is coming in on that. Our breaking news coverage here at CNN will continue right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Want to bring you up to date on the latest coming out of Tucson, Arizona. That's where a U.S. congresswoman is now hospitalized after being critically wounded in the head at a gathering of constituents outside a supermarket. She's Gabrielle Giffords, a Democrat, just beginning her third term here in Washington on Capitol Hill.
Before that, she served in the Arizona House and Senate. She's married to an astronaut, Mark Kelly. Seventeen other people were shot in the same attack, six are dead. We'll have more about them in a moment.
But investigators say they believe Giffords was the primary target, which makes this an attempted assassination. A suspect is being held, 22-year-old Jared Lee Loughner. And a nine millimeter Glock semiautomatic handgun has been recovered.
Police are looking for one other person who's described as a person of interest. The shooting happened about 10:10 a.m. this morning, Tucson time, just after noon eastern, 12:10 eastern, during an outdoor town meeting event at a Tucson shopping center.
Dr. Steven Rayle was there and helped treat some of the victims. I spoke with him earlier by phone.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. STEVEN RAYLE, TREATED VICTIMS AT SHOOTING SCENE: There is a sense of sort of unreality. And to be honest, I froze for probably a second, just not quite understanding what was going on. He continued to fire sort of rapidly, really at point-blank range. And the way things are set up, people really had no route to escape.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BLITZER: An eyewitness account of what happened. Dr. Rayle also saying that at that moment, when he saw what was going on, he himself hid behind a column. Then he dropped -- once a couple of other people grabbed the alleged shooter, brought him down, he joined in, held that shooter down as well, before he then started to help some of those who were severely injured. Dr. Steven Rayle on the scene.
There are going to be heroes in this, Don. People who risk their own lives to deal with this shooter who simply opened fire and started killing people.
LEMON: I thought it was amazing. I heard that interview that you did with that young man and he said the scene wasn't as chaotic as you would think it would be. People were fairly calm, and even a woman jumped in to help and to pull the magazine out of the gun. So unbelievable. Unbelievable.
Sadly so many people had to die, Wolf. But let's hope and pray that the congresswoman makes it through.
You know, Wolf, among those six fatalities today, a federal judge. John Roll presided over the U.S. District Court for the District of Arizona. This was someone who really worked his way up from the bottom of the legal ladder. He started his career as a bailiff in a county court.
Also killed today in what should have been a routine event was Congresswoman Giffords' director of community outreach, Gabe Zimmerman. He specialized in the very type of gathering where he and 17 others were gunned down. He was 30 years old, a former social worker, and engaged to be married.
Giffords' press aide tells CNN that Zimmerman oversaw the thousands of requests for help that came in to Giffords' office from constituents.
And the youngest victim of the Tucson attacks was nine years old. Here's what the "Arizona Republic Newspaper" is reporting. They say the little girl was just elected to her school's student council and was invited to Giffords' event by a neighbor who thought she would find it interesting.
Our special covering of the mass shooting in Tucson, Arizona continues after a break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Welcome back to our continuing coverage. Here's where things stand right now: six people are dead and 12 wounded after a mass shooting in Tucson, Arizona. Among the five people in critical condition tonight, Arizona Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords.
Doctors say a single bullet passed through her brain. However, they are cautiously optimistic because Giffords was able to follow commands when she came out of anesthesia after that surgery. Giffords's husband, NASA astronaut Mark Kelly, is at her side. The shooting happened this morning while Giffords was meeting with constituents at a Tucson shopping center. The alleged gunman is in custody. Onlookers attacked him at the scene. He is identified as 22-year-old Jared Lee Loughner.
Right now, Arizona authorities are looking for a second possible suspect. Among the dead, Federal Judge John Roll, one of Giffords' staffers, Gabe Zimmerman, and a nine-year-old girl also dead.
President Obama and House Speaker John Boehner are among the many public officials expressing horror and outrage over the shooting. House Republican leaders say they're calling off Wednesday's scheduled vote on repealing health care reform.
CNN has been on this story since it first broke. Here's how the day's tragic events unfolded.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JASON PEKAU, WITNESS: I heard about 15 to 20 gunshots in the parking lot. I came outside immediately. I didn't actually see a vehicle or any people fleeing. I just saw people running, screaming towards where the shooting happened. Everyone screaming that it was Gabrielle Giffords.
JESSICA CHAPIN, KGUN REPORTER: There were about ten ambulances here. There were those three choppers and they loaded people into them as soon as they could and got those 12 injured victims off and to the hospital. We are told that Gabrielle Giffords was one of those injured.
RHEE: She is in critical condition. The neurosurgeons have finished operating on her. And I can tell you at the current time period, I'm very optimistic about recovery.
OBAMA: I ask all Americans to join me and Michelle in keeping all the victims and their families, including Gabby, in our thoughts and prayers. Those who have been injured, we are rooting for them. And I know Gabby is as tough as they come.
GOV. JAN BREWER (R), ARIZONA: This is an unbelievable tragedy that the people of Arizona experienced today.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: What is it like to witness and survive a mass shooting like the one in Tucson, Arizona, today? An author who has studied survivors and listened to their stories gives us some insight next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Sadly, as we all know, our country has witnessed many mass killings. And while we mourn the loss of life, we've also learned from the survivors about what it took for them to make it out alive. Joining us now by phone is Ron Franscell. He's the author of a book called "Delivered From Evil" in which he profiles ten people who lived through mass killings.
Ron, thanks for joining us tonight. We know it's very early. But what's your take on the suspect's motivation here?
RON FRANSCELL, AUTHOR, "DELIVERED FROM EVIL": Don, I think that question is natural and it's human. I'm not a psychologist. I'm a journalist who just spent two years of his life exploring the experiences of mass murder survivors and their would-be killers. And let me assure you, nobody wants to know the answers to that question more tonight than the survivors and the loved ones of the dead in Tucson.
But the fact is, as natural and human as it is to want to know, I think we're going to have to be patient. Nothing I've seen yet suggests that Jared Lee Loughner isn't well within the profile of the typical mass murderer in our American experience, sadly to say.
He's -- so far, the bits of evidence -- all intriguing that we're seeing suggest he's a garden variety mass murderer.
LEMON: We listened to a press conference with the sheriff in Pima County. And he says obviously this young man has mental issues. And people with mental issues are more susceptible to vitriol. Does that fit the profile?
FRANSCELL: Sure. I don't know about the last part about they're susceptible to the vitriol. I think somebody's trying to imprint the political cauldron in Arizona on this. We don't yet know -- we really don't know if that's the case.
I think it's possible. I think the highly charged political atmosphere could be the crucible in which it was galvanized. But it's -- just strikes me as unlikely the cause of the attack.
LEMON: And it's import to point out too. We mentioned that and we talked about it. I talked about it with Wolf and our political players there in Washington because the sheriff mentioned it at that press conference. He brought to it light and mentioned it twice. He was very vehement about it.
So, listen, I want to ask you: many times when things like this happen, the gunman will turn the gun on himself. So does it mean anything that Loughner didn't kill himself?
FRANSCELL: Yes. It means something. We don't know what yet. But it does mean something. The typical American mass murder has given no thought to an escape. He probably doesn't even care about an escape and often anticipates being killed or killing himself.
We have darn few examples of mass murderers surviving the crime and being around for us to ask questions. So that's valuable.
LEMON: Ron, I want you to listen to someone who was there, who witnessed this. His name is Dr. Steven Rayle. And then we'll talk about it.
FRANSCELL: OK.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RAYLE: There is a sense of sort of unreality. And to be honest, I froze for probably a second, just not quite understanding what was going on. He continued to fire sort of rapidly, really at point-blank range. And the way things are set up, people really had no route to escape.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: He is talking about witnessing it. He's talking about helping out. Is this typical of people who survive these kinds of things to jump in and help out? And as he said during that same interview, it was not as chaotic as you might think?
FRANSCELL: Absolutely. We could take that comment and drop it into any account from almost all of the modern mass murders that we've -- we've endured here. The Lukey's Cafeteria Massacre in Colleen, Texas, in 1991 -- many of the witnesses' statements were like that. A truck crashes through a window and the immediate -- the immediate thought through most minds was that someone had had a heart attack and veered off -- out of the parking lot into the restaurant.
And people were getting up to rush to the aid of the driver. One of those people was the first to die.
LEMON: Ron Franscell, thank you very much. We appreciate you joining us this evening on CNN.
FRANSCELL: Thank you, Don.
