Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Oil Reserves at Stake in Libya; Hundreds of Protesters Killed in Libya; Border Patrol Agents Fight Mexican Crime Organizations; U.S. Travel Warning for Libya; Wisconsin Protesters Vow to Stay; Coping with Busted Budgets; Libyan Ambassador Condemns Regime; River Boat Condo For Retirees

Aired February 21, 2011 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: Top of the hour. I'm Suzanne Malveaux. Let's get you up to speed.

(VIDEO CLIP)

Angry teachers and other union workers are expected to crowd Wisconsin's Capitol building throughout another day. Their protests against the Republican governor's plan to restrict collective bargaining enters a second week. Madison schools are closed for a fourth day today because so many teachers are out protesting.

Teachers and unions are protesting a similar bill in Ohio. Today, University of Cincinnati students plan a rally to support teachers and other public workers. Organizers plan a big protest tomorrow at the state capitol in Columbus. That's when Republicans hope to vote the bill out of committee.

And the National Institute for Civil Discourse -- yes, that's right -- opens today at the University of Arizona in Tucson. Former Presidents Bill Clinton and George H. W. Bush are honorary chairmen. The center will debate, research and educate Americans about civility in politics. The institute is a result of the January shootings in Tucson.

Juarez, Mexico, just across the border from El Paso, records its bloodiest weekend in recent memory. Officials say that drug cartels have killed 53 people since Friday. In the resort town of Acapulco, 13 taxi drivers were killed.

Anti-government protests, violence and uncertainty are costing Bahrain financially today. Formula 1 race organizers announced they would not host this year's Grand Prix in Bahrain.

For an 11th straight day, thousands clogged the streets of Yemen's capital today. Protesters want Yemen's president to give up his long hold on power, but Ali Abdullah Saleh vows to stay until his term ends in 2013.

Protests in Libya are quickly escalating. So much so, some diplomats are questioning Moammar Gadhafi's grip on power. The United Nations says Secretary-General Ban Ki-Moon called the Libyan leader today to say the violence must stop. Human Rights Watch says 223 people have been killed. Libya will not allow Western journalists into the country for independent reporting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FRAN TOWNSEND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: This is a country, a government that very closely controls all information, all access. And power is highly centralized in a way that people in this country don't really appreciate.

Look, we have three -- by our Constitution, three branches of power. Right? The executive, the legislative, and the judiciary. And there are all checks on the other. There is no such thing in Libya.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: BP says it's pulling its 140 workers out of Libya. Onshore work will be suspended in the Libyan desert. Oil drilling will continue off the coast for now.

And the fighting in Libya may be half a world away, but that doesn't mean that you're not going to feel its effects. One thing of things at stake in that country is its oil reserves, oil used to make gas.

Our Christine Romans, she is live in New York.

And Christine, tell us, how is this going to affect folks at the gas pump and the prices?

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: It's already affecting the price of oil. A barrel of crude oil is up almost five percent here today, Suzanne. And when a barrel of crude oil costs more than -- days and weeks down the line, that usually means at the pump the gasoline that it is refined from will also be more expensive. We've already seen these prices rising even before this because of uncertainties starting with Tunisia and Egypt and spreading through the region, but let me tell you here about Libya.

Libya is an exporter of oil, and the United States is a consumer of oil from this country. And Libya is also in OPEC, that huge oil cartel in the Middle East. The U.S. imported 80,000 barrels a day from this country a couple of years ago, the most recent numbers on record. And Libya has the largest proven oil reserves in Africa, just ahead of Nigeria.

So you are seeing these oil prices rise on the international markets, even with markets closed in the U.S. today, on the international markets. Speculators and investors are driving prices higher because of their fears over instability overall.

The oil in Libya is light and sweet, and that means that it is destined quite quickly for markets in Europe. Most notably, 32 percent of their output goes right to Italy. So this is something that if there are any disruptions, it will be felt.

BP pulling out its nonessential workers. A lot of other international oil companies are pulling out their nonessential workers as well. And even the son of Moammar Gadhafi has been saying the blood will flow in the streets and the petrol will stop. The petrol will stop if --

MALVEAUX: And how soon do we think that would happen? How soon do we think that would actually affect the prices?

ROMANS: Well, that's a good question, and it's hard -- oh, very quickly. I mean, very quickly. When you have concerns in the oil market -- and we've already had prices moving higher -- when you have concerns in the oil market and you have concerns of disruptions, even if those disruptions don't happen, it can be a matter of days before oil prices -- gasoline prices start moving higher -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Christine, thank you so much.

ROMANS: Sure.

MALVEAUX: Here is your chance to "Talk Back" on one of the big stories of the day, the showdown between President Obama and congressional Republicans over the federal budget.

Our CNN's Carol Costello, she's in Washington with our "Talk Back" question.

Carol, a lot of people watching this. You and I remember it when the government shut down under President Clinton in D.C. A lot of people were impacted.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. And I have a feeling a lot of our viewers remember that time, too.

The specter of a government shutdown looms. The Republican-led House of Representatives passed a bill -- passed a budget bill with $61 billion in cuts the Democratic-led Senate is sure to reject. You get the picture.

Republicans and Democrats are in the midst of political warfare again, but at least they don't have to fight in the office. Congress is taking not just Presidents Day off, but presidents week off. But lawmakers assure us they are working the phones, and that is fantastic, because if Congress doesn't reach an agreement by March 4th, the government will shut down. And that could mean delays in Social Security checks, military veterans' checks, issuing new passports and oh, yes, nonessential federal workers will not get paid.

In a bit of political gamesmanship, Democrats introduced a bill saying that if the government does shut down, members of Congress and the president should feel the pain and not get paid. In other words, if you don't get your Social Security in the mail, or you lose pay, Congress and the president should not get paid either.

So "Talk Back" today: Should politicians face consequences if the government shuts down? You can send your answers to my Facebook page, Facebook.com/CarolCNN. And I will read your responses a little later in the hour -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: We got some great ones last hour. I'm looking forward to seeing these ones this hour as well. Thank you, Carol. COSTELLO: Sure.

MALVEAUX: Here's what's ahead "On the Rundown."

A grieving family in California takes out their rage on a television news crew.

And the winter that just won't quit. We're going to tell you where the next big storm is heading.

And securing the U.S. border with Mexico, why stopping illegal immigration has taken a deadly new twist.

Plus, teachers protesting budget cuts in Wisconsin. We're going to get a unique perspective from the former governor of Michigan.

And this is a good one. The royal wedding invitations, they have gone out. Did you get yours? Find out who did.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: It's now your turn to "Choose the News." We're going to tell you about three stories. You know how it works. You text message for the one that you want to see in detail later this hour and we will air it for you.

So here are the choices.

Imagine living on a riverboat after you've retired. Some boat lovers are building on that idea. All aboard. It is the Condo Boat.

Two, car enthusiasts will enjoy this one. It's the iconic Porsche made from spare parts. We're going to take you on a test drive.

And finally, meet the ROMEOs. That's the Retired Old Men Eating Out. They're part of a nationwide club whose members are mature enough to know just how to enjoy themselves.

So, all you've got to do is text 22360. Vote 1 for condo boat retirement; 2 for the Porsche test drive; and 3 for the ROMEOs.

Protests sweeping the Middle East and North Africa enter a new week with new intensity. People from Bahrain to Yemen, Iran, and now even Morocco are taking to the streets to demand freedoms in defiance of government crackdowns. But it's the crackdown in Libya that is most concerning right now.

Reports say that hundreds of protesters have been killed. CNN has not been granted access to report from Libya, but our own Fionnuala Sweeney, she is monitoring what is taking place there from neighboring Egypt.

Fionnuala, what are you hearing?

FIONNUALA SWEENEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it seems to be a dramatically unfolding situation in the capital, Tripoli, which of course has been Colonel Gadhafi's stronghold. We are hearing reports, and while these are unconfirmed, they are from an official opposition group that is saying helicopter gunships are being used on demonstrators in the streets.

We also learned from the "Al Qurnya" newspaper, which is a Libyan privately owned newspaper, which in recent days has been less inhibited by its reporting of the situation there, that the justice minister has stepped down and that the parliament building is on fire. There have also been a spate of resignations at the higher political and diplomatic level in the last 24 hours.

And just now we are hearing from the United Nations that the deputy ambassador to the U.N. from Libya is calling what is taking place a genocide, saying, "The Gadhafi regime has declared war on the Libyan people," and that "Gadhafi is committing genocide against the Libyan people." And he is calling for a closing of the airspace in Libya. He has, however, not stepped down. He uttered these words at an extraordinary and impromptu press conference just moments ago.

We are hearing that as the evening wears on in Tripoli, that people are -- we are unable to contact people at all. All the phone lines are down. But these reports we're getting from reliable sources as we continue to build up a picture of what is happening in Colonel Gadhafi's stronghold of Tripoli -- and it would seem that what Colonel Gadhafi's son has called "The Great Revolt" is now well under way.

I'm just quoting here from words that we were hearing from the security forces, Suzanne. They have said in the last hour that they -- their security forces have raided what they call "nests of destruction and horrors" in Tripoli, and they are demanding their citizens to cooperate with the security forces.

MALVEAUX: Fionnuala, is there a sense -- are you getting a sense that there is going to be more violence ahead?

SWEENEY: Yes, absolutely. I mean, I think if we can use the example of Benghazi as anything to go by, what started there were protests against the arrest of a human rights lawyer last Tuesday evening, and they steadily built in momentum and strength over the next few days.

Now, Benghazi is rather different from Tripoli because it's always been a hotbed of unrest against the Gadhafi regime. But Tripoli has always been the stronghold. And when we heard Saif Gadhafi, Gadhafi's son, last night on state television, he was speaking about how the army there would fight to the last man. But the army in Libya was loyal to Colonel Gadhafi, and it was not like the army in Egypt, which would stand by and let these protests happen.

MALVEAUX: Fionnuala Sweeney out of neighboring Egypt.

Thank you so much, Fionnuala.

Well, obtaining independent confirmation on events in Libya is very difficult, as Fionnuala had mentioned. The Libyan government maintains very tight control on communications, and it hasn't responded to the repeated requests from CNN for access inside of that country.

Checking some of the stories our affiliates are covering across the country.

In California, emotions run high when a news crew tries to get an interview with a grieving family. The family had set up a makeshift memorial where a man was killed, and they went ballistic when the news crew tried to see if anyone wanted to talk. Both reporters are shaken up but expected to be OK.

In Massachusetts, a doctor is charged with his second DUI. And check out the surveillance video. I mean, here you see it.

Police say that after smashing his SUV into a liquor store, he tried to grab one to go, but his arm was too short. So he left.

(WEATHER REPORT)

MALVEAUX: Well, the drug war in Mexico is heating up. We're going to show you just how hard a time U.S. agents are having in their fight to secure the border.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have to search every little crevice and every crack because they can hide anywhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: We're getting a statement now. This is coming out of New York, out of the United Nations. This is actually from the deputy ambassador to the United Nations, the Libyan deputy ambassador, a very important statement that he just made, Ibrahim Dabbashi.

He told members of the press here that after a review of what has been said by the Gadhafi regime, he says that the Gadhafi regime has declared war on the Libyan people, and that Gadhafi is committing genocide against the Libyan people. He has also stated that he is calling for a closing of the air space. That in Libya.

A very significant development here when you have those who are representing the country of Libya for the United Nations now making these type of dramatic statements. We should tell you that the deputy ambassador has not stepped down. He says that he is there at the United Nations headquarters to serve the Libyan people and not the regime.

This coming out of Libya, breaking news now.

Protesters, as you know, in Libya, they are trying to oust the country's leader, Moammar Gadhafi, after 42 years of being in charge. But it was Gadhafi's son who addressed the people about the government's stand and all of this uprising.

I want to bring in our Michael Holmes. He's here to tell us about who he is, Gadhafi's son, in today's "Globe Trekking" segment.

And just real quick on the breaking news --

MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

MALVEAUX: -- it seems as if they are members of -- at least they're representing the regime who are now distancing themselves --

(CROSSTALK)

HOLMES: Well, even leaving the sinking ship if you like. There have been a couple diplomatic representatives who have jumped ship already, and this obviously is not a message of support from the deputy ambassador to the United Nations.

No, that's fresh news. And it doesn't help Moammar Gadhafi and his situation right now.

You know, it's interesting. You're talking about his son.

MALVEAUX: Sure. Tell us about him.

HOLMES: He is the one who made the statement on television. And he is the second oldest son. Let's talk about him a little bit.

He's more in a spokesman role than a decision-maker at the moment, although he does hold positions of power there in the regime. This speech he gave on television, it was a pretty rambling sort of thing really.

It was around 1:00 a.m. on state television, telling the world that Libya is not Tunisia or Egypt. Of course it's wedged right in the middle of those two countries. Saying that change would not come to the country through protests.

Have a quick listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAIF AL-ISLAM GADHAFI, MOAMMAR GADHAFI'S SON (through translator): We're not Egypt. We're not Tunisia. We will have weapons. Everyone has access to weapons.

Instead of crying over 84 killed people, we'll be crying over thousands. Blood will flow, rivers of blood, in all the cities of Libya.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Saif al-Islam Gadhafi speaking there. And yes, a real cheery message, wasn't it?

He blames outside elements for the unrest. Now, we've heard this before. It's familiar, isn't it, from several other troubled countries that we've been covering? But he's promising that the government will make democratic reforms on condition that the protesters back down. If they fail to do that though, as you heard there, he says the regime is going to fight to the bitter end, rivers of blood.

MALVEAUX: So it almost sounds like a threat.

HOLMES: Yes.

MALVEAUX: Not necessarily a bargain or a negotiation, but more of a threat. How do you read it?

HOLMES: Yes, I think you are absolutely right there. That's true, it is more of a threat than an extortion to compromise, if you like. And the thing is that it's more likely to antagonize rather than satisfy those on the streets.

He's 38 years old, this guy, Saif al-Islam Gadhafi. As we said, he's never known a Libya, of course, where his father didn't rule the roost. Dad has been in power 42 years after a coup, so let's not mistake this speech as a sign that the younger Gadhafi is planning on taking over or anything like that, or that protesters would go along with that.

U.S. officials say no indication that Gadhafi, meanwhile, is ready to step down. His son is a bit of a medium, if you like, to address the anger in the streets, if you like, and the rest of it. He's been a bit of a bridge, if you like, between the country and the West. Fluent in English, got a Ph.D. from the London School of Economics. He's got a mansion in a very fancy suburb in London and has been acting sort of between Libya and the powers in the West, unlike his dad who rarely goes anywhere in distinctive tribal dress. He does dress in tribal dress, but he's a suit and tie guy, a bit of an indication to his ability to perhaps work as a cultural bridge.

MALVEAUX: So what kind of role does he actually have, his position? Does he actually carry a good deal of weight and power?

HOLMES: He has some power. I mean, his title is the general coordinator in the regime. He got that title in 2009. Before that, he was in charge of the Gadhafi Foundation, a charity organization.

Fittingly, he has positioned himself as something of a human rights advocate, which ties in well with that "rivers of blood" statement, doesn't it? It's someone -- he puts himself as somebody who is eager to see democratic and institutional reforms in Libya despite the iron fist rule of his father. And some do see him as a moderate within the regime.

He's offered that sort of vague list of democratic reforms that we've heard before in the region which has not satisfied protesters. Talks of a return to colonialism, mass poverty, not that that doesn't exist now.

MALVEAUX: Right. Sure.

HOLMES: Civil war if the protests continue. Not exactly the kind of reform that the people of Libya are ready to sign onto right now. And interesting that we see this spread to Tripoli, too. In a tribal sense, Benghazi, the second biggest city where we saw most of the activity, they were against him anyway in a tribal sense. But now it's in Tripoli. A different game.

MALVEAUX: All right, Michael. Thank you so much.

HOLMES: Good to see you.

MALVEAUX: Obviously, a lot that's happening there in Libya. We're trying to get information as much as we can, certainly, but it has been very difficult as closed as it is.

HOLMES: Yes. Exactly.

MALVEAUX: Thank you, Michael.

HOLMES: Good to see you.

MALVEAUX: Well, turning now to Mexico, where drug trafficking violence is spreading to the resort town of Acapulco. Thirteen taxi drivers were killed in the coastal city over the weekend.

Meanwhile, along the border in Juarez, the heart of this violent gang war. Fifty-three people were killed in the last three days.

The drug war in Mexico is making the job of U.S. Border Patrol agents even harder. Our Rafael Romo reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. We've got two approaching that we're going to meet (ph) again. Make that three.

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The call comes in and we rush to the scene. It starts, and the agents know they only have minutes to find the suspect.

RUDY GARCIA (ph), BORDER PATROL AGENT: He jumped the fence and he didn't stop. He just kept running.

ROMO: Agent Rudy Garcia (ph) finds the men hiding underneath a platform in a back yard.

GARCIA: You have to search every little crevice and every crack because they can hide anywhere.

ROMO: The migrant says he comes from southern Mexico.

LEONZO LOPEZ, MEXICAN MIGRANT: My family and poverty in Mexico -- I want better. I just want a job to support my family.

ROMO: Not far from there seven more would-be immigrants have been arrested, including this 32-year-old man.

CAIN MEZA AGUIRRE, MEXICAN MIGRANT: Back to Mexico with my family and never come back. That's what I want.

ROMO: Before the night is over, agents say they will detain more than 300 people. This is Nogales, Arizona, a battlefront in the fight against smuggling organizations.

AGENT DAVID JIMAREZ, U.S. BORDER PATROL: They like to operate under the cover of darkness because they think that they're not going to be seen.

ROMO: From a nearby control room, infrared technology gives agents eyes in the dark. Daylight reveals other resources like surveillance towers, vehicles, and an agent force that has more than doubled in the last 10 years to more than 3,400 for just over 250 miles along the Arizona border.

Agents say they're fighting a new enemy.

JIMAREZ: The whole smuggling organization has changed. It's not your mom-and-pop shop anymore. Now everything is organized crime.

ROMO (on camera): One of the things that you notice when you come near the fence here at the border is that you find rocks everywhere. Agents say that they are victims of attacks every day, and some rocks like this one can cause some real harm.

(voice-over): SUVs showed the signs of damage, and agents riding bicycles are especially at risk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can see those medium-sized rocks to brick-sized rocks. They're pretty big. They're not your average-sized rocks.

ROMO: Many times rock throwing is a diversion. Agents recently confiscated 1,100 rounds of ammunition going south into Mexico, presumably to be used by a drug cartel. This manhole had to be welded shut because it was being used to smuggle marijuana.

AGENT MICHAEL DAMRON, U.S. BORDER PATROL: For a long time they couldn't see them with the cameras because we're in a low ravine here. So it took them a long time to figure out what they were doing.

ROMO: As night falls again in Nogales, there is a new arrest. She is an 18-year-old girl from the Mexican state of Veracruz. For her it's the end of a 1,200-mile trip in search of a dream. For the agents, one of more than 300 arrests that they will make before the night is over.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: Rafael Romo joins us here.

Rafael, give us a sense of the number of arrests that are taking place for the last couple years. I understand that it's very specific and it's increased.

ROMO: Exactly. Well, it's very interesting. When you take a look at the numbers for the last 10 years, it was more than 600,000 back in 2000. Now it has gone down significantly to a little bit over 200,000, 212,000, according to the U.S. -- to the Tucson sector of the Border Patrol.

But what's happening, what the agents are telling me, is that they used to deal with people who crossed the border illegally to come work in the United States. Now it's the criminal element, the smuggling organizations, the Mexican drug cartels who have infiltrated all of these smuggling organizations and are basically running the show. So the numbers are less now, but they're facing more dangers and a more powerful enemy.

MALVEAUX: A dangerous situation. Thank you for that report, Rafael.

ROMANS: Sure.

MALVEAUX: Well, states are having to make some tough choices to deal with multibillion-dollar deficits. I'm going to talk with Michigan's former governor, Jennifer Granholm, about what it's like to lead a state out of the red.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Breaking news out of Libya, now in the United States. The State Department has ordered that all embassy family members and nonemergency personnel depart Libya, leave Libya.

U.S. citizens outside of Libya are urged to postpone all travel to Libya. This coming from our senior State Department producer, Elise Labott that this message from the State Department to order all embassy family members and nonemergency personnel to leave as quickly as possible.

We are trying to get a sense of just what is taking place on the ground there, but from all our reporting, things are deteriorating there. They are getting worse and it has become a dangerous situation.

Cries of union busting in Madison, Wisconsin that's where teacher walkouts are shutting down schools for a fourth day.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Some 50,000 people flooded Wisconsin's capital this weekend to protect what they consider an essential workers right, collective bargaining. A right that would be limited by the proposed budget repair bill to address a $137 million shortfall.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm here because I would not have gone to college if my father had not been a member of a union. I'm the first person in my family to graduate from college.

It was on his union money supporting all of the folks in the labor floor that got me where I am today and that's what I want for my children to remember. I want my children to support union labor so their children can have a future, too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Wisconsin is not the only state looking to close budget shortfalls by cutting back on the power of unions. Wisconsin's bill would eliminate the right of unions to have dues deducted from worker pay checks and require annual votes to maintain certification.

Well, Ohio has a nearly identical measure going through its state legislature. Hundreds of teachers held a street protest in Cincinnati this weekend. The state has an $8 billion deficit. Now, Iowa also has a similar bill limiting union bargaining rights.

Indiana is looking at other ways of limiting protections for unionized government workers. Along with the state of Michigan, you can see that these are all states in the rust belt hit hard by the recession. And of course this guest, she knows a lot about state money troubles and dealing with busted budgets.

Thank you so much for joining us, former Michigan Governor Jennifer Granholm. I want to start off by painting a picture. During your eight years, brutal cuts. You cut bigger percentage of your state's cost than any other state in the country.

You got rid of 25 percent of state departments, shut down 13 prisons, reformed pensions, benefit programs for public employees. Why didn't Michigan see the same kinds of protests and outrage that we're seeing in Wisconsin?

JENNIFER GRANHOLM, FORMER MICHIGAN GOVERNOR: Well, we were protesting, but I was protested against. I think every governor who does big cuts gets protested against, but I didn't go after the collective bargaining. I went to them and bargained hard at the table.

You know, I mean, he is asking for something like 5 percent or 6 percent contribution, health care contributions. Our new employees are contributing 20 percent to their health care contributions in Michigan. We don't even have a pension anymore for employees since the late '90s.

It's a 401(k) essentially. It's a defined contribution plan rather than a defined benefit plan. Believe me, we have looked at this every which way. But the unions in Michigan were partners in identifying ways to cut. They actually, I mean, they bargained hard. Don't get me wrong.

But they also gave over 700, about $750 million in concessions. They were representing people on the ground who could see where waste was and so at the bargaining table, we took in their ideas and implemented them and that's why we were able to achieve such great savings.

MALVEAUX: Governor, do you think the union representatives in Wisconsin need to give up more?

GRANHOLM: No, I mean, what they've said is that they will give up what the governor has asked, so clearly, this is more than just about the budget as everyone has said. Since they're willing to give him what he is asking in order to close this year's budget this is about something much greater than that and so I think what he is doing really has touched such a raw nerve. It is such an over reach.

He didn't need to go that far. He could work with the unions to achieve the results like we have been doing in Michigan. I mean, our governor, we're not supposed to comment on the person who followed you in office, but I do want to say that I think he is proceeding in a much more logical fashion by asking for the concessions at the bargaining table and not eliminating collective bargaining. We've got a deficit, too, but he is not going for the jugular.

MALVEAUX: Governor, on a more personal note, you're a mother of three. You see the teachers protesting out there, the schools are closed. Do you think the teachers are doing the right thing here?

GRANHOLM: Well, you know, if it were me, and again, I want to see teachers in the classrooms, and so obviously being able to express themselves on the weekends, etcetera, but I think it is not a great strategy to get the parents of those kids upset because they're out of school.

There is an awful lot of public employees who are there protesting and who can pick up the signs for them during school hours, but I think they should be in the classroom.

MALVEAUX: All right. Governor Granholm, thank you so much for your time. Good to see you.

GRANHOLM: You bet, Suzanne. Thanks.

MALVEAUX: Well, a reminder about your chance to choose the news. It's simple. Vote by texting 22360. Vote one for living on a river boat condo after retirement. Vote two for test driving a Porsche or vote three for the ROMEOs that's stands for retired old men eating out.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: We're following breaking news out of Libya, obviously a very dangerous and deteriorating situation there. We're now getting word, this from Libya's deputy ambassador to the United Nations out of New York. His name is Ibrahim Dabbashi. He has told members of the media that after a review of what has been said out of the Libyan government, the regime there.

He says that Gadhafi has declared war on the Libyan people and that Gadhafi is committing genocide against the Libyan people. He is now calling for a closing of the air space in Libya. This is coming from Libya's deputy ambassador to the United Nations.

Clearly, taking a stand here saying that he does not believe that the leader there, Gadhafi, is doing the right thing, that he has in fact declared war on his own people, the Libyan people, and that he is committing genocide against the Libyan people, very strong words coming from the deputy ambassador there.

The deputy ambassador has not stepped down from his position. He does represent the country to the United Nations, but he says that he is there at the United Nations headquarters to serve the Libyan people and not the regime.

So as you can see, pictures there, very troubling situation out of Libya. The violence continues. The situation is deteriorating on the ground and now there are some Libyan officials outside of the country who are speaking out against the regime. We'll have more after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: We are putting the claims of three prominent people, very prominent, under the truth-o-meter microscope today. Wisconsin's governor, President Obama, and Congresswoman Michele Bachmann. A lot of people listen when they speak. So we want to know what's true, what's false. Our Bill Adair. He is editor of politifact.com and Washington bureau chief for the "St. Petersburg Times." He joins us to tackle just a few of these.

Bill, you've been watching, you've been looking. Let's start with this one, OK.

Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker, of course he's dealing with these massive teacher protests for days now and he said under his budget repair bill "collective bargaining is fully intact." Bill, is that true?

BILL ADAIR, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, "ST. PETERSBURG TIMES": That's not, Suzanne. That one gets a "pants on fire" on our Truth-O-Meter. Indeed this is the part of the bill that is really upsetting the public employee unions, the part that would make some pretty dramatic changes to collective bargaining. The bill would make some pretty dramatic changes and so we gave that one -- that claim our lowest rating, "pants on fire."

MALVEAUX: "Pants on fire." Wow. OK.

Under the White House's budget proposal, President Obama said that, quote, "we will not be adding more to the national debt" by the middle of the decade. True?

ADAIR: No, that one gets a false on the Truth-O-Meter on Politifact. He made this claim last week when he unveiled his budget and when he had a news conference the next day. And it's a claim that the administration has stood by. But the reality of the budget is that the debt will continue to grow because of the interest payments. The interest payments are expected to grow. So Obama gets a false on the Truth-O-Meter.

MALVEAUX: And finally, Representative Michele Bachmann. She said that the government will "go out and buy my breast pump for my babies."

ADAIR: Another one -- another false. That's just not true. She is referring to a change in the tax law or in the interpretation of the tax laws that was announced by the IRS recently. And what the IRS actually said is that breast pumps can now be considered medical devices and therefore deductible. But that doesn't mean the government is going to buy them. That just means that there is now -- they are now eligible for a medical deduction if you qualify for one. So that one gets a false on the Truth-O-Meter.

MALVEAUX: All right, Bill. Bill Adair, thanks for setting it straight for us. We appreciate it. Thank you.

ADAIR: Thanks, Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Well, you're sounding off on our "Talk Back" question of the day, should politicians face consequences if the government shuts down due to the budget showdown? Well, Bill writes, "they should not get paid. They should also have been working today and the rest of the week to settle the problems."

Join the conversation at Facebook/carolcnn. We're going to have more of your responses up ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: We're following this breaking news out of Libya. Obviously the situation on the ground deteriorating there as several Libyan officials have spoken out today against the Libyan regime. We have heard earlier out of the United Nations, Libya's deputy ambassador to the United Nations, this coming from Ibrahim Dabbashi saying that the Gaddafi regime has declared war on the Libyan people and that Gaddafi is committing genocide against the Libyan people. He is calling for closing the air space in Libya.

Also, CNN now reporting that Libya's justice minister has reportedly resigned in protest to what he calls a bloody situation and a use of excessive force by security forces against those protesters. We are keeping our eye on that situation there. The State Department also calling on embassy family members, American embassy family members, nonemergency personnel, to depart that country as quickly as possible.

And here is your chance to "Talk Back" on one of the big stories of the day. The federal government faces a shutdown if President Obama and presidential Republicans do not see eye to eye. Carol's here with your answers to our "Talk Back" question.

And, Carol, a lot of people very concerned about the possibility of this happening, yes?

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. If Congress does not reach agreement on the budget by March 4th, the government will shut down. And a shutdown would mean Social Security checks will be delayed and federal workers won't get paid. So the "Talk Back" question today, should politicians face consequences if the government shuts down?

This from Jamie. He says, "not only should the politicians not get paid, but they should all be heavily taxed for wasting the people's time." This from Chris. He says, "I guess if the politicians are taking off presidents' week, they won't mind if all government employees, including the military, take off the week, too, right?"

And this from Rilley. "Missing a paycheck or two would be of little consequence to most members of Congress and none to the president. The consequence that counts will come in a year and a half at election time."

And this from Lucas. "A government shutdown is exactly what we need to startle Americans to action. Have you ever watched 'V for Vendetta'?"

Continue the conversation, facebook.com/carolcnn. Keep them coming.

Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: Thanks, Carol.

In the 2012 federal budget there is a $4.3 billion set aside for recruiting and training teachers and principals. Thousands of them in science, technology, engineering, math. But Christine Romans reports it may be hard to find them.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GARY NAGELHOUT, TEACHER (ph): You really think she's right? Yes, she is.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, HOST, "YOUR BOTTOM LINE" (voice-over): After 31 years as an engineer, Gary Nagelhout is starting a new career -- math teacher at Faith Christian Academy in Poughkeepsie, New York.

NAGELHOUT: I was very comfortable where I was. I loved my job. But my heart was to be with the kids and to work with students.

ROMANS: President Obama wants to hire 10,000 highly qualified science and math teachers like Gary Nagelhout in the next year. One hundred thousand over the next decade. A lofty goal to fix a critical problem.

NAGELHOUT: Everybody good with that?

KATE WALSH, NATIONAL COUNCIL ON TEACHER QUALITY: You have some of the top CEOs in the nation going into the president and screaming that the workforce that they're getting is not the workforce that they absolutely require to sustain a growing economy.

ROMANS: It's a catch-22. U.S. students lag in achievement in math and science. Those who do go into these fields often don't want to trade six-figure corporate salaries for lower teacher pay.

NAGELHOUT: I can afford to do it because I'm old enough to retire.

ROMANS: Nagelhout, who designed chips at IBM, also got help paying for his teacher training and certification from IBM, which says it's investing in its future workforce. ROMANS (on camera): This is getting the skills of a math or a scientist in the real world, in corporate America, getting it into a classroom so that kids can learn from that experience.

ROBIN WILLNER, IBM GLOBAL COMMUNITY INITIATIVES: They've made their money, they put their kids through college and now they're saying, you know, that was always my passion.

ROMANS (voice-over): IBM has put 31 teachers in the classroom so far, but it's a drop in the bucket.

WALSH: We're going to have to be looking to compensation, we're going to have to be starting much earlier at training the next generation of teachers by providing much more solid mathematics education in the way that other countries do.

ROMANS: What students need is another 99,999 Gary Nagelhouts.

NAGELHOUT: I wouldn't trade it for anything in the world. This is fun. It really is a blast.

ROMANS: Christine Romans, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: Our producers, they're tallying the votes right now on the story you'd like to see this hour in our "Choose The News" segment. And that is straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Now for the winner of "Choose The News." Plans to build a river boat condominium for retirees. Our Ed Lavandera has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): When you think of retiring, isn't this what it should look and sound like?

BILL TOUT, RIVER CITIES: We built this boat you're on now.

LAVANDERA: David Nelson and Bill Tout are banking on this modern day show boat to inspire a new generation of river boat lovers.

LAVANDERA (on camera): This is a huge ship.

TOUT: This will be a 600-foot-long, 108-foot wide, five-story-tall --

LAVANDERA (voice-over): The River City Condo will be a floating city with about 180 condominiums, cruising the country's most famous rivers all year long. Why live in one city when you can see a different one every day?

TOUT: The general rules are, winter down here, summer up there. We never want to see snow and we never want to see hurricane season. LAVANDERA: The ship is so large, it splits in two to squeeze through tight river spots. A little 18-hole golf course on top, mail delivery, Internet, a medical clinic and a helicopter pad for care flights.

LAVANDERA (on camera): Do you need police officers? Is this place going to get rowdy?

TOUT: No, no.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): David Nelson has lived on a river boat in St. Paul, Minnesota, for 23 years.

LAVANDERA (on camera): Do you think Mark Twain would like this?

DAVID NELSON, DEVELOPER, RIVER CITIES CONDOS: Yes. Yes, I think this is right up Mark Twain's alley. Yes.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): He's selling a new way of retiring. But will it catch on? So far, about 24 units have sold. Construction is expected to begin this summer.

NELSON: All you have to do is sit in your living room window and watch the world go by and have fun every day just being at home.

LAVANDERA: And, for now, show girls and music aren't included.

Ed Lavandera, CNN, Kemah, Texas.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: All right. CNN NEWSROOM continues right now with Martin Savidge, who's in for Ali Velshi.

Hey, Martin.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Suzanne, thanks very much.