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Trying to Block a Meltdown; Pakistan Frees CIA Contractor; Risk for U.S. Military in Japan; Four New York Times Reporters Reported Missing In Libya

Aired March 16, 2011 - 13:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: Now more than ever, when we talk about the nightmare in Japan, we are talking about two nightmares -- the nuclear and everything else.

Again today, fire broke out at the devastated Fukushima Daiichi plant and another burst of radiation escaped for reasons that are not clear.

The few remaining workers had to leave, but they came right back in even greater numbers when the danger eased.

Now, the crisis stems from overheated fuel rods, but elsewhere in Japan, on the right side of your screen, you can see a cold snap, including snow, is adding to the misery. Searching, supporting, surviving, all of it made all the more grueling. Officially, the death toll is over 4,314, with 8,606 considered missing.

This woman is scouring the rubble for her uncle. She thought she might have found his shoe, which you can see there.

The nation heard from its emperor today in an extremely rare event reserved for the direst national emergencies. In a televised address, Emperor Akihito said his heart is broken and he's deeply impressed by the courage of the survivors.

We can't speak about courage without a word about those volunteers, those unnamed volunteer utility workers who have surely been exposed to life-threatening radiation levels at Fukushima Daiichi, the nuclear plant. Nuclear experts call them heroes. The company hasn't realized any personal information about them, but a Japanese newspaper says one is 59-year-old and he's six months away from retirement.

We also heard this today from a plant worker's wife --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She says her husband is working at the site in the face of danger of exposure to radiation, but she wants him to do his best. She says his reply by e-mail indicated a serious situation. He told her to take care of herself because he won't be home for a while.

(END VIDEO CLIP) VELSHI: We've got much more to report from the nuclear front.

For a while today, traces of radioactive cesium and iodine were found in tap water in Fukushima City, which is 50 miles from the plant. You can see Fukushima City on the left. The Daiichi plant is on the right, on the ocean. Later, the water was clean, and officials stressed that there was never any danger to human health.

Authorities still want to flood at least one of the super-hot reactors with seawater that's being dropped from a helicopter. An earlier flight was aborted when the radiation levels spiked.

And now another facility, a separate facility, is also raising concerns. The government has evacuated a six-mile radius of the Fukushima Daini plant -- that is south of the Daiichi plant -- because of fluctuating temperatures there. The four reactors there are all shut down, and for now everything appears to be under control. That is still far from the case at the original plant, the Daiichi.

CNN's Tom Foreman brings us up to date on what has gone wrong.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This is the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant before the earthquake and the tsunami. Here are the nuclear reactors we've been talking about, numbers 1, 2, 3 and 4. And here's what they look like now since those terrible events.

They've been having persistent problems keeping water flowing to number 1, number 2 and number 3, trying to cool down the reactor cores and keep them from overheating, possibly melting down. But the real issue is number 4.

Number 4 was not even operating at the time of the earthquake, but outside the hardened case that holds the active nuclear ingredients, outside is a storage area for the spent nuclear rods which are still radioactively hot. They're kept in water so that they don't burst into flames. The fear is that the water has drained down and that, in fact, that's what's causing these fires.

If they are exposed, one nuclear expert told me you could not get within 50 yards of this without getting a fatal dose of radiation. Just as importantly, if they're burning, all of the ash, all of the smoke would carry cesium with it. Cesium is the same product that came out of Chernobyl and caused all of those problems.

Let's widen out and look at the area that they're concerned about there. This is the 12-mile radius in which they ordered evacuations of about 70,000 people, and said nobody can be in here. But now it's expanded beyond that, to a 19-mile radius.

And out here, the concern is that people need to stay inside, keep their windows closed, their homes airtight. No turning on ventilators or air-conditioning, keep their laundry indoors, everything they can to keep from coming in contact with any cesium if it's coming away from that, if this is indeed the source of the fire. You're hearing a lot of "ifs" here. One of the reasons you're hearing a lot of "ifs" is because there have been significant complaints that for all that's going on, on the ground there, there has not been enough communication from the power company and maybe from the Japanese government as well about precisely what is happening. The White House here is even concerned about that as people try to get a handle on precisely what is happening in those reactors, and all eyes are upon them.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: All right. Thanks, Tom.

You know, Japan uses a lot of nuclear power. One-fifth of our electricity in the United States is from nuclear power. This is how confusing this discussion is, because we don't really know the effects. One day you hear it's there, it's not.

Chad is here because he's got news on that second nuclear power plant that we're getting some troubled reports out of. This is south of the Fukushima Daiichi.

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: The Daiichi and then Daini, one and two, right there. It's about seven miles south.

And a little bit ago we had a new alert that said 10-mile radius, everybody out of the way, it's hot. It's not overly hot, it's still under control, but it's --

VELSHI: Right, but let's start clearing people out.

MYERS: -- but let's start moving them.

Now, that was kind of overlapped a little bit by the 30-kilometer that we had for Daiichi. But now just issued by the U.S. Embassy in Japan, a 50-mile radius for all U.S. citizens, saying we've looked at the situation, we understand what's going on, we believe the radiation can go farther, and we're recommending U.S. citizens to be 80 kilometers away, or 50 miles, away from the Daiichi plant.

VELSHI: Fifty miles, yes. Wow.

MYERS: So that would encompass everything here.

VELSHI: OK. With steam or things escaping from plants, there are two issues here about the radiation, and one of them has to do with where the winds are going.

MYERS: Correct.

(WEATHER REPORT)

VELSHI: And as we get more information, we'll share that with our viewers. You will. You and all of your fellow meteorologists are on top of this for us.

Thank you, Chad.

MYERS: You're welcome.

VELSHI: I appreciate that. Keep us posted about what goes on with Fukushima Daini, the second plant that we're having some problems with.

I want to tell you about something that happened in Pakistan. The CIA contractor who was accused of killing two men there has been set free. You might be surprised to hear what it took to get him free. It's kind of interesting.

Here's our social media "Question of the Day" about nuclear power. Should it be used as a source of energy? Why or why not?

Join the discuss on my blog, CNN.com/Ali, or go to Facebook, Facebook.com/AliVelshiCNN, or Twitter: @AliVelshi. Post your response. I want to talk about it later with you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: All right. An American in Pakistan, not too popular to begin with. So imagine the sentiment after he shoots and kills two native sons. That's exactly what happened in January. Raymond Davis said he shot in self-defense, and the U.S. rushed to his defense.

First, it said he was a diplomat. Not true. Then it said he should get immunity.

Well, less than two months later, this case has ended as controversially as it began. Davis has been released and the charges have been dropped.

Joining us from Islamabad with more on this, ITN correspondent Nick Paton Walsh.

Nick, very unusual circumstances.

NICK PATON WALSH, ITN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. It seems a large sum of money was paid. Now, it depends who you listen to how much that was.

A lawyer close to the case telling me $1.4 million. But the law minister for the Punjab area, where this instant happened, said it was as much to $2.3 million. And key to this, he says the U.S. government paid it.

Now, that has been flatly denied by U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. Perhaps the possibility a third party did pay the sum of money, which is known as diat (ph) under Islamic and some parts of Pakistani law.

Effectively, you're talking crudely blood money, a scheme under which the perpetrator of a crime pays the relatives of victims a sum of money to drop the charges. That's what happened today. Raymond Davis left court, and it appears now -- we're actually told is now in Kabul having medical tests, back in American hands.

VELSHI: What does this do to Pakistani-American relations, which continue to remain strained for so many various reasons? How do the Pakistanis feel about this?

WALSH: Well, I think we've seen on the Pakistani media already today a large outpouring of fury in the chat shows here, but even more so on the streets, where there are protests in most of the major cities. Anti-American sentiment here already incredibly high because of the covert program here of drone strikes against militants in the tribal areas.

Pakistani relations with the U.S. stretched absolutely to breaking point by this. President Obama making it clear at the very beginning how high the stakes were for the U.S. when he said, "It would be intolerable if Mr. Davis was not given diplomatic immunity and released by the Pakistanis."

So, really, this case has come forward in such a way where one Pakistani security official said to me it would definitely help relations improve, but none of this is going to make the Pakistani government look any better with a large part of Pakistani society that is absolutely furious at this ongoing cooperation with the U.S. -- Ali.

VELSHI: All right. Good to talk to you. Thanks very much for that report.

I want to get back to our social media "Question of the Day." We asked you, should nuclear power be used as a source of energy? Why or why not? Here are some of the responses you gave me.

Brandon says, "It should only be used if public safety can be absolutely guaranteed, but that may not always be true."

Vanessa writes, "No. What's wrong with wind power? Is it because the mills are so unattractive? There is obviously the land space for them. People place too much confidence in engineers."

Vanessa, I'm a big fan of wind, too. There's just not enough wind power out there to replace everything that nuclear does.

Matthew also says, "No. It may be the leading source of non- greenhouse gas-emitting energy, but it creates billions of gallons of nuclear waste that get stored in places that are not secure."

Michael has a different take. He says, "Absolutely. It's a great source of energy when used responsibly and monitored closely."

Therein lies the rub, doesn't it.

You can still join the conversation on my blog, CNN.com/Ali; on Twitter: @AliVelshi; on Facebook, AliVelshiCNN. A lot of you are messaging me about this. Don't message me. The whole idea is for you to get involved in the discussion. So do it right there where people can see it, on Twitter, on Facebook, or on my blog. With so much talk about radiation exposure in Japan, we look at how the U.S. military is protecting its crews, delivering much-needed aid to that nation, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(STOCK MARKET REPORT)

VELSHI: The U.S. military is one of the groups at the forefront of helping quake survivors in Japan.

Our Pentagon correspondent, Chris Lawrence, is in Washington for us.

Chris, there are concerns out there about U.S. military personnel exposed to the dangers, particularly the nuclear dangers in Japan. What is the U.S. government and the military doing to ensure their safety?

CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: A number of things, Ali. I guess first off the bat would be get out of the way of the radiation.

If you take a look at this map behind me, you can see those ships up there in the corner. Those used to be a lot closer to the Fukushima nuclear plant. They were moved north and off shore to get out of that downwind range of that radioactive plume.

Also, some of the pilots have been coming back with -- contaminated with radiation. They've had to be washed off, having their uniforms destroyed. They were given some potassium iodide tablets as well to ward off any of the effects of radiation.

Well, now that they've established this zone, a 50-mile zone, a no-go zone, so to speak, that's also being expanded out a little bit for the military. By that, I mean the pilots who are going in today, bringing relief supplies, doing search and rescue missions, they were going within about 70 miles of that plant. And they were given some of the pills ahead of time, before they went out on that.

Also, if you look down here, U.S. military bases, no real danger just yet, but as a precaution, with the families that are there, with the American civilians that work there, they're being told, stay indoors as much as possible and shut down your outside ventilation systems. Also, if we take a look at the other map, as we spin around here, you can see that several ships that were on their way to the Pacific side have been rerouted over here to the Sea of Japan to stay out of the way of that radioactive plume -- Ali.

VELSHI: All right, Chris. We will watch that with you, too. There have been a lot of responses from military families and members of the military saying that they're very happy to be involved in this relief effort. But obviously the military and the government want to be very, very cautious that we're not unnecessarily exposing people to these dangers.

Thanks, Chris.

Want to bring you up to speed.

It's about 3:21 in the morning in Japan right now. The official death toll there is 4,314, but 8,606 people are still listed as missing after last week's earthquake and tsunami.

More concern earlier today at the troubled Fukushima nuclear reactors. We saw what looked like a cloud of smoke rising over reactor number 3. Japanese officials now saying they believe there was no breach of the reactor's containment vessel, and it probably was vapor, not smoke. There's also been some developments at a nuclear plant south of that.

In Pakistan, American CIA contractor Raymond Davis has been released from jail after the families of the two men he killed in January forgave him. A U.S. official says he has left the country. Davis said he shot the men after they attacked him in Lahore.

A lawyer closely connected to the case told CNN the families were paid about $1.4 million. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton says the U.S. did not pay any compensation to the families.

Four "New York Times" reporters have been reported missing in Libya. They were in the eastern part of the country covering the fighting between rebels and forces backing the Gadhafi regime. They haven't been heard from since yesterday morning Eastern Time.

All four are experienced in war zones, including Stephen Farrell, who had been kidnapped by the Taliban in 2009, and photographer Lynsey Addario, who's been a guest on this show.

Right now there are as many questions about the dangers of radiation and how harmful it could be. Experts measure radiation in a unit called a millisievert.

Coming up next, Chad is going to join me to explain radiation measurements and how much of it is actually out there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Do not breathe in the air directly, and also make sure that your hair is not outside, but it's covered.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELSHI: Weather is coming into Japan. In fact, we saw some pictures that came in from this morning, and there is snow.

I mean, it is winter. It's a cold place. And this is a hampering rescue effort. But those people who are without electricity or without their homes, this is a real problem. MYERS: Millions of households still without power. First, it was six million, then down to four million. Now -- and they're still trying the rolling blackouts, making sure that there's enough power for everyone.

The jet stream has come in. It's a northerly flow right over Korea. Call my dad and ask him how cold it is in Korea in the winter. In the Korean War, he just tells me his feet were freezing the entire time.

VELSHI: Right.

MYERS: The cold front out in the Pacific Ocean, that is going to be the case for the next, I would say, four days, where temperatures are below -- definitely freezing at night, like 27 at night. But only up to 35, 36 during the day.

Look at Tokyo right now, 32. Now, we should have an observation from -- sorry. That got knocked down.

VELSHI: It's likely colder the further you go north?

MYERS: Absolutely.

VELSHI: Because Sapporo is -- look at that.

MYERS: Six tonight. And with the wind-chill coming in, too.

The winds have been blowing at about 30 miles per hour, so think about it. It's 30 degrees, and then the wind is blowing 50 in some spots. And there will be snow, mainly, though -- the way the spine works, the way the topography is in Japan, most of the snow will be caught here, a lot like it snows in Buffalo.

VELSHI: Right. Right.

MYERS: But the snow doesn't make it all the way down to Albany or Binghamton, right?

VELSHI: Right.

MYERS: It's a lake-effect, but this is just a giant lake called the Sea of Japan.

VELSHI: And the winds are still coming this way. The weather system is moving this way, the winds are going that way.

MYERS: And that's great news for the radiation plume --

VELSHI: But cold if you don't have a house.

MYERS: -- but it's cold. And that's the key.

It's also cold if you're looking for people. And it taxes everything.

VELSHI: Yes.

MYERS: It taxes your ability to move, it taxes your ability to not work without gloves. It taxes everybody's -- just psyche.

And then, all of a sudden, it's snowing. That covers up a little bit of the scent for the dogs out there that are working. It could be better, but it's still winter.

VELSHI: More than 4,000 people dead, 8,000 still missing. We'll stay on top of this. Thanks. And let me know what's going on with that second nuclear reactor, if you get any more news on that.

MYERS: Absolutely.

VELSHI: Reporters out in the field face any number of challenges. Reporters covering Libya right now put their very lives at risk. A group of American journalists is missing.

I'm going to bring you details about them right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: It's about 3:30 a.m. Thursday morning in Japan. Another sleepless night for lots of people there with no end to the quake aftershocks or to this building nuclear crisis. Shelters are overflowing at the edge of the evacuation zone which is around Fukushima Daiichi plant, northeast of Tokyo.

The situation there took another scary turn today when that big white plume started streaming from one of the reactors. Authorities said it appeared to be radioactive steam from a breach in reactor 3's containment structure. A small crew still working at the plant was temporarily evacuated until radiation levels dropped.

The official death toll in Japan, it's jumped again, 4,314. But 8,606 people are still listed as missing.

Meantime, the weather is adding to the misery in the quake and tsunami zone. Snow has been falling on homeless survivors, rescue crews and anyone still alive under all of that debris. Freezing temperatures are expected to hang on into next week.

Now for some other stories you might have missed. A CIA contractor jailed for killing two men in Pakistan has been released. Raymond Davis was charged with murder in January. He said he shot in defense. Davis has earned his freedom thanks to a provision in Pakistani law that allows victims' families to pardon a murderer. Now, sometimes there's a payment to the family, commonly known as blood money. A lawyer connected to the case tells CNN more than $1 million was paid out here.

Now, we just had comment from Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who says the U.S. didn't pay any compensation to the families.

Four New York Times reporters have been reported missing in eastern Libya. They were covering the fighting between rebels and forces backing the Gadafi regime. They haven't been in contact with their editor since yesterday. The Times says it has received secondhand reports that the four had been swept up by Libyan government forces, but that's not been confirmed. All four are experienced in war zones, including Stephen Farrell, who had been kidnapped by the Taliban in 2009. He had to be released by British commandos. And photographer Lynsey Addario, who's been on this show a couple of times.

Major global crackdown on suspected pedophiles has led to almost 200 arrests with hundreds more expected. Investigators in several nations, including Asutralia, the U.S., and UK took part in what's being called Operation Rescue. So far, they've rescued 230 children. The suspects were said to be members of an online forum called BoyLover.net, operating from a server in the Netherlands.

Jury selection has begun in New Haven, Connecticut in the second trial tied to a brutal home invasion and triple murder. Joshua Komisarjevsky is charged with killing a mother and her two daughters in July of 2007. He also faces charges of sexual assault, kidnapping, arson and robbery, 21 counts in all. If convicted, he faces the death penalty. His alleged partner in the crime was tried last year and sitting on death row as we speak. Opening arguments in this trial are expected in September in this trial.

In Tokyo, people flocking to the airports trying to get out of the country because of nuclear fears. Our Soledad O'Brien was just there. We'll bring you what she saw, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: In Japan today, the death toll is 4,313. But 808,606 people are still listed as missing across the country. 2,282 are injured. Meanwhile, there are fears about the growing nuclear situation, so much so that many people are going to the airports to try to leave.

CNN's Soledad O'Brien joins me live from Tokyo. Soledad, you just got back from the Haneda Airport. What's going on there?

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. We flew in from Akita into Haneda Airport. And while our flight itself was actually pretty full and crowded, when we got there, late at night Japan time, the airport was not packed. But we've seen pictures of Haneda, really, really packed and not even close to what the situation is at Narita Airport, which is where more international flights are leaving the country. Which is massive lines, some people describing them as three hours, sometimes more wait, as it snakes inside to outside, people waiting to get out of the country.

No surprise when you really understand, I think, Ali, just the sense of distrust, mistrust, and fear going on among the people. The contradictory information about the nuclear reactor system, the aftershocks are really terrifying. There have been many of them, quite strong. We feel them all the time.

And then sort of a sense of no one knows what's going to happen next, combined with it's brutally cold. There's a lack of food, a lack of fuel, and lack of information. None of that is a big surprise to me.

VELSHI: This confusion, contradictory information, it definitely feels like that from here in the United States. Is it more so in Japan where governments are saying there are dangerous levels of radiation, then there aren't? And then there's safety, then we're not sure whether this has been shut down or there was a leak. How does it feel over there?

O'BRIEN: Well, I think that there's a similar sense that someone can go, for example -- someone's going on TV live, government official, talking about how while the situation doesn't seem so bad while people are watching live picture of plumes of smoke rising above the Daiichi reactor, as you were just talking about a while ago. And of course, for somebody watching that, they feel like what they're seeing and what they are hearing really doesn't compute. And some of that is just the levels of dissipation, the radiation levels can rise and then they fall again.

But I think the bigger picture today certainly has been those reactors 3 and 4 and the idea of aborting that planned dumping of water from the helicopter because radiation levels were too high for choppers to fly in. It's sort of the same thing you see out West when we have forest fires, you know, just sort of a massive dump of water to do a cooling. So, that had to be aborted.

Again, as people watch this and say, well, it's said to be safe outside of 30 mile limit. And yet, at the same time, they're pulling -- aborting these missions because they have concerns about radiation levels. It feels sometimes contradictory.

But the chief of staff is on the air consistently here. He did two press conferences yesterday, trying to give a lot of information. And the emperor was on television as well, speaking to the Japanese people, which as you know, is a very rare event --

VELSHI: Yes.

O'BRIEN: -- which was both comforting, I think, to people, especially the elderly, but also an indication of how severe the crisis, if the emperor who very, very, very rarely goes on television proactively in a crisis is addressing the people. So, I think it's sort of that consistently -- well, it must be a very bad crisis, but everybody is saying remain calm. And combined with the temperature, combined with the lack of food, combined with the empty streets, combined with unclear sense of what's going to happen next for everybody and the aftershocks, people are very tense.

VELSHI: Soledad, you just got back from -- or you've been in a place that was very badly devastated by the tsunami. Give us some sense. We've seen the pictures and sometimes they tell more of a story. But you were just there. Give me some sense of it.

O'BRIEN: Yes. We came out of Kasanuma to go up to Akita, and now we're back in Tokyo. And we were really looking at the search and rescue efforts in that small city, 70,000 people, where they had earthquake damage but even more tsunami damage. The tsunami just roared through.

And tsunami damage in a city is just incredible, the debris field is amazing. Things just pancake and collapse. I actually think there's going to be quite a large death toll there because of the debris, so high, it's hard to see even what's two, three, four, five, ten feet below as you walk on top of the debris.

But the self-defense forces were out, sort of prodding with sticks to see what they could see and people were back in the streets a little bit. But it's cold, and for folks who have been displaced, many of them sort of wandering out trying to figuring out what to do next.

VELSHI: Yes, the cold really is going to hamper the rescue efforts. Soledad, thanks so much for your great reporting from there. We'll continue to follow it with you. Soledad O'Brien in Tokyo now.

I want to turn to Bahrain where violence continues to escalate. This is smoke rising over -- well, this is a map of Bahrain where we're showing you. Let's take this over to Pearl Square now, where you can see smoke rising over Pearl Square in Manama, where protestors reported hearing gunfire.

The square has been a gathering spot for anti-government demonstrators in recent weeks. Bahrain's government said in a statement that as police approached the area, protestors attacked them with Molotov cocktails. The police say they dispersed the crowds with tear gas. Several doctors say security forces stormed the main hospital in Manama. There are reports that staffers were beaten and hiding in rooms. Eventually the army told hospital workers they could leave. CNN cannot independently confirm those claims.

We were going to keep following the situation -- we are going to keep following the situation and bring you the latest developments on it in the Middle East. And Wolf will have a fair amount on this on "THE SITUATION ROOM" later on at 5:00 Eastern time.

Coming up, George Takei of "Star Trek" fame talks about how the Japanese are dealing with the crisis in their country. He'll tell us about gaman. It's an interesting word you may never have heard of but means a lot to the Japanese and might explain how they're dealing with the crisis. Don't go anywhere.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: For the last few days, we've seen disaster footage from Japan and watched death tolls rise while survivors continue their search for missing loved ones. The most recent numbers from Japan show 4,314 are dead. 8,606 are missing. And 2,000 have been injured.

Through all of this, one thing we haven't seen much of is violence, chaos and looting among the Japanese people, something we've seen in other disasters across the world. Even here in the United States. Japanese-American actor and activist George Takei joined us last hour to talk about how Japan is dealing with this tragedy. I asked him what the Japanese term gaman meant to him and the Japanese.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE TAKEI, TELEVISION AND FILM ACTOR: It means to endure with fortitude and dignity, self-restraint, control. And, you know, because Japan is a very densely populated country, you have to be respectful of others and exercise self-restraint. And it's really moving and powerful to see people who, I'm sure, are experiencing great anguish having lost family and loved ones, to be so orderly and dignified in that.

VELSHI: George, what are the limits of Gaman? At what point do you -- do the Japanese say I'm not sure that the authorities know what they're talking about or what they're doing? Is it based on trust for authority, or is it based on something else?

TAKEI: Well, the alternative is to start shouting, complaining, and what is that going to do? It's just going to make the situation worse. So it's better to restrain yourself. And if you see that there might be something questionable, you gather together collectively.

Japan is a very collectivist society and they work in concert with others. And in doing that, you have to exercise restraint as well as endure some people who might not be quite as restrained as you are.

VELSHI: Here's something interesting, though, that collectivist society is very helpful in a disaster like this. We have found people going back into those nuclear plants to try and deal with the situation. So this Gaman doesn't stop you, dignity and that reserve doesn't stop the Japanese from solving the problem and going in and trying to deal with the tragedy?

TAKEI: Well, there again, there's Gaman. They are members of a community, so they have -- they know that they are taking a high risk but they bear it, they endure it, fortitude, and for the sake of the others, they go in to keep the situation in the nuclear plants from getting worse. It's a remarkable cultural trait. I think it's a very distinctive thing to the Japanese. And I'm, you know, a third generation Japanese-American, but I remember growing up with that concept.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELSHI: Well, people are talking a lot about nuclear energy, whether it's good or bad p for the country. I've put this to you on my - on social media, Twitter and Facebook and on my blog. I get a lot of responses to a lot of questions. This one is burning up the Internet.

We're putting it to two experts on opposite sides of the issue. I'll talk about it with my Stream Team on the other side. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) VELSHI: Just want to bring you up to speed. We had seen quite a drop on the Dow, down about 280 points less than an hour ago. It's staging quite a recovery. I mean, you wouldn't think it's good news that the Dow is only down 178 points, but things are improving after some scares about how serious this nuclear event is in Japan.

Let me bring you up to speed. We just can't tell you enough about this issue, about what's going on. In light of what's happened at the nuclear power plant in Fukushima, Japan, there's been a lot of talk about safety on one hand and value on the other hand of the 104 nuclear plants here in the United States.

Are the criticisms valid? Let's start our conversation by reviewing how a nuclear reactor works. In this case, the particular nuclear reactors were talking about, with Chad, that were built 30, 40 years ago. Nuclear reactors have changed. There are some differences. Let's talk about what's happening there.

MYERS: There are better protections now than this building has. There are protections called walk-away safe. You can literally get up from the chair if you are an engineer downstairs and walk away and the machine will shut down all by itself.

VELSHI: Right. That's been a big question on social media, why can't these things just shut down?

MYERS: They will shut down without power. They will shut down after a tsunami.

VELSHI: The issue here is you need power to keep it going to stop the rods from overheating.

MYERS: Correct. Well, the whole thing happens because these uranium 230 -- I'm not a nuclear engineer, OK? But I've listened to a lot of very smart guys. It's in and it's out. So, I'm going to do my best to bring it down to layman's terms.

Fuel rods here. They get very, very hot. They are uranium 235. They get excited, their little atoms bounce back and forth. They get very, very hot. There are control rods down below. When you separate the rods from each other, with the control rods, you slow down how much bouncing around goes around, so you slow down the amount of heat that can be generated. Well, the heat comes when the rods are in water.

VELSHI: Right.

MYERS: Pure water. Not salt water like they're pumping now. Pure, pure water.

VELSHI: So these rods come into the water.

MYERS: And they boil! Big-time. I mean, six atmospheres worth of pressure as in all the steam that's caused moves up the generator and out through the steam valves.

VELSHI: All the steam here goes out here?

MYERS: Huge amounts of pressure like the amount of pressure behind a dam at a water hydro plant. That's going to just turn this.

VELSHI: Now, from here on in, this is just normal energy production. You can do this with coal, you can do this with gas. You're turning turbines, you're creating electricity.

MYERS: The problem was that the water coming in from the ocean to cool this steam back to water to condense it, that water stopped because the power stopped. The backup generator stopped. The batteries stopped eventually.

VELSHI: And they got flooded. The backup power got flooded by the tsunami.

MYERS: The earthquake didn't hurt this plant. It shut it down, normally shut it down. The tsunami flooded the backup, and the backup and the backup and a number of things cascaded from there, and that's where we are now. The rods --

VELSHI: And we do have plants that do this. We've got plants more modern.

This brings us to the Stream Team, where we can go deeper into this nuclear debate. Joining me now, Paul Gunter. He's the director of reactor oversight at Beyond Nuclear. And James Taylor, he's a senior fellow for environmental policy at the Hartland Institute.

Paul, let's start with you. Nuclear plants, good or bad for this country?

PAUL GUNTER, DIRECTOR OF REACTOR OVERSIGHT, BEYOND NUCLEAR: Bad. I mean, clearly what's been demonstrated at Fukushima is that nuclear power is more of a liability than it is in times of natural disaster or national crisis. So, when you need the power the most, this system will fail you, as has happened.

You know, I think what we should remember is that nuclear power plants, whether they're pressurized water reactors like you showed there, or boiling water reactors like at Fukushima, they all shut down when the grid goes down. Because 100 percent of their power for safety systems is reliant --

VELSHI: The grid -- you mean the electrical grid. When electricity isn't present, they shut down.

GUNTER: The electrical grid. Exactly.

VELSHI: Let's bring James in. James -

Let me just bring James in. James, Paul says bad. You say good?

JAMES M. TAYLOR, SENIOR FELLOW, THE HEARTLAND INSTITUTE: Well, in terms of the environment and human health, definitely good. Because of nuclear power, we do not have many of the alleged environmental harms that have been asserted by Paul.

For example, not only in the U.S. but around the world, there have been nuclear power plants in operation for decades. The only significant nuclear event was in Chernobyl. And that's like comparing apples to oranges because the system there is entirely different than Western nuclear systems.

And what we're looking at in Japan right now, we have pretty much the worst possible scenario compounded upon itself, and still, we're still unlikely to see any significant human toll as a result. Compare that, for example, to the number of humans that die on U.S. highways every day, which is about a hundred --

VELSHI: Well, hold on, hold on. Talk about comparing apples to oranges. Humans dying on highways has absolutely nothing to do with humans dying from nuclear exposure.

Paul, being fair now, the fact is, we're are a demanding world. We want cheap energy, we want plentiful energy. Prices of oil and natural gas and things like that have been going up. If we do away with nuclear, one-fifth of the electricity in the United States, what do we do?

GUNTER: Well, obviously, you know, the situation is right now that we take these plants one by one. Some have to be shut down immediately. Some will be phased out. But overall, we need to leave this dirty, dangerous and expensive technology in the 20th century and move into the 21st century energy policy with wind, offshore wind. Right now off the coast of Virginia, Maryland, and --

VELSHI: Paul, I'm going to stop you because this is sort of a fast-moving segment. Again, it's apples and oranges. There's nobody in the world who thinks wind is going to replace the energy that electricity provides.

GUNTER: Well, that's not true --

VELSHI: No, there isn't. There really isn't. Show me one fact that says one-fifth of the U.S.'s energy comes from nuclear energy. There is nobody in America thinks one-fifth of the electricity can come from wind.

GUNTER: Actually, I would disagree with you. Like I'm not saying that we're going to cut off one-fifth of the energy overnight. What I said was that there are some plants -- we have 23 of these Fukushima designs here in the United States, a number of them on the New Madrid fault. It's crazy to keep moving forward with old, decrepit plants that are then set on these fault lines. That's just insane. It has to be revisited by an independent evaluation.

VELSHI: James, is there some middle ground here? I mean, can we -- should we be building nuclear plants with far more redundancy for an earthquake and a tsunami at the same time?

TAYLOR: Yes. And we already have substantial safety regulations that require the operators of nuclear power plants to have procedures in place to test those procedures, to go through emergency drills.

And keep in mind that for the decades that we've been utilizing nuclear power without any catastrophes, we are still going to learn from what's happening in Japan, which is not going to be a catastrophe, either. So, certainly we're going to continue to learn. And when Paul talks about dirty and dangerous, nuclear power is emissions-free and there have been no U.S. fatalities regarding nuclear power.

VELSHI: Paul, last word to you. In five seconds or less, is there some amount of safety we can apply to nuclear power plants that would have you change your mind at all?

GUNTER: Well, you know, it's -- first of all, these things openly spill nuclear waste. We're aware --

VELSHI: That was sort of a yes or no question. I've got to actually wrap up my show soon.

GUNTER: No. I don't think that you can make an inherently dangerous system safe.

VELSHI: All right. Well, I promised you two guests with different views. Gentlemen, thanks very much for articulating your views for our views. There's certainly a lot of attention going to this topic. Let's discuss it again. Come back on the show.

Paul Gunter is the director of reactor oversight at Beyond Nuclear. James Taylor is a senior fellow for environmental policy at The Heartland Institute.

All right. In times of great need like we're looking at in Japan, nations rally to aid those in need. But there seems to be something different going on for Japan. I'll take a look at that in my "XYZ," coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: Time now for the "XYZ" of it.

Like other natural disasters, many Americans want to help Japan's earthquake victims. But as of yesterday Japan had only garnered $24 million in donations from Americans, mostly from corporations. When you compare that to Hurricane Katrina or the earthquake in Haiti, both of those events raised $100 million within the same time period, and a lot of that money came from individuals.

So far, Japan has made only specific requests of the international community, like asking for specialized search and rescue teams. So, the fact that there hasn't been a broader call for help from Japan may have something to do with it. Relief efforts right now are focused on immediate needs like food, water and medical care, all goods and services that can be purchased locally. Internationally charities like the Red Cross, World Vision and Save the Children are on the ground doing exactly that already. That's why cash donations now directed at those charities may be the best thing Americans can do to help the victims when their need is the most.

For more information on that, go to CNN.com/impact.

That's it for me. Brooke Baldwin takes over now with NEWSROOM. Brooke?

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Ali Velshi, thank you, sir.