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Two Tourists Killed in Florida; Inside a War Zone; Tuning In To the FAA's Turn It Off Message; Obama and Trump Heading West; "Spillionaires" Getting Rich Off BP; Blagojevich's Retrial Begins; Lindsay Lohan's Message to Hatch
Aired April 20, 2011 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: But now top of the hour. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: A new way to warn Americans that a terror attack could be imminent. Forget the color-coded system. This one gives specifics.
I'm Brooke Baldwin. The news is now.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: There are about a half a dozen to a dozen tanks lined up.
BALDWIN (voice-over): He reported on the front lines as chaos broke out in Libya. Now senior international correspondent Nic Robertson joins me live in studio to talk to me about his time inside a war zone.
Also, two tourists who just graduated college shot dead in Florida. The teenager in custody once as part of a gang initiation.
And they're being called oil spillionaires, people along the Gulf raking in cash from BP. Wait until you hear how they are making money and we will ask, is this legit?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: Welcome back. Hour two rolls on. I'm Brooke Baldwin.
We're learning more about the government's new system to warn you, Americans, about possible terror attacks. So, here's the deal. There are no colors this time, but they are in fact giving specifics, for example, location, targets. So will this help or does it run the risk of sparking fear and hysteria?
We will get you a live report on that just ahead.
But first I want to get to this. It's a border-to-border battle in Texas against fires burning across just about every portion of the state. And those firefighters out there, they are exhausted. They're doing all that they can to corral all those flames, but the dry, hot, windy weather is a formidable foe.
A bit of relief we're hearing on the horizon, but crews say the light rain, the cooler temperatures still won't be enough to dampen or really put a dent in those fires.
Just west of Fort Worth, there's this county. It's called Palo Pinto County. A massive fire forced 200 evacuations from there.
And that is where CNN's Eddie Lavandera is now.
And, Ed, what are conditions like? Have they improved whatsoever? And by the looks of it, it looks like the rain hasn't quite started yet.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we haven't seen any rain all day, but in terms of just heat and wind, it's been a much more pleasant day.
Temperatures in the 60s, perhaps the low 70s, very bearable. And the winds have been relatively light. So, really, what this has done for the wildfires has really kind of tampered everything down. And that comes as a welcome opportunity to the thousands of firefighters who are working in this area to kind of catch up, reinforce those fire lines, so that they can get back to work here which is expected to fire back up here in the next couple of days, as temperatures begin to rise again and the winds begin to pick up. That's what the forecasts are saying.
So this day a welcome opportunity to catch, to get some rest, Brooke, and try to catch up, because it's been a wild few days.
BALDWIN: Yes. I talked to a Palo Pinto volunteer firefighter just hour, who told me today is better. But he also told me those who are evacuated, including his wife and his daughter, still can't come home. Do we have any idea when they can return, is that all just predicated upon this firefighting effort?
LAVANDERA: Yes, I think that that's going to kind of one of those things that going to be touch and go, because we have been driving around. We have had colleagues driving around. And a lot of checkpoints that are blocked by state police, people not necessarily being allowed to get back into those areas, where homes might have burned down, except that those are still considered hot spots.
So, the last thing they want is a lot of people going back into these areas and these fires picking up again at a moment's notice, perhaps tomorrow or the next day, when the temperatures start to go back up. So they will be watching that closely. But really what they need is the rain. And not just a few hours of rain, Brooke. As you know, they need hours, days of rain to really kind of catch up with all of this.
So, the last count, this fire near Possum Kingdom Lake in here in the Palo Pinto County area was not even 50 percent contained. So there's still a great deal of work left to be done.
BALDWIN: We are watching it right along with you and your crew.
Ed Lavandera, my thanks to you.
And now if it's interesting, if it's happening right now, you're about to see it. I want to begin with this.
Some relief for air travelers weary of all those hidden fees, the lost luggage or being just stuck on the tarmac. Here's the deal. The federal government is beefing up the passenger bill of rights. So beginning in late August, all airlines must clearly list their fees and taxes on the Web site and if you're taking an international flight, you cannot be held up on that tarmac for more than four hours. That's the limit, four. U.S. flights are already limited to three- hour tarmac delays.
Getting in some new pictures of House Speaker John Boehner in Afghanistan. The Republican has met with President Hamid Karzai. He's also attended a memorial for U.S. troops there. And there is even a picture showing Speaker Boehner dropping a coin at the helmet of each of the fallen soldiers.
Want to take you now to Japan inside that troubled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant, where people have been evacuated and still not allowed back in. People living within a mile of the plant, they were forced to leave. Those towns now lay in waste untouched since the tsunami. And with the nuclear threat mounting, the area has been sealed off.
But before it was, we got an exclusive look inside what they call the exclusion zone.
And here is what is our Stan Grant saw.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STAN GRANT, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You can see just how quickly this family had to abandon this house. Their clothes are still hanging here in the wardrobe, as you can see around here, all of the personal effects, even photographs. There's a photo through here as well. Just how quickly they had to leave.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: As you saw, people have homes there inside the evacuation zone.
New video of flooding in Colombia. The devastation there we're hearing getting worse. This has been going on there for months and months. Look at the water. Hundreds of people killed, forcing millions to leave their homes behind. And avalanche and mud and debris covering an entire town.
And finally, they are called ballistic boxers. Check them out. Underwear designed to protect the U.S. troops in the war zone. We're told the silk boxers -- oh, they're silk, are they -- they cannot stop a bullet or protect from shrapnel, but they would stop small pieces of debris from an explosion. That's amazing. The military sending the gear to Afghanistan.
Now to Libya, where an Oscar-nominated journalist has been killed. We are learning much more about this man and what happened at the time of his death. Senior international Nic Robertson, who has spent a good chunk of the year in Libya, will join me live in the studio.
Also, two tourists are killed in Florida. A teenager now is in custody, and there are all kinds of questions about what happened in the moments leading up to their deaths. So, coming up next, we will get some answers from the Sarasota police captain. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: It is not at all the kind of headline Florida tourism officials want you to see. But take a look at Britain's "Daily Mail" online. The headline reads, gunned down in Florida, two fun-loving British friends enjoying a holiday of a lifetime.
Well, the bodies of these two college buddies were found in a rundown neighborhood of Sarasota this past weekend. And a 16-year-old dropout has now been arrested.
Have you heard about this story?
Captain Paul Sutton is with the Sarasota Police Department. He joins me on the phone here.
Captain Sutton, thanks for hopping on. And let me just ask you, and I'm sure many people have asked you this, the question must be, what were these two guys doing in such a rough part of town? And if you can, just explain to me how close this neighborhood is to the beach.
CAPT. PAUL SUTTON, SARASOTA POLICE DEPARTMENT: Right. That's one of the things that we're investigating, is how James Cooper and James Kouzaris came to be in this part of the town. I want to say one quick thing about the part of town.
BALDWIN: Sure.
SUTTON: The British press has sensationalized the area a bit.
This is a public housing area, which means it is rent-subsidized. But it is residential. And there are not crimes like this that occur on a regular basis in any portion of the city of Sarasota. In fact, this is the first murder that has occurred in the city of Sarasota this year.
So, we were shocked by it. It's a violent crime. It's not typical of this neighborhood. But we are investigating as to why Mr. Kouzaris and Mr. Cooper would have ended up in this project area, housing area, at 3:00 in the morning.
BALDWIN: So maybe one of the whys here is there are reports out there that this could be part of some sort of gang initiation. Is there any indication from your preliminary investigating that that is the case?
SUTTON: None whatsoever. And that's part of the sensationalized reporting that has gone on in this case.
A British reporter asked me, he said, is it true that there is an American gang that requires two murders in order to join this gang? And my answer to him was that we have had no other murders in the city of Sarasota. So, if initiation requires two murders, this would be a gang of one person.
BALDWIN: Well, Captain Sutton, that's why we're having you on, to help us set the record straight.
Let me ask you this, though. How usual is it that tourists would be wandering into these areas where the bodies were found? Is that odd to you?
SUTTON: Oh, it's very odd. The actual street is called Carver or Gore. And it's a one-way street. It's strictly residential. There are no businesses on that street. There's really no reason for any nonresident to be on that street at 3:00 in the morning.
It's not a through street that will basically get you from one spot to another. It's a very short one-way street in a residential neighborhood.
BALDWIN: Do you know what these two British young men were doing that night?
SUTTON: Yes. They were celebrating. They were having a night out on the town.
Mr. Cooper was here in town with his mother and father on a vacation, and also, of course, his friend James Kouzaris . They had been out with the parents earlier that evening. And then the two of them were having a night on the town. And why they left Main Street in downtown Sarasota and wandered the mile or mile-and-a-half, traveled the mile-and-a-half to this area is one of the things we're investigating.
BALDWIN: What are you hearing from any eyewitnesses?
SUTTON: Eyewitnesses who saw them downtown basically said that they were having a good time, they didn't see any conflicts with any individuals.
We're asking for anyone else that saw them downtown to report to the police, so that we can determine if there was anything that could have led up to this that occurred downtown. The people who were nearby when the homicide took place basically reported 3:00 in the morning they heard gunshots outside of their homes and when they came out to investigate, they discovered these two young men 35, 40 feet apart on either side of the road, both of them deceased from gunshot wounds.
BALDWIN: You know, Captain, I was in Sarasota not a couple months ago and it seemed to me like the safest place that I have ever been in Florida. So you say that these are the first two murders of the year.
Will this news, no matter what the outcome of the investigation, change anything, change anything about Sarasota, change anything about what you do in your police department?
SUTTON: Well, we're going to do a thorough investigation of this homicide.
And, as you know, within 24 hours of the homicide, we did make an arrest of a juvenile whose name is Shawn Tyson. He just turned 16 years old. He lives approximately one block from where the murder took place.
BALDWIN: You feel pretty confident you have got your guy?
SUTTON: We would not have taken him into custody if there was not probable cause for his arrest. We arrested him for two counts of murder.
BALDWIN: Captain Paul Sutton from Sarasota, thank you so much, the latest on the investigation there.
Now this:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTSON: More gunfire going off. But here's the truth. Here's what happened here. Look at the trees over here. Look at the devastation. Look at the destruction here. This is what the government wants us to see.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: He is a man who has spent weeks and weeks at the center of this warzone. Now, senior international correspondent Nic Robertson taking a little bit of a break from Libya here in Atlanta talking about life on the ground there in this country and the disturbing images he witnessed while covering that civil war. Nic is going to join me live in the studio and also take us live behind the scenes.
What is it like covering this story from the capital of Tripoli? Do not miss this conversation.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: If you have flown on a plane, you have definitely heard this, you know the announcement, turn off your cell phones, turn off anything with an on/off switch, turn off your computer, other electronic device while taking off and landing. But could something as simple and small as an iPod really cause disruption during the flight?
Armed with a cell phone and video camera, CNN's Ali Velshi boarded a plane to find out.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
AIR FLIGHT ANNOUNCER: At this time, please turn off all electronic devices.
ALI VELSHI, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: When you get on a plane you know that after everybody is boarded and doors are closed, they tell you, you have to turn off your CD players, your DVDs, your game players, laptops, things like that.
I have to say, I sometimes wonder whether it really matters. Well, the short answer is yes.
AIR FLIGHT ANNOUNCER: If it has an on and off switch, we ask that you turn it off now.
VELSHI (voice-over): In 1991, the Federal Communication Commission banned the in-flight use of 800 megahertz cell phones citing, quote, "potential interference with ground networks." Cell phones, the FCC says, differ from other personal electronic devices in that their signal strength is stronger and could potentially cause disruptions to the cell system towers.
(on camera): Now before you get mad at the airlines, it's actually not their policy; it's the FAA. They have a motto called Safety First, and what that means is they ban all electronics at what they call critical parts of the flight. That's at takeoff, the landing, and when you're below 10,000 feet.
(voice-over): For the noncritical portion of the flight, anything above 10,000 feet, the airline has to prove to the FAA that the particular device would not interfere with the navigation and communication systems of the particular aircraft in use, which is why some airlines allow Wi-Fi capabilities and other forms of electronic devices and some don't.
But there are those out there who say the need for these regulations is a myth. Experts who have read flight incident reports and performed scientific tests suggest that while there is no specific empirical evidence directly linking the use of personal electronic devices on planes with disasters, why take the chance at 30,000 feet?
DAVE CARSON, BOEING ELECTRICAL ENGINEER: The possibility of interference where there's a potential for interference would be similar to somebody saying, hey, I can drive through a stop sign without even slowing down and nobody's hit me yet. Obviously, it must be OK to do that. The same thing could be said of using a cell phone or wireless device on an airplane.
VELSHI: I'm heavy in-flight electronics user, but I think we can agree on one thing, no matter what the future flying rules and regulations are, no one really wants to sit next to someone on a plane and listen to them talk endlessly for hours.
Ali Velshi, CNN. (END VIDEOTAPE)
BALDWIN: Ali, thank you.
Also, keeping you in the loop, we are awaiting President Obama to speak live at a town hall in California. This one actually happening at Facebook headquarters. Will he address criticism from the Republicans who may challenge him next year? Ed Henry is standing by live at the White House for that. He is next.
We are also waiting for Nic Robertson, going to talk to me about covering the civil war in Libya.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: And now, "CNN Equals Politics." Let's go to Ed Henry at the White House for the latest now off the CNN Political Ticker.
And, Ed, what are we, about 20 minutes away from the town hall in California?
ED HENRY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right. That's right. The president will be talking with Facebook audience. He's going to their headquarters, sort of another dramatic step as he continues to try to reach out to young people particularly ahead of the 2012 elections.
But also, obviously, there are a lot of adults, more senior adults might be a charitable way of putting it. Not just young people who use Facebook, it's got hundreds of millions of users. This is one way for him to talk directly not just ahead of the election but also this deficit reduction message he started taking around the country.
Another item we want to take a look at is somebody who wants the president's job perhaps is Donald Trump. We already knew that he was heading in June into New Hampshire, Iowa, two big presidential primary and caucus states. Now we've confirmed that in June -- actually, in April, a little but sooner ahead of the events, Donald Trump is going to go to Nevada, another key state, it's actually third in the sweepstakes when the Republicans start voting.
He's going to be speaking to some Republican women's groups on April 28th. It turns out he's going to be in Vegas for the wedding of billionaire casino owner Steve Wynn and so he decided to mix in a little bit of politics.
But interesting, one of the issues that Trump has been pushing, this whole birther issue, it may -- he may be getting some push back from his fellow Republicans. Michele Bachmann, very fiery conservative, came out today on ABC's "Good Morning, America" and said, look, this issue is basically settled. Even though Donald Trump has been pushing it, she said when shown a copy of this certificate of live birth, she said that's good enough for me. Quote, "Well, then that should settle it. I take the president at his word."
This is yet another top Republican, we've heard from Karl Rove, from Eric Cantor in the Congress, saying that Donald Trump and others should drop this. The think it's too much of a lightning rod and that's it time for Republicans to move on, focus on jobs, deficit reduction, et cetera, not the birther issue, Brooke.
BALDWIN: Ed Henry for me at the White House. Ed, thank you.
And now this, there is a new way to warn you about possible terror attacks. Color codes, they're out; specifics are in. Coming up, we'll tell you why the next warning system could actually name your city and the likely target.
Plus, the pictures are rolling in. Look at that, $4.99. We're getting closer and closer to hitting that $5 mark in some cities across the U.S. We will tell you where that is happening and how to protect yourself from thieves. Yep, thieves getting creative, getting in your gas tank.
Stay right there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Another round of severe weather is threatening part of the nation, more troubling news at the gas pump and Uncle Sam says goodbye to the color-coded terror alert system.
Time to play "Reporter Roulette," and I want to begin -- there she was smiling cause she and so many Americans are happy about this -- CNN homeland security correspondent Jeanne Meserve on the government's new terror warning system.
Jeanne, tell me about it.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, there used to be five levels, now there are just going to be two, much simplified. They will be "elevated" and "imminent."
In the past, the alerts were very broad. Now they are going to try and make them much more specific. They may apply to a specific part of the country, a specific sector of the economy. They might apply only to law enforcement or in some cases they will be distributed to the public. And when they are, in addition to television and newspapers, they will be using social media like Twitter and Facebook to get out the word.
In addition, they are only going to last for two weeks. They can be he can extended, but the normal thing will be for them to expire after two weeks. This is because under the old system, the alerts would last so long that people would just stop paying attention to them.
This new system is supposed to go into effect next week, Brooke.
BALDWIN: Yes, haven't we been at orange for like multiple years?
MESERVE: Yes.
(CROSSTALK)
BALDWIN: OK, Jeanne Meserve, thank you very much.
Next in "Reporter Roulette," let's go to Chad Myers here in the Weather Center and talk about some more storms. We saw a number of tornadoes early in the week, and now we've seen some popping in Missouri, Illinois.
CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Correct. Mississippi, Alabama, Florida, Georgia, and Texas. Good news, though, kind of for Texas.
BALDWIN: What's that? The rain?
MYERS: Take the rain. Exactly. You know, just be careful what you ask for. But take the rain when you can get it. Showers and thunderstorms all the way from Jacksonville, especially south of there, through parts of Arkansas and eventually even into Texas. Some showers there popping up right along I-10.
This little button tells me there is a tornado warning somewhere. Let's see what it says. Choctaw, Montgomery and Webster Country. That would be Mississippi. That cell right there has a tornado warning on it, indicated by Doppler radar. It doesn't mean anybody has seen it yet. But this storm is spinning a little bit. Could put down a small tornado.
This is not the big tornado day - days -- that we have had over the past few days. This is going to be a wind event day, a hail day, and maybe two or three or five tornadoes. But you only need one to ruin your day, you know. Brooke, we'll just have to watch out.
BALDWIN: But Chad, quickly, and we talk about all these different tornadoes. This isn't a total anomaly. It's that kind of year, every couple of years, this kind of thing happens.
MYERS: We had a slow start. Remember, we were maybe down to about 20 percent of where we should have been, and then in the past six days, we're back up to normal.
BALDWIN: Got it.
MYERS: It's been a very brief spurt. Let's hope that spurt kind of just tapers off.
BALDWIN: OK. Here's hoping. Chad, thank you.
Next in "Reporter Roulette," today, surging stocks thanks to some surprisingly good earnings reports from tech companies. Let's take a look at the Big Board here. Or maybe -- we'll just take a look at Felicia Taylor. There's the Big Board! Dow is up about 186 points. That is looking much better than we've seen it in the last couple of days.
And then, Miss Taylor live in New York. And Felicia, we notice some cities, they are already very close, very close, to hitting that $5 gas mark FELICIA TAYLOR, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes. This just hurts, this story. It makes some of us very grateful that we can take mass transit. Americans are actually paying $5 for a gallon of gas in some states. Not surprisingly, we hear a lot about it in California. That's traditionally one of the most expensive places to fill up. We've seen photos of a station in Washington, D.C., getting close as well. And also in Stanford, Connecticut.
Not sure if it's any consolation to drivers there, but they give you a free drink when you fill up. So, OK, how does the $2 soda balance out for that $60, $70 tank of gas? I'm not sure. But we haven't even seen --
BALDWIN: That doesn't seem the answer.
TAYLOR: No, it doesn't! It doesn't! Exactly. The problem is, prices are likely to keep climbing for a few weeks. We have the all- important summer driving season. Unless we hit a tipping season that forces people to cut back on how much they drive, prices are probably going to go higher.
BALDWIN: OK, so look, that's obviously the inevitable. They were talking about how more and more people are stranded on the side of the road because they are pushing it to the last minute with the good old gas gauge.
But another issue, Felicia, gas thefts are apparently on the rise. Tell me about that.
TAYLOR: Yes, this is kind of interesting. Actually, to me it sounds dangerous. I guess it depends on how old your car is and how much you trust your neighbors or don't.
A lot of newer cars are designed to prevent gas siphoning. That's basically when you use a hose to remove fuel from a car or any kind of a vehicle. We've heard a lot about this when prices were surging back in 2008. So far, this has been happening evidently in Illinois, Pennsylvania, Nebraska, and Georgia, to name a few states. And even New Jersey, which has some of the cheapest gas in the nation -- relatively speaking. An easy and wallet-friendly way to protect yourself, get a locking gas cap. It costs about 10-15 dollars.
That sounds very dangerous, though, to siphon off gas.
BALDWIN: Yes, don't do it. Don't do it. But I don't have a locking gas cap. Maybe I should get one.
Felicia Taylor, yikes. Thank you very much.
That is today's "Reporter Roulette."
And coming up next on the other side of the break, I'm hearing he is en route to the studio right now. Our senior international correspondent taking a little bit of a break - if you call being here in Atlanta a break. Nic Robertson is going to talk about really behind the scenes, what it's like covering the war from the capital city of Tripoli. What has he heard from Gadhafi's sons, what's next in Libya. All of that is coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Right now, we're going to give you an inside look at the war raging inside Libya. Let's go back to last month. CNN's Nic Robertson reporting from the town of Zawiya. Watch this with me.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is completely the reverse from what we saw here about two weeks ago. This square was full of government opposition and now it's filled with gunfire, blaring horns of the government celebrating victory.
(GUNFIRE SOUNDS)
ROBERTSON: More gunfire going off. But here's the truth. Here's what happened here. Look at the trees over here. Look at the devastation. Look at the destruction here. This is what the government wants us to see. These people celebrating their victory here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Well, that is CNN's Nic Robertson. He has been right at the forefront of CNN's reporting for the last several weeks in Libya. Now he is here in Atlanta. Very different scene on some sofas versus what you've been covering and doing in Libya the last couple of weeks.
I just want to first ask you, and I remember asking you this when you were in Tripoli, all of the gunfire and watching that, you didn't even flinch, Nic Robertson. I mean, hearing all of that, being surrounded by it, what's happening in the skies - I mean, just a really honest question is are you ever frightened?
ROBERTSON: When you see the guns and you hear the gunfire, you know there's gunfire. It's when you don't see the guns and you hear the gunfire, then you start to worry. Then you flinch. And I find you come out of that environment and then you hear the gunfire, like watching right now, I was like ooh, ooh, ooh!
BALDWIN: You flinch now. After the fact.
(LAUGHTER0
BALDWIN: I want to get to some more of your reports. And we've pulled some more video. This is the moment when a woman, then unknown, she's approaching here a group of journalists to say that she had been raped by forces loyal to Moammar Gadhafi. We're going to let you pick it up here. Let's listen to that moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: So that is the story of Eman Al-Obeidy, who we have told her story. And so if I may, I want to pick up with the other part of the story. I know you saw a lot of, which is the government minders, these officials who turn up, I'm guessing out of nowhere. Are they following your every move when you're there in Tripoli and if they are, did that hamper at all any of your reporting?
ROBERTSON: They are all over the hotel, these government officials. And you know that they are there because these are the same guys that are going to be going out with you on these government- sponsored trips. But you don't know that they are going to physically pull a gun on you in the hotel. That's happened to our cameraman, Halil Abdullah (ph). You don't realize they are going to take your camera away from you and smash it on the floor of the hotel. So --
BALDWIN: Which they did to you all?
ROBERTSON: Which they did. It comes as a shock. You know these guys are there but don't know that they are going to react in this way or respond in this way.
BALDWIN: And you and I were talking earlier today. Just across the street, literally across the street to go grab a drink, they finally stopped tailing you.
ROBERTSON: Sometimes. I mean, Halil and Tommy Evans, my producer, went out to buy drinks at the store. I tried to go out two minutes after them to join them, and I got stopped at the gates by the police as well. The police and government minders, and I tried to say I'm with those guys, they started physically hauling me back. And the control -- but this was a progression. When we first went there, the government there didn't have any idea what it meant to let in 130 journalists. They didn't realize we were going to go everywhere and do what we wanted to do. And they realized it and started putting in more security people. Less intellectuals around us and more thugs to kind of control us. And that's what they did.
BALDWIN: I know you have a lot of contacts, you have sources within the Libyan government. So we have some more video. You've met several of Gadhafi sons. You have met with his sons, Saadi. You've also met with his Saif. And in speaking with them, did you learn anything with regard to their father? How do they feel about their father? Would they at all be willing to have him step down? To leave the country?
ROBERTSON: Leave the country, that's different. Step down, yes.
BALDWIN: Leave the country, no?
ROBERTSON: They say he would be afraid of being caught up and taken to the Hague, international crime tribunal for war crimes. They don't want that to happen. They want - he -- the father wants some kind of sort of recognition for his hero status in the country, which he had several decades ago amongst some Libyans --
BALDWIN: And amongst some tribes still today.
ROBERTSON: And amongst some tribes still today. Yes. So, they would like to see him -- and they do expect to see him step down but not as they say, at the point of a gun and not as initial starting position on negotiations.
BALDWIN: What about the mood among the Libyans? I know for the most part perhaps all of the time you've been in the capital city of Libya, which is far from the major, major fighting. And you haven't had the bombs. How is that effective? People within Tripoli -- I don't know psychologically, are they aware that this war is raging on?
ROBERTSON: When they see the heavy antiaircraft fire in the evening and then they hear some of the bombs dropping and planes fly over, they kind of register it. But then three or four hours later, the sun is out, the stores have food in, they might be lining up for gas because there isn't so much gas. But it's almost as if life is normal.
It's not. But this is the psychology in the war. When it seems normal, when there is nothing dropping in front of you, nobody dropping dead in front of you, no bombs dropping that minute, then you just get on with your life.
People at night, I mean, I talked to people in that city. People who with the opposition that we can't put on camera and talk about while we're there. And they tell me, my children are afraid. They tell me they can't sleep at night. They wake me up and say, Daddy, what is going on? So, you hear heart wrenching stories from people who want Gadhafi gone. But they can't come out on the streets and say it or on camera.
But at the same time, they are worried themselves about the bombing. Their kids are frightened.
BALDWIN: You mentioned -- you're a father, you have children. Are they fully aware of what you do and the dangers involved in your job each and every day?
ROBERTSON: A long time ago, my daughter said to me, "Daddy, you can't fool me." And she was right. And I can't fool their mom, either. They know what I do.
BALDWIN: Wow. Nic Robertson -
ROBERTSON: I'm the luckiest man I know.
BALDWIN: -- it is such a pleasure to meet you finally in person. Bravo. Amazing job to you and your crew. Thank you.
And they are being called oil spillionaires. People along the Gulf who have apparently made a killing off the oil spill disaster. Coming up next, I'll speak with someone who is livid over this situation and demand BP spend its money differently. Wayne Landry is a councilman in Louisiana's St. Bernard Parish. I will ask him all about this, next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN,: Have you ever heard the term "spillionaires" as in "oil spillionaires?" This is a name, a phrase coined for people who have gotten rich off the BP oil spill.
In a recent article published by Pro Publica on "The Washington Post," here it is Pro Publica, all 13 pages of it. They point to what they term a gusher of money that went to a lot of the wrong people and not to the people who actually needed this money.
Some are saying these "spillionaires" actually need jail time. Wayne Landry is a councilman in St. Bernard Parish there in Louisiana and he thinks the billions that BP has already spent could have been put to better use.
So Mr. Landry, thank you for coming on. Let me just ask you this point blank, how do you think all of this money should have been spent?
WAYNE LANDRY, COUNCILMAN, ST. BERNARD PARISH, LOUISIANA: Well, I want to put it in perspective because the media frenzy that's out there, I think sometimes loses the focus. We have a commercial fishing community in St. Bernard Parish that was affected by the oil spill.
I wanted that money first and foremost to go to those that were directly impacted, and that's our commercial fishing people. Secondarily, we have our restaurant too and small businesses that were also affected.
But, you know, when we talk about $18 billion being spent on this oil spill, and I look at FJK Campus boat launch in Shell Beach, which is still owed today $30,000 for the fuel he sold for the vessel of opportunities to go out there and clean up the oil spill.
And Lionel Serenay (ph) in Delacroix Island who still owed a couple hundred thousand for fuel. I mean, you know, there are some unique problems that have occurred in our powers obviously.
BALDWIN: What do you think should happen then to some of these people who gained this system and got all these money that you say they weren't entitled to? Would you take it as far as saying that they should go to jail?
LANDRY: Well, I think if this is any wrong doing that was prosecutorially (ph), obviously they should go to jail. I mean, when you have middle men in between BP and those vendors, and I'm not talking about claims for damages or anything, but actual asset acquisitions, you know, something is wrong when they are not being paid.
When you have a private citizen billing BP for our St. Bernard Parish deputies and the assets that our parish owns in terms of police vehicles and supplies, and they are billing BP for all of those things and then paying the deputies an hourly rate, and keeping the difference something is wrong there as well.
We also had a middle man in between a lot of other things in terms of the asset acquisition, which was another problem.
BALDWIN: When you read the Pro Publica article on their site, many, many different examples than there - "Washington Post" to really deserve all of the credit here and going through a lot of these different documents.
They site one specific example like a contractor billed BP more than $50,000 a month to rent a generator that apparently cost $1,500 a month, how extensive was this? How many people were doing this?
LANDRY: I think it was widespread. You know, and again, look, I really don't have to have sympathy for BP for having opened up their checkbook. I mean, this deficiency was created by them. The oil mess was created by them.
All indications that I've seen is that BP was acting irresponsibly and of course, they were being under a lot of pressure from the Obama administration to continue to put their assets in play to correct this problem.
But at the end of the day, when you see things like that, you see land use for $1 million a month to rent an acre of land that was going for $1,700 a month. I mean, those moneys and those dollars, we have commercial fishermen out of work because of this.
They waited four weeks to work three days then four weeks again off. With all of the uncertainty about their future, their heritage and their way of life, I mean, it was an enormous amount of inequities there and it's all across the board.
BALDWIN: And one man who cited multiple times in this article, a lot of finger pointing goes to the president of St. Bernard Parish. We did reach out to him just to try to get his side of the story, being fair and in part I want to read some of his statement.
He says, we demanded that our local businesses and vendors be used whenever possible and requested that BP distribute their purchases as widely as they could. He goes on, anyone who profited from the oil spill response should be held accountable for their charges. We fully support any action to correct any misuse or overcharging practices engaged by any responder, including federal agencies.
I wish I could have seen your face, sir, as we were reading that statement. Do you think, though, that this reinforces the belief held by a lot of people out there that the Louisiana government is corrupt?
LANDRY: Well, unfortunately, I think it does. And I think the article kind of pointed out a lot of little things like the dog food, the guy that went out and bought dog food. You know, our parish still should have been functioning as a parish. That's a normal activity of our parish. I can tell you, I lived in the area affected by the oil spill. I represent all of the people of St. Bernard Parish, but I live in that particular area. And I can tell you that people down there were not abandoning their dogs for BP to be responsible for the dog food.
Again, I am not concerned that BP had to open their checkbook. You know, right is right and wrong is wrong. I don't think BP should have been paying for those types of services and I know the article reflected that it was a future relative of our parish president.
Having said that, the leadership of our parish, which I am a part of, the leadership in total was not in control of tasking who worked, which restaurants were able to serve food, et cetera, et cetera. Our parish president had the sole authority through unified command to task those things.
BALDWIN: I know you say in the article you feel as though it's guilty by association. Councilman Wayne Landry, we thank you. We got to leave it there. Thank you so much, sir. Appreciate it.
LANDRY: Sure.
BALDWIN: The man known as "Blogo," he is back in the news. Jury selection under way in the former Illinois governor's retrial, but will he actually take the stand?
Also, here's an odd couple. Lindsay Lohan and Republican Orrin Hatch. What? Find out why the troubled actress is asking for the senator's help. Wait until you hear where he was when her message arrived. Joe Johns, of course, is all over this one in today's "Political Pop." Joe and I will talk in just a moment.
But first this, is America a happy country? You probably never maybe gave much of it too much thought. Well, Gallop did. They did a little research and got the list of the happiest countries in the world. How did America fair?
Rounding out the top five, most happy countries, Finland coming in at number four, friends down under, Australia, and ranking in the third happiest country in the world, our friend just in the north, Canada. So did America make the list of the top five happiest countries in the world? Stay right there. We'll be right back with the answer.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: OK. I know you've been thinking, could it be America one of the top happy five countries in the world? This new Gallop report did the leg work for us.
It has the list of the top five happiest countries, did we make it? Let's find out. This reveal this, coming at number two in the list is Sweden and the happiest country in the world is not America. It is Denmark and in case you were curious as many of us were, the U.S. ranked number 12 on the happy country list. And now to "Political Pop." Former governor of Illinois, Rod Blagojevich back in the news. The jury selection is beginning in his retrial on corruption charges.
Joe Johns here with the "Political Pop." Mr. Johns, do you think he's going to testify?
JOE JOHNS, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, that's a good question. All right, in Illinois, I don't know how many interviews this guy has given, but any interview you hear, it seems like he's talking his head off.
In case you need reminding, this is the case that came up out of the charges that Blagojevich allegedly tried to sell or horse trade away Barack Obama's Senate seat after he became president.
First time around, mistrial of 23 out of 24 counts. They are just picking the jury now and probably won't get started until next week sometime actually.
So will he testify on his own defense? He said he wants to tell his story, but doesn't want to over promise. The truth is, a lot of experienced defense attorneys say if he does testify, he's really going to get worked over on the stand because he said so much in public about the case. That's the way cross-examinations work.
BALDWIN: Yes, I mean, let's be honest, he's a bit of a talker because you know, look, if you're in legal trouble, you have a trial, don't your lawyers say, stop talking? But Blagojevich, not so much, why?
JOHNS: They probably can't control him first thing, but he also says it's because he's innocent. He feels slighted by the prosecutors. But some politicians in trouble, as you know, actually use the news media to get their message out to potential jurors and there's the issue of damage control. It's hard to imagine at this stage how he's going to be able to fix his image.
BALDWIN: Speaking of maybe some damage control, if this could be a segway, Lindsay Lohan, we have some news about Lindsay Lohan. She's tweeting members of the United States Senate, including Orrin Hatch of Utah. Why?
JOHNS: This is being described as Hill staffer as completely out of left field. Lindsay Lohan who has definitely had her share of run- ins with the law recently, could be back in court on Friday on that theft charge.
She apparently took a turn of what you might call lobbying the Congress to put up a tweet that calls on Republicans Senator Orrin Hatch and Democratic Senator Dianne Feinstein to support something called the Youth Promise Act, which has been kicking around in Congress.
It's about intervention, mentoring program, mostly for gang members and youthful offenders. I talked to Hatch's office today -- BALDWIN: What did they say?
JOHNS: Well, they really didn't have any comment on it other than to suggest that it was highly unusual and that he is opposed to the bill. Sounds like Feinstein is not opposed to the bill, but wasn't able to get through to her office.
BALDWIN: So why, again, is Lindsay Lohan doing this? What kind of cause is this?
JOHNS: Well, this is basically a bill to help youthful offenders and gang members get intervention, counseling and treatment, if you will, when they get locked up on any of a number of charges. It doesn't really reduce sentences or anything.
This story was first reported by the Hill newspaper and Hatch's office actually said when this tweet came out, he was on jury duty on Monday which, of course, is kind of irrelevant because Congress isn't even in session. It's not like he's going to run to the floor of the Senate and change anybody's mind.
BALDWIN: Or run to his Blackberry and tweet something back out to Lindsay Lohan.
JOHNS: Exactly.
BALDWIN: Not so much. Joe Johns, good to see you with the "Political Pop." Thank you so much. You have to be watching the bottom right hand corner of your screen. We've been showing you President Obama who has just begun speaking at this town hall.
Remember, it was yesterday he was in Virginia. Now this is town hall number two and, of all places, Facebook there, in California.
And that does it for me here at Atlanta. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Now up to Washington, Candy Crowley in "THE SITUATION ROOM" -- Candy.
