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CIA Did Surveillance on Bin Laden Compound For Months Before Raid; Two Islamic Clerics Not Allowed on American Flight By Pilot; Storms and Tornadoes Devastate Southern States; Analysts Debate Political Significance of Bin Laden Killing; New Candidate Enters Republican Field of Presidential Hopefuls; Female Jockey to be Riding In Kentucky Derby

Aired May 07, 2011 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, there, everybody. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, Georgia, this is your Saturday morning.

It is 10:00 a.m. here in Atlanta, but it's 9:00 a.m. in Memphis, Tennessee. That is where people are on alert. Take a look at that. They are waiting to see if their homes are going to withstand the flood waters. We could be talking about historic levels of flooding there and in other places along the Mississippi river. We will have a live update.

Also, more and more new details continue to trickle out about exactly what happened in Pakistan before a U.S. team moved in on Osama bin Laden.

Also, a school trip to the zoo ends with a trip to the hospital for a 7-year-old boy who is mauled by a leopard after he tried to get a little too close. The witness will share how quick-thinking visitors may have saved the day.

But first, I want to get to some more details and more reaction about the removal of two Muslim clerics from a commercial airplane. This happened yesterday aboard an Atlantic southeast airlines flight. The flight was headed from Memphis to charlotte. Earlier I spoke with Ibrahim Hooper, a spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations which was contacted by the two Muslim men.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

IBRAHIM HOOPER, COUNCIL ON AMERICAN-ISLAMIC RELATIONS (via telephone): They said they were taking a flight to a religious conference in Charlotte from Memphis. They went through security, even went through secondary security, and got on the plane, were taxiing out. They were taxied back. TSA came on and pulled them off and said the pilot was refusing to fly with them because passengers were uncomfortable with them.

Now, the Delta officials on site rescreened them and assured they were no threat and trying to get the pilot to put them back on the plane, and the pilot absolutely refused and, ultimately, took off. HOLMES: Sir, was there anything, at least these men say, I assume maybe they have flown before and they might fly all the time for all we know, but was there anything in particular looking back that they think they did to cause any kind of alarm to their fellow passengers?

HOOPER: No. They weren't told that any passenger made any accusation against them. All that was mentioned was that some passengers were uncomfortable with them. And I'm assuming that would stem from what you could regard as Islamic attire, a robe and a skull cap, that kind of thing.

I think what you've got here is kind of one of these Juan William scenarios where people are just uncomfortable being on a plane with somebody that looks like they're Muslim.

HOLMES: I do want to share. I just want to share for our viewers. These two were on an Atlantic southeast airlines flight. They did put out a statement. I'll read it to you and share it with our viewers. And they say "We take security and safety very seriously, and the event is currently under investigation." They go on to say, "We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience that this may have caused." Ibrahim, from what you understand - go ahead.

HOOPER: The imams actually praised Delta. Delta is the governing body of that airline. They praised the delta officials on the scene for trying to negotiate with the pilot to get them back on the plane. But it seemed to be the pilot's problem.

HOLMES: Any passenger, they weren't told the passengers were uncomfortable, but as they were on that plane did anyone say anything to them that made it seem that they were uncomfortable?

HOOPER: No. They said no one said anything and delta officials went on the plane and actually asked people if they were uncomfortable and offered to put them on another flight, if they were uncomfortable, and nobody raised their hand.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: All right, we do want to note here that both men were bound for a conference where the subject was prejudice against Muslims. It's also worth noting, this is not the first such incident we have seen. Five years ago six imams kicked off a flight on a different airline after they were returning from that same conference.

We do want to turn now to some weather and devastating weather, in particular, flooding. Look at this, folks. This is happening all along the Mississippi River. It's spilling over its banks. It's forced its tribute airs to flood streets and backyards, some areas under evacuation orders. Not everyone is leaving even though maybe they should.

Look at this map, the affected states there. The Mississippi river, of course, cuts right through the center of this country and you can see all those places along Iowa, Illinois, Missouri, they're seeing flooding. Levees are being counted on to save communities. Most of this is being caused by rain in some places up to 20 inches.

Coming up at the bottom of the hour, we are talking to the office of emergency preparedness in Memphis. We'll hear exactly how things are going there. Stick with us for that.

Now, the rising waters flowing towards the Gulf of Mexico putting a lot of major cities in danger over the next few days and also even weeks. Alexandra Steele meteorologist is here with us on this CNN Saturday morning. You and I have been talking about this all morning. How people have time. They are getting a heads up. They know a disaster is coming in two weeks. Kind of odd to say it that way, but that is literally what we're talking about, is it not?

ALEXANDRA STEELE, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Absolutely. It's not a flash flood that happens in seconds. What residents are seeing is a slow water rise and it's just unbelievable. What we've seen here along the Mississippi, maybe in some of these areas we've seen a foot rise a day, and that's what we're going to see until it crests.

So we're talking about a crest of 50 feet in some areas. This is where we have the record flooding and all these flood warnings. So right now we're watching, I think we all kind of began to talk about it and see it when we saw and heard from Caro, Illinois, with, of course, the towns being evacuated. That's what we're beginning to see as the Mississippi heads south and so does the slow wall of water that continues to move.

The problem is we'll see in the next five days, not the 15 to 20 inches of rain that we have seen, an incredible amount of rain for so much of the central portion of this country from Illinois down to Louisiana and Mississippi and western Texas and western areas of Kentucky, so much rain, 300 percent of average for the most part. A few more inches is possible in the next five days, but, certainly, nothing like what we've seen.

And, of course, this is the Mississippi flooding down to Memphis. And Memphis, unfortunately, is really the biggest city and next in line, expected in just four days to crest at 48 feet. Major flooding just to give you a little perspective is 46 feet. To give you even more perspective, six inches, that's it, of flowing water can drown a person, six inches. Look what we're talking about here -- 48 feet.

We talk about it being historic and record breaking and it most certainly is, a lot of these records back to 1937 and the floods of 1927 and even a 1915 number. So, it is quite dramatic.

Moving farther south, Memphis is up next and as we move through the next couple days. Vicksburg you'll see 14.5 feet above flood stage and the important note with this, this is the Mississippi river and just to show you, the communities and the casinos along these rivers. So, incredibly dramatic and you can see by the time we get to Baton Rouge, we're going to see the cresting the 23rd of May, just in a few days. Back to you, T.J.

HOLMES: Alexandra Steele with us this weekend. There's another severe weather story we need to tell you about. This took place last week. It seems like a lot has happened since then and a lot has happened, but, remember, we just saw last week one of the largest outbreaks of tornadoes in this country's history. It was also one of the deadliest in this country's history.

We bring in Reynolds Wolf who is in there in the south at a Red Cross relief center in Tuscaloosa. I have been hitting on this this morning that last week we woke up to these tornados and then a lot of royal wedding coverage and then Osama bin Laden was killed and that took so much of the headlines all week. It seems like, you know, remind our viewers here just how historic of a week we saw last week even though, unfortunately, this story seems to moved away from the headlines.

REYNOLDS WOLF, CNN METEOROLOGIST: No question about it, T.J. I mean, certainly, it was the worst natural disaster in the state of Alabama's history, maybe in the nation. It's something that will take the region a very long time to recover.

I can tell you right now at this particular relief disaster, it is one of 11 here in the state of Alabama, over 50 nationwide. And people have been coming in here and doing everything from showers to hot meals and something to drink and anything from dental care, regular health care, it's amazing. It's a one-stop shop for people who have lost everything and amazing thing to see people volunteering and helping out fellow Americans.

But, I would be remiss to say this is not the only place affected. We have really focused on a great place of Tuscaloosa, but there are many smaller communities across the southeast that have just been ripped apart by these tornadoes. There are places like Webster's Chapel.

Another place ravaged by the tornadoes is Pratt City just to the northwest of Alabama, northwest of Birmingham, rather. The mayor of Birmingham was actually there yesterday. If you check out this video, you can see a bit of it. Mayor William Bell was there and he also had a special visitor with him, that's the comedian Bill Cosby. He is the speaker at Miles College and the two were able to walk around and see the damage first hand and, again, they were both mesmerized by what they found.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL COSBY, ENTERTAINER: What I've seen of trucks and maintenance things coming to clear up, as long as that's happening. And I think people have learned from Katrina that this is reality. And your mayor to make sure so quickly, so fast, this is turning people into believers. And we need them to believe that they can help each other.

MAYOR WILLIAM BELL, BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA: While this storm was devastating, it has brought out the best of our city and I'm grateful to be the mayor of a city that has such wonderful people in it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF: I can tell you that the cleanup has really begun in many places, including Pratt City and here in Tuscaloosa bit by bit. You have to remember, again, this is a tornado of historic proportions, just incredibly large, at times over a mile wide in spots. So, T.J., certainly going to take a very, very long time before we recover. Let's send it back to you in the studio.

HOLMES: Reynolds there for us in Alabama. We appreciate you, as always, talk to you soon.

For our viewers, if you're looking for ways to help out the disaster victims in the south, go to CNN.com/impact to find information on charities and help with both flood and tornado victims.

An American born radical cleric linked to Al Qaeda appears to have escaped an American military attempt to kill him. A drone fired a missile into an area of southern Yemen where Anwar al-Awlaki he is known to spend time. Al-Awlaki was born in New Mexico and is accused of recruiting the so-called "underwear bomber" who tried to blow up a plane in Detroit back in 2009.

Meanwhile, the Taliban in Afghanistan acknowledging the death of Osama bin Laden. This comes on the heels of acknowledgment from Al Qaeda that its leader was killed from American commandos. The Taliban statement issued yesterday said bin Laden, quote, "embraced martyrdom," and that his death will reinvigorate the holy war against the United States and its allies.

Officials at the zoo in Wichita, Kansas, say there are no plans to euthanize a leopard that attacked a first-grader yesterday. Witnesses say the boy climbed over a barrier and got too close to the exhibit.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NAOMI ROBINSON, EYEWITNESS: The cat just really reached out and grabbed him by his head and then a man and woman jumped up there and kicked him in his head. And he released the child and they just grabbed him and put pressure on the side of his face where he clawed him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: A zoo spokesman says the incident is a first in the 40 years since the zoo has been open. The child's condition has been upgraded from critical to fair.

Before the special operations team moved in, U.S. intelligence was keeping a close eye on the compound where Osama bin Laden was living. We'll take you inside this high-tech surveillance operation. That is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: It's 16 minutes past the hour now. Before Seal team six went charging in the compound, CIA analysts had done their homework, months of painstaking work from a safe house trying to determine if the tall man they nicknamed "The Pacer" was really the most notorious terrorist on the planet. CNN's Brian Todd with the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Keeping eyeballs on Osama bin Laden in Abbottabad, U.S. intelligence put together a so-called pattern of life. Crucial details on the people inside this compound and their movements. Human intelligence was critical, and CNN has learned in the weeks leading up to the raid there were multiple sightings of a tall man. According to "New York Times" and "Washington Post," the CIA operated out of a safe house here the bin Laden compound, listening in, photographing, watching meticulously.

SCOTT SHANE, "NEW YORK TIMES": They supposedly observed behind one-way glass so no one could look in at them.

TODD: We couldn't get comment on the reported safe house from anyone at CIA. The "Times" and "Post" say for months the U.S. team used telephoto lenses, infrared imaging, eavesdropping devices from the facility. CNN contributor Tm Fuentes is a former FBI assistant director who served in Iraq. At our data wall we mapped out possible safe house locations.

TODD (on camera): Here's a satellite video of the area. If you're running a safe house, which one do you choose?

TOM FUENTES, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: You'll probably look at something in this area here because you have multiple houses. It will be easier for people to come and go and not track the attention of some of the other places. Also, you'll have to consider in this section of houses, do you have a higher house? It's hard to tell.

We're looking vertically down. Are one of these three, four stories high to enable a view over the compound view to look at who is walking around on the inside? You want to avoid a place like over here because it's too exposed.

TODD (voice-over): White House officials say bin Laden may have lived at the compound for up to six years, BUT It's not clear if he ever ventured out. The American spies observing the house observed a man taking regular walks, 20 minutes, sometimes an hour at a time. They were never able to confirm it was bin Laden. They called him "the pacer."

The safe house was likely a crucial piece in this operation and a risky one. With all the equipment, personnel and informants being shuttled in and out, it could have been blown at any time.

Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: Well, from a childhood of wealth to a U.S. ally against the soviets to 9/11 mastermind, how Osama bin Laden became the world's most wanted man. Tonight CNN takes an in-depth look at one of the most haunted terrorist of all time. Our Anderson Cooper hosts an award winning documentary "In the Footsteps of bin Laden," 7:00 eastern right here on CNN.

One of the Republicans considering a run for president is in South Carolina at this hour. There's a good chance you don't know his name or his face. But why still is this potential candidate so intriguing? Well, because until last week he was working for President Obama.

Also, "Fortune" magazine has released its list of America's largest corporations. No surprise that three of the top five are oil companies. I'll give you 1:15 to come up with the other two. I assure you you'll coming up with at least one.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: "Fortune" magazine has released its list of America's 500 largest corporations for 2011. That's based on revenue. Two out of the five are not oil companies. Fannie Mae, the financial services company comes in fifth on the fortune 500 list. The next three are in the oil business, Conoco Philips, Chevron, Exxon Mobil. And topping the list for the second year in a row, the one I was pretty sure you would get, Wal-Mart.

Well, it has been a pretty busy week for Republican John Huntsman. Who? You know, John Huntsman. You know John Huntsman. He's the former governor of Utah and he's also president Obama's former ambassador to China. He arrived back home and met with lawmakers and huddled with advisors about a possible presidential bid.

And today he is making a first public appearance. He is delivering the commencement address at this school. Now, the school and its location are of a little bit of significance here. And for that, let me bring in CNN political reporter Peter Hamby on the line with me from Columbia, South Carolina.

Peter, would I be silly to believe that this is just the coincidence that he happens to be delivering a commencement address in South Carolina of all places?

PETER HAMBY, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER (via telephone): No. Why would you think that? He's also delivering a commencement address in New Hampshire later this month. Obviously, two key primary states in the Republican nominating process and, yes, seriously thinking about running for president. Most viewers might not know who he is. If you look at this guy's poll numbers, he's at one percent.

So why do we care? He surrounded himself since returning from China with a crew of top political advisers. He's sitting on a huge family fortune and, like you said, he just returned from China and, obviously, China and the economy are likely to be huge topics of discussion in the Republican nomination fight.

But he worked for president Obama, and he's on the record calling Obama a remarkable leader. Just this week on CNN, former president Jimmy Carter called John Huntsman an attractive candidate. That's not exactly the way to win over Republican primary voters. But the Huntsman campaign thinks -- excuse me, he's not officially a candidate, but they believe there's space for him in the field for kind of a moderate, fresh face.

HOLMES: Peter, for our viewers here. He has this background on China, which could help him out and surely the economy is going to be a big part of the upcoming campaign, but what else about this man, because you hear the same thing, he's an attractive candidate? What is it about him that has so many people paying attention, even though a lot of people might not even know his name?

HAMBY: It's interesting. The speech he just finished at the University of South Carolina was our first chance to see him. And he wasn't campaigning, per se, but he did make his service in China calling it a patriotic duty when you're called to serve by the president, you serve.

But when you talk to Republican activists around the country, they're not really impressed with the current field of candidate. Mitt Romney, Newt Gingrich, these folks haven't really excited the Republican base. So, there's a hunger out there for a new voice. That's why you see so many people clamoring for Chris Christie to run for president, for example.

But the Huntsman team thinks he can be that fresh face. He is attractive, charismatic. He rides a Harley and talks in a speech about how he used to play in a rock 'n' roll band in high school and made an illusion to the band Ben Folds Five, they were a '90s band. We'll just have to see if it works. He'll probably make a decision about the race at some point in June. But he's worth keeping an eye on, I think, T.J.

HOLMES: That band reference sailed over my head, too. Peter, good to have you on the line. We appreciate you. We'll be checking in with him plenty throughout the campaign season.

We're getting close to the bottom of the hour. This weekend I know you're looking for a way to save money. We're trying to help you with that, in particular, on gas. About $4 a gallon is the average, so everybody is trying to find the cheapest gas possible. Believe it or not, this was a very simple thing you can do, a simple app that will help you find the cheapest gas in your very own neighborhood. In one minute and 15 seconds I will tell you about it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: We're coming to the bottom of the hour on this CNN Saturday morning. Before the break I was telling you there was an app that could help you find the cheapest gas in your neighborhood. This thing is called gasbuddy.com. You may or may not have heard of it. But it has been around for a while, 11 years and five million users. You can see this map here, but it shows you where the cheapest gas is across the country. Or, you can simply type in your very own zip code and see the prices for gas stations in your very own neighborhood. And it's called Gas Buddy. It's available on the web or as an app for your iPhone, your android or windows mobile. Use it, might save you some money.

Well, when disaster strikes, Tad Agoglia, he and his response, his mobile response team, are some of the first to arrive on the scene. That was the case in 2008 when he was a top ten CNN hero. It's true now. They rolled into Ringgold, Georgia, a town hard hit by the devastating southern tornadoes.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TAD AGOGLIA, CNN HERO: When a disaster strikes, you don't really know what you're going to need. That's why we packaged up four tractor trailers loaded with gear and tools and piece of equipment. We roll those rigs all across this country.

We decided to come to Ringgold, Georgia, because it's a small community and most likely they didn't have the resources they'd need. All these homes were completely destroyed. My team had been to about 38 mega storms at this point, but we have never seen anything like this before. It's all gone, almost like the whole city went through a blender.

When we first got here, we started powering up the shelter and clearing the roads and we wanted to just help stabilize the situation. We will have him come in and grab these trees off these two stones right here.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They went over and cleared the cemetery. That's why I'm able to bury my father today.

AGOGLIA: We're going to keep working until this is done.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He then came over and offered his services, again.

AGOGLIA: We just joined with the family members on our hands and knees looking for things.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We found a wedding picture of my dad and mom. These guys are angels. Thank you so much for you and your team.

AGOGLIA: When we see people that are really suffering and struggling, it's our responsibility to come and to help. This is part of being human, to see a need and to do something about it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOLMES: And since 2007, Tad and his team have helped 39 communities around the U.S. as well as in Haiti, all free of charge. If you know someone like tad who is making a difference in the world, please, we'd like to hear about them. All of this year's CNN heroes is chosen from people you nominate at CNNheroes.com.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: All right, about 33 minutes past the hour on the CNN Saturday morning. I'm T.J. Holmes. Thank you for spending part of your day here with us.

One of the stories we're keeping a close eye on, the water levels, the ever rising water levels and Memphis and other Mississippi towns. Oh, my goodness, spring storms are adding to this growing flood threat. Experts say it could be the worst flooding in more than 80 years.

With that in mind, Memphis, the city and also Shelby County authorities have issued some evacuation orders for residents living in low-lying, flood prone areas. I want to get on the line now with Mr. Bob Nations. He is with the Shelby County office of preparedness there. Sir, thank you for being on the line here with us. I was talking to you in the commercial break and you said the river is wrapping its arms around you. What do you mean by that?

BOB NATIONS, OFFICE OF PREPAREDNESS, SHELBY COUNTY, TENN. (via telephone): We knew the eventuality would become a reality and we watched this now for about ten days and so our tributaries are beginning to back up west to east and the Mississippi is rising, as has been forecast. And so it just looks like tentacles that are wrapping its arms around Shelby County.

HOLMES: When do you think it will stop rising and expect some sign of relief?

NATIONS: The forecast now is that the Mississippi River will crest next Wednesday, may 11th, at 7:00 p.m. at 48 feet. And we're watching that and we'll continue to monitor that. But right now that's where we're headed.

HOLMES: Any thoughts, sir, on mandatory evacuations? There were a few places that had those up and down the Mississippi river. Are you just advising people to evacuate or are you advising them to step up and require them to get out?

NATIONS: We really don't have a mandatory evacuation law to stand on. So, we strongly suggest when we go door-to-door and hand out our leaflets of the evacuation notices, for their safety and for the security of their property, we strongly suggest that people heed those warnings.

HOLMES: Well, if you had that law right now, sir, would you use it?

NATIONS: I think in some areas we probably would.

HOLMES: At this point, one more thing here -- no deaths or any injuries associated with this flooding or any people missing. How is that going as far as the human toll?

NATIONS: Well, very fortunately we had no reports of injuries and certainly no reports of any fatalities at this time, and, obviously, we're hoping that won't occur.

HOLMES: Mr. Bob nations, again, with Shelby County. Sir, we appreciate the time. We know it's a busy time for you guys. We appreciate the update. Good luck to you.

NATIONS: Thank you, T.J.

HOLMES: All right, the killing of Osama bin Laden we'll head back to now. That has been a major story this week and a triumph for the U.S. military and a triumph for the White House. It's also proving to be a political triumph. Yes, there are some politics involved here. The president visited ground zero. Former presidents, George W. Bush, Bill Clinton chose not to attend at ground zero event.

CNN senior political analyst David Gergen says some Bush supporters said he hasn't been given enough credit by the Obama administration.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID GERGEN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: There are people around President Bush who are irritated, sore that they're not getting more credit for what they did in years past. They believe that the harsh interrogation techniques used on the detainees in Guantanamo did provide a clue to help find the currier that led to bin Laden. They believe that president Obama should have given more credit to President Bush and that famous speech that he made a couple nights ago.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Joining me now to talk about the death of Osama bin Laden and other power politics in general, Republican analyst Lenny McAllister and Democratic strategist Maria Cardona, friends of our show here on CNN Saturday and Sunday morning.

Maria, good morning. Maria, Do I have you? She cannot hear me just yet. So, Lenny, I will start with you since Lenny clearly sabotaged her microphone and her IFB this morning. I'll just go ahead and start with you.

(LAUGHTER)

Lenny, while we're getting that worked out, I'll ask you guys at the beginning every time, every weekend, what was the political headline of the week for you? So, what was it?

LENNY MCALLISTER, REPUBLICAN ANALYST: Well-deserved presidential bump, well-deserved bubble bursting.

HOLMES: What is that potential bubble bursting?

MCALLISTER: Well, the news from the economy is not good. The unemployment rate has gone up. Jobless claims are going up. The GDP has slowed down. We have a lot of economic indicators that are not going in the right direction and this is something that, you know, President Obama, everybody compares him to Jimmy carter. But his greatest presidential comparison right now that he has to avoid is daddy Bush. George H.W. Bush because his approval ratings went through the roof after desert storm, but the economy did not allow him to have a second term. That's what the White House from a political standpoint is going to have to be concerned about moving forward.

HOLMES: Lenny and to our viewers as we continue work to get Maria back up with us. I'll continue with you, Lenny. Have you seen anyone this week try to take advantage, political advantage from the left or from the right, really, of the Osama bin Laden killing?

MCALLISTER: Well, one of the interesting thing, "The Hill" came out the newspaper in Washington, D.C., on the day that president Obama went to ground zero tried to float out a proposal that was floating the idea of taxing motorists by mileage. It was something that was quickly scaled back by the White House. They distanced themselves from. If anything, that disappointed me because I felt that was taking advantage of the situation from a political standpoint.

Now, again, we're not focusing that much on the economy right now. And, it's well-deserved. This is ten years that we're looking at. A period of time where we hurt as a nation and president Obama for making this move and having the nerves of steel to say I would rather fail trying to do this than rather say what if.

Even the move to notify Pakistan, we had enough indicators that perhaps Pakistan wouldn't play nice with us and this was the move that need to be made. From an international standpoint, you can't really knock the president at all.

But we do have to look at the economy moving forward and not allow this afterglow to be too long and then we start looking at unemployment and other indicators going in the wrong direction for too long a period of time.

HOLMES: Lenny, you stand by for me and we'll take a quick break here and we'll work on getting Maria back up and running. Maria Cardona always pairs up with our Lenny McAllister. Quick break and come on back and see if she's here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: About 18 minutes until the top of the hour. Thanks to some patchwork we had to put together here we have Maria Cardona with us now, Democratic strategist who always pairs up with our Lenny McAllister. We had a little technical issue. We had to get her on the phone there. That is how we're going to be able to hear her but I have known her long enough to know when she speaks, we can always hear Maria speak.

(LAUGHTER)

So, good morning to you.

MARIA CARDONA, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Thank you, T.J.

HOLMES: I don't know if you were able to hear Lenny, but Lenny got a head start on you on a lot of stuff.

CARDONA: I saw his mouth moving, but I didn't hear anything he was saying. HOLMES: That's typical. I'll start with you, Maria. Maria, I ask every week when I start with you guys, what was the political headline of the week for you, so, you tell me what yours was.

CARDONA: My political headline this week, T.J., was that we had a commander in chief who showed true grit, tough leadership and, frankly, went into a game-changing event that has changed the way that we look at his leadership, especially his critics.

HOLMES: Now, has anyone, in your opinion, Maria, did anyone this week, Republican or democrat, try to take any kind of political, political advantage of the situation with Osama bin Laden?

CARDONA: I don't think so, and I think that is, as it should be. And I will even say that Bush actually deserves credit here for laying the groundwork for making sure that this mission culminated in catching Osama bin Laden.

I think that in President Obama inviting President Bush to come to him with him to ground zero, I think, showed that he does not see this as a political event. The White House doesn't see this as a political event.

I hope that we're able to stay that way because we really experienced a show of unity after this happened and sort of went back to the notion that when we work together, we really can get things done and that's exactly what the president talked about on Sunday night.

HOLMES: Now, Lenny, let me bring you back in here because there was some debate. If anything got political, I guess it was this question of who deserves credit and who deserved how much credit for this? You just heard Maria say there that, yes, in fact, the Bush administration deserved a lot of credit. But, how did you see that, Lenny, play out this week of back and forth. Was that really a big part of the whole conversation?

MCALLISTER: No, not to me. I look at two images, the image of President Bush with the bull horn right after 9/11 and I look at the image of President Obama fixated, sitting there. And I said it on my radio show when you and I were talking yesterday. That's what you want in presidential focus. Those are the only two things that should have been focused on, the image of President Bush in 2001 and the image of president Obama in 2011, and that should have been what we fixated on when it came to presidential leadership front to back throughout this whole decade of terror.

HOLMES: And Maria, will this -- voters have short memories for the most part. We're still talking about an election that is a good year, year and a half away here. People will still talk about the economy. Do you think this situation with Osama bin Laden now, does that give the president a talking point to run on or does it just take away a talking point for Republicans to attack him on, national security?

CARDONA: I think more so it takes away a talking point from the Republicans. As you know, there were many critics who whined about how he was supposedly weak kneed and didn't have the spine to make the kind of decisions needed to win the war against terrorism. He clearly has put that to rest and has shut them up.

I don't think the boost I don't think will continue to Election Day in terms of this specific event. What I do think will happen is the economy will continue to be the issue. But if we go through continued job creation the way that we saw on Friday, 224,000 jobs were created in April, the 14th consecutive month of private sector job creation, if that trend continues and companies continue to hire and the Republican GOP candidates look as weak as they do today, then I do think he has a good chance of being reelected.

HOLMES: Lenny, you come in on that point. Many people may not know, but there was a presidential debate potential candidates here, a debate of Republicans this week. How did your candidates, Lenny, look this week in your opinion?

MCALLISTER: They, they focused more on Osama bin Laden than they did on jobs. Yes, they added 244,000 jobs in April, but unemployment claims have gone up three out of the last four periods. It's at the highest weekly rate since August of 2010. The GDP has slowed down. Unemployment has gone up two-tenths of a percentage point.

If they would have focused more on that, used the word "jobs," used the words economy, jobs, employment getting America back to work, if they used those catch phrases more often, they probably would have gotten more traction Thursday night.

They did not and that's something that a Republican candidate coming through 2012 is going to have to fixate on. If we're talking about 244,000 jobs added, that will sound great. When the unemployment rate goes up 0.2 of a percentage point and the unemployment claims go up, you can't focus on the quarter of a million jobs added when you add that on the flip side.

HOLMES: Lenny, I'll let you wrap it up. But we were showing video of that debate, and a lot of the bigger name candidates were not there, or potential candidates were not at this particular debate. But, Lenny on the point that you were making that I will let Maria make here. Some people point to the fact that the unemployment rate went up as kind of a good sign that more people are feeling better about the economy and they are entering getting back into the game, back into the job market.

Maria, is that still going to be a tough sell because people kind of gauge the economy on a couple of things. They hear the unemployment number and they hear it goes up. And they drive past the gas station and they see that price going up.

CARDONA: Well, what we also saw this week, T.J., hopefully it will trickle down to the gas prices, but the price of barrels of oil actually went down and in terms of the unemployment rate, you're absolutely right, it went up, because those had been frustrated they could not find the jobs now see hope in the numbers and the hundreds of thousands of people who did find jobs, the folks who could not find jobs earlier are now jumping into the job market because they see hope.

And you saw that in the straight analysis of economists from all the left to right. They were saying that this is actually a good sign, the fact that the unemployment rate went up, because now more people see hope that they can find jobs. And you hear it also in corporations. They are now hiring.

If that train continues and if we see nothing from the GOP presidential field, and Lenny said it, they did not, could not talk about jobs in their debate. The debate switched to terrorism and Osama bin Laden and to foreign policy. That's not a good place for them to be right now.

HOLMES: Well, guys, you two, it is always fun, always interesting, but this is probably one of the more interesting segments I have done with you two after Lenny sabotaged all of our technology so that Maria would be at a disadvantage.

(LAUGHTER)

CARDONA: Yes, Lenny. I got to look into that one.

MCALLISTER: That's just what we need is another conspiracy this week, right?

(LAUGHTER)

HOLMES: Yes, no more. You're right, Lenny. Lenny, Maria -- Maria, thank you for being willing to tolerate that and make this work the best way we could. We go MacGyver on this show if we have to.

CARDONA: You owe me one.

MCALLISTER: Happy mother's day, Maria.

CARDONA: Thank you, all.

HOLMES: They are chasing history at the Kentucky derby. One jockey could ride all the way to glory this weekend. You need to hear about this one in particular.

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HOLMES: All right, let's bring in our good Ray D'Alessio from HLN Sports. We have the derby today, and some history could be made, not necessarily by a horse, but by one of the jockeys.

RAY D'ALESSIO, HLN SPORTS HOST: First female jockey hoping to win the Kentucky Derby. Talking about Rosie Napravnik. Twenty-three- years old, T.J. This girl certainly has talent. Last year she spent time between Delaware and the fairgrounds in New Orleans and won a combined 236 races. Was also named, she was named jockey of the year at Delaware park, won the title there, the first female to do that.

She has been racing horses competitively since she was seven years old and said it's not only her dream to win the Kentucky Derby, but she wants to be the first female to win the triple crown.

HOLMES: Only the sixth to compete here.

D'ALESSIO: Best finish by a female at the Kentucky Derby, 11th.

HOLMES: We don't see a lot of women.

D'ALESSIO: No, you don't.

HOLMES: Good luck to her. The horse she's going to be on?

D'ALESSIO: Pants on Fire, currently seven to one on odds.

HOLMES: That's good stuff. We'll watch that closely. We had some news, we all some more things we wanted to get to with you, but we will get to you this weekend. Ray, always good to have you, buddy.

Coming up here next, a corporate anniversary with a whole lot of fizz. Can you guess?

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HOLMES: As we get close to the top of the hour, what a weekend it is going to be here in Atlanta. This is Centennial Olympic Park right outside of our CNN world headquarters where Coke is throwing a party. And if you get a ticket, did you get an invite to this party? This is the 125th anniversary. And they are going to celebrate in style this weekend.

And this is part of the salute of the world and to the hometown of Atlanta. This big Coke bottle projected on all six sides of the headquarters. The image also shows ice cubes dropping in a glass and filling with coke in the building will be illuminated every Thursday, Friday, and Saturday night through the end of May. Happy birthday, Coke.

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