Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Reaction to Obama's Mideast Address

Aired May 19, 2011 - 12:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to our viewers here and around the world.

You have been listening to President Obama and his speech outlining the U.S. vision regarding the Arab world, the uprising as well as what the Obama administration would like to accomplish in establishing two- state solution, Israel-Palestine, and peace, as well as looking at the region as a whole and moving forward at the next two years.

HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: All right. Repression will fail, Suzanne, was one of the things President Obama said. And the tyrants will fall. He even mentioned Bahrain, an American friend, criticizing some of its actions against prodemocracy activists in that country.

Fareed Zakaria is live in Cairo with his impressions on this Middle East speech. What did you make of this speech by the president, Fareed, today? It was really a sweeping look at the region, though some countries such as Saudi Arabia were not mentioned.

FAREED ZAKARIA, HOST, "GPS": Hala, exactly, it was -- it was his role as educator in chief that came out today. He provided a kind of world view, almost a historical interpretation of the causes and consequences of the Arab Spring. He began in the beginning with Tunisia and moved forward. And he tried to present a way in which he saw America's interests and values as squarely aligned with this Arab revolution.

He touched on the places that we don't like, the regimes we don't like that are having trouble dealing with people, Tehran, Damascus. He also talked about Bahrain and Yemen. But you are right, of course, he didn't talk about the 800-pound gorilla that is Saudi Arabia.

But he also then went on to talk about ways to consolidate these revolutions, he talked about the Arab-Israeli peace process. He was tougher on Syria than he's been. He was more explicit in his -- in his support for two states, Israel and Palestine on 1967 borders, plus mutually agreeable land swaps, so very comprehensive.

I have a feeling though that while it will be well received in the region, there is an urgency here to questions about whether these revolutions are going to go awry or whether they're going to be consolidated.

I mean, here in Egypt, there is great concern that having done this extraordinary revolution, they are still living under a military dictatorship that arrests its people, engages in military trials, torture, tear gas, and so I think they will be looking for that follow-through reactions that America's diplomats and ambassadors and perhaps the secretary of state do. It was a good speech, but I think many Egyptians think right now they need a little more force than just a speech.

GORANI: And Fareed, it was interesting, it almost seemed like the Obama doctrine is like let's deal with this on a case-by-case basis, country to country, and essentially putting the responsibility and onus on the people there saying that they had done more in six months than the terrorists had gotten done in decades. Do you think that the people there in the Arab world and the Middle East wanted to hear more from this president in terms of concrete ideas and solutions to move their democracies or their revolutions forward?

ZAKARIA: Well, you know, people are mixing, you know, Egypt, well, there are 80 million people here and 80 million different opinions, but my sense is that they really do feel that this is about themselves. They don't think that United States has all the answers or all the solutions. I think that they are very much trying to consolidate their own revolution.

As you know, there are calls in Egypt for people to be -- crowds to be out here behind me in Tahrir Square tomorrow, and then again on the 27th, to call for a kind of second revolution. I think they would probably like the United States to help them in the process of making sure that the army does actually devolve out to a genuinely Democratic system. I'm sure they would like the help economically, but more than anything else, I think they see this as their revolution and they don't want anyone to big-foot it. So, I don't think they would not be looking to the United States to have some kind of silver bullet here.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Fareed, it's Wolf in Washington. I just want to get your reaction to what he said about President Bashar al-Assad in Damascus. He was pretty tough, he said Assad can lead that transition to democracy, if he will, or get out of the way. I think there are very few observers who believe he will actually lead a transition to democracy. But the president stopped short of saying that Bashar al-Assad must do what Mubarak in Egypt did or Gadhafi in Libya is supposed to do, namely leave. What did you think of the way the president finessed the words on Syria?

ZAKARIA: Wolf, that is the one part of the speech that I was a little puzzled by, because I think that we are clearly moving in the direction -- when I say 'we,' I mean U.S. foreign policy -- of calling for regime change in Syria. I'm not sure why we are phasing it out over several weeks, because as you say, there's almost no prospect that Assad will be part of a Democratic transition, but the Syrian regime is a minority regime, an alowide (ph) regime, that rules over a majority that really do not want to be ruled by this tiny minority that they, by the way, regard mostly at heretics. And so, this regime knows it has no place to go, it's not going to compromise.

So, in that case, if we are taking the position that there needs to be a Democratic transition, the logical consequence of that is to ask for Assad's ouster or, at the very least, to call on him to peacefully step down. And I understand concerns about instability, but we're going there anyway and it struck me that the president could have gone -- he went one shade further than he's gone, I think he could have gone a couple shades more.

BLITZER: Was there anything that -- else that you thought was thunderously missing besides his avoiding any direct reference to Saudi Arabia, going -- stopping short of calling on Bashar al-Assad to step down, was there anything else you would have wanted to hear, Fareed?

ZAKARIA: No, I thought it was a comprehensive speech. I, by the way, understand why he didn't bring up Saudi Arabia. It is the most awkward case where our short-term interests are not in -- not compatible with our long-term values. He highlighted the fact that there would be such occasions. He didn't -- he didn't point out that this was the most -- the specific one. If there were instability in Saudi Arabia, you are looking at $250 a barrel oil, and that would potentially plunge the entire western war -- perhaps the entire world -- into another recession.

So, I think there are good reasons to be somewhat cautious about change in Saudi Arabia. I think that he was also -- he also gave a speech that I would be surprised if anyone in Israel would object to, because he was very clear that Israel's legitimate security interests have to be taken care of.

He was very clear on the fact that Hamas could not be negotiated with as long as it refused to recognize Israel and call for its destruction. I think that there are many of those kinds of key issues that Israelis were worried he would either ignore or half-state, he stated pretty fully. So, I thought he was quite even-handed while calling for a Palestinian state on 67 borders, plus or minor land swaps. He also recognized Israel's legitimate security needs, so I'd be surprised if there is too much criticism out of -- out of Tel Aviv tonight.

ZAKARIA: Then at the same time, he also made clear that unless Hamas accepts Israel's right to exist, it accepts all the previous agreements, renounces violence, terrorism, then it's going to be difficult to restart Israeli-Palestinian negotiations.

Fareed, stand by, we're going to go check in with all of our correspondents and our analysts here in Washington, around the world. Much more of our breaking news coverage coming up after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Well, welcome back. We were listening to President Barack Obama and his vision for the Middle East. And Hala, one of the things that struck me, it was in the very beginning that he basically mentioned very quickly, he said about Bin Laden's capture and killing and he said that he was not a martyr but a mass murder, that this was someone who did not promote democracy and then he moved on. How significant do you think it was that he mentioned Bin Laden, said he wasn't a martyr, but then the rest of the speech we really didn't hear much about it? GORANI: Right. I think what's significant is that he himself said the Al Qaeda agenda is seen as a dead end -- was seen as a dead end by the time Osama Bin Laden was killed. And I think that's very accurate based on what people in the region tell us. The popularity rating, if you want to call it that, of Osama Bin Laden and Al Qaeda and some of these key countries, such as Egypt, has slipped substantially.

And people, after the revolutions, have said and have felt that they are the ones that are producing change, they are the engines of the change, not the Islamists. In fact, the Muslim Brotherhood itself, if you want to talk about them, didn't even participate in the initial days of the uprising in Egypt and really joined the -- sort of joined movement a lot later.

MALVEAUX: One of the other things that he mentioned, he talked about the two-state solution was so important, Israelis and Palestinians taking charge of their future there. And obviously, that is something that he staked his reputation, his credibility on as one of the priorities in his own administration. I want to take a quick listen to what he said about that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: For the Palestinians efforts to delegitimize Israel will end in failure. Symbolic actions to isolate Israel at the United Nations in September won't create an independent state. Palestinian leaders will not achieve peace or prosperity if Hamas insists on a path of terror and rejection. And Palestinians will never realize their independence by denying the right of Israel to exist.

As for Israel, our friendship is rooted deeply in a shared history and shared values. Our commitment to Israel security is unshakeable and we will stand against attempts to single it out for criticism in international forums. But precisely because of our friendship, it's important that we tell the truth. The status quo is unsustainable and Israel, too, must act boldly to advance a lasting peace.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: I want to bring in Wolf here, because Wolf, President Obama has been speaking about Israel and Palestinians acting boldly for quite some time. Did you hear anything significant, did you hear anything new out of this particular speech that really moves the ball forward?

BLITZER: Well, he made it clear, what former president Bill Clinton and former president George W. Bush supported, he made it clear that any final settlement involving the Israelis and Palestinians has to be based on the pre-'67 lines -- the pre-'67 borders, in his phrase, with mutually agreed swaps.

In other words, if the Israelis were to take over land in the west bank where they have settlements, they would have to give up some presumably equal amount of land from within Israel proper or pre-'67 Israel. That was the strategy that Bill Clinton had in his final months in trying to reach an agreement between the Israeli prime minister at that time, Ehud Barak and the Palestinian leader, Yasser Arafat.

But it's the kind of agreement that George W. Bush tried to put together, they failed in the final months. Secretary of state, you'll remember, Condoleezza Rice trying to work out an agreement with the Israeli prime minister, Ehud Olmert at that time and the Palestinian leadership of Mahmoud Abbas.

Here the president says it bluntly. I was intrigued by his comment, because a lot of people are focusing in on September at the United Nations general assembly, and both of you will appreciate this. At that time there is going to be a resolution, we're told, in which they will call -- recognize a Palestinian state that basically includes the pre-'67 lines.

The president was critical of that. He said symbolic actions to isolate Israel at the United Nations in September won't create an independent state. A general assembly resolution as opposed to a security council resolution is not binding, it's a political statement, if you will. So, the president made it clear, he's not in favor of that.

So, it's a -- it's a sensitive situation but everyone knows, if there's going to be an agreement between the Israelis and the Palestinians, the outlines that the president basically put forward there, are -- they're nothing new but that's basically the outlines of an agreement that there's goodwill on both sides.

MALVEAUX: I think it's a very complicated situation. I want to bring in our Ed Henry, because Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, is going to be at the White House meeting with President Obama tomorrow.

They have had no breakthroughs when it comes to the issue of Israeli settlements. That is still very much an impasse when it comes to these negotiations and these talks.

What we hope -- what does the president hope to get out of those talks tomorrow with Netanyahu?

ED HENRY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Suzanne, you're exactly right to frame it that way because that's very significant. The fact of the matter is that, you know, Benjamin Netanyahu will be here at the White House and, as Wolf says, it's not new in and of itself for a U.S. president to have this stance in terms of the pre- 1967 borders.

I just got off the phone with Aaron David Miller, a former U.S. Mideast peace negotiator, who said that this was the first time the furthest any U.S. president has gone in a formal address to say this pointblank, that this is what Israel should embrace.

And the timing of it coming less than 24 hours before the Israeli prime minister will be here at the White House. It's obviously going to anger the Israeli government but it's also worth noting the president steered clear of two other very controversial matters. Didn't talk about dividing up Jerusalem.

MALVEAUX: Sure.

HENRY: And did not talk about refugees. Those are two important issues for the Palestinians. And so the president not mentioning that was a little bit of a bone to the Israelis -- Suzanne.

GORANI: All right, Ed Henry. Thanks very much at the White House.

Jill Dougherty is at the State Department with more on what this speech means.

Let's talk again about this Israeli-Palestinian paragraph in the president's speech, Jill. I found it interesting that he went in to some detail regarding what he believes -- President Obama believes should be a future Palestinian state, a non-militarized sovereign state.

Is that something we've heard before from a U.S. president?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think overall, yes. You know maybe not in exactly those words but I -- the only news that I really heard, if you were looking for news, was that statement as Wolf was mentioning about the 1967 borders.

And I would like to stand back and kind of look at this and say, why did the president have to deliver the speech at this particular moment? It was extremely professorial. It had almost footnotes. In fact, as we're standing here, I'm taking my BlackBerry and looking at this blizzard of paperwork that's coming out of the White House right now.

There is a sheet on every single country and practically every single issue, complete with facts and figures. It really does feel like a doctoral dissertation. I didn't feel that -- it almost had the feeling that you've been through this enormous heads-swirling change in that area, and -- you know, the Middle East, North Africa, and now everybody has come out after the tornado is over and said, what happened?

And so the president was here to say, this is what happened, this is where we are, this is what we want to do, and then standing back. His overall message is, if you do reform the right way, which is what we think, if you support human rights and the right to vote and economic reform and women's rights, et cetera, then we'll be there to help you.

If you take the risks of the free form, you'll have the support of the United States. That I think was the overall message.

GORANI: All right, Jill Dougherty, thanks very much.

And, Suzanne, it did sound academic, it did feel academic.

MALVEAUX: It usually does with President Obama.

GORANI: And I think the line of this -- the last five minutes is from Jill, the blizzard of paperwork we've seen out of the White House. Every time I look up, I see another three or four fact sheets on different countries.

MALVEAUX: I think the point, too, is being that there's still a lot of unanswered questions and a lot of this is really determined by the people on the ground in the region, how they determine their own future, and clearly the Obama administration wants to play a role in that, but I think that the primary role is going to be with the people there.

So we're going to have more after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: I'm Suzanne Malveaux. Welcome back to CNN NEWSROOM's special coverage of President Obama's speech regarding the Middle East and the U.S. vision there.

GORANI: I'm Hala Gorani, and welcome to all our international viewers watching us on CNN International this hour.

BLITZER: And I'm Wolf Blitzer here in Washington where diplomats, government officials, members of Congress, and people all over the world are beginning to digest what they just heard from the president of the United States. And there's a lot of material there -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: Certainly is, Wolf. CNN is committing its vast global resources to this potentially pivotal story all over the world. We are looking at the speech and reaction from the Arab world.

Our Senior International Correspondent Nic Robertson is live in Tunisia. Jerusalem Bureau Chief Kevin Flower standing by in Jerusalem. And live from Libya, our own Sara Sidner. In neighboring Egypt, Fred Pleitgen.

Want to first get reaction from Nic in Tunisia.

Nic, that country, of course, set off the wave of uprising in the region. It was really the first flash point that we saw. The people very motivated took to the streets. So did it make a difference? Has anything really changed?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, even a week and a half ago when we were in the capital, Tunis, they were still tear gas being fired by the police at small crowds of rocks (INAUDIBLE) who are still angry that they feel that the current government really isn't a significant transition from where they were before.

They're hungry for this sort of democratic change that President Obama is talking about. So the change is coming. Elections will be coming. The United States has sent officials here who can help give advice on how Democratic elections can and should go ahead. So the appetite is there but the stability is still not here.

Tourism is down by -- is a third of what it should be at this time of year. So the country is still hurting from the instability, instability in the region. Libya shelling across the border, a lot of concern in Tunisia about what happens there in Libya. Libya of course could be an economic powerhouse for the region and bringing better economy for Tunisians, Libyans and Egyptians on the other side of the border.

So for people here there are still a lot of concerns about this phase of transition. But I have to say, one of the interesting things, listening to President Obama as he managed very carefully to lay out the different issues facing the different countries, United States position on all those things.

When we look at what he said about Israel -- the Israelis and the Palestinians, he talked about the status quo for the Israelis cannot remain the same. But what he -- what he finds very difficult to do is to link this at what's happening across the region. It is of course the Egyptians who help broker the deal between Hamas and Fatah, help solidify this Palestinian position.

That's not something that happened under the ousted President Mubarak. This is something that's happening across the region. These political attitudes are changing particularly towards the Palestinian-Israeli issue -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Nic, thank you very much.

I want to go to Sara Sidner in the rebel-controlled Benghazi, that is in Libya.

Was this president's speech strong enough? The rebels were looking for a hard line commitment. Do they feel like they got it?

SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What we're hearing from the opposition is, quote, "good enough." They were happy to hear that he talked about Moammar Gadhafi the way he did, calling him the most extreme case of a leader cracking down with violence on its people.

But one thing that's very interesting and the thing that has people smiling here in Benghazi is that he mentioned that Libya's opposition has been able to create a legitimate interim council.

Now the United States has not recognized the National Transitional Council which was brought together by the opposition as a potential interim government. They haven't officially recognized it but they feel like hearing that from Obama really set that in motion and they expect that that will then happen because of what he said.

And so there are a lot of smiles here when it comes to those who are a member of the National Transitional Council hoping that that is going to mean that it's recognized. And if and when it is recognized, they're hoping that that will open the door to funds. Really what the people here want is guns, funds and training.

They did not hear Mr. Obama say that in his speech, however they think the door is open to at least funds and official recognition of the opposition's interim government. BLITZER: All right, Sara Sidner in Benghazi.

Let's go to Jerusalem, our bureau chief Kevin Flower is there.

How are the Israelis likely to react to what they just heard?

KEVIN FLOWER, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: Well, Wolf, by and large I think they'll be fairly pleased with what they heard. They heard an unshakeable commitment by the White House to Israel's security. They heard an outline of the peace process, a peace plan that is basically very familiar to them and one that they support.

And they're also going to like the words they heard, the words directed towards the Palestinian side. The American president telling the Palestinians that their bid for recognition of an independent state at the U.N. in September was something that he did not support.

He raised questions. He said the Palestinians are going to have to answer questions about how Hamas-Fatah unity government going forward, how that could actually work.

So I think on balance, a lot more that the Israelis took out of this positively than the Palestinians. Not much good news there for the Palestinians. But frankly, Wolf, they were not expecting much out of this speech to begin with.

BLITZER: Kevin Flower in Jerusalem for us.

Hala, Suzanne, we're getting ready, the prime minister of Israel will be arriving in Washington tomorrow. He'll be meeting with the president of the United States. So obviously we'll get his reaction to what the president has just heard. Then Netanyahu will address a joint session of Congress on Monday.

Certainly a lot to digest on the Israeli-Palestinian front, a lot of digest on the democracy movement in North Africa and throughout the Middle East. And we're only just beginning to understand this U.S. strategy as it unfolds -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Thank you very much, Wolf.

As we know, many administrations previously have tried to do what President Obama is doing now. So we'll see how this -- whether or not he's any more successful in the current state of affairs.

GORANI: And it's going to be interesting. If the goal was to present a coherent U.S. foreign policy approach to the Middle East, it's going to be interesting to see how it is received and digested in the coming days in the region. Because so much is going on and each country is very different from the next.

Egypt is not Syria. Syria is not Tunisia. Tunisia is not Bahrain. So it's going to be interesting to see if the way it is welcome is what President Obama intended for this speech which is to give sort of a general strategy, foreign policy strategy for the region.

MALVEAUX: And the president seems to recognize that.

All right. Hala, thank you very much.

And thank you to you for watching this special CNN NEWSROOM edition.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)