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John Edwards Facing Indictment?; Severe Storms Rake Midwest; Shooter in Gabrielle Giffords Incident Ruled Not Mentally Competent to Stand Trial; Men Who Went to Morehouse College on Scholarship from Oprah Winfrey Make Appearance at Her Farewell Show; Large Tornadoes Continue to Rip Through Southern States

Aired May 25, 2011 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back to CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Another wave of severe weather building right now near the nation's midsection. I want to show you some live pictures. This is from our affiliate out of Kansas City. These of pictures of what is left of some sort of building. You can see crushed cars. It looks like a number of school buses nearby. Heaven forbid that is a school.

Again, from our affiliate KMBC. This is Missouri.

Chad Myers, what do you know? What are we looking at? And what do you know about this storm that has just wrecked this little town?

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes.

This is specifically Sedalia, Missouri.

BALDWIN: Sedalia.

MYERS: And this is right along Highway 65, about a mile southeast of downtown Sedalia.

And the tornado was on the ground about an hour, maybe an hour-and-a- half ago. We saw it rotating, put the warning out. There was plenty of warning on the storm. The hook echo showed about a 120-mile-per- hour potential for a tornado. That doesn't mean it gets all the way down to the ground, but as we have looked at some of the damage here, houses made of two-by-fours have lost their roof. And that is very typical of F-2 tornado, EF-2, 100, 120 miles per hour.

But then what we have seen is that mobile homes have been demolished. And that will happen because the one-by-twos are made inside a mobile home, not two-by-fours. And so there are damages just a little bit to the right of this picture.

And I'm sure they will keep moving back forth and zooming in out where the mobile home park is pretty much in shambles.

BALDWIN: Help give me the lay of land here. I know you said some of these storms are headed toward Saint Louis.

MYERS: Yes.

BALDWIN: With regard to Joplin, how far is this from Joplin?

MYERS: This would be about 65 to 100 miles where the storms are now east of Joplin, not moving to Joplin, moving away from Joplin and moving to Saint Louis on completely the other side of the state.

BALDWIN: OK. And this is just going to be one more of those days where you and I have just continue to have a conversation. We see what ends up popping up.

MYERS: Yes.

BALDWIN: And you just jump over here and let us know what you see.

MYERS: I said yesterday there would be 20 to 50 tornadoes. And so far, the reports are 48, so somewhere -- so that was the high side of my estimate certainly.

Today, probably the same, another very high-risk day. The humidity is in place. Low pressure is in place. Twist is in place, which means that the wind shifts direction with the elevation that you are going up. So, if you were a hot air balloon, you would be going this way for a while. Then the wind would shift. You go this way. And that allows the storm to twist. And when the storms twist, they put down tornadoes.

BALDWIN: OK. Chad Myers, do me a favor. Stand by. I know you are here late talking to Anderson Cooper, who is live on our air, and who has now called in.

Anderson Cooper has been in Joplin, Missouri, for the better part of the last couple of days.

Anderson, just do me a favor. Bring me up to speed as to precisely where you are, where things stand today. And also I'm curious as to this number, this 1,500 people unaccounted for. Tell me what that means.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Well, it is not clear exactly what it means.

It is certainly shouldn't be read to mean that 1,500 people have perished. That doesn't seem to be the case. You know, the communication is really difficult. There is a lot of people who just haven't been able to get in touch with their loved ones. They are starting to kind of work out those systems out. There's now a place people can go to try to make contact online with loved ones. Other people may have just left the state even in advance of the storm and family members just don't know where they are.

So a lot of that could just be kind of the confusion that we always see after a disaster like this. But there are a number of people that we know of who -- who are missing. And, you know, I spent part of the day with the family of Will Norton, who is a young man who had just graduated -- BALDWIN: Joplin High School.

COOPER: -- from -- yes, just graduated high school, was driving home with his dad in his H3, in his Hummer, when the storm hit. The father is badly injured. He's in the hospital. And when the father came to, the son was gone. He was holding on to Will, according to his family.

And Will was sucked out through the sunroof of the vehicle by the force of the tornado. They have not found him. And what is so -- you know, it has been a roller coaster for the family because, Monday night, when I first talked to Will's aunt and his sister, they had got --

BALDWIN: Yes, I was watching.

COOPER: Yes. They had gotten a report that Will's name was on the list at Freeman Hospital, one of the local hospitals, in their triage area and that he -- they understood that he had been sent to another hospital.

And so they were trying to search other area hospitals. They have now learned that that initial report was false, that Will was never even at that triage unit at Freeman Hospital, so they frankly don't know where he is. And they are now -- I mean, they're searching the lakes. They're searching debris fields. They're doing what they can.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Help me to understand. And I know I will be speaking with a grandmother a little later in the show who is -- they can't find her 16-month-old grandson. And they're going essentially to this makeshift morgue. They have looked at just pieces of paper, I guess, that are on some wall of folks who have been found.

It sounds like people are going sort of from hospital to hospital. If you are in the area, if you are looking for a loved one, what is the best chance of getting any indication as where that individual may be?

COOPER: Well, I mean, the Red Cross has now set up a center that people here know about that they can go and get information and try to kind of track down a loved one.

But it is still -- there is a lot of conflicting information. There's this story, for instance, that a lot of -- at the Red Cross center even, there was a sign saying that Will Norton had been found and that he was in a hospital in Springfield. That is not true.

And his family has heard this report on Twitter. They have heard it online on the Facebook page that they have set up. A lot of people keep saying, oh, he is in a hospital in Springfield.

BALDWIN: Yes.

COOPER: He is not. They actually drove to Springfield. They looked at the young man who is there. There is a young man who, as of yesterday, was unidentified and who is basically a John Doe at this point who is alive, but who is in -- is in -- is being treated in Springfield. It is not Will Norton though.

So, there is a lot of conflicting information. And, again, I mean, it takes time to work this stuff out, but, you know, you can only imagine what it is like for all these families.

BALDWIN: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

COOPER: As we were out with them today, you literally -- there were police officers and divers in the lake, you know, going through the lake.

BALDWIN: Searching for them. I can't even pretend to imagine what this must be like for Will Norton's father, aunt, sister, and so many other of these family members who just don't know where their children, their husbands and wives are.

Anderson, I appreciate you calling in. Of course, we will be tuning in tonight to see you live 10:00 Eastern time right back there in the thick of things there in Joplin, Missouri. Thank you so much for calling in and keeping us all apprised.

Also, I have Chad Myers still standing by, because I want to show you more video. It just keeps coming in. And we just want to pass it along to you. This is video I want to share. This is video from Chickasha, Oklahoma. I know you have been there. This was video that was shot just yesterday. Let's just listen to this for a moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Slow down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get out your window. Get out your window.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (OFF-MIKE) take that shed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's behind us (OFF-MIKE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (OFF-MIKE) good.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, my God. Back up. Yes. Oh, no. Stop. Oh, no. What did it destroy? (INAUDIBLE) Oh, it is a trailer house. Slow down, Brendan (ph). No, slow down (INAUDIBLE) debris.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Look at that, some sort of building, some sort of structure just entirely obliterated. Keep in mind these are professional tornado chasers. And I will be speaking with the guy who shot that video, chased that tornado down in Chickasha.

You were there. You were tracking that exact tornado yesterday. The pictures -- I sat at my own desk with my headphones in just sort of watching this piece of video. He rolls down the window.

MYERS: And backed up.

BALDWIN: And backs up.

MYERS: They were backing up. Yes.

And that storm got a lot bigger. That tornado was probably up to 140- miles per hour, up to the EF-3, EF-4 standard. It started out -- the beginning of that video was just the beginning of the tornado. They may not have even seen it, except for that little bit of mist. It almost looked like a dust devil, didn't even look like a tornado, wasn't even attached to the cloud above.

BALDWIN: And then it starts to evolve.

MYERS: And, then, all of a sudden, it got bigger and bigger and bigger. And it even got about twice as big as what you see here. But I have lived in Oklahoma and Nebraska and places.

I tell you, I stand here. I look at that video. This is the first time I have seen it, first time I have heard the audio. And the hair on my arm completely standing up.

(CROSSTALK)

MYERS: I could not -- and I could not stop it. I couldn't help but just going, oh, my -- these guys are right here.

But you know what? I understand that are in the car, but there may have been someone in that building.

BALDWIN: This is a fairly rural area, though, is it not, Chickasha, Oklahoma?

MYERS: Well, sure, but Chickasha, that storm went all the way up the turnpike. And it was making a run at Norman, Oklahoma, which is not a rural area.

BALDWIN: University of Oklahoma, right?

MYERS: Right. Exactly. So, it went kind of up toward Noble and just running up there.

And this is the kind of path that the Moore, Oklahoma, F-5 tornado happened in '99. And I'm thinking, are we are going to go through this again? Moore, a Midwest city. What are we going to do?

And, finally, right at the very end, when it got to about I-35, it lost its punch, it lost its rotation. I was like, ah. How did it know to do that?

BALDWIN: Thank goodness it lost its punch --

MYERS: Right. Yes.

BALDWIN: -- though it seems like there are other storms popping up as well that you're looking at. Stand by.

(CROSSTALK)

MYERS: There will be many today.

BALDWIN: You and I have a busy two hours ahead of us, friend. So, stand by for that.

I also want you to talk to -- help me talk to the guy next hour who is the one who chased that thing down. We will do that.

But in terms of numbers here, I just want to get you last -- at last count, at least, yesterday's wave of tornadoes killed 16, two in Kansas, four in Arkansas, 10 in Oklahoma.

But I want you to listen to this. This is Oklahoma City. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It started coming a little bit -- now it is making a left turn. I'm stopping because it is coming up to I-40. I'm stopping because it is coming up to I-40 right now. Unbelievable. It's right here. It is -- it I a killer tornado, an absolutely killer tornado that is now crossing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: OK. Now, watch this. You see this? You see all the pieces of debris? That was a semitruck. This is near Shawnee, Oklahoma. Roger, let's roll it back. Let's watch it one more time. Keep your eyes on that, a semitruck coming down what looks like a highway ripped to pieces, a tornado striking a semitruck, again, Shawnee, Oklahoma, pieces of the truck tossed around like errant scraps of paper.

But I want to show you what was left of that thing. Let's go to that picture. You see -- there it is, the red one there. The driver was sucked from the cab. He survived, can you believe? His name is Jeremy Morrison (ph). He in fact saw a car nearby, walked over to this car, found its two passengers hiding underneath it.

He said, folks, don't know how often you drive through Oklahoma, but that is not how you survive a tornado. How about that? Here is another survivor.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIMMY WAGONER, TORNADO SURVIVOR: So, we went to the cellar and we were in there probably 15, 20, 30 minutes. And I told her, I said that -- I said there's one coming. I said it is real close by.

And I heard it hit something back southwest of here. I don't know exactly what. And then we heard it hitting the -- going across the top of us. I just thank God that we went for the cellar when we did.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Thank God is right.

As for the 1,500 unaccounted for that Anderson I were just talking about, I'm going to speak with a city official there in Joplin who can explain why that number is so high. That is next.

Also, just a couple of weeks after destructive twisters ripped through Alabama, Joplin, Missouri, meets the same fate. Coincidence? A church group here from Joplin actually sent a disaster team to help a church congregation in Alabama, and now the favor is getting returned.

And we are just getting word Tucson shooting suspect Jared Lee Loughner to be dragged out of court after a loud outburst. And that is not all. More breaking news on that case, we're going to have it for you next. Stay right here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Tucson shooting suspect Jared Lee Loughner is apparently incompetent to stand trial. That's according to a judge, this ruling just in this afternoon. This is all based on evaluations that were conducted in Springfield, Missouri.

In fact, our own Ted Rowlands was inside that courtroom. And just reading Ted's note here, he says that Jared Lee Loughner had a loud outburst in courtroom, was dragged out of the courtroom by not just one, but two U.S. Marshals.

We are working on getting Ted in front of the camera. As soon as he is able to do that, we will bring him to you live to get more color from what happened inside that courtroom -- again, not fit to stand trial.

Once again, parts of the Midwest being hit right now by severe weather. In fact, take a look at this with me. This is -- this is just into from Sedalia, Missouri, some serious damage from sort of severe weather event in Missouri. We are watching this whole system develop, along with Chad Myers, our whole weather team over there.

But I want you to stand by as we turn our attention back to Joplin, Missouri. Matt Harenza, associate pastor of Carterville Christian Church, is live for me.

Matt, I know your church went down to Alabama last month to help the tornado victims there. And now disaster has hit home for you. And I just think it is so important to remind everyone there are so many folks in Alabama still reeling.

Just back up and tell me how you and your church, why you wanted to go help down in Decatur in the first place.

MATT HARENZA, CARTERVILLE CHRISTIAN CHURCH: We had done some flood relief with the church in Nashville that's affiliated with the church in Alabama. And they called and asked if we could send a team down to help. And that is something that we have done in the past. And so we felt fine to do that.

BALDWIN: I know, Matt, you are there in Tornado Alley. I know you know tornadoes. But when you were down there in Alabama helping those folks down there, did you in a million years think this could happen in my own town?

HARENZA: No, no, not at all, not like this.

Things in Alabama were bad. We were in a more rural area. And it didn't look like this. It was not this bad.

BALDWIN: How is your own home? How is your family? Is your home still standing there in Joplin?

HARENZA: My home is safe. My family was safe. Actually, we watched the storm from the carport. It was just a rainstorm at my house, but I knew that something had gone terribly wrong when debris started falling from the sky in my front pasture.

And we have medical records from St. John's Hospital, which is nearby where we are at now doing the interview, in my front yard, which is about six miles from here.

BALDWIN: Wow.

And talking about paying it forward. Now the folks who you helped in Alabama are reaching out, what, to your friends in Nashville to come help you in Joplin. Am I getting that right?

HARENZA: Yes, that is right. They are waiting to see what they can do for us, as we call the needs out to them. They are standing in readiness to reciprocate.

BALDWIN: What does that say to you about the hearts of these Alabamans who have been hit by travesty just a couple of weeks ago and they're already thinking about you guys?

HARENZA: Actually, the first phone call I got from anyone after the initial onset of the tornado was from the pastor that I worked with at the church in Alabama.

And it says a lot for the church, that the church is more than a group of people showing up at a building, that the church is people who help other people.

BALDWIN: And what kind of message -- what kind of message is that sending, not just to Alabama and to Missouri, but everyone else hearing the story?

HARENZA: Well, I just hope it shows the power that the church has, that God works through terrible tragedies, and when bad things happen, that he is still in control of his people.

BALDWIN: Matt Harenza, I thank you so much for standing by live for me. Glad that honk stopped as well. Matt, thank you so much.

And I want to stay in Joplin here. Obviously, this city remains in a state of shock today, three days after that monster tornado killed at least 125 people. That is the latest number we have here today at CNN. Teams of rescuers, they're out there, dogs as well, continuing to comb through the block after block of destruction.

A huge source of concern is this number we keep talking about, the fact that 1,500 residents remain unaccounted for. Who are they?

To help me out with that, Lynn Onstot. She is the city's PIO, public information officer.

Lynn, help me understand this number, 1,500. Who is among that 1,500?

(CROSSTALK)

LYNN ONSTOT, JOPLIN PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICER: Well, unfortunately, that number is probably not a true number. It's gotten out there. And I think some of our media folks, no offense, are running with that.

And I just want to be clear that that number does not necessarily mean that people are injured or deceased. That number was an original estimate of people who may be unaccounted for. We know that a lot of people had traveled out of the area over the weekend and may not have returned home before the storm or they left immediately after the storm.

And with that said, loved ones were definitely trying to call in. And loved ones were try to call in and, you know, locate their loved ones.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Well, that is -- Lynn Onstot, that is precisely why we wanted to have you on. We want to set the record straight here at CNN, because we kind of thought 1,500 is a mighty large number as well.

And so a lot of the folks may be perhaps within that number could be people who were out of town, could be people who just simply are OK, just can't be located. Is that right?

ONSTOT: Correct.

And thank you so much for understanding that we have a number that we are asking people across the country to broadcast for us, because we know people travel, you know, in all sorts of places that we want people who have been in the Joplin area and may be unaccounted for, so to speak -- people may be looking for them. They need to call this number and let us know where they are, so we can say, yes, we are glad you are safe.

BALDWIN: Lynn, let's just do this live here on CNN. What is that number?

ONSTOT: It is 417-659-5464.

BALDWIN: Say it one more time.

ONSTOT: 417-659-5464.

BALDWIN: OK.

Lynn, since I have you, I also want to ask you about this. Obviously, this entire area, a lot of Joplin is a disaster area. And so rescue crews in there hoping to find the survivors amidst some of the rubble. In the meantime, folks who live there who want to go check out their houses had to file for some sort of permit, right, to get back into the disaster zone. That has been temporarily lifted?

ONSTOT: Yes, it has.

Ideally, we were trying to help those in the disaster area, so they could get to their homes quickly and try to -- the people that weren't supposed to be in there to -- well, move away. If they didn't have a permit, they could not get in the area.

Unfortunately, those that needed a permit, that kind of clogged the system as well. So, we lifted that. Immediately, we saw that that was not going to work as we saw it. So we just again have our police force out and really patrolling and making sure that people that need to get to their homes, get to their businesses are able to do so.

And, you know, I know people are curious. And it has been a devastation for Joplin, but we are asking if -- you know, we have a great news crew from all sorts of people that are streaming video and showing pictures.

BALDWIN: Yes.

ONSTOT: Watch it on the Web. Watch it on their TV. That is where they need to get their pictures.

BALDWIN: OK. Lynn, is there anything else here that you need to pass along, any other message to folks in Joplin or elsewhere?

ONSTOT: We just really want to thank the country and worldwide. We are getting well-wishes from everyone and prayers and support. We have had a vast number of volunteers, donations. Things just -- just keep coming in. And we can't say thank you enough.

Obviously, no one has is truly prepared for this.

BALDWIN: Yes.

ONSTOT: We have got an emergency operations center that is running quite efficiently, but, again, we have seen an outpouring of support. And we just want to say thank you.

BALDWIN: Our hearts are with you, Joplin. That is certainly the case.

Lynn Onstot, thank you so much, calling in from Joplin, Missouri. Thank you.

(CROSSTALK)

ONSTOT: OK. Thank you.

BALDWIN: And now to this -- he is the former golden boy of the Democratic Party, but today things looking kind of blue for this man, John Edwards. Sources tell CNN the Justice Department is gearing up for a possible indictment. We will tell you what he is being accused of and how he got in such a sticky situation in the first place. Joe Johns standing by for that, he's going to join me now.

And back to Arizona for more on the judge's ruling on the Jared Lee Loughner case -- he has been ruled incompetent, unfit to stand trial on the charges in the Arizona Safeway shooting rampage. More on that, as there was some sort of outburst in the courtroom -- this guy was dragged away by two U.S. Marshals.

Stay right here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: He has been mostly out of sight, out of mind since his failed presidential bid back in 2008, at least publicly speaking, but behind the scene, John Edwards has been in the narrow sight of a federal grand jury.

And today, after an intense two-year investigation, CNN has learned the Justice Department may be ready to indict him. The case centers around alleged misuse of campaign funds, a mistress and a frantic attempt to cover it all up.

Here is CNN's Joe Johns.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): John Edwards, the politician, remember him?

JOHN EDWARDS (D), FORMER VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have much work to do because the truth is, we still live in a country where there are two different Americas.

JOHNS: But as it turned out, Mr. Two Americas here had two very different faces himself and one of them wasn't very pretty. People close to him said it was the face of betrayal, betrayal of the people closest to him -- his late wife, Elizabeth, his supporters, his staffers, his contributors.

Granted, Edwards was a promising politician at first, successful Democratic senator from the South, telegenic guy, rich trial lawyer but a spokesman for the poor, smart but homegrown, talked such a good game, he got picked up as John Kerry's running mate in 2004.

SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), FOREIGN RELATIONS COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: I have chosen a man who understands and defends the values of America. JOHNS: But it didn't work out. So, next election cycle, Edwards jumped into the race for the White House once again. And by early 2008 --

EDWARDS: It's time for me to step aside.

JOHNS: -- he was out. But not before getting entangled in a messy relationship with a woman named Rielle Hunter. She eventually gave birth to Edwards' child. Edwards, at first, denied having the affair and then denied being the father. But last year he finally admitted it.

The story reached a sleazy low point with a videotape surfaced that is reported to show Edwards and Hunter having sex. The tape wound up in the hands of former Edwards staffer Andrew Young, who turned it over to a court after Rielle Hunter filed a lawsuit.

It took eight months before Edwards' wife Elizabeth, suffering from terminal cancer, learned the extent of the affair. And before she died last year, she went public with her feelings in a book and numerous TV appearances.

ELIZABETH EDWARDS, JOHN EDWARDS' WIFE: I wrote in this, "Maybe it was that 30-year investment I had in my marriage. Maybe it was that I could not separate the flawed man before me from the boy with whom I fell in love in 1975. It does not matter now."

JOHNS: The death of Elizabeth Edwards might have been the end of the story except for the fact there has yet to be a full public accounting. Edwards raised $43.9 million in campaign money in his bid for the White House. Where some of it came from and where it went has been carefully scrutinized.

Rielle Hunter worked for the campaign and got paid as a videographer. Questions have been raised whether any of the campaign funds donated to support Edwards might have been used improperly, misreported, not reported at all, or used to keep the affair quiet.

Andrew Young said he was persuaded to claim her child was his own and thean went to great lengths as Edwards' aide to help conceal the affair.

ANDREW YOUNG, FORMER AIDE TO JOHN EDWARDS: This was John Edwards' idea from the beginning.

JOHNS: Which brings us back to the golden boy, a once-rising politician with so much promise. Something like this could never have been part of the plan.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Joe Johns live in D.C.

Joe, the wording here is important, because we know that the Justice Department may, may be ready to prosecute, but there could also be a plea deal. How likely is that? JOHNS: Well, it is a good question. I mean, first there's the guilt or innocence question. Number one, John Edwards has always said he didn't break any laws, and then beyond that, there's the personal concerns. You know, he was a very successful trial lawyer, and he apparently has intimated to some people that he would like to go back to starting some type of perhaps a public service law firm.

But the problem with that is that if he were to plead guilty to a felony, it would be difficult for him to start the public service law firm, because he would have to give up the law license, so there are a lot of questions in there beyond the simple guilt or innocence question.

And, also, we don't really know what crime may or could be alleged here. You know, are we talking about just campaign finance, or is there something else more to it? These are things up in the air.

BALDWIN: So we don't know that. So what about some of the other key players in the case, namely Andrew Young, the prosecution's star witness here. He is key in the case, is he not?

JOHNS: Yes. He worked closely with John Edwards for a long time, so closely in fact that he says that John Edwards asked him to falsely take responsibility for Rielle Edwards' (ph) child. He did that. And then he says that John Edwards sort of threw him under the bus as it were. Later he came out and wrote a book and said he told the whole story, and also said it is John Edwards' idea to do this. This is a guy who would be very important in any case presumably against John Edwards.

BALDWIN: Also, Joe, also important is Edwards' finance chair Fred Barron who paid for Hunter's homes, private jets, but he denied Edwards ever knew anything about it. Now, he died, but this all happened right before he died. Could the testimony be key to the defense?

JOHNS: Well, it is obviously relevant, but the question is whether you can get something like that in simply because he may have been defending John Edwards, but he is deceased now. It is not like he could be asked to come into court and answer questions about the veracity of the statements back in the day.

So that's kind of a big issue. But he's not really the only contributor. There is another contributor out there, a philanthropist who gave a bunch of money who has said that she had no idea where that money was going. There are a lot of pieces to this story.

BALDWIN: The final question, and this is an if -- if there is no plea deal, and John Edwards is found guilty and goes to jail, how much time are we talking about here?

JOHNS: If -- well, it all depends what is going on in the grand jury, whatever kind of crime they think that they are alleging, you know, what they say John Edwards did. What he knew obviously is crucial, but it's pretty hard to venture a guess in my mind as to what he could be sentenced for until we know what it is that the prosecutors are saying he did.

BALDWIN: Sounds like a lot of blanks to fill in here.

JOHNS: Yes.

BALDWIN: Joe Johns in D.C. Thank you, Joe.

And back to Arizona, we will get you more from the judge's ruling in the Jared Lee Loughner case, and ruled incompetent to stand trial in the charges of the Arizona shooting rampage from back in January. Ted Rowlands just out of the courtroom, and we will talk about the outburst that Loughner had in court which led to removal from the courtroom. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: All right, breaking news here out of Tucson, Arizona. A judge has ruled that Jared Lee Loughner, the shooter from the shooting rampage at the Safeway supermarket back in Tucson in January has been ruled incompetent to stand trial. This is based on evaluations that were conducted in Springfield, Missouri, where Loughner was held. Ted Rowlands was inside that courtroom where apparently there was some sort of outburst. Ted, what happened?

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, first to the ruling. The judge basically took these reports from two separate medical professionals and he also looked at the videotape which all sides had the interviews that he was subjected to while in Missouri, and he is incompetent to stand trial, which basically puts a hold on the federal proceedings at this point.

And he will be taken to the hospital where he is evaluated for a few months, and during the evaluation, they will see if he can be rehabilitated, if you will, to stand trial. That is what is going on now.

As far as the hearing, itself, at one point the judge was talking about an issue with the media trying to get access to documents, and Loughner who was sitting in his chair, rocking back and forth through the proceedings. He looks much different by the way, because he h facial hair and long hair and full hair, and not the skinhead look he had originally. He was rocking back and forth and then all of the sudden, he had an outburst.

And it was very difficult to hear what he actually said. I thought he said "Thank you for the freak show," and then I could not hear the rest of it. Other people thought he said "Thank you for the free pill." But regardless of what he said, he interrupted the judge, and two marshals right on either side during the whole proceeding jumped on him instantly and pulled him down to the floor. He was continuing to talk to the judge, and the judge ignored him and kept speaking.

I was sitting right in back of Loughner's parents, and they were visibly upset. They were crying at one point. It was a very, very emotional and shocking episode of this very emotional hearing which lasted in excess of an hour and just concluded a few minutes ago. BALDWIN: So this sounds to be a different Jared Lee Loughner who we saw in the courtroom and Cheshire grin answering the judge yes/no, and so he appeared quite different this time.

ROWLANDS: Yes, not only physically, but the judge after the outburst, the judge took a ten-minute recess and brought him back in, and the judge asked Loughner, you have every right to be here, but would you rather watch this via a video monitor, would you rather watch it on TV. And he had a sheepish voice and said on TV. The judge said fine, and they took him out to watch the proceedings.

But you're right. The first time he came to court, he seemed to be taking it all in with the grin and focused on everything that the judge said, and much different story today.

One of the things that the judge did talk about is, is he faking it? Both of the medical professionals say no, he is not, and he is consistent, and he, himself, says he is not insane or mentally ill, and he takes offense to the idea he is mentally ill, according to both of the medical evaluators and the judge who watched the tapes of the interviews.

BALDWIN: We have reached out to Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords' office and we have not heard from them yet. But as soon as we do, we will pass it along. Thank you, Ted Rowlands. As Ted said, Loughner goes to the mental facility and whole thing is put to a grinding halt, and we will be checking in with his status in months from now.

Our other breaking news story, back to the Midwest. More severe storms, tornadoes across the midsection of the country. This is new pictures. This is Sedalia, Missouri, and pictures fresh into CNN within the last hour. We will not go far from the developing story on the ground in Missouri and several other surrounding states as well.

I do want to get this in. After 25 years on air, Ms. Oprah Winfrey is saying goodbye today. One of her legacies is paying for 64,000 students to go to school, including hundreds in Atlanta's Morehouse College. In fact the top Morehouse man is here in the studio to explain Oprah's own impact on his school, and why it brought Oprah Winfrey to tears and how his own grads plan to pay it forward. We will be right back.

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BALDWIN: I want to get you a little bit of reaction on the breaking news here that the judge has ruled that Jared Lee Loughner has been deemed incompetent to stand trial. Let's go to our senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin joining me from New York. Jeffrey, what is your first reaction? Is it a surprise that this man is not fit to stand trial?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Not really. I mean, you know, this is something that the legal system has struggled with literally for centuries. What do you do with someone who is crazy? What do you do with someone who is obviously not mentally fully there? Do you go ahead and try them anyway? Do you punish them as if they were the same as any other defendant, the same as a hit man who was simply doing it for money?

And frankly the legal system has not successfully figured out what to do? We have had John Hinkley who almost killed President Reagan in 1981. That was a very controversial use of the insanity defense.

It is important the recognize that this is not the last word of the Loughner case, because all the judge has said is that at the moment he is not competent to stand trial. I will check back in September. That conclusion could be changed come September.

BALDWIN: Well, let me ask you about that, right. And now Jared Lee Loughner goes to mental facility, and he will undergo more psychological evaluation, and what if the they come back to the word "crazy," and what happens to Congresswoman Giffords and her husband who is up in space right now with the Endeavour crew who wants some expedient trial, what if he is crazy?

TOOBIN: Well, the important thing to point out is that he doesn't go free. That is not one of the options on the table. But what will happen is that he will be sent to some sort of prison psychiatric facility to be held indefinitely.

So there will be no formal resolution of the case, and no judgment that he will remain there forever. But the legal process will continue, but it will continue in this unresolved state for perhaps months or years. You cannot have a trial.

In defense off what the judge is doing, if the defendant actually has no idea what is going on, and is incapable of participating in the trial or understanding it or participating in the defense, it is a judge's obligation not to let the trial go forward. Now, I know that a lot of people feel like that is gaming the system, some sort of gift to the defense, and that is an understandable reaction. But those are the rules of the game, and the judge is doing what he is supposed to do.

BALDWIN: And again, we are awaiting reaction from Gabrielle Giffords, the office of the congresswoman. Jeff Toobin, thank you so much.

And now this. After more than two decades on air, the queen of daytime TV says farewell to all of her fans around the world. Oprah's philanthropy has never been a secret, but did you know that for more than 20 years she has funded a scholarship at Morehouse College in Atlanta. Oprah has helped more than 400 men obtain a higher education. Watch this.

BALDWIN: Oh, there was an audio issue. But I can tell you, because I was there, and it was Tyler Perry introducing this whole montage of Morehouse men who were saying thank you to Oprah. And then yesterday, if you watched her show, here they are one after another, 300 of these men appeared, moving Oprah to tears. Here is the audio, and let's listen.

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BALDWIN: It gives me goose-bumps to watch in on television, it gave me goose-bumps to sit there as well. Dr. Robert Franklin is the president of Morehouse College who just so happened to be on the same flight with me after the big night last week in Chicago. It is great to have you in the studio, sir. That was the showstopper.

ROBERT FRANKLIN, PRESIDENT, MOREHOUSE COLLEGE: Yes, it was an emotional high point of the entire farewell.

BALDWIN: I don't think it was on the television version, but in the commercial break in the United Center. And she said, that is it. I'm done.

FRANKLIN: The other thing she declared is this is newsworthy, to see 300 young men to come back to say thank you to a great donor, but also to pledge their own money to continue to pay forward.

BALDWIN: I want to get to that, but first explain to me -- explain to me how you pulled this off? These are men as I was, you know, asking you all kinds of questions on the plane last week, it took months of planning to pull this off and to get these men. How many men came to Chicago?

FRANKLIN: We had 300.

BALDWIN: You had 300 men. How did you pull it off?

FRANKLIN: We learned early on that the producers were thinking of the final shows and my communications team pitched an idea that since Oprah has helped over 400 Morehouse men, why not bring a large number of them? They had a bigger idea than we did. We thought maybe 100, and they wanted 300. They began over a three-month period to contact the Morehouse men all over the globe, and they showed up.

BALDWIN: I don't think that people fully realized that Oprah had helped so many men in the college educations, and she has at Morehouse and beyond and explain to me this paying it forward and that is what Oprah teaches and your Morehouse men are paying it forward and talk about it.

FRANKLIN: Well, central to the Morehouse ethos is the notion of lifting others as you climb. And so, Oprah really believes that it is cheaper to educate than to incarcerate. And when young people go to school, stay in school, and graduate and become productive citizens, they don't and don't cost the taxpayers more. So our young men appreciate that message of investing, making a good investment in the lives of others. And we're seeing a terrific social return on investment now.

BALDWIN: And these men have raised more than $300,000.

FRANKLIN: It's now more than $380,000 and growing. Since the show has aired we're getting phone calls from people who want to contribute, more young people that want to attend the college. It's been exciting for the college

FRANKLIN: That is tremendous. Thank you. It's such a pleasure to get to sit next to you on the plane and then have you here in Atlanta.

Now back to more breaking news. Tornadoes across the Midwest today. These are pictures. This is Missouri. This is storm damage just within the past hour. Look at this. We are not going to take you too far from this. Chad Myers and our weather team looking at the live pictures, what you need to know next. Stay here.

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BALDWIN: Back to our breaking news. Tornadoes in the Midwest. I bet you've noticed this. I know that we have here at CNN. We're seeing big tornadoes this year, just sheer size. Look at this one in Alabama, this was April. Here's the one that hit Joplin, Missouri, on Sunday, another massive tornado.

Now take a look at this one. This is Canton, Oklahoma. This is just yesterday. Look at this. Look at the size of that tornado. I want to bring Chad Myers back in. This is something that we were talking about in our morning meeting, the sheer size. Are they odd? Are they usually large this year?

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes.

BALDWIN: Why? Do we have an answer for that?

MYERS: That's a thesis for a doctorate student. But I have some theories.

BALDWIN: How big are we talking?

MYERS: We're talking 200 miles per hour. EF-4, EF-5, if you get a 5, you are above 200. Joplin was just considered a five. Tuscaloosa was a four, just below 200 miles per hour.

BALDWIN: Your theories?

MYERS: It's been very cold in the Rockies, record snow pack. Ask any ski resort in the Rockies. They've had a lot of snow. It even snowed last week in Colorado. That's cold air. The jet stream is a little bit stronger this year in the Pacific. But also the cold air and the warm air, it wants to be warm in the south. The Gulf of Mexico is warmer. So you have something warmer in the south and colder in the north, jet stream in between goes faster. A faster jet stream makes bigger tornadoes.

Also, there's been a drought in Oklahoma, also a drought in Texas. Not as many tornadoes out there because it hasn't rained in Oklahoma and Texas. It's a drought. When the sun comes out, there's not extra evaporation. It makes more humidity and more storms. If there's not the evaporation, you don't get more storms. Where has the rain been? The Mississippi River valley. There's humidity everywhere. Where do the storms go? Tuscaloosa, Joplin, even Raleigh. BALDWIN: That's a multifaceted answer. And then you try to wrap your head around the numbers. Something we've also seen this year, tornadoes hitting good size cities like Tuscaloosa, Birmingham, Raleigh, Joplin, Missouri. This is something that we have talked about off air.

MYERS: Guess where those tornadoes should have been -- miles north of Tonga, Oklahoma. But when you get east of the Mississippi river, when you start pushing farther and farther to the east, the population center is better.

BALDWIN: This is just bad luck?

MYERS: And a chance of hitting something bigger.

BALDWIN: Which they have over and over and over. We're going to hit hour two in a few minutes. Stand close to the story. Thank you, sir.

Wrapped in his mother's arms one minute, the next, gone. Imagine this, the grandmother of 16-month-old Skylar Logsdon joins us with their real life tornado nightmare. We'll be right back.

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