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Battle for Tripoli; Gerges: Libya could become Iraq; Strauss- Kahn Could be Free Today; Southwest Expands into Atlanta; Clashes Near Tripoli Airport

Aired August 23, 2011 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: -- saying that there's gunfire going on outside the Rixos Hotel. He is hearing mortar fire.

Arwa Damon says she's hearing mortar, residents fleeing, and the information minister saying they are surprised by the speed with which they are taking control.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: This may be the tipping point. This is maybe it.

VELSHI: This maybe it. He says 85 percent of the city is under their control. All right. Our coverage of this continues.

CNN NEWSROOM with Kyra Phillips begins right now -- Kyra.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, you guys. Thank you so much.

Well, from celebration to confusion in less than one day. This time yesterday, we were reporting how rebels were gaining on Tripoli. International leaders were talking about a new political era and rebels were actually bragging that they captured Gadhafi's son.

Well, then, overnight, Saif al-Islam appears smiling and laughing. He says that he lured the rebels into a trap. And that his father Moammar Gadhafi is still running the country.

So, right now, as we look at these live pictures out of Tripoli, we still don't know if Gadhafi is in his compound or not. But NATO jets are flying low over his compound. At least one explosion has been reported. NATO won't confirm any bombing, however.

And rebels are engaged in fierce fighting near the compound as well.

And as we heard just a moment ago, a rebel official reporting that they have actually breached the gates there.

We are hitting the story hard with multiple correspondents on the ground. Matthew Chance in the heart of Tripoli. Arwa Damon reporting from the city's airport. Sara Sidner is in Zawiya, the scene of fresh fighting. And Fred Pleitgen is in Benghazi, the opposition's home base since the start of the uprising.

All right. Let's get straight to Matthew Chance now who is actually caught up in a pretty dangerous situation, so dangerous actually we are actually not able to bring him up live at this point. But he did file this report, I'd say, less than an hour ago. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): I'm in this hotel, the Rixos Hotel, in the center Tripoli, very close to that compound of Moammar Gadhafi. And all morning, there's been very ferocious clashes, gunfire, explosions taking place in the direction of that compound.

You can't see the compound from our vantage point here. In fact, at one point, all of the journalists that are gathered in the hotel moved downstairs into the basement because we felt there was some sort of incoming artillery shells striking areas very close to where the hotel is.

There has been a lot of outgoing artillery as well and, clearly, there is a huge battle underway at the moment between the rebels and the Gadhafi loyalists who we now know to be holed up, to some extent, at least, inside that Gadhafi compound in the center of Tripoli.

And so, that's the situation, as I see it, at the moment from our very limited vantage point.

We are not hearing, at the moment, any NATO jets in the skies over Tripoli. But we are hearing explosions and what we are assuming those explosions are artillery shells being exchanged between the two sides in this area of the Gadhafi compound.

But what we are not hearing, the kind of heavy air strikes that we witnessed in this city, in the area of Tripoli the past several weeks and particularly in the past several days, and we're not hearing aircraft in the skies over the Gadhafi compound and over this hotel. I know that this area of Tripoli which clearly still in the hands of Gadhafi's forces

And so, it's difficult for me to -- you know, admittedly, it's difficult for me to, you know, give a very comprehensive assessment of what the military situation is like outside because, at the moment, I'm lying on my belly in a hotel room, hoping we don't get hit by a shell.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIPS: Well, in just a couple of miles to the east of Matthew's hotel, fresh fighting, we are being told, near Tripoli's international airport. That's where we find our Arwa Damon. She actually entered the city with a group of rebels. She's joining us live from the airport with the latest.

Arwa, what can you tell us?

ARWA DAMON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Kyra, we are hearing a number of explosions in the distance and some pretty intense fighting (AUDIO BREAK) with the rebel fighters who are basically here saying that it was coming from clashes happening to the north, along the strategic highway that leads straight from this international airport all the way to the Bab al-Aziziya compound.

They also said that some of Gadhafi's units were trying to loop around and attack the airport from the south, trying to regain this strategic location.

Now, this highway between the airport and Gadhafi's compound is critical for a number of reasons. It is located along two military complexes and one of them a major refueling station, the other a fuel storage facility. There also two main military bases located to the east. And while the rebel fighters continue to push to the north to reinforce those units they are currently engaged in that intense fighting around the Bab al-Aziziya compound. They also (AUDIO BREAK) that it's going to be a very tough, intense and slow road ahead.

PHILLIPS: And, Arwa, I know we got a bit -- we've had kind of a tough connection with you. I hope you can still hear me. We are still able to make you out and hear you pretty clearly. But we are looking at a live picture out of Tripoli right now. You can actually see the smoke coming from the compound.

Are you getting any new information from your vantage point? Can you see this as well? What do you know?

I know this is all kind of happening at once, but we are hearing gunfire, we're seeing smoke. We got a live picture now not far from the compound.

DAMON: Well, we can't really see that from our vantage --

(AUDIO BREAK)

PHILLIPS: All right. We apologize. We had a feeling that might happen.

As you can see, if you're just tuning in, we were able to get a pretty solid live picture from Tripoli right now where there's reports of explosions. NATO won't confirm bombing, but we are getting reports of explosions and some fierce fighting right there at the gates of Gadhafi's Tripoli compound.

We are going to stay on this live picture and try and monitor it.

You heard from our Matthew Chance who filed a report less than an hour ago. He had not heard any jets overhead at this point but we are monitoring it, trying to keep you up-to-date, minute by minute on what exactly is happening on these reports of attacks on Gadhafi's compound.

And we want to point out, we still can't confirm if Moammar Gadhafi is there on his compound or not.

As you could imagine, we've got a number assets there in country trying to get information, a lot of conflicting information. It's definitely hard, as you listen to all of the various sides within this -- this struggle to actually find out what's going on and to get truth. Everybody has a different story at this point.

But at least we can show you the live pictures. We are seeing smoke. We are hearing gunfire and we are trying to work this all -- work ourselves through the live pictures and the various bits of information we are getting from a number of sources at this point.

OK. Do we have -- we do have. OK, excellent.

We have Abubaker Saad who actually we're going to talk to coming up in about 15 minutes. You may remember, we talked to him yesterday. He used to be an aide and also an interpreter for Moammar Gadhafi.

And, Professor, I appreciate you joining us once again this morning via Skype there from your university.

ABUBAKER SAAD, FORMER MOAMMAR GADHAFI'S AIDE: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: Let me just ask you, since -- we were just able to get this live picture. You can actually see the smoke coming from the compound. We are getting all of these various reports about what is the status of Moammar Gadhafi and what exactly happened to his sons.

This time yesterday, when you and I were talking, the rebels said they had captured both of them. As you know, overnight, Matthew Chance was able to interview Saif al-Islam. He said he lured the rebels into a trap, he was never captured.

What is your take on all of this? You used to work side-by-side with the Gadhafi family.

SAAD: Well, it is very interesting, because after gathering all kinds of information and news that he was actually under house arrest, he and his brother Mohammad, each one of them. But the problem is here that we're looking at is that you part of a war, of an urban war. You can't really capture somebody and leave them under house arrest when you really don't have a control over the whole city.

They should have whisked him and his brothers out of the area and put them in a safe spot, say, like back in Zawiya or any spot they could protect them.

What they did, the mistake they did and rebels are actually confessing to that mistake, that they actually kept him under house arrest. You can't really keep that when you don't have a full patrol of a city.

PHILLIPS: Professor, stay with me. I understand we've got Matthew Chance calling in from the Rixos Hotel.

Matthew, are you there? Can you hear me OK? Can you tell what your situation is and if you're still hunkered down there in the hotel?

CHANCE (via telephone): Yes, Kyra, we are still in the Rixos Hotel. Journalists are still in the basement of this hotel as well for the most part, because all around the building here and close to the compound of Colonel Gadhafi, which is just a short distance away from the Rixos Hotel, there have been these ferocious battles raging, presumably, between the control of this area between the Gadhafi loyalists still holed up very much in this part of Tripoli, and the rebels who, you know, are controlling some areas of the capital as well.

There have been artillery round explodes. There have been burst of heavy machine gunfire. All of the journalists in the hotel have got their body armor on and helmets because one of the things that happened a few moments ago was that there was what was said to be a sniper firing a round into the hotel. It's not clear from which direction that bullet came. But, obviously, it was another, you know, kind of, you know, decks to which the experience of being in this hotel and covering this conflict from this vantage point has plunged.

But having said that, on the upside, the electricity is on. I'm able to phone out on occasion to get reports back to you for updates and we'll try to continue to do that throughout the course of the day, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Matthew, can you still speak to me for a moment or do you feel it's not safe to talk to me right now? You tell me.

CHANCE: No, I think it's fine to speak to you. I've got a bit of a time limit on the amount of time I can use this cell phone -- this cell phone call.

PHILLIPS: OK. Let me --

CHANCE: -- because we haven't been able to charge our batteries up on hours.

PHILLIPS: OK. I don't want to -- I want you to be able to charge up your battery. So, maybe, just yes or no, you can tell me quickly from the information you're getting and as you put it last night, it's kind of hard to figure out what is true and what is not at this point. You even got a quote from a fellow journalist lying as a national sport there in Libya. So, it's hard to weed through what is fact and fiction.

But to your knowledge, do you believe Gadhafi is holed up in his compound or not?

CHANCE: Well, there's no way for us to verify that, obviously, but interesting to say Saif al-Islam Gadhafi last night, he told me that all of his family were in Tripoli and we're working on the assumption that means in some kind of bunker in the Gadhafi compound. But, obviously, again, we got no way of knowing that for sure.

But what we do know is that compound of buildings associated with Colonel Gadhafi has been heavily bombed over the past several months. And so, if members of the Gadhafi family are there, that they are presumably in bunkers very deep under the ground. But, again, it's very difficult for us to say with any certainty. There's very little limited vantage point we have here in the Rixos Hotel.

PHILLIPS: I got it. Please charge your batteries, Matthew. Stay in touch with us when you can. We appreciate all of the information that we are able to get to you at this point. Matthew, thanks.

Is Abubaker Saad still with us?

OK. Professor, you were able to hear from Matthew Chance there and for our viewers that may not be familiar with you in our interview yesterday, he used to be a personal aide to Moammar Gadhafi and his interpreter. You're also he's interpreter. You're now here in the States as a professor.

You actually told me yesterday you do not believe Moammar Gadhafi is in Tripoli, that this is very much a ruse. That you believe he's probably hiding out in his home town or maybe a tribal protected area.

Please tell me if you still believe that that is the case and why.

SAAD: I still think it is -- it is the case. I don't think he is in the compound. Once the compound was bombarded the first time, he was removed from there but into other residents in Tripoli as I have heard.

But in the last couple of weeks, if -- you know, and you have been receiving all -- copes of his messages to the Libyan people through the Libyan television and the quality of his messages has deteriorated. And the audio of the phone calls and that began to confirm in my mind that he has been already removed, either to Sirte, which is his hometown, which is a stronghold, and it is under his control and the forces that are in Sirte are led by one of his sons, Moatessem.

And the other holed up could be or the other possibility could be the city of Sabha, in the southwest of Tripoli where his tribal group, his tribal members are very strong there and he has a very strong military presence in that particular city down in the desert.

So, those are the two possibilities I would think of that after the heavy bombardment of his compound that could be the alternative.

PHILLIPS: Now, Professor, as Gadhafi's former aide and interpreter, one journalist who Matthew Chance was talking to said, look, here in Libya, lying is a national sport. You can't figure out who is telling the truth and what exactly we're dealing with at this time.

So, let me get it from your perspective. First of all, Saif al-Islam, he says, you know, he lured the rebels into a trap, that his dad is still in charge. What do you make of what Saif is saying? Do you believe that he was captured? That he escaped, that he wasn't captured at all? That this is part of a big lie to try and promote a certain image?

SAAD: Well, let us look at it from the perspective of how -- how events went. Sunday night, the revolutionaries said they captured him and one of his brothers. All Monday, had he a chance to refute it and he did not refute it until very early Tuesday when he spoke with Matthew.

So, when you think about it, why didn't he refute it very quickly in order to rise the morale of his fighters down in the city of Tripoli?

So, to me, that he actually -- and rebel side is saying that they had him under house arrest. So, here, really, we don't know the truth. Really, lying is not a sport in Libya. It's just that you are dealing with a war propaganda. Each side is trying to make the other side look worse.

And that's basically what he is doing. He came out and ordered just to make that particular point.

PHILLIPS: Abubaker Saad, appreciate so much of you weighing in. Please stay with us, sir.

For those of you not familiar with Professor Saad -- he is now at West Connecticut State University. He's a former aide to Moammar Gadhafi. He's been helping us sift through all the information we've been getting there.

Sara Sidner, I understand, has been able to link up with us now. She is joining us live out of Zawiya, where apparently fresh fighting is being reported.

Sarah, bring us up-to-date.

SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Actually, we are in Tripoli and no fighting in Zawiya, where we just were. We are in the city of Tripoli and have been here for about an hour now.

I can tell you that we can hear the fighting going on. We heard from the rebels they have sort of surrounded the area of Bab al-Aziziya which is where the Gadhafi compound is. There's a heavy firefight that's been going on. We are at a checkpoint now.

And what we're seeing is something very different than yesterday. We were in the same area yesterday going into the city center. What we are seeing is residents fleeing like we have not seen before.

Now, when we speak them to go on camera many will not go on camera saying that everything is fine, everything is fine, but we clearly see that people are becoming quite scared. They don't want to be in the city any more. They're not sure where the gunfire is coming from on whose side. It's coming towards their neighborhood. It is a street- to-street fight in the city.

Even the media, we have been asked questions even by the rebels where to go because some of them don't seem to know if it's safe in Zawiya where we were, which was secure. And so, obviously, there's a bit of a communication breakdown between those who are manning the checkpoints and those who are in the city and fighting. So, a very difficult and intense situation here in Tripoli.

PHILLIPS: And, Sara, let me ask you, we just got word from Mahmoud Shaman, the minister of information for the National Transitional Council. He just came forward about 10 minutes ago and said he estimates conservatively that rebels control 85 percent of Tripoli right now. You just made your way into Tripoli. What's your take with regard to that number and what he is saying?

SIDNER: To be honest, I'm not sure they know how much of Tripoli they actually control. We were hearing things like 80 percent, 90 percent, 95 percent, depending on who you talk to and that was yesterday. And then, all of the sudden, we heard people saying, it's not safe in the city center, there are some problems in some neighborhoods. We're having a firefight in that neighborhood.

I think communication is very difficult here. We know that from our own perspective. We know some of the phones are not getting through. So, the communications are very, very difficult.

We do know, however, the rebels do control some parts of Tripoli and a pretty large portion because we were able to drive around in those areas for the past 10 hours or so.

But I think it's very, very hard to assess just how much of the city that they have complete control over because, again, there are streets in which you can turn down and suddenly face with Gadhafi forces.

Now, Gadhafi forces don't seem to be in large numbers, to be fair, they are having incidents such as dealing with snipers and that sort of thing.

So, to get an assessment of the entire city, I think, is difficult at this time.

I do want to bring this up. We just heard from the rebels that they have -- the National Transitional Council has set up an office now just on the outskirts of Tripoli, so they are here. The political wing of the opposition is here set up in a secret place. We can't tell you exactly where that is but we hear now from our rebel sources they are in the area, and that is a significant change.

PHILLIPS: Got it. Sara Sidner, live in Tripoli for us -- Sara, thank you so much.

Stay with CNN. We're going to take a quick break.

You're looking at live pictures now out of Tripoli. Apparently, the smoke has pretty much cleared over Moammar Gadhafi's compound but we can tell you -- according to our Matthew Chance who is not far from there, hunkered down in a hotel not far from Gadhafi's compound, that there have been explosions. There is fierce fighting. Some reports coming through, rebels saying they breached the gates of Gadhafi's compound.

But bottom line: we still cannot confirm if Moammar Gadhafi is there on his compound.

We are following all of the breaking news for you live, right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) PHILLIPS: Hurricane Irene is crashing through the Atlantic and gaining a lot of strength right now. It actually left some flooding and damage in the Dominican Republic and, apparently, it's headed toward the Bahamas now.

CNN's Jacqui Jeras is tracking the storm for us.

Hi, Jacqui.

JACQUI JERAS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Hey, Kyra.

Yes, a really serious storm and a major threat for life and property. The Turks and Caicos next in line here. This is where Irene is now. It's a powerful category 2 storm, maximum winds around 100 miles per hour. But it is well to the north now of the Dominican Republic and so intensification is going to be expected right up until the time we see a major landfall.

This is moving through the Turks and Caicos, and the heading towards the Bahamas. Let's show the latest track and what we're expecting with this system. There you can see, it's spending sometime through the -- all of the Bahamas really just getting lashed by this major hurricane. Category 3 as you head through the day on Thursday.

Florida will likely start to feel the impacts of this on Thursday as well. But it's just going to be the coastal areas for the most part that are going to be brushed with some winds and some heavy rain as well. And then it's expected to take a northerly turn and make its way on up towards the Carolinas.

Now, the computer models have been shifting eastward. That's a trend we have been seeing through the weekend and the early part of this week. That white line is a National Hurricane Center forecast and look at everything trending towards the east. Nothing brings it towards Florida any more.

But this is a very big storm, Kyra, almost 400 miles wide, that's how far the tropical storm force winds stretch out, so everybody across the Southeast is really going to feel the impact of this storm.

We'll keep you up-to-date.

PHILLIPS: All right. Great. Thanks, Jacqui.

More from the CNN NEWSROOM straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Live pictures out of Tripoli right now. You can see the smoke still billowing up in the air.

This is what we know and what we don't know at this point.

What we know -- according to our Matthew Chance who is hunkered down not far from there in a hotel, unable to leave the hotel because of talk of snipers in the area firing into the hotel where he actually is. He said he can confirm, though, there is fierce fighting right there at Moammar Gadhafi's compound.

But here is what we don't know -- we don't know if Moammar Gadhafi is on his compound, if he's hunkered down in a bunker somewhere, if he's fled to his hometown. Of course, there are a number of different takes as all of the various factions are trying to look like the party that is gaining in what so many of our analyst have called a war, not a revolution, that's taking place here and Libya.

We've got reporters all across Libya at this point. I understand Fred Pleitgen, who just met with opposition leaders, is up live now.

Fred, tell me exactly where you are and about this meeting that you were able to get some information on.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Kyra.

Yes. I'm in Benghazi, which is, of course, the stronghold of the Libyan opposition, the capital of the Libyan opposition, if you will. I just came back from a meeting with a senior official from the Transitional National Council, which is, of course, the organization that says that it's representing the Libyan rebels and the rebel fighters that are all across this country.

One of the specifics things that I asked this person is -- I asked him what happened with Saif al-Islam Gadhafi where they put out a press release, that confirmation saying that he'd been captured by the rebel forces, and then, a couple of hours later, he shows up at the Rixos Hotel to meet with journalists there. And they say that they are investigating the matter. And they themselves at this point are not exactly sure where that faulty information came from. But they say there is going to be a major investigation into this and they are going to find out what went wrong.

Nevertheless, it is, of course, clear that Saif al-Islam has not been captured by the rebels.

Now, they do say that even in spite of this, they don't feel that they've lost any of the momentum in the battle for Tripoli, if you will. This person specifically is someone who has great knowledge of the Tripoli area and he says he believes they will be in control of the city in the next two or three days and the Transitional Council is making preparations as we speak to have some of its high level members relocate from here in Benghazi to Tripoli. They say they're going to do that once it becomes safe for them to be on the ground there -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: So, Fred, let me get your take here. The fact that we can get no confirmation from the rebel leaders that you've met with, how do you feel this plays into the credibility of the rebel fight? And there's this talk of rebels coming together and the formation of this transitional council, yet, it seems like they can't even get their information straight.

So going forward, how does this play on the credibility of what is taking place here with regard to who could be leading this country if Moammar Gadhafi, indeed, is completely taken out? PLEITGEN: Well, yes. You're absolutely right. There's major concerns as to the credibility of the Transitional National Council and to their possibility to actually unite this country.

I mean, one of the things they keep saying is they believe that once Moammar Gadhafi has been defeated, once he's been ousted officially from power, that people in this country will come together, that there will be national reconciliation.

But, I mean, this a very tribal society and one of the things that's very clear is that even the rebel force even in and of itself is not one that is by any means united. If you look at the fighters in Misrata, if you look at the fighters here on the eastern side in Benghazi, you look at the fighters that are coming in from the southwest from the Nafoussa (ph) mountains, they all have very different agendas and very different takes on how the future of this country should look like.

There's some groups who feel that there should be a large chunk of Islamic law in the way that this country is governed the future. There's a people who are very liberal. So there are a lot of concerns as to whether the National Transitional Council is going to be able to unite this country when all is said and done.

One of the things that experts keep saying they have the fear that pretty much the only thing that is uniting these factions is Moammar Gadhafi and their fight against Moammar Gadhafi and what's going to happen once he goes away.

So at this point in time, you're absolutely right. The fact that they're not able to get their information straight, they don't seem to have very good firsthand information as to what is going on in Tripoli is something that raises concerns.

However, they still claim once all is said and done and once this is over and they move in to govern this place, that they are going to be able to pull all those factions together, try to unite them, and in effect, bring some sort of Democratic rule to Libya in the next 8 or 10, maybe 20 months -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Our Fred Pleitgen who just met with the opposition leaders there in Benghazi, reporting to us live.

Fred, thanks so much.

Well, if we aren't careful, Libya could become another Iraq. That's according to one of the best minds in the Arab world. He's going to join us in just a second to explain his thoughts on what's happening right now.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: We have gotten word that Standard & Poor's president is stepping down. That announcement comes just a of couple of weeks after the credit rating agency downgraded the U.S.'s AAA rating. Apparently Devon Sharma will take another role in the company before leaving at the end of the year.

Alison Kosik is following that story out of the New York Stock Exchange.

On stop that, Alison, we also talked about the Department of Justice investigation that is ongoing, as well. So what's happening here with S&P?

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, S&P says you know what, Sharma's departure, it really has been in the works for months and it doesn't have anything to do with the downgrade. And, in fact, it comes after S&P split into two units.

But, you know, image is certainly a concern for this agency. Standard & Poor's is dealing with a lot right now, with criticism over that downgrade. A Justice Department investigation into how it rated mortgages in the years leading up to the financial crisis. And these activist shareholders that are pushing for more oversight. And Washington has especially been vocal in its criticism. And, you know what, it didn't help that Fitch and Moody's still held firm to their U.S. rating of U.S. credit at AAA.

The FT says that S&P's CEO last week acknowledged that everything is being scrutinized so expect more changes this year for the agency. You know what? They're under a microscope, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Markets just opened. How are they looking today?

KOSIK: We've got a bit of a pop right now. You know what, investors are really in this kind of wait and see mode ahead of a big address on Friday that Fed Chief Ben Bernanke is going to give. We could see things change in about 20 minutes. We're getting new home sales numbers. They are expected to drop. We'll see if they move the markets at all -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Alison Kosik at the New York Stock Exchange. Alison, thanks so much.

Well, the battle for the control of Libya continues to escalate. Rebels mounting an attack on the Gadhafi compound in Tripoli. We're being told residents are fleeing that city. Now there's fresh fighting reported in Zawiyah.

CNN's Sara Sidner has now made her way to Tripoli.

Sara's there's been a lot of confusion about how much is actually under rebel control right now. You and I talked minutes ago about a spokesperson for the Transitional Council coming forward saying that they believe rebels control 85 percent of Tripoli, but you're saying that there's a mixed bag of opinions with regard to that number.

SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I think it's difficult for them to say just how much of Tripoli they control because communications are very, very poor here. The reason why we're able to community with you is because of satellite. You cannot call from one area to the next sometimes the phones just cut out. And also because there's NATO in the sky, oftentimes communications get cut with satellites.

So there's a lot of confusion, I have to say, amongst the rebels and amongst the people in the city. And I think that's one of the reasons why you're seeing people fleeing. But you're also seeing people fleeing, their faces looking a bit tense in some regards as they're leaving the city because the fighting has been very, very intense over the last few hours near Bab al-Aziziya and you can hear that throughout the city. We can hear that where we are in Tripoli. A scary situation.

One thing that we are hearing and seeing right now that's different than yesterday is a lot more residents fleeing. We're also seeing the checkpoints change. They're now opening up the cars. They're now looking in the trunks. They're now checking each and every car that comes by unless they know for sure that they are rebels, that they are in support of the cause. And I think you're seeing some tenseness here because, obviously, some of the residents in this city have to be or were or had to be a supporter of the Gadhafi regime. Not every single resident city would necessarily be happy to see the rebels in their city.

And so you see one of these situations where people are trying to get out, they see these checkpoints that are disconcerting. These guys have guns. They're blowing them off in the air and things are pretty tense here.

The other thing that we're hearing from rebels now is that some of the Gadhafi forces are posing as rebels. We've heard that in other cities when we were there, for example, in Misrata and Ajdabia and Benghazi, where they would start acting and trying to pretend to be rebel forces and trying to take action that way by getting closer and closer to the forces or making -- giving people a false sense that they are with the opposition.

So there's a lot of difficulties here with communication. There is still quite a bit of fighting going on and things just feel very, very tense in the capital today, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Sara, what are rebel leaders telling you with regard to Moammar Gadhafi, his whereabouts? Is he on his compound or not? Have they, indeed, breached various gates there on his compound? We're getting mixed reports.

I'm curious what the rebel factions there are telling you, if anything at all.

SIDNER: They're telling us that they're still sweeping the city. That's as much as we can get out of them. And obviously, they have their issues with giving out certain information. At one point, we do know that they were saying they had surrounded bab al-Aziya, which is the Gadhafi compound. I think they believe that Moammar Gadhafi is in Tripoli. I think there's a general belief that he's somewhere in the city. I think that's why also you're seeing the intense checking now where they weren't doing this before. In the last two days we've been along this road, driving in and out and they were not doing that before.

So I think they do believe he's in the city and after hearing from his son Saif al Islam yesterday talking to our Matthew Chance and other reporters in the international -- in the hotel where all of these international correspondents are located, he's saying that the entire family is there.

Again, it's very hard to get to the truth, though. Until someone sees Moammar Gadhafi and until someone can take pictures of him, can speak with him, we don't know where he is. But the rebels believe he is here in the capital somewhere -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Sara Sidner there live in Tripoli.

All right. So here's what we don't know and that is where exactly Moammar Gadhafi is. Everybody is speculating now, as you can see, on all sides of this battle. We really don't know how much the rebels are in control. As you heard from our Sara Sidner there, she said it's -- you just cannot determine whether 85 percent of Tripoli is in the hands of rebels right now even though that is what they're reporting. And she's right there in Tripoli. So we're going to at least try to get a handle on what could happen next in light of not having a lot of hard facts.

Fawaz Gerges is the director of Middle East Center at the London School of Economics. Fawaz is joining us now live out of London.

Fawaz, are you confused as so many others with regard to who is actually in control and winning this battle right now?

FAWAZ GERGES, AUTHOR, "THE RISE AND FALL OF AL-QAEDA": Well, you know, Kyra, we're all confused because we don't really have much information. I mean, think of yesterday. Yesterday, it seemed that the war was over. Yesterday, the rebels told us that Saif al-Islam, he had (INAUDIBLE), he was arrested, that his brother Muhammad was arrested, that basically the city has fallen. We all were swept away.

Today, we know, in fact, that Saif al-Islam was not arrested. We know that Muhammad is still free. We know that Gadhafi and his sons are leading the battle for Tripoli. We know there is intense fighting in many parts of the city. And what worries me a great deal, Kyra, is that the rebels do not seem to coordinate the actions, that they don't have a unified command and control, no army.

In fact -- and this is -- the reason why I'm worried because now, the front line in Tripoli has expanded. Streets, neighborhoods. This is urban warfare. This really means bad news for the rebels and their ability to swiftly secure the city. This is the -- I mean, current situation.

The big picture, Kyra, Gadhafi had lost and he had lost big times. His game is over. The rebels had really made some significant advances in the last weeks, in particular, the last 48 hours. This is a significant moment for Libya, a moment fragrant with possibilities and risks. And I think it's a matter of time even though there are battles to be waged, even though the battle still raging in Tripoli and Sirte and other cities, the reality is the war itself has been won by the Libyan people and it's up to the rebels and their leadership to basically begin the process of reconstructing.

This is the $1 million question. Will the leadership of the rebels rise up to the occasion, put their house in order, create a functioning government, inclusive government, and basically create institutionalized their movement?

They have not institutionalized their movement yet.

PHILLIPS: Exactly. I mean, Fawaz, I mean, I'm listening to you and I'm having visions of Iraq and being in Iraq when there was so much celebration about the fall of Saddam Hussein, but then we saw what happened.

There was so much division among all of the tribes and it was totally impossible to put together a cohesive government with everybody that was on the same page and we see the status of Iraq now. We saw what happened there from the looting to the issue of civil war, to all of the people dying in the fighting.

So as you look at Libya right now, and you're watching what'd happening, are you concerned that it could go the Iraq way?

GERGES: You know, Kyra, you're absolutely correct to raise concerns and questions and compassion about Iraq and Libya.

But the reality is Libya is not Iraq for a variety of reasons. Let me just for your -- for our viewers let me just mention a few points. Iraq's modern history is really soaked with blood. From the 1920s up to the present it's been a very bloody history.

They are and they were multiple sectarian divisions and the country itself, since, as you know, the 1980s was really low intensity warfare and in fact, Baghdad on the morning that the coalition forces the American forces entered Baghdad, the city basically was burning and the looting.

So far what's good about Libya, in fact, the leadership is fully aware of the Iraqi model. No looting, no burning of the city. The leadership has made it very clear that there will be no vengeance acts, there will be no summary execution. They are fully aware of the Iraqi model. Even Saif al-Islam, and Gadhafi if they were -- when and if they are arrested they will have justice that is by the International Court of Justice.

But let me answer your question directly now and say unless the leadership, unless the leadership of the rebels rise up to the occasion, there is the likelihood, given the extent of warfare now in Tripoli and other cities, that all it takes is a spark and you're going to have Libya descending into the Iraqi model. This is a reality and that is why the next few days and next few weeks are really, really critical for Libya and the Libyan people.

PHILLIPS: Fawaz Gerges I know you're staying with us. I'm actually going to bring you together with one of Moammar Gadhafi's former aides. We're going to have another discussion in about 30 minutes. Fawaz, I always appreciate your perspective. Thanks so much.

We're going to take a break. More from the CNN NEWSROOM straight ahead.

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PHILLIPS: Well, high-powered international banker Dominique Strauss- Kahn could be free to go home today. The sexual assault charges against him are expected to be dropped.

CNN's Zain Verjee in London now. So Zain, there are people now who are saying this whole scandal was an effort to get him out as head of the International Monetary Fund. What's the -- what's the international take on this?

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Well, let's get straight to the newspaper headlines and see what they have to say. Ok, Kyra, let's start with "Wall Street Journal" Europe -- its headline reads, "In France more trouble". It says, "More troubles could await Dominique Strauss-Kahn if he opts to return home. French prosecutors were still looking into accusations that he assaulted other women and his socialist friends have launched their presidential-election campaign without him."

Take a look at "The Guardian", Kyra. "DSK walks, but Nicolas Sarkozy will run". It says, "The case against Dominique Strauss-Kahn is being dropped but his reputation is in tatters, his accuser's, too. So who benefits? Only one person stands to gain, Nicolas Sarkozy." That's the French President.

Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Kyra was planning, everybody thought to run for election to be president of the France, and he was engulfed by this scandal, and that's not going to happen -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Well, we will follow what happens to him today here from the U.S. as well. Zain Verjee thanks so much.

And we are also following all the latest developments out of Tripoli. Where exactly is Moammar Gadhafi? Is he in control? How much ground are the rebels gaining? We're following it all for you straight from the CNN NEWSROOM.

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PHILLIPS: All right. Let's check stories across country now. In Florida, folks getting prepared in case hurricane Irene hits. Generation -- or generators rather, and gas cans, flashlights, all that stuff flying off the shelves right now. People are also stocking up on food.

Well, let's take you to California now. A convicted murderer captured by the FBI, they nabbed him 36 years after he walked away from a prison work detail. But get this. It was his mother that led police to where he was. It was her dying wish to speak with him one more time. And the FBI actually tracked their phone calls.

And in Iowa, it was the National Guard to the rescue. A school bus gets stuck on a flooded road. The kids sat there for more than an hour. It wasn't all that bad. They got a free ride in an Army truck, they said.

Well, we're hearing that Southwest Airlines is going to be offering flights in and out of the Atlanta's Hartsfield-Jackson Airport. And Alison Kosik, pretty significant considering all the flying that takes place here at our international airport. When -- when folks saw that Southwest was going to be having this inexpensive flight, as you can imagine, a lot of happy people.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We heard cheers.

PHILLIPS: Yes exactly.

KOSIK: Yes so -- and sure this not only a big win for Southwest, it's a huge win for people that fly in and out of Atlanta Hartsfield. You know, the airport is the biggest U.S. airport that Southwest currently doesn't service.

And Southwest is able to actually get its foot in the door, in Atlanta because it bought Air-Tran which already had the big presence there. It's also a big location for business travelers. And that segment of the traveling public really brings in more profits for airlines.

And get ready, Delta, it could give you a run for your money. You've got a pretty good stronghold in Atlanta as well.

Now, Southwest also launching nonstop flights to five cities. Take a look in Chicago, Baltimore, Denver, Houston, and Austin, Texas. It's going to be offering initial fares as low as $79 each way. This all starts in February. Grab your tickets -- Kyra.

PHILLIPS: Ok, Alison Kosik, thanks so much.

PHILLIPS: We've got more for you straight from the CNN NEWSROOM. Stay with us.

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