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Attack Near U.S. Embassy in Kabul; GOP Rivals Take Aim at Rick Perry; Sizing Up Republican Presidential Debate Winners and Losers; Fact-Checking Debate Claims; Explaining HPV; Interview With Afghanistan President Hamid Karzai; Social Security: Romney Vs. Perry

Aired September 13, 2011 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: That does it for us.

Our Suzanne Malveaux, still in Afghanistan. Boy, did she have a day today, Drew.

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN ANCHOR: She was supposed to come back today. I think she's stuck there now for the network because of all these attacks. She's going to be the on-the-scene reporter. We're going to have her in the next hour.

PHILLIPS: Great.

GRIFFIN: All right. Thanks, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: See you tomorrow.

GRIFFIN: And live from Studio 7, I am Drew Griffin, in for Suzanne, who is now on assignment in dangerous conditions in Afghanistan.

Let's get you up to speed though on this Tuesday, September 13th.

This is what's going on. Taliban fighters attacking the U.S. Embassy in Kabul today with rocket-propelled grenades and guns. It's been a fierce firefight under way now for several hours.

U.S. troops trying to flush these guys out. They're in an abandoned building where the attack was launched. Fewer than 10 Taliban are believed to be involved.

And Iran saying two Americans could be released in days. That is if the men's families pay bail of $1 million.

Josh Fattal and Shane Bauer have been in custody since they went on that hike in 2009. Iran sentenced them to eight years for spying and illegal entry. The Americans say they were just hiking in Iraq, accidentally straying into Iran.

Texas Governor Rick Perry may feel like he is a punching bag this morning. Seven Republicans who trail Perry in the polls, well, they roughed him up in last night's CNN/Tea Party presidential debate. Topics in Tampa ranged from Social Security and immigration to job creation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, look, I think Governor Perry would agree with me that if you're dealt four aces, that doesn't make you necessarily a great poker player.

GOV. RICK PERRY (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I was going to say, Mitt, you were doing pretty good until you got to talking poker.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: We will dive head first into the debate in about 10 minutes, all the slams and spin, and the facts and the fiction.

President Obama leaves the White House shortly to pledge his jobs bill. He's going to Columbus, Ohio, to do it. Today's focus, creating new construction jobs to modernize public schools.

The president wants to pay for the jobs bill by limiting tax deductions for wealthier Americans. It's not clear Republicans will go along with that.

New Yorkers today choosing a replacement for former congressman Anthony Weiner. Polls indicate the Republican, Bob Turner, could upset the Democrat. His name is David Weprin.

The 9th District in Queens, in Brooklyn, has been in Democratic hands for almost a century. No matter who wins, by the way, the victory will be brief. The district may disappear when New York redraws its congressional lines.

The U.S. State Department says Niger has or will detain this guy, Saadi Gadhafi. He's the son of former Libyan leader, Moammar Gadhafi, who crossed into Niger on Sunday. Saadi Gadhafi told CNN's Nic Robertson he's there to check on Libyan citizens.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: He says that what he is doing there, he's on a humanitarian mission. That's how he describes it. That's why he says he's fled south out of Libya to Niger. He said that there are thousands of his tribesmen who have fled across the border, in Tunisia, afraid of the rebels, the National Transitional Council, afraid of what will happen to them, he says.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: Moammar Gadhafi's wife, daughter, and two other sons turned up in Algeria. That was last month.

Well, there she is, the new Miss Universe. Angola's Leila Lopes took the title at the pageant in Brazil last night. Lopes says her smile is her biggest weapon.

Plastic surgery? Nope. Lopes says she loves her body just the way God made it.

And here's your chance to "Talk Back" on one of the big stories of the day. Today's question: Is it time to walk back tax deductions?

Carol Costello joins us from New York.

Hi, Carol.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm still laughing about her smile is her biggest asset.

GRIFFIN: Well, that's one of them, Carol.

COSTELLO: Exactly, that is one of them.

All right. Let's get to it, shall we?

You know the jobs plan the president wants Congress to pass, like and right now, like, it doesn't look good. Yes, Republicans like parts of the plan, but they don't like how the president wants to tax the rich to pay for it.

Yes, Mr. Obama wants to end tax loopholes for oil and gas companies, hedge fund managers, and he wants to let the Bush tax cuts expire. The biggest chunk, though, $400 billion, will come from limiting tax deductions for Americans making more than $200,000 a year.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We've got to decide what our priorities are. Do we keep tax loopholes for oil companies, or do we put teachers back to work? Do we keep tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires, or should we invest in education and technology and infrastructure, all the things that are going to help us out-innovate and out-educate and out-build other countries in the future?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: It's deja vu all over again, as is the Republican response. This, from Senator Jon Kyl.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JON KYL (R), ARIZONA: Who is it, Mr. President, that are the first to hire coming out of a recession? It's small business. So the very people that we are asking to hire more Americans, to put them back to work, are the people who would be impacted by the taxes that the president talked about the other night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So, the "Talk Back" question today: Is it time to walk back tax deductions?

Facebook.com/CarolCNN. I'll read some of your comment later this hour.

GRIFFIN: Carol, thanks. Can't wait for that.

But we want to get right now back to our top story, the bombing at the U.S. Embassy in Kabul. I should say it's an attack.

Our Suzanne Malveaux is at CNN's bureau near the embassy.

Suzanne, what is the latest there?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you can probably hear the call to prayer that's happening behind me. It just started to rain within the last hour or so.

We were on the streets, not far at all from where this attack has occurred. It is not over, Drew. This has been going on for six hours or so.

So far, what is happening is that we understand that out of the four suicide attackers that were inside of that building shooting at the U.S. Embassy, at the NATO compound, at the International Security Assistance Force, and other intelligence offices, that two of the four insurgents have been killed. This was an international coalition that went up into the sky, and helicopters that ended up shooting into that building, killing two of the four insurgents.

The other two insurgents are inside of the building. They are still resisting. There's still somewhat of a firefight.

When we were out on the streets, there was a large, loud explosion that occurred right outside of the facility. You had Afghan police, as well as Afghan army, trying to keep the crowd under control, to pull them back a little bit. A lot of confusion on the street, Drew.

We also passed one of the local hospitals. That's where we saw at least one of the wounded being taken in. It looked like he was bleeding from his stomach.

Talked to a hospital official there who said they had at least six injured. There were five civilians and one police officer there.

And then we just so happened to pass another military hospital. And that is where we saw a man in the back of a pickup truck, if you will. He had been shot. He was killed. This was a dead man, and they were bringing him inside of that military hospital.

We spoke with the military officials right outside, and they said it was actually one of the insurgents who had been killed inside of that building, who had been shooting earlier in the day. So, U.S. officials, those inside of the embassy right now, they are still hunkered down. They say that they are still on lockdown now, but nobody inside that building is hurt.

We've also heard from the international military, the coalition that we spent a lot of time, Drew, you know, the last couple of days, looking at the training exercises for the Afghans that go on there. Nobody has been hurt there, as well. That is the word from that facility.

But this is still a very tense situation here in Kabul. It is not the only attack.

There are two other attacks that happened this afternoon. All of them claimed by Taliban.

A second attack that also happened, a suicide bomber with a vest strapped to him went to a police compound. He was actually shot. There were two police who were injured in that incident.

A third incident happened, as well, and this was at a local high school, where you, again, had another suicide bomber. Two people were injured there.

So, overall, when you look at the big picture here, Drew, you're talking about four police officers killed, at least several injured, as well as civilians.

It may not sound like a lot, but what is meant here for the Taliban is that this is a strategy, if you will, to prove that they can get to the heart of this security structure inside this major city where you have all the power brokers. You've got NATO, international forces, the presidential palace, all of this very nearby, very close, to show the Afghans that they can get to the heart of the community and create chaos, create fear.

That is something that a lot of people -- we've talked to them on the streets -- are concerned about. They want to feel safe again.

And this comes at a critical time, we know, because this is the time they're trying to train the Afghans, get them up to speed, and basically be in charge of their own security in very short order, by the time the U.S. and NATO combat troops come home, by the end of 2014. So it is a tense situation.

We have heard from the president. President Hamid Karzai releasing a statement, offering his condolences. We've heard from officials that we've been speaking with from the highest level, General John Allen, who's responsible for the U.S. troops and the NATO troops, the mission here, saying that this is the kind of high-profile tactic that they know has a huge psychological impact on this community.

So this is just what's happened. It's far from over, Drew. It is still playing out, but so far, it look like they are still in a rather tense situation around the embassy.

GRIFFIN: Suzanne, you hit on all the points I was going to ask you except for one. Who is in charge of the security, and how did this happen?

MALVEAUX: Well, in terms of the U.S. Embassy itself, we were just there a couple days ago for the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attacks. You have a private contractor who handles security, it's overseen by the military. But aside from that, Drew, you've got a ton of people who were involved in this. Right?

You have the Afghan police, the Afghan army. You have some members of their air force. And then you have a huge complex which is a complex that we were staying in until today, when we were going to actually leave, which is the International Security Assistance Force.

And that's the group of -- that represents 35 different countries, and their security elements that here to train. They got involved in all of this, as well. They were a part of the defense, if you will, the firefight that occurred to take out those insurgents.

So there are a lot of players here that are on the ground, that are involved in this. It really is kind of an international effort, if you will, because this is the center. This is where you have the security system, the heart of the security system in Kabul, where this training is taking place, where the mission is taking place, the transition of this mission taking place, all here in the city's capital.

GRIFFIN: It's just stunning that they were able to get so close, get into this abandoned building, and then open fire without anybody stopping them.

Suzanne, we'll look for more of your reporting. Great work. You're there at such an important time. And we appreciate that from Afghanistan.

And here's a rundown of some of the stories ahead, still.

First, tough talk in Tampa at that first-ever CNN/Tea Party debate last night. The field gangs up on the front-runner.

HPV sparked one of the most heated exchanges. A lot of people don't know what that is. We're going to tell you.

Then, a college degree, but years of unending debt. More grads default on their student loans and file for bankruptcy.

And the guy you can't see is the man trapped beneath that flaming wreck. You have got to see what happens next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: It was real easy to recognize Texas Governor Rick Perry at last night's Republican presidential debate. He's the guy with the bull's eye on his back. Perry, of course, ahead in the polls, so his Republican rivals took aim at him on issues ranging from Social Security, to illegal immigration, even vaccinations.

CNN Political Correspondent Jim Acosta has highlights from the first-ever CNN/Tea Party debate.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How will you convince senior citizens that Social Security and Medicare need to be changed and get their vote?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The first question may have been on Social Security, but it was really about Rick Perry, who once called the program a Ponzi scheme.

PERRY: It has been called a Ponzi scheme by many people long before me, but no one's had the courage to stand up and say, here is how we're going to reform it --

ACOSTA: But as Perry tried to turn down the heat, Mitt Romney cranked it up.

ROMNEY: But the question is, do you still believe that Social Security should be ended as a federal program, as you did six months ago, when your book came out, and return to the states? Or do you want to retreat from that?

PERRY: I think we ought to have a conversation.

ROMNEY: We're having that right now, Governor. We're running for president.

PERRY: If you'll let me finish, I'll finish this conversation.

ACOSTA: That teed up what might have been the one-liner of the night.

NEWT GINGRICH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm not particularly worried about Governor Perry and Governor Romney frightening the American people when President Obama scares them every single day.

(APPLAUSE)

ACOSTA: But that wasn't the only flash point. Take the economy. Asked whether the Lone Star governor was responsible for jobs created in his home state, Romney said pro-business Texas deserved the credit, not Perry.

WOLF BLITZER, HOST, CNN'S "STATE OF THE UNION": Tell him how much credit he deserves.

(LAUGHTER)

ROMNEY: Well, look, you know, I think Governor Perry would agree with me that if you are dealt four aces, that does not make you necessarily a great poker player.

PERRY: Well, I was going to say, Mitt, you were doing pretty good until you got to talking poker.

ACOSTA: But it was Michele Bachmann who was coming up with some winning hands, hitting Perry on his executive order to require that school girls receive vaccinations against the sexually transmitted HPV virus that may cause cervical cancer.

REP. MICHELE BACHMANN (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Little girls who have a negative reaction to this potentially dangerous drug don't get a mulligan. They don't get a do-over.

ACOSTA: Then she suggested Perry was interested in doing more than saving lives.

BACHMANN: I just wanted to add that we cannot forget that in the midst of this executive order, there was a big drug company that made millions of dollars because of this mandate. We can't deny that.

BLITZER: You've got to respond to that.

PERRY: Yes, sir. The company was Merck, and it was a $5,000 contribution that I had received from them. I raise about $30 million. And if you're saying that I can be bought for $5,000, I'm offended.

ACOSTA: And Perry found himself on the wrong side of the Tea Party when he defended his support for in-state college tuition for the children of illegal immigrants, a policy that got boos from the crowd.

BACHMANN: That is not the American way.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN: That was Jim Acosta.

You know, Mitt Romney led the charge against Rick Perry, but the debate gave other candidates a chance to challenge the view that this a two-person race. Is it? Well, let's find out.

Joining us to talk about the candidates and how they scored is CNN contributor John Avlon, senior political columnist for "Newsweek" and "The Daily Beast."

John, rather than pick a winner, what was your observation last night as far as who improved their chances and who decreased their chances?

JOHN AVLON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, there's no question Rick Perry is the front-runner, because everyone was firing at him. But he did have some unsteady answers, some unsteady performances.

If you were judging this on points, I think you would have to give it to Mitt Romney. He was polished, he was professional, he knew his stuff. And he's been seasoned in political combat before in a presidential campaign. And in some ways, the serious challenges that Rick Perry represents has forced him, who used to be the de facto front-runner, to up his game, to get his character on.

Bachmann did fairly well in terms of playing offense, but I still think that this is right now, effectively a two-person race, with a very interesting broader debate going on.

GRIFFIN: Now, I watched the debate last night, and I believe I saw one candidate actually kill his own potential election. I want to play this bite. Let's go ahead and play this bite from the debate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICK SANTORUM (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And they want to kill us for because of who we are and what we stand for. And we stand for American exceptionalism. We stand for freedom and opportunity for everybody around the world. And I am not ashamed to do that.

(APPLAUSE)

REP. RON PAUL (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: As long as this country follows that idea, we're going to be under a lot of danger. Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda have been explicit --

(BOOING)

PAUL: They have been explicit, and they wrote and said that we attacked America because you had bases on our holy land in Saudi Arabia, you do not give Palestinians a fair treatment, and you have been bombing --

(BOOING)

PAUL: I didn't say that, I'm trying to get you to understand what the motive was behind the bombing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: John, when I saw that -- I mean, in spite of what some New York comics like about Ron Paul, I thought he absolutely killed his chances to win a Republican nomination by insinuating that it was U.S. policy that brought on the attacks of 9/11.

AVLON: Drew, he didn't insinuate it, he said it. And he's said it before.

He said this four years ago when he was running for president then. Ron Paul has been consistent on this, and it's always been a big, big problem.

Some folks like to gloss over the full range portfolio of his policy positions, but I think the larger point is this: by putting that forward right after 9/11, the 10th anniversary, by reminding people, I think it does make people realize that Ron Paul is a baggage of problems, and he's very intellectually influential in terms of shaping the debate in the Republican Party. But those positions do not make him a serious or credible, long-term general election candidate. Them is just the facts.

So, you know, for those of us who lived through 9/11, that kind of statement is deeply offensive. It is what he believes, and that should be part of the debate. But I think the Tea Party got a big wake-up call about the downside of Ron Paul last night.

GRIFFIN: Yes. Let me ask you about Herman Cain, because he's coming on our show later. He seemed to do pretty well, but I'm not sure that the Republican Party is ready for him, as well.

AVLON: Well, Herman Cain has distinguished himself by being a first-rate order in this field, a dynamic presence, able to simplify complex ideas in just type sound bites. But the reality is, is that as great as it is to be a CEO in the run for president, the folks who have tried to approach the Oval Office with that resume don't generally do too well. So, I think while he adds a lot to the debate, and he has some supporters who are very intensely in his corner, he is not a top-tier candidate. Them is just the facts.

GRIFFIN: So we're left with the same two top-tier candidates after this debate, is your reflection on that?

AVLON: Right now, it is a two-person race between a Tea Party Evangelical base for Rick Perry, with executive experience, and Mitt Romney being the more establishment Republican, making essentially a general election argument. The other candidates all have their core constituencies -- Michele Bachmann, Ron Paul, Newt Gingrich, even Herman Cain -- but right now, in terms of the top two, every poll shows it, and the debate dynamic last night bore it out.

This is still a top-two race, two guys fighting it out in the big tent last night, Mitt Romney and Rick Perry.

GRIFFIN: John, thanks. Appreciate it.

John Avlon from New York.

AVLON: Thank you.

GRIFFIN: Well, Herman Cain says if he's elected president, he will bring a sense of humor to the White House because America is too uptight. I'll talk with the former pizza company CEO and presidential candidate, live, during the next hour, right here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: Zero jobs created from the stimulus, stealing money from Medicare to pay for health care reform, those are some of the comments from the Republican presidential debate. Are they true? Our Tom Foreman is going to check the facts.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: Here's a rundown on some of the stories ahead. Up next, a lot of tough talking at the Republican debate last night. Some facts, some fiction. We're checking both.

Then redefining the enemy in Afghanistan. Suzanne Malveaux speaks exclusively to the president there.

And later, unconscious and trapped beneath a flaming wreck. If you haven't seen this, stick around. Wow, these bystanders come to the rescue. You'll see how this one plays out.

We have already a lot of claims tossed back and forth during the Republican presidential debate last night. Are they true? CNN's Tom Foreman separates reality from political rhetoric.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Jobs, jobs, jobs. That's what all the candidates said it was about and they all went after President Obama over this issue of creating jobs. Listen to Governor Rick Perry and the question of whether or not the stimulus helped.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. RICK PERRY (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He had $800 billion worth of stimulus in the first round of stimulus. He created zero jobs. $400 plus billion in this package and I can do the math on that one. Half of zero jobs is going to be zero jobs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOREMAN: That's a big claim when you look at it there. He is saying that the stimulus effectively created zero jobs. The problem is, the Congressional Budget Office, which is still quite respected here despite all these disagreements says that's not the case. It created or saved between 1.4 and 3.3 million jobs. Now that's a big range and it's kind of a squishy term. Created or saved.

But undeniably, other independent economists have said, there's no question, the stimulus spending made employment in this country. It helped some people pay their bills when otherwise they would not be able to.

So as much as the governor would want to say that this is true, it is flat out false. But he wasn't the only one to stray a little bit from the straight and narrow. Listen to what was said by Michele Bachmann about Obamacare, as they like to call it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MICHELE BACHMANN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We know that President Obama stole over $500 billion out of Medicare to switch it over to Obamacare. We also know that Medicare hospital trust fund will be bankrupt within nine years. These are programs that need to be saved to serve people, and in their current form, they can't.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOREMAN: Again, this is a very explosive claim. The notion that the president stole over $500 billion of Medicare. Well, first of all, no, he did not steal it. This is legislation. You may disagree with it, but it is the law. There is nothing illegal or theft involved in something like this. Beyond this, though, you have to have some framing here.

This money was not taken from Medicare in the sense that it was being taken from the benefits that people would get. In fact, this was about trying to control the cost as it grew over the next ten years. Money that would be paid to doctors or hospitals saying that money could be contained and spent in better ways. We're also talking, when she talked about that one particular program about just one of four different programs under the same umbrella. So, again, it would be easy to think it's the whole program, no. It's just one of them and her prediction on when it would go broke was the most dire of the predictions. Others say it could stay around for a longer time.

So, again, as I said, there should be some framing here. She did have a kernel of truth to what she said, but overall, it ended up being misleading.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN: Tom Foreman, checking the facts for us. Thanks, Tom.

Another big moment from the debate last night, Michele Bachmann relentlessly hammering Governor Rick Perry for an executive order that Perry signed that would have forced young girls to get vaccinated against HPV.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PERRY: Parental rights are very important in state of Texas. We do it on a long list of vaccines that are made, but on that particular issue, I will tell you that I made a mistake by not going to the legislature first.

BACHMANN: I'm a mom, and I'm a mom of three children. And to have innocent little 12-year-old girls be forced to have a government injection through an executive order is just flat-out wrong. That should never be done. That's a violation of a liberty interest.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: Well, there's a lot of debate about what Michele Bachmann said. Was it true or not. She also accused Governor Perry of pushing the program because of campaign contributions from the pharmaceutical company Merck that makes that vaccine. Perry says he was trying to prevent young people from getting a deadly cancer.

So a lot of people aren't even sure what HPV is.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: So I'd like to introduce it.

GRIFFIN: Yes. Senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen.

First of all, you were chatting me up during the thing. Nobody was going to be forced to have this vaccination?

COHEN: No, no. So let's be clear about this. What he did, what Perry did in Texas four years ago was he said we're going to mandate that girls get this vaccine to enter sixth grade, but parents can opt out of this mandate, just fill-up a form and your girl won't have to have the shot. So it was a mandate with an opt-out. I'm not real sure that qualifies as a mandate, but that's what it was. It was a mandate with an opt-out.

GRIFFIN: Let's talk just in case -- you know, we have an intelligent audience, but not everybody is up to speed on all the medical news. This vaccine is to prevent cervical cancer down the road for girls.

COHEN: Right.

GRIFFIN: And you get this virus through sexual intercourse.

COHEN: Right. It's sexually transmitted. You don't get it by sneezing on someone or something like that.

GRIFFIN: Right, so it's a touchy subject.

COHEN: It is. And so that's I think one of the reasons why years later we're still talking about this. So HPV played such a starring role in the debate. I want to introduce. I want to show it. It has a face. Let's see what it looks like. There it is.

That is an image, a microscopic image of the Human Papilloma Virus. Sexually transmitted. And there is a vaccine that girls can get or women can get, and it -- what it does is it will prevent most, not all, but many cases of cervical cancer. And 4,000 women a year die of cervical cancer. That's not a big killer in numbers, 4,000, but certainly women do die of cervical cancer.

GRIFFIN: The other thing that came up in the debate from Michele Bachmann was that it might not be safe.

COHEN: Right. She sort of said, she said that some woman -- she told Ali Velshi that a woman came up to her, said her daughter got the shot and got very, very sick from it. The Centers for Disease Control will tell you that it is a safe vaccine. That there are no serious side effects. And if you get the shot and you get sick, that is a coincidence.

There are quite a few people who say that their daughters got the shot and became paralyzed or had some terrible side effect. But experts will tell you that this is a coincidence. It is not cause and effect.

GRIFFIN: What is the law right now in Texas as it deals with this vaccination program? And is it similar to other states?

COHEN: You know, it's interesting. In Texas now, you don't need to get HPV in order to go to school. The way that it works is that the CDC officially recommends it for girls ages around 11 or 12, OK? And then states can decide whether they want to require it for school entry. There are a few states that require it for school entry. Texas is not one of them. So after all that, Texas does not require it for school entry.

Now I know I'm making matters even a little more confusing. For all vaccines, not just HPV, parents can opt out. So I know as a parent, I'm sure you remember this from when your kids were in school, that they said this forms that say your kids got to get vaccinated, but if you really don't want them to get vaccinated, you can fill out another form and file an objection, and your kids doesn't have to get vaccinated so there are opt outs.

GRIFFIN: All right. Elizabeth Cohen, thanks for clearing that up.

COHEN: Thank you.

GRIFFIN: OK, take care.

The U.S. embassy in Afghanistan attacked by the Taliban in the latest of several high-profile incidents there.

Suzanne Malveaux sat down with Afghan President Hamid Karzai. Find out why his government is in talks with the Taliban.

Suzanne joins us live from Kabul right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: The Taliban had launched a brazen attack targeting the U.S. embassy in Afghanistan's capital along with other high-profile coalition organizations.

(VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: Rocket-propelled grenades, machine guns, and other light weapons were echoing through the city. An Afghan official says one police officer and three militants have been killed. The U.S. embassy spokeswoman tells CNN there are no casualties among embassy staff.

Let's go to Suzanne Malveaux who is near the embassy right now.

Suzanne, is it still going on? Is this attack still in progress?

MALVEAUX: It is still in progress, but really there's not much left to it. You only have one insurgent out of the four that remains inside of that building who is resisting. The other three have been killed. But the people who are inside the U.S. embassy are still on lockdown. They're not leaving until police, the military, the international coalition is assured that you don't have another one of those insurgents that's out there that could potentially kill Americans or others who are in this region. So it is still going on.

They are trying to find this fourth individual to make sure that they are taken care of, as well. I tell you we went on the streets earlier today and we saw what one of those insurgents looked like. He was in the back of a pickup truck being taken to a military hospital. And he had been shot. He was killed. And so they are very serious about this.

This has been something that's going on for seven hours now. It's been a very chaotic, a very tense situation. The good news, Drew, is that they did not enter or in any way enter or impede the compound, the barrier there, for the U.S. embassy, for NATO, for coalition, for the intelligence offices of the Afghan officials here. That is the good news.

The bad news, of course, a lot of fear, a lot of frustration on the streets, when they realize that the Taliban insurgents were able to get that close and carry out such a bold attack. The numbers are small, Drew, when you look at it, when you think about it. The casualties, the fatalities, the numbers are small, but symbolically, this is very important.

It's very significant because what the Taliban strategy is is to try to show that they can hit in the heart of the security system here in the capital, in Kabul, among all the powerbrokers. And that is exactly what they were able to do today, Drew.

GRIFFIN: Suzanne, this makes it all the more challenging for a lot of us to understand just why the Afghan government is negotiating with the Taliban. You talked to Hamid Karzai yesterday about this. What is he trying to do there?

MALVEAUX: Well, sure. And it's not just the Afghan government that's negotiating with the Taliban. It's actually the U.S. government that's also negotiating with the Taliban. And an international group of leaders who are negotiating, talking now with the Taliban.

Essentially the Obama administration, the strategy now is to kill as many Taliban insurgents and fighters as possible. But negotiate and talk with those who they believe are reasonable. That will put down their weapons and somehow establish some sort of peace.

So, yes, I talked with the Afghan, President Hamid Karzai yesterday. And essentially asked him, you know, what's the Taliban offering here? What are they giving up? Are they cooperating -- are you hearing anything from this group that would lead you to believe that they will work together in some sort of peaceful way.

And here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: Are you currently negotiating now with the Taliban?

HAMID KARZAI, PRESIDENT OF AFGHANISTAN: We are engaged in a process of peace building in which both our international partners, the United States and Britain, and other countries and also the Afghan peace council are busy talking with some elements of the Taliban.

MALVEAUX: Is the Taliban offering anything now? Are they cooperating? Are they saying we are going to renounce violence, we're going to give rights -- equal rights to women? What are you hearing from the Taliban?

KARZAI: Some of them are, yes, some of them are willing to talk. Some of them are feeling very much that this country is suffering and that this country's suffering must end. Afghans, they'd like to see this country do better.

MALVEAUX: What's the timetable here? How fast do you think they'll say, OK, we agree to these terms, there'll be peace?

KARZAI: As far as a desire on our part is concerned, the timetable is as soon as possible.

MALVEAUX: What does that mean?

KARZAI: It means if it can be done tomorrow, we'd welcome it. But as far as the reality on the ground is concerned, it's surely going to take time.

MALVEAUX: Months, years?

KARZAI: Well, perhaps more than months, maybe a year or two, that, too, if we can have a proper understanding with our neighbors in Pakistan, with Iran.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: And so, a year or two is what he's talking about here. It's not accidental, if you will, that this timetable matches what we're seeing the timetable for U.S. and NATO combat troops to withdraw from Afghanistan by the end of 2014.

So, what they're trying to do is really negotiate here with the Taliban to set up some sort of deal, some power-sharing deal, and peace in Afghanistan. At the same time, pull out these combat troops, train the Afghans to take care of themselves.

And then you have a separate track that's happening, too, which is that the United States and Afghanistan are also talking, negotiating about a long-term plan after 2014, to have some sort of significant presence here on the ground for training, for advising, and for military, as well, to make sure that this place is a stable place going into the future -- Drew.

GRIFFIN: All of it going on today as the Taliban brazenly goes into the capital and stages this attack.

Suzanne Malveaux, live from Afghanistan -- thanks, Suzanne.

Well, it's Romney versus Perry on Social Security rounds two of their battle. It played out during last night's debate. We're going to have the details coming up in our political update.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: Rick Perry was in the crosshairs of the CNN Tea Party debate last night.

Mark Preston and Peter Hamby, part of "The Best Political Team on Television," are live from Tampa, where the debate was held. Mark, did Mitt Romney's Social Security attacks on Perry do any major damage?

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL EDITOR: Well, you know, Drew, we expected that was going to happen. And right out of the gate, we saw Mitt Romney go right after the Texas governor.

But, you know, you have to give Rick Perry some credit, he was able to walk back what he said last week regarding Social Security. He was able to walk that back and I think mitigated some damage.

We saw Mitt Romney go after him hard and he will continue to do so, especially in a state like Florida where we are right now, where there's a lot of seniors down here.

I've got to tell you, though, Drew, it wasn't necessarily Social Security last night for the Texas governor. It was having to do with the mandates and also having to do with illegal immigration. And Rick Perry was not only taking it from Mitt Romney, he was also taking it from Michele Bachmann.

GRIFFIN: Peter, the immigration thing is something I want to ask you about because his record on immigration, that would be very important, especially to Tea Parties or just conservative Republicans.

PETER HAMBY, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Absolutely, Texas is, you know, Ground Zero for the battle about illegal immigration.

I think what Mark mentioned, none of the Michele Bachmann, Rick Santorum, a lot of these candidates went right after Mitt Romney -- excuse me, Rick Perry. While they didn't deliver a knockout blow, they did raise some questions. And, again, on illegal immigration, you know, they attacked him for the Texas Dream Act which he signed in 2001 which basically gives instate tuition credits to the children of illegal immigrants as long as they are working towards citizenship.

But when Perry defended that, he said, you know, these children came here, they should have a chance to become citizens and go to college like everybody else no matter what your last name sounds like. To the Republican base, that sounds a lot like John McCain and Ted Kennedy when they are pushing the Senate immigration back in 2005 and 2007. That's not language they like to hear, even though Rick Perry said it was a state issue rather than a federal one.

So, you can expect to see that Republican candidates keep pressing Rick Perry on his record. There's a lot in there, a decade worth of stuff for these candidates to mine through as we head forward to a number of debates, Drew.

GRIFFIN: Yes, guys, they are arranged on the stage based by poll numbers, the stronger you are, the more towards the middle you are -- obviously, those guys on the fringes are trying to fight their way up. I thought Santorum may have held on there.

But the guy on the other end, Jon Huntsman, does he continue on from here? HAMBY: Well, Jon Huntsman had a somewhat difficult night. He came up with a strong debate performance the last time. Huntsman kind of has a Tim Pawlenty problem at the moment, which is that he makes jokes that seem to fall flat and you can tell the audience, which is really emblematic of the Republican base at this point, wasn't really feeling him.

But, Drew, you nailed it. He was trying to insert himself into the debate, again, turning back to Utah's really strong record on job creation. And he even tried to go to the right of Rick Perry on border security when Rick Perry, you know, expressed some skepticism about whether border fence a long would be enough to stop illegal immigration. Huntsman said that would be treasonous but it kind of fell flat in the room, I think, Drew.

GRIFFIN: Yes. I thought it was a little forced.

Anyway, guys, Peter, Mark, thanks a lot. It was a good debate, that's for sure. And for the latest political news, you know where to go, CNNPolitics.com.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: You've been weighing in on our "Talk Back" question of the day. Is it time to walk back tax deductions?

Carol Costello joins us from New York with the responses -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Hey, Drew.

Today's question, as you said, is it time to walk back tax deduction?

This from Elliot, "We need to give major tax breaks to the middle and lower classes and small business. Major companies, oil companies, et cetera, need to pay higher taxes. It's obscene that as our economy suffers, they record, record profits."

This from Chris, "Democrats had two years of control and look at where we are today. The Democrats did not focus on jobs and only passed far left legislation that has nothing to do -- that has done nothing, rather, to improve our economy. How much time should people give them?"

And this from Paul, "It's time to simplify the tax code. The more complicated something is, the easier it is to find loopholes. Drastically reducing deductions will ensure everyone pays."

And this from G.I. Jane, "Flat taxes. Everyone pays. No exceptions."

Facebook.com/CarolCNN if you like to continue the conversation. I'll be back with you in about 15 minutes.

GRIFFIN: Thanks, Carol. Look forward to it. In Utah, an accident leaves a biker trapped under a burning car and bystanders rush in to save him. We'll show you how this played out.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRIFFIN: Let's go "X Country" now to see what stories are happening at our affiliates.

In Logan, Utah, look at this scene. A man gets stuck under a burning car after his motorcycle crashes. Several people rush to help, lifting the car and pulling this guy to safety. He is now in stable condition.

Take a look at that. That is incredible stuff as all of these people rush in there to -- wow, there he goes. Pull him right out. He's in stable condition.

Next stop, Pennsylvania. Ten Mile Creek Bridge near Uniontown was imploded to make room for a new bridge. That bridge carried people across Route 88 across that creek.

Finally, in New Jersey, the wings of the "Miracle on the Hudson" plane are on the way to the Aviation Museum in Charlotte, North Carolina. Remember that plane? It was the one, the US Airways flight that Captain Chesley Sullenberger safely crash-landed in the Hudson River after it was struck by birds coming out of New York.