Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

End of 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell'; No Clemency for Georgia Death Row Inmate Troy Davis; Tyler Perry: Bad for Blacks?; Israel and The Palestinians; Palestinian Statehood on U.N. Agenda; Parole Board Denies Clemency for Davis; "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" Policy Ends Today; Nancy Grace Does the Cha-Cha; Deadly Anti-Government Protests in Yemen; Interview With Rob Reiner

Aired September 20, 2011 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: It is a new hour in a new day for equality in the U.S. military. Today, a policy enacted by President Clinton in 1993 is officially repealed.

"Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is no more. Gay men and women can now serve openly in every branch of service, and thousands of service members who were kicked out when their secrets leaked out can try to re-enlist. Though as we heard last hour, there's really no guarantee they can pick right up where they left off.

Defense Secretary Leon Panetta and Joint Chiefs Mike Mullen are briefing reporting live right now at the Pentagon.

Let's listen in for just a moment.

LEON PANETTA, DEFENSE SECRETARY: As secretary of defense, I'm committed to removing all the barriers that would prevent Americans from serving their country and from rising to the highest level of responsibility that their talents and capabilities warrant. These are men and women who put their lives on the line in defense of this country, and that's what should matter the most.

I want to thank the repeal implementation team and the service secretaries, along with the service chiefs, for all of their efforts to ensure that DOD is ready to make this change consistent with standards of military readiness, with military effectiveness, with unit cohesion, and with the recruiting and retention of the armed forces. All of the service chiefs have stated very clearly that all of these elements have been met in the review that they conducted. Over 97 percent of our 2.3 million men and women in uniform have now received education and training on repeal as a result of these efforts.

I also want to thank the comprehensive review working group for the work they did on the report that laid the groundwork for the change in this policy. And, above all, I'd like to single out the person who's next to me at this table, Admiral Mike Mullen. His courageous testimony and leadership on this issue I think were major factors in bringing us to this day, and he deserves a great deal of credit for what has occurred.

Let me also, if I can, give you a quick update on the defense budget and where that stands at this point.

As you know, the department has been --

KAYE: You've been listening there to Defense Secretary Leon Panetta thanking those for their work to repeal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell." And in just a few minutes, you'll meet an Iraq War vet and former congressman who helped make "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" a thing of the past. Patrick Murphy joins me live at 10 past the hour.

Twenty years on death row, three execution dates set and then scrapped. Today, though, Troy Davis looks all but certain to face lethal injection at 7:00 p.m. Eastern Time tomorrow.

The Georgia Board of Pardons and Paroles is rejecting Davis' last-ditch appeal for clemency, despite a global campaign promoting doubt in the evidence against him. At trial, the state relied almost entirely on witness testimony, and seven out of nine witnesses who implicated Davis have since recanted or changed their stories.

Amnesty International is one of several groups that has lobbied, rallied and collected hundreds of thousands of signatures on Davis' behalf. In light of today's decision, it says, and I quote, "Allowing a man to be sent to death under an enormous cloud of doubt about his guilt is an outrageous affront to justice."

This much is certain: a 27-year-old former Army Ranger and Savannah, Georgia, police officer was killed while trying to protect a homeless man from attackers who wanted his beer. Over the years, Mark MacPhail's family has never wavered in believing Troy Davis is guilty and demanding his sentence be fulfilled.

CNN's David Mattingly was at that parole board hearing yesterday. He joins me now with the fallout of all of this.

So it sounds like he does have a date here, and it looks like it's finally going to happen this time.

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The fourth time does seem to be the most certain. His followers right now have a couple of options that they're going to try. They're both long shots.

They're trying to pressure the D.A. in the county where this crime happened to go to the judge who signed the execution warrant to get that judge to try and rescind that order. That's a tremendous long shot. They're also going back to the Board of Pardons and Paroles to try to get them to rescind their order and grant clemency. That board has never done that. It's probably not going to happen.

KAYE: What do you think was it? I know that there were a lot of people who testified yesterday before this board. What do you think was the testimony that turned the board this way?

MATTINGLY: They did have, at the very end -- the last word belonged to the family of Mark MacPhail, the officer who was killed here. They heard from the prosecutors and then they heard from MacPhail's family. That's probably what resonated with them the most, because they did spend half the day listening to the attorneys for Davis go over line by line every argument they had about this. And Davis' attorneys came out of there thinking that they were listened to, that they got their points across. But in the end, it was this board sticking with this prosecution that has lasted now for 20 years.

KAYE: And I know that from what I understand, the murdered officer's daughter spoke with that board?

MATTINGLY: Yes. It was very emotional. The family all came out together, the wife, the two children, the mother. They all came out and said they were looking for justice and -- well, let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOAN MACPHAIL-HARRIS, MARK MACPHAIL'S WIDOW: No time is easy when you have to go before the Pardons and Paroles Board, but we feel like we got to say what we needed to say, they heard what we had to say. They heard the truth, which is the most important part, and I believe that they will probably favor in our favor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: And that was yesterday. This family's been through this now for 20 years. This is the fourth time. They are predicting an execution of this man.

KAYE: And so, supporters, though, they are still not giving up?

MATTINGLY: They're not giving up. They're planning a public demonstration tonight, they're planning some more demonstrations tomorrow.

You've heard about their plans for whatever appeals they can possibly muster up. Everything they can possibly do right now between now and 7:00 tomorrow night, they're going to do it.

KAYE: All right. David Mattingly, thank you. Appreciate that.

(NEWSBREAK)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: More now on one of our top stories, the end to one of the most controversial policies in U.S. military history. "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" forced thousands of gays and lesbians out of the military since it was implemented in 1993. The man who led the congressional effort to repeal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is former Democratic congressman Patrick Murphy. He's a combat veteran of the Iraq War. He's currently running for the Democratic nomination for Pennsylvania attorney general, and he joins us now from Philadelphia.

Patrick Murphy, thank you so much for coming on the show.

Start, if you will, by telling us what your reaction is to this historic day.

PATRICK MURPHY, FMR. DEMOCRATIC CONGRESSMAN: Well, thanks, Randi, for having me on.

Today is an incredible step on a journey to end discrimination in our military and in our country. Today is a testament to the hard work of heroes like Lieutenant Colonel Victor Farenbach (ph), a University of Notre Dame graduate, a combat fighter pilot.

Actually, when I was in Iraq in 2003 and 2004 with the 82nd Airborne Division, he was actually controlling the skies in Baghdad. I mean, he's an American hero, and yet, after doing so many combat missions, someone found out that he had a loved one back at home, a man, and they turned him in, and unfortunately he had desk duty. They took him off those sorties.

And that's wrong. And there are so many others that were thrown out just like Victor Farenbach (ph). And Randi, that's why we fought so hard to make today a reality.

KAYE: How do you expect this to go through? I mean, in terms of how will it be accepted? And do you anticipate any problems in implementing the new policy?

MURPHY: I don't expect any problems, Randi. And you know why? Because we have the best military in the world.

You know, these young heroes, these 18, 19, 20-year-old heroes, who take an oath to support and defend that Constitution, they are willing to take a bullet for the defense of our nation. They are the most professional and lethal fighting force in the world.

You know, there's 26 other countries that allow their members, their countrymen, to serve openly. To say that the American military forces aren't as professional as those 26 other countries isn't true.

And, you know, these heroes -- when I served in Iraq, when I was with the 82nd Airborne Division, Randi, we didn't care what race you were, what religion you had, what sex you were. We didn't care who you were writing letters home to. We cared whether or not you could handle your assault rifle, could you do your job so we could all come home alive?

KAYE: So what do you say to those in the military who are still, to this day are, against this, concerned about their privacy, concerned about what might happen? What do you want to say to them?

MURPHY: Well, and let me be very clear. I mean, there's training that has already happened, and I know earlier, just about 10 minutes ago you had Secretary Panetta on, and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Admiral Mullen. Ninety-seven percent of these troops have already been trained.

If there's misconduct or if there's anything that goes wrong, it doesn't matter if you're gay or straight. Turn them in. That's why we have the Uniform Code of Military Justice. That's why we have Army or Marine Corps or Navy or Air Force regulations.

There's already rules in place. The fact is this: is that there are folks that sense that they didn't necessarily agree with the policy, and I get that. That's America. No one is ever going to agree on anything.

But there was a decision made by the commander-in-chief and now executed by the military leaders of our country. And I have all the full faith and confidence in these young heroes.

KAYE: I've got to say, though, you know, I hear you talk about training. I mean, did we have to train our military members to fight alongside an African-American soldier, to fight alongside anybody else? I mean, doesn't it appear just so bizarre to you that we have to train our military to work alongside these folks?

MURPHY: Well, it's training meaning it's a briefing, frankly, Randi. It's not like --

KAYE: But still --

MURPHY: -- military training where -- I know. But you know what? Some folks want the training to happen, so they made training happen. And it's really these proper briefings.

But we had already had these briefings, by the way, already to -- basically, when these young heroes come into the military, we are taught at an early age -- you know, I joined at 19 back in 1993 -- that we all wear the color green, that we all bleed red, that we do this to support and defend the Constitution, to win our nation's wars.

KAYE: Yes.

MURPHY: We have to put all our personal preferences aside, what part of the country you're from, what religion you are. It doesn't make a difference. What makes a difference is, are you dog the job to protect the families and our great country?

KAYE: Patrick Murphy, appreciate your time today. Thank you.

MURPHY: Thanks, Randi.

KAYE: Coming up, Tyler Perry's success in the entertainment industry has become a very divisive topic. Is his success a step in the right direction toward more diversity in the entertainment industry, or is there a problem with his message?

We'll discuss that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: Tyler Perry. He is the highest paid man in Hollywood, according to "Forbes." Thanks to five movies he produced over the past two years and two TV series, Perry earned $130 million between May, 2010, and May, 2011. He's known for producing movies primarily for black audiences, but a growing number of critics in the black community take issue with Perry's work, including director Spike Lee.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SPIKE LEE, DIRECTOR: Each artist should be allowed to pursue their artistic endeavor, but I still think there a lot of stuff that's on today is coonery buffoonery. And I know it's making a lot of money --

(APPLAUSE)

LEE: -- and breaking records, but we can do better.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAYE: Perry defends his material, saying that he shares a positive message. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TYLER PERRY, PRODUCER: All these characters are, are bait -- disarming, charming, make you laugh bait. So I can slap Madea in something and talk about God, love, faith, forgiveness, family, any of those things. You know?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAYE: So is Tyler Perry's success a win for black Hollywood? And does it have further implications for racial politics?

Joining us are finance professor Boyce Watkins and commentator Toure.

Thank you both for coming on the show.

Toure, let me start with you.

You just wrote your book, "Who's Afraid of Post-Blackness: What it Means to Be Black Now," a great book. We'll talk about that one in just a moment. But you've been saying that Perry doesn't really create a good product.

I wanted to share a clip here, along with our viewers, a clip from "Madea Goes to Jail," and then get your reaction to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "MADEA GOES TO JAIL")

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Honey, you're in jail because of what you did. Learn how to take some responsibility for yourself, for your own stuff. I can't stand folk who want to be the victim. This person did this, that's why I'm this way. Everybody in this place has got a story.

(END VIDEO CLIP, "MADEA GOES TO JAIL")

KAYE: All right. So you look at that scene, Toure, it seems kind of positive. TOURE: Is it done, Randi? Because I wasn't watching. Is it done? Is the clip done?

I mean, like, look, Tyler Perry is one of if not the worst director in Hollywood. He's willfully ignorant of the craft, and I can think of no aspect of the filmmaking craft that he excels at, certainly not acting or writing or cinematography or directing or set design. He perhaps excels at marketing, but that's not really a filmmaking craft.

But what is really dangerous about the product he puts out is that he's celebrating a certain victimhood. I see this especially in "For Colored Girls," which was a fantastic play, but a horrible movie, and celebrating this victimhood and sort of telling black women that it's OK to feel like a victim and to wallow in the pain of your life. It's just a really horrible message. It's like cinematic malt liquor for the masses.

KAYE: All right.

Let me get Dr. Watkins in here.

I know that you think that Perry actually has a pretty good message here, somewhere in there.

DR. BOYCE WATKINS, FINANCE PROFESSOR, SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY: Well, you know, I've never had malt liquor before, but I will say that Tyler Perry -- you know, you have to be disturbed about any black man who makes that much money by putting on a dress. I mean, there's a historical context that has to be thought about.

But Tyler Perry is not Lil Wayne. He's not giving some sort of prepackaged message for self-destruction or anything like that. At worst, Tyler Perry, he has been able to ride a little bit of the Flavor Flav model of economic empowerment by sort of presenting these characters that are a little bit problematic.

But if you look deeper at Perry's message, you see that these characters really are bait, as Tyler says. And when I analyze his movies -- remember, I started off as a huge critic of Tyler Perry, but when I watched his movies, I saw what he was doing.

He was using comedy to educate the masses. And then you have to even go further and realize that if you look at the country -- and we have 17 percent black unemployment and all these other things going on -- Tyler Perry is in Atlanta creating jobs, he's doing something that nobody else in black Hollywood has been able to do. So when we talk about victimhood, look at black Hollywood. You have so many actors and actresses complaining that they can't find jobs.

KAYE: Yes.

WATKINS: Well, Tyler Perry is creating jobs, which I think is a beautiful thing.

KAYE: So, Toure -- TOURE: You know, it's interesting.

KAYE: -- why do you think he's so successful?

TOURE: Just one thing I want to point out, that drug dealers also create jobs, but we're not giving them credit for creating jobs. Just creating jobs is not enough.

WATKINS: But he's not a drug dealer, though. Come on.

TOURE: He's creating bad jobs. And --

(CROSSTALK)

KAYE: But you can't argue -- Toure, you can't argue with his success. I mean, he's had films open up number one and two. So why the successes?

TOURE: Well, I mean, McDonald's sells a lot of hamburgers. Does that make it good food or good for you? No.

Tyler Perry is definitely serving an audience that is underserved by Hollywood. Especially black southern women do not see themselves at all in Hollywood fare. So, when he's serving them movies where they appear to be in situations that are naturalistic and recognizable to them, and definitely have that Christian message, I absolutely understand why my grandmother, my mother, and my aunts love this stuff. And my family down South, why they love this stuff.

I just can't watch it without cringing, because I've actually seen good movies and I know these are poorly-made films.

KAYE: All right. I want to switch gears here, because we do have one other topic that I want to talk about with you guys before we run out of time here.

Toure, in your book you discuss how blackness has many definitions. It can't be boiled down to one thing. But then you have the Congressional Black Caucus saying that Obama isn't doing enough for the black community.

So, is blackness, do you think, being too narrowly defined here?

TOURE: Well, I think there you see modern blackness at play in that the Congressional Black Caucus is arguing with and disappointed in Barack Obama. And they're not just going to support him, or he's not just going to support their agenda.

We have the right and the ability to disagree in public, and it's not traitorous to disagree in public this way. But also, you see Barack Obama cannot be seen to be a black president. He doesn't do the presidency in a black way. He does the presidency as a human being, with his ideas coming from where he wants to come from.

And he certainly can never be seen to be doing something special for the black community. So in that way, we kind of lose something with a Barack Obama presidency, where a Bill Clinton or even a George Bush, who put two black people in the secretary of state chair, they can do things for black people that he feels uncomfortable to be able to do.

KAYE: Dr. Watkins, how much would you say that the black community matters in the next election, and the president's relationship with the black community?

WATKINS: The black community matters quite a bit. I mean, we gave President Obama one-fifth of the votes he needed in order to be elected.

I think what you see really going on is huge political education going on in the black community. We're constantly talking about this at "Your Black World," and what I've seen is the momentum has really shifted against the president, unfortunately.

In the beginning you had a lot of people who put their picture of Obama right next to Martin Luther King and Jesus. And now you've got people wondering why the economic situation for African-Americans has gotten worse, while it's actually gotten a little better for white America.

And everyone kind of goes back to three years ago, when the president said that the rising tide will lift all boats when it comes to solving the black joblessness problem. But the thing is that we can't get to a point where we're so afraid and so ashamed of connecting to the black community, that we continue to just neglect the black community.

So I think that voices of dissent against the president are not traitors, they are simply democratic. But I think voices of support for the president are simply saying look, we love you so much, we want you to succeed, but we need you to do a good job. And I think that's OK as well.

KAYE: All right. We'll have to leave it there.

Dr. Watkins, Toure, thank you both for coming on.

And I do want to mention as well that we did invite Tyler Perry to come on for this discussion as well, but he did decline our request.

Coming up, presidents have tried and failed on this issue: brokering peace between Israel and the Palestinians. Wolf Blitzer walks us through key historic moments when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: The Israeli/Palestinian conflict is heating up on the diplomatic front in New York. The standoff that's shaping up at the United Nations over the Palestinian statehood has put a spotlight on President Obama.

Remember this statement last year? (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: When we come back here next year, we could have an agreement that will lead to a new member of the United Nations, an independent, sovereign state of Palestine living in peace with Israel.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAYE: President Obama failed to meet that goal. Now his policies in the Mideast are being called into question. But efforts to broker peace between Israel and the Palestinians have a long, complicated history. Past presidents have tackled the issue, but clearly their efforts failed as well.

Wolf Blitzer takes a look back.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Bill Clinton brings Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin and Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat to the south lawn of the White House for the signing ceremony of the Oslo Accords. There was a dramatic handshake. At the time, nearly everyone was optimistic that it wouldn't take all that long to resolve the key issues in the Israeli/Palestine peace process, including refugees, settlements, Jerusalem, and borders.

That optimism was misplaced.

November 4, 1995, Rabin is assassinated by a Jewish extremist.

YASSER ARAFAT, PALESTINIAN LEADER: I'm very sad and very shocked for this awful and terrible crime.

BLITZER: Early 1996, Israel is struck by a series of Palestinian terror attacks and suicide bombings. And by May, Israelis elect a hard-liner as their prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu.

October 23, 1998, President Clinton tries again. He invites Netanyahu and Arafat to the Wye River Plantation in Maryland. It winds up with another ceremony at the White House, but progress is limited.

WILLIAM JEFFERSON CLINTON, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There can be no success without principled compromise. The road to peace, as always, is a two-way street.

BLITZER: Just as he's wrapping up eight years in the White House, Bill Clinton gives it one more try, this time engaging Arafat and then-Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak at Camp David outside Washington. Barak was willing to give up all of Gaza and most of the West Bank.

That territory would then become the new Palestinian state. But as Clinton later told me in an interview Arafat rejected that proposal, insisting on a complete withdrawal. September 2000, the second Palestinian begins then all the key players start changing.

In early 2001, George W. Bush becomes president of the United States and Sharon is elected prime minister of Israel. In 2003, the road map to peace is proposed of the Mideast Quartet composed of the United States, the United Nations, Russia and the European Union.

November 2004, Arafat dies and Mahmoud Abbas also known as Abu Mazin becomes chairman of the PLO. In 2005, Sharon unilaterally expels Jewish settlers and withdraws Israeli security forces from Gaza.

ARIEL SHARON, FORMER ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER (through translator): The world is awaiting the Palestinian response. A hand held out in peace or fire. We will respond to an outstretched hand with the olive branch. However, we will respond to terrorism forcefully.

BLITZER: In 2006, Hamas, which the U.S. and the Europeans consider a terrorist group, wins Palestinian elections and takes over the Gaza strip. Abbas and the Palestinian authority which control the west bank won't allow Hamas to get involved in any peacemaking efforts or decisions. November 2008, America elects a new president who promises change.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: To those who seek peace and security, we support you.

BLITZER: In June 2009, Barack Obama pushes his vision for a more democratic Middle East right in the heart of Egypt.

OBAMA: I do have an unyielding belief that all people yearn for certain things. The ability to speak your mind and have a say in how you are governed.

BLITZER: In 2011, the Arab Spring begins transforming the Middle East. May 2011, President Obama publicly goes further than any American president before him with this pronouncement.

OBAMA: We believe the borders of Israel and Palestine should be based on the 1967 lines with mutually agreed swipes.

BLITZER: Prime Minister Netanhayu calls the 1967 borders indefensible and relations between the two allies are tested. Wolf Blitzer, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: President Obama is expected to sit down with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at the U.N. this week. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas will submit his membership request to the U.N. on Friday.

The Palestinians have the support of a majority of the countries in the Security Council and General Assembly, but the U.S. has pledged to veto that measure.

HLN's Nancy Grace was among the performers last night in this year's premiere episode of "Dancing with the Stars." Up next, we'll tell you about Nancy's cha-cha.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: Now let's get you caught up on some of the stories you may have missed. The Georgia Board of Pardons and Paroles denied clemency today for death row inmate Troy Davis. The decision came one day after a last-minute appeal by Davis.

Since his conviction in 1991, seven of nine witnesses have recanted their testimonies, sparking a worldwide clemency campaign. Davis is set to die by lethal injection for the 1989 murder of Police Officer Mark MacPhail. His execution, delayed three times, now scheduled for 7:00 p.m. tomorrow.

The Pentagon has officially ended its "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy in place since 1993. It now welcomes gays and lesbians to openly serve in the military. And the estimated 13,000 service members kicked out under the old policy can now apply to re-enlist.

The 13th season of ABC's "Dancing with the Stars" kicked off Monday night. We got a chance to see our very own Nancy Grace -- there she is -- come from behind the anchor desk and do a pretty darn impressive cha-cha. After facing the judges, Nancy said this about her routine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HLN'S "NANCY GRACE": The main thing I feel is great that we got through the dance and Tristan did such a great job. He really led me through it, which is wonderful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAYE: Woo! Look at her go. You can catch Nancy and her all-star cast next week on "Dancing with the Stars."

Before Oprah, there was Zernona Clayton, Atlanta Mayor Casim Reed and members of the Atlanta city council were on hand to honor the broadcast icon. The first black woman to have her own television show.

Mrs. Clayton, the founder, president and CEO of the Trumpet Awards Foundation has dedicated her life to promoting racial understanding and worked closely with the Dr. King Jr. and his wife, Careta.

She also served Turner Broadcasting for 30 years as corporate vice president for urban affairs. Zerona Clayton began her TV career in 1967 and became the south's first black person to have her own television show.

Coming up, bloodshed in the streets Yemen. Is this key U.S. ally in the fight against al Qaeda on the verge of an all-all civil war? We'll tackle that and other questions in a live report right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: Human rights groups in Yemen today accuse government troops of firing on peaceful antigovernment protestors. At least two people were killed in the capital sauna.

The death toll since the start of the latest government crackdown on Sunday now stands at nearly 60. For months protestors have been trying to force the resignation of hard line president, Ali Abdullah Saleh. A key U.S. ally in the fight against al Qaeda linked militants in Yemen.

Mohammed Jamjoom is closely following developments for us from Oman and joins us now. Mohammed, what's the latest on the fighting and reports that a cease-fire may actually now be in place?

MOHAMMED JAMJOOM, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Randi, earlier in the day activists and eyewitnesses in Sanaa and other cities throughout Yemen were saying that it was the third day of carnage. They were really concerned that the country was tipping into all out civil was because the clashes were so fierce.

In the past couple of hours, we've heard that the vice president in Sanaa who's been empowered by the president to act on his behalf has called for a ceasefire amongst the warring parties. Now while I spoken to a Yemeni government official who said that he believes that all these warring factions are now in some sort of gentlemen's agreement and the clashes have stopped for the most part.

The residents that I'm speaking to there in the past hour are saying that in fact they don't quite believe that a cease-fire is in effect. They're still hearing a lot of shelling, a lot of loud explosions. It's not as fierce as it was earlier in the day, but they worry it will pick up later on in the evening and it will get bad in the overnight hours. Randi --

KAYE: Who exactly is involved in this fighting? I mean, has this come down to rival tribes?

JAMJOOM: Well, Randi, we have had situations in Yemen in the past few months where rival tribes have clashed in the streets of certain cities, this particular round of fighting is between two different factions of military units.

You have the Republican Guard, this is an elite military unit controlled by the son of Yemen's president. They're fighting with military units loyal to a general who defected from the ranks of the president joined the Revolutionary Movement a few months ago.

His forces, the forces that are loyal to this general, have been out on the streets of the capital trying to protect the antigovernment demonstrators so that they don't come under fire from the security forces there.

So it's a very volatile mix of groups in the streets of the capital and because these two factions with a lot of firepower between them are fighting each other, you have thousands and thousands of people caught in the middle.

A lot of innocent bystanders, protestors, they're the ones that are really in harm's way right now. That's why you have such a high casualty figure the past few days.

KAYE: I want to ask you about the president before I let you go because he's obviously still, as far as we know, he's still in Saudi Arabia, recovering from the assassination attempt. Is there any word on his condition or when he might return to Yemen?

JAMJOOM: Well, by most accounts, diplomats both Yemeni and from other countries in the region, they say President Saleh's health has really improved. We've seen pictures of him in the past of weeks where he does look like he's gotten much stronger, that his burns have recovered, his wounds are getting much better.

He's seen walking around. President Saleh keeps vowing to return to Yemen even though, you know, so many countries and so many groups are calling on him not to because they believe that if he does return, the situation will get even more chaotic.

But just yesterday, we saw President Saleh meeting with Saudi King Abdullah. He was thanking the Saudi king for his help in his recovery and the Saudi king was calling on all the different Yemeni factions to try to sign some sort of mediation agreement so the political crisis would come to an end.

That being said, though, not a lot of hope that even if some kind of power transfer deal is signed, it will resolve the crisis. It's gotten so bad, especially in the past few days, so many people out on the streets and vowing to keep continuing to come out on the streets. They don't believe that President Saleh signing any type of piece of paper is really going to resolve this anytime soon. Randi --

KAYE: Mohammed Jamjoom in Oman. Mohammed, thank you.

Coming up, a hot button legal issue makes its way to a Broadway stage. With an all-had star a-list cast, one of those stars, Rob Ryaner, the man right there joins us next to talk about the play called "Eight."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: The theater was jam-packed for last night's sold-out Broadway premiere of the new play, "8," a play all about Proposition 8, the California ban on gay marriage. Written by Oscar-winning screenwriter Dustin Lance Black, "8" chronicles last year's federal challenge to the ban with courtroom transcripts. It was a seminal case deeming Prop 8 unconstitutional. Last night's reading boasted an A-list cast, including Morgan Freeman, John Lithgow, Ellen Barkin, and my next guest, award-winner director, actor and producer Rob Reiner.

Rob, thank you so much for coming on the show. Up until this play --

ROB REINER, ACTOR, DIRECTOR AND PRODUCER: My pleasure, Randi. KAYE: Up until this play, no one really knew exactly what went on inside that courtroom. So tell me about "8" and why it was so important to you to tell this story.

REINER: Well, we feel that this is the last big piece of the civil rights puzzle that is being put into place. The gay community is the one community in America that is treated less under the law. And we took -- we brought a federal lawsuit to Proposition 8, which was the initiative that passed in California disallowing gays to marry. They had had that right. We felt it was unconstitutional. We brought it to court with David Boies and Ted Olson, the two guys that opposed each other in Bush v Gore. They teamed up, and we won the case in a federal court.

Now, there were cameras in the court, but the Supreme Court said that we were not allowed to show those videotapes, nobody was allowed to see what happened in there. We felt that this is a very important case, along the lines of Brown Versus the Board of Education, and we felt it was important that people know what happened inside that courtroom and that the opposition, the proponents of Prop 8, had no legal grounds, that the initiative was deemed unconstitutional.

They presented no evidence. They showed no reason why gays and lesbians should not be married not only in California but throughout the country.

KAYE: Right.

REINER: We -- Lance Black put this play together so that we -- and he took a compilation of all of the evidence and the transcripts of the trial, and we put it on on Broadway to let people see what happened in that courtroom.

KAYE: And what was the reaction? How did the audience respond?

REINER: Oh, it was astounding. I mean, you know, we were obviously preaching in some degree to the choir, but there were standing ovations. Ted Olson and David Boies were there. We brought them up on stage. The place went crazy. It was pretty wild.

And now we hope that we can mount this play in schools across the country, high schools and colleges, to let people know what actually is going on. This may ultimately make itself to the -- this case may make its way to the Supreme Court. But until that time, we want people to know what happened in that district court in California.

KAYE: You've compared this case, as you just mentioned, to Brown Versus Board of Ed. Do you really think it rises to that?

REINER: Yes, it does because in that case, it was all about, you know, whether or not separate but equal was constitutional. Thurgood Marshall argued very passionately and correctly that there is no such thing as separate and equal.

We are saying the same thing here, that there is a group of people who are being treated separately, who are under the law not given the same rights as everybody else. And until the gay community is allowed to be seen under the law as equal with everybody else, they are second-class citizens.

That just is not American. And so we are bringing this as, like I say, the last big piece of the civil rights puzzle.

KAYE: Well, let me ask you about "Don't ask, don't tell." You and I are speaking on a very historic day here, officially repealed now --

REINER: Right.

KAYE: -- allowing gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military. What do you think about that?

REINER: Well, it's kind of interesting, when you think about it. You know, I was talking to, you know, your competitors the other day, and Joe Scarborough brought up a very interesting thing, that the gay and lesbian community is basically fighting for some very conservative ideas, the right to get married and the right to serve in the military.

(LAUGHTER)

REINER: So we've won one of those things, and -- which is -- absolutely should have been done a long time ago, and I think years from now, we're going to look back at this and say, What was all the fuss about? Why were gays not allowed to have what everybody else has?

Just like women couldn't vote many years ago, blacks couldn't vote, we look at that as pretty silly right now. And I think in time, we'll look back at this as being silly. But right now, it's a very serious fight and we're taking the fight to the federal courts.

KAYE: Let me share with you the most recent CNN polling of Americans' view on same-sex marriage. In -- 53 in support, with 46 opposing there, percentage-wise. Where do you think the country really is on this issue?

REINER: That's just about right. And it's kind of interesting when you think about it because back in 1967, there was a case, Loving Versus Virginia, that was brought all the way to the Supreme Court, and that was a case about whether or not interracial couples could marry, whether a black person could marry a white person. At that time, almost 70 percent of the country was against interracial marriage.

Here we're presenting this case in a climate where we have over 50 percent in favor of gay marriage. And I think as time goes by, you'll see that those numbers will rise. So it is definitely moving in the right direction, and we feel very good about our chances at the Supreme Court, if it gets that far.

KAYE: And to those who just simply don't support it, for moral reasons, they say, or religious reasons, what would you say to them? REINER: I'd say you're entitled to your opinions and your feelings. And we're not saying you shouldn't have those feelings. What we're saying, though, is that under the law -- and by the way, the government is the only one that grants the right to get married. It's not the churches. The churches get their right to marry people through the government.

So you can continue to have your feelings, have your -- whatever you feel your morality tells you to do, but you should not deny other people from having those same rights. And that's all we're saying.

KAYE: And very quickly, what is your next project, or is this it?

REINER: Well, this politically is it. I just finished a film with Morgan Freeman and Virginia Madsen called "The Summer of Monty Wildhorn." We finished about a month ago, and it'll come out next year. And I'm very excited about that.

KAYE: Rob Reiner, we really appreciate your time. Such an important issue to give some time to. And I look forward to seeing that play of yours all around the country. Thank you.

REINER: Thanks for having me, Randi.

KAYE: Fired for all the wrong reasons. It's why one company is "Facing the Music." We'll have that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: Every day on this show, we call out someone to "Face the Music." Today it is the decision makers at Acme Electric in Wisconsin. "The San Francisco Chronicle" reports the electrical supply company has to pay a record $846,000 for firing a regional sales manager in a discrimination case.

A supervisor gave Charles Wideman (ph) a low performance rating, saying that he spent too much time close to home base. Well, turns out the guy was recovering from cancer surgery, two surgeries. The Fair Employment and Housing Commission, a state civil rights agency, ordered this payment, the biggest ever in a discrimination case, including a $25,000 fine for what the commission described as, quote, "despicable conduct."

The company reportedly argued the employee was let go because of work deficiencies and the declining economy, but that was shot down because Acme Electric immediately hired a replacement for him.

Gee, if you were recovering from a major cancer battle, wouldn't you need some time near home to recover. For your decision to fire this man, it is time for you, Acme Electric, to "Face the Music."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: Earlier today, CNN's Wolf Blitzer sat down with President Bill Clinton to talk Republican politics. That's right, the former Democratic president shared his thoughts on some of the top GOP candidates. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WOLF BLITZER, HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": You said some of the Republican candidates are more moderate than the others. Let's talk about that for a second. Who do you like, and who are you concerned about? Not from a political standpoint, but from the standpoint of America's future.

BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, it appears that Governor Huntsman and Governor Romney at least have not come out in just flat-out denial of climate change. It appears that -- Governor Huntsman said he supported the compromise to raise the debt ceiling because America couldn't afford the economic consequences.

BLITZER: So what I hear you saying is you'd be happier if Romney or Huntsman got the nomination than Rick Perry.

CLINTON: Well, it's not up to me to -- that's a -- they'll both lose, if anybody thinks I've endorsed them. I'm just saying that I appreciate the fact that they're trying to navigate a landscape that bears almost no relationship to what's produced successful economies in the world. And there are lots of countries that are now doing better than we are in some areas because of the very ideas that, apparently, you have to support to get the nomination.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: For more of Wolf's interview with former president Clinton, you can tune into "THE SITUATION ROOM" today, 5:00 o'clock Eastern, right here on CNN.

That will do it for me. CNN NEWSROOM continues with Brooke Baldwin. Hi, Brooke.