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Michael Jackson Death Trial Begins; Conrad Murray on Trial; Consumer Confidence Unchanged; Home Prices Climbing; Senate Votes to End Shutdown Threat; Congress Avoids Government Shutdown; Closing Arguments in Knox Appeal; Engineer Rappels Down D.C. Monument; Bake Sale Prices Based on Race; Suit Filed in State Fair Stage Collapse; UNH Delays Energy Drink Ban; Middle Class Incomes Rise in 21 States; Dow Rallies Again; Sean Parker's Internet Influence; YouTube Soccer Star Dies in Crash

Aired September 27, 2011 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KYRA PHILLIPS, CNN ANCHOR: And it's the top of the hour.

First up, the world will be watching as Michael Jackson's death trial begins today in Los Angeles and all eyes will be on Dr. Conrad Murray. He's charged with involuntary manslaughter in the pop superstar's death. The entire Jackson family will have front row seats as opening statements begin this morning.

CNN's Don Lemon is there. So Don, let's talk about who the players are in the case this morning.

DON LEMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Kyra, before we talk about the players, it's starting already. When you and I talked earlier, it wasn't this busy. You can see it's starting to get busy in here. This is the first sign of it, no pun intended, fair trial for Dr. Murray.

And there are on folks on the other side of the block, you can see them over my shoulder. There's one person who had on a T- shirt that said Dr. Death. And so it goes just one group, Kyra, came all the way from Houston, they say, to support Dr. Murray.

Now to those players that you asked me about. The players, of course, in this Michael Jackson, even though he's no longer with us, he's going to loom large in the courtroom today and of course, Dr. Conrad Murray, he is Michael Jackson's former doctor who was there at the last moment of Michael Jackson's life.

And he is the person who has been implicated to Michael Jackson's death. Involuntary manslaughter, that's the charges here and of course, you have the judge and then you've got the prosecution team.

Here's an interesting thing, Kyra that I want to talk to you about because Ed Chernoff who is part of the defense team, a player here, should not be under counted here because he has won more cases than most.

He's a former prosecutor - former assistant district attorney. He lost one felony trial, one in 40 and then on his team is Michael Flanegan. He's the only person who has gotten someone acquitted who has been involved in Propofol death in a wrongful death suit that was - where Propofol was used, the improper use of Propofol.

So I think it's important there and then on that team, Kyra, on his team is someone who was worked with Michael Jackson's former attorney, Mark Geragos in one of his trials. So he knows Michael Jackson intimately.

So it's going to be interesting. A lot of people think because of what happened that it's a slam dunk. It's not. You shouldn't count these people out because Conrad Murray has put together a very, very smart team of attorneys to represent him here. So it's going to be - who knows what's going to happen and this is just the very beginning.

PHILLIPS: We'll watch it with you the entire way. Don Lemon live out of L.A. for us. Don, thanks so much.

And in just about 10 minutes, we're going to talk about the defense and prosecution's strategies with our senior legal analyst, Jeffrey Toobin.

Well, this morning, we have a new measure of the economy and how Americans feel about it. It's the consumer confidence index that was released just minutes ago. Christine Romans, what do you think? What's the outlook?

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, it didn't get worse and that's quite honestly is a good turn of events. The 45.4 is the number in September versus 45.2 in August and this is the Conference Board Consumer Confidence Index.

Basically what it tells us, when you take all of the fear and optimism of the American consumer and you boil it all down, you've got a number that wasn't very much different in September than it was in August.

You've got housing prices. You've got frankly disgusting concern about what is happening in Washington. You've got job problems, all of these things and stock market volatility, all of these things kind of boiling together to give us a view of how people are feeling about things.

And I'll tell you that anecdotally, talking to recruiters and hiring managers, they have been saying over the last six weeks or so that they have seen kind of a stasis in the jobs market. And that might be something that people are feeling as well.

I'll tell you, 45.4 is not necessarily a great number. It hasn't gotten worse. But you want to see a number that is higher than that to show you that people are feeling more optimistic about the economy. That's where we are.

You can see the stock market has not really moved or lost much of its gains on it. So it shows you the stock market also is not troubled too much by this number, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right, how about those mortgage rates? Is it a good time to refinance? How many times do I ask you this question?

ROMANS: The answer is yes, yes, yes. But, you know, I say this and I've gotten a lot of e-mail feedback from people who say, I'm trying. I'm trying. Either I'm under water or I can't get through on the phone because they are so busy at the bank.

Let me tell you about mortgage rates. Mortgage rates, this has been the flight to safety, and all of this uncertainty in the world has pushed money into the treasury market and that has driven down mortgage rates.

Mortgage rates for a 30-year fix rate mortgage, just around 4 percent and if you're refinancing into a 15-year loan, people have been getting like 3.3 percent on a 15-year loan. That 15-year is a kind of a popular refinancing tool.

So think of it this way. If you have a mortgage right now at say 5.3 percent, which is roughly what all that outstanding mortgage rates have an average, you know, interest rate of about 5.3 percent, Kyra. If you were to refinance a $200,000 mortgage into these 4 percent or something, 30-year fixed rates, you would save about $1700 a year.

That's real money and that's money that can go into your pocket and go into the economy. A colleague here just finished her refinancing, Kyra. It was like a part-time job to do it, but she's saving hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of dollars and I've heard it from a lot of people who have been e-mailing me and talking to me on Twitter.

If you could do it -- also if you can buy a home right now, prices are the lowest since I think the middle '90s. But you have to have a big down payment, Kyra, a big down payment. You have to have very, very good stellar credit and then you can get these very, very low interest rates.

But also in housing number this morning, the housing four months in a row now of housing prices climbing, still down as you can see from July 2010 about 4 percent down from a year ago, but showing creeping higher over the past few months some of these home prices.

So, again, if you've got the money, great, stellar credit and if you need to live in the house you're going to buy, it might not be a bad time.

PHILLIPS: Got it. Thanks, Christine.

ROMANS: Great.

PHILLIPS: Let's talk politics now. With only days to spare, the Senate has seemingly avoided a government shutdown by passing a short- term spending bill. Lawmakers were able to stop the bickering and actually strike a compromise on a potential deal breaker.

Giving FEMA badly needed money for disaster relief. Now the measure, which received strong bipartisan support, goes to the House. Kate Bouldan is on Capitol Hill. Kate, let's talk about the break through.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The breakthrough, Kyra, really came yesterday afternoon when FEMA announced, contrary to what earlier estimates had been, that it actually was going to be able to kind of stretch its money in its much depleted disaster relief fund to make it through the end of this week.

That's key because the end of this week is also the end of the fiscal year. So that basically -- that really just eliminated the major sticking point that was holding up agreement. This was Republicans wanted the short-term additional funding for FEMA for the rest of the fiscal year to be paid for by cutting spending elsewhere.

Democrats did not want that. So with FEMA's announcement, the major issue was simply taken off the table and so the Senate was able to move very quickly last night and with pretty good bipartisan majority to pass the bill that will fund the government through November 18th and also in the next fiscal year.

And that kicks in which is Saturday, will give FEMA additional money of $2.65 billion. Kyra --

PHILLIPS: All right, so what exactly happens from here then, Kate?

BOLDUAN: Well, as always happens up here. This needs to now go back to the House. The House does need to have its say. But I have heard from House Majority Leader Eric Cantor's office that the House is expected to vote on a one-week extension pretty much identical funding levels, a one week extension.

They will do that quickly with a legislative maneuver on Thursday. And what that will do it will bridge the gap between now and when the House returns early next week because they are out right now. And then they can take up the full measure of the funding bill to take them through November 18th, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right, Kate Bouldan on the Hill. Kate, thanks.

Now overseas, after almost four years in an Italian prison, Amanda Knox will wait a few more days to find out if she will go free. Her appeal of a murder conviction is wrapping up today after some pretty interesting closing arguments. Zain Verjee has been checking out some of the international headlines. Zain --

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT, CNNI: Hi, Kyra. Both sides really have come out punching. The prosecution has basically painted her as satanic. They say that she's a loose promiscuous woman. She does drugs and also they described her as two-faced and diabolical.

What they also did in court was they showed some bloody pictures filled with stab wounds of the victim who was killed, her roommate, Meredith Kercher. Now the defense came out and said that Amanda Knox and her ex-boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito also in this trail that they are just two kids and they are just victims of this whole situation.

If you look at headlines, "The Daily Telegraph" from Australia says "Killer or Handy Fall Guy." It goes on to say suddenly the closed case has become a question of whether two innocent people were jailed by shoddy investigations or couple of natural born killers will get off on a technicality.

The "Scotchman's" headline, "Court Turns into Theater as Knox Appealed Her Conviction." It goes on to say the former University of Washington student has been caused by prosecutors as a cunning young women with a pension for extreme sex games and by supporters as a naive victim of bumbling Italian police and unreliable forensic evidence.

That's what this whole thing is hinging on really. I mean, she may walk in a few days because the defense has put together a very strong argument saying that the evidence -- the DNA evidence used in the initial conviction was a mess and never should have been allowed because it was unreliable. So we'll find out in the few days. She's got a chance to address the court before they'd give their verdict.

PHILLIPS: Got it. Zain, thanks. Well, a controversial bake sale at U.C. Berkley. It starts today and many people are calling it racist. We'll explain after the break.

And middle class families feel the pinched of the sour economy, but in some places, there is good news about your paycheck.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Live pictures now from the Washington Monument. These are engineers that are actually going to be rappelling from the top down to the bottom looking for damage from the earthquake, you know, after it happened.

Engineers noticed a few cracks. We've been talking about that. They shut down the monument and now they are finally getting a chance to assess the damage. We'll let you know how it all turns out and when you'll be able to go back in there and check it out from the top once again if you're going through D.C.

Other stories making news cross country now, a controversial bake sale starting today at U.C. Berkeley. Campus Republicans are pricing the cookies and brownies according to race. White men will pay 2 bucks. Asians, Latinos, blacks and women, they're going to pay even less. It's all to protest a bill that would allow race, ethnicity and gender to be considered in university admissions. In Indiana, a woman whose same sex partner was killed in last month's state fair stage collapse is joining a federal law suit. It seeks to overturn the state's $5 million cap on total damage payouts. They will try to get equal treatment for gay and lesbian survivors.

University of New Hampshire is delaying its just announced ban on energy drinks. Administrators would say they are dangerous when mixed with alcohol. School says it needs more time to study the issue and then they will hear from students.

All right, here we go. America's next big trial. Opening arguments begin today in the involuntary manslaughter trial of Michael Jackson's doctor, Conrad Murray.

CNN's senior legal analyst, Jeffrey Toobin joins me to talk about the prosecution and the defense strategies. Jeffrey, prosecutors say Murray gave Jackson the fatal dose. The question is, how do you prove that?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, the prosecution is going to try to do what the prosecution always does, which is keep it simple. Say these were the drugs that he was administering. These are the drugs that were found in Michael Jackson's system.

This is the cause of death, end of story. They want to just keep it narrow to the drugs that were found in Michael Jackson's system and say that this was incompetent and worse, reckless treatment of Michael Jackson and thus Dr. Murray would be guilty of involuntary manslaughter.

PHILLIPS: Now, defense attorneys are going to try to show that Michael Jackson gave the drug to himself. How do they make that case?

TOOBIN: Well, I think that the defense has a real shot in this trial because, you know, unfortunately, Michael Jackson lived in an environment where he had a lot of drugs at his disposal. He relied on them. He got them apparently from a variety of different sources.

There may have been false prescriptions used, phony names. This may have been enabled by other people in his circle. Again, as usual in a case -- in any sort of criminal case, the defense has got to say, look, this was a lot more complicated.

There were more people involved here. And, in the more controversial aspect of the defense, the defense is going to say Michael Jackson himself was responsible for his own treatment, not Dr. Murray.

PHILLIPS: Well, and if you look at these court documents that were filed, witnesses, the defense team plans to call in, Jeffrey, we're reading his makeup artist, former head of security, his nanny, we're all talking about Michael Jackson even his dermatologist. We could learn -- what do you think possibly some bombshells about his personal life? TOOBIN: Absolutely, because what the defense wants to do is prove that Michael Jackson's relationship with drugs, including drugs that could have killed him, did not begin and end with Conrad Murray.

They are going to say, look, this is a guy who had a long history of drug use and drug abuse and their witnesses are going to try to show that.

You can be sure that the prosecution is going to say, this is all irrelevant unless they can prove that the drugs in his system were administered by any of these witnesses, the prosecution is going to argue it's all irrelevant. So the judge is going to have some tough calls to make as this trial proceeds.

PHILLIPS: I know you'll be watching it closely. We'll be talking a lot more. Jeffrey, thanks.

TOOBIN: OK, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: OK. All right, Alison Kosik is talking about your money. We know the recession has hit people's paychecks hard, but actually in some areas incomes are -- are on the rise.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this is kind of a surprise when you think about the shape the economy is in. Kyra, you know incomes are actually rising in 21 states in D.C. That's almost half of the country.

Now CNN Money analyzed some census data on income growth between 2007 and 2010. The big trend that stands out here is that incomes rose if you live right around the nation's capital, if you work around the nation's capital, a lot of money going to federal contractors there.

We saw the biggest increase in D.C. with income surging 12 percent. Also pay in Maryland and Virginia, that was up, too, but keep in mind, that may not last if government spending is cut.

Now other places where income are up as well, some energy-rich states like North Dakota, Louisiana and the agriculture state where demands for crops there in South Dakota, Kansas and Iowa.

A rebound on Wall Street that lifted incomes in New York and New Jersey. But keep in mind as well, most of these gains are small, less than 5 percent. But once again in this kind of economy, every little bit helps. Don't you think, Kyra?

PHILLIPS: Absolutely. You know what else helps? Seeing that rally on Wall Street.

KOSIK: Yes, day two of it. You said it. The Dow is up 208 points right now. You know what? Investors really believe that the latest proposal to end the debt crisis in Greece and Europe will happen and that Greece will avoid a default.

We're seeing all components in the green right now being led by financials. Financial shares up anywhere from 2 percent to 5 percent because there was a big worry that financials, that banks would have big exposure if Europe imploded with the debt crisis. So you're seeing investors buy back those bank shares, Kyra.

PHILLIPS: All right. Alison Kosik, thanks so much.

Coming up, he helped start Napster, changed the music industry. He was the first president of Facebook, what changed every industry. So what is next for Sean Parker? We've got the exclusive interview.

Plus, what do Nancy Grace and Janet Jackson have in common? Two words, wardrobe malfunction. We've got in showbiz headlines coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: So how big is Sean Parker? Big enough for megastar Justin Timberlake to play him in the movie about Facebook "The Social Network." Parker was a key player for both Napster and Facebook, but in an exclusive interview with CNN, the billionaire says he didn't do it for the money.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN PARKER, INTERNET ENTREPRENEUR: I definitely wanted to earn my freedom, but the primary motivation and for me, money was always about freedom. But the primary motivation was never making money. It was having an impact.

Like Napster was, in many ways, a culture revolution more than it was a successful business. And Facebook -- it took me until Facebook in 2004 to create a company that was both a successful business and also a cultural revolution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Parker's latest venture is a partnership between Facebook and a web service called "Spotify." He expects that that will create the biggest music platform in the world.

I'll tell you what, Nancy Grace sure showed her stuff last night on "Dancing with the Stars." "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT" host, A.J. Hammer, he knows what everybody is talking about. Hi, A.J. Tell us what happened.

A.J. HAMMER, HOST, "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT": Well, Kyra, who knew our own very own Nancy Grace had such moves like that. Last night on "Dancing with the Stars," we saw Nancy and Tristan, her partner doing the quick step.

I have to say, they were dead on. She got a score of 21 out of 30 from the judges' panel. Also some very nice compliments, I actually thought she was going to cry when Len Goodman said her performance was refreshing and a very proper quick step.

Bruno described her performance as vivacious, alive and confident. "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT" didn't catch up with our vivacious HLN dancer after her performance. While she was excited that she did so well, she also knew that she had to keep things in perspective. Let's watch what she told us.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST/"DWTS" CONTESTANT: As happy as I am right now, I still remember standing on that bottom step last week with Artest thinking that we were going to be the ones going home after one dance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HAMMER: I should also mention that Nancy did have a little bit of a wardrobe malfunction during her lively dance. She tells us that nothing was actually seen and like any true professional, Kyra, she recovered nicely.

It didn't seem to have any impact on her score. She tied for third. That's pretty good. I think we're going to see her sticking around for at least another week, hopefully the entire run. She'll get that mirror ball that's what I'm hoping.

PHILLIPS: Yes, I have no doubt she's going to stick it out and she's going to do a great job. All right, she's very much a professional. Now A.J., we're hearing that the cast of "Jersey Shore" may not be happy with the recent decision by the governor of New Jersey?

HAMMER: Yes, I'm thinking they might not be partying over this news. The New Jersey governor, Chris Christie, vetoed a $420,000 tax credit on Monday. This would have had residents of the garden state actually paying for the production costs of MTV's "Jersey Shore."

Here's what Christie said in a letter, "As chief executive I'm duty-bound to ensure that the taxpayers are not footing a $420,000 bill for a project, which does nothing more than perpetuate misconceptions about the state and its citizens."

Now we all know the show has come under fire for all the wild antiques and hard partying we see on the series and of course, it's taken some heat over the past few years that it's been on from those who say the show just perpetuates negative stereotypes of Italian Americans.

This however, will not mean the end of Snooki, the situation and the whole gang. MTV says the governor's decision, Kyra, will have no impact on the show and quite frankly, I'm sure the show makes the state a lot of money in tourism from people who want to go down to the shore.

PHILLIPS: There are a lot of people that follow that cast of characters, shall we say. Let's go from the reality show to the reality star. The millionaire matchmaker apologizing for some pretty harsh comments that she made?

HAMMER: Yes. This is Patty Stinger. She was just on Bravo's "Watch What Happens Live" and she was responding to a question about long distance relationships and in responding she said in the gay world, there are always going to be open relationships and that there is no, as she put it, curbing the gay.

That wasn't all she had to apologize for. She also said that Jewish men lie. And after that had to tweet an apology which was not really an apology. She said, gay men heart variety customary for them to hook up first, get to know the man after.

Commitment is hard when there's so much variety. So Stanger sent out another tweet saying she supports gay men and that she's so sorry, did not mean to offend anyone. Love you all. It sounds to me like she may be doing damage control here thinking about her image more than anything else.

We'll have to see if it has a negative impact on her show, "The Millionaire Matchmaker". But open mouth, insert foot.

PHILLIPS: Big foot. Thanks, A.J.

Coming up, a father-son road trip like no other. Emilio Estevez and Martin Sheen join us live right here in studio to talk about their new movie "The Way."

And with Rick Perry's recent stumble, there's renewed pressure on Chris Christie to run, but is there room on stage for another candidate or will Christie finally be the answer to many Republican's prayers? Political buzz next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Checking top stories now. Opening statements set for today in the trial of Michael Jackson's doctor. Conrad Murray is charged with involuntary manslaughter in the pop star's death

Senate Republicans and Democrats have worked out a compromise to keep the federal government from partially shutting down. The FEMA funding agreement still needs House approval before the end of the week.

And Libya's new leader says the Lockerbie bomber will not be going back to prison. Scottish authorities freed Abdel Baset al- Megrahi on humanitarian grounds two years ago. Now, despite some Western pressure to jail him again, Libya says the case is closed.

Time for "Political Buzz" -- your rapid fire look at the best political topics of the day, three questions, 30 seconds on the clock.

And playing today, Democratic National Committee member Robert Zimmerman; founder of Citizen Jane Politics, Patricia Murphy; and CNN contributor Will Cain.

First question, guys, there's renewed pressure now on Chris Christie to run and the conservative Web site Newsmax says that he might be mulling it over. So, some say, if he gets in, he'll lead the pack. But that was also said about Rick Perry.

So, Christie, what do you think -- could this be the answer to many Republicans' prayers? Robert?

ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE MEMBER: OK. You know, not only is Rick Perry leading the pack initially, but four years ago, Rudy Giuliani and Fred Thompson were leading the Republican polls and the answer to Republican prayers. But they didn't win the nomination because nominees are not picked from polls and prayers. They're picked by winning the early caucuses in primary states.

This year could be a little different however. When you listen to these Republican candidates engaged in personal attacks (INAUDIBLE) references, you wonder if they're running for president or auditioning for "Real Housewives" of the Republican.

PHILLIPS: Will?

WILL CAIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, you know, Chris Christie is not Republicanism prepackaged from Costco and sold one size fits all, Kyra. On immigration, Christie said it's not a crime to be in this country without documentation. Lou Dobbs on this channel said he should resign from that kind of comment. Christie has said that climate change is caused by man, but has said he wouldn't back a cap and trade deal.

On the flip side, it's hard to get more fiscally conservative than Christie. He has reduced the influence of public employee unions and talked about entitlement reform. In the end, he has the ability to shoot straight, be principled without being partisan, and it would make me really happy.

PHILLIPS: All right. Patricia?

PATRICIA MURPHY, CITIZEN JANE POLITICS: I would tell Chris Christie, do not take the bait on this one. These are the same activists who wanted Jon Huntsman to run. He's not good enough. They wanted Rick Perry to run, he's not conservative enough. And when you get into the details of Chris Christie, just like Will was saying, nobody is perfect on this race.

And Chris Christie would not be perfect enough for these activists. His climate change position, I think, is a significant problem for him. He says it's real. He says it's manmade. That's a nonstarter for a lot of these Republican activists.

I would tell Chris Christie to stay in office. He's only been year and a half. Not nearly enough experience. Stay in office. Do not run. Just stay where you are.

PHILLIPS: All right, guys. Second question: Facebook filing paperwork now to create its own political action committee. What do you think? Will it impact the race?

Will?

CAIN: Yes. It can impact the race, Kyra. I mean, look, this is a group of employees pulling their money together to have a louder voice. I tell you what I wish -- I wish that companies did not feel the need to have tax. I wish we had a government with a tax code and an innovation system where they didn't invest in innovation and didn't subsidized corporations so that companies didn't feel the need to have a pact in Washington.

I wish they look at Washington and said, that's a cute little entity far off the coast and we'll stick to what we do best and that's making money.

PHILLIPS: All right. Robert?

ZIMMERMANN: You know, I wish in the new redesign for Facebook, they invented the "dislike" button to go with that, because, ultimately, it's incredibly ironic to watch the leading social networking site resorting to old-style politics of lobbyist and, of course, political action committees.

But, Will, if we want to reform the tax code, the first step is reforming our campaign finance code so that we don't need political action committees. I don't fault Facebook. I fault the political finance system.

PHILLIPS: Patricia?

MURPHY: I would love it if Facebook would say: we'd stay the small company that it once was and be my own private bulletin board. But Facebook is a $100 billion company, 750 million users.

And Congress is intensely interested and worried actually about what Facebook is up to. They don't like their privacy control of lack of privacy controls. They are worried about a Facebook monopoly.

So, they would actually be crazy not to have a PAC, not getting involved in these races. I know Will doesn't seem to like it, but it's absolutely crazy. They'd be crazy not to be starting a PAC right now.

PHILLIPS: OK, guys, your buzzer beater. Twenty seconds each on this one.

Ron Paul tells Jon Stewart: get ready for a Ron Paul explosion. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JON STEWART, COMEDIAN: What is it about your candidacy that they so easily dismiss? And are they right when they say Ron Paul is not an electable figure?

REP. RON PAUL (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They're wrong on that. I've been elected quite a few times already, so I prove that I can be elected. We're 10 percent, 14 percent, 15 percent. So, I think we very well could be, and most likely are on the verge of an explosion of interest in this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: All right. Robert, define explosion.

ZIMMERMAN: Well, we had a Michele Bachmann explosion, of course, in the Iowa straw ballot. Then, we had the Herman Cain explosion in the Florida straw ballot. And now, we have the Ron Paul explosion.

All three of one thing in common: they are about as genuine and credible as Donald Trump's comb over. Ultimately, their explosions are going to fizzle.

PHILLIPS: Will?

CAIN: I'd like to ask a question for Jon Stewart. And here's why Ron Paul can poll so well and at the same time be dismissed, because for many of us, especially conservatives, Ron Paul is exactly right on about 80 percent of his positions. He knows about free markets and constitutionalism. He sounds great.

But the other 20 percent, he's absolutely -- it's unacceptable. The problem is that it's different for everybody. Some people don't like him. He sounds like an isolationist on foreign policy. For me, it's the Fed and people can't get over that last 20 percent.

PHILLIPS: Patricia?

MURPHY: You know, there has been an explosion for Ron Paul. The Ron Paul Nation loved this man. They would lay down on train tracks to save his life. They will give anything for him.

But Ron Paul is, honestly, too intellectually honest to be in politics. It's just a good venue for him. But he takes his positions to the most logical conclusion. He's extremely consistent and that's never going to win an election for him nationwide.

CAIN: Sad. That's sad.

ZIMMERMAN: It doesn't help either, you know, Patricia.

PHILLIPS: I'm going to say that we're going to do buzzer beater plus five seconds. It also triggers some type of response there.

MURPHY: It's usually Robert.

PHILLIPS: Oh, the blame goes to Robert.

MURPHY: But I love it. Give me five for seconds of Robert.

PHILLIPS: All right, guys, we'll talk again. Thanks.

MURPHY: Thanks.

PHILLIPS: All right. So, coming up, some very special guests are joining us live right here in studio. Martin Sheen and Emilio Estevez talking about their new father-son film with father-son conflict at its core.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, he's a soccer player who became a YouTube sensation. Now, we're getting word that he's died and he was only 21 years old.

CNN's Don Riddell joining us from London.

Remind us about this player that we talked a lot about, Don, just a couple of weeks ago and what happened.

DON RIDDELL, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, Kyra.

Well, any young death is tragic, but this really is especially so. Promising young footballer who really made international headlines just two months ago is now no longer with us. We're talking about 21 year old Theyab Awani who played for the United Arab Emirates football team. He was killed in a car crash on Sunday.

And this is a player that was a silver medalist of the Asian Games back in 2010, promising young footballer who was helping his team qualify for the Olympics and the World Cup. In fact, he played in a great game against Australia just six days before the accident.

But it was his goal against Lebanon two months ago that really propelled him into international fame. You may recall, Kyra, he was the guy that took the penalty, a back heel penalty against Lebanon when they were already winning the game 5-2 that made him globally famous.

It was a very controversial goal. The goal was allowed to stand but he was booked because the referee deemed said that it wasn't really in the spirit of the game, and in the United Arab Emirates and in the Middle East where kind of saving face is so important, it really was seen as utterly humiliating for Lebanon's players.

And now, of course, he's no longer with us. His teammates have described him as happy, smiling, a great footballer with a great future and a very respectful young man. And the grief in the UAE in the moment is really quite profound.

PHILLIPS: And you were talking about the timing of his death especially difficult right now, Don?

RIDDELL: Well, absolutely. This came just days after another young footballer in the UAE was also killed, also in a car crash. That's Saeed al Nooby, a 20-year-old who played in the second division of the United Arab Emirates. And, in fact, the UAE's team manager was on his way back from the funeral of al Nooby when he heard about this other death.

So, I mean, just -- almost impossible to comprehend and make sense of it all. But it does point to rather alarming statistics when it comes to traveling on the roads in this part of the world. A World Health Organization report two years ago declared that UAE was the eight most dangerous place to drive in the world, with deaths on average 37.1 per 100,000 members of the population every single year.

So, very dangerous place to drive on the roads, but that doesn't make these tragedies any less important.

PHILLIPS: Don Riddle, thanks so much.

Well, straight ahead. We're pretty excited about our next guests. Live with us right here in the studio, filmmaker Emilio Estevez and the star of his new movie, Martin Sheen. They'll show us the way, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, the death of a child is every parent's worse fear, and you never know where that nightmare might take you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hello?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (on the phone): Are you the father of Danielle Avery?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a very personal journey and you always want to make sure --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tom, your son. I'm so sorry. I had no idea.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My son was almost 40.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, but he will always be your baby.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: A tragic end to a son's wanderlust is the start of his father's journey. That's the heart of "The Way," which actually traces the beautiful, historic way of St. James, the pilgrimage route through northern Spain.

Emilio Estevez directed the movie, played a central role, but he gave his father, Martin Sheen, the starring role. Gentlemen, good to see you.

EMILIO ESTEVEZ, ACTOR/DIRECTOR: Good morning to you.

PHILLIPS: That was kind of nice of you, Emilio. You know, you give your dad the head role. What the heck, he's such a rookie.

ESTEVEZ: I figured it was time.

PHILLIPS: Time to give him his break.

ESTEVEZ: A break for the old guy.

(LAUGHTER)

PHILLIPS: I have a question for you, though, Emilio. This is not your typical Hollywood film. You really feel God in this movie. And I'm curious. When you went to studio reps and pitched this, what was their reaction?

MARTIN SHEEN, ACTOR: Oy!

(LAUGHTER)

PHILLIPS: Dad said oy!

ESTEVEZ: You could see their eyes glaze over. What is this? I don't understand what this film is all about? And I said, well, really, it's about the heart. And it's really about faith and family and community and humanity. And all of the things that Hollywood doesn't really seem to be interested in.

PHILLILPS: It's interesting. And Martin, the character is really this kind of old, grumpy kind of curmudgeon --

SHEEN: Well, he's not that old!

(LAUGHTER)

PHILLIPS: Well - OK, that's true. Okay. A young, crusty, curmudgeon --

SHEEN: He has his AARP card, of course.

PHILLIPS: That's right. Big lobby.

But that's not you. As we can see right now in this interview, you are known to be a very gregarious, loving, friendly individual -

ESTEVEZ: Winbag!

PHILLIPS: Winbag, yes! In this film - oh my gosh, it's supposed to be serious. This film really is serious, folks, I promise you.

SHEEN: Yes, but there is an endless supply of laughs. We lighten the load along the way.

PHILLIPS: You have to. You're dealing with the death of your son in this movie.

SHEEN: Yes.

PHILLIPS: So I'm curious, for Martin, not for Tom the character, did you extract anything from that?

SHEEN: Well, you know, every artist has a pool of resources to conjure up the necessary emotions for any part, and when you get the role it's kind of like being given a license to go to those private places. And to bring private pain public. That's what all artists do.

So, Emilio constructed the script and reined me in so that I didn't overdo it at any one particular time. It had to go on for 40 days, you know.

But, you know, it's the story of loss and healing and redemption. And usually father-son stories, the son overtakes the father. And in this case it's the reverse. The father becomes the son and becomes himself and becomes the real father that he was never able to do to his son in life.

PHILLIPS: Let's take a look at another clip.

SHEEN: OK.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (acting): You said you were on family business?

SHEEN (acting): I am.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (acting): But you have all of the equipment for the walk to Santiago.

SHEEN (acting): Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (acting): So, that box with the ashes?

SHEEN (acting): My son.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

I promise you we were going to get back to the film again, but I have to be honest with both of you, when I saw that clip, when I saw another couple of the other clips and then the overall film, I thought about Charlie. Here you guys were making this film about a son's death, a brother's death. Charlie's life was playing out worldwide. He was challenging his own death.

Did you find it ironic that here you were making this powerful film and in real life, both of you were thinking, wow, could I lose a son for real? Could I lose a brother for real? Emilio?

ESTEVEZ: Well, you know, life is so very precious and we live under our -- our lives have been under a spotlight for so very long. He's gone through a tremendous amount of pressure and stress, and he's come out the other side.

We saw him on Friday night. He showed up at the AARP screening in Los Angeles. And he looks great, and he was in great spirits. And I think he's come -- I think he's really come around, and he's certainly embraced by the family. We've never left anybody, any member of our family out there to hang. And we've always embraced each other.

PHILLIPS: Dad, what do you think? Kind of ironic as you're working on this film and then here we were in real life watching what was happening to Charlie?

SHEEN: Yes, sure. As Emilio said, he's made a tremendous turn in his life. And he's become far more aware of his behavior. And, you know, we adore him. We've never, ever stopped loving him. On the contrary, when he needed it, we loved him more. So any parent would do that.

PHILLIPS: That brings us back to the film. As you say, as he changes his life around, in the film there's a spiritual awakening. I guess you could say that happened. We know where you stand. You've talked about your faith, your work within the Catholic church.

You're still sort of not sure, Emilio?

ESTEVEZ: My mother likes to call me a work in progress.

PHILLIPS: Did the film change that?

ESTEVEZ: Well, yes, this was a film was an experience that was enlightening and spiritual on every level. Yes, there were moments during the production where I had to step back and say, this is not coincidence. There is -- there is a divine moment here happening, and I need to pay attention to it.

SHEEN: You know, all of us are seeking transcendents, whether we're conscious of it or not. So, all of our lives we're trying -- if we're living honest lives, it's an effort to unite a work of the to the flesh.

And pilgrimage makes that possible on two levels. You know, the physical journey itself, you pack all of the things that you think you're going to need and go on a long and arduous journey. You cannot share your burden with anyone. You have to carry everything that you've packed.

But along the way you begin to get rid of a lot of it because you realize you don't need it. And then something very special begins to happen. You begin the transcendence inside and you begin to let go of the things that you've packed inside your heart. Your resentments and anger and guilts and all things human.

And while none of us can have anyone carry our burdens -- we have to carry them -- but we cannot carry them without community. And that I think is where the film comes to fruition. It's this absolute paramount human condition that we all share. It's called extended family or community. We cannot live without each other.

PHILLIPS: I'll tell you, it carries a beautiful message. Emilio, you did a great job.

ESTEVEZ: Thank you.

PHILLIPS: Dad, you weren't so bad yourself.

SHEEN: Hey!

(LAUGHTER)

PHILLIPS: The movie is "The Way." You don't want to miss it, that's for sure. Comes out the first week of October. October 7, right?

ESTEVEZ: Right.

SHEEN: Yes.

PHILLIPS: We'll take a quick break. We'll be right back.

SHEEN: Thank you so much.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: Well, if you're savoring your morning cup of coffee right now, here is more news to perk you up. You may be reducing your risk of depression sip by sip. That's right, according to study published in the Archives of Internal Medicine, drinking two or three cups a day reduced the risk in women by 15 percent. Women who drank four cups or more saw their risk shrink by 20 percent. The same results were not found in decaf coffee or with other drinks, by the way, that did have caffeine.

All right. In the next hour of the CNN NEWSROOM, rappelling down the side of the Washington Monument. Sounds like a scene from a movie, right? Well, they're checking for cracks after last month's earthquake. We're going to ask a National Park ranger what it was like to be inside the monument as the quake struck.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIPS: All right. Let's check in on the presidential campaign trail as Republicans shore up their bases and their credentials. Senior political editor Mark Preston is in Washington. Mark, we're talking about Rick Perry.

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL EDITOR: We are, Kyra. Check out this scoop last night from Peter Hamby. He got this story late in the evening.

Rick Perry made telephone calls to targeted Republican voters in Iowa and South Carolina last night. Basically, how this works, he's targeted voters -- get it -- a telephone call and they are asked to hold on the line. Then Rick Perry comes on the line and holds a conference call and he takes questions.

What he's trying to do is shore up his base after some of the stumbles he's made on immigration and Social Security and of course, HPV vaccination. In fact, let's take a quick look at this quote from Katon Dawson, his South Carolina campaign chairman on why Rick Perry did this. What Katon says here is that Rick Perry he told these voters, "Let me be clear these things up and tell you where I am. This is my stance for me, not the media, not the pundits."

So, Rick Perry clearly trying to shore up his base in these two key states. Kyra?

PHILLIPS: All right. Mark Preston, thanks. You can expect your next political update in the next hour.

That does it for us. We'll see you here bright and early. Martin Savidge in for Suzanne Malveaux. Good morning, my dear.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. It is always a pleasure to be with you. Share the stage!

PHILLIPS: Take it away.

SAVIDGE: I will. Thanks!