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Amanda Knox Appeal Decision Soon; Meredith Kercher's Family on Knox Murder Appeal; Third Week of 'Occupy Wall Street'; Interview with the Journey Band

Aired October 03, 2011 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Randi. Thank you very much.

And hello to all of you. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Want to get you caught up on everything making news this hour, "Rapid Fire."

Let's begin with breaking news here out of Perugia, Italy, in the case of Amanda Knox. Here is what we've just learned.

A decision is expected in one and a half hours from now, so around 3:30 p.m. Eastern Time today. Remember, Amanda Knox, she is the college student appealing her conviction for the brutal murder of her roommate in Italy. And today we heard from Amanda Knox herself, speaking in fluent Italian, pleading for her freedom. She said she had nothing to do with the murder of Meredith Kercher.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AMANDA KNOX, DEFENDANT (through translator): I haven't done the things that they are suggesting I have done. I haven't murdered. I haven't raped. I haven't stolen.

I wasn't there. I wasn't present at the crime.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Two judges and six jurors are considering Knox's appeal. Obviously, we'll bring you their decision as soon as we get that right around an hour, an hour and a half from now.

Now to this story. Take a look at this billowing black smoke with me. This is a chemical plant. This is just near Dallas, Texas.

This thing, we've been watching it. It's been going for a little over a couple of hours now at the Magna Blend facility in Waxahachie, Texas. That's right around 30 miles south of Dallas.

Traffic has all but stopped on the roads and rails right around this facility. Also, we've learned an elementary school and a college in the area have been evacuated.

Six thousand kids sent home early today in Michigan after a note was found with what police are calling a credible threat. It happened in a suburb of Detroit this morning. A teacher found this note at Salem High School with a threat from another student. Three high schools in all were locked down at first, but they've now been dismissed for the day.

We haven't heard yet what exactly the note said, what it entailed. We can tell you that all kids are safe at this point in time.

And that emergency room doctor in the Michael Jackson death trial says Dr. Conrad Murray did not tell her he had given Propofol to the pop star. Dr. Richelle Cooper pronounced Jackson dead at Ronald Reagan UCLA Medical Center, and Cooper says Murray told her that Jackson's cardiac arrest came after he gave him two doses of Lorazepam. That's a sedative, but she says he never mentioned Propofol.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. RICHELLE COOPER, RONALD REAGAN UCLA MEDICAL CENTER: I was told he was given Lorazepam through an IV and then was given a second dose.

DAVID WALGREN, PROSECUTOR: Were you ever told at any point in time about any medications by Conrad Murray other than the Lorazepam?

COOPER: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Dr. Cooper also testified Jackson was clinically dead when he arrived and he did not have a pulse.

The Supreme Court back in session today. This year's term began actually with a tribute to senior Associate Justice Antonin Scalia, who is beginning his 25th year on the nation's highest court. Chief Justice John Roberts read a statement noting Scalia had been nominated back in 1986 and "The place hadn't been the same since."

Dick Cheney lining up with the Obama administration on several topics, in fact. Appearing over the weekend on CNN, the former vice president says he agrees with the decision to take out an American-born Muslim cleric with a drone strike. In fact, he called the killing justified.

The former vice president also praised President Obama for ending the military's "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD CHENEY, FMR. VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, I think the decision that's been made with respect to allowing gays to serve openly in the military is a good one. I mean, it's the right thing to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Now, Dick Cheney wasn't totally full of compliments for the Obama White House. He says the administration should reverse its criticism of robust action taken toward terror suspects when he was vice president. A former CIA contractor who went to prison in Pakistan was arrested in Colorado over the weekend. Witnesses say Raymond Davis got into a fistfight with another man over a parking spot in this shopping center near Denver.

This picture, it's from earlier in the year, right around the time Davis was released from prison in Pakistan. Remember, he was charged with killing those two men when he worked there as a CIA contractor. Davis has said he acted in self-defense.

Much more to come this hour and next.

Check this out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Amanda Knox pleads for her life in her own words, flawlessly in the language of the Italian jury.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. The news is now.

(voice-over): Amanda Knox begs for her life in the local language of her Italian jurors. It's decision day for the American college student accused of killing her roommate in a night filled with drugs and a sex romp.

Protests on Wall Street swells. Hundreds arrested and new groups popping up across the country.

Plus, it's "Music Monday."

And then the video that might have you yelling at your TV screen, "Is he crazy?" Extreme kayaking. You're going to hear from the guy behind the camera on this wild photo shoot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: A decision is expected to be a little bit more than an hour from now in the Amanda Knox murder appeal. It was supposed to be this year -- this junior year abroad, studying in Italy in this picture- perfect town. But it turned into a four-year nightmare for the families of two young women.

First, Meredith Kercher, who was brutally sexually assaulted and murdered in her bedroom. And then, Amanda Knox, the American roommate convicted of killing Kercher in what prosecutors alleged was this drug-fueled sex game.

Now, Knox has been taking an emotional beating through this process, labeled "Foxy Knoxy" by the press and a sex-loving she-devil by prosecutors. But today Knox spoke for herself. She told the court in Perugia, in Italian, "I am not what they say I am."

Let's go straight to Senior International Correspondent Matthew Chance. He's been following this for us out of Perugia.

And Matthew, let's just begin with the news that we learned. So you have learned that there will be a decision in this case in an hour and a half from now.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. That came out from rumors.

First of all, we spoke to lawyers of one of the defendants, Raffaele Sollecito, in the last few minutes. It's now been confirmed by the court that at 21:30, so half past 9:00 local time, less than 90 minutes away, that court there behind me in Perugia will resume. The jury, the judges will come back, having made up their mind what will be the fate of Amanda Knox, that American exchange student, and her former boyfriend, Raffaele Sollecito.

A number of options on the table. They could quash their murder convictions and set them free tonight, or uphold their 26-year and 25- year, respectively, murder sentences for the killing of Meredith Kercher -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Matthew, if you can, just talk to me a little bit more about when that courtroom and those jurors and judges heard from Knox earlier today. From what I understand, she sort of initially spoke haltingly, and then paused and said, "OK," and then continued on really with what the crux of her statement was in Italian. A huge day for her.

CHANCE: That's right. That's right, it was.

It was perhaps the biggest speech of her life. I mean, she's been preparing for it for months, according to her parents, deciding exactly what she was going to say to the jury and the judges as she stood up there in the court this morning.

And in a very emotional speech, pleaded for her innocence, said that she had lost a friend in Meredith Kercher, and had absolutely nothing to do with her killing. And she did it in Italian in order to try and -- you know, I think to cut through to the jury a bit more. That may have endeared her to them. She certainly spent a lot of time in prison, four years, learning Italian much better than she first spoke it in her initial trial, so that may have made a difference.

The jury all night -- all day today, rather -- have been considering that, as well as the other evidence against Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito, not least the DNA evidence which was the only physical evidence used to essentially convict Knox and Sollecito back in 2009. Independent forensic experts were brought in by this very court to examine that police forensic methodology. They found the evidence to be flawed. If the jury are looking for a reason to set Amanda Knox free, they may have found it in that forensic evidence -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Matthew, here is my question though with regard to this decision that comes down. From what I understand, you have these two judges, you have six jurors. Right? So that's eight different people. What if these people come back with a split decision? Who is the tiebreaker?

CHANCE: The tiebreaker goes to the defense. If it's 4-4, then the defense gets it and it's an acquittal. All that's required in this court is a majority decision, so if it's 5-3, that will be the decision that's carried over.

But again, if it's a split decision, if it's 4-4, then it goes to the defense. That's my understanding of the system here in Italy.

And who knows whose favor that's going to work in at the end of the day? We'll find out in about an hour.

BALDWIN: OK. Matthew Chance, we will check back in with you then.

A tremendous day for the Kerchers and the Knoxes and Sollecitos as well.

Matthew, thank you very much.

As we mentioned, Amanda Knox, really the biggest speech of her life. Let's listen to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KNOX (through translator): (SPEAKING IN ITALIAN)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: (SPEAKING IN ITALIAN) "I am innocent." That is Amanda Knox speaking in fluent Italian. And we just thought it was important for you to hear her in her own words with the subtitles up on the screen.

I want to bring in legal analyst Sunny Hostin in New York.

And Sunny, wow. The Italian system is very different than ours here.

As I mentioned with Matthew, you have these two judges, these six jurors. Interestingly, he mentioned the tiebreaker would be the defense.

My question to you, let's just begin with, how does this process even work? Ultimately, these eight individuals vote on one of multiple choices with regard to Knox's fate, correct?

SUNNY HOSTIN, LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR, "IN SESSION," TRUTV: That's right. I mean, there are eight all together, Brooke. Two are judges, six are laypeople.

We have five women and three men. Also, they have sort of four options, in my view, open to them.

They could, of course, affirm the original conviction and sentence, which means she would be in prison for another, I suppose, 22 years. It was a 26-year sentence. Or they could overturn the conviction and find her innocent, acquit her. She would get to go home today, is my understanding. Or they could give her a stricter sentence, a harsher sentence.

The prosecution is now asking for life in prison. So they could up her sentence, or they could give her something lesser, they could find her guilty of a lesser crime and perhaps keep her in there for a longer time, or also give her time served. So there are about four options available to her.

I think what we just showed was really extraordinary, Brooke, because you don't see that in this system, in the United States. You typically do not see, on appeal, a defendant getting up in front of the court, getting up in front of the people that are deciding her fate, and saying, "I am innocent," and giving her version of events. That just typically does not happen here. So this has just been an extraordinary case and an extraordinary day, I think, to come for Amanda Knox.

BALDWIN: One more question for you, Sunny. And I think, to be precise, this is not a verdict, as you've explained. This is a decision on appeal with those four different choices, potentially.

Jurors and the judges, five women, three men. What do you make of that, majority female? Will that help or hurt Amanda Knox?

HOSTIN: You know, in United States that's something I think that could hurt her or help her, because we know that the victim here was a woman. Now the defendant is also a woman. So it could go either way in the United States.

I wonder if it doesn't help her, though, in Italy, because she spoke to them as a young woman proclaiming her innocence, which is very different from what she did before when she spoke. She's much more fluent this time. She's much more emphatic about her innocence.

So I wonder if it doesn't sort of weigh in her favor to have so many women deciding her fate. Women that are mothers and daughters and sisters, perhaps they'll have some empathy for her.

BALDWIN: We will be hearing that decision in just over an hour. Sunny Hostin, thank you so much.

And just to reiterate what she said in court today, "I did not kill. I did not rape. I did not steal." Those are the words of Amanda Knox.

But what about the victim's family? What do they want everyone to remember?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHANIE KERCHER, VICTIM'S SISTER: Everything she went through, the fear and the terror, and not knowing why, and she didn't deserve that. No one deserves that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: More of that emotional sound from the family of Meredith Kercher in just two minutes.

Plus, incredible new video of the Occupy Wall Street protests. Hundreds of people arrested for walking across this bridge.

And a little later ahead, you know what today means, "Music Monday." I sit down with the rock legend Journey. Find out what brought them to tears in my interview coming up later this hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: They were two young women on this exciting journey, living far from their families, learning Italian, learning about life in a foreign country. It should have been the best of times for 21-year- old Meredith Kercher and 20-year-old Amanda Knox. But the good times ended in horror with a brutal murder that shattered two families.

And as the Knox family has been very visibly seeking freedom for Amanda, we haven't seen as much of Meredith Kercher's family. But today, as they await this decision, which, again, is coming down in just about an hour from now in Perugia on that murder appeal, her family sat down and talked about their beloved Meredith. This is Meredith's sister Stephanie.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERCHER: Meredith has been hugely forgotten in all of this. Meredith was such a lovely, lovely girl, a great friend to everyone that she knew. She would help everyone out. She would be rushing around to make sure she could get to everyone's birthday or dinner or anything that she needed to had help them with, as well as doing one of her own things. And she was always there for everyone.

I think what everyone needs to remember is what mom and I were talking about earlier, the brutality of what actually happened that night and the violence, everything that Meredith must have felt that night, everything she went through, the fear and the terror of not knowing why. And she didn't deserve that. No one deserves that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: The Kercher family also spoke about Amanda Knox's appeal and their faith in the Italian justice system. Here is Meredith Kercher's mother, Arline.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARLINE KERCHER, VICTIM'S MOTHER: I think you still have to go by the evidence because there is nothing else. I mean, what I want, what they want doesn't come into it. It is what the police have found, what the science has found, what the evidence is. And that's all you can go on.

S. KERCHER: Only those people there that night will ever really know what happened until someone actually comes forward and says, yes, I did it, and this is what happened. A. KERCHER: We need to find out what happened, and it's not really a question of reaching out or, you know, joining them in anything. It is to find out what happened to Meredith and to get some justice for her, really.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: The Kerchers say it's tough to think about forgiveness for Meredith's killers.

And 700 men and women arrested for blocking a bridge. Take a look.

These are actually live pictures. I thought you could hear them chanting. The Occupy Wall Street protest pushing into their third week, and now the protests are spreading across the country.

We're going to break down what exactly these men and women are trying to accomplish after this short break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: In lower Manhattan, the loud, sometimes disruptive and growing demonstrations begins a third week today. The marchers calling themselves "Occupy Wall Street." And for several hours yesterday, they occupied and blocked the Brooklyn Bridge. I'm talking hundreds of people.

The movement's exact focus? Well, there really isn't one. The leader who is calling the shots and directing this protest, he really isn't one of those either.

But I want you to watch this. This is from this weekend's Occupy Wall Street marches right there in New York City.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're taking over the roadway.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Take it!

Who speaks?

UNIDENTIFIED GROUP: Wall Street!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who speaks?

UNIDENTIFIED GROUP: Wall Street!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You will be arrested for disorderly conduct.

UNIDENTIFIED GROUP: Wall Street!

UNIDENTIFIED GROUP: Who speaks?

UNIDENTIFIED GROUP: Wall Street!

The whole world's watching! The whole world's watching!

Let them go! Let them go! Let them go!

Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Occupy Wall Street has inspired similar movements in other cities including Boston, Los Angeles, San Francisco, even Boise. The demonstrators are venting their anger on issues ranging from high gas prices to climate change in what many are calling quite simply corporate greed.

A quick reminder back on our breaking news story. We are just about an hour away from this decision by two Italian judges and six jurors in the Amanda Knox case out of Perugia, Italy. And contested DNA evidence is really at the heart of Amanda Knox's appeal, specifically DNA prosecutors say was found on this kitchen knife and also on the clasp of Meredith Kercher's bra.

And over the summer, two court-appointed DNA experts, forensic experts, took a second look at the evidence and how it was actually handled. And they found that the DNA evidence used to convict Knox -- they found it was unreliable, contaminated.

Greg Hampikian is a DNA expert and a professor of biology and criminal justice at Boise State University. Also chief of the Idaho branch of the Innocence Project.

Greg, I know you also consulted, as we mentioned, with the Knox family. And I just want to first -- welcome, by the way.

GREG HAMPIKIAN, DNA EXPERT: Thank you.

BALDWIN: I want to begin with just science itself. You have said multiple times that science is everything.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: What do you mean by that?

HAMPIKIAN: Well, it was in Italian. It was Galileo who taught us that it's OK to have a gut feeling. You call it a hypothesis.

You test it. If it's wrong, you reject it and you start over. And the same thing is true in forensic science. You can start with a gut feeling, as they did in this case in Italy.

BALDWIN: What you think might have happened.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes, for whatever reason, whatever your suspicion is. And then you look at the scientific evidence. And if it disagrees with your gut feeling, like a hypothesis, you reject it.

And that's what should have been done here early. Those young people should have been let go at the very beginning when the DNA came back. BALDWIN: Let's go back. It was November of '07, and you have the murder scene. And there was testing and they got the evidence.

And you say with regard to those procedures, they did a good job.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes. The day of the murder, there's a video I had to watch, and it's gruesome. There's a body in the room. They're taking samples from the victim, taking samples from the room. More than 100 items collected and tested.

They he did a great job. Everything in that room the day of the murder collected by the Italian police, analyzed by DNA is either the victim, Meredith Kercher, or Rudy Guede, someone who is not a suspect in this case. Originally, they had no idea he was involved, until the DNA told them they should have thrown out that gut feeling about Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Let me pause for a moment because I'm being told we're going to put this on a split screen where we're getting live, these are live pictures. There is a little bit of activity in Perugia, this is just outside of the courthouse. I'm told some vehicles arriving. We're going to keep our eyes on it that as I have you talking to me about DNA evidence.

So, that procedure was all well and good and done up to snuff.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: And then, though, it was ultimately the trial and these two key pieces of, what, evidence.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: You have the kitchen knife.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: And Kercher's bra clasp.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: And what was found, Amanda Knox was found on the handle and Sollecito, her former boyfriend, was found on the clasp.

HAMPIKIAN: That's right.

BALDWIN: Why didn't that stand?

HAMPIKIAN: We're calling it key pieces of evidence. And that's -- you know, we're saying that because in the appeal we're showing, in fact, the Italian experts appointed by the judge have shown those are unreliable pieces of evidence. They were used as the key pieces against Amanda and Raffaele.

BALDWIN: That was the game-changer.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: Hold your thought. Got to take a quick break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Breaking news here in the Amanda Knox decision. It's going to be coming down in just about an hour from now.

I want to continue our conversation with Greg Hampikian, DNA expert, professor of criminal justice of Boise State University, also chief of the Idaho branch of the Innocence Project, friend of the Knoxes, consulted with regards with this forensic evidence with the Knox family.

And before we continue the conversation we had before the break, you just got a text from Amanda Knox's stepfather.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes, saying the same thing we're hearing, that there's movement and time to get into the courtroom. So, everybody's on tender hooks. It's up to the jury and the judges at this point.

BALDWIN: Six and two. I did want to ask -- we were talking about this earlier and I think our viewers will find this fascinating is that -- you know, obviously this is happening in Perugia, Italy -- the Italian courtroom. They're all speaking Italian. We heard Amanda speaking fluent Italian this morning.

But the Knox family, they don't speak Italian.

HAMPIKIAN: No.

BALDWIN: They're sitting in that courtroom watching essentially the fate of their daughter and not comprehending what's happening.

HAMPIKIAN: No. They have -- there are some volunteers who help from time to time trying to translate, but you can imagine what happens in a courtroom if you have somebody whispering next to you the whole time. I'm sure the judge wants them to keep that down. Sometimes, there's no one with them translating. And they just try to figure it out the best they can.

BALDWIN: How do they do that?

HAMPIKIAN: I think it's just very difficult. It's always hard when you have a foreigner in the courtroom, that's -- their family is left out.

BALDWIN: Let's go back to the DNA evidence. We were talking about the kitchen knife and bra clasp. And on appeal, this judge -- it was up to the judge who said, before we continue on, I want to have independent forensic experts take a closer look at these two pieces of evidence. And what did those experts find?

HAMPIKIAN: Well, they said everything we had said, that I had said, 2 1/2 years ago, in that the defense experts, Italian defense experts, who said even earlier at trial that the DNA on the knife is most likely contamination, that it's unreliable, it should not even have been reported, it's below the standard level that we look at.

And we set those standards for really good reason. If you look below those levels you're going to see contamination. You'll see it in your chemicals in the laboratory. You'll see it that you carry family members' DNA to work with you. You'll get all kinds of contamination.

And that's why -- one of the reasons why we have to all validate what level we look at. The Italians started at what where the FBI and my lab, and others use, a criminal cutoff. But on that knife, they went lower and lower and lower until they found something.

BALDWIN: If I'm the Kercher family and I'm thinking, well, then how did Amanda Knox's DNA get on this knife? And how did Raffaele Sollecito's DNA get on that bra class. I mean, isn't just that simple?

HAMPIKIAN: Yes.

BALDWIN: I mean, if we shake --

HAMPIKIAN: Yes. So, we do that, right? And, you know, we touch hands, I touch my tie, I go home and your DNA is on my tie. It looks like we're a little closer than we are.

BALDWIN: Yes.

HAMPIKIAN: And that happens. You have to think about it. We touched. Some of your cells get on my hand. Those are loose cells. If I just washed my hands, maybe my hands have less loose cells so I can transfer DNA.

And that's one of the reasons again we don't look at every single cell of DNA in the laboratory we have to validate what level we can look at. My laboratory we set it even a little lower than the FBI. But pretty much, there's international agreement that you don't go below a certain level. They did in this case.

BALDWIN: So beyond no doubt with regard to your forensic expertise that you say she is not connected.

HAMPIKIAN: Oh, yes. There's no physical evidence connecting her. And for Raffaele it's this bra clasp that they find 46 days later that's been moved all over the floor. In court -- you know, during the appeal, they show this video where they're handing it from one investigator to another. Their gloves are dirty.

And we replicated this in my lab just by not changing our gloves every other piece of evidence. We've shown that you do contaminate things. You will transfer from one object to another unless you're changing gloves in between each piece of evidence.

BALDWIN: I have a quick favor to ask you live on TV.

HAMPIKIAN: Yes? BALDWIN: And that is, would you mind sticking around with me when we get the decision in just about less than an hour?

HAMPIKIAN: Sure.

BALDWIN: Greg, thank you so much. See you in a little bit.

Meantime, speculation surrounding a potential Chris Christie GOP presidential bid is increasing. One GOP candidate is calling Christie too liberal.

Jim Acosta has that and more in your Political Ticker, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Let's head to Washington and get a quick check with Jim Acosta on the latest news fresh off the CNN Political Ticker.

Mr. Acosta, what do you have?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, we were just talking about this a few minutes ago here in the political unit, about how we are literally three months away from potentially the Iowa caucuses. Now, Iowa Republican officials have not said that the caucuses are going to start on January 3rd, but with South Carolina moving up to move ahead of Florida, that just means that New Hampshire and Iowa will probably do the same. So we're getting very close.

And why am I bringing up all of this, Brooke? It's because the pressure is really on Chris Christie to make this decision this week, and that is really -- all of the indications we're getting out of Trenton right now is that the New Jersey governor will make this final decision one way or another, yes or no, whether or not he's going to run for the White House in 2012.

And it's because of that compressed timetable that we're talking about that there's this great urgency for Governor Christie to make up his mind. He is already starting to take some abuse from his potential rivals, namely Herman Cain, who was on one of the Sunday talk shows yesterday saying Chris Christie is simply to liberal to be the GOP nominee.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HERMAN CAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I believe that a lot of conservatives, once they know his position on those things that you delineated, they're going to not be able to support him. So I think that that is absolutely a liability for him, if he gets in the race.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And speaking of Herman Cain, he was in New York earlier today meeting with Donald Trump. And we have some video of that to show you. Or perhaps some photographs to show you.

And, you know, there's a picture we got up on our Political Ticker right now showing Herman Cain and Donald Trump.

Brooke, as you know, Cain is the former CEO of Godfather's Pizza and Donald Trump has very much, as of late, become sort of a political godfather inside the Republican Party. So, you could call the caption the two "godfathers" if you don't mind me saying.

BALDWIN: And I also heard Herman Cain has an idea of jazzing up a very famous and, might I say, iconic presidential tune. We actually have that with Joe Johns in "Political Pop." I don't know if you heard about that. We're going to have some fun with that.

ACOSTA: I heard he wants to make it fresher, I believe that was the word he used, more fresh.

BALDWIN: Yes, I think more fresh. We'll get a little more specific here coming up. Jim Acosta --

ACOSTA: I won't step on Joe, but yes.

BALDWIN: Jim, thank you very much.

ACOSTA: OK.

BALDWIN: And speaking of music, you've all heard this song, right? The woman behind the song -- there we go -- behind the song "Rapper's Delight," she has passed away. We wanted to pay special tribute on this music Monday to her.

Plus, they laughed, cried with me sitting in this interview room backstage. But what does band Journey think about shows like "Glee" and "The Sopranos" and "Rock of Ages" actually using their movie? I sit down with these guys coming up in two minutes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: All right, Roge, roll the music. There we go.

You know, Sugarhill Gang's "Rapper's Delight," right, was produced back in 1979 by a woman named Sylvia Robinson. Hard not to be moved to that one. The 76-year-old passed away last week of congestive heart failure, so we just wanted to give her a little music Monday love on this afternoon.

And speaking of, if you haven't watched us, we've moved up an hour here so maybe you don't realize this is music Monday for our viewers.

And today's music Monday is part throwback and part current pop. Even though Journey does have a new front man, close your eyes, just close them, while you listen to this. You may never notice the difference.

Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: For someone who's never rocked out on a stage, what does that mean? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It mean, it's loud. It's just loud.

BALDWIN: It's loud.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's really loud. Yes.

(MUSIC)

JONATHAN CAIN, JOURNEY KEYBOARDIST: It's rock with melody, rock with the heart, rock with the soul.

NEAL SCHON, JOURNEY GUITARIST: We play a little bit of this, that, and kind of mix it up. It's a very diversified band. Yes.

(MUSIC)

BALDWIN: "Glee," "Sopranos," "Rock of Ages," what does all of that mean to you? That they've taken your music and done what they have? What does it mean to you?

CAIN: Well, it's approval. It's a massive amount of approval. It just feels great.

BALDWIN: Did you even know what "Glee" was at the time?

SCHON: I didn't, no.

CAIN: My kids told me.

BALDWIN: What did they say?

CAIN: My teenage girls said, dad, this is the biggest thing that's going to happen for Journey and you're not going to believe how big this is. All of our friends are talking about it. They're going to download this song. You wait and see.

And they kind of got me ready for it. So they turned on the TV and we watched it together and it was amazing.

SCHON: All a sudden the younger fans started coming, listening to our actual records after listening to the "Glee" records.

ROSS VALORY, JOURNEY BASSIST: Younger people who did not necessarily grow up with it have discovered it with the advent of "Don't Stop Believing" becoming so popular. It's become an anthem.

BALDWIN: How -- guys, how did that even begin, that finding Arnel? You found him.

SCHON: I searched on YouTube because I just didn't want -- I knew we needed to get a lead vocalist in the band and I didn't want to go through the old process of, you know, auditioning. So I just went to YouTube because I know what's on there is real. You know, there's no doctoring it. If you hear talent in somebody, it's going to stand out to you. But when I heard our songs, I contacted Jon and I said, check this out. And he did "Open Arms" and he did "Faithfully." I was just, like, whoa, this is incredible that he sounds this good.

ARNEL PINEDA, JOURNEY LEAD SINGER: I was living in the street for, like, more than a year, like when I was 15. Sometimes begging for food, sometimes you have to sleep in small chair, you know, for overnight.

So it was -- those things, you know, well, I got through it because I -- I kept my faith, I kept my belief, and I always put in my heart what my mom told me, you know, always fight, fight, fight, believe, and move on. Never look back because it's just going to stall you. You know, just move on, you know?

I went on, and then I met these guys. I'm here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who else should be singing "Don't Stop Believing"? Right?

BALDWIN: I see teary eyes in you. I see it in you. What is -- you.

CAIN: He makes us a better camp, his energy, where he's been.

BALDWIN: So don't stop believing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every night it means something.

BALDWIN: Every night, it means something.

DEEN CASTRONOVO, JOURNEY DRUMMER: It's a brotherhood. That's what I love about this band. It's a brotherhood. It's not a bunch of guys just making a living, going out doing what we have to do. That's what we bring in every night. We live and feed off it. We love what we do, but it's fun.

BALDWIN: Back to "Don't Stop Believing" -- tell me the back-story on the song.

SCHON: Well, I had the chorus but I didn't have anything else. I said, I don't know what else the song is. I just have, don't stop, that was it, believing. And so, Steve said, well, let's think about a chorus, you know?

So he made me play this piano thing with the same chords but without the base note. Then Neil came up with the bass line. So it was this big improv that happened one afternoon.

Truly it's why you want to be in a band because everybody brought something that afternoon to my little idea, you know? And I watch my little idea turn into our little idea and then became a bigger idea, you know, when we wrote the lyrics and actually recorded it. And Neil looked over at me one time, we finished, we're listening to it, he says, I think it's pretty catchy, this could be a hit.

PINEDA (singing): Don't stop believing, hold onto that feeling, streetlights people --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Awesome!

BALDWIN: Thank you so much.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Journey. How about that? Thanks you guys for sitting down with me as long as you did.

By the way, you can always watch all of our Monday music interviews, just go to the Brooke blog as we call it. CNN.com/Brooke. Tell me what you love. I want to know what you're listening to and who you think should appear -- next week perhaps.

Coming up, though, a decision is expected in just about 30 minutes from now in the appeal of Amanda Knox's murder conviction. We have just seen her parents walk back to court moments ago. Will the 24- year-old be set free? We're going to take you live to Italy for coverage of that decision about to be read here.

Also, an extreme kayak feat captured on camera. We're going to talk to the man who shot this incredible video of this kayaker making nearly a 100-foot drop over this fall.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Just want to remind you before we continue on to trending, we'll pop a box up on the screen. We are just about half hour -- there it is -- half an hour away from the decision to come down from those jurors and the judges in the Amanda Knox case. The appeal there in Perugia, Italy. We're going to bring you live some live elements here in the matter of minutes. So, stick with us.

But moving along, it looks like the end of the world. That is what a professional kayaker told CNN affiliate KATU after taking this, sort of, death-defying 100-foot drop over the edge of this waterfall. And I tell you what? It gave me butterflies just to watch it. Check it out for yourself.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

BALDWIN: Yes. That live shot kind of puts it in perspective, don't you think?

This is Aibiqua Falls, as you know, this is part of Oregon. This is in the Willamette Valley. This is 40-year-old Jesse Coombs (ph). He took on this daring stunt, he says only a handful of others have ever tried before him. The drop actually took, if you're playing it in real time, three seconds, but he says it was a grueling three seconds. Coombs didn't come out entirely unscathed, though. He did suffer a punctured lung and fractured shoulder joint.

But I want to bring in the photographer Lucas Gilman who captured these amazing images. He's on the phone with me from Jackson Hole, Wyoming. We'll talk photography in a second, Lucas. But I just have to ask. I mean, I'm assuming you're buddies with Jesse, seemed like a perfectly fine waterfall just to look at. Why did he need to do that?

LUCAS GILMAN, PHOTOGRAPHER (via telephone): Well, thanks, Brooke. That's as a good question. You hate to lose a friend over something like this. But, you know, Jesse has continued to push the sport and push his own personal goals, and it was just an amazing feat.

BALDWIN: Lucas, I know you didn't go over this fall with Jesse, but from what I understand you put some of those cameras in some pretty precarious places. Can you tell me where and how you did that?

GILMAN: Yes. I bushwhack around the world. And basically, you know, sort of like real estate, location, location, location. Getting to these spots are not particularly easy, whether you're rappelling into a canyon or you're bushwhacking through a jungle, you know, basically, you have to get to the optimum spot and put yourself in the best possible position for success.

And you have to intrinsically have to trust your gear because there is no take two, no re-do. Using the best possible gear like Nikon cameras and Sandisk memory, you just basically, you know, sort of guarantee your success.

BALDWIN: That's exactly what I was thinking. You can't exactly ask him to go over this waterfall any more than one time. It kind of pressures on you.

Final question -- you know, extreme kayaking today, what's tomorrow? How do you top this?

GILMAN: Well, you're going to have to tune back in for round two. There's something in Brazil that's going to be pretty special that nobody's ever seen before. So, you'll have to give me a call.

BALDWIN: All right, Lucas Gilman, we will do so. You can share your video with us as well. Thank you so much for calling in.