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Western GOP Debate Gets Testy; Audience Reacts to GOP Debate; Bears, Lions, Tigers on the Loose; Greek Protesters Clash with Police; Apple Shares Drop After Earnings Miss; Herman Cain's Liberal Church
Aired October 19, 2011 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to both of you. Have a great day.
The CNN presidential debate, tempers flare, accusations fly, we're going to talk more on that.
This morning after we're tallying the fight cards of the most testy debate of the election season. Jim Acosta is in Las Vegas where the candidates anted up, they threw down.
Jim, they all must be nursing some bruises this morning after that throwdown. Any winners?
JIM ACOSTA, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: You know there were some winners, there were some losers, and I think you're going to see in this piece who we're talking about. You know this was, as a lot of people are calling it, fight night here on the Vegas Strip.
For weeks Mitt Romney has cruised through debate after debate, staying out of the fray, and sort of letting some of the other top tier candidates like Rick Perry and Herman Cain take all of the abuse but that all came to an end in last night's CNN debate.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Anderson, you say --
(CROSSTALK)
GOV. RICK PERRY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: -- that you knew you had illegal working --
ROMNEY: Could you please wait?
ACOSTA (voice-over): It was a Wild West shootout on the Las Vegas Strip and at times it felt like Rick Perry's last stand with an urgent strategy to take down Mitt Romney.
PERRY: Because you hired illegals in your home and you knew for -- about it for a year and the idea that you stand here before us and talk about that you're strong on immigration is on its face the height of hypocrisy.
ACOSTA: But Romney wasn't laughing for long. ROMNEY: Are you just going to keep talking? There's a tough couple of debates for Rick.
ACOSTA: Civil discourse was out the window. This was the first GOP debate to get personal.
ROMNEY: We hired a lawn company that -- to mow our lawn. And they had illegal immigrants who were working there. You have a problem with allowing someone to finish speaking and I suggest that if you want to become president of the United States, you've got to let both people speak.
ACOSTA: Unlike past debates, the night was also Romney's first real test as a frontrunner as the candidates took aim at his health care plan in Massachusetts. Rick Santorum pointed out some of Romney's own advisors helped draft President Obama's health care law.
RICK SANTORUM (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You just don't have credibility, Mitt, when it comes to repealing Obamacare. You are -- your plan was the basis for Obamacare. Your consultants helped Obama prep Obamacare.
ACOSTA: At issue, Newt Gingrich says, is the individual mandate in both Romneycare and Obamacare.
NEWT GINGRICH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There's a lot of big government behind Romneycare, not as much as Obamacare, but a heck of a lot more than your campaign is admitting.
ACOSTA: Romney responded he got the idea from Gingrich.
ROMNEY: Actually we did the idea of an individual mandate from you. You did support an individual mandate.
GINGRICH: Yes, sir.
ACOSTA: Rising Republican star Herman Cain also found himself on the defensive over his 999 plan. Independence studies have found the plan's individual business and national sales taxes all set at 9 percent would raise taxes on millions of Americans.
PERRY: I'm going to love you, brother, but let me tell you something, you don't have to have a big analysis to figure this thing out. It's not going to fly.
ACOSTA: Romney pointed out a new sales tax would be combined with existing state sale taxes.
ROMNEY: Will the people in Nevada not have to pay Nevada sales tax and in addition pay the 9 percent tax?
HERMAN CAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Governor Romney, you were doing the same thing that they're doing. You're mixing apples and oranges.
ROMNEY: I got be getting a bushel basket that has apples and oranges in it because I got to pay both taxes.
ACOSTA: For Perry it was a night to take a campaign full of lemons and make lemonade. Giving Republicans a bitter taste of a more combative campaign to come.
PERRY: And you get to ask the questions and I get to answer like I want to.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ACOSTA: In the post-debate spin room a senior Romney adviser accused Rick Perry of having a strategy to, quote, "kill Romney," but in the end that adviser said, Perry, quote, "just killed himself."
That might be wishful thinking on the part of the Romney campaign because Rick Perry showed he still has some fight left in him -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: OK. It looks like all of them still do. All right, Jim Acosta, thanks so much.
ACOSTA: I think so.
WHITFIELD: So the audience members used words like immature, polarizing and uncomfortable to describe the debates they saw last night. They didn't use the word boring, however.
CNN's T.J. Holmes joins us now from Las Vegas.
So, T.J., it also looks like the candidates weren't the only ones coming out swinging.
(LAUGHTER)
T.J. HOLMES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Again, that's one way you can put it, Fredricka. But there is no doubt a new hit show on the Vegas Strip. Did you see that last night? Get your tickets now as the Venetian presents "2012, the Republicans." They should sell tickets to these things from now on and everybody in the audience.
Fredricka, I talked to a ton of folks, many of them on camera, which you're about to hear from, but many off camera, and all of them said the exact same thing and had the very first impression of this debate was not about politics, it was about candidates behaving badly and one in particular.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Too much fighting tonight.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some were a little immature.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not getting better. It's getting worse. It's polarizing the country.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was a little surprise for me tonight. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And some of the candidates didn't exhibit the class that other candidates did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think Governor Perry's hurt himself tonight.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would not vote for Rick Perry at this point.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I really liked Rick Perry, and then after the debate I kind of faltered away from Rick Perry a little bit more.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Romney and Perry.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The way they acted to each other.
SANTORUM: It was a little uncomfortable with the Perry/Romney exchange. But they seem to have a thing for each other, but they don't -- they don't seem to get along too well.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think they know that time is running out and that they're trying to get to that upper echelon and get the votes, and the only way to do that is to bash each other instead of taking the moral high road.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm sorry, this is -- these are not role models that I would be looking up at.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, sure, they're ratcheting it up a little bit, but, you know that's -- it's a very low-level ratcheting up. I mean nobody called anybody else either a socialist or a Nazi. You know so they really haven't -- they haven't made it European parliamentary style debates. Those will be fun. Or Korean where things get thrown. I'd love that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Now, the last guy, of course, there he was being tongue in cheek, and he was the only person I talked to who wasn't a Republican. He came literally to see the show, and boy, did he get one.
But you heard one guy speak about role models in that piece, and he actually said, what if a fifth grader was watching that last night? And we're telling fifth graders and people how -- telling young people how to maintain their cool and how to treat each other, that was not a good example.
And listen to this, Fredricka. Someone even used the example of the Coach Schwartz from the Detroit Lions and Coach Harbaugh, you know, that little dust-up they had after their game with the handshake? They said, still, these are adults, they're the leaders. They did not set a good example last night. That's all anybody could talk about -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: I think what we saw on display, survival of the fittest.
HOLMES: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
WHITFIELD: We'll see what happens next, at the next debate. T.J. Holmes, thanks so much in Las Vegas.
All right, tune in tonight for a primetime interview of Herman Cain. Pierce Morgan dig deeper than 999, that's tonight at 9:00 Eastern, right here on CNN.
Deputies in Zanesville, Ohio, have orders to shoot to kill after about 50 exotic animals escaped their pens at a private farm Tuesday. Deputies have shot two dozens of the animals so far. The animals include lions, tigers, bears and cougars. Police found their owner dead last night. Today, nearby schools have been closed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHERIFF MATT LUTZ, MUSKINGUM COUNTY, OHIO: Obviously, we haven't gotten real wide yet because obviously there's a lot of wooded area and we have not put people on foot in those areas due to the nature of this thing. Obviously, our public safety has always been the top the priority. Officer safety is right there with that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Zanesville's mayor, Howard Zwelling, joins us live by phone with the latest on the hunt under way right now.
So, how, Mr. Mayor, are you getting the word out to people to be safe? What are you instructing them to do?
MAYOR HOWARD ZWELLING, ZANESVILLE, OHIO (via phone): Well, this happened about two miles outside of Zanesville. So Sheriff Matt Lutz is in charge of the whole operation. I have had several calls from people who are concerned that the -- that they are shooting these animals and it's my understanding that the Columbus Zoo is on hand with tranquilizing materials.
So whenever possible, they're going to tranquilize the animals and save their lives. But I don't have a complete update because Sheriff Lutz is out in the field and is preoccupied at the time. I understand he's going to have a press conference at 10:00 and update everybody.
Meanwhile, it's several of the schools in the area are closed. People are being told to stay inside. Safety of the people is number one on the sheriff's mind. The people in Zanesville, we're asking them to be careful. It's business as usual. Everybody is going to work and we're telling people to look around and be cognizant of what's around them and watch out for wild animals and -- so we're being cautious about it.
WHITFIELD: And Mr. Mayor, let me ask you, too, do you have any idea what happened? What happened to that park owner that he was found dead? ZWELLING: I got a call from my safety director Bob Branford last evening around 9:00 or 9:30, and he told me that Terry Thompson, the owner of the farm and the owner of the animals had set them free and then shot himself. And so that's the best information that I have.
WHITFIELD: All right. So your information is that he committed suicide after setting the animals free.
Mayor Howard Zwelling --
ZWELLING: That's the best information I have.
WHITFIELD: All right. Mr. Mayor, thanks so much for your time and, of course, we'll try to keep in contact with you as the hunt continues for many wild animals.
ZWELLING: Thank you very much.
WHITFIELD: And a news conference is set for the next hour, as you heard the mayor say. We'll bring you that -- the latest on the developments as they happen.
All right, turning now to money matters overseas. Angry people are taking to the streets in Greece right now. They're protesting an expected vote to raise taxes, cut wages and slash jobs to fix Greece's financial crisis. And already, things have turned violent.
CNN's Max Foster is in London with an update on what's happening -- Max.
MAX FOSTER, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hi, Fredricka. Yes, these clashes, they are getting more and more violent. We think these are the biggest demonstrations and certainly set to be the biggest demonstrations since this whole economic thing crisis started in Greece a couple of years ago.
Demonstrations taking place outside the parliament building, inside building disgust that will increase taxes, cut jobs, cut wages. That's been done so many times before. The people outside simply think that they can't take any more. These -- you have to have some sympathy for these people there. The economy is on its knees and they don't feel the economy can take any more.
But at the same time, the government has to push through extra cutbacks otherwise the country won't qualify for European bailout. If it doesn't get that bailout -- still being discussed, by the way -- the country will go bankrupt. You know, it will default and that will have huge repercussions much worse. And it's a very difficult situation.
This is how the world press is looking at it. One newspaper, "St. Thomas Times Journal", in Canada are saying, "There is no rescuing Greece from financial crisis." And this is becoming a more common view. "European countries are fearful for themselves if Greece is allowed to default. At some point, reality has to be faced, though. Let it abandon the euro and revert to the drachma, until it comes to terms with itself," which is fair to say, Fredricka.
But if Greece does default, then a lot of French, British, German banks are going to lose a lot of money, American banks as well. Those economies are in a bad state already. So then they look vulnerable. So it's a really difficult balancing act but, you know, this is the reality of it. Demonstrations in Athens.
WHITFIELD: All right. And a big potential ripple effect.
Max Foster, thanks so much, from London.
On to politics now, the race for the White House, Herman Cain and Mitt Romney are running close in the polls. Some have Cain ahead, but if you ask Republicans who's more likely to get the nomination, it's no contest, they say.
We'll talk with GOP strategist Ed Rollins coming up.
Also ahead, Prince Harry got skills impressing his U.S. helicopter instructors as he trains for deployment to Afghanistan.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Checking stories across country now.
The involuntary manslaughter of Michael Jackson's doctor, Conrad Murray, resumes today after a five-day break. The prosecution is expected to call their final witness this morning. Murray faces up to four years behind bars if convicted.
A Southwest Airlines flight from Los Angeles to Kansas City ended up making an emergency landing in Amarillo, Texas, Tuesday, when one of the passengers became a bit unruly, they say. Police say a man was arrested on a charge of interfering with a flight crew. He was apparently screaming obscenities at other passengers.
And also from Los Angeles, a 911 dispatcher is being credited for helping a driver stop her run away car Monday. The woman called asking what to do with a stuck accelerator pedal and an impending red light.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
CALLER: The car's in front of me and I can't stop.
RICHARD ENGERSBACH, 911 DISPATCHER: I was really hoping that I wouldn't have to hear the car crash and, thankfully, she did what I asked her to do.
Can you try putting the car into neutral and turning of the ignition?
She did a really good job of maintaining composure.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
WHITFIELD: Police say the woman also her 5-year-old daughter with her at the time.
All right. Let's talk more now about the Republican candidates. Polls show Herman Cain and Mitt Romney pretty much tied. But are they really that close?
CNN/ORC poll asked Republicans who was most likely to win the GOP nomination and this one isn't even close when you look at it that way. Romney blows everyone else away.
Ed Rollins is a Republican strategist.
Ed, looks like Republicans really want Cain, but they feel they need Romney to beat President Obama. What is this all about?
ED ROLLINS, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, Cain has had an interesting run here, he's a motivational speaker. He's very entertaining and I think people like him. But I don't think he's going to be the nominee of the party. He has no organization in states like Iowa and New Hampshire and South Carolina.
And you've got to win delegates. You've got to win the vote, and at this point in time, it's all about debating skills and what-have-you.
And he got -- his 9-9-9 got pretty trashed last night and I don't think there was another person on the stage that would basically be supportive of it.
WHITFIELD: But it seems, as though, Cain was a real target last night. Romney was a real target last night. So, the other candidates are seeing these two as the threat, the ones to beat.
ROLLINS: Well, I think you have to bring them back in order to basically put yourself forward. There still isn't the clear conservative candidate yet, the alternative to Romney. Obviously, Mrs. Bachmann had a shot at that. Mr. Cain had a shot. Mr. Perry had a shot at that.
Obviously, until you have votes in Iowa, probably someone doesn't emerge who is that challenger. I think the key thing last night, if you like "Housewives of New Jersey" or World Federation Wrestling, last night was a great show. It was great show for Anderson Cooper and CNN.
It was not a good show for the Republican Party. I don't think beating each other up, not just debates on issues, but there was a lot of personal stuff challenging Mr. Romney's integrity and what-have- you. It's not the best show to put forth to the American people.
WHITFIELD: So, a lot of sparring, a lot of sparring not just between, not really between Cain and Romney, but instead mostly between Romney and Perry. But it doesn't boil down to who presents themselves as the more presidential debater.
ROLLINS: No, it doesn't. At the end of the day, these are the two men that have the resources and the organizations. And for those of us who have been around the game a long time, our assumption is they are the ones that will be able to go on and carry this nomination beyond Iowa and New Hampshire. Everybody else is either broke or not necessarily having the organization to move forward. It's never not too late and there can always be a surprise. But at this point in the time, those are the two people that are serious in the sense of mechanics.
WHITFIELD: All right. Ed Rollins, thanks so much. Good to see you this morning.
ROLLINS: My pleasure, thank you.
WHITFIELD: Coming aside, pushing aside the bluster and finding the bottom line. We'll look at three things that we may have learned from last night's debate.
And next, the Boss becomes the big man on campus. A massive special collection of Bruce Springsteen memorabilia moves from a public library to a college campus. We'll tell you where, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right. Let's get to your "Showbiz Headlines" now. Everything you want to know about rock star Bruce Springsteen can soon be found at New Jersey's Monmouth University. The school agreed to be the new location of the hometown hero special collection. A local library became too small for the more than 14,000 pieces of memorabilia.
Philadelphia native Will Smith and his wife, Jada Pinkett-Smith, are now part owners of the Philadelphia 76ers basketball team. The Hollywood couple partnered with one of the largest equity firms in the world to purchase the team. The NBA officially approved the sale this week.
And fashion expert Carson Kressley has more time now to vote to close this morning. He is the latest celebrity to be eliminated from "Dancing with the Stars." Kressley had been in the bottom three for several weeks now.
Overseas, Queen Elizabeth arrived in Australia to cheering crowd today. It's expected to be an emotional visit.
CNN's Max Foster is covering that for us from London.
So, Max, why is this going to be emotional?
MAX FOSTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, a lot of people are billing it as a farewell tour of Australia. She is not just the queen of England. She's the queen of Australia as well. And she's in her 80s and some suggestion that she can no longer really keep up with these big tours. She had to call the other day and she had to call off some engagement here in London and actually lot of people in Australia quite please about that as a big anti-monarchy movement here, although the queen herself is quite popular. I think the prime minister, Julia Gillard, sums it up quite well. She says she does want a republic, but she wants it to come after the queen's reign, and she talked about how the queen is here in Australia. Australians will be enjoying and celebrating her presence here, but certainly lots of people who think it's still inappropriate that she's arriving there.
But, you know, I don't think anyone is expecting the monarchy to go while she's still alive, at least.
WHITFIELD: OK. In the meantime, let's talk about somebody else. Let's talk about Prince Harry who is in the U.S. He's in the middle of some helicopter training and, apparently, he's getting rave reviews. Why?
FOSTER: You know, this is it. We weren't given any access, official access to Harry while he's there. This is a profession tour while she's there, learning to fly those Apache helicopters there.
But "Daily Mail" in London has managed to get a source in the military and the source has been talking about how Harry has surpassed all expectations, including his own. And the U.S. instructors are really impressed by him, so he's doing really well.
Another quote from an insider, he certainly isn't getting any special treatment in California. It's not the way he wants it. He wants to be a regular soldier, they say. He's loving, Fredricka, being in the States. And we know he's been out a few times, maybe he'll be there long term.
WHITFIELD: Who knows? I'm sure if you find out. You'll share that with us.
Something else you have to find out. This is your assignment from me today, what is in the queen's handbag? Why does the queen need to carry a purse? That's all I want to know. Does she have people to do that for her?
FOSTER: She definitely doesn't carry cash. I have to assume.
WHITFIELD: She probably doesn't have a cell phone in there. I don't know why that shot right there with her with that handbag strikes me. And that's the thing I want to know, what's in her handbag and why does she need to carry it?
FOSTER: A tissue, I reckon.
WHITFIELD: OK. That's right. It's going to be an emotional tour, so maybe her hanky is in there.
All right, Max Foster, thanks so much.
Alison Kosik is at the New York Stock Exchange where shares of Apple are selling off after their earnings missed expectations.
Alison, how big of a deal is this? ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: You know what, Fredricka, it is a big deal, because, you know, just like death and taxes, Apple blowing past its earnings expectation is pretty much a certainty. So, the fact that it missed its expectations is a real shocker to Wall Street.
What do you get? You get investors selling off shares. Apple shares are down 5 percent in dollars and cents. That wipes tens of billions of dollars off its market share.
But let's get real here. Apple is still making money hand over fist. It made $100 billion. I'm talking about in sales over the past year. IPad and Mac sales for Apple hit a record.
And listen to these numbers. Apple sold almost 8,000 iPhones an hour, 5,000 iPads an hour. That's a lot of merchandise sold very quickly. Apple, of course, is also getting set up and expects a solid holiday shopping season.
So, I'm sure it will make up any lost ground from the past three months -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right. And is the drop in Apple shares going to hit the broader market today?
KOSIK: You will see that, we are expecting to see a modestly lower open today. The tech heavy NASDAQ, that's where a lot of the tech stocks are. It's likely to take the biggest hit.
Also, the Dow is coming off an almost 200-point gain yesterday. So, it's not going to be a big surprise to see some investors sell some stocks today. It's usual after that rally.
Other factors in play today, we got a mixed housing report and strong earnings from Intel and Morgan Stanley. Of course, also on the radar today, all of those headlines coming out of Europe. We have the opening bell happening in about three minutes -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right. We'll look for that. Thanks so much, Alison.
And we'll talk more about the GOP debate coming up. Mitt Romney and Rick Perry were really going at it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. RICK PERRY (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I'll tell you what the facts are.
MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Rick, again -- Rick, I'm speaking.
PERRY: You had the -- your newspaper -- the newspaper --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Oh, boy, Perry brought up an issue that dogged Romney in the 2008 campaign and it clearly got under Romney's skin, again. Details, straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: The GOP presidential debate was hot last night.
Take a look at angry right here in Athens, Greece. Protesters are out. Very upset about the idea of taxes being raised, wages being cut, and jobs being slashed. Apparently, they have been going toe to toe with police there.
You see right there at the lower right-hand corner, somebody throwing something at police, and we understand that earlier, police were sending out some tear gas. So, this is the kind of conflict unfolding in the streets of Athens, Greece.
Our Diana Magnay is there. She's on the phone with us right now.
Diana, this really is very heated, very dangerous. How is this situation likely to be contained, if at all?
DIANA MAGNAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Well, right now, I'm looking down on clouds of tear gas rising from the central square, the parliament square in front of the parliament building. Riot police have cleared one-half of the square and they're facing off with a crowd of very angry men, basically dressed in black who have ripped up the pavement and the stones and (INAUDIBLE) square, and they are hurling them.
Earlier, we saw earlier (INAUDIBLE) at police, and the police responding with these stun grenades which cause the loud explosions and with tear gas. This is something, you know, that has become fairly commonplace at a Greek riot. I don't know if you can hear the tear gas below me and certainly getting into the back of my throat.
These have become fairly commonplace at Greek riots and after two days of general strikes. It is expected that they might escalate into this kind of violence. Violence continuing outside the parliament building as the parliamentarians inside to pass the latest round of austerity, which is why people here are so angry, Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: Well, incredible. All right. Diana Magnay, keep us posted. Thanks so much, from Athens.
Back in this country now, Las Vegas has seen its share of fights, but nothing quite like this. Check out one of the more intense exchanges between Mitt Romney and Rick Perry about illegal immigration.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERRY: Those people that hire illegals ought to be penalized.
And, Mitt, you lose all of your standing, from my perspective, because you hired illegals in your home and you knew about it for a year. And the idea that you stand here before us and talk about that you're strong on immigration is on its face the height of hypocrisy.
(LAUGHTER)
ANDERSON COOPER, MODERATOR: Governor Romney?
ROMNEY: Rick, I don't think I've ever hired an illegal in my life. And so I'm afraid -- I'm looking forward to finding your facts on that, because that just doesn't --
PERRY: Well, I'll tell you what the facts are.
ROMNEY: Rick, again -- Rick, I'm speaking.
PERRY: You had the -- your newspaper -- the newspaper --
ROMNEY: I'm speaking. I'm speaking. I'm speaking.
(CROSSTALK)
ROMNEY: You get 30 seconds. This is the way the rules work here, is that I get 60 seconds and then you get 30 second to respond, right?
Anderson?
PERRY: And they want to hear you say that you knew you had illegals working at your --
ROMNEY: Would you please wait? Are you just going to keep talking?
PERRY: Yes, sir.
ROMNEY: Would you let me finish with what I have to say?
(BOOING)
ROMNEY: Look, Rick --
COOPER: I thought Republicans follow the rules.
ROMNEY: This has been a tough couple of debates for Rick, and I understand that. And so you're going to get testy.
(APPLAUSE)
ROMNEY: But let's let -- I'll tell you what, let me take my time, and then you can take your time. All right?
PERRY: Great. Have at it.
ROMNEY: All right.
My time is this, which is I have in my state -- when I was governor, I took the action of empowering our state police to enforce immigration laws. When you were governor, you said, I don't want to build a fence. You put in place a magnet.
You talked about magnets. You put in place a magnet to draw illegals into the state, which was giving $100,000 of tuition credit to illegals that come into this country, and then you have states -- the big states of illegal immigrants are California and Florida. Over the last 10 years, they've had no increase in illegal immigration.
Texas has had 60 percent increase in illegal immigrants in Texas. If there's someone who has a record as governor with regards to illegal immigration that doesn't stand up to muster, it's you, not me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: So, each man accuses the other of hypocrisy. Perry brought up an issue that dogged Romney in 2008 presidential campaign. They both touched on it, but who has the facts on his side?
CNN's Tom Foreman does a fact check for us next hour.
So, let's turn right now to the three things that voters learned from last night's debate.
Our deputy political director Paul Steinhauser joins us now from Vegas.
So, Paul, let's begin with Rick Perry coming out swinging really feeling like, I guess, he had to because of previous debates.
PAUL STEINHAUSER, CNN DEPUTY POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Yes, this was his fifth debate for Rick Perry, for the Texas governor, since he jumped into the race for the White House back in mid-August. And it was definitely was his most performance, most feisty performance.
Myself and Peter Hamby are writing about that on CNN.com. And you can read it there.
But, listen, right off the bat, Rick Perry did not even wait for the questions to begin to go on the attack. In the candidates' self- introduction, he calls himself a real conservative and not one of convenience. That was obviously a dig at Mitt Romney and he went on from there.
You saw he brought up the attack against Romney for using a landscaping firm that hired illegal immigrants. We hadn't heard that since the last presidential cycle. Rick Perry brought it up. They also sparred over jobs and over Romney's health care plan in Massachusetts.
Rick Perry, Fred, listen, since his lackluster debate performances in late September and early October, we've seen his poll numbers drop. He was the frontrunner, no longer. He needed a strong performance. He finally did it. He finally woke up. We'll see if it continues, Fred.
WHITFIELD: OK. Now, to number two, Romney gave as good as he got. Explain.
STEINHAUSER: Yes, listen, we knew Romney was going to come under attack because he's on top. And when you're on top, all the other candidates gun for you. That happened again last night. But it seems they got under their skin a little bit more than in past debates. In fact, in one of those exchanges with Perry, Romney put his hand on Perry's shoulder. It seemed like he got upset.
But he did have some strong responses each time. And that's been his trademark. Yes, he comes under attack, but he's able to respond.
It must be frustrating, though, for Mitt Romney and his campaign that Romney's health care plan which they label Romneycare and they say was the genesis for the president's much despised health care law -- among Republicans, at least -- well, it must be frustrating that it keeps coming up debate after debate after debate, Fred.
WHITFIELD: Yes. OK. We got to work on the grammar (ph) on that banner, by the way.
OK. And then, finally, why 9-9-9 was actually number one.
STEINHAUSER: Oh, yes, number one right off the bat. Listen, we knew Herman Cain's plan was going to come under attack. When you rise in the polls like the former Godfather's Pizza CEO, you get more scrutiny. As that 9-9-9 plan came under attack, right away, the first question in the debate, and all of the other presidential candidates went after it, dissecting it, criticizing it for that 9 percent sales tax. Cain had an answer for each attack but it seemed in a way a little bit simplistic.
I think Herman Cain needs to give a few more details about 9-9-9, Fred.
WHITFIELD: All right. Paul Steinhauser, thanks so much.
And a reminder, to read Paul's story and to get all the latest political news, go to our Web site, CNNPolitics.com.
Still ahead, good news for some 55 million Social Security recipients. It looks like you'll be getting a raise.
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WHITFIELD: After two years without an increase in benefits, Social Security recipients are expected to get a raise next year.
Let's get more from CNN's Christine Romans in New York.
So, Christine, why are benefits going up now?
CHRISTINE ROIMANS, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, because they make this calculation based on consumer price inflation. And when we have a good read of an average of the data, then they say this time of year, everywhere, what it's going to look like for next year. So, it's based on consumer inflation now, what you're going to be paid next year.
We know there'd be a 3.6 percent cost of living adjustment for next year for the millions of Social Security beneficiaries, some 55 million seniors and also people who are getting Social Security benefits checks of other types. It's going to add about $39 a month overall.
But one thing some folks are saying, don't spend it all in one place because there could be some Medicare premium changes and we're going to know more about those in the next couple weeks. They could eat to some of that. So, for seniors who are very carefully looking at their budgets for next year, there are a couple of moving parts. But it is the first raise in about three years.
And, Fredricka, it's very clear that seniors more and more are relying on Social Security benefits to pay their bills. We know that Social Security benefits, on average, account for 41 percent of an elderly person's income. Forty-one percent so, it's incredibly important that $39 on average.
And for one-fifth of couple, elderly couples, Fredricka --
WHITFIELD: Yes.
ROMANS: This is all -- they're living on these checks. They need that money to increase.
So, there you go at 3.6 percent raise the first time in three years -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: Yes. So, every penny, dime, dollar counts.
ROMANS: That's right.
WHITFIELD: All right. Christine Romans, thanks so much.
All right. Checking stories cross country now. Plenty of smiles in Hempstead, in New Hampshire, after a boy who disappeared Monday was found safe. Police say neighbors discovered the 9-year-old hiding under a bed and eating ice cream.
Police in northern Indiana are looking for the thief who stole a vehicle from a car dealership by using a tow truck outfitted with a crane. Cops say surveillance tape shows the suspect lifting the jeep into the truck bed and then driving away in under six minutes.
And a South Florida woman suffered a severe case of sticker shock after getting a $201,000 cell phone bill. Her brother apparently racked up roaming charges by visiting Canada and then texting repeatedly. The company has since rolled back the bill to less than 3,000 bucks and has given her extra time, wow, to pay the bill.
All right. Coming up, Herman Cain makes no secret of his strong, religious faith. What he doesn't mention as often is his church. We'll go in depth, next.
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WHITFIELD: All right. All week long we're going in depth on Herman Cain as the GOP candidate has surged in the top -- to the top of the pack, thanks to his plain- spoken conservative views and a gift for expressing them.
Now, he honed those speaking skills at his hometown Atlanta Church. John Blake is a writer and producer at CNN.com, he is also a former member of Antioch North Baptist Church, Herman Cain's congregation and he just wrote about the perspective of Herman Cain and whether the congregation would be full heartedly behind Herman Cain. Good to see you, John.
JOHN BLAKE, WRITER AND PRODUCER, CNN.COM: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: Well, yes, you write that -- yes, the Black Church has long been a paradox. It is one of the most politically liberal but theologically conservative institutions in the black community. Cain's house of worship embodies some of those contradictions. So you have to wonder if this church is, indeed, as a whole behind Herman Cain, just based on your statement there.
BLAKE: I think they will be behind him as far as his theology. I mean it is a paradox because the black church a lot of them won't still ordain women, they're very concerned about gay issues but at the same time, a lot of them are very politically liberal.
And I think they will accept Cain, but his politics I think they have a kind of hands-off policy.
WHITFIELD: But there's a conflict?
BLAKE: Well, there's a conflict so long as -- if you talked about politics, I think there's a conflict.
WHITFIELD: What about?
BLAKE: But a lot of them won't really talk about politics with Cain.
WHITFIELD: Will -- will anyone reveal to you, what about his politics would there be a conflict with?
BLAKE: Well, his statement a couple of weeks ago when he said a lot of blacks are brainwashed and they vote Democratic. I think that would offend a lot of people. And in fact it offended some of the clergy in the church as well as in Atlanta. I mean that's implying that black people are like cows, you know, which is a herd mentality. So I think that offended a lot of people.
But, at the same time, there are people in the church who about very proud of Cain. He is a guy that went to Morehouse and went off and made a fortune and came back.
So it's kind of this -- it's like family. You get together for Thanksgiving and you argue about politics, but you still love them in the end.
WHITFIELD: Reverend Alexander, the lead pastor, at Antioch North loves him like he's a son.
BLAKE: Right.
WHITFIELD: But at the same time, has he been outspoken? Because you write that he may have a little internal conflict about some of the politics of Herman Cain.
BLAKE: Right I mean --
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: How are you able to learn what those things are because, Reverend Alexander wouldn't talk to you for the article, nor did Herman Cain.
BLAKE: Right.
WHITFIELD: But who was it that you did talk to who established where he's coming from, where the pastor's coming from?
BLAKE: Well, the two sources we're kind of establishing where Alexander comes from. Pastors to Normandy Church I talked to a couple of those pastors but also Alexander's sermons, his own statements. Here's a guy who said publicly that Rosa Parks and Malcolm X, these are some of my Civil Rights heroes. People -- he said that Dr. King really influences him.
So you can see where he's coming from and that -- you know from that perspective, but also Antioch -- the church that Alexander pastors (ph) is like a -- is a stopping place for civil rights heroes.
So Alexander is definitely not in the camp of -- of Herman Cain's political philosophy. But yet at the same time, people say he's really good friends with him. In fact, Cain sang "The Impossible Dream" at Carmen Alexander 50th anniversary celebration.
WHITFIELD: In your article you're going as far as saying that even Herman Cain feels a little conflicted as well. You write that there is a real contradiction in Cain. That on one hand he says racism is not a huge obstacle for blacks but then admits privately that it is, particularly in Georgia Republican politics?
BLAKE: That came from an assistant pastor in Antioch. And I don't -- I wouldn't say that Cain is a -- has a lot of confidence about this. It's hard for me to peer into his heart to say that. But what I would say is that what that pastor said to me about Cain, is that he's aware that there's racism still out there and he's been unaffected by it but he's not going to make a big issue out of it.
WHITFIELD: All right.
BLAKE: Because the Tea Party members are some of its biggest supporters and he wouldn't want to alienate them.
WHITFIELD: John Blake thanks so much. It's a fascinating article in the belief section of CNN.com. All should read it. BLAKE: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: Thanks so much.
BLAKE: Ok.
WHITFIELD: It's good to see you.
All right, authorities are hunting down exotic animals that have escaped from a farm. The latest on the search now under way in eastern Ohio. As we're minutes away from a news conference updating the situation straight ahead in the NEWSROOM.
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WHITFIELD: Here's a look at stories making news later on today.
At 1:00 Eastern Time, Apple holds a public memorial for its founder, Steve Jobs at the company's campus in Cupertino, California. Many local stores will also close in observance.
At 2:30 Eastern, the Senate committee studies the danger of concussions for athletes of all ages.
And just before 3:00 Eastern Time, President Barack Obama will talk jobs in Virginia at a fire station in North Chesterfield.
We're following lots of developments in the next hour of the CNN NEWSROOM. Let's check in first with Alison Kosik -- Alison.
ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, I'm Alison Kosik at the New York Stock Exchange. I've got some good news for 60 million seniors. You're getting a raise next year. Fredricka I'll have details on that in the next hour.
MAX FOSTER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And I'm Max Foster in London with details of some violent demonstrations in Greece as the government makes even more cutbacks to economy already on its knees -- Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right thanks so much Max and Alison. I'll check back with you momentarily.
And Dewey Bozella (ph) spent 26 years in prison for a murder he didn't commit. And now he had lived out a dream: winning a professional boxing match. I'll actually get a chance to talk with him next hour.
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WHITFIELD: All right. Let's talk a little sports; some little -- Game One World Series. Jeff Fischel here. Oh, my goodness.
JEFF FISCHEL, HLN SPORTS: Finally, we get to the fall classic.
WHITFIELD: That's right.
JEFF FISCHEL: And this is the Rangers and Cardinals.
WHITFIELD: It's been forever.
FISCHEL: It's a long season, no doubt. But finally we're going to have Rangers and Cardinals. Texas owner and president Nolan Ryan says his team will win in six games. Ryan predicted a 90-95 win, regular season. The Rangers won 96. So he knows what he's talking about.
St. Louis Cardinals hosting tonight's Game One. Starting pitchers, C.J. Wilson for the Rangers, and Chris Carpenter for the Cards. St. Louis may have a secret weapon. Cards fans, Kelly and John LaShien (ph), had a baby 11 weeks ago. The 2011 girl comes after their other kids were born in 2004 and 2006. Yes, Cardinals fans know those were also years the team made it to the World Series. I'm sure Cardinals thinking right now, maybe we can get them to keep having babies. Some small signs of hope.
WHITFIELD: You'll never get him to pull out --
(CROSSTALK)
FISCHEL: The NBA lockout, ESPN reports, owners and players, they're ready to talk again. This after a marathon 16-hour session wrapped up early this morning. The federal mediator told both sides not to talk to reporters. These are the main issues right here. You know, we're talking about progress being made, and hopefully we do see signs come in. NBA fans are dying to have a season.
WHITFIELD: Oh, my goodness. I know it.
FISCHEL: Let's do hockey, the Dallas Stars Jamie Ben (ph), taking on the Columbus blue jackets single-handedly. Takes the puck, it's around one man, blows back a couple of other, stand by a fourth and scores. Stars go on to win this one. 3-2. Nice goal by Ben.
Golf now, Keegan Bradley. The shot of the day at the PGA grand slam in Bermuda. 219 yards to the hole. Second shot uphill. Right at the pin -- Eagle on this one, ends the day four under; tied with Rory McIlroy for the lead. Way ahead of Charles Schwartzel and Derek Clark. Of course, they are the four guys that won majors this year.
And a Bellevue, Washington cemetery is offering a golfers-only section. The cemetery is laid out like a golf course. The fairway, greens. Fredricka said --
WHITFIELD: Ok. I don't know. Maybe it's not. It's kind of creepy.
FISCHEL: Even a sand trap dividing the spaces for earn. They got up behind the idea that says golfers who spend a lot of time in the bunker are now free to spend eternity there. I guess there are no --
WHITFIELD: Ok. Wow. That's thought provoking.
(CROSSTALK)
I'm at peace with it, thank you. All right. Thanks Jeff.
