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UC-Davis Police Pepper Spray Protesters; Secret Video Reveals Mistreatment of Hens; Saif al-Islam Gadhafi Finally Behind Bars; 1 in 6 Boys Victim of Sexual Abuse

Aired November 19, 2011 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Animal cruelty. Disturbing undercover video shot by an animal rights group showing chicken cruelty. One huge restaurant chain takes action to stop ordering from the company.

Stopping the cycle of abuse. Three-time tour De France Champ Greg Lemonde tells his own personal story of child sex abuse. He's sharing his deepest and darkest secret to the help other victims.

Celebrating a capture. Moammar Gadhafi's son, finally behind bars. Will he go before a world court to face murder charges against his own people?

And backstage pass. One like you've never seen before. Through the lens of a famous photographer to the biggest rock stars to ever walk the planet.

All of that and more right here right now on CNN.

Good evening, everyone. I'm Don Lemon. Thank you so much for joining us.

The University of California-Davis is investigating what it describes as a chilling incident caught on tape. It happened on Friday night.

A campus police officer is seen spraying occupy protesters with pepper spray point blank in their faces as they sit in a circle. The university says police were trying to clear out the Occupy encampment and felt trapped by the protesters. Eleven people required treatment. Two were hospitalized.

Joining me now live from the UC Davis campus is Sophia Cameron. She was one of the protesters who was pepper sprayed.

Sophia, thank you so much for joining us tonight. Were you shocked when you saw that officer pull out that can?

SOPHIA KAMRAN, PEPPER-SPRAYED PROTESTER: I'm sorry. Could you repeat that?

LEMON: I said were you shocked when you saw that officer pull out that can of pepper spray and start spraying? KAMRAN: I was shocked. When students are sitting on the ground and no way of moving to be violent, being totally peaceful, I don't understand the use of pepper spray against them.

LEMON: Did you suffer any injuries, Sophia?

KAMRAN: For a good two hours afterwards, my eyes still burn. My face and hands still burn when I'm in a warm area. And afterwards when I tried to shower the pepper spray off, it was like feeling the intensity of that first spray all over again.

LEMON: Why did you and your fellow protesters form a circle around the officers, and what's your reaction to their claims that they felt trapped?

KAMRAN: We didn't form a circle around them. At first, they broke into our circle to remove our tents, which was apparently the aim of the riot cops in the first place.

After they remove our tents, they made about five very arbitrary arrests. It could have been any student. It wasn't one person in particular that was acting out. They just arrested who they could, which we felt was unjust. So we stood in solidarity with them or actually we sat in solidarity with them, and asked for them to be set free. And that's why we didn't move from the crossway because police shouldn't arrest people as a show of force. It should be for a reason. And if they've already done their task, they should leave and not continue to agitate and abuse students.

LEMON: So you don't think they felt trapped?

KAMRAN: Yes, I think they've done that.

LEMON: No, I said you don't felt that -- you don't feel like police officers felt trapped? They said they felt trapped by you guys.

KAMRAN: I think they could have stopped?

LEMON: No, no, they said that they felt trapped by you forming this circle or this line in front of them.

KAMRAN: Oh. I can't speak on behalf of them. I saw briefly in videos that there were students around them. That was not something that was planned. We who were sitting on the floor were not the only ones blocking them. In fact, we were sitting down.

The students that I will put in quotes "encircled them" actually were bystanders who became engaged with our struggle as it was going on. They weren't people who were there all day, which I think goes to show that they felt something was happening on their campus and they needed to defend us and those that were arrested.

LEMON: OK. Sophia, the chancellor has set up a task force to investigate the incident. Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LINDA P. B. KATEHI, CHANCELLOR, UC-DAVIS: We always hope that students will follow the appropriate policies. Policies exist to allow 60,000 people to use this campus effectively and safely. I don't believe that it's appropriate for me to resign at this point. Really, I do not think that I have violated the policies of the institution. As a matter of fact, I have personally worked very hard to make this campus a safe campus for all.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

LEMON: So Sophia, you and others are calling for the chancellor's resignation. Why do you blame her for what the officers did, and what did you think of her response?

KAMRAN: What do I think of her response?

LEMON: Yes.

KAMRAN: I think professor put it very well. We are trained as students in the university to see through the rhetoric of those trying to defend actions that are indefensible. A task force will accomplish nothing. Her resignation is what we are currently asking for. And in that, I and many of my fellow students will not participate in a task force with her. She made her choice that day. And we now stand in solidarity with each other in asking for her resignation.

LEMON: All right, thank you. And the chancellor said she is not going to resign.

Sophia Kamran from UC-Davis, we appreciate it. Thank you for joining us.

We want to go now to another story, one that may be very hard to watch. It is graphic and it is sickening, and it will probably make you think twice the next time you order eggs from a fast food restaurant.

CNN affiliate WGN has the disturbing details. Again, viewer discretion is advised.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (via telephone): Hundreds of hens crammed into wire cages with no room to move, dead hens left rotting in cages, workers burning off the beaks of chicks without painkillers -- it even shows one worker swinging a bird around on a rope.

The company in question is called Sparboe Farms. The undercover footage comes from its facilities in Iowa, Minnesota and Colorado. The facility in Vincent, Iowa produced all eggs for McDonald's restaurants west of the Mississippi.

NATHAN RUNKLE, EXEC. DIR., MERCY FOR ANIMALS: Most of this abuse took place in front of or by supervisors and managers at this factory farm. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Twenty-seven-year old Nathan Runkle is the executive director of Mercy for Animals -- an animal rights group based in Chicago he founded when he was only 15-years old. They're dedicated to preventing cruelty to farm animals.

RUNKLE: To know that this abuse is taking place for McDonalds and for Egg McMuffins, I think, really shocks and appalls people. So, we're hoping the company really steps up to the plate and makes some meaningful policy changes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After the footage was exposed, the fast food giant announced it would stop buying eggs from the company.

McDonalds released a statement which reads in part, "Based upon recent information, we are no longer accepting eggs from Sparboe. This is not a food safety issue for our menu items. We can assure our customers that eggs in our entire supply chain meet McDonald's high standards for quality and safety."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: That was WGN reporting. And the president of Sparboe Farms put out a response on the company Web site.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

BETH SPARBOE SCHNELL, OWNER & PRESIDENT, SPARBOE FARMS: The acts depicted in the footage are unacceptable, inconsistent with our values as farmers and violate our animal care policies and procedures. We immediately began an internal investigation and have identified the individuals responsible for these actions including at least one animal activist.

These men worked together on a traveling crew and made the videos on several of our farms. Because we have zero tolerance for animal abuse, the men responsible for these acts have left, been terminated or placed on leave. Our investigation is ongoing and any other individuals involved will be held accountable."

(END VIDEOCLIP)

LEMON: In a written statement, she said, "An independent audit by Iowa State University found Sparboe Farms in full compliance with animal welfare policies."

Let's talk some politics now, shall we. Iowa is back in the spotlight for the Republican presidential hopefuls. The state's first in the nation caucuses are a little more than six weeks away and most of the top candidates attended tonight's Thanksgiving family forum in Des Moines. A gathering of social conservatives, a group that's essential for the successes in Iowa Republican and Iowa Republican contests.

And I want to go to Shannon now.

Shannon, how did this event go? SHANNON TRAVIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It went pretty well. I mean, there were six presidential candidates. And about 3,000 Christian Evangelicals gathered here to hear what they say. Just a few highlights.

It was a fairly friendly discussion. They talked about faith and family and values. They even talked about economy and foreign affairs, but wrapped around the issue of morality. It went fairly well until Michele Bachmann, everyone hadn't even left the building yet, the candidates. She sent out an e-mail basically saying that Newt Gingrich hasn't been consistently against abortion rights. We asked Newt Gingrich about that, and he said he hadn't seen the e-mail and he wouldn't really comment on it. Don.

LEMON: So Mitt Romney was not there. What was the reaction to his decision not to come, Shannon?

TRAVIS: Yes, Mitt Romney was not here. As you know, he was campaigning in New Hampshire at the same time. The reaction was not kind. Take a listen at what have Bob Vander Plaats. He is the president and CEO of this organization. Take a listen at what he had to say about Mitt Romney's absence.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

BOB VANDER PLAATS, PRESIDENT, THE FAMILY LEADER: Romney was the only one who stiffed us. And I think that's gone with his persona in how he's treating Iowa, which happens to be a swing state and he wants to win the presidency, which tells me he lacks judgment.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

TRAVIS: Pretty harsh words from Bob Vander Plaats. Two other things of note about Romney, Don. For one, he's opening up his first Iowa campaign headquarters here. He's already opened it up, actually. We just learned about it though. And he just got the endorsement from Senator Kelly Ayotte of New Hampshire -- up in New Hampshire. That may hold some sway with some conservatives maybe in that state and elsewhere. Don.

LEMON: All right. I neglected to say Shannon Travis when I introduced you. You're like Cher, one name, Shannon.

Thank you very much, Shannon. We appreciate you joining us.

Tuesday night on CNN, the Republican presidential hopefuls will take part in a debate on national security and the economy. It's hosted by Wolf Blitzer and cosponsored by the Heritage Foundation and the American Enterprise Institute. Watch it right here, 8:00 p.m. Eastern Tuesday night on CNN.

Before Libya's revolution many people thought Saif al-Islam Gadhafi would be the country's next leader. But tonight Moammar Gadhafi's son is in custody. His fate in the hands of men he once described as rats. Jomana Karadsheh looks at his fall and what's next for him. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A day of celebration in Libya. Many calling it the true end of the Gadhafi era. Once the heir apparent to his father's iron-fisted rule, now Saif Al-Islam Gadhafi is a prisoner of war held in an undisclosed location in the western Mountain City of Zintan. He was caught in the remote southern deserts of Libya. It appeared he had been seeking to escape into neighboring Niger.

After an hour long fire fight, these fighters from Zintan hold up the silver rifle taken from his hands. Libyan officials say he will be soon transferred to Tripoli where they want him to stand trial. The new interim prime minister reassuring the international community that his country is capable of providing a fair trial.

Human Rights Watch on Saturday called on Libyan authorities to treat Saif Al-Islam humanely and to hand him over to the international criminal court. The apparent killings in custody of Moammar Gadhafi and his son, Moatassem Gadhafi, on October 20th are particular cause for concern about Saif Al-Islam's treatment. Human Rights Watch said in a statement. "The international criminal court that has built a case against Saif Al-Islam for alleged crimes against humanity says a decision will be made on where he will face justice."

LUIS MORENO-OCAMPO, PROSECUTOR OF THE ICC: The rules are clear. The judges will decide but the rules are the primacy for the national authorities, depending if they have a case. So we will discuss that. I think, in some way now, it's an easy time. The difficult time was to stop the crimes and arrest him. Now it's easy.

KARADSHEH: Ocampo is expected to travel to Libya next week. Many Libyans say with the capture of the most wanted man comes an end to their fears of an insurgency he could have formed to destabilize Libya's fragile hold on freedom.

Jomana Karadsheh, CNN, Tripoli.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Up next, three-time Tour de France champion Greg Lemonde shares his own deep dark secrets about sexual abuse in the wake of the Penn State scandal. CNN education contributor Steve Perry will tell us how common it is in the school system.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Have an incredible statistic to think about for you as a child rape scandal unfolds at Penn State. One in every six boys, according to researchers, is sexually abused before age 18. So often victims lock the pain away and never get the help they need.

That's why the group "One in Six" exists. To let men know they're not alone. That it's not their fault and that it can happen to practically anyone including a three-time winner of the Tour de France. Greg Lemonde was the first American to ever win the tour back in 1986, but he carried with him a secret, sexual abuse that he says he suffered at the hands of a family friend when he was just 12 years old. Now Lemonde is on the board of "One in Six," committed to helping others like him. He described to me what he went through.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GREG LEMONDE, SAYS HE WAS SEXUALLY ABUSED: Actually, I would sleep in my room as a guest and stay over probably every couple weeks, come visit and at one point, you know, he -- while I was asleep, sexually abused me and it was something that was really confusing. Really confusing.

LEMON: Have you ever confronted -- have you ever confronted him?

LEMONDE: I couldn't figure out where he was. And, of course, I hired an investigator and about three minutes later he gave me the address. And my wife called to find out where he is. You know at working. And literally, it had been in the news, and what we found out that he had just left, moved to Italy. That's the last thing I've heard.

LEMON: When you heard about Penn State, and you hear about what's in the grand jury report, "A 10-year-old boy, the assistant coach, the graduate assistant saying that he saw, which basically was rape, the rape of what appeared to be a 10-year-old boy in the shower, and then leaving that boy with the person who he's seeing doing it to him in the act."

What went through your head? What did you think about that?

LEMONDE: Even the thought that a man would see what happened to that boy and not report it is disturbing. If it was a girl, I would believe and hope that somebody would report it regardless, boy or girl. But I do believe if it was a girl, it would definitely be reported. It's something -- it's taboo. I've tried to -- I've personally put money into this foundation "One in Six," and just the act of trying to ask and get contributions and something that I think is the economic impact in the psychological damage is so huge, I mean, it is -- you can't even calculate it. And it's even hard for me to ask because it's -- I know there's going to be this squeamish reaction.

LEMON: How has your life been different after your abuse was revealed to the world?

LEMONDE: I can see myself heading towards a self-destructive pattern. And I told my wife, I finally just kind of had -- could not hold it anymore and blurted it out. But the relief of that, holding that secret for so long, and that's probably the most damage that happens is that you feel somehow that you're part of it, you were responsible for it.

LEMON: Your sexual abuse came to light in 2007 during a hearing and Floyd Landis' doping scandal. And you urged him to confess. And so you shared the secret of your abuse with him, and then later you said that Landis' manager called you, pretended to be your accuser to blackmail you to keep you from testifying. Am I correct with this?

LEMONDE: That's correct. That's correct. I was trying to not mention names but you're right. And it was I had just landed my wife headed towards the hotel and got a call, and it was claiming to be my uncle and sadly my only uncle that was living, it got out. And I tried to tell him that this wasn't him. But it got out that it was my uncle and it wasn't an uncle. It was a family friend.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Have you forgiven Floyd Landis for doing that?

LEMONDE: Yes. Well, yes, I've forgiven him. I see that he was, you know, really poorly advised and desperate.

LEMON: You don't believe in silence because you're here. You certainly haven't stayed silent on the issue of doping in cycling. What's your relationship like these days with Lance Armstrong?

LEMONDE: I haven't talked about him in a long time. But I have zero relationship. He's not somebody I want to even put energy into, to be honest. Let's just say there's a federal investigation right now, and I'm not really familiar with it. I know that there's an investigation. And I -- I believe that there's where there's smoke, there's fire.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Thank you, Greg, for that.

Next, education contributor Steve Perry tells us how common sexual abuse is in our schools. And why he thinks more men will now come forward about being sexually abused.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK. Parents, please listen up. Child sex abuse in our schools. While the headlines are focused on the alleged scandals at several universities including Penn State and Syracuse, abuse is happening to children all the time. All across the country.

Let's talk to this man now. Steve Perry, a CNN education contributor and a principal at a public school in Hartford, Connecticut. He joins us now live from Hartford.

Steve, you've been an educator for many years now. Level with us. How bad is this problem?

STEVE PERRY, CNN EDUCATOR CONTRIBUTOR: At least three times a year, I find myself in a situation where I have a child and I say child, that could even be a high schooler who has divulged some form of sexual abuse, if not rape, full-on rape to us in a number of ways. It comes out through an English paper, it comes out through a conversation with a friend who then tells us. This is common. It's sad, but it's common.

LEMON: And you're talking -- these are students you're saying in your own school.

PERRY: Oh, yes.

LEMON: This isn't just in the school system where you are, right?

PERRY: Oh, no, no, no. This is just in our school. We have a small school. And we're not different. You'll find it pretty regularly that children are struggling to find out how this happened to them or why. And so our first reaction is to tell the children that they've done something very, very courageous.

They think they've shamed their parents so they try to hide it from their parents. They feel like they've done something wrong. They try to hold it inside. And maybe if they do something right, it won't happen to them anymore.

What the first thing that we want to do is we sit down and talk to our children is let them know, a, that we love them and b, that they didn't do anything to have this happen to them. This person is sick. It's not about this person being a homosexual or heterosexual. They are pedophile. That's its own circumstance.

LEMON: That's it's own. OK, so listen, you say that you think that there's going to be more young victims coming forward. Why, Steve?

PERRY: Well, because now we're starting to have a conversation, especially boys. Before it was this, if I can say sissy complex where if you came out, somebody was going to call you a sissy especially if you're a boy to say that you had in fact made this situation occur.

But when we look at amateur athletics, the environment is ripe for rape to occur. Because many of these men are left alone with the children and sometimes especially when you look at AAU in particular, children are traveling across state lines staying in hotels with grown men who have not been vetted.

There's been no background check there because somebody said to them they can be a coach. And so parents don't have as much control over what's happening in these settings. And so I think that's one.

Another reason, very pedestrian, many of us are fathers now and we have young sons and daughter who are playing sports. And so some of us who maybe have experiences that are coming out and say, hey, man, that guy's still a coach. Something's wrong with him. You need to go in and do something with that coach.

LEMON: What you know now, you don't want it to happen to your own child. And listen Steve, you and I have been talking about this, texting each other. You are very passionate about this issue.

What should parents do to protect their children? I know that's a standard question that you hear on the news. But what should parents do. It's not -- listen, it's not the creepy guy with the trench coat that everybody thinks about.

PERRY: No, no, no. It's the guy -- these guys, listen, these guys are predators. Just like a predator, it lure the kid in with gifts. So if you see a grown behind man giving children gifts and it's not their birthday, you needed to ask yourself why spending an exorbitant amount of time with children when it's out of the context on what they should be doing. That's a problem. No child should be spending the night at a grown man or woman's house. There's no reason for that. Parents, you got to use your noggin.

In addition to that, go as much as possible to what the children's activities are. So if it's a dance instructor or if it's a basketball coach, you need to be there.

And here's the other part. Cut out the fat in the schedule. Meaning that if you do have somebody pick your child up and take your child to a basketball game because for some reason you can't take him there, you should know about how long it takes to get to and from a game. There shouldn't be that much downtime. Your child doesn't need that much downtime with grown people. They need to be around children, so it's imperative that parents ask questions of their children and get to know the person.

It's difficult because here's the other side of this, Don. Many of our parents end up blaming themselves. They've ask themselves what did I do wrong. Some of these suggestions that I'm giving can help you. But the truth is, a predator is a predator is a predator, and they're going to find children. That's the scary thing.

LEMON: And I have to go. You said every single kid that you come across, you said at least three every year, sometimes more, the kid always has some degree of culpability. I shouldn't have done this. It's my fault in a certain way, correct?

PERRY: Yes, they all do. All the kids come in and the first thing they say, they apologize. They apologize for what they've done.

LEMON: Because they think they've done something wrong and that's how the predator gets away with it. Steve, we're out of time.

PERRY: They completely internalized that -- yes.

LEMON: Thank you so much. Thank you for your passion. Thanks for coming on. We'll have you back again.

Steve Perry, our education contributor here on CNN joining us this evening. Again, thanks to Steve.

When we come back, an update on our top story. We're going to talk with the chancellor of UC-Davis about what she calls the chilling pepper spray incident on her campus.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) LEMON: All right. Updating our top story right now. The University of California-Davis is investigating what it describes as a "chilling" incident caught on tape. It happened Friday night. A campus police officer seen spraying Occupy protesters with pepper spray pointblank in their faces as they sat in a line.

University says police were trying to clear out the Occupy encampment and felt trapped by the protesters. Eleven people required treatment. Two were hospitalized. Joining us now UC-Davis Chancellor Linda Katehi.

Thank you, Chancellor, for joining us. So the question...

LINDA KATEHI, CHANCELLOR, UC-DAVIS (via telephone): You're welcome. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak with you.

LEMON: You said that it was a sad day or a day that you would not want to remember on campus on Friday. Explain what you meant by that.

KATEHI: Well, we had -- we had an event that I hope we will not really see again on our campus. We have been in the last two and a half weeks dealing with student unrest. Our students are very upset. And they are very frustrated and they are trying to find ways to express this frustration.

On Thursday, they tried to -- they created a camp. They set up a camp on our quad, and which is against university policies for a number of reasons. Safety, primarily, is one concern and health. Now, the group that set up the camp was not only UC-Davis students but the group had individuals from outside of our community, which really increased our ability to help them and provide support. We were very worried about their own security, safety and their own health.

LEMON: Well, Chancellor...

KATEHI: They just wanted to stay on the quad for the whole weekend.

LEMON: Chancellor, let me jump in here. Chancellor...

KATEHI: So, we worked with them for almost a day and a half trying to explain the policies and provide them with opportunities to express their frustration through other means, through other forums. We have -- we allow them to have, of course, public demonstrations and rallies and other discussion forums. All of these were opportunities that we wanted to provide to them. And a few students decided to, in fact, take the tents and go away but there was a group...

LEMON: Chancellor.

KATEHI: ...that decided to stay. And we wanted the police as a matter...

LEMON: She can't hear me. Can we just kill her mike? She can't hear me. Sorry, we're going to have to get back to the chancellor. She can't hear me and we are out of time, and I wanted to jump in and ask her a few questions. But when she's on the phone like that, if she's talking, she can't hear me jumping in. But again that is the chancellor for UC-Davis.

Chancellor, can you hear me now?

KATEHI: Yes, I can hear you.

LEMON: So, Chancellor, you have to -- hang on. Before you start talking, you have to -- short answers because when you're talking on the phone, you can't hear me jumping in, and I'm trying to ask you questions, OK?

KATEHI: OK.

LEMON: So I'm going to ask you -- did the students tell you what were they protesting specifically? What were their demands?

KATEHI: They did not have demands. They were protesting primarily against the economic situation in the state of California...

LEMON: OK.

KATEHI: ...the situation with higher education, the increased tuition, the lack of jobs and all of these environment that they are facing themselves.

LEMON: OK. And you said that you are calling in a task force. You're going to create a task force.

KATEHI: Yes.

LEMON: ...to deal with the situation and to investigate it.

KATEHI: Primarily the police. I found these actions the police took this morning to be unacceptable.

LEMON: OK. Are you going to resign as the students have been asking?

KATEHI: We really want to look into this very carefully and take action.

LEMON: Are you going to resign as the students have been asking? They've demanded that you resign.

KATEHI: No. In fact, I think what I am committed to doing is to really take action, pay attention to what has been happening, and make sure that this will never happen again on our campus.

LEMON: All right. UC-Davis Chancellor Linda Katehi. Thank you very much. We appreciate you joining us.

Let's move on now and talk about one of the biggest casino cheating scams in U.S. history and it was caught on surveillance cam. We're going to show you how a blackjack ring used a phony card shuffle to rake in millions before getting caught. That's right after the break.

But first, Dr. Sanjay Gupta's new CNN program profiles innovators from all walks of life and in all fields of endeavor. This week on "THE NEXT LIST," he talks with Christopher Brosius, a cab driver turned award-winning perfumer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTOPHER BROSIUS, PERFUMER: I can remember scent very, very accurately, which I'm told from even like really excellent researchers at the Monell Center in Philadelphia that people can't do this. I can't imagine how they can't, but I'm told they can't. I catalog smells in my head. I remember them. I can pull them and start arranging them in my head without even doing anything physically.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Make sure you tune in Sundays to watch "THE NEXT LIST" or set your DVR for it. It's at 2:00 p.m. Eastern.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: As car cheats go, these guys were pros. They hit casino after casino. Surveillance video showed how the team -- there they go, how the team used hi-tech equipment, hand signals and slight of hand shuffling to rake in millions of dollars. But their luck ran out at the blackjack table in San Diego.

George Joseph is founder of the Worldwide Casino Consulting, an expert on casino security and he is here to demonstrate some of the techniques that these cheats used.

George, thank you for joining us. The dealer was in on the scam and he used something called a false shuffle. Explain that to us.

GEORGE JOSEPH, FOUNDER, WORLDWIDE CASINO CONSULTING: OK. To demonstrate that, I'm going to show you a deck of cards that are -- that are in order. And for the demonstration you're going to think that the cards are being shuffled.

And this is called the riffle shuffle and it looks as though the cards are mixed, and in fact, the cards are still in the same order.

LEMON: So nothing is mixed.

JOSEPH: Nothing is mixed. Now, if you knew the order of playing cards coming out in any round of play, you would have a big -- have a big edge on the casino. You would know how to bet on which side in a baccarat game. You would know the outcome of a blackjack hand and so on.

LEMON: OK.

JOSEPH: So, that was kind of what the genius of cram (ph) was.

LEMON: All right. So the false shuffle, just one component. What did -- what did the others do?

JOSEPH: The others were bettors and or trackers, and in some cases just locked up the table, so that the -- so that some innocent player wouldn't sit down and mess up the order of the cards.

LEMON: OK. So they reportedly hit 29 casinos and stole about $7 million. Why did it take so long to catch them?

JOSEPH: That's a very good question. You know, given that virtually every one of their instances were on videotape. Sometimes it's a lack of communication between the floor and the eye. Sometimes the false shuffle was so good that they didn't recognize it as a false shuffle. And until they got intelligence from other casinos around and then pieced it together, so it took a while to piece the -- to put the thing together.

LEMON: Yes. So, you know, it's almost like an "Oceans 11" thing, George. A lot of people try to scam casinos. And this one, well, you said it was so successful because sometimes the false shuffle was so good.

Was it the number of people who were in on it? And does it have anything to do with technology? Does technology help? Do you see the people speaking into their cigarettes there? Or is it just you have to be in on it at the casino with the dealer and the people working there?

JOSEPH: Well, it's really kind of a combination of both. You know, in the early days, you would memorize a group of cards in order and keep that order. Then they moved to, as I said, tape recorders and then microphones and hidden cameras and now cell phones.

But what really made the scam for blackjack so profitable for the bad guys was the use of a computer program that allowed you to put cards randomly into the -- excuse me -- into the computer program. And then on the next round of play, it would tell you how many hands to play, how many cards to draw in order to break the dealer. And then adjust the number of hands to play. So that technology wasn't available 30 some years ago when it first started.

LEMON: George Joseph, good information. Thank you, and I appreciate you showing us the false shuffle. We like the demonstration.

JOSEPH: My pleasure.

LEMON: Thank you. Have a great evening.

JOSEPH: Thank you.

LEMON: Is there water on one of Jupiter's moons? Jacqui Jeras joins me next for Saturday night mysteries.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Once in a while, atmospheric conditions are just right to create a phenomenon known as sundogs.

Jacqui Jeras here with Saturday night mysteries.

JACQUI JERAS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes.

LEMON: OK, Jacqui, what is a sundog?

JERAS: You've seen sundogs, right? You know, you see the sun, you see like a mirror image on either side of the sun. It's caused by ice crystals. But look at this video. See that flash.

LEMON: OK. Now I get it. Yes.

JERAS: That's like a dancing or a flashing sundog. Yes. This video was shot a couple months ago actually in Singapore, but it's making the rounds right now on YouTube as well as in Facebook. And everybody's like, what the heck is causing that dancing cloud?

Well, basically, you know, it's formed of ice crystals because it's so high in the atmosphere that it's cold, and those crystals can move and rotate whenever the electrical field in the atmosphere changes.

So look at the big cloud back behind it. That's a thunderstorm cloud, my friend.

(CROSSTALK)

JERAS: Thunderstorm clouds create lightning. So whenever a lightning, you know, strike happens, then it changes the electrical charge in the area. And that thing jumps.

LEMON: That's really cool.

JERAS: That's cool.

LEMON: I like the clouds on an airplane. Whenever -- when you go like next to a thunderstorm and it's amazing. It's scary but it's amazing.

JERAS: Cool stuff.

LEMON: Let's talk about water on Jupiter's moon.

JERAS: I know. We all think that alien life is going to happen on Mars, right? You think of little green men or where they're going to have the big discovery. But researchers now from the University of Texas in Austin have discovered liquid water on just underneath the ice crust of Jupiter. And this is a huge discovery. There's so much water there, it could fill the Great Lakes, all five of them. Believe it or not.

LEMON: Really?

JERAS: Yes. So, it's a huge thing because water means life.

LEMON: Life, yes.

JERAS: So there are all these cracks on the surface of Jupiter's moon here. Well, this is one of like six moons, by the way. And those crabs they think are because of the warmer water underneath which is making that ice crack.

LEMON: OK. I want to get to this real quick. Whatever happened to Gordon from "Sesame Street"?

JERAS: Well, he's still there if you watch "Sesame Street". But look at this guy. Do you know who this man is? Look familiar?

LEMON: He's my uncle.

JERAS: Is he? Your long lost cousin perhaps?

"Sesame Street" wants to know. OK. There have been like three other Gordons since the show's beginning. But this is the very first Gordon. He shot the test pilot and then he never made the final cut. So he wasn't on the real show. And they've gone back through all of their archives and they can't figure out who it is. Not even, you know, lifers on the show.

So, if you know who he is, they want you to e-mail to whereisgordon@sesamestreet.org.

LEMON: We're going to put out a -- what do you call that -- an APB, an all points bulletin, on Gordon. If you know who he is, let us know. Tweet me at donlemoncnn or...

JERAS: He's a good dancer, I know that.

LEMON: ...or at Jacqui Jeras, right, your Twitter?

JERAS: Yes, just Jacqui Jeras.

LEMON: Jacqui Jeras, thank you. All right. Appreciate it.

All right. Here's a quick look at Sunday, ahead at Sunday.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Fredricka Whitfield. Tune in Sunday in the 2:00 Eastern hour for my face-to-face conversation with actor Isaiah Washington. Where has he been since the stormy departure from the hit TV show "Grey's Anatomy"? And he answers this --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Do you ever watch the show?

ISAIAH WASHINGTON, ACTOR: I peek in, I'm not allowed to, because I love Sandra Oh.

Yes. I see her with that Owen guy.

WHITFIELD: That was your counterpart, your love interest on the show.

WASHINGTON: I'll be lying to you if I said I don't peek in because I just adore Miss Sandra Oh.

WHITFIELD: Do you ever tune in and say I wish I was still there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: That's tomorrow, 2:00 Eastern hour. Don?

LEMON: All, Fred, thank you very much. Sorry to step on you right there, Fred.

Coming up next, we're going to see this. Her dream was to become a ballerina and she refused to be held back because of the color of her skin. See how this young lady is sharing her passion for dance with the next generation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: An unlikely ballerina is raising the bar in the mainly white world of classical ballet. In this week's "What Matters," our Suzanne Malveaux introduces us to Misty Copeland, an award-winning dancer, who is inspiring young girls of color to stay on their toes.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SUSAN MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Misty Copeland isn't your average ballerina. She's the first black female soloist for the American Ballet Theater in more than 20 years.

MISTY COPELAND, BALLERINA: I think that most people's idea of what a classical ballerina is is a white woman, very thin. You know, Petite without curves.

MALVEAUX: Outside the ballerina world, curvy may not be the word you would use to describe Misty. But she is reshaping the idea of what a ballerina should look like.

COPELAND: A lot of the challenges, I think, black women in ballet face are feeling like you don't look like, you know, the people around you.

MALVEAUX: Copeland began dancing at age 13 and was often the only black girl in her dance classes. She says race wasn't an issue when she fell in love with ballet.

COPELAND: I never questioned myself. I never thought I'm not a ballerina because I don't look like the girl next to me.

MALVEAUX: And now she's on a mission to make sure young minority girls feel the same way through her work with organizations like the Boys and Girls Club. She hopes to encourage dancers of color to be true to themselves.

IMANI DEJESUS, BALLET STUDENT: She taught us that even if we're different, if we're unique, we can be just as equal as anybody else.

MALVEAUX: Copeland says the first step is to follow your dreams.

COPELAND: The message I want to send to them is just that anything is possible if you truly are passionate about it and give it your all.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: And Copeland's next performance at the American Ballet Theater will be this summer in "Firebird." She is also designing a dancewear line for curvy ballerinas.

Bob Dylan, Bruce Springsteen, the Rolling Stones and many others. There's one lucky guy who got to hang out with them and take pictures. He's the author of this photography book. You're going to meet him next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: If Bob Dylan asks to you go on tour and be his official photographer, well, you say yes. Ken Regan got that offer back in 1975. His experiences are documented in a new book and it's "All Access". That's the name of this book. "The Rock 'N' Roll Photography of Ken Regan."

In his first ever TV interview, Regan tells me about touring with Dylan and the stories behind some of the historic photographs.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KEN REGAN, PHOTOGRAPHER: Bob hired me in '75 to be the tour photographer on the "Rolling Thunder Review." Every night, Bob and I would sit down either in his hotel room or backstage and we look at the contact sheets from the two previous days and I would project color on the wall. And I think it was like the third or fourth week and Bob says, hey, Ken, come here, I've got to show you something. I was just setting up the projector.

He said, see this photograph? And he points to the one in the hat and the scarf. And he said, this is the best picture that's ever been taken of me.

I mean, what do you say when someone says that? I just said wow. And he held that photograph for 28 years. Now, we didn't have a contract. We only had a handshake but every time a magazine wanted to do a photograph of Bob on the cover, you know, I would always run it out by his manager, and they kept saying no, no, no, Bob wants to hold this, Bob wants to hold this.

And I said to Jeff Rosen one day, I said, what does he want to do hold this for his obit? I mean, the Kennedy Center was honoring him. They wanted to use it on the cover. The Oscars wanted to use it.

So, finally in -- I think it was 2003 or 2004, Jeff calls me up and he said, Ken, guess what, Bob is finally going to release the live music from the Rolling Thunder tour and he wants to use that photograph on the cover of the CD. And I said wow, finally.

Once this tour started, and it was getting a lot of press. I mean everybody wanted to join the tour. Bruce came up to see the show. And that year, you know, Bruce had been on the cover of "Time" magazine and "Newsweek" the same week. And you know, he was kind of inching past Bob as, you know, the super folk rock singer. And it was the first time they ever met. You know, and he came into the dressing room and, you know, I was in there by myself with Bob.

And Bruce came in, and they started talking and I took about, I don't know, eight or nine frames, and I just decided, you know, I've got the photograph. Let me get out of here. Let me leave them alone for a while.

So I go into the dressing room, I said, Bob, you'll never guess who's here. He said who. I said Muhammad Ali. He said you got to be kidding. He said he wants to see you. He said OK.

So, he brings him in, and his manager must have had this in a box or something like that because Muhammad brings this box in and he takes out a boxing glove larger than Bob Dylan. It was gold and he presents it to Bob. And then you know, they chatted and I posed the two of them together.

And at one point in time, I was going to say, you know, should I get an apple box because Bob is so much shorter than Ali.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: And you can find my entire interview with Ken Regan on CNN.com. Thanks for watching. Good night.