Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Attorney General Under Fire; Two Dead In Shooting At Virginia Tech; Obama: Ask Bin Laden; Senate Rejects President's Nominee to Head Consumer Protection Board; Orrin Hatch Interview; Shoe Company Uses All Recycled Material

Aired December 08, 2011 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Top of the hour now. I'm Fredricka Whitfield, in for Brooke Baldwin.

Again, we're watching a breaking story out of Blacksburg, Virginia. You're looking at pictures right now thanks to our affiliate there at the Virginia Tech campus. It is on lockdown because of a shooting that took place earlier today.

Police are looking for a suspected gunman. What we do understand, according to Virginia Tech authorities, two people were shot dead. One was a police officer making a routine stop on the campus. And then according to eyewitness accounts, the alleged gunman then took off to a parking lot where another person was killed.

Still unclear, the identity of that person, but, again, the entire campus on lockdown as authorities continue to look for this suspected gunman.

Now watch this.

An emergency summit to save the euro, Jon Corzine on the hot seat over millions of missing dollars. Jerry Sandusky a free man for now. And possible dangers of two birth control drugs.

(STOCK MARKET UPDATE)

WHITFIELD: All right, next, Jason Carroll in Bellefonte, Pennsylvania, Where former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky just posted a quarter of a million dollar bail.

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Fredricka, Jerry Sandusky was released from the Centre County Correctional Facility. He is now back at home under house arrest.

Cameras were there as he pulled into his driveway. He is out on $250,000 bail. As part of his bail, he will have to wear some sort of an electronic monitoring device. Also, he will not be allowed to have any contact with any victims or any potential witnesses. He can have no unsupervised contact with any minors, this all the result of being arrested yesterday.

He now faces new allegations of sexually abusing two boys. That now brings the number to 10 victims, alleged victims, who say Jerry Sandusky sexually abused them when they were young boys. His next legal hurdle will be his preliminary hearing, Fredricka. That is set for next Tuesday.

WHITFIELD: All right. Thanks so much, Jason Carroll.

The makers of the birth control pills Yaz and Yasmin are in the hot seat. The FDA want to know if Bayer concealed information about dangerous side effects.

Our senior medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen, is here.

So, Elizabeth, what are we learning about these drugs that perhaps people did not know before?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, these were heavily, marketed drugs. You saw ads for them all over the place. Women together and running through fields and looking happy.

And what some are alleging is that studies that were done, not by Bayer, who markets the drug, but by independent doctors, that they show that this drug has a two to three times higher blood clot risk than what the Bayer studies showed.

WHITFIELD: They didn't know this before? Or is this data new?

COHEN: Well, here's what's happening here is that plaintiffs, people who are suing say that in fact, Bayer knew about this and basically hid it.

I want to introduce to you a woman. She is 20 years old. Her name is Elizabeth Rippee. She died on Christmas Eve 2008. And her twin sister and her mother will be testifying. They said she was perfectly heavy (sic). She had taken other birth control pills before.

But after a couple of months of being on Yaz, she collapsed. It turned out she had a blood clot and they say doctors say that it was because of Yaz.

WHITFIELD: OK. Now, when someone sees an advertisement for a drug, they figure it is FDA-approved. That means it is safe pending what your doctor prescribes. Should people rethink how they look at ads?

COHEN: I think people should rethink how they look at ads. And here's why.

If you see an ad for a drug, it is pretty much by definition new. And new means expensive. And they're pushing it because they want to make money. New drugs are not as tested as old drugs. If you're seeing an ad like this one here, new drug, has not been tried out most likely on millions and millions of people yet. And drugs that have been tried out on millions and millions of people are -- we know more about them. They have more of a track record will.

So before you go to your doctor and say, hey, give me that thing I saw on TV, think again. You might want something older that has more of a track record. And, remember, if you're seeing these ads, guess who is in your doctor's office most likely?

WHITFIELD: How interesting.

COHEN: Drug reps pushing the same drug. So your doctor has been told, this is the greatest thing ever. You're being told this is the greatest thing ever. And, really, it might be just as good or maybe even worse than drugs that are already out there.

I also want to add here that Bayer says Yaz and Yasmin are safe and they say that may be giving a statement by the end of the day.

WHITFIELD: OK. We will look forward to that. Thanks so much, Elizabeth.

COHEN: Thanks.

WHITFIELD: All right, meantime, this just in now. We're getting word that exams, final exams have been postponed on the campus of Virginia Tech. Earlier, we have been reporting to you that the entire campus is on lockdown now on this first day of what would have been final exams. There was a shooting on campus.

At least two people, according to Virginia Tech authorities, two people have been killed, including that of a police officer making a routine traffic stop. We will give you more information as we learn it, but, meantime, those exams have been postponed, but lockdown still in place.

Up next, Eric Holder under fire and on the hot seat. The attorney general called to testify on the operation that sent guns to drug cartels and Republicans aren't forgiving, floating words like jail, lies, and even impeachment. That's next.

Plus, they died serving this country, yet the remains of dozens of U.S. troops were dumped in a landfill -- why the military's mistake is worse than previously thought.

Stay right here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: If it's interesting and happening right now, you're about to see it, "Rapid Fire." Let's go.

The U.S. military now confirms partial cremated remains of at least 274 troops ended up in a Virginia landfill. "The Washington Post" reports mishandling of body parts at Dover Air Force Mortuary was much more widespread than first believed. Dumping military ashes as medical waste was halted in 2008. Partial cremated remains are now buried at sea.

Former Syracuse university assistant basketball coach Bernie Fine is being sued for alleged sexual abuse of a minor. The suit filed today by Zachary Tomaselli accuses Fine of molesting him in a Pittsburgh hotel room after a game in 2002. There are questions about Tomaselli's credibility. A prosecutor has given Fine's lawyers evidence that may help them try to disprove Tomaselli's allegations.

And Eric Holder is on the hot seat. The attorney general testifying again on Capitol Hill about the infamous Fast and Furious debacle. The operation sent hundreds of weapons into the hands of drug cartels. Republicans blasted Holder for shifting blame.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMES SENSENBRENNER (R), WISCONSIN: What are you going to do to clean up this mess?

ERIC HOLDER, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: Nobody in the Justice Department has lied.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Holder says Republican critics are trying to score political points by calling for his resignation.

And tragedy near Las Vegas. A helicopter taking a tour group on a sunset flight over the Hoover Dam crashed into a mountainside yesterday. The pilot and all four passengers were killed in the accident near Lake Mead. Sundance Helicopters was operating the tour. The National Transportation Safety Board is now investigating.

And in Greenwood, Indiana, an SUV crashes into a gun shop. Two burglars then storm into the storm -- store, rather -- and then steal guns worth about $10,000. But the damage to the store was more than three times as much.

And in Tacoma, Washington, a school bus driver falls asleep at the wheel and a high schooler comes to the rescue. Here, you can see 17- year-old Emmanuel Williams rush forward to wake the driver up. The bus had been swerving on the interstate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

EMMANUEL WILLIAMS, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: There's nobody else noticed anything, and he was asleep, and he can't notice anything.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Williams is being called a hero by other students on the bus.

The flow of hot lava is coming dangerously close to the last house standing in the Royal Gardens subdivision on Hawaii's Big Island. Homeowners have been running from Hawaii's Kilauea volcano since 1983, when it began erupting nonstop. This week, the lava flow moved more than 500 yards within a loan home there.

For 86 years, Coca-Cola's secret formula has been locked in a bank, but no more. The vault holding that formula is now on display inside the World of Coca-Cola Museum in Atlanta. We're told the new exhibit is designed to allow visitors to get as close as possible to the legendary secret. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's shocking. I had no inkling that this was going on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: This guy's neighbor is accused of taking welfare money while living in a million-dollar mansion. Wait until you hear what the feds say a couple in that home did with the cash meant for the poor. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: A Seattle couple is accused of living high on the hog while collecting government benefits intended for the poor and the disabled. The couple allegedly traveled the world and kept multiple savings accounts worth tens of thousands of dollars. But where they live is what is grabbing all the headlines.

Chris Ingalls of CNN affiliate KING knocked on their door.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRIS INGALLS, KING REPORTER (voice-over): Not the place where you would expect to find a down-on-her-luck welfare recipient. But newly unsealed court documents say a woman who receives state and federal welfare payments has been living on this waterfront property since 2003.

Property records show the 2,400-square--home with gardens and big view windows is valued at $1.2 million. No one answered the door when KING 5 came knocking. Next-door neighbor Carl Tomet (ph) describes the couple that lives in the home as friendly and was surprised to hear they could be welfare cheats.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's shocking. I have -- had no inkling that this was going on.

INGALLS: Agents believe the woman lived in the house with her chiropractor husband, who they suspect posed as a landlord renting her the house when she applied for benefits. The woman receives each month a voucher for $1,272 to pay her rent. On top of that, she gets federal and state cash payments for disability and even a monthly allotment of food stamps.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: All right, federal agents raided the home and federal attorneys have filed a civil lawsuit against the couple to try to recover $135,000 in housing subsidy payments. We have tried to reach the couple, but they have not responded.

Up next: President Barack Obama responds rather harshly to the Republicans looking to take his job.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Ask Osama bin Laden and the 22 out of 30 top al Qaeda leaders who have been taken of the field whether I engage in appeasement.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: The president in attack mode as the White House gets a clearer picture of the Republican presidential race.

And Gloria Borger with new information on the battle between Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney. That is coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: President Obama pushed back hard today to charges that his foreign policy is based on appeasement. Nearly everyone in the -- GOP presidential candidate used that term Wednesday before a group of Jewish Republicans. The president kindly suggests that they are uninformed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: Ask Osama bin Laden and the 22 out of 30 top al Qaeda leaders who've been taken off the field whether I engage in appeasement or whoever is left out there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Still ahead, he helped search for a little girl before crews found her body today. A man who worked near her home appears in court, accused in her brutal murder.

Plus, a woman goes missing after appealing -- appearing, rather, on "The People's Court" show. Well, now a major discovery in the search for a missing mom. Sunny Hostin is on the case and she is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: In politics, momentum is everything. And Newt Gingrich clearly has the wind at his back right now in the race for the Republican presidential nomination.

New CNN polling shows the former House speaker is leading his fellow candidates in three of the four early voting states. In Iowa, he has a double-digit lead over Mitt Romney at 33 percent. In Florida, Gingrich is polling near 50 percent. Mitt Romney is not even close with 25 percent.

The same goes in South Carolina with Gingrich on top at 43 percent. Even at Mitt Romney's beachhead, New Hampshire, the former speaker is gaining ground.

With all that being said, let me bring in our chief political analyst, Gloria Borger.

Looking at these numbers, Gloria, it looks like Gingrich has all the momentum right in his pocket.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: He does. He has got a lot of momentum. And that's really important because we're very close to the Iowa caucuses. We're less than a month away.

But let me caution you this. Nothing is locked up. This has been such a topsy-turvy kind of race here that you can have momentum one day and you can not have it the next day. And what we know of Newt Gingrich is that he kind of an undisciplined guy who is prone to speaking his mind. And sometimes that can get you in trouble.

We also know that the voters, Republican voters are very undecided. Half of them say that they could still change their minds, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Interesting. OK. So you write on your column at CNN.com about Romney and the focus of his campaign, saying this -- quote -- "Romney is promising us we will see more of him. And that's a start. Oh, and, by the way, has he noticed that Gingrich may be a lucrative target of attack since he is now ahead in three early state polls, Iowa, South Carolina, and Florida? So far, all we have heard from Romney is that Gingrich is a career politician. That's true, but it is also true that Romney would have been a career politician had he won his Senate race or his last bid for the presidency, as Gingrich pointed out. It is not a great line of attack coming from Romney."

That's what you write.

BORGER: Right.

WHITFIELD: So are we seeing that Romney is perhaps going to be taking a much more aggressive approach?

BORGER: Well, I think the campaign has really pivoted today, actually, Fredricka. I think what you're seeing is not Romney himself, but some key surrogates like former New Hampshire Governor John Sununu, former Missouri Senator Jim Talent, coming out in a conference call talking about the Newt Gingrich that they knew.

And let me just tell you what Sununu said, for example. He said that Gingrich was self-serving, self-aggrandizing and displayed irrational behavior when he was the speaker of the House.

So they are not tiptoeing around Newt Gingrich anymore. The question I have is, when will the candidate, if ever, will Mitt Romney himself take on Newt Gingrich's leadership when he was the speaker of the House? Because that was very controversial.

WHITFIELD: OK. And Newt Gingrich has been asked about what is behind his surge. He sat down with Wolf Blitzer yesterday, and this is his take.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Can you taste this Republican nomination right now? NEWT GINGRICH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: No. I think it's -- look, remember, I was way down here, and now I'm up here. So, I know you can go way back down here. We still have a lot of work to do with the next four weeks in Iowa, then a real rush in New Hampshire, then on to South Carolina, then on to Florida and Nevada, I mean, all those within about a month.

So, I think if we have a little interview right after Nevada, we'll have a better sense of how real it is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Hmm.

So, Gloria, it was not that long ago, you know, his tune was a little different. He was pretty certain that he was going to be the nominee.

BORGER: Right. Yes.

WHITFIELD: And now he was being a little more hesitant. Why?

BORGER: Right. He told ABC; I think I'm going to be the nominee.

Now he's backed off of that --

WHITFIELD: Right.

BORGER: -- because it's a funny thing about the voters. They don't like to be told what the outcome is going to be before they go to the polls.

And I think that Newt Gingrich, his handlers have clearly said to him, you know what? Don't be so full of yourself. It seems a little arrogant when you predict victory before a vote has been cast. So he's not going to do that.

And also, realistically, he understands that it is not a direct and easy path to the nomination, that this could go on a very, very long time because some early states are not winner take all in delegates. They could be divided up. And so you could see Romney and Gingrich kind of following each other way down the trail.

WHITFIELD: All right, Gloria Borger, thanks so much.

Up next, a development on the missing drone that Iran claims it shot down.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

POPPY HARLOW, CNNMONEY.COM CORRESPONDENT: Time now for the Help Desk where we get answers to your financial questions. Joining me this is Jack Otter, the executive editor of CBSMoneyWatch.com, Donna Rosato, senior editor at "Money" Magazine. Thank you both for being here. Donna, your question comes from Monique. Monique is a 58-year-old widow. She was married for 10 years. She wants to know if she remarries, will she lose the right to her late husband's Social Security benefits.

DONNA ROSATO, SENIOR EDITOR, "MONEY" MAGAZINE: This is an interesting one. She will not lose her rights, but she can't remarry until after age 60. So if she has someone in mind, they might want to have a long engagement. It is true if you're divorced you have to wait until at least 10 years to collect but that's not true of a widow.

The other thing to keep in mind, whoever she marries, check how much Social Security that person may get and weigh that against what she might have gotten from her previous husband and see what may be higher.

HARLOW: Good advice.

Jack, your question comes from Min in California. Min writes "Are there any tax advantages to investing my 401(k) contribution in my own company's stock?"

JACK OTTER, EXECUTIVE EDITOR, CBSMONEYWATCH.COM: There is no tax advantage, there is a huge financial investing disadvantage that we'll talk about. But anything within a 401(k) is all taxed the same as ordinary income when you take it out.

But the problem with investing in company stock is your financial present and future is hitched to your company. Everyone thinks their company is great and there will be no problems, but, who knows? There could be a stumble down the road and you could lose your job and if your retirement savings are invested, you could lose both your job and retirement savings. So no more than five percent in company stock. And really is there any reason to be in company stock? Answer that question carefully. Generally I would say no. Diversify away. Your fortunes are already hitched to your company.

HARLOW: All right, thank you guys so much. If you have a question you want answered send us an e-mail any time to CNN help desk at CNN.com.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Authorities are still on the lookout for a suspected gunman on the Virginia Tech campus. This after two people were reportedly shot and killed, including a person in a parking lot on the Virginia Tech campus, and also, a police officer who was making a routine traffic stop on the campus. This student told our affiliate how she tried to save the police officer's life.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JULIE FLEMING, VIRGINIA TECH STUDENT: Well, coming out of the gym, I was to the sidewalk to go home to my dorm. And I saw the police car sitting there, the unmarked one. And I thought he was responding to a call here because I heard a bunch of sirens coming in the distance. So I kept toward his car, thinking I'll get around it before the police get here.

Then the police pulled up. And they opened his car door. When they opened it, he just fell out toward the ground. And then they immediately started reviving him. And then they took off with some sort of automatic weapons, I guess and started running the opposite direction after the gunman. And then I've been standing here since then. The officer didn't make it because they covered him with sheets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Clearly that student is still visibly shaken after what she witnessed. She witnessed other officers that were trying to revive and save the life of the police officer who was shot and killed during a routine traffic stop there at Virginia Tech campus. Meantime, live pictures thanks to our affiliate WDBJ there. They continue to look for the suspected gunman. And again, the campus remains on lockdown. This taking place on what was to be the first day of final exam there on campus. So, again, two people killed on the Virginia Tech campus today, one police officer and the other person were still awaiting some identity.

Meantime, this also just in. The U.S. confirmed a drone shown on Iranian TV is an American aircraft. The pictures show what looks like an intact drone on a pedestal with uniformed people looking over it. The U.S. has said the aircraft crashed but Iran claims its forces shot it down last week. U.S. officials add they have no reason to believe the video of the drone is fake or fraudulent, but also say it would be very hard to fake such a display.

On the case right now, the maintenance man accused of beating, raping and stabbing a seven-year-old girl and then dumping her body in a trash compactor. Well, that person has just gone to court for the first time now. And 20-year-old Ryan Brunn wore a bullet-proof vest for his first appearance before a judge. Sunny Hostin is on the case. So Sunny, what are the charges being imposed on him?

SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR: He was arrested on suspicion of murder and making false statements to authorities. So certainly he is the only suspect in this case, and police believe that they have the right man responsible for the murder of the little seven-year-old.

WHITFIELD: He is wearing a bullet-proof vest. What's the reason why?

HOSTIN: Well, you know, there's been such public outrage in this case. I think that authorities are concerned for his safety. We do see these bullet type, bullet-proof vests used in court. It is not the norm, but it isn't unusual either.

WHITFIELD: So the victim's mother is calling for the death penalty if Brunn is convicted. How will prosecutors make that decision?

HOSTIN: Well, they'll look at the facts of this case. They need to determine whether or not this crime was unusually heinous, atrocious and cruel. What we know so far is that this little girl was sexually assaulted. She was asphyxiated, she was stabbed, she had blunt trauma to her head, only seven-years-old.

So certainly, it would qualify factually under sort of the rubric of capital punishment and heinous, cruel and atrocious. But the investigation continues. The district attorney in Blue Ridge Gary Moss has indicated that he has not yet decided to seek the death penalty, but they are considering it.

WHITFIELD: So the little girl's name, Jorelys Rivera. Her mother was also in court trying to win back the custody of two of her other children. Ultimately, how is it that she was able to win her children back? What was the argument?

HOSTIN: Well, the issue has been what is in the best interests of her children. And because Jorelys was taken without being supervised from this playground, authorities were concerned for her other children. They said that they lacked supervision. She argued that there was a teenager who was supposed to be watching the little seven-year-old when she was outside playing, and she did win her day in court today. So the two children are back with her now.

WHITFIELD: And then there is a possible break in the case of that Florida mom who disappeared after being on television on the people's court, squaring off with her ex-fiance. What more do we know about any potential breaks in that case?

HOSTIN: That's right. This is a significant discovery. They did find her iPhone 4. We don't know the location where it was found. We don't know exactly what is on the phone. But we do know that the serial number indicates that this did belong to the missing mom. This is an important discovery because we know, Fredricka, that we live with our phones. So it is undergoing forensic testing right now.

But it will give prosecutors and investigators the information that could lead to another break in this case -- Internet searches, her -- the phone calls that she could have made, the location where she could have been taken. So certainly, this is a really important break in this case. She has been missing for about three weeks. And as we know, her fiance is still the focus and the primary suspect in this investigation.

WHITFIELD: And no indication of where that phone was found and its proximity to say, a last place that witnesses thought they saw her or even the proximity to her home?

HOSTIN: They aren't releasing that information, of course, because it is still an ongoing investigation. But we do know they have the phone and that they are conducting forensic testing on the phone. And it is important to note that the phone we're being told is in very good condition, so likely that they'll get a lot of information from it.

WHITFIELD: All right, Sunny Hostin, thanks so much for being on the case.

Now to one company in Georgia that is thriving on recycling. But the end product is not what you think. Brooke Baldwin has today's "Solutions." (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Old can be new again. That's what Okabashi Brands is doing one shoe at a time.

BAHMAN IRVANI, CEO, OKABASHI BRANDS: With our shoes, they are primarily one material. You can recycle them.

BALDWIN: The shoes are made from a patented blend of plastics called micro blast. They are 100 percent recyclable, with all scraps and rejects going back into the hopper. Customers send their worn shoes back to the plant where they're cleaned, ground up, and blended into a whole new pair.

BRAD LAPORT, VP OF MANUFACTURING, OKABASHI BRANDS: Nothing going into landfills, nothing in the garbage cans, nothing floating in the ocean or any of those things. We use 100 percent of all of our materials. Obviously we're keeping the planet clean and we're not wasting anything. Our costs are actually lower because of it.

BALDWIN: With about 30 million sandals sold, being green is paying off in more ways than one.

Brooke Baldwin, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: President Obama blasting Republicans for rejecting his Wall Street watchdog choice.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This makes absolutely no sense.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: One Republican said it is not the man he is against but something else. Senator Orrin Hatch will join me live on why he voted against the president's pick, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Today's Senate Republicans managed to stymie one of the president's top domestic priorities. They marshaled 45 votes, enough to block the nomination of Richard Cordray to head the newly created Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. A short time later, Mr. Obama denounced the vote and defended his nominee.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The majority of attorney generals, Republican and Democrat from across the country, have said this is somebody who can do the job with integrity, who has a tradition of being a bipartisan individual who looks out for the public interest, and is ready to go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Richard Cordray was nominated in July. He is a former Ohio State attorney general and a former Ohio treasurer. He also served as a Supreme Court clerk under Justice Anthony Kennedy. And joining us now from Capitol Hill, Senate Republican Orrin Hatch from Utah. So you wrote today, senator, in the "National Review" that you have no problem with Richard Cordray. Yet you voted against him. Why?

SEN. ORRIN HATCH, (R) UTAH: Well, that's right. None of us have a problem with Richard Cordray, at least to my knowledge. The reason we voted against him was that we suggested to the president that this CFTB, this so-called consumer agency, has abject power over credit in this country, abject power without any responsibility, any transparency, any accountability.

And what we want to do is correct that by having a board of directors to which this person has to report, have them report to the appropriations process in Congress, and have them report to other processes that literally, all other agencies have to.

We cannot give a total czar that even the president can't suggest things to or can't control running this agency and determining the credit worthiness, or the credit situation for people all over the country.

This is the worst doggone piece of legislation I've seen since I've been here. It is even worse than Obamacare.

WHITFIELD: So you instead would like to see some sort of board of directors. Where does that suggestion go then?

HATCH: Well, we're letting the president know, we'll be happy to vote for Mr. Cordray if he would come out and amend this stupid bill and allow the taxpayers of America some rights that aren't given here. You're going to give a total czar total power, not even reportable to the president, not reportable to the appropriations processes and Congress, not reportable to Congress, total power over the credit of people throughout the country.

That is not what our country is about. We've never done that before. And yet that's how broad this Dodd-Frank bill is. It is killing small banks. It is killing financial institutions all across this country. It is making them incapable of giving loans to small businesses and other businesses to create jobs. It is one of the worst bills I've ever seen in my whole 35 years in the United States Senate.

WHITFIELD: The president said shortly after the defeat of this nomination, that he said, you can, quote, "We are not giving up." Is it your concern that he may use a recess appointment?

HATCH: Well, he's been known to do that. We'll try to stop that.

WHITFIELD: How would you stop that?

HATCH: Why don't we get a president who is willing to work with congress? What we're asking for is not unusual. It is certainly isn't flagrant. It is certainly isn't excessive. It is having a board of directors that supervises this person so that this person is not an almighty god in bureaucratic dress. Frankly, that's not a bad request. We want some transparency. We want some accountability to the Congress. We want accountability to the appropriations process. That's why we have a congress. That's why we have an appropriations process.

WHITFIELD: All right, senator --

HATCH: And the president, he's oblivious to all this.

WHITFIELD: Let me just stop you there. Listen to what the president had to say and what his assessment is about this defeat.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: We have a Congress right now, Republicans in Congress right now, who seem to have entirely forgotten how we got into this mess. And part of the reason was because we did not empower our regulators to make sure that they were ensuring fair play.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: So, what's your response to this and to people, Americans who say this is yet another example of Congress, the White House, not getting a long and yet one more thing that's not getting done?

HATCH: Well, the president knows he can beat up on Congress and the people will like that, and so that's what he's doing. Instead of working with Congress to provide some accountability and some transparency so people will know that they're not going to be regulated into the ground by a single individual with all mighty power and a half-billion-dollar a year budget?

All he's got to do is say look, I'll work with you. Let's get some of these constraints put into law and then let's get Mr. Cordray on and I think he'd have an easy time if he did that.

He doesn't work with Congress. He's either out of the country or doesn't weigh in. He doesn't pull people down to the White House like he should. He hasn't been a leader that we need.

WHITFIELD: So, it's not --

HATCH: Frankly --

WHITFIELD: You don't disagree that there needs to be some regulation. You don't like the method?

HATCH: I don't disagree that regulations sometimes are very important. This administration has been the most over-regulatory administration in history. And we're just suffering the problems because of it.

Small business can't grow because they're so overregulated. The banks are so over-regulated they can't loan. They're scared to death they're going to be indicted. And this is wrong and this president ought to know it. And he ought to work with us rather than just always blaming Congress for everything when he hasn't provided the leadership that we need to have Congress really do --

WHITFIELD: And Senator Hatch, less than a year from now, we're talking about the presidential election, the Republican field of candidates. Who do like? Who are you backing?

HATCH: Well, I believe there's only one person who really has a chance of winning on the Republican side, and he's the best nominee there and the only one with extensive private sector experience of great success and extensive public sector success of great success, and that's Mitt Romney. I endorse Romney.

I know every one of those Republicans. I like every one of them. They're good people. But I don't think any of the others have that type of broad experience that can help our country at this miserable time we're in right now when we clearly don't have the leadership either in Congress or in the presidency to be able to pull our county out of the mess it's in. Romney can.

WHITFIELD: Senator Orrin Hatch, thanks so much for your time, appreciate it.

HATCH: You bet.

WHITFIELD: Up next, she is currently secretary of state, but Hillary Clinton's 2008 campaign is asking supporters to send money. Why?

Plus, the White House holding its holiday party last night, and the theme was quite interesting. Joe Johns was there and he's got the scoop. He's going to share, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Time now for your Political Pop. Hillary Clinton's camp is still trying to get rid of campaign gear from 2008. They're selling it at kind of close out prices. Some items are even signed by President Clinton himself. Joe Johns joins me now from Washington. So, Joe, what's with this blue aisle special or the blue light special on Hillary gear?

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: I know. Fred, how many politicians can get away with this three years after the campaign?

WHITFIELD: I didn't know anybody could.

JOHNS: That's pretty incredible. You have to have pretty good name recognition, right? A fire sale on Hillary Clinton's campaign gear from three years ago. The historic race for president came down to her and Barack Obama. We know who won.

Still, there are people who wish they would have gotten some of the gear, perhaps. There are still signs, button, t-shirts, as well as DVDs of the 2008 speech at the Denver convention, which apparently are being signed by former president Bill Clinton, and those go for $250 each. You've got to really want that, right? It's not just to get her name out there. She has something like $270,000 in debt to retire from the campaign, and former candidates have been known to resort to drastic means to try to pay down that debt.

WHITFIELD: So it's mostly about paying down debt. It has little if nothing to do with her eyeballing another run of some sort?

JOHNS: I wouldn't go that far because you know and I know that just about anything anybody does in Washington, D.C., if it's a politician --

WHITFIELD: There's always a dot-dot-dot.

JOHNS: She says no, but it could happen.

WHITFIELD: Meantime, tis the season, holiday parties, and that includes that of the White House. You were there. How did it strike you? How do you compare it to a previous holiday parties of the White House past?

JOHNS: Well, honestly, the first thing I can say is the weather is always bad. It's December.

HATCH: But you're inside. I'm not feeling sorry for you.

(LAUGHTER)

JOHNS: I'm just saying. The rain was unbelievable. OK, once you get inside, the most impressive thing was the Christmas tree with the U.S. military service medals. You heard about this. Wondered how they were going to pull it off. The tree looked incredible. You know what happens with these things. A lot of food, drinks, everybody gets to shake hands with the president and first lady. Not a sit down dinner. Heavy appetizers.

WHITFIELD: They don't want you getting too comfortable.

JOHNS: Exactly, right. And you don't want to act bad because you'll hear about it and there's all these people writing things down and taking pictures.

Bo the dog was everywhere. From Political Pop I know this. Not necessarily from seeing him all over the place because I didn't go to all the rooms. It was kind of cavernous.

The downside again though was the weather, torrential rain, incredibly tight security.

WHITFIELD: Why are you harping on the weather?

JOHNS: It was so bad.

WHITFIELD: Had your galoshes, rain jacket. There was a cover before you actually entered the place.

JOHNS: And you had to show your I.D. two times because of the Salahis.

WHITFIELD: You've got to step up security as a result.

JOHNS: Yes, I know. They didn't frisk me though. That was good.

WHITFIELD: I'm sure because you were on your best behavior you'll get another invite for the next Christmas party.

JOHNS: We'll see. This is the first time during the Obamas that I got to go, so I've been good.

WHITFIELD: OK, very good. Thanks so much, Joe. It was nice to see that Bo was everywhere.

So before we let everybody else go, shares in many major U.S. bank stocks fell today causing a drag on U.S. financial markets. Take a look at the Dow right now, down 203 points. We'll continue to watch things.

Also, the primary concern is the eurozone debt crisis. European leaders are meeting at a debt summit in Brussels. French President Nicolas Sarkozy issued a dire warning. Sarkozy says "failure to reach an agreement is a luxury we cannot afford," his words.

All right, that's going to do it for me. Wolf Blitzer is next.