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Nine Days Until Your Paycheck Shrinks; Obama Ratchets Up Tax Fight; House GOP Talks Payroll Tax Cuts; Ron Paul Gets Testy Over Newsletters; U.S. Update on Pakistan Drone Strike; House Democrats Talk Taxes
Aired December 22, 2011 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: All right working Americans, all eyes on Congress. The calendar and literally the clock. We have nine days to go and Congress has that much time to extend the payroll tax cut or your paycheck is going to be a little smaller come beginning of the year.
Here's an idea of how much we're talking about. If you make $35,000 a year, you're going to see about $700 gone next year. If you're on the higher end, making $110,000 we're talking about $2,300 next year. It will be gone and you see the scale there where you end up in between those two salary ranges.
But still, about 150 plus million people are going to see their taxes go up if Congress does not act. The public anger now growing. Election year is looming. The debate is turning into a blame game between Republicans and Democrats.
We have our Kate Bolduan with me now. She is on Capitol Hill. Dan Lothian at the White House. Dan, I'm going to start with you. But I also need to remind our viewers, you too as well, I might have to jump in there because we're standing by to hear from Speaker Boehner.
At any moment, he's going to step in and speak to reporters. He's expected to take some questions. So when he steps to that podium, a really important player in this whole process right now, we will certainly listen to him.
But Dan, let me start with you and the president today, we're expecting to hear from him?
DAN LOTHIAN, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right. I mean, this is yet another part of the overall strategy to put the pressure on House Republicans to go ahead and pass this short-term extension deal that was forged in the Senate and then work on a longer deal, that one-year deal later.
So you've seen from this White House the president coming into the briefing room to put pressure on Congress. They've appealed to the public via their blog and Twitter to send in what losing $40 in a paycheck would mean to you.
Today, the president just shortly after noon will be appearing here at the White House. Alongside him will be ordinary Americans the White House says who will talk about what losing that 4$40 will mean to them.
Some of these folks have actually weighed in online. Again, this is the White House effort to show that this fight that's going on here in Washington right now has some real consequences that middle class Americans will be impacted and the economy, which is struggling, but showing signs of recovery could be impacted as well -- T.J.
HOLMES: All right, stay with me, Dan. Kate, let me bring you in here. We saw the video yesterday of the president going shopping. Of course, it's the holidays. He needs to do some Christmas shopping for the girls, that's fine.
But it also seemed to be a sign to a lot of people that he is literally right now waiting around. He's home alone with the dog. His family's already gone on vacation.
And so he's waiting for Congress to make a move or the leaders in the House, rather, to make a move. So what work, Kate, is being done to get some kind of conclusion to this?
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: At the moment, quite honestly it's more a wharf words and kind of another type of pressure campaign as Dan was talking about on the part up here.
I mean, there isn't a lot of negotiating going on or really any negotiating at all because both sides, House Republicans and Senate Democrats, and you could say there are also some Senate Republicans on the side of Senate Democrats here, their positions are pretty well known.
They're pretty well dug in at the moment as neither side seems ready to budge. We're waiting here obviously, T.J., to hear from House Speaker John Boehner, the key player at the moment. All eyes trying to see what move he'll make, if he will make a move.
But we're told at this press conference, we're likely to hear the similar message we have heard from him yesterday. He'll be up there with the eight House members that he has appointed to a conference committee that he says is the way to go to hash out the differences between the House and the Senate on the way forward on this payroll tax cut.
He's likely to say what he said yesterday in terms of we're here, we're ready to work, that House Republicans oppose this two- month extension that passed with bipartisan support in the Senate because they believe it does not provide the certainty that Americans, and specifically businesses, need in terms of tax policy.
They don't like this kind of patchwork quick fix kicking the can down the road policy. They say they're standing firm on that -- T.J.
HOLMES: Nine days until people's checks get smaller. You're telling me we're going to hear more of the same. That gets us nowhere. Dan, I want you to listen to something, our viewers to listen to something from Senator John McCain. Something he told CNN this morning going after the president and the president's, what he calls lack of leadership. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: Is it really fair to put as much heat as you're putting on the president on this one? A lot of eyes are pointing to House Republican leadership right now as being intransigent.
SENATOR JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I think that that is legitimate to an extent, but I also think that in times like these in the past four presidents that I've served under, they have exerted a lot more leadership than going shopping. By the way, I also feel that in the upcoming election, which is less than a year from now, no incumbent is safe nor should they be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: OK. So, Dan, he wants to put some responsibility at the feet of the president, but a lot of people right now hold one house, one body of Congress, and actually one party responsible, and that's Republicans.
Is the president, the White House, comfortable with how this is playing out? They don't want taxes to go up, sure, but still politically the way this is playing out, are they pleased?
LOTHIAN: Well, look, they tend not to want to publicly admit that they're pleased with how this is playing out, how the president might look. They say that the president is more concerned about making sure that middle class Americans are protected during a difficult economic time.
But privately they realize that the president, at least they believe, is looking good here, that House Republicans are the ones who are coming out of this not looking good in the eyes of the voters --
HOLMES: Excuse me, here. Dan, I'm sorry. We do see Speaker Boehner and we're going to go ahead and listen to him and expect him to make a statement and take some questions. Let's listen.
(BEGIN LIVE SPEECH)
REPRESENTATIVE JOHN BOEHNER (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: I urged him to call on Senator Reid to work with us to finish this bill that will provide for one year of tax relief for Americans workers.
I told the president there's one big reason why we need to do a full year, and that's jobs. A one-year bill, like the president requested and like the House produced is simply better for jobs and better for our economy.
A one-year bill provides on average about $1,000 for American workers as opposed to the Senate bill, which would provide a measly $166. As importantly, a one-year bill would provide certainty for American employers as they begin to plan for next year.
A two-month extension only perpetuates the uncertainty that too many employers already have in dealing with the economy and what's coming out of Washington. Listen, I used to run a small business.
I can tell you that the language in the Senate bill will hurt small businesses. The Senate only goes for two months, but businesses send their taxes in, write the check. I used to write the check to the IRS. It's done on a quarterly basis.
You're going to have a couple of months at this, another month at this trying to figure out what your obligation is, it's going to be difficult. Secondly, the paperwork requirements and the programming requirements contained in the Senate bill will make it virtually impossible for those who provide payroll services to do the job that employers hire them to do.
The fact is, we can do better. Americans are still asking the question, where are the jobs. It's time for us to sit down and have a serious negotiation, solve this problem so that American workers don't see their taxes go up in January.
REPRESENTATIVE ERIC CANTOR (R), MAJORITY LEADER: Good morning. As the speaker said, it is our position that we want to make sure we provide some certainty to the working people of this country that their taxes are not going to go up for an entire year.
Unfortunately, that view, although it is shared, is not being implemented or proposed to be implemented by the Senate proposal. We're here and we want to solve the problem. Frankly, given where the parties are, there's not a big difference between our positions.
It all comes down to the paid for, it's the budgetary impact of the extension of this tax holiday. I saw the president out yesterday doing his Christmas shopping. I saw he brought his dog with him. You know, we're here.
He could bring his dog up here. We are pet friendly. You know, again, it will not take a long time. We could probably resolve the differences within an hour. That's why we're here to say, let's do this, as the speaker said.
Let's avoid any more uncertainty. Let's try to avoid another one of these difficult moments within 60 days so we can get on about the business of putting in place factors for better economy and job creation.
REPRESENTATIVE DAVE CAMP (R), MICHIGAN: Good morning. Employers are telling us that this convoluted mechanism the Senate cooked up in a rush to get out of town doesn't work. We think we should listen to our employers.
The Democrats failed to do that in the health care bill, and that's how we ended up with that burdensome 1099 provision that we had to repeal and we did so in a bipartisan way. People in my district are working this week.
They're working next week. We think we should be doing that in Congress. We have the time. Let's get this issue right for the sake of our economy, for the sake of our job creators, and for the sake of our country and the American worker. Thank you.
(END LIVE SPEECH)
HOLMES: All right, we're hearing it there. I believe as I bring back in Dan Lothian and our Kate Bolduan, I believe you all could hear that. But Speaker Boehner, as you were saying a moment ago to me, Kate, we were going to hear more of the same today. That's what we were expecting.
Here we are nine days before this tax holiday ends and people's taxes go up, checks get smaller, and we are still or they are still dug in. So what's up there on the Hill? What is even possible right now, Kate?
We're running out of time to even get a conference committee in place and to get all of this legislation in place in time even. So what is even possible?
BOLDUAN: Well, and they are running out of time. What we're seeing here is kind of political positioning. There are not talks going on as far as we know. They're not negotiating. House Republicans are not talking to Senate Democrats. Senate Democrats are not talking to House Republicans.
Because both sides say their position is known and they're waiting for the other side to blink. I'll tell you that I would say more attention right now is on House Speaker John Boehner and House Republicans as House Republicans are facing far more criticism, especially now that it includes criticism from their fellow colleagues in the Senate.
Senate Republicans who just simply say that House Republicans have botched how they've handled this, kind of policy wise as well as politically. What we're seeing right now is we are seeing, you know, House Speaker John Boehner trying to make the case why they are opposed to the two-month extension.
We talked about that before. But here's kind of the kicker. Here's the important thing that everyone needs to realize is that you hear House Republicans saying we want a one-year deal, a two-month deal isn't enough and it doesn't provide certainty. On the other side of the capitol in the Senate, Senate Democratic leaders and Senate Republicans, they agree. They all want a one-year deal here.
What Senate Democrats are arguing is they're saying you have to push through this two-month extension in order to allow us time to negotiate this longer deal because negotiations had stalled to this point.
So there is still a lot of talking past each other, which is not a good indication that they're ready to come to the table. Of course, you mentioned the clock, T.J. and it's always important to keep an eye on that because the clock matters up here.
When they're up against a deadline, as I've been saying, miracles can happen. It's not certain though how this is going to turn out. It looks like this is stretching into next week.
HOLMES: And, Dan, I'll let you wrap it for me here. It really got a laugh out of a lot of us here in the studio when we heard him say it, but Leader Cantor talking about the video we saw of the president going out shopping, had the dog with him.
He said bring the dog to Capitol Hill, we're pet friendly. I assume we're not going to see that, but that goes to that role or the idea of what role is the president playing now and how much of a role can he play? When this seems like this is really in the hands of the House and the House leadership.
LOTHIAN: That's right. And you know, you also heard John McCain earlier also make that same comment about the president out there shopping yesterday with his dog. To be fair, the president did reach out to John Boehner by phone and also to Harry Reid before going out on that shopping trip.
So the White House points out that the president has been very much engaged, but they also say that there are very few options here. There's nothing more that the president can do. It's really in -- the ball is in the court of the House Republicans.
You know, there was already a bipartisan deal in the Senate. As Kate has been pointing out, this is something that everyone agrees on, that there should be this one-year deal, but in order to get there you have to have a temporary, a two-month extension.
So that's what the president is focused on hoping that up on the Hill that House members can, indeed, make something happen here, although it's uncertain what they can do right now.
HOLMES: All right, Dan Lothian, Kate Bolduan, thank you both. I know we'll check in again. We may see Speaker Boehner take a few questions. So we'll listen in and maybe bring you some more of that live to our viewers. Several other members are making comments.
I'm just taking a look over my shoulder here. But if he does start to take questions, we'll certainly let you listen in on that. Reminder, we're expecting to hear the president a little after noon today Eastern Time. The president 12:15 Eastern Time going to make comments, we will have that for you as well.
Meanwhile, we'll get back to some presidential politics in a moment and something that happened some 20 years ago, 20 plus years ago still having an effect on Ron Paul who has been leading in some of the latest polls in Iowa. Some racial comments that he once took credit for, now he's saying it wasn't him and he's walking out on CNN over it. We'll explain. Stay with me.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Well, with Ron Paul leading in a new Iowa poll, the presidential candidate is facing renewed questions about racially inflammatory writings. Writings that were published back in the '80s and '90s.
They appeared in newsletters bearing Paul's name, but rarely carried a byline. Now the liberal "New Republic" covered this story three years ago. More recently that same reporter writing for the conservative "Weekly Standard" fleshed out even more details.
We here at CNN as well as a number of other organizations, including "The New York Times," have also fleshed out some new details, uncovered more items like this from a 1992 newsletter shortly after the L.A. riots. It was titled, "Special Issue on Racial Terrorism."
One line reads, and I quote, "order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks," end quote. Order, as you may recall, was restored when the National Guard moved in.
Then two years earlier in another Ron Paul publication, an article criticized President Reagan for signing legislation approving the creation of the federal Martin Luther King Jr. holiday.
And it said, quote, "we can thank him for our annual hate whitey day," end quote. In 1996 when Paul was running for Congress, Democrats dug up other passages from his newsletter that he did not deny writing.
Talking about crime in Washington, I'm quoting again, "given the inefficiencies of what D.C. laughingly calls the criminal justice system, I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal," end quote. Ron Paul defending himself briefly yesterday to our Gloria Borger.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: So you read them, but you didn't do anything about it at the time?
RON PAUL (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I never read that stuff. I was probably aware of it 10 years after it was written. It's been going on 20 years that people have pestered me about this and CNN does it every single time.
BORGER: Wouldn't you say it's -- is it legitimate? Is it a legitimate question to ask?
PAUL: Yes. When you get the answer, it's legitimate that you sort of take the answers I give. You know what the answer is, I didn't write them. I didn't read them at the time and I disavow them. That is the answer.
BORGER: But you made money off of it?
PAUL: If you know I made money on it, you know more about my finances than I do.
BORGER: Do you know that you didn't? I mean --
PAUL: I don't even know what you're talking about. I mean, you know, if it was published for ten years, so if that was 1 percent of all the newsletter I made money off, you know, talking about gold stocks, I think you're really confused on that.
BORGER: OK, well, it's just a question. I mean, it's legitimate. It's legitimate. These things are pretty incendiary, you know --
PAUL: Because of people like you.
BORGER: No, no, no. Come on. Some of this stuff was very incendiary and you know, saying that in 1993 the Israelis were responsible for the bombing of the World Trade Center. That kind of stuff so --
PAUL: Good-bye.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Well, with me now Patricia Murphy of Citizen Jane Politics as well as the "Daily Beast" and our CNN contributor, Will Cain.
Patricia, you and I were talking in the commercial break, that it's hard to defend that yes, some of these writings, but the mistake he might have made was to walk out on the interview and that's gotten so much attention now.
PATRICIA MURPHY, FOUNDER AND EDITOR, CITIZEN JANE POLITICS: Yes. Well, I think he definitely has two sets of problems. First are the original writings, which I have heard him denounce before. I've seen him answer this question a lot more effectively.
Now what he did yesterday with Gloria Borger is create another story where he didn't need to. It was in effect an unforced error. What he's done is bring more attention to the situation, bring more people to read those newsletters and to know more about what was said in them than he needed to.
This is a situation he needs to defend, he needs to denounce, and he needs to be much more effective because the writings are so offensive. I think that he made a bad situation much worse than it needed to be.
HOLMES: Will, do you agree with that, maybe he should have stood up, answered the questions but, again, kind of created this buzz with that spectacle in front of a camera?
WILL CAIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Definitely, he handled it poorly. Definitely, he got testy with Gloria. I can't believe he took off his mic and walked away from it. He handled it as bad or poorly as it could been handled.
You know what's kind of interesting though to both of you guys is we kind of are working under the assumption that had Ron Paul handled this perfectly, had he, you know, strongly condemned them, given us a strong explanation for how this happened, then we could look past it.
I think that's interesting, why. These are extremely inflammatory newsletters. Look, I'm a Ron Paul -- I like a lot of things about Ron Paul. I have no desire to criticize him. But I think it's odd that we're assuming if he handled this perfectly that somehow we could get past this.
HOLMES: I guess -- Will makes a good point there, Patricia. I get what you're saying. The story was going to be out there and he'd have to answer these questions. But some of this stuff that was written in there, I mean, is it enough?
Is that enough of an answer or even an apology, Patricia, for him to say I didn't write it even though it was my newsletter. Yes, I take more responsibility. These things are pretty damning.
MURPHY: They're very damning. He does need to apologize. I don't mean to say that, well, if he apologized, nobody would care about it, but I think he needs to own it and defend himself and reiterate he didn't write these and didn't know about them.
The only thing that is keeping Ron Paul in less trouble than he could be in is, frankly, we're getting into the Christmas holidays. People are not paying attention as much. Ron Paul supporters feel like they know him. This will come as no surprise to many, many of the people who feel like they know Ron Paul and they won't believe something that the media says even if what they're saying is true.
So I think he is going to be in less trouble than some other candidates. But it is why the Republican Party has always considered him a fringe candidate and always will.
HOLMES: Will, wrap this for me in 30 seconds here. What's the effect on Iowa?
CAIN: Well, the effect on Iowa. I have to think this does catch up on Ron Paul eventually. I just want to say I'm only following logic where it goes.
I was a small publisher of newspapers in Texas. Had this happened one time and Ron Paul says I didn't write it, somebody else wrote it, I didn't read it then I could maybe understand that.
But it happened multiple times and if it happened once and somebody drew your attention to it, wouldn't you be much more careful? It's just odd. All of it is odd, T.J.
HOLMES: You sound like you don't buy it, Will?
CAIN: I'm just having trouble rationalizing it. Look, again, this is coming from the perspective of someone who likes the policies, a lot of the substance that Ron Paul espouses.
You know, Ron Paul fans are some of the most ardent out there. They'll hate some of these things, but you can't hate logic. You can't hate rationalization. Explain this. I don't understand.
HOLMES: All right, Will, Patricia, thank you both. We're going to see you all again. Just can't get enough of you two, can we? It's 20 minutes away for the "Political Buzz."
Among the topics there, Tim Tebow more popular than any Republican running for the White House right now, not that surprising, I guess. But we'll see you both here in about 20 minutes. Thanks so much.
Also coming up, take a look and listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's just such tight confines in here and to have to walk from the front to the back of the bus with people just beating the hell out of you. What must he have gone through?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Retracing Robert Champion's last steps. We'll have the latest in the Florida A&M hazing investigation.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: As we come up on the bottom of the hour now, the full autopsy results have been released for Florida A&M student Robert Champion.
Experts telling CNN the drum major had severe muscle damage, the type of stuff you usually see in a car accident, child abuse, or even torture.
Our George Howell following this investigation into Champion's death and the beating that caused it. He had injuries similar to what you see in torture?
GEORGE HOWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: T.J., this is a very complicated case because there are potentially a lot of people who saw something.
We know for a fact that there were at least 30 people on the bus when Champion was beaten. So we turned to a law enforcement expert who understands complex cases like this to get a better understanding of the questions police are asking to find out who did this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HOWELL (voice-over): It happened on a tour bus parked outside an Orlando Hotel, November 19th. Florida A&M Drum Major Robert Champion died after a vicious beating. Investigators say it was a homicide that resulted from hazing.
MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: You look at a bus like this, the narrow aisles, the seats so close together, the ceiling. It's just such tight confines in here, and to have to walk from the front to the back of the bus with people just beating the held out of you. What must he have gone through?
HOWELL: We turned to HLN law enforcement analyst, Mike Brooks, to take us into the minds of investigators trying to piece together what happened to the 26-year-old victim before someone placed this 911 call.
UNIDENTIFIED OPERATOR: Is he breathing?
UNIDENTIFIED CALLER: We don't know if he's breathing or not. We need an ambulance ASAP.
UNIDENTIFIED OPERATOR: I have help on the way already.
HOWELL (on camera): How do you determine a level of culpability? Who did what?
BROOKS: That's a great question. And as a law enforcement officer, I want to know who were the ones that were delivering the blows, the serious blows, was there one person who delivered the most blows that may have caused his death? We don't know. Were there other people who might not have been involved at all?
HOWELL (voice-over): Band members who spoke to CNN say it may have been the result of a hazing ritual called crossing bus sea where the victim walks backwards from the front of the bus to the back while being beaten repeatedly by fellow band members.
(on camera): Investigators have their work cut out for them because they've got to interview everyone, but this bus is a crime scene. What happened?
Where did it happen on this bus when he was being beaten with fists, maybe with musical instruments? Those are things law enforcement has to find out exactly what happened.
(voice-over): Robert Champion died of significant rapid blood loss due to blunt force trauma according to the autopsy report, the victim of a severe beating. With so many possible witnesses on the bus --
BROOKS: I find it hard to believe that if that much was going on inside the bus, if they were beating him so viciously inside that bus, that somebody on the outside didn't hear something, didn't see something.
HOWELL: Brooks says it's a complicated investigation to determine exactly what happened in the moments leading up to Robert Champion's death.
BROOKS: Did anybody try to stop this? Did anybody say, he's had enough, he's had enough? Knock it off? Did that happen?
HOWELL (voice-over): Only the people in that bus know.
(END VIDEOTAPE) HOWELL: The next headline in this case will be when police make arrests. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement and the Orlando Sheriff's Office both investigating this case, T.J., but so far no arrests have been made.
HOLMES: OK. You said make arrests. It's a bus full of people beating this kid. You arrest the whole bus?
HOWELL: There could potentially be 30 people arrested. You just don't know at this point, but we know that there were at least 30 people who saw something, possibly those who participated. This case clearly is a complicated situation.
HOLMES: And a couple of other cases of hazing going on in the campus.
HOWELL: Well, another student, Bria Hunter, who claims that she was beaten. There's also an investigation into financial fraud at FAMU within the band so it's a very complex case mainly being looked over by the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.
HOLMES: All right, George Howell, thank you so much. You've been following this case for us. I know you continue to do so.
HOWELL: Thank you.
HOLMES: We appreciate you. Well we're at the bottom of the hour here now.
And we're still learning more from the Department of Defense about the U.S. air strike last month. Do you remember the one in Pakistan that killed 24 Pakistani soldiers? An investigation has now found that U.S. forces were acting in self-defense and that miscommunication between both sides played a role.
Barbara Starr on this case for us. And self-defense sounds like they were justified, but at the same time mistakes were made.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right, T.J. Look, self-defense because they thought they were under attack by insurgents, but it turned out there were no insurgents. There was no insurgent gunfire directed at U.S. forces.
We have had the briefing and, you know, just right off the top let's play you a bit of sound with the official apology. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE LITTLE, PENTAGON SPOKESMAN: The loss of life and for the lack of proper coordination between U.S. and Pakistani forces that contributed to those losses. We express our deepest regret. We further express sincere condolences to the Pakistani people, to the Pakistani government, and most importantly to the families of the Pakistani soldiers who were killed or wounded.
(END VIDEO CLIP) STARR: But how did U.S. forces wind up killing 24 Pakistani military? Well, it was a complex fire fight in the middle of the night in a remote mountain area. U.S. forces reported they were taking machine gunfire from a ridge line they thought was Afghanistan. It turns out it was Pakistan. There was a border post there the U.S. didn't know about.
When they figured out part of what was going on, then they had poor communication with the Pakistanis. They had wrong mapping information on the U.S. side so the information that they gave the Pakistanis, the Pakistanis thought it was all taking place 14 kilometers away.
What you are talking about here is fundamental mistrust between both military forces when a fire fight emerged. Nobody exactly is saying what was going on, where they were, and what the communication simply got out of control by all accounts. Error upon error escalated and this became a real tragedy that has resulted in very deep mistrust between both sides. So much mistrust that at this point the U.S. hasn't even fully briefed Pakistan on the results of this investigation, T.J.
HOLMES: All right, Barbara Starr with the update for us at the Pentagon. Thank you as always.
And as we get past the -- well excuse me, past the bottom of the hour now we're going to turn back to presidential politics. And Republicans haven't settled on a candidate. They are not -- a lot of people say they're not crazy about their candidates so far, but somebody they do like more than all of their Republican choices, Tim Tebow.
Talking about that and other things in our "Political Buzz" segment. That is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Well, "Political Buzz". Your rapid fire look at the best political topics of the day. Three questions, 30 seconds on the clock. Playing today: Democratic strategist and dapper, Robert Zimmerman; Patricia Murphy of Citizen Jane Politics and the "Daily Beast"; and our CNN contributor, Will Cain.
First question here, Republicans really seem to like Tim Tebow. They don't know who they necessarily like on the GOP field, but they seem to like Tebow. A new poll was put out there by the Public Policy Polling. It shows he's viewed favorably, Tebow is, by 68 percent of Republicans.
Put that in perspective. None of the GOP presidential candidates are seen positively by that many Republicans. So how do Republicans, Will, how do they find a Tim Tebow candidate that everybody seems to like?
WILL CAIN: You don't find Tim Tebow is the problem, T.J. You certainly don't create them. You know the world is set against the Tim Tebows of the world. You could play a good five-minute long clip of football experts saying Tim Tebow will never make it, he doesn't have what it takes. I'm no fan of Tim Tebow over and over and over.
Tim Tebow is whether or not we're talking about this business that we're in right now, any business, or politics, they're not found. They force their way in and then they get a legion of followers. So things -- same thing will happen in politics. Eventually somebody will force their way in, somebody unorthodox.
HOLMES: Robert, so far who is that person who could become that Tim Tebow candidate?
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Let me tell you, T.J. just in fairness I may -- I may have said some on my own party but I can't think of a Democrat who would score 68 percent or come near Tim Tebow's approval ratings. And that's because Tim Tebow is above partisan politics. And there should be causes and issues and people like Tebow who should be above that. What defines him and why he's such a national -
HOLMES: Robert, Robert I'm going to need you -- I apologize -- to stand by for a second. We are hearing from the Democrat majority -- the Democratic Whip in the House right now. Steny Hoyer I'm told is making some comments. Let's go ahead and listen in on this payroll tax cut fight.
(BEGIN LIVE SPEECH)
REP. STENY HOYER (D), MINORITY WHIP: And 48 million Americans, seniors on Medicare, will have the security of having their doctors available put at risk. We ought not to be creating that kind of uncertainty and anxiety among the American people. The stakes are too high to be arguing about politics and process. The Republicans contention that the two-month compromise is somehow unworkable is simply untrue.
If it were, we wouldn't see a new and desperate Republican proposal today to settle on a three-month extension. Speaker Boehner, who just appeared here, says he and his members want a one-year extension. We want that too.
Now we offered a bill he talked about and the House passed a bill. He talks about regular order. That bill had no hearings in the Ways and Means Committee. It had no mark-up in the Ways and Means Committee and was passed three days after it was introduced in the middle of December, just days ago. But he expected, I suppose, the Senate to take it home. They didn't. What did the senate do? They did what Americans are asking us to do. They came together, reasoned together, and voted together, 89 senators came together and said we ought to pass a compromise and to give us time to work out any differences that remain.
Every family in America understands that. Take a breath, step back, let's see how we can get to where we want to be. That is a one- year extension and, yes, a two-year extension on the SGR. Let's enact this bipartisan compromise, however, to eliminate uncertainty for American families and then get right to work on a one- year version, not wait until February. Not walk away and hold off until the last minute. And let us not have a conference while we hold hostage 160 million Americans with fear that their taxes will go up on January 1st.
Let us not hold hostage 48 million seniors who will fear that their doctors will not be available to them. Let us not hold hostage 2.3 million Americans who don't have a job, are looking for a job, want to work and have the fear that they won't have the resources to support themselves and help support their families.
The American people are waiting. They're watching, closely and intently.
There was a cartoon in the "Washington Post" today which said that Speaker Boehner said, you know, we didn't get 12 presents under the tree so I'm going to take away the two presents you got. Mr. Speaker, let's give them the two presents and let's work on getting the other ten presents. That's what they want us to do. That's what the Senate did. That's what almost everybody in this country, including the "Wall Street Journal", says we ought to do, Mr. Speaker.
Now perhaps Rush Limbaugh and Grover Norquist don't think that's what we ought to do. But Americans think that's what we ought to do. And I am pleased to have to yield to the ranking member of the budget committee who grapples with this issues every day, knows how difficult they are to resolve and knows that sometimes you make an agreement on what you can agree on and then continue to work on that what you cannot.
Chris Van Hollen from Maryland.
REP. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D), MARYLAND: Thank you, Mr. Hoyer. And thank all of you for joining us today. Like you, I listened to the Speaker of the House who was just at this podium a short time ago. And as I heard his remarks, it was very clear that he's not listening to the American people. Just like the House Republicans did not listen to the American people when they threatened to have the United States default on its debts for the first time.
(END LIVE SPEECH)
HOLMES: All right. I'm going jump back in here and bring back in our "Political Buzz" players today. We're going to get rid of some of those questions because this is happening right in the middle of what we're doing.
So Robert, sorry I had to cut you off there but we wanted to hear from the Whip in the House, Steny Hoyer there.
ZIMMERMAN: Wise choice.
HOLMES: Yes. We wanted to hear from him. But I'm going to bring actually you, Patricia, in now. Republicans, they can't win this fight. There's a lot of nuance and there's a lot to this fight and a lot in the legislation and the back and forth.
But what people understand, what they hear is that your taxes are going to go up if the Republican leadership doesn't agree to something that's already been agreed to and they are the ones holding it up. Is there any way they can win this argument?
Patricia, There is no way, zero way that House Republicans at this point can win this argument. When they have lost the support of the "Wall Street Journal" editorial page, when 89 senators vote for this package and they say it's not good enough, they say it's nothing that they can live with.
They are starting to look so intransigent they are making the 11 percent approval rating of Congress look a little high. They have lost this argument on really just on the message alone. They do have good points. They do have good reasons that they could explain, but when you say let's take this to a conference committee, that does not put money in people's pockets. It doesn't put on a bumper sticker. They have lost the argument. They actually need to just wrap this up, do a short-term deal and go home.
ZIMMERMAN: Patricia --
HOLMES: Who is trying to get in there? Yes, go ahead.
ZIMMERMAN: Patricia, I think there's another issue here worth examining, and that is a good many of the House Republicans don't believe in the payroll tax cut extension, don't believe in extending unemployment benefits. Many have argued, like Michele Bachmann, one of the leaders of the Tea Party caucus, that unemployment benefits, in fact, are in fact wasted because people are using them to rip off the system or she's argued that payroll tax should not be extended. That's another issue here.
What they have done though -- what the Tea Party has done is unite mainstream Republicans with the President, with the Democrats in opposition to what is really a reflection of their greed and their hypocrisy and their conduct on this issue.
HOLMES: And Will, we're going through this exercise right now. At the end of the year, people are trying to, you know, get through the holidays. The economy is tough enough. Difficult financial times. They have to worry now about next year and their taxes going up.
Will, you said next year they're going to get this worked out. There's no way they're going to allow people's taxes to go up January 1. So what are we getting out of this exercise?
CAIN: I think so. Here's why. First of all, Robert's right. I think that an appropriate message and I told you this in the last hour, T.J., the appropriate message would have been what Robert just said actually.
Make a principled position against the payroll tax cut. Explain why the payroll tax cut is not actually something beneficial. But instead they didn't play that card and they lost this political fight as Patricia described. They have no way to win the political fight here.
Let me ask you this, if you had no way to win the political fight, do you want that fight to drag on? I think we all know the answer is no. We need to recognize the Democratic Party has an interest in extending this fight another two months up to the "State of the Union", a fight that they know President Obama can win.
Republicans are opposed to a tax cut. Look, Steny Hoyer said a couple of things that we all can agree on. Two-month is -- uncertainty is bad for the economy.
HOLMES: Yes.
CAIN: Two-month bill does not fix that.
Number two, they all want a year-long bill. Why don't they come together -- and number three, we should get to work -- so why don't they get to work right now? That the House Republicans have put a bill together; forget your Christmas break. Take a couple of days. Come back now or come back next week, Senate, and put together a bill now. Why do you have to work hard after the holidays?
(CROSSTALK)
Patricia: The senate is not coming back.
HOLMES: Go ahead, Patricia. You first.
Patricia: I have to say quickly. The Senate is not coming back. This is over for this year. The Democrats have the Republicans exactly where they want them. They are not going to give in to Republicans at this point.
If the Republicans' point is that there should be more certainty in this process, why are they letting Americans who are on unemployment benefits think that they might not have checks coming January 2nd? I mean they are -- they are stepping on their own message.
ZIMMERMAN: Patricia, the reason for that --
HOLMES: Get in there Robert. Go ahead.
ZIMMERMAN: Patricia, the reason for that is because, as I mentioned, the Republicans in the House don't believe in the concept of unemployment benefits or extending the payroll tax cut. But the bigger issue here is, this is not a Democrat or Republican fight. These are 89 Democrats and Republicans in the Senate, joining with Democrats in the House, joining with the "Wall Street Journal", demanding that there be a compromise and demanding that this be reconsidered in January.
Will, to your point, this is not an easy issue. If it was, it would have been done. It's not about just sitting around for a week and getting it done by January 1st. It's going to take tough negotiations. It's going to take the Republicans' willingness to compromise and putting the taxpayers first over their own personal philosophical agenda.
CAIN: Robert, I have a suggestion --
HOLMES: Ok. Wrap it for me quickly. Will, wrap it for me quickly.
CAIN: I never suggested this was an easy issue. But all I'm suggesting to you Robert, is we might not want to assign the blame of politics to one party only in this fight. It's a substantively difficult argument. And I've made this argument several times.
You keep saying Republicans are opposed to the payroll tax cut. You're right. But you say it as though that's a condemnation. It's not. It was a message that should be embraced.
ZIMMERMAN: I am.
HOLMES: All right. Will, Robert, thank you both. Patricia, always good to have you as well. This fight, as it is, continues. It's only got nine more days to continue and people's paychecks are going to get smaller. But we shall see if at least the extension goes for a couple of months.
Thanks to you all. I'll talk to you again soon.
I know, we're about a quarter of the top of the hour.
And coming up, we're going to check out a different side of Will Ferrell.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILL FERRELL, ACTOR: We've been to the Oscars and the Golden Globes and all these fancy things that were a treat. But that one night a year where we get to give out the scholarship checks is -- you know, supersedes all of that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Yes. We're just getting word from more Senate Democrat and Republican leaders. There's been a lot of back and forth in the past couple of hours in this payroll tax cut.
Let me bring in our Kate Bolduan. We're hearing from the senate minority leader now. And I'm reading through the statement, and he's kind of getting on everybody.
BOLDUAN: Right. I want to just make sure we heard correct. This is from Senator Mitch McConnell, this is the Senate Republican leader, the top Republican in the Senate.
And what we have here, is Senator McConnell, he seems to -- who has been largely silent throughout kind of this back and forth between House Republicans and Senate Democrats breaking his silence today issuing a statement and proposing, really, a compromise between where the House Republicans stand and what we're hearing from Senate Democrats.
I can read you part of his statement, but essentially what I'm reading that he's proposing is that Senate Democrats, they move to appoint conferees, appoint negotiators to this conference committee that Speaker John Boehner and House Republicans are demanding they move towards in order to negotiate this one-year deal.
And on the flip side then, the House Republicans should move forward and pass this two-month extension that Senate Democrats and Senate Republicans have signed on to and that they support in order to make sure that this tax cut does not lapse.
In his statement Senator Mitch McConnell says that this compromise, if you will, it prevents any disruption in the payroll tax holiday or other expiring provisions and allows Congress to work on a solution for the longer extension.
So this is noteworthy, as I mentioned at the top, T.J. We have not heard from the top Republican in the Senate as there's been this war of words between the White House and House Republicans and Senate Democrats. So this is the first time we're really hearing from him in this late stage in the game.
And now he seems to be proposing a compromise. A word of warning though, we have not gotten reaction from Senate Democrats or House Republicans yet. So we'll have to see how this plays.
HOLMES: I'm sure it's coming soon. Kate Bolduan, the update, thank you very much.
BOLDUAN: Of course.
HOLMES: Hearing from the Minority Leader in the Senate, Senator McConnell.
We're about nine minutes of the top of the hour. Quick break, we're right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Taking a look at stories making news cross-country. Take a listen.
This is Pembroke Pines, Florida. Carolers not just singing Christmas carols. This is outside the office of U.S. Representative DebbIE Wasserman Schultz. These are protesters singing songs like "Jail Bail Rock" and "Frosty the Jailerman". The group actually upset about the planned building of a large prison in the community.
Also in New York City, the most expensive in Manhattan has just sold for $88 million. You know who bought it, a Russian billionaire. Do you know who he bought it for? His 22-year-old daughter. According to the listing, the apartment which covers the length of a city block, has ten rooms and two wood burning fireplaces.
Also Fort Knox, Kentucky -- these just never get old. Take a look here 300 soldiers returning home in time for the holidays. Look at that excited young lady there. They spent a year in Afghanistan helping the country's security forces.
Well, there will be a little something special coming up on Monday night football. Not just the big game between the Saints and the Falcons. ESPN says Betty White will be the star of the show's open. The network is only saying that the 89-year-old comedian will be part of a holiday themed piece.
Also tough go right now for Kobe Bryant. It's been rough out there for him. You know by now that he's actually getting a divorce. Also he thought he was going to get a chance to play with Chris Paul in that whole trade, but commissioner blocked that deal.
Now, throw this in, an injury. He has a torn ligament in his right wrist. This happened in Monday night's preseason game against the Clippers. We're told now that he is day to day.
Speaking of that game, this was the final warm-up here, if you will, for them. Blake griffin, the dude is just a man child. That's a pre-season game but still, a lot of people are wondering if the Clippers can now challenge the Lakers for supremacy in L.A. with Chris Paul now playing for the Clippers. He will be hooking up early and often with Blake Griffin there. Griffin had 30 points; for the second time in three days the Clippers beat the Lakers.
Next hour the CNN NEWSROOM coming your way; it means you're a few minutes away from Suzanne Malveaux. Four former NFL players are suing the NFL over head injuries. They're claiming they downplayed the link between concussions and brain damage.
We're taking a closer look at that case, a case that could be a big deal on the gridiron. That is coming your way when Suzanne takes over after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
