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Guilty Verdict In Rutgers Case; Massacre Suspect Headed To U.S.; Caged 13-Year-Old Weighs 40 LBS.; George Clooney Arrested; Attorney: Massacre Suspect Headed To U.S.; Attorney Mulls Putting War On Trial; Microbrews Defy Tough Times; Funk Pioneer George Clinton At SXSW; "The Road We've Traveled"

Aired March 16, 2012 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: We now know the verdict in the case of the former Rutgers University student accused of spying and intimidating his gay roommate who then went on and committed suicide. Dharun Ravi guilty of the most serious charge against him, that being biased intimidation. He was also found guilty of invasion of privacy, tampering with evidence and several other charges. This young man here could now face up to 10 years in jail and possibly be deported to his native India. Tyler Clementi was his roommate. He jumped to his death off the George Washington Bridge. That was back in 2010. And Ravi had spied on Clementi's sexual encounters with another man with a webcam and had shared it with others on Twitter.

I want to bring in Miguel Marquez. He's watching this story for us there in New York.

And so this guilty verdict, big surprise or no?

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, big surprise that it was across the board. I think anybody who watched the trial realized that it was a very, very complicated trial. It was very easy to break down in the press and a lot of people had perceptions about what happened in the trial, but when you looked at the specifics and the details of what happened in that trial, it is pretty remarkable that on every single count the jury, in some aspects, found Mr. Ravi guilty of both invasion of privacy and then the compounding factor, biased intimidation.

BALDWIN: We know his father, Tyler Clementi's father, addressed these young people after the verdict was read. Let's take a look at that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE CLEMENTI, FATHER: To our college, high school and even middle school youngsters, I would say this. You're not necessarily going to -- you're going to meet a lot of people in your lifetime. Some of these people you may not like. But just because you don't like them does not mean you have to work against them. When you see somebody doing something wrong, tell them, that's not right. Stop it. You can make the world a better place. The change you want to see in the world begins with you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: It's been just about two years since they lost their son. How -- just describe their reaction as the verdict was read, Miguel.

MARQUEZ: Well, they -- you know, they held onto each other. James, their son, was also there. The Clementi mother and father held on to their other son, James, who was there in the trial -- in the courtroom. It appeared that at some point Mrs. Clementi began to cry as the jury was reading a very lengthy and complicated result that they had put in. For Mr. Ravi's part, he was emotionless. I think probably in shock. He seemed to stare down at the floor, not able to look at the jury as they read those results. But the family clearly, in court every single day or almost every single day if not every single day of this trial, certainly happy that this is -- this part of it is done. But it's not -- it's not clear to me that they will ever feel closure in this case.

BALDWIN: As for Dharun Ravi, as we mentioned, he could be going to jail for 10 years. And it's so import to just re-emphasize, I mean, had it not been for social media, right, had he not tweeted about what he saw, he may not have been in court today.

MARQUEZ: This is -- yes, the prosecutors really built their case around this. You know, he saw Clementi. It's -- nothing he ever said was sort of virulently anti-gay. He was never really, really mean to him. But when he saw him -- when he turned on his webcam, saw him and this visitor that he had, making out or kissing, had other people present there and then tweeted about it, telling the world or at least telling his friends around him, who then told his friends or their friends. And then two days later, when Clementi asked to use the room again, he then tweeted again saying that, you know, tune in. Dial into my webcam. You can see it for yourselves. My roommate's at it again with this -- with this visitor.

Clementi, the prosecutor said, looked at Ravi's Twitter feed at least 38 times after that very first tweet went out, worried about what else was coming. He was clearly concerned about what this guy was putting out to people all up and down the dorm where he was staying. People that he would be going to school with. He was clearly a shy guy who was very embarrassed by it.

BALDWIN: Miguel Marquez, thank you so much.

Meantime, let's get you caught up on everything else making news here at the top of the hour. "Rapid Fire." Let's go.

First up, an American soldier accused of that massacre in Afghanistan is to arrive a little later today in the U.S. The still unidentified soldier has reportedly left Kuwait and is believed to be bound for Fort Leavenworth, Kansas. He attorney says he will be arriving there sometime later this afternoon. Much more on that in just a moment.

Also, Hollywood A-lister George Clooney arrested in Washington, D.C., today. Arrested, handcuffed, while protesting at the Sudanese embassy. Also the Oscar winner's father with him. He, too, was hauled off, along with congressmen, human rights activists. The protests were to raise awareness over the crisis currently in Sudan. And, Clooney, we're told, he has now been released and is expected to speak to the media any moment now. We're watching for that.

Also, great video. Look at this. Yet another tornado. This is a twister approaching Dexter, Michigan. This was shot yesterday by a guy playing golf. In the state, 70-degree March weather, playing golf and saw this thing. At least 50 homes were destroyed and dozens damaged in the area right around Ann Arbor. Thankfully no one died and no major injuries were reported.

Also, President Obama is making his way through two time zones today to attend five fundraisers. What's it going to bring in for his campaign, you ask? An estimated $5 million. The president now in Chicago. Tonight he will be headed to Atlanta where actor and director Tyler Perry is hosting one of the fundraisers.

And after a year of protests and violence, the U.N. intends to send a special envoy to Syria soon. Kofi Annan, the United Nations point man on the conflict there, plans to send the envoy to the capital of Damascus in hopes of setting up an international monitoring plan. Though it's still not clear exactly when this envoy will be going. Last weekend Annan met with Syrian President Bashar al Assad to try to stop his siege on his own people for protesting now against his regime.

And funny man Russell Brand arrested in New Orleans. Police caught up with the comedian yesterday at Harrah's Casino after he failed to turn himself in. A warrant had been issued for Brand after he allegedly snatched a cell phone belonging to a member of the paparazzi because he or she was taking his picture, and then tossed it through a window. Brand was charged with criminal damage to property. He was released after posting bail.

And the new iPad. Remember, this isn't iPad 3. This is just the iPad. Now in stores. You see the lines. This is Tokyo. Tough to believe these tablets were first released just two years ago. The new version will cost the same as the iPad 2, $499.

And a lot more to cover for you in the next two hours, including this.

As we learn more about his personal life, the U.S. soldier who's accused of killing those families in Afghanistan returns to the U.S. We are also hearing from his attorney who says this is just the beginning of a trial on the war itself.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. The news is now.

A new movie shows the pain of bullying.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've got to be the one that doesn't fit in.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: I'll talk with one teenage victim about the one thing he says he'd do differently.

John Edwards' ex-mistress who helped cover up the affair and their love child will testify against him. You'll hear what she gets in return.

And, in case you needed proof, beer can survive a recession. I'll speak live with a guy whose start-up is part of America's comeback.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: The U.S. soldier suspected of mass murder in Afghanistan is now on his way back to America. He has hired a prominent civilian attorney who spoke at length today to us at CNN. And this attorney told us that this so far unidentified soldier is due to arrive late this afternoon. He's going to be held at Ft. Leavenworth, Kansas. Here's a look. So they have a high security prison. And you can see there is an airstrip, as well, as we hone in. Plenty of room as well next to that prison to land a chopper if need be. And you can bet this transfer today will take place under the tightest security.

Want you to now hear from the suspect's attorney. He says he has spoken with his client by phone. He says he is a highly decorated soldier, a strong family man and he is disputing any kind of suggestion we've heard thus far that there might have been some kind of issue with this soldier's marriage, because of this published report based upon unnamed military sources. So, again, here is this lawyer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN HENRY BROWNE, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I know for a fact that the marital problem issue is totally bogus. And I'm not -- I'm a little concerned as to why that's being floated out there by the government. And the other part is, you know, anyone who's in Afghanistan right now, particularly someone who's been in Iraq three times previously and been injured, would obviously be under a great deal of stress. So, stress is always a factor. I know for a fact that there is no issue with his marriage. It's a very strong marriage and, frankly, we're all taking offense to that. Now, whether there was alcohol involved or not, I simply don't know. I haven't spoken to my client about that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: I want to bring in Casey Wian. He's actually standing outside the office of that attorney.

And, Casey, what more do you know about that phone conversation between this lawyer and this client that U.S. Army sergeant suspected of killing those 16 Afghan civilians on Sunday? CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, that phone conversation took place yesterday morning, early, when the soldier was still being held in custody in Kuwait. Now as you've reported, he is on his way back to the United States.

The attorney says the soldier wanted to send his love to his family. And we asked him if he expressed any kind of remorse for this shooting incident. The attorney said he would not have any comment on that. He did say, though, that this soldier seemed unaware of some of the circumstances surrounding this case. And that was very much of concern to the attorney. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BROWNE: He sounded distant and kind of like a deer in the headlights, but OK. I conveyed his family's love for him. I told him I did not want to speak to him about specifics of the case because I don't trust the phone not being monitored. I don't know what the facts are. He seemed to be unaware of some of the facts that I talked to him about, which makes me concerned about his state of mind, obviously.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Casey, I just wanted to ask you about this. This attorney. This civilian attorney. His name is John Henry Browne. How did he get hooked up with this particular client, this soldier?

WIAN: Well, the family requested that he represent this soldier, John Henry Browne. He's a very high-profile defense attorney here in the Seattle area. He has defended the so-called barefoot bandit recently several years back. He also defended serial killer Ted Bundy and one former military attorney suggested surprise that this soldier would hire someone who has, in his history, the defense of a serial killer. But apparently his family did ask for this attorney to represent him. Despite concerns about his personal safety, John Henry Browne agreed to do that. He will be paid by the family, according to Mr. Browne, Brooke.

BALDWIN: What about, Casey, the personal safety of this soldier's family? I mean according to what I've read, you know, as you mentioned, he's married, he has two children, two very young children. Do we know where they are? Is the military going to great lengths to protect them?

WIAN: Yes. Absolutely. And that's a primary concern. That's one reason why the military says they have not released this soldier's name. His wife and his two children, contrary to some previous two reports that were out there that they had been moved off of the base, the joint base Lewis-McChord, near Seattle here in the Tacoma area. The family, according to Mr. Browne, the attorney, remains on that base, which would seem to be a very, very safe place for them to be, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Casey Wian for us in Seattle. Casey, thank you so much. I want to bring in our next guest from Washington, Gary Solis, adjunct professor of military law at Georgetown University. He is a former Marine prosecutor.

Sir, welcome.

The unnamed massacre suspect here, as we just showed, has hired this civilian lawyer. This fairly high-profile lawyer. If you were prosecuting this particular case, would you rather go up a civilian attorney or a military lawyer?

GARY SOLIS, FORMER MARINE PROSECUTOR: Well, I think I'd probably prefer to go up against a military lawyer because we would both be familiar with the rules in the courtroom and how to get to the convening authority and where the levers are in that particular jurisdiction. It's always nice to be in your familiar surroundings that you've worked with before so you know how to best -- to most effectively operate.

BALDWIN: OK. Let me play a little bit more sound as we're hearing from the attorney of this accused soldier. And he is talking specifically here about the prospect of putting the entire war in Afghanistan on trial. It's pretty interesting remarks. Take a listen with me.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BROWNE: I'm old enough to remember the My Lai Massacre in Vietnam and how that hastened the end of that war. Maybe a tragic incident such as this will get people to rethink the war in general. I certainly don't want to put the war on trial, but I think that people should start thinking more about why we're there and how long we're going to stay there.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN: It does sound as if you're going to put the war on trial, though.

BROWNE: We'll see.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: We'll see, he says.

Gary, do you see any advantage, if you look at this sort of, you know, tactically speaking from the defense perspective, that they could gain by turning this into a political trial, a trial about the war itself?

SOLIS: Well, good luck. I was in Vietnam when My Lai went down. I was a company commander then in the Marine Corps. And I was a military judge years later after I went to law school. And if I'm the judge in this case, I'm not going to let him go there. That's not what this case is about. The case is about the guilt or the innocence of the accused, not the justness or unjustness of the war. So I don't think he's going to make much progress in trying to put the war on trial, if that indeed is an attack he attempts. BALDWIN: What if he doesn't do it in the courtroom but he does it publicly?

SOLIS: Oh, he can do that. He can do whatever publicly. He's free to do that. And he's welcome to do so. But in the courtroom, this is only a court marshal about guilt or innocence of the accused.

BALDWIN: So if you see --

SOLIS: I -- if indeed --

BALDWIN: It would -- go ahead. Go ahead.

SOLIS: If indeed this case gets to trial, I have my doubts.

BALDWIN: Why do you doubt that?

SOLIS: Because I think that this is a case tailor-made for a mental capacity defense. That is, an insanity defense. Whether the accused suffered from a disease or defect of the mind which prevented him from recognizing the wrongfulness of his acts. And I think that that's going to be a significant issue in this trial and I wonder if we'll ever see it go to trial.

BALDWIN: How would the defense go about proving that? And we don't know anything. We don't even know this guy's name. So we don't even know if there are issues. He suffered some sort of head injury, I know, in Iraq and he did go to a medical center in Washington state as a result of that before going to Afghanistan. But how would the defense prove that and when?

SOLIS: You just showed him how. Just what you said. Just put that into evidence. This is his fourth combat tour. PTSD is on everybody's minds. He's been injured in combat before. And as he said, everybody at that base is under a high amount of stress. So those are issues which could constitute a start down a road towards mental incapacity.

We heard that -- his lawyer said that he didn't seem to know what was going on. A deer in the headlights and so forth. So I think that that's very definitely a possibility. The defense does have the burden of proving mental incapacity. The government doesn't have to prove the contrary. But I think that there is certainly a basis for such an defense here.

BALDWIN: What about, Gary, we were also wondering about the issue with multiple deployments. He had been in three tours in Iraq. This was his fourth. Fourth tour. First in Afghanistan. Could this trial, if it goes to trial -- and, again, you're saying you don't think it would -- if it does, could it impact the conduct of this war, future wars, multiple deployments? And also in this soldier's case, sending him back out, as we just discussed, because of this head injury and also some sort of serious foot injury he sustained in Iraq?

SOLIS: No, I don't think that it will be an issue for deployments because what we have now is a volunteer army. And four deployments is a lot in a combat zone.

BALDWIN: It is a lot.

SOLIS: But it's not unique. I mean three or four months ago, one of our soldiers was killed on his seventh deployment. We have Marines and soldiers who have been over there five, six times. So this is not going to change our deployment schedule. This is a case of criminality, of an individual who I believe has a defense in that he has been sent overseas so often, but I don't think it's likely to change our deployment schedules. We can't afford to. We only have so many soldiers and we have so many responsibilities over there.

BALDWIN: And so much money to spend.

Gary Solis, I thank you so much, adjunct professor of military law at Georgetown. Thank you.

Coming up, caged -- caged in a closet, strapped to a bed, locked in the bathroom for days, maybe weeks at a time. I'm talking about a 13-year-old boy who weighs all of 40 pounds. Coming up next, why he was locked up and what happened to the other four kids in the home.

Also, we have a close eye here. Live pictures. Do we see George Clooney? George and his father Nick part of this whole melee, it looks like, outside of this jail in Washington, D.C. They were arrested after protesting outside the Sudanese embassy, what, just about an hour, two hours ago. Can we dip in and listen? Let's listen.

(BEGIN LIVE FEED)

GEORGE CLOONEY, ACTOR/ACTIVIST: You got hit (INAUDIBLE) today earlier.

NICK CLOONEY: Hey, knuckleheads.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You talking to me?

G. CLOONEY: Yes, he was talking to you. He called you a knucklehead.

Well, listen --

N. CLOONEY: (INAUDIBLE).

G. CLOONEY: What we've been trying to achieve today is, we're trying to bring attention to an ongoing emergency. One that's got about a six-week timetable before the rainy season starts and a lot of people are going to die from it. So our job right now is to try to bring attention to it. One of those ways was apparently getting arrested. I guess we're not allowed to hang out at the Sudanese embassy.

N. CLOONEY: I didn't know that, did you?

G. CLOONEY: No, I didn't know that either.

N. CLOONEY: I thought it said welcome.

G. CLOONEY: You go ahead and say something.

N. CLOONEY: All I want to say is this whole Sudanese ongoing drama has scarred my son and me for a number of years, since our first visit there in 2006. It continues to be an ongoing tragedy. We want to do anything we can to ensure that that tragedy ends in our lifetime. And I must say, in my case, that's not very long. So I'm hoping we're going to finish this up and get something going so that we can all live to see all of the Sudanese people go home and get on with their lives. Thanks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If the words never again mean anything, it means that people of conscious have to stand up when ethnic cleansing is taking place. And this manmade famine, these attacks on civilian targets, are aimed exactly at ethnic cleansing. And this extraordinarily broad range of political leaders, cultural leaders, public figures, public --

(END LIVE FEED)

BALDWIN: Well, this is something I never thought I'd say, but, as we mentioned before, George Clooney arrested today as he and his father, Nick Clooney, they, along with head of NAACP, Ben Jealous, members of Congress, several others, as they were mentioning, arrested outside the Sudanese embassy. They thought they said the welcome -- saw the welcome sign. I understand police did warn them a couple of times. They were arrested. They were hauled off to jail. And now they're speaking. Let's listen to George Clooney one more time.

(BEGIN LIVE FEED)

G. CLOONEY: There are people dying every day there. There at a pretty decent number. There were 34 people killed in a month and a half period of time in one village alone. About 500 people injured. That's from random bombing of civilians. These are not military targets at all. These are antanovs (ph) flying over the top and opening up their cargo doors and dropping bombs out. It's also from these new -- these 300 millimeter rockets. They are not very good at hitting their targets, but they're big, so they hit a lot.

So, first and foremost, there is the immediate danger of that. But what is in -- what is the real looming danger is this. They're trying to choke these people out and get them to leave. It's their land. They've lived on it. It's the oldest society in the world. They've lived there a long, long time. They are not leaving their land. They are hiding in caves while these bombs go on.

In the meantime, they have been unable to farm their land and they -- their land, often times their farms, when they did, were burned. So what we're facing now is hundreds of thousands of people who are looking at the possibility of starvation because the rainy season is coming. And when the rainy season comes in six weeks, then even when it's time -- even when -- if the government of Sudan says, OK, we'll allow aid in, it will be too late. We can't get up those roads. And anybody who's been there understands, it is impossible to travel those roads. So it needs to start now because best estimate are tens of thousands of people are going to die from starvation that is manmade. This isn't a famine. You know, this is a manmade tragedy by the government of Khartoum to get these people to leave. So it's immediate, I think.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you think you accomplished something by getting arrested here in front of the Sudanese embassy (ph)?

G. CLOONEY: I don't -- you know, you never know if you're accomplishing anything. All we're trying to do is bring attention to a moment in time that is actually important. We hope that this brings attention to it. We hope it helps. With both the parties on The Hill have been great supporters of these issues, but this was very much a Republican issue. It is also very much a Democratic issue. So we hope it gives some more political will and focuses some more and all of you here help do that. And we appreciate that. And we hope that as -- the people understand that there really is a ticking clock on this and that we need to get moving.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Clooney, you've been at this for some time.

G. CLOONEY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not just in the last few days, but the last few years. Can you point to any progress that's been made by bringing attention to it?

G. CLOONEY: Well, there's been amazing progress at times. You know, the referendum creating an entire new southern state without any bloodshed is monumental. That was -- that's a real complement to the Chinese, who acknowledge the southern state, which made it very difficult for the north to do much. It's a great complement to the administration and the hard sort of personal work that they did on putting together these leaders in making sure that that happened. They've been some great strides.

But on the other hand, there is an awful lot that still keeps going on. Darfur is still a problem and it's still going on. Avia, when I went there a year ago, it was, you know, 120,000 people. There no one there. There's no one there now. They have been either killed or moved into camps.

So these are all ongoing problems all by the exact same people. These same men charged with war crimes against humanity at the Hague are responsible for this. And they want these people off that land. And that -- it's that simple. So if they would stop doing that, we would appreciate it, you know.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Clooney --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How'd they treating you in there?

G. CLOONEY: It was really rough, you can imagine. Have you ever been in a cell with these guys? Why don't you ask them?

(END LIVE FEED)

BALDWIN: All right, joking about it just a little bit, sharing a smile with his father there in a D.C. jail. George Clooney, fresh out of jail in Washington after being arrested at that Sudanese embassy.

By the way, if you want to keep watching this, you can. Pop open that laptop or that computer, go to cnn.com/live. And again, he was on The Hill this week testifying. Met with the president about what's happening, the atrocities in Sudan. Obviously very, very passionate about it.

By the way, we do have video of the arrests going down. We're going to share that with you in just a moment. Be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: And now this is just one of those stories. We sit around in the morning meeting, we think, do we share this? It's pretty tough to tell, but we want to tell it because it's just an example of why, as a society, we can do better.

So this one comes out of central Florida. It involves a father and his girlfriend. They are now in jail. Police in Brevard County say this man's 13-year-old son was found locked up and lying on the floor of a bathroom. Basically, according to police, the boy was caged. We'll let the police explain.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CPL. GARY BOYERS, TITUSVILLE, FLORIDA POLICE DEPARTMENT: We got called out this evening to an unlawful caging. Came out, did our investigation, were able to determine that a child had been held here. This occurred over a period of time. We're still trying to narrow down what the time range is. I believe over a couple of months.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So that's disturbing enough, but now consider this, the 13-year-old boy the police found weighs only 40 pounds. Just think about that for a moment, 40 pounds. That's the average weight of a 5- year-old. This boy is 13.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What did you do to that child? You almost killed him, they say.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Not much to say. The father, Michael Marshall, being charged with aggravated child abuse and false imprisonment. Police say Marshall told them he caged the boy and didn't feed him as punishment for stealing food after food was being withheld from him.

He stole food because he wasn't being allowed to eat. In other words, he was starving this 13-year-old. Police say the boy was sometimes locked in a closet, sometimes strapped to a bed, sometimes locked in a bathroom.

And police found four other kids in the house. They are all in protective custody. This case yet another reminder, if you see something, say something because we can do better.

Handcuffs latched onto George Clooney. We just saw him a moment ago. We're going to watch the complete tape of the entire arrest at the Sudanese Embassy. Hear from him directly after this quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: All right, back to our Hollywood leading man here, George Clooney, arrested not too long ago leading this protest in Washington. The actor handcuffed in front of the Sudanese embassy. His own father right there with him.

He was hauled away as well along with congressmen, human rights activists and basically these protests are calling for an end to the atrocities by the Sudanese government against their own people, children included there.

Now the Oscar winner as you say, live, he was released just a couple of minutes ago. But for those of you at work who missed it, I want you to watch as the whole melee unfolded earlier this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE CLOONEY, ACTOR: We're here really to ask two very simple questions. The first question is something immediate, and immediate we will need humanitarian aid to be allowed into Sudan before it becomes the worst humanitarian crisis in the world immediately.

The second thing we are here to ask is a very simple thing, is for the government in Kartum to stop randomly killing its own innocent men, women and children. Stop raping them and stop starving them. That's all we ask.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm not -- it's the people on the other side of me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Well, he wanted attention on the issue, and by the looks of that crush of photographers and reporters, it looks like he got it.

Meantime, the president of Afghanistan, Hamid Karzai, blasting America for not allowing Afghan authorities to meet with the U.S. soldier accused of shooting and killing 16 Afghan civilians this past Sunday.

Coming up next, we have all these new details as to when the soldier is supposed to be back on U.S. soil.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BALDWIN: I want to talk more now about the massacre of the 16 Afghan civilians. The American military suspect, he is to arrive on U.S. soil very, very soon. This is all according to his newly hired civilian attorney.

He is John Henry Browne. That attorney talked to CNN today saying his client should arrive late this afternoon in his destination. Take a look at the map. You're looking at Fort Leavenworth, Kansas. We're going to talk about this facility in just a moment with our correspondent at the Pentagon, Chris Lawrence.

But first let's take you back to Sunday morning when that massacre happened, and it continues today to strain relations between the United States and Afghanistan. I want you to listen to Afghan President Hamid Karzai.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRESIDENT HAMID KARZAI, AFGHANISTAN: This is the end of the road here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: End of the road?

KARZAI: End of the road. Nobody can afford such luxuries anymore.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: I want to go straight to Kabul to Sara Sidner. We heard Karzai say end of the rope, end of the rope. He's not happy about a lot of things, apparently.

SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, very frustrated, to say the least. He sat and listened for more than an hour to village elders. Some of them were slapping them tables, shaking their hands and saying that we don't want any kind of compensation, give us justice.

So he listened to that for quite a while and then spoke to the village elders saying that they felt the same. That compensation is nothing that this government wants. They really want to see justice done.

But he is not so happy about how the United States handled the investigation, because, he said, the Afghan investigators were not given their due, not allowed to speak with that accused U.S. soldier, the person accused of killing 16 people in the Panjwai district in Kandahar. Here's what he said about this investigation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARZAI: The Afghan investigation team did not receive the cooperation that they expected from the United States. Therefore, these are all questions we will be raising and raising very loudly and raising very clearly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: We also know President Karzai spoke to President Obama by phone. Do you have any details of that, any readout? SIDNER: Yes, he talked a little bit about that. He said that he was speaking in postue, that Mr. Obama was upset with him because he had asked for this transition from NATO forces being in control of the country to Afghan forces being in control of the country by 2013 as opposed to 2014, which really has been the date that was agreed upon, and so he said that Mr. Obama was upset with that.

He also talked a little bit about the surveillance video that some Afghan investigators have been shown. We asked him specifically, are you happy with that? Did you see the video yourself?

This surveillance video supposedly shows this accused U.S. soldier coming back to base, trying to sneak back into base and then comes and puts his hands up like so. And he is skeptical about the video.

He says, the investigators have looked at it and they are, quote, "not convinced." So there are a lot of questions, a lot of skepticism coming from the Afghan government as well as the villagers who are clearly angry not only with NATO soldiers and American soldiers, but I think America as a whole -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: So questions on the Afghan side. Sara Sidner, thank you.

Questions also on the U.S. side. I want to go to the Pentagon here. Pentagon Chris Lawrence, specifically here as we're waiting for the arrival of this still unnamed soldier at Fort Leavenworth, Kansas, do we know anything more about when he should be arriving? I imagine it will be pretty high security.

CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON: Yes, Brooke. Well, it should be soon. If you're flying from Kuwait and he's been enroute since early this morning at the very least, he should be arriving by sometime late this afternoon at the very latest.

We do know that once he gets to Fort Leavenworth, I just got off the phone with a representative there, when the inmate gets to Fort Leavenworth, he's given a very lengthy physical and psychological evaluation.

It's given to all inmates and it's used to determine whether they are cleared to live with some of the other inmates or perhaps they might have to be isolated.

Now if his confinement, so to speak, is anything like Bradley Manning's, the Wikileaks suspect was, he's going to be living in an about 80 square foot cell. It has a steel bunk, sink, one window.

Again, if it's clear to be around other inmates, he'll be able to exercise and eat with a small group of other inmates and use the library as well. BALDWIN: So you said, he could be around other inmates. They wouldn't just keep him alone.

LAWRENCE: It is possible. I mean, there is special housing, in more of an isolated area, but if he is cleared to live around other inmates then yes, he would.

BALDWIN: OK, let's talk about this trial if in fact, he goes to trial. We're talking to former Marine prosecutor. He doesn't think he will.

But we've heard from the suspect's attorney. He hasn't ruled out putting the war itself, the war in Afghanistan on trial. Could a trial such as this one, could it have -- I don't know.

Kind of impact in terms of the conduct on this war, future wars, maybe multiple deployments? We know this soldier was his fourth tour.

LAWRENCE: That's right. Well, I got to say this. He wouldn't be the first defendant to do so. Remember, the war has been going on since 2001. There have been a lot of crimes committed in the last 11, 12 years. A lot of people in service. A lot of people who got home and committed crimes.

Let me bring you a quick quote, Brooke. Just this sort of illustrate this. This is not about the stress of warfare. This is about heinous crimes committed against innocent civilians. That quote has nothing to do with the case we're talking about now.

That was the prosecutor talking about the Steve Green case. He was the soldier who raped an Iraqi teenager and murdered her family. So, you know, he had mood-regulating drugs that he had been prescribed.

He had seen a stress counselor. So a lot of the same elements of stress, warfare stress, PTSD. Those things have come up in other trials. This won't be breaking any new ground in that area, but how successful it will be, that's the question.

BALDWIN: OK, Chris Lawrence for us in the Pentagon. Chris, we'll be watching for you and we will be awaiting the arrival of this soldier at Fort Leavenworth perhaps in the coming hours, as you mentioned late afternoon. Thank you.

Coming up next, totally switching gears, CNN going in depth on the industries behind America's come back. What businesses are doing well? Would you believe Microbrews are part of this whole success story?

They're not only tasty for beer fans, but they're a great bet financially. We're going to talk to the co-founder and CEO of stone brewing company to show us how he turned beer into money, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BALDWIN: CNN this week we've gone in depth focusing on America's comeback over the last couple years. But one industry is not just on the rise, it's been growing all along, Microbrews.

It's Friday. We got to have a little fun here. The latest numbers show in 2011 craft brew sales were up 16 percent, and that according to the Brewers Association follows two years of growth in revenue.

U.S. beer sales, by the way, overall, according to the association, they were down 1 percent. So what is it about a pint, maybe a bottle here of this niche lager that makes it defy these economic tough times.

To answer that, we have someone who's watched it happened, who's help make it happen in San Diego where Microbrews are hot, hot, hot. I want to go straight to Greg Koch. He's the co-founder, CEO of this stone brewing company.

So Greg, congrats on your success. Before we go any further though, let's do a little craft beer 101 for people who don't know. What is a craft beer?

GREG KOCH, CO-FOUNDER AND CEO, STONE BREWERY COMPANY: Well, craft beer is essentially identified by brewers that are independent, traditional in that they don't use additives and adjuncts and they use traditional ingredients, and we are small. We're not like the major international conglomerate breweries, we're small and unique and all over the country.

BALDWIN: What is it about your beer that people are willing to pay when they don't have a lot of money to spend?

KOCH: Well, we had this crazy idea. Maybe we should try and make our beer taste really, really good instead of being the lowest common denominator approach.

BALDWIN: So, OK, beyond the tasting good part. I just wanted to, you know, what are some takeaways, Greg, for people who are struggling? If they're maybe already in a business, thinking of starting up an independent business, give me three good pieces of advice, part of your business acumen that they could emulate.

KOCH: Well, I think in today's economy, people are very focused on about exactly what they're getting for their money. As a result, if you as a business person focus on giving great quality rather than bringing down on what you do and trying to please everybody. In fact, I actually advocate ignoring everybody, instead following your own heart, following your own passion.

BALDWIN: OK, so you follow your own passion. Be amazing. What do you mean by be amazing? Isn't that one obvious?

KOCH: Well, it's not unusual that a lot of companies will actually do things they know are not amazing in the attempt to get more customers. The American public doesn't want amazing, and I disagree with that.

I think the American public, when faced with great options, will make great choices. So we built our business and the craft brewers have built their business on this very simple premise, do something that's amazing, make really great beer rather than lowest common denominator.

And don't go in with the idea that people just want something that is dumbed down, but instead that they maybe just want something that's great, and provide that for them.

BALDWIN: It sounds so simple. Greg Koch, congratulations to you, stone brewery in California. Back to you. Hope to come find you sometime. Appreciate it.

Coming up next, an impromptu performance by the grandfather of funk. I'm talking about George Clinton.

I actually got to sit down with this guy to hear about his fight. He's fighting -- he told preserve the funk. I'm telling you save his own musical recordings and this web site that is helping him raise the money thinks that many of you to do so. That's next.

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BALDWIN: He's known by a lot of names, the grandfather of funk, Dr. Funkenstein, the pioneer of punk. He is George Clinton.

So this was just a couple days ago. I was standing just off the stage. He stopped by the CNN Grill at South by Southwest. We were all down in Austin over the weekend. He is 71 years young. He treated the whole crowd and myself to this impromptu performance.

The guy was up until 3:00 in the morning and there he was. He asked for help in terms of digitizing his intensive musical library, which will cost him 50 grand. That's his goal and he's doing it through a new fundraising web site. It's called Indy Gogo and I caught with him. We talked to him about this unique campaign.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE CLINTON, MUSICIAN: We have hundreds and hundreds of reels of track over the years and have put that stuff onto digital format now.

SLAVA RUBIN, CEO, FOUNDER INDIEGOGO: No matter how big you are or how small your needs are, you can raise money. Seeing George Clinton to raise money to preserve his music and to save his studio is incredible.

BALDWIN: If I'm watching and I'm thinking, OK, I guess I can give, but what's in it for me? I get a thank you from you?

CLINTON: A thank you, a record, a video, a phone conversation. Whatever anyone asks for when they donate, we try to accommodate that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: I tell you, that guy couldn't have been nicer. By the way, here's where they are right now, see the number, 20,000. That's how far they are to that $50,000 goal for the George Clinton Foundation.

The website again, it is indiegogo.com. If you want to catch up on all things south by southwest, check out CNN's special coverage tomorrow 2:30 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN. Looking forward to that.

Meantime, let's talk politics. Candy Crowley joins us with a little America's Choice 2012 political update. Let's begin with the Obama campaign because they appear to be in full swing with that debut of that 17-minute film.

It's called "The Road We Traveled." What do we know about the strategy behind the movie? A lot of big names involved here.

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Listen, it's pretty simple. It's a big, flashy, catch your attention 17-minute promotion for the president. Why?

Number one, it's the kind of thing that tends to stir your base. The folks that might be a little unhappy with President Obama because he hasn't done this or that, but are nonetheless with him, it puts enthusiasm back in.

You know, there's music in it that makes you feel all, you know, let's go. So it's one to stir the base, but it is also to get out there with here's my story before the Republicans pick whoever their nominee is going to be and seeks to define President Obama on his terms.

So this is sort of a stake in the ground. Here's who I am, as well as something to play to the choir, basically, and say, now remember this. Remember he did this and he did that and so it serves kind of both those purposes.

BALDWIN: Tom Hanks serves as narrator. We also see former President Bill Clinton. In fact, let me just tee up a clip. We're about to see a clip. This is Clinton talking about President Obama's decision to green light the Bin Laden raid. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He took the harder and the more honorable path. When I saw what had happened, I thought to myself, I hope that's a call I would have made.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Candy, you hear the light music, the crescendo. Is this like a locomotion?

CROWLEY: Absolutely. And he finally got the terrorists we've all been looking for all these years and he made this brave decision. Yes, it's the story according to the people who like him best.

And, you know, it is intended for those who might have some doubts or might be thinking, yes, but he promised to do this and didn't. It's kind of like a pep rally only on the high scale end of it.

And again, it helped put these things out there to define the president before his opponents do.

BALDWIN: Candy Crowley, thank you. Full swing, here we go.

Meantime, actor, activist George Clooney arrested today. Video of what went down, details as to why. That's next.

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