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Shuttle "Enterprise's" Final Flight; Flight Scare Due To Bedbug Bites; Ford Profits Fall; $200,000 Raised For Zimmerman; Ex-CIA Official Defends Waterboarding; Obama: Would Veto GOP Student Loan Plan
Aired April 27, 2012 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. I'm Carol Costello.
Happening right now in the NEWSROOM, another very big day for space geeks and history buff, the shuttle "Enterprise" riding atop a 747 bound for New York's Intrepid Museum. We are live every point of the way.
Zimmerman bomb shell. Trayvon Martin's killer who told the court just last week that he was broke has $200,000 in the bank. This morning his bond could be revoked.
Plus, scare on the tarmac, 43 passengers kept on a plane for more than three hours. The cause, a bug bed bite. NEWSROOM begins right now.
Space shuttle "Enterprise" making its final flight. It's traveling from Washington to New York City, its ultimate home, the Intrepid Sea, Air and Space Museum, which is located on the Hudson River in New York City.
The "Enterprise" is the granddaddy of the shuttle program. It served as the prototype even though it never experienced a space mission of its own. In case you missed it, here's the shuttle's departure from Dulles just outside of Washington.
That happened about 30 minutes ago. Takeoff was a little behind schedule, but we have no reason to believe the delay will affect the "Enterprise's" plans. NASA says it will do low flyovers over the Statue of Liberty and other New York City landmarks.
We are following the "Enterprise" as I said every step of the way. Reynolds Wolf is here with me. You are tracking the flight. Jason Carroll is live in New York City.
John Zarrella, he's our space correspondent. He is live in Miami. Let's head out to John F. Kennedy Airport first. That's where "Enterprise" will finally land. Jason Carroll is there. Set the scene for us.
JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, there are a lot of excited people who are starting to arrive here at JFK. Hundreds of invited guests, school children coming in from New Jersey, Connecticut, and of course, right here in New York we'll be on hand as well as invited guests from NASA.
And the Intrepid Sea, Air and Space Museum is going to be here as well and in fact, I have one with me here right now. This is Susan Marenoff.
Susan, so a lot of anticipation and excitement about the "Enterprise" finally making its way to New York. This has got to be a great day for you.
SUSAN MARENOFF-ZAUSNER, PRESIDENT, INTREPID SEA AND AIR MUSEUM: It's an absolutely wonderful day. I think that the build up has been great even with it being here or supposed to have been here Monday or Wednesday. Just that makes it that much more exciting that wheels are up and it's happening today.
CARROLL: And there are some concerns about whether or not the "Enterprise" would arrive today. It's windy out here today, 30 miles an hour gusts, but everything is a go.
ZAUSNER: Everything is a go. The flight crew is completely confident. We had weather check this is morning. We had weather check every day, clear skies, a little breezy, but we'll deal with it.
CARROLL: Now an exciting day for New York City. Not so exciting for the folks in Houston who were hoping to get their hands on a shuttle. Tell us how that all came about. That New York came to be one of the cities chosen to get a shuttle.
ZAUSNER: You know, there were 29 originally who responded to an RFI, request for information. Three years ago, we were asked to respond to a second one. Apparently, the field went down to 21 institutions.
But clearly, we all wanted this so badly. There were certain parameters. New York has just a fabulous population. We're so excited that we'll be able to take care of it, perpetuate its honor and its history.
We are going to be able to really explore even greater depth now our stem programming, our science, technology, engineering and math programming. We are just so excited it will be coming to New York.
CARROLL: You know, I was explaining to Carol that for folks here in the northeast, it's so exciting to get an opportunity to see a shuttle. You know, folks in Florida are used to it. People in Houston are used to it. But here in the northeast, just give us a sense of what it's like for those people here to see a shuttle so up close.
ZAUSNER: You're spot on. This is going to be the largest NASA artifact north of Baltimore and the entire northeast region. So for kids to be able to come and see this where they would have to travel miles and miles to go somewhere else. It's right in their backyard. So it's so exciting for school trips and for other institutions that we'll be partnering with, for universities so we are all just so excited that we now have this representation in the northeast.
CARROLL: Many questions about what the future of space travel will be. For the past three decades, the shuttle program has defined what NASA is. So I'm curious how do you think NASA will be defined in the future?
ZAUSNER: You know, it's very hard for me to say, but this is the reason why it's been so important for these museums to want to display the shuttle. This is going to make people think. What are we going to do going forward? Is it going to be public again? We have to figure it out, but we know as a country we're going to figure it out.
CARROLL: Who knows maybe someday the next space artefact you'll get will be something from a private company going into lower orbit maybe.
ZAUSNER: You never know.
CARROLL: But an exciting day for us today. Thank you very much, Susan. Thanks very much for being with us.
So Carol, as you saw, the flight took off at about 9:24 a.m. The flight expected to take about anywhere between 30 and maybe 40 minutes. It will do a low fly over, over some exciting parts of the city, the Hudson River, downtown near Battery Park.
So a lot of people even though they weren't invited here to be with people like Susan and myself and the hundreds of other who will be out here.
Just average New Yorkers will get an opportunity to go out their doors, go out to the Hudson River or go downtown and get an opportunity to see something historic, a space shuttle flying in its own way over the city -- Carol.
COSTELLO: I know it will be so fantastic. We keep showing shots of the Versono Bridge and there's a reason for that. Reynolds Wolf is here with me now.
He's tracking the flight of the space shuttle "Enterprise." We believe it's somewhere over South Jersey and soon it will appear right in this area, in all its glory.
REYNOLDS WOLF, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes, it's going to be a picture perfect. You know, the weather is going to cooperate for people on the ground. I'm sure it's breezy. We have had some winds as Jason mentioned around 30 miles per hour or so.
Some fair weather cumulus. But I'll tell you the pilots that are right now at the controls of the 747 are among the best on the planet. These guys could make this flight blindfolded with their eyes closed. These guys are among the very, very best.
But it should be a fairly interesting time to see it come in. The weather will be great for all the spectators on the ground. They are going to be lining along the Hudson, of course, in Southern Manhattan to see this come in.
It should be something to behold, but the weather will be picture perfect further up to the west, a little bit of a storm, but not going to affect this here today.
COSTELLO: You talk about the future of space travel. I don't know, these moments that we are lucky enough to witness history like this. You think back on your own personal history.
And I can remember sitting with my dad when I was a little girl watching the first man walk on the moon, a very special image in my mind.
I mean, it's clear as day I could remember it and I'm sure many Americans are feeling, wow, we hope we can have those memories one day again.
Let's head to Miami now and check in with John Zarrella. You have been covering the space program, like, forever?
JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well not quite since man first landed on the moon. Not that old, but I was a little boy too. And I remember it the same way you do. I remember I had a reel to reel recorder and I was recording the audio of --
COSTELLO: I was too!
ZARRELLA: Walter Cronkite's narration of the moon landing. But you know, you were just talking with Jason Carroll about that whole controversy and you're right when you said they were downright angry in Houston.
Because, you know, Houston thought they should get a shuttle. They thought it would be "Enterprise" because besides Florida there's no other place synonymous with space flight as Houston, Texas.
NASA's decision making process was, look, we want the shuttles in places where they will get the maximum exposure. New York, Florida, and of course, out in California. So that was a lot of what went into the decision-making process to put "Enterprise" in New York.
And you know, you're also talking with Laurie Garber about Leonard Nemoy. There was this terrific still photo that we found of the "Star Trek" cast standing there all in front of shuttle "Enterprise" as it rolled out from Palm Dale, California where it was built at the skunk works factory that they call it there. I think we have that photo. There it is. That's the crew. Of course, you know who is not in that picture? Who is not in that picture?
COSTELLO: It's Captain Kirk in there? I'm looking.
ZARRELLA: He's not there. He must have been out looking for hotel deals that day. I don't know.
COSTELLO: Working for hogwire.com. He couldn't make it.
ZARRELLA: If you do get Nemoy on today with you, ask him where was Kirk for this photo, but that's a great photo of "Enterprise" with the cast there.
COSTELLO: John, I did want to ask you this it because Lori Garber did bring up this. There's a reason that Leonard Nemoy is there. There's a reason he's there talking to the crowds in New York City.
There's a reason that that the space shuttle is doing these flyovers of major cities in the United States. This is an orchestrated PR campaign by NASA, right?
ZARRELLA: Yes. There's no question about it. You know, we talked about the fact that NASA right now is in this downturn. They are in between programs. They went through this after Apollo. Before shuttle there was a down period as well.
But in this case, perhaps it's a little scarier times. Budgets are tighter. NASA wants to make sure it keeps its funding. You know, a week from Monday in your show at 9:22 a.m., space x is going to attempt a launch and rendezvous with the International Space Station, the future of lower orbit, commercial companies.
It's a huge, huge undertaking. First time ever if it's accomplished that a commercial company will have done anything remotely close to this. Rendezvous birthing with the International Space Station, drop off supplies, that's the future.
The future for NASA is, as Lori Garber put it, is deep space exploration. Building a rocket that will take humans out to an asteroid and eventually on to Mars. It takes a lot of money.
NASA did not have enough money to continue flying space shuttle and build this next generation rocket thus the approach turn lower orbit into commercial companies. Let NASA concentrate on what it does best and that is building a next generation space craft.
COSTELLO: Truth be told, John, if NASA had been more nimble in its future plans, NASA wouldn't be having this, you know, downturn in its space program today.
ZARRALLE: Yes, I don't think there's any question about it. There's a lot -- not just NASA. A lot of the blame falls, you know, at the steps of Congress as well. Moneys were not appropriated. Decisions were made back in the Bush administration to do away with the shuttle, to go to a new rocket design.
And then that rocket design was actually the constellation program, was then scrubbed by the Obama administration. There have been all of these fits and starts and changes. So there's plenty of blame if you want to blame to go around where NASA is now.
And as one astronaut put it to me, not that long ago, he said, listen, we have got to have smoke and fire to inspire young people, to inspire America again to get the funding to do the things we need to do.
And that may come in 2014 when NASA finally flies a capsule out to about 5,000 miles and re-enter it into earth's atmosphere. High re-entry like if you were coming back from an asteroid or from Mars. But they have to do that -- Carol.
COSTELLO: We're going to talk more about this. But we have to take a break now as we await the space shuttle "Enterprise" to come back into our camera's range as it flies over the Hudson River. We'll be back in a minute.
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COSTELLO: Just about 15 minutes past the hour. Checking our top stories now.
The shuttle "Enterprise" as it makes its final flight. It left Washington's Dulles Airport just about 45 minutes ago heading to New York City. We'll show you those images. The "Enterprise" is the original prototype of the shuttle program and will be displayed at the Intrepid Sea, Air and Space Museum.
The CDC has given the all clear after fears that a Delta passenger may have monkey pox. A Minnesota woman coming back from Uganda trigged the scare. Passengers on board the flight were quarantined for three hours in Chicago.
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SEAN PENNINGTON, PASSENGER: The captain comes on and says, well, this may sound a little strange, but it seems like we are going to be quarantined for a moment. Apparently, someone is on board and they may or may not have something. And we're taking pictures. Does it look like this? No, it didn't look like that.
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COSTELLO: The doctors checked the passenger out and it turns out she just had some bites from bedbugs.
Big losses in Europe and Asia are cutting profits in half for Ford. The automaker swinging to a loss in both regions after posting profits just a year ago. Ford also says vehicle sales slipped to 2 percent worldwide.
And Alabama's governor has kicked of a prayer service for tornado victims. A massive twister tore through the state one year ago today. Killed more 50 people in Tuscaloosa and levelled more than 7,000 homes. The city is still trying to rebuild today.
A bombshell in the case against George Zimmerman. It turns out the man who shot and killed Trayvon Martin isn't broke. He has $200,000. Something Zimmerman's attorney did not spell out at his bond hearing.
That means a judge today could revoke Zimmerman's bond. The $200,000 came from Zimmerman supporters who donated to his web site. Zimmerman's attorney who said he thought his client had no money spoke exclusively with Anderson Cooper.
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MARK O'MARA, GEORGE ZIMMERMAN'S ATTORNEY: I'm not certain that he thought in some sense they were available to him because even after the bond was granted, it was the family who was trying to come up with enough money for the bond.
And I guess if they thought they had easy access to it, they could have used that. But now that I'm aware of it, we're going to deal with it in a much more transparent way. Probably bring in someone like an accountant to assist me with administering it and deal with it openly.
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COSTELLO: So there was a court hearing this morning. We understand it's now over. In fact, Martin Savidge is monitoring that hearing. So what happened?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, essentially what the judge decided was that he needs to know more information about this money. Where did it come from? Who had control of the money?
And especially who had control when last week they were talking about whether George had money or not. So it's been put off for now. The judge will rule at another time.
The state though has asked that bond, as a result, be increased for George Zimmerman. So we'll see, but at least, they didn't want it revoked, which would have been George Zimmerman would have to go back --
COSTELLO: They really wanted a million set for bond, right?
SAVIDGE: Correct.
COSTELLO: It was set much lower than that and that was based in part of the fact that George Zimmerman and his family had no money.
SAVIDGE: Correct. They said they were indigent. In fact, there were three family members, his mom, dad, and his wife, who went on the stand under oath and said they didn't know how much money had been raised by this web site.
Well, now this raises questions as to were they being completely honest? One thing we do know is that George Zimmerman wasn't lying because George Zimmerman wasn't under oath and he was never asked specifically about those web sites.
So for the time being, it just appears that he was slow to tell his attorney about it.
COSTELLO: So his parents also testified in court in that initial bond hearing. His wife testified, right. Surely she knew about the money, but she said they had no money neither of them had jobs. She's going to school to become a nurse.
SAVIDGE: Here's where the issue comes up. The attorney says that part of that money was used for his bond. And also part of that money was used for living expenses for George Zimmerman because he couldn't go to work because of concerns for his safety.
So if money was being spent, you'd think the family would know something about where it's coming from, which is why for them to say they didn't raise questions. The state didn't make a big issue of that today, but I don't think this is the last we're going to hear this.
COSTELLO: I don't think so either especially if the judge says he's reviewing it. Martin Savidge, thanks so much.
The CIA agent who led water boarding of terror detainees after 9/11 is talking about it for the first time. Jose Rodriguez tells "60 Minutes" that waterboarding, sleep deprivation and other enhanced interrogation techniques paid off with valuable information that saved lives.
Critics say the techniques amounted to torture. Rodriguez talked with "60 Minutes" about the most notorious and maybe least cooperative detainee of all. The 9/11 mastermind, Khaleid Sheik Mohammed, agents waterboarded him more than 180 times in a month.
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JOSE RODRIGUEZ, FORMER HEAD OF CIA CLANDESTINE SERVICE: This is an individual who didn't give a rat's -- about having water poured on his face.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He never believed for one second you were going to kill him?
RODRIGUEZ: Let me just tell you. Khalid Sheik Mohammed would use his fingers to count the number of seconds because he knew that in all likelihood, we would stop at 10. So this doesn't sound like a person who is afraid of dying.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If he's sitting there counting off, he knows you're not going to kill him. Then why do it? What's the point?
RODRIGUEZ: I think that the effect of waterboarding, sleep deprivation and everything else that was done eventually got to him.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So what happens? Does he break down? Does he weep? Does he fall apart?
RODRIGUEZ: He gets a good night's sleep. He gets -- by the way, he was very heavy when he came to us. He lost 50 pounds.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: His insure, like people in the hospital?
RODRIGUEZ: Yes. It was part of the starve technique techniques.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So sleep deprivation, dietary manipulation, I mean this is Orwell Yan stuff. The United States doesn't do that.
RODRIGUEZ: Well, we do.
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COSTELLO: The Obama administration ended the enhanced interrogation program. Rodriguez says that was a mistake. He's also criticized the use of drones to kill terrorists rather than capture them.
Right now, the space shuttle "Enterprise" on its way to New York City. We'll bring you live coverage as CNN NEWSROOM continues.
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COSTELLO: You have to admit this is an endearing sight, all those school children in New York City at JFK waiting for the space shuttle to make its big landing at JFK.
As you know, the space shuttle "Enterprise" on top a 747 took off from Dulles International Airport just about an hour ago. It's on its way to New York City. It will fly past landmarks first before landing at JFK.
We believe it's somewhere over South Jersey making its way to the Versano Bridge. Soon we'll see it flying by, but not quite yet. So we'll get to other news right now.
Now is your chance to talk back on Twitter. The question for you this morning, does Vice President Joe Biden help or hurt the president?
Democrats love that Joe Biden connects with blue collar Americans like this Joe Biden with his 2012 campaign catch phrase.
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JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: If you're looking for a bumper sticker, it's pretty simple. Osama Bin Laden is dead and General Motors is alive.
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COSTELLO: But there's another Joe Biden. The gaffe-prone Biden, the one Americans love to poke fun of because he make s it so easy. In the very same speech, Biden did it again.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) BIDEN: Now is the time to heed the timeless advice from Teddy Roosevelt. Speak softly and carry a big stick. I promise you the president has a big stick.
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COSTELLO: That line inspired what looked like a million off- colored tweets and special honors on late night TV.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: While discussing the U.S. policy on Iran today, Joe Biden said that president Obama "has a big stick." In related news, Joe Biden is now banned from the White House steam room.
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COSTELLO: You have to wonder if Biden's gaffes overshadow the good stuff. According to Pew Research, Biden's approval rating was 38 percent in January. That was down from a 50 percent approval rating in November of 2009, just saying.
So the talk back question today, does Vice President Joe Biden help or hurt the president? Facebook.com/carolcnn. I'll read your comments later this hour.
We'll be back with more live coverage of the space shuttle in just a minute.
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COSTELLO: It's 10:30 Eastern Time. Welcome back. Checking our top stories now.
The space shuttle "Enterprise" is a couple minutes south of JFK. These are shots from earlier. When it hits New York City, it's going to fly by several landmarks first.
You see it's riding on top of that 747. The shuttle will eventually be moved into its new home at a museum there on the Hudson River.
Space shuttle actually scheduled to touch down at New York's JFK, which is where we find Jason Carroll. So let's head out there. Good morning, Jason.
CARROLL: Good morning to you, Carol. As we've been standing here way off in the distance, I'm not sure if my photographer Ricky can catch it for us. Ricky are you going to give it a go and try? I don't know if he can make that out, but that's it. That's the space shuttle way out there. That's what we're being told making a pass.
Of course it will get a lot closer between now and just a few minutes when it's expected to land here at JFK. Lots of excitement here as you can imagine hundreds of invited guests standing by and waiting to see the shuttle land. Also folks such as Leonard Nimoy, "Spock" from the "Enterprise" will be here.
But also we've got the real deal. We have Major General Joe Angle. He was one of the first pilots of the "Enterprise". This has got to be an incredibly exciting day for you as we're now just minutes away from seeing the "Enterprise" land here right now.
MAJOR GENERAL JOE ANGLE, PILOT: It really is Jason. And thank you for letting me be here and thank you for having me on the show with you today.
CARROLL: Now I know we were are talking a little earlier. I know you are from Houston. And I know some folks there in Houston were disappointed their city was not chosen to have a shuttle. But as you were saying there simply aren't enough shuttles to go around.
ANGLE: That's very true there are -- there are so many places that wanted to have a shuttle on display. Wanted to have it as part of their educational programs in their museums for the children. Just a shame there weren't more of them to go around. But I think you all are very fortunate and I know you'll do a wonderful job.
CARROLL: You know as we -- you know as we're now once again just minutes away from seeing the shuttle landing, it will get a lot closer to now in a few minutes. Tell us what it's like being up there and flying an aircraft like a space shuttle.
ANGLE: It's a wonderful feeling. It's a very gratifying feeling for someone who has -- who has devoted their career to test flying like myself and all the other astronauts have done. To get to do -- to get a flight in a space -- a space shuttle is just the culmination of your entire professional career.
CARROLL: We're going to try and get some more shots of that shuttle. Ricky, I know you're trying to do your best but it's still a little bit far away as you try to get some shots of it.
But what do you think is going through the pilots' minds right now who are on board?
ANGLE: The pilots of the carrier aircraft you mean?
CARROLL: Correct.
ANGLE: Well, they are very busy in the cockpit right now. In fact we talked with them down at -- in Washington, D.C. when they brought -- when they brought "Discovery" up from Cape Kennedy and -- and loaded the "Enterprise" up to come up here. And I know the pilots very well, I know the crew members and they said they are just very, very busy in the cockpit. They had no idea how excited it was -- how exciting it was for the people on the ground until they got on the ground and watched the news.
CARROLL: And so much has been said about the future of space travel. Because when you think about it for the past three decades NASA has really been defined by the shuttles and now they are no more. They are all going into museums. So how do you think NASA will be defined in the future?
ANGLE: Well, the programs that NASA is involved in now and will be involved in the future. The space -- the International Space Station is -- is -- is our big focus right now. Continuing the research and the development and the -- and the testing that's going on in the station is going to make it possible for us to make long- duration flights beyond lower its orbits to Mars to the other destinations that we will be going to. We're developing the capability on board the International Space Station right now.
CARROLL: So hopefully the interest in space will still be there.
And Carol just a few minutes ago before you came to us, we were standing here watching the little kids who were dressed up in the little blue NASA uniforms. And you said, "Jason you should be getting a shot of them. That's really going to be the future of travel". That was an inspirational moment as well was it not?
ANGLE: It really was, that is our future. Those -- the young -- the young boys and girls, young men and women who are -- who are beginning to get their interest, develop their interest. Not just in aviation, not just on going into space but in science and math. They are getting -- they are getting motivated right now. And that's so terribly important.
CARROLL: Well hopefully the motivation continues and the inspiration continues as well. I want to thank you once again for being with us. What a pleasure. Thank you so very much.
Once again, Major General Joe Angle, one of the first original pilots of the "Enterprise" as we're now just a few minutes away from seeing the "Enterprise" land here at JFK -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Oh it's such a beautiful -- it's such a beautiful sight, Jason. We could probably see this better than you. Because our cameras can get closer than your line of sight so we're feeling really lucky right now. "Enterprise," the space pioneer. So is Eileen Collins, the first woman to command a space shuttle. She's on the phone with us right now.
Eileen I was just thinking about getting young people excited in the space program. And excited about becoming an astronaut. You remember John Glenn was such a hero. He was a star. We -- we don't have those kinds of figures so much anymore.
COL. EILEEN COLLINS, NASA (via telephone): Well, I think that we will again. You saw earlier today or at least you talked about the power of a write-in campaign where the "Constitution's" name was changed to "Enterprise" because of the number of people that you know the Trekkies and -- and many others that wrote in.
If we write our congressmen and congresswomen, if we write the President in the White House, don't write to NASA because we already get tons of letters and we totally agree with you. But if you write to our elected leaders and say this is important to the future of our country, to our leadership, to exploration, to keeping our country great, having a strong space program.
So I would challenge the American citizens to write in and tell your lawmakers you want to have a strong space program. NASA is working on it, but it really helps to have the -- the funding and the help of the American citizens behind us.
COSTELLO: Yes well, it's not the greatest economy right now so I think many -- many Americans probably understand why we're on stand down as far as the space program goes nowadays. But you do mention that -- you know we need to get young people more excited about a space program and that means getting them more excited in math and science. And maybe if they could believe they could become an astronaut and -- and explore space, maybe that would renew the interest in this country in the subjects of math and science.
COLLINS: Yes you are exactly right. And that's exactly what it does. The space program, you know, I look at -- when I was in fourth grade. When I first decided I wanted to be an astronaut, I was reading about the "Gemini" astronauts and I wanted to be one of them.
And young people today -- we'll we do have a space station, we do have astronauts that go to our space station. Now they are being launched by the Russians Soyuz. Some day we hope, we're saying maybe 2016, 2017 we'll be launching our own astronauts again.
But it's very, very important to have United States astronauts launching from our country because our young people see this and they say, "Hey I want to do that someday". And I know I need to be good in math, I need to be good in science, I need to study technical fields because that way not only could I -- I fly, but you could also work in mission control be an engineer, you can help design these new spacecrafts.
So I agree with you 100 percent. And I -- I think our teachers across the country are doing a pretty good job integrating space into the math and science curriculum. And they need to keep doing that.
COSTELLO: When you saw those little kids waiting at JFK, you know, they were dressed in their space suits and they are excitedly waiting the shuttle to come into view, what goes through your mind?
COLLINS: Oh I love it, you know actually they motivate me. When I see young people -- and I still go out and talk at schools. I think it's important for astronauts to do that because I get a lot out of that myself. And it energizes me and it makes me want to go back out and talk up the program and the things that I've done. So I think it's really neat and good for the kids.
COSTELLO: We talked a little bit about this before about how NASA has orchestrated all of these, these flyovers of major cities past American landmarks. It's sort of like this orchestrated public relations campaign. Is it effective in your mind?
COLLINS: Well, I'm not sure what you're asking there, but I think that you know NASA does a pretty good job of public relations. NASA has a very limited budget so we you know reach out to the -- private media for example CNN to help us with the coverage. You're doing a great job this morning. I've been watching it from before the time that "Enterprise" took off out of Washington. I think you're doing a great job and keep it up.
I would say you know getting -- just take a look at the activities that are taking place on the International Space Station. I would say most Americans don't know what's going on up there. But there is quite a bit of research on the human body, developing new technologies. These are the things that our astronauts are doing to help -- help us have a better future whether it's in health or technology or exploration in general.
And it's pretty exciting. Even those things can -- can inspire young people.
COSTELLO: Yes and Eileen stand by and, of course, we're bringing these pictures not help NASA so much but because it's part of our American history. And people are really intrigued by this. You can see all of the people standing on the ground watching for this thing to pass over.
We're going to continue our coverage after a short break.
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COSTELLO: Breaking news out of Washington right now. The Obama administration is threatening to veto a bill designed to keep interest rates on student loans from doubling. Confused? Well White House Correspondent Brianna Keilar is in Washington to sort this out for us.
I thought the president was for this?
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Both -- the President is for this. The idea of extending these rates, Carol and so are House Republicans and Mitt Romney. The issue is really how they do it.
So overall what's going on here is an election year battle over how to keep college affordable for college students has really ramped up in a major way with President Obama threatening to veto a Republican bill in the House that has just started to get underway for debate between Democrats and Republicans there in the House just a few minutes ago.
So they've issued this veto threat because the difference between the Democratic bill and the Republican bill is how to pay for the price tag of extending these student loan interest rates that are set to double, to go from 3.4 percent to 6.8 percent July 1st.
Republicans are proposing what they call eliminating, as they put it, a slush fund that was created by Obama care. This is a discretionary spending fund that was created by health care reform. And Democrats are hitting at them saying you're going to be targeting, in part, things for women's health. Testing like mammograms and that kind of thing.
Democrats are proposing a different way to pay for it. They want to do what they call eliminating a corporate tax loophole, but Republicans counter Carol that this is something that would hurt small business. And this veto threat really just ramping everything up and we're going to see a lot of debate on this going for awhile.
COSTELLO: So what they are trying to find what -- about $6 billion to pay for this plan? And the $6 billion in the Republican plan comes out of the President's health care law?
KEILAR: Yes. And I actually have spoken with a spokesperson for Speaker Boehner who says that President Obama -- this is what Republicans are saying, they are saying, "This is a fund that the President over time zeros out himself in his own budget". So in their words, they say, "President Obama is desperate for a fight".
So you can tell the words are just going to be slung back and forth on this between the White House and Republicans and Mitt Romney.
COSTELLO: Brianna Keilar live at the White House.
Coming up, of course, we're following the flight of space shuttle "Enterprise" as it wraps its final journey. I see Jason Carroll out there at JFK. And he has a special guest with him. That will be Mr. Spock. We'll bring them both to you when NEWSROOM continues.
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COSTELLO: Space shuttle "Enterprise" is expected to touch down at New York's JFK Airport very soon. We're expecting it to touch down at 11:00 a.m. Eastern time.
Jason Carroll is there. And I'm so jealous. You have Mr. Spock with you.
CARROLL: That's right. You asked for it, Carol.
COSTELLO: I did.
CARROLL: I remember listening to that a little earlier. You said you wanted me to track him down. I've have tracked him down, the man, Leonard Nimoy. This must be an incredibly exciting day for you. I know that you've been looking forward to this. Tell us about what you're feeling today?
LEONARD NIMOY, ACTOR, "STAR TREK": It feels like a reunion. The first time I saw this ship was in September 1976 when it was rolled out at Palmdale. The hangar doors opened and out came the "Enterprise" which was named after our "Star Trek Enterprise" on "Star Trek".
CARROLL: I think we have a picture of that somewhere. I think you were wearing a quite 70s blue pantsuit or something.
NIMOY: You have to learn. Bell bottom pants. CARROLL: Your style has improved greatly.
NIMOY: We were all there. The cast and Gene Rodenberry the producer. And the Air Force band was playing the theme from "Star Trek". It was a great thrill to be there that day.
CARROLL: And it's thanks to the fans of "Star Trek" right, because initially the thought was the spacecraft was going to be named the "Constitution".
NIMOY: It was named "Constitution". And Gerald Ford was president at the time. They got a big load of letters from "Star Trek" fans who were very good at writing letters. They convinced the President that the ship should be named "Enterprise" and that's the way it came about.
CARROLL: You know when you look at "Enterprise" landing here now just a few minutes from now --
NIMOY: Yes.
CARROLL: -- you think about it's going to a museum, but you can't help but think about the future. When you watch "Star Trek", it's always about this vision of what the future might be. What do you think the future will be in terms of NASA?
NIMOY: Well, "Star Trek" was always very positive about the future. That was one of the great things the audience always enjoyed. It was a very optimistic future, very positive. And I think one of the most important things that "Star Trek" had to offer was to explain to young people what the possibilities of science were and to excite people about the idea of being scientists, engineers, and stuff -- we needed those kind of people who had the vision into the future like that.
CARROLL: And I know you'll be speaking to the crowd that is gathered here today. You'll be speaking a little later. What do you intend to tell them?
NIMOY: I'm going to talk about how the "Enterprise" name came about on the shuttle. And what it meant to us to be there that day when it was first rolled out in 1976 at Palmdale. To be part of history like that, it's a great day.
CARROLL: A beautiful day. A great day for so many people here. I know we only have you just for a few minutes. Also I have to ask you. As you're standing, you see -- I know you've seen a lot of the young kids coming in. I'm not sure if they recognize you. I know the older kids such as myself do. But what is it like for you to see the younger kids? Some of those dressed in the NASA uniform?
NIMOY: It's a real treat. It's a real treat. And to be able to be involved with something that has spanned so many generations as "Star Trek" has, as the space program has. I'm very excited to be part of this. CARROLL: I hope the inspiration continues for those young kids. I know you continue to inspire people even to this day. Thank you very much, Mr. Leonard Nimoy.
NIMOY: Great. Pleasure to talk with you. Thank you.
CARROLL: Thank you so very, very much. Again -- once again, Leonard Nimoy. You asked for him, we tracked him down. We found him, we got him for you.
COSTELLO: I did. But I didn't say a word. Can I just say I admire you. And in the new "Star Trek" movie, you had a prominent role, Leonard Nimoy. And I enjoyed it very much. You're fantastic.
CARROLL: And in fact Carol, we were talking about that. Carol Costello, the anchor, remember we were talking about the new "Star Trek" movie.
NIMOY: Yes.
CARROLL: It was great. He did a great job in it and we were talking about that just before. Will you be in another "Star Trek" movie?
NIMOY: We're talking. We're talking.
CARROLL: Talking, Carol. Hopefully.
COSTELLO: Fantastic. Thank you so much.
This thing is just about to land, Jason Carroll. Can people see it from where you're standing?
I think Jason Carroll is saying his good-byes to Leonard Nimoy and helping him exit the stage. When Jason gets his, what we call an IFB which is really an ear piece so he can hear me. Jason, do you have that thing back in?
All right then.
CARROLL: I do.
COSTELLO: Can you see the shuttle from your vantage point now?
CARROLL: I cannot. I know an announcement was made that the pilots were having a good time -- had a good time flying the shuttle by the Hudson, above the Intrepid Air and Space Museum. And that we're not just about nine minutes away or less. So, we should be seeing the shuttle very, very soon.
COSTELLO: All right Jason. We're going to take a break so we can see it. We'll be right back.
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COSTELLO: Ok. You're looking at live pictures of that Boeing 747 with the space shuttle "Enterprise" on its back. It's now flying over New Jersey. Just about seven or so minutes away from JFK where it will land to the delight of hundreds who are gathered there including many school children who just can't wait to get a glimpse of this thing.
Jason Carroll has been out there all day long. John Zarrella is with us from Florida. He's been covering the space program like forever. So John Zarrella, as you're watching this, what goes through your mind?
JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, what goes through my mind is we're looking again, at the end of an era. We in our lifetime will never see another vehicle like this. A vehicle that's launched vertically into orbit and can return, fly down like an airplane and land. And anywhere in the world, people knew that a space shuttle came from the United States. It was that kind of an iconic vehicle.
There's no mistaking it. It's the space shuttle. It wasn't like a rocket capsule.
You know, there's an interesting fact a lot of people probably may not recall or remember. The Russians actually built a space shuttle. It flew a couple of times. Never into orbit. Sub-orbital, just like "Enterprise" did. And then they abandoned the program. I believe it was called the "Boron", was the name of their shuttle. It sits outside of Moscow I believe in Star City right now. Exposed to the elements.
Well, these shuttles when they're retired are going to be in beautiful museums around the world. But, you know, as you watch it come in there, we're going to do this again in the fall when "Endeavor" goes out to California and then when "Atlantis" is trucked literally over to just down the road over to the visitor complex at the Kennedy Space Center.
But it is an end -- the end of an era that in our lifetimes, we will never see another vehicle with this kind of capability to fly astronauts to the space station and bring them back.
But as Eileen Collins said to you, it's the beginning. You know, we have to move on. There's a new era ahead. There it goes by the Statue of Liberty. What an absolutely spectacular shot and certainly appropriate.
COSTELLO: Yes. And I think my heart stopped for just a minute. That was a beautiful picture. Just unbelievable.
ZARRELLA: Yes.
COSTELLO: Jason Carroll, hundreds of people are waiting for a glimpse of this thing. It's going down the Hudson right now. It should soon be there. Who is in the crowd?
CARROLL: Well, there are so many folks here. I'm going to give you an opportunity to try and get a look at this. Look at the crush of media that's like sort of moved into the bleachers there. You can see -- you've got -- the bleachers are jammed on one side. And then you have just as many folks located on the other side as well.
They made an announcement saying that the pilots are having a real good time flying over New York City. They have headed out to the south, but they are expected to be here at JFK just about seven minutes from now. So you can imagine, everyone has been waiting out here in the cold and in the wind and just waiting for "Enterprise's" arrival.
What an exciting day for the folks who are here. Just now minutes away.
COSTELLO: I know. Can't wait to land.
We're going to take a break. We'll be back.
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COSTELLO: Shuttle "Enterprise" set to land in four or five minutes at JFK.
That does it for me. Thank you for joining us. I'm Carol Costello. Kyra Phillips, take it away.
