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Possible Heathrow Security Breaches; Syrian Defector Talks; U.S. Navy Fires on Boat in Persian Gulf; Protest By Fire; The Poetry of the Taliban; Americans Kidnapped in Egypt Have Been Released

Aired July 16, 2012 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: Hey there. Welcome to NEWSROOM INTERNATIONAL. I'm Suzanne Malveaux. We're taking you around the world in 60 minutes.

Here's what's going on now:

In Syria, this video posted online, said to show rebel fighters in Damascus. Activists tell news agencies that armored vehicles deployed near the city center for the first time since the start of the uprising.

At least 28 people are dead after torrential rains soaked the Japanese island of Kyushu. Floods, swollen rivers, mudslides forced thousands to evacuate homes. Food and supplies are being airlifted to areas where hundreds are cut off because of fallen trees. Many are relying on volunteers for help.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I am grateful, really, really grateful. There is no way I can do it alone, and this area has many elderly people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Forecasters expect more heavy rain to actually hit the island.

Take a look at this. This is a powerful tornado caught on tape as it ripped through the town in northwestern Poland. One person was killed, 10 others wounded over the weekend.

Now, a witness describes this as a black column carrying everything away with it. We're talking about birds, debris, sucked up water from the lake. The latest burst of violent weather to batter Poland this month.

In London now, we've got some very serious concerns that are being raised over Olympic security. While hundreds of athletes start arriving today , "The Observer" newspaper is reporting that last few weeks, several people on a terror watch list were waved through at the airport instead of being flagged. Olympic organizes there are also scrambling to fill thousands of security jobs after the main contractor said it would not be able to provide the 10,000 staff that it promised.

Joining us from London is Dan Rivers, to talk a little bit about this. It sounds, Dan, kind of alarming, what's going on here.

And, first of all, just give us an update on these folks who were on the terror watch list, who essentially made it through security who are in the country.

DAN RIVERS, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's what the observer newspaper is claiming. However, the home office, the interior ministry, if you like here, is pushing back on that claim. They are admitting that there were staff on passport desks here, a board of full staff who don't normally check passports, that extra people have been drafted in to reduce waiting times when you arrive at airports like Heathrow.

But they are insisting that no corners were cut, but all of the normal checks were done, as per usual. In fact, they're saying that an independent inspector of the border force agrees that all of the necessary checks were being done and he had full confidence in the process.

So, they are pushing back hard against the suggestion that sort of half a dozen known terror suspects have been allowed to slip in because of staff who aren't properly trained or people don't know what they're doing because they've been drafted in to check passports at the front here in the U.K.

The other perhaps bigger story here, that's getting a lot of track is the story about this private security firm that has failed to come up with the requisite number of guards for various Olympic sites.

Now, the interior minister here, the home office minister, Theresa May, has been defending what's happened. Basically they've had to draft in an extra 3,500 soldier to bridge the gap left by the security firm G4S, because they're unable to guarantee the full 10,000 guards at various, different sites that they were contracted to provide.

Here's quick bite from Theresa May explaining what went wrong.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THERESA MAY, BRITISH HOME SECRETARY: In fact, we have accredited over 20,000 G4S personnel. The issue is getting staff to the venue security task.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RIVERS: So she's basically saying, until last Wednesday, they were being told by this private security firm G4S that they would actually get more people than necessary. They would overshoot their target. In fact, now we know they're going to undershoot and the police and army are having to step in, canceling holidays, canceling leave, in order to make sure all of the various stadiums are guarded properly.

MALVEAUX: And, Dan, how worried and people there? I mean, you know you talk about this scrambling at last minute for security. People must be pretty concerned.

RIVERS: It's pretty unedifying. It's embarrassing for G4S, the company involved. They've held up their hands and said, yes, you know, it's a mistake we apologize. There are lots of calls for them to make sure that they pick up the tab for example soldiers having to cancel holidays.

Some soldiers coming out of Afghanistan think they would have a break after six months away in combat and then suddenly having to find to go up and basically check tickets at Olympic venues and search bags and so on. So it's embarrassing for them. Embarrassing for the government and the Olympic organizers, as well.

But the message is being, you know, throughout the government, that you know there is, of course, a security concern here just a day after we won the bid here in Britain for the Olympics in 2005, we had the 7/7 bomb attack. So, that underlines a constant security risk here in London. They're saying they can ensure these games are safe and secure.

MALVEAUX: All right. Dan, it sounds like it's just a messy situation there. A lot of work to do just with the days away from the Olympics. Thanks, Dan.

Up until a few days ago, he was Syria's top man in Baghdad. Now, he's the most senior Syrian diplomat to defect. Nawaf al Fares, he is speaking to CNN, his first exclusive interview with the U.S. network and he says that the Syrian government has deliberately opened the door to al Qaeda militants.

He's telling his story to our own Ivan Watson, what has actually finally pushed him to abandon this regime.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Nawaf al Fare was Syria's man in Baghdad for nearly four years. That is, until a few days ago when the Syrian ambassador to Iraq suddenly announced his defection.

(on camera): What prompted you to say, I've had it, I don't want to work with this government anymore?

NAWAF AL FARES, FORMER SYRIAN AMBASSADOR TO IRAQ (through translator): I served the Syrian regime for 34 years and in many different positions but after what happened in the last year during the holy revolution, all of the killing, the massacres, the refugees, I don't see how anyone can remain silent. So I decided to end my relationship with regime.

WATSON (voice-over): Fares one of al Assad's trusted lieutenants, an insider who knows how the Syrian government works.

(on camera): Who is making the decisions in Damascus right now?

FARES: The regime in Syria is a totalitarian regime and dictatorship. There's only one person who gives orders, that person is the president.

WATSON (voice-over): In his first interview with the U.S. news organization since his defection, Fares rejected Syrian government claims that the Syrian rebels are al Qaeda terrorists. Instead, he accuses the Assad regime of cooperating with al Qaeda ever since the U.S. invasion of Iraq in 2003, by paving the way by al Qaeda militants to transit Syria to attack targets in neighboring Iraq.

FARES: Bashar al Assad and his security forces are directly responsible for the killings of thousands and thousands of Iraqis and coalition forces, because he gave al Qaeda everything it needed. He trained them and gave them shelter.

WATSON: Fares points to a controversial cross border U.S. military raid in 2008 against the Syrian town of Al Sukariya. Fares claims the American target was an al Qaeda camp run by Assif Shawkat, the brother in law of the Syrian president.

(on camera): You saw with your own eyes that Assif Shawkat was leading this al Qaeda in Iraqi operation?

FARES: One hour after the raid, Assif Shawkat was there at the location. A conversation took place between me and him, and he was angry by the attack made against Al Sukariya. He was kind of scared.

WATSON (voice-over): Fares is now in Doha, under the protection of the Qatari government.

Syrian opposition members applaud the ambassador's defection, but tell CNN they don't trust a man who waited 16 months before joining the uprising.

(on camera): What message would you like to send to Bashar al Assad and to your former colleagues in the Syrian government right now?

FARES: My former colleagues, I ask them to join the people and leave this corrupt regime. There is still time.

To Bashar al Assad, I say, you don't know history. Two wills cannot be defeated: the will of God and the will of the people. History will curse you for the crimes you committed in Syria.

WATSON (voice-over): A blunt warning from a man who was once of the Syrian regime's top enforcers.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: Ivan Watson, he's joining us from Istanbul with more.

And, Ivan, you know that these accusations are explosive. Do we know, or do we suspect that this guy is really credible?

WATSON: Well, he certainly was in a position where he would know a lot of the dirty laundry of the Syrian regime, especially if we go back to dark and bloody days in Iraq in '05, '06, '07 when the U.S. was repeatedly accusing the Syrian government of allowing jihadists and al Qaeda to transit Syria into Iraq, charges that the Syrian has always denied.

Nawaf al Fares did seem to want to curry favor not only with the Syrian opposition now that he's defected, and he talks about a, quote/unquote, "holy revolution" against al Assad, but he also said he wanted to cooperate with international organizations to help bring down the Syrian regime and even said he would support a foreign military intervention.

So he does very much seem to be wanting to make friends with Western governments that he previously was very much at odds with when serving the Syrian regime.

MALVEAUX: Ivan, I want you to take a look at this video here and just listen with me.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

MALVEAUX: So, Ivan, so this is video that was posted online. It said to show rebel fighters in the capital's Midan neighborhood. And activists telling news agencies the armored vehicles deployed near the city center. This is the first time this has happened since the start of the uprising.

What do we know about this?

WATSON: The fighting has clearly spread to the Syrian capital now, not just the suburbs anymore, but now we're seeing the Syrian government cannot fully control Damascus the way it claimed to in the past. And not only is there this incredible purportedly live video that the rebels were streaming but also video of a roadblock from one of the main highways cutting through Damascus with opposition activists blocking traffic and members of the Free Syrian Army that we talked to claiming that they're trying to cut off supply routes for the Syrian military to basically make the situation easier for the rebel fighters.

One of the Free Syrian Army officers that I talked to today, he said the fight for Damascus is coming soon. In fact, we may have even seen the start of it in the last two days -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Ivan Watson, excellent reporting as always. Thank you.

Here's more of what we're working on for this hour of NEWSROOM INTERNATIONAL: love, passion, grief. Not emotions you'd associate with the Taliban. But some members of the group, they are now putting out poetry.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The village seems strange. This is separation as if my beloved have left it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Plus, less than two weeks away from the Olympic Games. And while we are watching the athletes compete, we're also going to be checking out what they're wearing. This year it's going to be different. Women can now wear religious coverings and hijabs. The evolution of Olympic fashion, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Breaking news that we're following here. I want to bring in our Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr to talk a little bit about what we know about a U.S. military supply ship firing on a small boat in the Persian Gulf.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Suzanne, it happened earlier today. It is exactly the kind of incident that worries the U.S. Navy in the Middle East so much.

A Navy oiler, a supply ship, fired on a small boat in the Persian Gulf near Dubai when this small boat got too close. The Navy tried, they say the crew tried to warn the craft to stay away. The ship, the small boat, kept coming. The Navy eventually fired warning shots. They say the small boat still kept coming.

And finally, the crew of the USS Rappahannock, you see it there, which had a security team on board, used their .50 caliber machine guns to disable the boat. One person on the small boat that was approaching the Rappahannock was killed, three were injured.

This incident, you know, is -- it has happened before tragically. It still remains to be seen whether the small boat was an actual threat. But when these small boats in these waters get too close to Navy ships, they try and warn them to stay away and if they keep coming, they just have no choice, they have to try to stop the boat, they say -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: Barbara, do they have any information at all what kind of boat this was? Where this boat was coming from? Who was on this boat?

STARR: Well, I have to tell you -- a U.S. official is describing it as a small, white pleasure craft-style small boat. You know, that, of course, could mean anything. In the waters of the Persian Gulf, all kinds of small boats go up and down the gulf all day and all night long. Fishing boats, vessels, merchant ships, small boats, people out for a day sail.

So, you know, the appearance of the boat may not get to the question of what the boat might have been up to or what the Navy thought it was up to. They will have to investigate this.

Is it a case of mistaken identity and it was simply a small, white pleasure boat and the people on board may not have understood that the U.S. Navy was signaling them to stay away? We just don't know yet. But the Navy says they went through their standard procedures. They even fired warning shots across, in front of this little small boat, before they finally fired to disable it -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: And, Barbara, really quickly, explain to us why they are in such high alert in that particular area to not allow a craft to come close to our military.

STARR: Well, I mean, again, part of it starts with these are very crowded waters. The boats, small boats go up and down. A lot of them are speed boats. You know, we've seen -- we have seen the Iranians out there in the past. That's always the big concern.

If you see a speed boat coming at you at high speed, how close do you let it get before you stop it? Iran always a concern.

We do not know at this point, no one has told us, that this boat was coming out of Iranian waters. It was about 10 miles out from the port in Dubai. So, it was out in open waters by all accounts.

But, again, you know, when they get to too close the Navy protocol, they have to stop them. You will remember, Suzanne, the Navy learned a tragic lesson about this back in Yemen many years ago when small boats approached the USS Cole and blew it up.

MALVEAUX: All right. Barbara Starr, thank you very much. Appreciate it.

In London, a flood of people showing up for the Olympics. It's already started with the games, they don't open until next Friday. But the first wave of athletes and officials, they're already arriving.

Heathrow Airport expecting around 237,000 people to pass through today. Well, that's an all-time record. More than 500 volunteers being stationed around the airport to welcome the athletes.

And when the Olympics get going, they're going to look like never -- they've never looked before. First of all, there's going to be more female U.S. Olympians than ever and some very different kinds of outfits that are going to be coming to light as more female athletes compete.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: Until recently, Kulsoom Abdullah, a competitive weight lift who are represents Pakistan at the international level, had shied away from competitions with clothing rules that conflicted with her religious beliefs.

KULSOOM ABDULLAH, INTERNATIONAL COMPETITIVE WEIGHTLIGHTER, PAKISTAN: That was my choice, is that I felt like if I couldn't cover myself, then I wouldn't go compete.

So the first competition that I couldn't go to, it was definitely disappointing.

MALVEAUX: Athletic attire can be alluring as events themselves, such as the gold shoes worn by four-time Olympic gold medalist Michael Johnson in the '96 and 2000 Games, or the one legged leotard worn in competitions by gold and silver medalist, the late Flo Jo.

Female competitors will find the dress code for some sports, including weightlifting and soccer, have changed. In an effort to make the Olympics more inclusive for women, more modest uniforms as well as hijabs will be permitted.

Muslim women from Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Brunei will be competing for the first time. With the help of the Council on American Islamic Relations and the U.S. Olympic Committee, Abdullah pushed for the International Weightlifting Federation to allow Muslim women freedom to uniforms to that conform to the conservative dress code.

NIHAD AWAD, CAIR NATIONAL EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR: The way we look at sport, it should be also global and it should accommodate people from different backgrounds, different national origins, different beliefs, as long as they meet the standard of the sport itself. So this shows openness, shows tolerance.

MALVEAUX: Abdullah's efforts have helped raise the bar for women worldwide.

ABDULLAH: Anyone who competes at any national, local, international competition that is under the IWF organization or guidelines can cover their arms and legs and their head. So for me, it meant I could compete because that's how I dress.

AWAD: Kulsoom Abdullah is a pioneer, a trailblazer who set a record, an opened the door for Muslim women.

ABDULLAH: I finally made it. I did it. I'm wearing the clothing I wanted to wear.

Women that normally weren't going to compete can now compete. The boundaries are broken.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: So the world's other big sporting agencies are also relaxing their rules. Earlier this month, soccer's governing body lifted its ban on head scarves.

The Red Cross declaring civil war in Syria. What that means for the nation and possible war crimes prosecutions.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Welcome back to NEWSROOM INTERNATIONAL. We're taking you around the world in 60 minutes.

In Syria, witnesses say they are seeing the largest military deployment in the capital since the start of the uprising. Fighting rages you can hear the sounds of gunfire across Damascus.

Now, activists say troops backed by armored vehicles have now entered the neighborhood to get rid of the rebels. As this is happening, the International Red Cross has now officially declared this Syrian conflict a civil war.

Hala Gorani, she's joining us to talk about the significance of this.

So, what does that mean, Hala? What are the -- what's the criteria? And what does that mean for people on the ground?

HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR & CORRESPONDENT: Well, the International Committee of the Red Cross had previously said that there was fighting -- intense fighting in hot spots, in localized areas in Syria, Homs, Hama, Idlib, for instance. In this case, this is the terminology of the Red Cross, it is calling the conflict in Syria a non-international armed conflict, which is in laymen's terms a civil war.

What does that change? Well, it means that civilians and noncombatants are now protected under international humanitarian law, which could lay the groundwork for future prosecution for war crimes of people involved in the conflict who break basic international humanitarian rules such as torture, killing of civilians, preventing the wounded from reaching hospitals and getting medical care.

So, it changes things not on the ground for now but possibly in the future.

MALVEAUX: What does it mean for the President Bashar al Assad? If this is -- if it's considered a civil war and he faces potential war crimes, will they go after him as a war criminal possibly?

GORANI: Well, that's possible, of course. But you know what's interesting about a non-international armed conflict, in other words, civil war, and this establishment of international humanitarian law is that now, all sides have to respect these rules of engagement inside the country which means prosecution can happen on the side of the regime, but also on the side of the rebels. The regime has been accused of perpetuating atrocities. But it's also important to note that now, some of the rebel fighters have been accused of breaking basic humanitarian rules.

MALVEAUX: Tell us what's happening in Tremseh. I understand it was on Sunday, just yesterday, that they went back to the place where 150 people were killed in one day, the worst day ever in this uprising. What have they found?

GORANI: Well, initially, this is why it's difficult for us, because access to Syria is still extremely limited to international journalists. Initially, what we heard is there was another massacre of civilians, women, children, and combatants as well. But from the evidence that the U.N. monitoring team as well as other journalists who have been on the ground, it seems as though it was an attack by the Syrian regime against combatant outposts.

Most of the video was of fighting age males which is a tragedy, of course, perhaps not on the level of what we saw in other villages where there, you remember the horrifying videos of women and children lined up like that on the floor of mosques and in homes. In this case, it appears it would have been the regime targeting rebel fighters and rebel positions, whether they were there positioned or they're protecting the village is unclear.

MALVEAUX: OK. Hala, thank you. Appreciate it.

We've got breaking news. We're going to have more of it after the break. We understand the Americans, some Americans in Egypt who are being held hostage have now since been released. We're going to have a live report from Cairo up ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: We've got some breaking news here. Americans who were held hostage in Egypt have now been released. Pastor Michel Louis from Boston and Lisa Alphonse were traveling through Egypt on a missionary trip to Israel. They were abducted on Friday when the tour bus was stopped in the Sinai Peninsula.

Mohamed Fadel Fahmy, he's joining us on the phone from Cairo.

I understand that you actually had a chance to talk to them, is that right?

MOHAMED FADEL FAHMY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I just spoke to Michel Louis and he is extremely happy. He said, "All I can say, thank God to our governors for securing our release. We're heading directly to Israel to join the members of our church as soon as we get our passports sent to us from Cairo. I tell my family I'm in good health and good spirits but I have not taken my medicine since Friday, so I'm a little tired."

Lisa also is extremely happy. She said they've been treated really well. I've spoken to the authorities and they are now in police custody along with a Egyptian interpreter. They're in good spirits. They're waiting to get their passports and it seems that the situation has been resolved.

MALVEAUX: Then how was it resolved, Mohamed?

(CROSSTALK)

MALVEAUX: How do we know?

FAHMY: The authorities did not give in to the demands of the kidnapper.

MALVEAUX: So do you know how this was resolved? How did they escape?

FAHMY: It happened really quickly. I was on the phone with the intelligence and they were telling me that they're not reaching any sort of solution and then the police headquarters called me up and said, hey, they're here, they're in our bureau.

So it's actually not clear what exactly happened for this breakthrough, but everybody's happy that this has been resolved and we will be following up with more information, and we will be getting more photos of them in the police station.

MALVEAUX: And, Mohamed, who was actually holding them hostage? What did they want?

FAHMY: The kidnapper was known as Jirmy Abu-Mashu (ph). He is a well-known criminal in Sinai. He wanted his uncle released from an Alexandria prison, who he claims has been detained on false drug charges. The kidnapper is not known where he has gone but he's not been apprehended so far.

MALVEAUX: And, Mohamed, you say that they are in good spirits, in good condition, because we do know that the pastor's a diabetic.

FAHMY: Yes. He also added that he did not receive his medicine since he was abducted and he's a little tired, but he's happy and he wants to join the rest of his 22 members of the church that continued their trip to Israel.

They were in Sinai on a missionary trip and they were heading to Israel when he was abducted and picked up off the bus. He's in good spirits. At the moment, they will be escorted by the U.S. embassy personnel who are on their way to Sinai to receive them.

MALVEAUX: All right. Mohamed, thank you very much. When you have more detail, we'll get back to you. Appreciate it.

Madonna causing yet another controversy. A political party is threatening to sue Material Girl over a swastika.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Welcome back to the NEWSROOM INTERNATIONAL, where we take you around the world in 60 minutes. Right now we are talking about France, where Madonna may be hit with a lawsuit. Here's why.

At her concert Saturday night in Paris, Madonna flashed a video of Far Right party leader Marine Le Pen with a swastika superimposed over her face. It is a really quick montage but enough to outrage the National Front Party.

We want to bring in our entertainment correspondent, Kareen Wynter, to talk about it. First of all, why was that -- tell us why it was so upsetting and how Madonna -- what was the point of it, really?

KAREEN WYNTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, first of all, Madonna's known for using her live shows as a political platform in the past.

Now France's National Front, they are fighting back. They are not too happy about what went, and Madonna's camp has responded to the legal threat, telling CNN that the show's been the same since it started in Tel Aviv in May, but they declined, Suzanne, to comment any further.

Now the image is part of a video montage -- we saw a little bit of that there -- showing several current and deposed world leaders projected onto a giant screen during the song "Nobody Knows Me," one of Madonna's singles.

Then after the image of Le Pen appears, it fades into an image of Adolf Hitler. A spokesperson for the party said the images are an insult and draw a terrible link between the party and an ideology they reject.

They had previously warned Madonna that the party would seek legal action if the singer showed the image at her concerts in France, but it seems like Madonna clearly did not heed that warning, Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: Do they explain at all why they are showing this, why they keep showing this, the point that she's trying to make?

WYNTER: Well, again, here, Madonna's such a political lightning rod. She hasn't commented as to why she chose this leader. There are reports in the past she's targeted the pope, she's targeted the former president of Egypt. So we don't know, again.

But Madonna, she loves to use the stage to make a political expression. Her camp didn't go into detail here as to why they chose this party but here's some background, though, for viewers who may not follow French politics closely.

The National Front, it's the third largest political party in France (inaudible) actually won its first seats in parliament in 15 years with two lawmakers elected.

Le Pen, she made a strong showing, Suzanne, in the first round of France's presidential election. She's pledged to crack down on illegal immigration, called for France to leave the Eurozone and restore its currency to the franc.

But, you know, knowing Madonna, she loves controversy. She knows people are talking about it, so maybe she'll put out another statement, explaining why she close to do this. Why, Madonna? Your music speaks for itself.

(CROSSTALK)

MALVEAUX: She's causing controversy as the goes around the globe with her music and some of the statements that she's making. Appreciate it, Kareen, very much. Thanks.

WYNTER: Sure.

MALVEAUX: When it comes to Sweden's music scene, here what's topping the charts.

(MUSIC PLAYING) MALVEAUX (voice-over): This is the group Panetoz performing their smash hit "Dansa Pausa." I kind of like this one.

I think our floor director's dancing here, by the way.

(LAUGHTER)

MALVEAUX (voice-over): The group formed in Stockholm, but its members come from across Africa, including countries Gambia, Ethiopia (ph) and Angola. The song, which is about celebrating life -- you can kind of tell, right? Hit number one on iTunes. The music video has also more than 700,000 views.

Again, it's a movement in New York but Occupy protesters still out in full force around the world, even sleeping on couches in Hong Kong. One company is fed up and wants to remove them.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Several stories caught our attention today, photos as well. Take a look.

In India men bathe in a river before going to the temple for prayers. It is the Shivan (ph) festival happening across India to honor Shiva, the Hindu god of destruction. This is the holiest month, according to (inaudible) calendar.

And people from a small town of Adeje (ph), Spain, watch as wildfire engulfed the hillside earlier today. More than 70 firefighters and members of the military tried to put out that fire. Threatens a World Heritage site on the Canary Islands.

This guy, sleeping on a couch is camped outside the HSBC bank headquarters in Hong Kong. Protesters are some of the last remnants of the worldwide "Occupy" movement. The bank is trying to evict them.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Welcome back to NEWSROOM INTERNATIONAL. We take you around the world in 60 minutes.

Want to jump right now to Saigon, June 1963. This is very disturbing. You might want to turn away for the next minute if you are sensitive here. What you are seeing is an iconic image. A monk burning himself alive. He was protesting government persecution of Buddhists. Now it captured the world's attention nearly 60 years ago, but the practice actually dates back to the late 4th century.

And fast forward today in Tibet. It has become what my guest calls an epidemic. Since March, more than 40 men have set themselves on fire to protest China's occupation of Tibet. CNN contributor and Boston University religion professor Stephen Prothero, he is joining us now to talk about it.

I mean, you know, even just seeing these pictures, it is so horrific. It is so disturbing to realize that people are driven to do this to themselves. You write a piece and you talk directly about the Dalai Lama. You call him out and say he could stop this. He could actually stop this, but he has remained neutral. You say that, "if the Dalai Lama were to speak out unequivocally against these deaths, they would surely stop. So in a very real sense, their blood is on his hands." Can you explain that?

STEPHEN PROTHERO, CONTRIBUTOR, CNN "BELIEF BLOG": Well, first of all, I think it's important to say that, you know, the blood is also on the hand of the Chinese government. So we have a situation here that really is an attempt at the destruction of the language, the religion and the culture of the Tibetan people. So it's understandable frustration that we're seeing here.

But the sad part is, is that we're seeing a response that is, you know, self-killing, self-violent. The Tibetan Buddhist tradition and the Dalai Lama have stood for centuries for peace. The Dalai Lama won the Nobel Peace Prize. I was just in D.C. yesterday at the Martin Luther King Memorial and I saw King talking there, his words, about the United States setting a moral example for the world. And the Dalai Lama has traditionally done that. But I think in this case he's fallen short by not denouncing these killings and bringing them to an end.

MALVEAUX: Why is this happening? Why has it become, in your words, an epidemic?

PROTHERO: Well, part of it is copycatting. You know, one of the things we know about suicides from just studies of suicides of individual, non-political suicides, is that the greatest tendency to -- for someone to commit suicide comes among people who know people who committed suicide. And the same thing happens with these politically motivated events, whether they're in Tunisia, whether they're in Tibet, or whether they're in the Middle East. You know, if you know someone who's doing this, it kind of builds on itself. So the idea that these people are just killing themselves isn't quite right. They're helping to keep a chain going that is going to lead to the deaths of other young monks and, in some case, nuns and religious people in Tibet.

MALVEAUX: I want to read to you the response to the recent deaths that the Dalai Lama said. And he's quoted here, "if I say something positive, then the Chinese immediately blame me. If I say something negative, then the family members of those people feel very sad." Isn't he basically in a catch-22 here?

PROTHERO: I think -- I agree, I think he's in a very, very difficult situation. But this is where leaders show their leadership. This is where spiritual leaders show their spiritual leadership. And I think in this case at least the Dalai Lama is falling short. He could step out and say, listen, I know there's a tradition in China of doing this, I know this tradition goes back, but we stand for non-violence. And that non-violence includes non-violence against others and also non-violence against ourselves.

You have to realize, a lot of the kids are teenagers who are killing themselves here. These are not necessarily 40, 50-year-old monks. These are, in many cases, people who are very new to the Buddhist tradition, who are self-emulating themselves in front of Tibetan monasteries. And it bears a kind of grim resemblance for me to situations in the Middle East with suicide bombings. Obviously they're not killing other people, but they're religiously motivated, they're young people. In many cases, they don't necessarily know what kind of life could be out in front of them. And for us to be, you know, cheering them on I think is a big mistake.

MALVEAUX: Stephen Prothero, thank you so much. We appreciate it.

Poetry isn't the first thing that probably comes to mind when you think of the Taliban in Afghanistan. Well, the controversy books, they're controversial books. They talk of love, war, from the other side.

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MALVEAUX: Romance, passion and sadness. Not words that you typically associate with the Taliban. But a controversial new book is hitting the shelves filled with poetry by members of the Taliban. As Becky Anderson reports, it is not just Taliban supporters who are actually reading this.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tears run down my colliery (ph) guards. Afghan history has been defamed. Just as our turban was held high in the world, today it has descended our guard (ph).

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Love, patriotism, grief. Words inspired by the Afghan landscape, written by the country's brutal former rulers, the Taliban. Their poetry appears in a new book by two western academics. It hints at an unseen side of the militant group.

ALEX STRICK VAN LINSCHOTEN, EDITOR, "POETRY OF THE TALIBAN": The poems, I guess, are part of this wider tradition of (INAUDIBLE) literature of a kind of cultural tradition almost. Can you have similar images used to the ones which the classical poets of the 19th century used. There are love poems. There's obviously a great sense of patriotism and nationalism to the poems. And also, you know, a reflection of the experience of being in the war and the suffering that they talk about in the villages.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The village seems strange. This is separation as if my beloved has left it. The grief of separation is so cruel that it is not scared of anyone. When the soul does not leave the body, it shakes.

FELIX KUEHN, EDITOR, "POETRY OF THE TALIBAN": This poetry was so present. You know, you would find it on friend's cell phone. You would listen it to it in a taxi. You would have it in friends' cars. And even people when weren't supportive of the Taliban and who weren't Taliban still listen often to this poetry just because its -- they could, you know, relate to this on an emotional level.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, Afghan, stand up. The enemy has come today. He has come to the green lawn of your homeland. Stand against him. You might destroy him. He has come to the garden of red flowers.

ANDERSON (on camera): If you had one message for the west, for those who've never lived in Afghanistan, who've never met anybody who, for example, fights in support of the Taliban or simply calls themselves a supporter of the Taliban, what would you say about those you've met who fall into that category?

KUEHN: I think what I would like them to understand is that the Taliban are humans. Just as we are.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What cruelty is it that has brought this grief to our nation? Lights are snuffed on contact. There is great grief and sadness.

ANDERSON (voice-over): But publishing these poems has drawn criticism from the highest levels. With one former British military commander, Richard Kemp (ph), saying, "it gives the oxygen of publicity to an extremist group." It's a claim the book's editors deny.

STRICK VAN LINSCHOTEN: The central problem in many ways of the foreign engagement and interaction in Afghanistan has been lack of understanding, quite often. And this is just one piece in the wider puzzle, I guess. But, you know, we're on our way now, as President Obama said recently. But, you know, it's still important to try and engage, particularly at the moment, where we're engaged in political discussions with the Taliban.

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