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Armstrong Could Lose Tour Titles; Florida Braces for Isaac; Best Buy Defends New CEO's Pay; Prosecutors: Holmes Made Early Threats; Shooting in Front of Empire State Building

Aired August 24, 2012 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Hi Soledad.

Happening now in the "CNN NEWSROOM", cycling shocker breaking overnight -- Lance Armstrong facing a lifetime ban and the possibility of being stripped of his seven Tour de France titles. But there are questions about whether the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency even has the authority to take action in the first place.

Vice president pick, platform revealed, presidency defined. The announcement we all used to wait for at political conventions. We already know. So do conventions really matter?

Fresco fiasco, and what has to be the worst art restoration project ever. A painting of Jesus hundreds of years old virtually -- well, you see what happened. The 81-year-old parishioner who thought she was doing a good thing now coming forward, accepting responsibility, in this case the picture is really worth a thousand words.

Plus this.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Brian Todd in Tampa where concerns are growing about Isaac possibly coming ashore as a tropical storm or a hurricane. That's Bay Shore Boulevard. That was flooded eight weeks ago by a tropical storm. Look how close it is to the convention center.

Can the delegates from out of town be evacuated here in time if the storm hits here? We'll tell you about the concerns.

NEWSROOM starts right now.

COSTELLO: And good morning to you. Happy Friday. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you for being with us.

We begin this morning with a bombshell announcement about Lance Armstrong. He could lose his seven Tour de France titles and he's facing a lifetime ban from cycling. Those decisions by the U.S. Anti- Doping Agency comes hours after Armstrong said he would stop fighting charges of illegal doping.

And according to Reuters, the head of the agency says Armstrong's decision to drop the fight means their case has substance. Armstrong has always denied doping, though.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LANCE ARMSTRONG, CYCLIST: I think that the people that know cycling know that we're the most passionate, fanatical crazy team out there when it comes to preparation in the right way. We spend more time on equipment and training and legal methods than anybody else. And I stand by that statement. And over time, we'll see.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: But now Armstrong says there comes a point in every man's life when he has to say enough is enough. "For me, that time is now." Armstrong made his decision after losing a legal bid to stop the Anti-Doping Agency's case against him.

Joining us now, Peter Flax, editor-in-chief of "Bicycling" magazine.

Welcome, Peter.

PETER FLAX, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, BICYCLING MAGAZINE: Good to be here, Carol.

COSTELLO: This is what it says on the cover of your magazine this morning. You see it there at the bottom. So why won't this decision bring the truth but not justice?

FLAX: Well, I think that this has dragged on for so long, and, you know, it's like the situation is that Lance is guilty of what he's charged of. And at the same time, he's the victim of being, you know, a part of a witch hunt. And so it's not satisfying. The verdict will not change a lot of people's minds. And it will leave a bad taste in people's mouths.

COSTELLO: And I can see why you say that. The U.S. Anti-Doping people say they have 10 witnesses who would testify against Lance Armstrong. But he's passed every drug test he's taken, right?

FLAX: Yes. He -- there's one drug test that's in question where he actually failed the drug test and produced a doctor's note afterwards. But he passed lots and lots of tests. I think the testimony from his teammates who testified to USADA would paint a very different picture of a systematic program where he and his teammates used performance enhancing drugs and doped.

And I think there -- in my mind, there's no question that these activities transpired. It also is true that he's the greatest cyclist of his generation and an inspiration to millions. So it's a difficult situation to process.

COSTELLO: So does this agency, do they clearly have power to take away Lance Armstrong's Tour de France wins?

FLAX: USADA is definitely set up to have the single authority to run this sort of drug testing and arbitration. I think in the case of the Tour de France titles, it's going to turn into a little bit of an international spectacle because the international body that rules pro- cycling and the company that owns the Tour de France are going to have to weigh in. And so this could drag on for months. And those two bodies might decide otherwise. So we'll just have to wait and see whether everyone abides by USADA's decision or whether there's just more conflict.

COSTELLO: And, Peter, we have heard that Lance Armstrong -- they might go after Lance Armstrong's winnings from his Tour de France titles. Have you heard that?

FLAX: Yes. I mean, there's definitely a lot of speculation about whether new litigation will open. There was a case years ago for a company that gave Lance a $5 million bonus for winning his fifth tour, and it's possible that in situations like that that people are going to, you know, present new litigation. Financially, I don't think it's the kind of stuff that's going to bankrupt Lance or necessarily ruin Live Strong, his foundation. But you know it's another round of challenges he's going to have to deal with.

COSTELLO: Peter Flax, editor-in-chief of "Bicycling" magazine. Thank you so much for joining us this morning.

FLAX: Good to be here.

COSTELLO: America's poorest neighbor in the path of disaster again. Just hours from now, Tropical Storm Isaac will pound Haiti and the 400,000 people still living in tents. That's nearly three years after devastating earthquakes left them homeless. Many of the people did not even know the storm was coming until CNN crews arrived and told them the storm was on its way.

Millions of Floridians know they could also be in the path of the storm that could reach hurricane strength. Right now, the future track is still unclear. One big question is how much of an effect will Isaac have on the Republican National Convention in Tampa. Tens of thousands of people are streaming into the Gulf Coast City ahead of Monday's start. We have team coverage for you this morning.

CNN's Brian Todd is in Tampa with more on storm preparations underway. But let's start with CNN meteorologist Rob Marciano who's tracking Isaac.

Go for it, Rob.

ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Carol. Yes, this thing has strengthened just a little bit overnight. It's a large storm, but for the most part it's been very disorganized. It looks like it's getting its act together just a little bit. But because it's been so slow to strengthen, we don't think it's going to blow up into a hurricane before it hits Haiti or Cuba. So that's good news for them.

But the bad news is, it still has a ton of moisture with it, and that's really the main concern when you're talking about Port-au- Prince and the surrounding hillsides that for the most part have been deforested. And now the people who live on and below those hillsides are in shanties and tents. So mudslides are going to a huge concern when this thing makes its way towards the north and east.

We've been talking about the track. Where is it going to go. Well, yesterday they flew a high altitude reconnaissance aircraft well north of the storm itself. And that gave us valuable data that we plug into these computers. Each one of these lines indicates a computer model that now will be coming a little bit more tightly clustered as we go -- get into the Gulf of Mexico.

So we're getting some more confidence as to where we think this is going to go. The strength of it, we still don't really understand that quite just yet. We don't think it's going to become a hurricane. You know, famous last words. But again the main threat for Cuba and Hispaniola will be the rainfall.

Into the Florida -- straits as we go through Sunday night into Monday. So tropical storm force conditions expected along all of the Keys. Possibly including Miami. And then potentially developing this into a hurricane, making its way as a category 1 landfall anywhere really from Tampa potentially to New Orleans, Tuesday into Wednesday. So that's the latest track. It will continue to change. But as we get closer, you're going to have to start to think about making some preps, including folks in Tampa -- Carol.

COSTELLO: That's right, Rob. Because people are taking no chances. And that's very smart of them.

Many people in Tampa and several other Florida cities are already preparing for Isaac. They're filling up sandbags and stocking up on essentials, including bottled water and batteries.

Brian Todd is outside the Republican National Convention site in Tampa. This is an area that's prone to flooding, right?

TODD: Sure is, Carol. You know, just eight weeks ago, Tropical Storm Debby hit near here, and this area just to my left, Bay Shore Boulevard, in downtown Tampa was under at least a few feet of water. Well, Bay Shore Boulevard, as I mentioned, just a couple of blocks from here, this is the convention center, the area where the convention is going to be held. The forum is just around the corner.

And you see the water behind me. It's a low-lying area. Storm surge is a huge problem here. That was a problem during Tropical Storm Debby eight weeks ago, and it could very well be a problem here if Isaac comes anywhere near here as a tropical storm or as a hurricane.

Problem is, Tampa Bay is kind of a funnel. It just brings water up from the Gulf right into this area. It has nowhere to go. Once it hits right about here, other than to maybe flood these areas. We talked to Dan Noah, a meteorologist with the National Weather Service about the potential for storm surge right where we're standing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DAN NOAH, METEOROLOGIST, NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE: One thing about Tampa Bay is once the water gets into the bay, it gets -- piles up. And right where we are standing is where it piles up. And that's why some of the biggest storm surges occur right here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: So that's always a worry here. And that's why there's been so much concern about, you know, Tropical Storm Isaac as it creeps up here. You heard Rob's forecast. Even if it, you know, projects out and it passes maybe 100 or some miles to the west of here, just the residuals from that storm could cause problems, Carol. And of course it could do that right when all the delegates are here.

COSTELLO: It could be but we hope not. We'll keep our fingers crossed.

Brian Todd reporting live from Tampa this morning. Of course weather permitting CNN's live coverage of the Republican National Convention from Tampa begins Monday night at 7:00 Eastern.

Best Buy is going to pay its new CEO a package of about $32 million for three years. What's even more surprising, this news comes days after the company announced a 90 percent drop in its second quarter profits. And get this. That new CEO could get more than $6 million even if he doesn't take the job.

Alison Kosik is at the New York Stock Exchange to make this more clear for all of us.

Good morning.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. So his name is Hubert Jolie. He officially was named CEO of Best Buy this week. You know, but even for that 32 million bucks he's going to be getting, this guy is inheriting a huge mess. Best Buy sales have fallen in eight of the last nine quarters.

And the guy who was CEO before him was forced out after he was involved in an inappropriate conduct with a female employee. That scandal also forced out Best Buy's founder and chairman Richard Schultz.

All right. So he's got a lot of work to do. And, yes, he's going to be paid very, very handsomely for it. So here, let me break down what his pay package looks like. Jolie is getting an annual base salary of about $1.2 million. Wait. Hold onto your hat. That's just the beginning. He's also getting over $16 million to compensate him for money that he's actually forfeiting by leaving his old job as CEO of Carlson. That's the parent company of Radisson Hotels and TGI Friday's.

Wait, and there's more. There's the bonuses. Almost $9 million a year in bonuses begin in 2014. And some of that is actually going to depend on how well the company performs. But, Carol, before you have a total outrage thing about this, there are two ways you can look at this. You can say that the company is struggling and the CEO should be paid based on how good a job he does in the future, or you pay upfront for top talent to come in and whip the company back into shape. You want the best, you've got to pay for it -- Carol.

COSTELLO: OK. I'm trying to look at it both ways. It's going to take me a couple of days. I'm looking at it.

Alison Kosik, thanks so much.

KOSIK: Have I convinced you?

(LAUGHTER)

COSTELLO: Thanks, Alison.

Startling new details about accused mass shooter James Holmes. His early threats and warning signs before the movie theater massacre. Why prosecutors are now pointing a finger at his former university.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Just about 15 minutes past the hour, time to check our top stories.

The man who killed 77 people in Norway last year has been sentenced to the maximum, 21 years in prison. Anders Breivik said he committed the crime to prevent the, quote, "Islamization of Norway." Prosecutors wanted Breivik to be acquitted on insanity grounds and held him in a -- and held in a mental health facility. The courts, though, found him sane.

A top U.S. diplomat, Ryan Crocker, faces drunk driving and hit- and-run charges in Washington state. Police say earlier this month, Crocker's car hit a tractor-trailer and spun out of control and then he drove away. Tests showed he had blood alcohol levels that were twice the legal limit. Crocker has been U.S. ambassador to several nations, including Afghanistan.

In money news, when the Federal Reserve bailed out insurance giant AIG taxpayers wondered if they'd ever see that money again. Well, it turns out that the government actually made an $18 billion profit.

AIG's bad bets played a major role in the 2008 financial crisis. Washington still owns $29 billion of AIG common stock, though.

And two Massachusetts men on a sight-seeing trip probably never saw this coming. Take a look at that. A 150-pound boulder fell from a canyon wall in Arizona. As you can see, it smashed through the windshield of their SUV. The boulder actually landed between the two men in the front seat.

Both of those men walked away with only minor cuts. Oh, my gosh! That's incredible.

Although we are excited about the upcoming political conventions, there are many who are not. They yearn for the days when political conventions used to be more than scripted infomercials.

Back in the day, George H.W. Bush and the candidates before him used the convention to announce the V.P. candidate. You know, like right there. Hello, Dan Quayle.

To be fair, even today, conventions can create stars like Ann Richards, the keynote speaker at the Democratic convention in 1988. She was the Texas treasurer, and this delicious snarky comment netted her the governor's office.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANN RICHARDS (D), TEXAS STATE TREASURER: Poor George. He can't help it. He was born with a silver foot in his mouth.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Hey, it was a great line. But this year, the keynote speakers are Chris Christie for the GOP, already a rising star. And actually he is already a star. And for the Democrats, Julian Castro, the mayor of San Antonio, a not so subtle plea for the Hispanic vote.

Of course, conventions can rally the base. Drill, baby, drill was born in 2008.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROWD: Drill, baby, drill! Drill, baby, drill! Drill, baby, drill!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: But is all of that enough to justify all the time and money to put on two massive cheerleading sessions?

Larry Sabato is the director of center for politics at the University of Virginia. He has written about this in "The New York Daily News." Welcome, Larry.

LARRY SABATO, THE NEW YORK DAILY NEWS: Welcome. Good morning, Carol. How are you?

COSTELLO: I'm good. I know you think conventions are getting to be a waste of time. So tell us why.

SABATO: Well, I have to confess I'm going to my 19th and 20th national conventions, so I'm just as guilty as anyone else. These things are dinosaurs but they are not extinct.

I -- look, you can't turn back the clock, carol. It would be nice if in some ways if we could go back to a time when I grew up when you had the coverage road blocked by all of the major networks. They covered the conventions gavel to gavel.

And if you were going to watch TV, you were going to watch the conventions. You were actually going to learn something. It was a civic education moment for the country.

Well, that's gone forever. You know, you have so many cable choices. Most of the cable channels won't cover any convention activity.

So in essence, the audience is reduced to a self selected band of partisans on both sides. Hey, the Democrats on the second night of their convention have to go up against the NFL opener.

Carol, who do you think is going to win that? Who's going to get a lot more viewers? Will it be the NFL or the Democrats? I think we know the answer.

COSTELLO: I think we do too. Although we hear -- I'm talking about the Republican convention -- we hear the Republican convention will focus extensively on Governor Romney's time at Bain Capital and his Mormon faith. So won't that help people who choose to watch the convention, won't that help people get to know him?

SABATO: Well, I think it will help those who actually watch, if there is a substantial number of swing voters or undecideds. And as we're seeing this year, there really isn't. I would peg the number of undecided voters at around 5 percent. To turn that around, it means 95 percent of the people already know for whom they are going to vote, and the vast majority are not going to change their minds. People are dug in this year.

So I think that's another reason why the conventions have become cheering sessions for the partisans, for the true believers. And that's OK. Their enthusiasm level matters, and it will determine which side wins the turnout battle in November.

COSTELLO: The networks, you know, CBS, ABC, NBC, not CNN, the networks will cut back their coverage. They agree with you. They say people are kind of bored with the selection. They have already made their choice.

But when you look at the big picture, isn't that -- kind of irresponsible on the part of journalists?

SABATO: Well, in one word, yes. Networks have used CNN and the other cable channels increasingly as an excuse not to cover the basic events that key circumstances of American politics. And that's a shame, because still millions and millions and millions of Americans just watch those basic networks. They don't get to cable channels as often as they get to their major network. So they are not learning as much as they once did about these candidates and about the parties.

And, look, even though they are infomercials, carol, they do present the basic platform. You get a sense of the candidates. You get a sense of what they're like, what their values are. You know what the parties stand for.

So they are important educational moments. And unfortunately, lots and lots of Americans are tuning out education and moving even further into the entertainment realm.

COSTELLO: Yes. They're going to watch football.

Larry Sabato, thank you so much for joining us.

SABATO: They are going to watch football.

COSTELLO: That's right. Thanks, Larry.

SABATO: Thanks, Carol.

COSTELLO: Here is a campaign bound to grab headlines. Tony Danza and Alec Baldwin, both considering a run for the mayor of New York City. It could happen.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Startling details out of Colorado. Prosecutors now say James Holmes, who is accused of killing 12 people at a midnight movie, had made threats a month earlier at the University of Colorado.

Holmes appeared in court, his hair still died red. His lawyers argued over access to his University of Colorado records.

Jim Spellman is live on the phone from Denver. Tell us more, Jim.

JIM SPELLMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Yes, Carol, the prosecutors in this case are looking for all the information they can get from the university about James Holmes, especially in this period before the shooting, the month of June. Yesterday, we know why.

Prosecutors said in that month alone, he failed his oral exam, made unspecified threats that were reported to campus police, and then he dropped out. Meanwhile, we know he was buying large amounts of ammunition and guns and we know he was seeing a psychiatrist on campus at that point.

Now the defense in turn wants to keep all of this information from the university out of prosecutors' hands. That's what this hearing has been all about.

The judge did not rule yet. We'll have to wait and see what he decides. But it really raises an important issue, which is: did the university know something about James Holmes was dangerous leading up to the attack, and possibly could something have been done to stop it, Carol.

COSTELLO: From what I understand, his alleged threats were turned over to campus police. But do we know if the campus police turned anything over to the Aurora police?

SPELLMAN: We don't. And that's a really key question here. But there's a real strict gag order, and almost all of the important documents in this case has been sealed. So, that's in a way why this hearing was so important yesterday because we got this information directly from the prosecutors and we've been having to piece things together through the series of hearings because we just can't get this information.

COSTELLO: Jim Spellman, reporting live for us from Colorado this morning.

In Florida, a new storm bears down as old memories bubble to the surface. Twenty years ago today, hurricane Andrew struck. Its impact still felt every day.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

COSTELLO: Some disturbing breaking news to tell you about out of New York City, right near the Empire State Building, a place where many tourists are visiting that iconic landmark in America. This is at 5th and 34th in midtown Manhattan.

Apparently, and CNN has confirmed this part of the story, five people have been shot. We have our Poppy Harlow heading down to the scene. We don't know the circumstances surrounding the shooting, why it went down, whether it had anything at all to do with the Empire State Building. We just know that shooting happened near that landmark.

When Poppy Harlow arrives on the scene, we'll get her on the phone and hopefully she'll have more information to pass along to you.

In other news this morning, today, millions of Floridians have their eyes on the horizon, but their memories may be locked on hurricane Andrew. Twenty years ago today, the category 5 storm roared ashore and became at the time the costliest natural disaster in U.S. history. And the impact is still being felt today.

CNN's John Zarrella is in Miami. Good morning, John.

JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

You know, people are certainly keeping a close eye on hurricane Isaac or tropical storm Isaac. And if it should hit here, people in south Florida are going to be safer and better prepared than most anywhere else in the hurricane-prone areas. And why? Because of hurricane Andrew.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ZARRELLA (voice-over): The ritual has begun. People buying up storm supplies, plywood, water. It happens about every year in Miami, and reaches a frenzied pace when something is out there headed this way.

Like there is now, Isaac. But this year, the timing is, let's say, a bit creepy for a couple of reasons. What are the odds Tampa would be in that cone of uncertainty the same week the Republicans are in town?

MAYOR BOB BUCKHORN, TAMPA, FLORIDA: We actually calculated the odds when we bid on the Republican national convention. And it is probably less than 1 percent chance that a hurricane will hit based on history.

ZARRELLA: And then there's August 24, 1992.

REPORTER: This is going to be one of the big natural disasters in our nation's history.

ZARRELLA: Only the third category 5 hurricane to strike the U.S. in recorded history came ashore south of Miami. Its name, Andrew. Entire communities were flattened, a nightmare event.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You ever heard of the devil breathing down your neck? We had the devil here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's boats on boats, under docks, on docks, there's docks on boats, it's -- it's a mess.

ZARRELLA: And it remained a mess for several years. But out of the Andrew devastation grew the toughest hurricane building codes for new construction in the nation.

Storm shutters and impact glass had to stop a projectile. The plywood decking on roof has to be thicker. Now even the nails have to be ribbed so not to pull free.

(on camera): A major dilemma for scientists and engineers trying to figure out what construction materials and techniques would best hold up in a major hurricane has always been simulating a major hurricane.

Well, that's not a problem anymore.

(voice-over): It's called the wall of wind. At Florida International University, a dozen norm out fans can replicate the most powerful hurricanes.

ERIC SALNA, INTERNATIONAL HURRICANE RESEARCH CTR.: Now we have reached major category wind strength.

ZARRELLA: Here a roof built to current code is tested against a pre-Andrew roof. It's clear what works.

SALNA: You can't get it in any other way, until you actually put it in a wind field this wide and with this force. Then you can really tell, does that product really work or not.

ZARRELLA: Saving lives is the bottom line. The wall of wind team believes what they learn here will do just that.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ZARRELLA: So 20 years ago during hurricane Andrew, the winds gusted, Carol, to 175 miles per hour, 180,000 people were left homeless, 110,000 businesses and homes were destroyed, and another 10,000 businesses. So it's a tough day.

COSTELLO: More than that. That's an understatement.

Great story, though. John Zarrella reporting live for us this morning.

Here is a problem -- facing Mitt Romney's running mate, Paul Ryan.

Remember that song from Twisted Sister? Turns out the '80s hard rock hit is causing some very hard feelings on the campaign trail, actually beyond the trail. I'll tell you why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: If a picture is worth a thousand words, many of them in this case will only be four letters long. This is the 120-year-old Fresco of Jesus by a Spanish painter whose relatives still live nearby. It adorns a church in Spain. And I'm sure you've seen this.

This is what it looks like now. A well-meaning parishioner, she's 81 years old, she's come forward. She tried to restore it. She was given permission, but nobody monitored her work. So this could be ruined forever.

This woman is distraught. She is reportedly now suffering from anxiety. Art experts are too. They are hoping to save it.

The BBC described it as looking like, quote, "a very hairy monkey in an ill-fitting tunic".

There's a long history of actors entering politics. Gene Kelly, Ronald Reagan, Arnold Schwarzenegger to name a few. Now Tony Danza -- Tony Danza and Alec Baldwin may wind up running for mayor of New York City.

I didn't mean to laugh, A.J. Hammer. I didn't. But it's like Tony Micelli running for mayor. It's weird.

A.J. HAMMER, HOST, "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT": Well, it's funny. I was thinking about it, Carol. You know, when Ed Koch was mayor, he would always ask, how am I doing?

Tony Danza may be asking New York City voters, who's the boss? You never know.

The sitcom star telling "The Wall Street Journal" he is a concerned citizen, he reads the papers, and he thinks maybe he is the guy to help New York. He says, let me fix the city, let me run for mayor. He told the "The Journal" that he would probably push for congestion pricing to help the traffic situation and he raised the idea of going up against the other celebrities also considering getting into politics. We've heard Alec Baldwin talk about it. Even Jay-Z, and by the way, you could sign me up to be at that debate.

But I don't think we have to worry about seeing any Tony for mayor signs just yet because he also told "The Journal" he didn't know if he could stand the scrutiny, Carol. We know there's a lot of scrutiny. Hey, he also admitted it's a tough job, and it's not like anybody is asking me.

So, we'll see, I would love that debate, though. Wow.

COISTELLO: That would be quite interesting.

Let's talk about Dee Snider, Twisted Sister, and Paul Ryan.

HAMMER: Dee Snider doesn't think much of Paul Ryan's politics. And he doesn't want to be associated with his campaign in any way. Paul Ryan has been using Twisted Sister's song "We're Not Going to Take It."

So Dee released a statement, here is what he is saying. "I emphatically denounce Paul Ryan's use of my band's song 'We're Not Gonna Take It' in any capacity. There is almost nothing he stands for that I agree with."

He did release a second statement, because he wanted to explain it's not that he's anti-Republican, he specifically doesn't like Paul Ryan and he wanted to make that clear. So, in a second statement, he also reminded everyone about his song's history, saying this. "I do find it ironic that the same song, 'We're Not Gonna Take It," that was under fire from conservative watch dog groups in the '80s is now the go-to song for those same groups."

It is a pretty amazing, Carol. This is a pretty regular occurrence where politicians use songs. Artists pull them or tell the artists or tell the politicians, hey, don't use my song. The Ryan campaign did respond to Snider pretty quickly by saying, we're not going to play it anymore.

COSTELLO: I'm always -- I don't know. It's just strikes me as strange that these political camps don't call the artist and say, hey, do you mind if we play your song?

HAMMER: Well, I think they know what the answer is going to be in most cases. And it's also interesting to me that they sometimes don't even look at the lyrics. In this case of this particular song, they didn't know the song's history and how much fire this song -- it was a rebellious song in the '80s and came under fire from a lot of conservative watchdog groups.

COSTELLO: A.J. Hammer -- oh, A.J., thank you. You'll be back in the next hour. And so is Dee Snider. Actually, he won't be back, but he'll be joining us in the next hour to talk about this dispute and why he released two such strongly worded statements.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

COSTELLO: All right. We have more information now on what transpired near the Empire State Building at 34th and 5th in New York City. Apparently, police were near the scene of the shooting and have shot the shooter dead.

WABC is reporting there is no longer any danger in this area. CNN has confirmed that five people were shot. Not inside the Empire State Building, not on top of it, but outside of the Empire State Building.

We still don't know what the motive was, if this had anything at all to do with the Empire State Building. But as you might examine, it is tourist season in New York City, so there were lots of people around that area.

Not only that, it was at 9:00 a.m. Eastern Time, and a lot of people were walking to and from work. Penn Station is two avenues over from this. It's at 34th and 7th. So this is a very congested area.

So when we get more information, of course, we'll pass it along. But here's what we know. Five people shot outside of the Empire State Building. And we have confirmed that police have shot the shooter dead.

When we get more information, of course, we'll pass it along. We're going to take -- oh, Poppy Harlow is on the way to the scene, so of course she'll get us more information soon. She's great.

We'll be back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is CNN breaking news.

COSTELLO: As promised, we got someone on the scene near the Empire State building in New York City. Rose Arce is one of our producers. Rose, we know five people were shot. We know the shooter is dead. Can you tell us more?

ROSE ARCE, CNN PRODUCER (via telephone): Yes. People here have a slightly different account than what the police are saying. Like just to set the stage for you, there are a good number of tourists. And we're at the height of tourist season in New York. So it's a pretty harrowing situation, very long lines outside of the Empire State building.

When all of a sudden one witness described to me that a man ran after another man and pulled a gun. He said it was not a small handgun but it looked to be sort of either a sawed-off shotgun or an automatic weapon and started firing into the man's chest. At that point, people began to scream. The crowd dispersed. And an elevator man from inside the Empire State building came rushing out and actually pursued the guy with the gun and was calling for help, alerted the police who apparently were inside. Who then chased after the gunman and caught him right in front of the Empire State building tourist entrance. Shot him people say three times.

In fact, his body is still lying on the ground outside of the entrance to the Empire State building.

COSTELLO: Oh my gosh. So how were the other people shot? I mean how did they get hit?

ARCE: Well, I mean people here, witnesses here say that they there was some ricocheting of bullets on the first shooting. But they are under the impression that no one other than the initial victim and the shooter were actually wounded.

And I can tell you looking down at the scene right now, I'm only seeing two people who were shot. They may have been taken away before I got here. But it does appear that there are the two of them. They have the police officer off to the side and the doorman, the elevator maintenance men all being interviewed right now.

COSTELLO: I'm just sort of stunned that this security person from the Empire State building started chasing this armed man who had just shot someone.

ARCE: Yes and I mean even more amazing is that yes he's all uniformed and everything but really his security job is to guard and operate the elevator. He's not even an armed guard, you know, as far as I can tell from talking to his colleagues here. He's not even trained to do this, but as soon as he heard the shooting he ran right outside and went after this guy. They say he almost caught him, he was running so fast.

COSTELLO: Well, kudos to him. I mean -- I mean obviously he was trying to stop this guy from committing more violence.

ARCE: Yes, yes, absolutely. I mean people were talking about him as being heroic. You know he was -- there's a crowd of people that were right outside the building, and you know, because it's August, it's New York, it's the Empire State building a lot of these people they don't speak English. I mean I talked with several tourists here from Spain, other countries, you know, and they were completely stunned by what had happened and were screaming but didn't have the opportunity to communicate it, have the ability to communicate with police.

And this guy apparently will be able to both get police and pursue this guy all the way -- I mean he must have run a half a block after this guy, caught him like right near the tourist entrance where the police shot him.

COSTELLO: So were the police, did they just happen to be nearby? Because it's hard to get through the crowded streets of New York City, frankly.

ARCE: Yes. I -- my understanding was that the police officer that he alerted was nearby. I know I actually was in the Empire State building with some tourists not a week ago and I do know that there seemed to be police officers that are stationed around the building quite a bit.

I mean they were there at all hours, because there are very long lines of tourists and it is considered a major New York City landmark. Also you know several people described to me that it was incredible, the speed with which this building got surrounded by New York Police Department vehicles, ambulances, emergency service -- very, very fast.

COSTELLO: Wow. Just describe to people how congested this area is, even without the tourists.

ARCE: Well even without this, I can tell you that this is one of those points in the city where you always have a traffic jam and there's a considerable amount of construction on top of the fact that you have the Empire State building here. The Empire State building itself has scaffolding on one side right now so the traffic is at a snail's pace and then you add to that, that you have the long tourist lines.

The tourist lines at the Empire State building right now are so long that when you come in and get a ticket, they're giving you a ticket to come back hours later so that you won't have to stand there all day. That's how many tourists there are in New York right now trying to get into this building.

COSTELLO: Wow. Again, if you're just joining us, these are live pictures courtesy of WABC, of Fifth and 34th near the Empire State building. A witness told our producer Rose Arce that a man with a large what looked like a sawed-off shotgun was running after another man, he shot that man and somehow CNN has confirmed at least four other people were hit by either shrapnel from the shooting or were shot. We're not sure about that.

Rose, pick up the story from there again and tell me, so there is the security guard, the man in charge of guarding the elevators inside the Empire State building, he heard this gunfire, he ran out and then what happened?

ARCE: Apparently he runs out of the building and is screaming inside to police. He's got his phone out and he's chasing this -- this gunman. You know he say he kept him in pursuit -- he kept him in his eyesight.

That's when another police officer apparently came from out of nowhere. People believe he was alerted by him and shot the guy right in front of the entrance, and in fact it's quite a scene right now because you have this, you know, big crowd of tourists that have been pushed back a half a block, all staring at the front of the Empire State building and there's a body lying out front with like a white sheet over it. COSTELLO: Oh I just can't imagine. You know we've heard that the crime rate in New York City has been inching up in recent months. I mean this doesn't sound like the gunman targeted tourists. It sounds like he was chasing after someone he wanted to kill.

ARCE: Yes, well that's the speculation here certainly. I think the one thing that makes people wonder if this was just a normal, you know, regular sort of street robbery is the fact that the gun, everyone keeps mentioning that the gun was so unusual. It wasn't like a handgun. It was bigger than that.

I mean one person said to me, this is four or five inches longer than a regular gun, that it's bigger, it's thicker and looked to them like a -- like a sort of a semiautomatic weapon. Of course, people don't know which gun is which, but it looked to them to be larger than the regular handgun and also when it's fired, it's fired into this guy, multiple shots you know.

And also, New York certainly has had its crime issues but I would say as someone who lived in Manhattan it's very rare to see that kind of a street crime in the city anymore.

You know to see somebody take out a gun and shoot somebody else that's definitely fallen into the area of something very shocking, unusual. You know I mean for -- although people here are speculating, saying if it were a mugging, why would you use that kind of a gun.

COSTELLO: Definitely.

ARCE: They described, by the way, both men as being not well dressed as in suit and tie but dressed sort of nicely, and that both of them were white, regular sort of haircut, kind of average-looking guy, no one that you would think was unusual. They looked sort of like businessmen in the neighborhood, without the suit and tie.

COSTELLO: Wow. Ok, so -- so again, five people hit by bullets or the ricocheting of bullets outside of the Empire State building. One man is dead, we believe that was the shooter. Police say they did -- police did tell CNN the shooter is dead and as our producer Rose Arce said his body is still lying right near the entrance to the Empire State building.

I would suspect, Rose, that -- that tourists are not being let out of the area right now?

ARCE: Yes what they've done is anybody who was outside the building they've pushed back just really in some cases across the street and in another case about a half a block away. I think it's -- you can presume that there are a considerable number of tourist still inside because there have been people leaving the building. And building right now -- the front of the building is closed off to anybody but police and they have a small group of witnesses there that they've been interviewing.

COSTELLO: Well Rose, great job. You stay on the scene and try to get more information for us. We're going to take a quick break. We'll be back with much more on the NEWSROOM.

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