Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

San Diego Mayor To Resign; Aaron Hernandez Indicted For Murder; Hannah Anderson Speaks About Phone Calls; Victim Explains DiMaggio Relationship; Obama Offers College Cost Plan; Stopping A Potential Massacre; NASDAQ Suspends Trading; Manning Wants to Live as Woman

Aired August 22, 2013 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CASEY WIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: She hasn't been here personally the last couple of days. But they have scheduled a news conference up in Los Angeles later this afternoon, so we may hear more details from her.

Also in those negotiations, that former federal judge who is mediating -- who has been mediating and the San Diego city attorney and two powerful San Diego city council members, including the president of the city council, Todd Gloria, who would be the acting mayor if, in fact, Filner does step down tomorrow -- Suzanne.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: And, Casey, when you talk about a settlement here, what would happen with the 18? Because our last count was 18 women who had alleged some sort of harassment by the mayor. This settlement, would it just involve the mayor and the former press secretary or could this actually open up for all 18 of these women to somehow get something out of this?

WIAN: Hard to say. It's our understanding that the only legal action has been fired -- filed by that one woman, his former press secretary, Irene McCormick Jackson. So, we do not know what the plans are of all of these other women. We're just going to have to wait and see. We do know that many of them have reported the details of their allegations of inappropriate behavior to the San Diego County Sheriff's Department which has been -- had a hotline open for women to come forward and report these allegations. In terms of any lawsuits that may be filed down the road, we just don't know -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: And, Casey, before I let you go and get into more of the legal weeds of all of this, paint a picture for us here. I know there are people who had a recall effort. People who have been collecting signatures to have him to step down to recall as well. Are there protesters? I mean, there have been groups on both sides who have been involved in this. Are there people where you are who are gathering who are waiting to see what happens with the mayor?

WIAN: No, it's pretty quiet, Suzanne. I've got to tell you, there have been protests, some rallies. Those signature gathering efforts in that retail -- recall campaign, those organizers say they will continue to do that until the mayor has stepped down and a special election has been called. That hasn't happened yet. So, they are going to continue to gather signatures. They are taking some credit for putting on -- putting the pressure on the mayor to reach this proposed settlement.

Basically, it's pretty quiet. I think a lot of people have just been waiting for this day that they expect it to happen, 80 percent or so of San Diegans wanted the mayor gone and it appears he's very, very close to doing that -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Casey, we're going to get back to you in a minute for more details, but I want to bring in our Legal Analyst and criminal defense attorney, Joey Jackson, joining us from New York. And, Joey, first of all, walk us through potentially when they talk about a settlement here with the mayor, what kind of terms are they looking at?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Sure. Well, first of all, Suzanne, as we know, it's private, at this point, because it has to be shared and otherwise approved by the city council. However, I would presume that the mayor has an interest and the city has an interest. What are both of those interests? We know them well. The city has an interest to ensure that they have a representative who, of course, doesn't engage in any type of sexual abuse who represents the people and does so in a way that the people admire and respect, unlike what you can argue happened here.

The mayor, of course, has his own personal interest and that is will he be afforded pay? If so, what type? Will there be any severance package? If so, what would be the nature and extent? Would there be health care? How long would it last? And so, I would presume that the mayor and his representatives are arguing and debating and, of course, negotiating with the city to ensure that those mutual interests coincide. And finally, Suzanne, you know that any legal action would be protracted. And as a result of that, that's something you want to avoid. It does not serve the people's interests and it certainly wouldn't serve the mayor's interests.

So, as a result, I think they want to read some common understanding so that he can go and they can get the representative that they need.

MALVEAUX: So, Joey, just to be clear here. Let's say they have a settlement here. He agrees to resign. They have some sort of deal when it comes to pay. Because he has this settlement, does it mean that all those women, the other 17 women, would they have any kind of legal recourse? Could they charge him? Would he face additional charges potentially of sexual harassment or sexual abuse in the workplace or outside of the workplace?

JACKSON: Sure. You know, that's a wonderful question, Suzanne. What generally happens in any settlement is what you try to do is you wrap everything into one. However, the settlement here is somewhat complex. First, the women who, of course, he engaged in this alleged abuse with, they want their recourse. And in the event they want to sue, the issue is they should be entitled to do that. And any side agreement that the mayor has with the city should not void their ability to be able to move forward against him. And so, that is a complex nature should that be covered here.

If it is covered, Suzanne, the issue becomes to what extent should the city be on the hook for his conduct? Now, obviously, you can make the argument that he was acting within the scope of his employment. And to that extent, the city would be on the hook if it could be established that he did it at that time. So, I would suspect that those -- this mediation agreement will cover all of what you just addressed. That is the extent to which the women can sue. What would be the price tag associated with it? Could we reach an agreement to avoid any litigation into the future? And those are all the items that is this agreement should account for so that we can end it and end it here.

MALVEAUX: OK.

JACKSON: Finally, there's something called a waiver and release. That waiver and release means you waive any claims and you release the city from any further liability. And so, I would think that the women who he is alleged to have abused would certainly have -- want to have their say in any agreement which would void their potential for moving forward legally against him and the city.

MALVEAUX: All right. Joey, thank you very much. I appreciate it.

We're following another breaking news story here. This is involving former NFL star Aaron Hernandez. We have just learned he has been indicted for murder. Hernandez is accused of gunning down his friend, Odin Lloyd, in June. He has been held without bail since his arraignment. This happened two months ago. I want to bring in Susan Candiotti. She's at the courthouse out of Attleboro, Massachusetts. What are the details?

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the Grand Jury returned this expected indictment we have to say but just a little while ago, and it does indeed indict Aaron Hernandez, the former New England Patriots tight end for the murder of Odin Lloyd. This happened overnight on Father's Day. What this means is that a court appearance scheduled for the top of this hour that was meant to be a probable cause hearing during which the state would have to provide more evidence to prove that they had enough information to move forward. That probable cause hearing goes away.

Instead, Suzanne, prosecutors are expected to formally announce this indictment. And this also means that from here on out, the case will move to a higher court called the superior court. They'll probably set an arraignment date also at that time. That's not expected to happen today -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: And, Candy, what do we know about the latest on the other Grand Jury investigation involving the double murder in Boston last summer? Could that also mean more legal problems for Hernandez as well?

CANDIOTTI: It could indeed. There is separate, completely separate Grand jury seated in Boston and sources tell us they are looking at whether Aaron Hernandez was involved in an unsolved double homicide in Boston just last summer. You might remember, we've been telling you that authorities, sources tell us, that they seized an SUV in the driveway of Aaron Hernandez's uncle's home in Bristol, Connecticut. That's Hernandez's hometown.

And also, just this week, we learned that authorities found the suspected murder weapon in this -- in that case, so certainly that Grand Jury investigation is also moving forward. So, we are waiting to see whether that Grand Jury might do it Aaron Hernandez in that case as well. So, he is obviously in a lot of legal difficulty, to say the least, right now -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: And where is he being held now and when might we see him next in public?

CANDIOTTI: Right. Well, he's being held in a local jail here, and he will be in court at 2:00 this afternoon for what was to be the probable cause hearing. So, he'll be there to hear about this indictment in person. And then the next time we'll be expected to see him is when he faces an arraignment on this indictment. That could happen in the next few days, a week, probably we'll find out the exact date later today.

MALVEAUX: Susan, thank you, following the breaking news. Kidnapping victim Hannah Anderson, she is now speaking out. She is trying to set the record straight about her relationship with the man who police say killed her mother and brother. We're talking about James DiMaggio. Topping off the list of what she wants to correct here, those 13 phone calls and text messages that she exchanged with DiMaggio the day she was kidnapped. Listen to what she said on "The Today Show."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HANNAH ANDERSON: The phone calls weren't phone calls. They were texts because he was picking me up from cheer camp, and he didn't know the address or what -- like, where I was so I had to tell him the address and tell him that I was going to be in the gym and not in front of the school just so he knew where to come get me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: I want to bring in Stephanie Elam in San Diego who has been following all of this. And, Stephanie, first of all, is there a sense of a need that she feels to set the record straight? Why does she feel that she's got to explain herself? Has she been faced with some criticism in the social media world?

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, she has been dealing with a lot of that. A lot of people have had a lot of questions about some decisions that have been made about where she's been, some of her public appearances, some of the social media aspects of what she's been saying. But I think it's important to keep in mind that this is a 16-year-old girl. She's very young. And she's still dealing with the fact that she's lost her mom. She's lost her eight-year-old brother. In fact, during that "Today Show" interview, listen to what she said about her family members that she's lost.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: He had a really big heart, and she was strong hearted and very tough. She knew how to handle things.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ELAM: And she has also talked about how the social media has helped her keep in touch with some of her friends and to feel a little bit of normalcy -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: And one thing that she has to deal with, and it must just kind of add to the -- to the trauma and the exasperation she feels here, the pain, is the fact that the family of DiMaggio, DiMaggio's sister, is calling for a paternity test, DNA, to figure out whether or not they believe that DiMaggio is actually the father of she and Ethan. Is there any way that that family is coping with that request? How are they dealing with that?

ELAM: Yes. I spent time with Hannah's grandparents, and these are the parents of Tina, Hannah's mother, and they call the claim completely ridiculous. They said that if you take a look at a picture of Brett Anderson, Hannah and Ethan's father, they look just like him. And they think that the whole claim was ridiculous. But the one person in the family who had some very fiery words was the maternal grandmother's brother, David Braun. Listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID BRAUN: What I would tell the DiMaggio family, I would tell them to shut up with their accusations and their implications until after the funeral, until after my precious Tina and precious Ethan are buried.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ELAM: And that's one thing that the whole family, the Anderson family, wants everyone to take a look at and focus on is the fact that right now everyone should be remembering Ethan and Tina, especially leading up to the memorial on Saturday -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right, Stephanie Elam. Thank you, Stephanie, appreciate it.

Here is also what we're working on for the hour. Tuition costs now have been skyrocketing with Americans owing about $1.2 trillion, that's with a T, in student loan debt. Hear what the president wants to do to keep college cost in check.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: We're talking about right here in the Atlanta area a twist of fate that might have saved 800 elementary school students from tragedy. This is an amazing story. We are learning that Antoinette Huff now being hailed as a hero for talking down the gunman. She wasn't even supposed to be at work on Tuesday. She actually had the day off. But a shift change put her in the front office and in a position to prevent a potential massacre.

The sheriff's department has released Tuff's 9-1-1 call and it reveals just amazing, the bravery, the calmness as you listen to the recording. You've got to keep in mind here that the gunman has told Tuff that he is mentally unstable and he has stopped taking his medications.

Martin Savidge has got all the details.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (from captions): Dekalb Police, what is your address and your emergency?

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over) It's a remarkable call.

ANTOINETTE TUFF, BOOKKEEPER: I am on Second Avenue in the school and the gentleman said tell them to hold down the police officers are coming. He said he going to start shooting. So tell them to back off.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): Alone in the office of an elementary school, bookkeeper Antoinette Tuff is face-to-face with a man armed with an assault rifle and close to 500 rounds of ammunition.

TUFF (from captions): : Ooh, he just went outside and started shooting.

Ooh, can I run?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (from captions): Can you get somewhere safe?

TUFF (from captions): Yes, I got to go. Yes, he's going to see me (inaudible) and he's coming back.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): It isn't just her life on the line, but the lives of hundreds of students and staff, as well as dozens of police officers now outside.

TUFF (from captions): He said to tell them to back off. He doesn't want the kids, he wants the police. So back off.

And what else, sir?

He said he don't care if he die. He don't have nothing to live for. And he said he's not mentally stable.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (from captions): OK. Stay on the line with me, OK? Put the phone down if you have to, but don't put it on hold so I can't hear.

TUFF: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (from captions): Can you tell me where you are?

TUFF: In the front office with him.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): He has got an AK-47. She is only armed with her words and puts her own life on the line. TUFF (from captions): I have to let them know that you have not tried to harm me or do anything with me or anything. If you want to but that doesn't make any difference. You didn't hit anybody. So, OK.

Let me ask you this, ma'am. He didn't hit anybody. He just shot outside the door.

If I walk out there with him, if I walk out there with him, so they won't shoot him or anything like that?

SAVIDGE (voice-over): To connect with the suspect she pours out her own personal story of a marriage that suddenly ended.

TUFF (from captions): Well, don't feel bad, baby. My husband just left me after 33 years.

But -- yes, you do. I mean, I am sitting here with you.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): And her own thoughts of suicide.

TUFF (voice-over): We all go through something in life.

No, you don't want that. You going to be OK.

I thought the same thing, you know. I tried to commit suicide last year after my husband left me but look at me now. I'm still working and everything is OK.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): There is no hint of fear, no sense she is lying to save herself. Her cool, collect nature moves even the police dispatcher.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (from captions): Ma'am, you're doing a great job.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): Moments later after convincing the gunman to put down his weapon and lay down himself, the police barge in.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On the ground. On the ground. Do not move. On the ground.

SAVIDGE (voice-over): And only then does Antoinette Tuff finally break down.

TUFF (from captions): Let me tell you something, baby, I ain't never been so scared in my life.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice-over): Me, either. But you did great.

TUFF (from captions): Oh, Jesus.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is unbelievable, remarkable story. Thanks, Martin Savidge.

Students at Ronald McNair Discovery Learning Academy went back to class today. This is the first time since Tuesday's incident. Tonight an "ANDERSON COOPER 360" exclusive, the 9-1-1 dispatcher on the tape that you just heard is going to be reunited with the bookkeeper, Antoinette Tuff, the brave school bookkeeper who stopped the tragedy.

This is going to be an amazing exchange. This is their first meeting since that fateful day. That is tonight at 8:00 Eastern. You're not going to want to miss that.

Bradley Manning says he wants to live as a woman named Chelsea. And he wants to be provided with hormone injections in prison. We're going to take a look how this could affect his 35-year sentence for giving documents to WikiLeaks.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: This just into CNN. NASDAQ has suspended trading. It's going to resume soon.

I want to bring in our Maribel Aber, who joins us from NASDAQ to explain why is this happening right now?

MARIBEL ABER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, there. Well, what happened today about 12:20 today, Nasdaq suspended options trading here. What that means to me and you is really this has nothing to do with equities. We're not talking about if you own stock in Apple, Facebook, whatever have you, that doesn't apply to that, so options as a means of trading is actually quite sophisticated.

So for the regular investor this may not mean a whole lot to say your 401(k) or your investments. But as we know right now, there is an investigation that's happening. We've heard from the SEC. They're looking into what caused this, I don't know what they're calling it, I guess a glitch, and we'll hear further details.

But right now what we know is that its options trading has stopped on Nasdaq and this is not impacting equities.

MALVEAUX: Do we know when it will resume?

ABER: I am hearing from Nasdaq, I just got off the phone with a spokesperson there. They said momentarily, so they have to figure out what's going on with what's called UTP and CIP, again, too complicated for the audience but really how the information, trading information is disseminated, that has to clear up. They have to figure out what that problem is, but they're saying that it should resume momentarily.

MALVEAUX: All right. Maribel, thank you. Appreciate it.

Bradley Manning is beginning his prison sentence with a rather stunning revelation. The Army private says he wants to live as a woman. He plans to seek hormone therapy behind bars as well. Manning made this announcement -- this was just a day after being sentenced to 35 years in prison for leaking classified military documents to WikiLeaks. His struggle with gender identity came up during his trial in a picture released by the military showing Manning wearing a wig. In a statement released today Manning says, quote, "As I transition into this next phase of my life, I want everyone to know the real me. I am Chelsea Manning. I am a female.

"Given the way that I feel and have felt since childhood, I want to begin hormone therapy as soon as possible. I hope that you will support me in this transition."

HLN legal analyst, criminal defense attorney, Joey Jackson joins us again from New York.

So, Joey, first of all, the military prison system, how would they handle this, this kind of request, would they even be prepared really to do so?

JACKSON: Well, at this point, Suzanne, their indication is that they're not prepared. They have said that they don't do this. They don't provide any type of therapy. And so an official request would be made and the issue would be whether they could be compelled to provide that therapy.

Now, here is how it would with play out legally, Suzanne. What happens is that we have an Eighth Amendment. We know that under our Constitution it speaks to the issue of cruel and inhumane treatment and punishment.

Here is what happens. You are required to give if you are a federal prison or any prison for that matter, medical treatment to a prisoner.

However, the issue here will be whether or not the denial of this treatment constitutes the deliberate indifference and is in a serious medical condition. The answers to those questions will have a lot to do with whether he is afforded this treatment or denied this treatment.

MALVEAUX: And I want to show you, too, this is what the U.S. Army official told CNN, saying here that "Bradley Manning will be treated like anyone else at Ft. Leavenworth. As far as the prison is concerned, he is inmate number xxxx and a lot of inmates have issues that they're dealing with.

"Even if you have gender identity disorder, you still serve your sentence."

So he is not asking for gender reassignment surgery. He is asking for these hormones here essentially.

Could that legally be a necessity for him, saying this is a medical issue?

JACKSON: It certainly could, Suzanne. There is precedent for this. There are 2.3 million prisoners of course in our Federal Bureau of Prisons. That is a lot of prisoners. Certainly only a fraction of 1 percent of them have anything to do with gender or transgender issues. However, given that that's an issue, and he has, as we know, been diagnosed with what's called gender dysphoria. As a result you can argue that that's a medical condition, it needs treatment to the extent that the prison denies that, you could say it is deliberate indifference and so the hormone then would have to be required.

The issue then becomes at what cost? We know that gender reassignment surgery which you have indicated he has not asked for is between 12,000 and 30,000 and we also know or have some sense that these hormones would be about $200 a month.

So if he could establish that as a result of this diagnosis that he has received that the denial of that would constitute deliberate indifference by the prison officials, certainly he would be on his way to being requiring and compelling the military prisons to provide him the treatment that he desires.

MALVEAUX: And two quick questions here. First of all, who would pay for the hormone treatment and, secondly, would there be any kind of situation that the prison would be required to ensure his safety, like separating him from the other male inmates if they did not feel like they agreed with what he was doing?

JACKSON: Sure, Suzanne. The issue is to both. Number one, who would be required to pay, you and I, the taxpayer would pick up the cost to the extent he is housed in a federal prison and taxpayers support that prison. That's number one.

The second thing is that certainly prison officials have an obligation, a responsibility, and a serious one, to provide for anyone's safety. If there is gender identity issue which he does have and which has been diagnosed, they will of course need to provide for that.

And so should he be in a male prison, a female prison or under some type of watch or solitary confinement, all of that would need to be meted out. But it's clear that the U.S. officials have to plan for this because certainly in the event they do not respond to his request we could anticipate a lawsuit which I am sure you and I will be discussing in the future if that happens.

MALVEAUX: All right. Joey, thank you. I am sure we will be following the story very closely. Thank you, Joey.

JACKSON: Pleasure, Suzanne.

President Obama says that college is unaffordable for too many Americans so he is proposing a way to actually help out. It is a total rehaul of how colleges get federal aid.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The fact is that we have been spending more money on prisons, less money on college.

(END VIDEO CLIP) MALVEAUX: How he plans to tie federal aid to college performance, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)