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Interview With Maryland Senator Ben Cardin; Syria Ready To Disclose Weapons; Wife Accused Of Pushing Husband Off Cliff

Aired September 10, 2013 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Back to our breaking news, Russia's Interfax News Service now is reporting that Syria is ready to disclose the location of its chemical weapons. Again, this is a report from Russia. We're awaiting some sort of official confirmation on that. But let's go to Capitol Hill to Senator Ben Cardin, Democrat of Maryland and a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. So Senator, nice to see you, sir. Welcome to the show.

SEN.BEN CARDIN (D), MARYLAND: It's good to be with you. Thank you.

BALDWIN: A lot happening. From what you are now hearing about this whole Syria situation and what Russia is saying Syria will explain where its chemical weapons are, does that report sound credible to you?

CARDIN: Well, we just finished a meeting with the president. Our objective is quite clear. We want to deter and basically degrade Syria's ability to use chemical weapons in the future. If they turn these weapons over to the international community, we've achieved our objective. So I think the fact that the president's taken such a strong position, that there's a credible use of force here, that the international community and particularly Russia and Syria are looking much more seriously at the control of their weapons.

Whether it's a credible proposal or not, we'll have to wait and see, we need to make sure we have a way to hold it accountable, that's enforceable and it's timely, the control of their chemical weapons to the international community.

BALDWIN: I understand and I hear you saying that the president, the administration wants you all to help him keep the pressure on, but just as you mentioned, you just came out of that meeting. Can you describe his tone, describe if there's any skepticism on the president's part?

CARDIN: I think the president's realistic. We've heard commitments made in the past that have not been adhered to. We've seen the president of Syria, President Assad, make a lot of statements in the past that he didn't live up to. We've seen him turn on his own people. So obviously we're very suspicious. But we prefer to use diplomatic channels. I think we now have the attention of the international community. So we will explore this. We'll see whether it will work, but we will not let them use this as a way to delay an international response to make sure chemical weapons aren't used in the future.

BALDWIN: Isn't that what this does, though, sir, delay, delay, delay?

CARDIN: Well, quite frankly, we'll see. The Security Council resolution could be passed in a matter of days. The transporting of chemical weapons can be done very, very quickly. So we can judge whether this is proceeding in good faith or not. I think the president is committed to making sure that any agreement is credible and that there's accountability.

BALDWIN: Did you get any kind of timeline from the president or the administration as far as how long we wait for diplomacy to happen and if not a vote happens?

CARDIN: No, the only time-sensitive issue is that if Syria were to try to use chemical weapons again, but absent that, I think the administration is confident that their options are not limited by time so that we can explore diplomacy without jeopardizing our mission.

BALDWIN: Senator Ben Cardin, I appreciate you so much, a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Thank you so much.

Now that Syria's prime minister says he supports Russia's proposal for Syria to hand over control of this chemical weapon arsenal, the question becomes, when, how? Secretary Kerry said earlier that the Syrian regime, and I'm quoting, "has about 1,000 metric tons of numerous chemical agents."

CNN's chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour joins us from New York. Here we have this new sort of layer of the story in the last hour with the breaking news that Syria's reportedly ready to tell the world or at least according to Russia, here are our chemical weapons. How skeptical are you of that report?

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think one has to really put it to the test. It's not about my skepticism. It's about whether this is actually going to work. It seems, though, these developments are coming fast and furious. This was attributed to the Syrian foreign minister, who was the first one standing there at a press conference in Moscow yesterday saying that he also backed Russia's proposal to put chemical weapons under international control.

Remember, this also puts them on the record as admitting publicly that they actually have chemical weapons, which they never did before. So I have just been speaking to the former British foreign secretary who's now head of the International Rescue Committee and deals with the humanitarian crisis and the refugees. He said knowing how these things work, knowing President Putin and the G-20 Summit, he believes that President Obama probably convinced President Putin that he was serious about using force.

So this brings you right to the point of this sort of central plank in international diplomacy and that is diplomacy backed by the credible threat of force. I think everybody is beginning to now realize that if there is any movement on these chemical weapons and handing them over to some kind of international control, then it's because of the seriousness by which the international community, the United States was prepared to take action, limited action, but nonetheless action on Syria.

And I think everybody is now saying, certainly to me, that that threat cannot be lessened, that pressure cannot be lightened. I spoke just now to Congressman Van Hollen, a Democrat, a key Obama ally, who broke a little news saying they're going to introduce a resolution that gives the president some 30 days grace once the resolution in Congress is approved and presented if the president decides he wants to pursue a successful diplomatic route.

Then he'd be able to continue to do so. If not, then he would have -- if not, within a 30-day period, he could and would be authorized to use force. That's what his allies on Capitol Hill are trying to present so that he has some kind of backing from Congress.

BALDWIN: That's news was just talking to a senator on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, asking specifically on a timeline so that is news the 30 days. Next, logistically to you, Christiane, how is it decided that if we find this credible, what then happens to the chemical weapons? Explain that process to me. Would they stay in country? Would they be guarded? Would they be transferred? Who keeps them, et cetera?

AMANPOUR: Well, I have to have say, this is the most complicated part of it. I'm not an expert on that, but having listened to David Kay, who's the American international weapons control expert, weapons investigator, having talked to a number of people, including Fredrick Hoff, who's a former Obama administration official, it is a massive undertaking to try to do this, particularly in a hot war.

There's a civil war going on inside Syria. Most people believe that absent a total sort of acceptance by the Syrian regime allowing people to come in, and not just inspectors, but inspectors who would need presumably armed protection to go about their work, it's like sending in a little mini army to go and corral and find and confirm and secure these chemical weapons. It's not a simple undertaking. That's a big issue.

Another thing that's not a simple undertaking is getting the legal authority from the U.N. on this. Now, you know, the world seems to have said, yes, this is a good idea. France is right now trying to present a resolution that would call for this international inspection on Syria's chemical weapons, but that would also be backed by a credible threat of force if it didn't happen. Russia apparently is now going wobbly on that. Will Russia actually sign on to a resolution regarding its own proposal? We'll see.

BALDWIN: That's right. Russia doesn't like that. Christiane Amanpour, thank you very much. Do not miss CNN tonight, our full coverage of the president's primetime address. Here is what's coming up tonight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ANNOUNCER: CNN tonight, at 7:00 on Erin Burnett, after meeting the president, will Democratic Senator Joe Manchin change his mind on Syria? At 8:00 on "AC 360," after Russia's Syria offer, what does the president hope to accomplish now with his speech?

At 8:30, Wolf Blitzer joins Anderson to preview Obama's address. At 9:00, watch the speech with live coverage by Wolf Blitzer. At 9:30, Piers Morgan and Wolf bring you reaction to the speech in Washington, around the nation, and the world.

At 10:00 on "AC 360 LATER," Anderson and the panel break down the night's key moments. Special live coverage all on CNN Tonight, starting at 7:00 Eastern with "ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Coming up, just three weeks ago, more than 1,000 people were killed in Syria, victims of this horrendous chemical attack. Some survived, and some doctors who treated these victims are afraid to even talk about it. Why? Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta has been talking with these doctors in Lebanon. He will join me live after this quick break.

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BALDWIN: I don't have to tell you. You've seen it, the choking faces, the contorting bodies, you've seen these graphic images continue to come out of Syria that show what we are all but certain of, this chemical attack that killed more than 1,000 people a couple weeks ago. As you see here, a lot of the victims are children and women.

We are now hearing about the survivors of that attack who have been treated and are recovering from the effects of sarin gas. Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins me next door to Syria in Beirut, Lebanon. Sanjay, you have been in contact with a lot of people. You've been talking to medical workers who say they treated these children, these victims. They don't really want to talk. What's worrying them?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: It's hard to say for sure, Brooke. I mean, I think there's a lot of anxiety, a lot of nervousness, and fear of retaliation. I'm not sure why. It doesn't make a lot of sense. They're fearful not only for themselves but also the hospitals where they work. So, you know, from a journalist's perspective, what happens in situations like this is you're talking to your sources, getting this information, and then suddenly they go dark. You don't hear from them anymore. They're talking to you via Skype, but you can no longer contact them. It's a fluid and a bit nerve racking situation, I think, for them. Exactly what's driving it, Brooke, it's hard to say. It's complex in many ways.

BALDWIN: What kind of drugs, Sanjay, can be used to treat these people who were victims of this gas?

GUPTA: Well, you know, there are good anecdotes available for something like sarin, for example, but you have to have it available, obviously. You have to make sure you can administer it. You have to do it pretty quickly. You may have seen this already, but it's atropine and most big hospitals, any hospital around the world, will have a medication like this. It's typically used as a cardiac or heart medication. It can also stop some of the most devastating effects of sarin, for example.

Sarin is a neurotoxic drug. It's a type of pesticide, actually. It works by sort of turning everything in your body on. Your lungs start secreting fluids. Your muscles start to convulse. Ultimately your diaphragm goes into a state of convulsive activity as well. Medication like atropine if given quickly can countermand a lot of those effects. Again, you have to have it available and know that you're treating someone who's been exposed to sarin.

BALDWIN: As a doctor and as a journalist and a dad, I know covering this and seeing this first hand is tough, but Sanjay, we appreciate you and your crew for being there and talking to these victims and doctors. Thank you so much.

And coming up, this Montana couple married for little more than a week had some sort of arguments of all places at the top of a mountain, at the edge of a cliff. We're going to tell you what happened next and what happened to this wife afterwards. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: An argument at the edge of a cliff comes to a tragic end, and now this newlywed wife, who's charged with the murder of her husband. Have you heard of this story yet? Authorities say this woman Jordan Lynn Graham was arguing with her husband back in July at Montana's Glacier National Park. They were hiking. The two apparently got into some kind of heated exchange. Prosecutors say she pushed her husband face first off that cliff. His body was found days later.

Lynn Berry joining me from HLN to talk about this, this is awful every way around, but to read the story and hear they got married eight days --

LYNN BERRY, HLN ANCHOR: And you know what's so bizarre about this, Brooke? She had told a friend she was having second thoughts about the marriage. She actually texted her the night that he died and said to her friend, in a text, well, I'm about to talk to him. So the friend text her back and says, I'll pray for you guys. Here's the kicker. She writes back, but dead serious, if you don't hear from me at all again tonight, something happened.

Police say something did happen on that cliff. Apparently, they got into some sort of an argument. She admitted eventually to police he grabbed her arm. She swatted it away instead of turning away in anger and walking off she pushed his back face first off a cliff.

BALDWIN: So this happens one day. It took, what, four days for her or her whole story to come clean.

BERRY: Actually, she didn't even report him missing. The day after this all apparently happened, police say it was his employer that called and said we don't know, he didn't show up for work. So police go and talk to Ms. Graham. She said she had a text message from her husband that he was going out with a friend from out of town. She said she deleted that text message. Police are saying it never happens.

Days ensue. It becomes more and more suspicious. She actually leads park rangers to an area of a cliff that she says she had found the body. A park ranger obviously very suspicious about that, but she said it's a place he wanted to see before he died. Eventually, in a second police interview, she admits to the argument and admits pushing him off a cliff. She now faces second-degree murder. She could face life in prison.

BALDWIN: So she is now instead of being a happy newlywed, is in jail. Lynn Berry, thank you very much. I so appreciate it.

Want to take you back to our breaking news out of Syria here. We're just now learning not only is the regime, according to this Russian report, ready to disclose the locations of its chemical weapons. We are now getting word that Syria is ready to sign the international ban on these weapons, but again skepticism. Should the world be skeptical from this? This is a huge development. That is next.

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BALDWIN: Back to our breaking news on Syria. In the last hour, these two different developments we've learned regarding whether the U.S. will strike Syria. The first comes from the meeting President Obama had with lawmakers when he visited Capitol Hill today. He's asking for senators to delay a vote to authorize a strike to give the latest diplomatic option a chance.

We have also learned now that reportedly Syria is ready to sign the chemical weapons convention that basically is this international treaty that bans the use, the stockpiling, and the production of chemical weapons. Specifically Elise Labott has the latest on that reporting. Elise, let me just bring you in and tell me who are you hearing this from?

ELISE LABOTT, CNN FOREIGN AFFAIRS REPORTER: Well, basically, Brooke, we're hearing that, you know, now the administration is talking with all of the allies about moving this towards the U.N. Security Council. There are meetings at the Security Council now about working towards this Chapter 7 resolution, which basically puts the Russians and the Syrians on the hook to declare all these chemical weapons and authorizes the use of force if it doesn't.

The question now is, the administration is saying that this credible threat of the use of force was really what brought us to this point, which made the Russians ask this proposal to go to the United Nations. If the president delays this vote, asks Congress to delay the vote, is this threat of force now still there in the air and will it get the Russians and the Syrians to move as quickly?

BALDWIN: We want to get reaction to this news both from Capitol Hill and from the United Nations. We have correspondents standing by. That's next.

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