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"Blood Scattered" In Kenyan Mall, 62 Dead; Obama Comments On Kenya Mall Attack; Huge Food Fight In Texas Restaurant; Flooding Death Toll Now At Eight; Players Sport Bands To Protest NCAA

Aired September 23, 2013 - 14:29   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Bottom of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

The standoff here between security forces and terrorists inside this mall still unfolding this very second. Take a look. You hear that? That is the sound of gunfire outside of this -- this upscale mall. This is Nairobi. This was from a couple of hours ago. It happened about an hour after government officials in Nairobi said security forces had taken control of the shopping complex.

We still don't know the fate of those hostages or the gunmen, for that matter, but we can tell you that the Red Cross says 62 people have died since Saturday when these gunmen from members of the terror group al-Shabaab first stormed this mall. More than 175 people were wounded, including five Americans.

And some of those Americans who escaped, they are speaking about this ordeal, including a woman from North Carolina and her family who spoke with our CNN affiliate WAVY.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LUE MALAKIA, BENDITA'S MOTHER: I was scared to death that I was going to get a call saying that she was dead.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice-over): Her daughter, 30-year-old Bendita Malakia says the gunmen barged in the terrace where she was eating and started shooting.

BENDITA MALAKIA, ESCAPED KENYA MALL ATTACK: We stood up and we starred to turn and then there was a second. Then we heard machine guns. And then we started to run. And there was a second explosion, which knocked us on the ground.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Malakia and her friend made it inside a store where dozens of people were hiding, hoping the gunshots wouldn't come their way.

B. MALAKIA: You could hear, while we were back there, them methodically kind of going from store to store, talking to people, asking questions, shooting, screams and then it would stop for a while and then it would go to another store.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In the meantime, Malakia's mother was glued to the news, feeling helpless.

L. MALAKIA: And I couldn't get to her. I couldn't make the wrongs right.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: After more than four hours, Malakia and the others were rescued by American security forces in the Kenyan army. Her mother was horrified to hear what her daughter lived through.

L. MALAKIA: And she says, in between times you could hear people that had been shot that had -- that was in pain. You could you hear that, she said.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Malakia won't let herself feel the hurt, the pain or the terror she felt inside this mall, only gratitude that these words weren't the last ones she shared with her mother.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just completely luck. We're on the ground floor, easily accessible. I think a lot was lot. We did a lot of praying in there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: The Kenyan military said more than 200 people were rescued from inside the mall. Ten people have been taken into custody for questioning including four people picked up at an airport.

Want to go straight to New York, joining me now, one of America's best known and well respected lawmen, Ray Kelly. He is the New York City Police commissioner. So Commissioner Kelly, thank you so much for taking the time today to talk to me. You know, we saw the scenes in New York today. The stepped up security, of course, linked to the start of the U.N. General Assembly where you are.

And we're told that the al Shabaab terrorist operation, this is linked to what we have been watching the last couple days from Kenya. Commissioner, al Shabaab's recruitment within the U.S. is said to be one of the FBI's most urgent worries. So to what extent, A, is the group on your radar, and B, how much do you worry about its members striking U.S. soil possibly in conjunction with what is happening in the building behind you this week?

RAYMOND KELLY, NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: Well, al Shabaab has been on law enforcement radar screens for quite a while. Most of their activities have been limited to Somalia, but of course, our concern is that they can extent out of Somalia, and of course, we have seen that in Kenya. You know, there's a whole group of concerns we have, but we've been doing this for many years.

It's a major commitment on our part. We work closely with our federal partners. We have about 190 delegations here. That includes about 120 heads of state. Some of them are very high profile and of course, the president is here today and will be here tonight and tomorrow. So, you know, obviously, it adds to our concerns, but we have a lot of experience in doing this.

BALDWIN: Right, you know all about targets. You know about hard targets. We see it playing out in Kenya, specifically, a soft target, a shopping mall. My question is, do you see a day, Commissioner, when American shoppers, you know, have to pass through metal detectors to go to the mall or to go to a football game? Do you think we should be walking through those metal detectors today rather than later?

KELLY: I think the logistics of that would be extremely challenging. There's so many locations that you could at least hypothesize would be a target. The expense, the cost, the people needed to do that, I think, would be prohibitive. Really, I think the attack in Kenya underscores the importance, the need for intelligence, to continue to try to get any information that's going to give law enforcement a leg up, the ability to intercept these types of acts before they take place. It's not easy, but it's something that we have to continue to do.

BALDWIN: Let me just ask you straight up, commissioner, which soft target do you fear the most?

KELLY: Well, we have so many soft targets. It would be difficult to pick one out. We have locations, of course, but the vast majority of iconic structures in this country, quite frankly, are soft targets. That's why I say intelligence is so important. We have a regimen here where we deploy uniformed officers to sensitive locations, locations where we may have some information that concerns us. But we don't have enough uniformed officers to do that consistently. Again, we need information to help us intercept and prevent acts like what happened and are happening now in Kenya.

BALDWIN: Commissioner Kelly, I want to quote you. This is from a speech you gave earlier this month. Quote, "The threat of terrorism is as great if not greater than it was before the World Trade Center was destroyed from al Qaeda's perspective, the war it waged on the streets of lower Manhattan on 9/11 continues from the U.S. to Europe, to Indonesia, to West Africa. That is certainly not what the Obama administration has been saying. They keep telling us, you know, that al Qaeda has been decimated. How can you and the administration see these so differently?

KELLY: Well, I think it's true that the core of al Qaeda has been reduced. Their capabilities have been reduced, but they're still able to communicate. They're still able to give leadership to actions not in the Fatah, not in Pakistan. Then we see these affiliates growing in size. We see al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. We see al Shabaab. We see al Qaeda in Maghreb. We see al Qaeda in Iraq. We see al Qaeda in Syria right now.

So I think in a sense, you know, we're probably both correct. Core al Qaeda has been reduced, but their affiliates, their acolytes have increased in size and certainly I think they have increased in potential danger around the world.

BALDWIN: New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly, thank you so much for joining me today. Taking a couple minutes, and you know, where he's standing at the United Nations, President Obama, as he mentioned, in New York for the U.N. General Assembly. In fact, we have some sound from President Obama speaking alongside the president of Nigeria about this attack, specifically in Nairobi, take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I've had the opportunity to speak with the President Kenyatta directly about the terrible tragedy that's happened in Nairobi. And we're providing all the cooperation that we can as we deal with this situation that has captivated the world. I want to express personally my condolences to not only President Kenyatta who lost some family members in the attack, but to the Kenyan people. We stand with them against this terrible outrage that's occurred. We will provide them with whatever law enforcement support that is necessary. And we're confident that Kenya, which has been a pillar of stability in Eastern Africa will rebuild, but this, I think, under underscores reawakening all of us as an international community to stand against this senseless violence that these groups represent and the United States will continue to work with the entire continent of Africa and around the world to make sure that we are dismantling these networks of destruction.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: President Obama speaking at the United Nations, specifically about that ongoing as I speak -- ongoing fatal hostage attack in Nairobi, Kenya. We're keeping a close eye on it as it's after 9:30 local time.

Back here at home, a high school rivalry goes way too far. Take a look at this, food fight, some students in big, big trouble. Find out why a number of these kids could face legal charges. We're on the case. That is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: So maybe you thought about doing this once upon a time, but the reality for some students at rival high schools in San Antonio could spell suspension after this huge food fight. So this whole thing went down at a place called "What-A-Burger" restaurant after a football game between Brandise and O'Connor High Schools. Some of the teenagers posted pictures. You can see, you know, this is Instagram. They put it on Twitter, and that could come back to haunt them. More on that in a minute.

Let me bring in CNN legal analyst, Danny Cevallos, who join said me from New York. So let me get this in, Danny. We know that the school district released the following statement to CNN. This is what they say. Campus administrators will review videos to identify students who will face appropriate consequences including suspension from school.

North Side Independent School District will also cooperate with law enforcement and restaurant management in pursuing criminal charges if warranted. That's the first thing that jumped out at me, Danny, is criminal charges? I mean, do you think that will be brought against them? DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: This statement reflects a general move towards taking discipline away from the school and putting it in the juvenile justice system. Now, there are a lot of theories. Some are that juvenile justice has become big business and these placement facilities make a lot of money when juveniles are placed in detention centers.

So this is -- reflects also society's move away from allowing the school to discipline its own students. We now have mandatory reporting and zero tolerance policies. You hear stories of children being disciplined or suspended for having cardboard cut-outs of guns. The discussion of working with law enforcement when it comes to a food fight, I think virtually everybody out there, either themselves or they know somebody who is involved in something like a food fight.

In fact, it's immortalized in the movie "Animal House." And when we saw that, we all laughed. It's an interesting move away. All we do when we criminalize what our kids do, we give a lot of kids' juvenile records, which a lot of people think they're sealed. Someone can always find them.

BALDWIN: I'm sure you never would have been involved in something like that back in the day, Danny. Let me get in what this restaurant is saying here, the principals from both Brandise and O'Connor High Schools have reached out to offer their sincere apology for the food fight. In addition, students from both schools whether they were involved or not have come to the restaurant and apologized.

Good on them, and we greatly appreciate the outpouring of support. This is what jumps out at me. Because you have these teenagers who are like this, so they'll do something like a food fight or who knows what else, and they post it to Twitter so there's the evidence right here for charges if charges are brought, viola.

CEVALLOS: Yes, it's an interesting -- I practice a lot in the juvenile justice system. It's a fascinating development where people are essentially, they might as well plead guilty with the things they're posted online, whether it's social media or otherwise. And maybe it's something our generation will never understand, that the younger generation simply has to, they're compelled to post pictures of their shenanigans.

The reality is that juvenile def defendants and defendants in general, younger people are creating a wake of digital evidence everywhere they go, and they're doing it knowing full well of the consequences. It's simply handing a case to law enforcement a bow attached.

BALDWIN: That's a perfect way to put it. Danny Cevallos, thank you.

And coming up, that food fight wasn't enough for you, got another one on the ice hockey fans, anyone? This turns into way, way more. You'll see that.

Plus, we'll take you to Colorado. Some new concerns for folks there, floodwaters could be reaching oil fields. This as the state gets ready for a high-profile visitor this hour. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: I want to take you to Colorado now. We can tell you that Vice President Joe Biden. He is there today, surveying areas damaged by weeks of extensive flooding. He will be touring parts of the state alongside the governor of Colorado, John Hickenlooper. Larimer County has confirmed an eighth fatality from all of the floods. Two people in the county are still listed as missing and they're presumed dead. Some washed out roads are beginning to open, but there's still a lot of concern about the possibility of more spills in flooded oil fields.

Help is still needed for the victims of the floods. Remember, if you would like to help, I know so many of you do, just to our impact your world page, simple just go to cnn.com/impact.

Coming up, should college players -- football players, be paid? Some of them are taking this big step wearing wrist bands in protest. That's not all they're demanding. Why this could change the fight in one of the biggest money makers in all of sports.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: A number of college football players all around the country are united and demanding change in the NCAA. Over the weekend, players wore the letters APU, stands for all players united on their gear. So what is the message behind the lettering? CNN's Sara Ganim explains.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SARA GANIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Companies pay millions to advertise on athletes. So some college players thought, why not send out our own message? They grabbed sharpies Saturday and scribbled this on their armbands, towels, and athletic tape. The letters APU, all players united. Twenty eight college football athletes from at least three Major Division I teams staged a polite unauthorized protest for NCAA reform.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Players really wanted to find a way to be more visible and vocal and to show unity.

GANIM: Ramoki Huma, a former UCLA linebacker and voice for reform said it was the athletes' idea.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Money is going to go to the places it always goes. We're talking about salaries for coaches, athletic directors, NCAA headquarters, or luxury boxes in the stadiums. But they're not being directed to take care of players' medical expenses, to invest in concussion research, brain trauma research, to help protect the players that generating the money and even education.

GANIM (on camera): We hear all the time the argument the college athletes should be paid, since so many others cash in on what they do. That's not their only complaint -- they also say if they get injured on the field, there's no guarantee their medical expenses will be paid. If they don't graduate in four years, there's no guarantee they can still stay and get a degree.

(voice-over): Players at North Western, Georgia, and Georgia Tech took part in the "All United" pledge. The NCAA seemed surprisingly understanding. Saying as a higher education association, the NCAA supports open and civil debate regarding all aspects of college athletics. But it didn't seem like they were open to talking about it after the Georgia Tech game where about ten players participated. This was Head Coach Paul Johnson's response.

PAUL JOHNSON, GEORGIA TECH HEAD COACH: I can assure you that now that I'm aware of it, we'll talk to them about it.

GANIM: Two players from two different schools who said they wanted to talk to CNN about the pledge later pulled out of the interviews. We caught up with one player who participated, even though a team handler tried to discourage us from talking about it.

JEREMIAH ATTAOCHU, GEORGIA TECH FOOTBALL PLAYER: I'm going to get in some trouble for this. I know guys out there at Georgia Tech. They don't have the academics to fall back on and things like that, so you know, just looking out for everybody.

GANIM: Houma later told CNN that as far as he knows, no players have been disciplined for participating.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: So on the field, in the studio, what is this about? Is this about being paid or something else?

GANIM: Well, it's partly about that. But every person I talked to who is an advocate for NCAA reform has told me their number one concern is concussions and number two, education. The two play into each other because if a player is injured on the field and thinks they might lose their scholarship, they're less likely to report.

It's something Pennsylvania Congressman Charlie Dent and I have talked about a lot because he introduced legislation earlier this summer that would call for a total and complete NCAA overhaul and reform. He said, you know, this is a problem if these players don't report this. Because they think they might not be able to finish and get their degree. He wants to have congressional hearings on it.

BALDWIN: What are the universities saying?

GANIM: The universities all aren't commenting today. However, I can tell you that the person who organized this told me that none of the players have gotten in any kind of trouble or been reprimanded for it, but the universities are not talking about it.

BALDWIN: Thank you very much.

Coming up, you will hear from a man who said he was targeted for wearing a turban and having a long beard. Twelve people yelled get Osama as they attacked. He's not Muslim. Now New York police are investigating if this is a hate crime. Plus, as the hostage situation inside that Kenyan mall intensifies, I'll speak live with a Somali community leader here in the United States about the possibility these suspects could include Americans recruited by terrorists.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)