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Exclusive with Gov. Christie; Toronto Mayor Admits to Smoking Crack; Escaped Oklahoma Inmates Captured; Missing Family Found Dead

Aired November 05, 2013 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: He is known for speaking his mind. Moments ago on this Election Day, Chris Christie doesn't hold back in an interview with CNN, and you're about to hear it.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. The news is now.

Did the childhood of a football player contribute to his alleged harassment of a teammate?

A family vanishes without a trace, left behind, their smoldering SUV.

Plus, are people like us living far, far away? New research shows it's not out of the question.

And, did the football coach who collapsed on the field see signs of a mini stroke?

And we begin. Great to be with you. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Election day 2013. Big races. Major decisions for voters. And how these issues and races are decided could have an impact really far beyond today. Far beyond Election Day.

Take a look with me. Among the places we are keeping a close eye on here, first you have Virginia, where Democrat and Clinton family friend Terry McAuliffe is favored over Republican Ken Cuccinelli and the race for governor there.

Heading up north, New York City, where left leaning Bill de Blasio could become the first Democrat to win the mayor's office since the 1980s.

But we begin in New Jersey where Republican Governor Chris Christie is looking like he is headed for re-election in a Democrat-leaning state. Here he was, Governor Christie's re-election, would be seen as the start of something much bigger. He is a centrist, straight talker who has shown he can win over traditionally Democratic voters. And that has a lot of people talking about the future for the run for the White House. Jake Tapper has spent a heck of a lot of time with this governor today. He joins me live from Asbury Park, Bruce Springsteen anyone?

Jake Tapper, tell me about the governor.

JAKE TAPPER, ANCHOR, CNN'S "THE LEAD": Well, greetings from Asbury Park, New Jersey, Brooke. As you mentioned, I got to spend some time with Governor Christie today. And as you mentioned, people are looking to New Jersey and Virginia to see if there's a lesson for the Republican Party as a whole here. And Governor Christie says that he believes there is one when it comes to how the party can win the White House in the future.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: I think that the party's got to focus on winning again. You know, sometimes I feel like our party cares more about winning the argument than they care about winning elections. And if you don't win elections, you can't govern. And if you can't govern, you can't change the direction of a state, like we've done in New Jersey. And so, you know, I don't - I said, well, one, I think we need to get ourself refocused on that. And secondly, I think sometimes we forget that candidates matter. I mean it's not just about a checklist of issues. It's also about how a person presents themselves as a candidate, how they articulate their view on things and how they react to situations. People make judgments based on all those things.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Now, Governor Christie maintains he is not a moderate despite the fact that many in the Republican Party look at him and believe he is because of the way he has governed here in New Jersey, a blue state, a Democratic state, as you say, Brooke. He says he is a conservative. And we talked a lot about what he thinks the national party needs to do from here on in.

BALDWIN: I know you're going to tackle that. We're going to hear much more of that on your show. But let me turn a corner here, Jake Tapper, and let me just ask you about the president and about his -- let's call it what it is -- a broken health care promise. It's broken. You have heard it. I have heard it. Our viewers have heard it so often. We can just about recite it in our sleep.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If you like your private health insurance plan, you can keep it.

If you like the plan you have, you can keep it. If you like the doctor you have, you can keep your doctor too.

We will keep this promise to the American people. If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor, period. If you like your health care plan, you will be able to keep your health care plan, period.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Now millions of folks are finding out that's not true. And now we all of the sudden are seeing the fine print.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) OBAMA: What we said was, you could keep it if --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: If. So now there was an if. Before you could keep it, period. Now you can keep it --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: If it hasn't changed since the law's passed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Jake Tapper, you heard the president. You can keep your insurance, not period, but if it hasn't changed since Obamacare passed. How can he say, as he seemed to be saying right there, that he's been saying all along? What's the meaning here and the significance of this new "if" clause?

TAPPER: It's interesting because in 2009, when I was a White House correspondent, I asked President Obama about this promise he was making because it didn't seem like you could change such a significant part of the economy and not have repercussions where people had to get different insurance or were forced to change doctors. And what he said in 2009 was, what he meant was, if you like your health care plan, the government is not going to force you to change it. Now he's saying something different, a new clause. So I did ask Governor Christie today, who has a reputation for blunt talk to some people's pleasure, to some people's displeasure, I asked him what advice he would give President Obama about this trouble that he's in about this broken promise.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIE: Here's what my suggestion would be to him. Don't be so cute. And when you make a mistake, admit it. And, listen, if it was a mistake in 2009, if he was mistaken in 2009, 2010 on his understanding of how the law would operate, then just admit it to people. Say, you know what, I said it, I was wrong, I'm sorry and we're going to try to fix this and make it better. I think people would give any leader in that circumstance a lot of credit for just, you know, owning up to it instead of now trying to -- like, don't lawyer it. People don't like lawyers. I'm a lawyer. They don't like them, you know? And don't lawyer it. And when I saw that this morning - I saw that this morning for the first time and I thought, he's lawyering it. That's Barack Obama the lawyer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: So, Brooke, there you have it, don't be so cute.

BALDWIN: Yes.

TAPPER: This is Governor Christie's suggestion for President Obama, don't be so cute, admit what was wrong, say you're going to fix it, say that you were wrong and be a leader, not a lawyer. That is Governor Christie's advice, unrequested for President Obama, Brooke.

BALDWIN: But given nonetheless on board that bus.

And, hey, since I have you and I know you've been on a bus, I don't know if you've seen this, now numbers from Gallup. These approval ratings for the president now dipping down to 39 percent. Jake Tapper, what do you make of that?

TAPPER: Well, it's been a - it's been a rough rollout for Obamacare. And I think that the administration has a credibility issue right now when it comes to the comments that president Obama made about being able to keep your doctor. And we should point out, this affects a small percentage of the population, but it's still millions of Americans who are now being forced to change their health care plans. And he also has a credibility issue when it comes to explaining what he meant in 2009.

Now, I've been reading "Double Down," the book about the 2012 campaign. And that book is filled of examples of Romney and Obama campaign staffers who are brilliant and have wonderful advice for their candidates, if only their candidates weren't so flawed. So I have no doubt that one of those brilliant White House advisers will be able to help President Obama out of this pickle, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Jake Tapper, thank you so much. We'll be looking for you, of course, on "The Lead" with much more on this interview with Governor Chris Christie, on Obamacare, lots of things they tackled with Chris Christie wearing his don't panic cufflinks here today on election day. So tune in to "The Lead," 4:00 p.m. Eastern here on CNN.

Coming up, big, big news from the fourth largest city in North America. Have you heard from this impromptu news conference from the mayor of Toronto? Apparently we the media were asking the wrong questions. The question was whether or not he was an addict. The right question would have been, Mr. Mayor, did you smoke crack in office? That is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Drunken stupors, crack, and the leader of the fourth largest city in North America. Turns out once again it's the media's fault. We were all asking the wrong questions. Mayor Rob Ford, are you a crack addict? No way, he says. What we should have been asking is really just a much simpler question. Mayor Rob Ford, have you been smoking crack on the job?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR ROB FORD, TORONTO: Yes, I have smoked crack cocaine.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When, sir?

FORD: But, no, do I? Am I an addict? No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When did - FORD: Have I tried it? Probably in one of my drunken stupors probably approximately about a year ago. I answered your question. You asked the question properly, I'll answer it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How many times -

FORD: Yes, I've made - I've made mistakes. All I can do now is apologize and move on. I don't know what - oh, guys, whoa, whoa, whoa, OK, can I - can I just -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

FORD: All I can say is I've made mistakes. That's - and you guys kept referring to alcohol. It was a couple of isolated incidents. There's been times when I've been in a drunken stupor. That's why I want to see the tape. I want everyone in the city to see this tape. I'd like to see this tape. I don't even recall there being a tape and a video. And I know that. So I want to see the state that I was in. But that's exactly it. And I don't know what else I can say here, OK?

So I wasn't lying. You didn't ask the correct questions. No, I'm not an addict. And, no, I do not do drugs. I made mistakes in the past. And all I can do is apologize. But it is what it is, and I can't change the past. And I can apologize to my family, my friends, my colleagues, and the people of this great city. I can't change (INAUDIBLE).

So I told you, probably - probably -- approximately -- I'd probably say in and around about a year ago, but I don't know exactly. That's why I want to see - I want - I don't - I don't even remember. After some of the stuff that you guys have seen me, the state I've been in, it's a problem. So I want to - I want to get --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you on drugs right now?

FORD: I said - oh, God.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: There you have it. The mayor in his own words. After months of allegations, pressure on the Toronto mayor increased last week when the police chief announced investigators have found this video of the mayor that allegedly showed him smoking this crack pipe.

So let me bring in Robyn Doolittle. She is an investigative reporter for "The Toronto Star" and one of two Canadian reporters who has actually seen this video.

But, Robyn, let me just begin with this impromptu news conference. What forced the mayor's hand here? Why admit this now?

ROBYN DOOLITTLE, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER, "THE TORONTO STAR" (via telephone): We have no idea. I did connect with some of the mayor's staff afterwards and they were completely taken by surprise. Police sources indicate that the police service wasn't planning on releasing anything today or tomorrow that would prompt this. It was -- I happened to actually be outside when the mayor held this press conference and it did have the air that he just kind of snapped. And it is a small point in the magnitude of the events, but the media had asked him repeatedly, have you ever smoked crack? He's just always responded saying, I'm not an addict.

BALDWIN: You say you weren't part of this gaggle. You talked to reporters who were. I mean can you talk to the atmosphere and also just sort of the mayor's behavior, the laughter?

DOOLITTLE: Pardon me. How long ago?

BALDWIN: No, just, have you talked to reporters who were part of this whole scrum, you know, shoving microphones in his face when he was sort of finally admitting to this. And I'm curious just the atmosphere among everyone. And the mayor almost laughing it off.

DOOLITTLE: Right. Yes, I mean, so I said I did happen to be standing there when he came through. He came off the elevator and he was walking towards his office. He never speaks with reporters. This is - this is extremely rare even - so he stopped and turned around. And that was shocking on its own. And he answered a few non-important questions and then he finally looked at a reporter and said, you asked me something last May. That's when "The Star and Gawker," the gossip website, first reported that we'd seen this video of the mayor appearing to smoke crack. He said, you asked me a question back in May. What was it? And someone said, have you ever smoked crack? And he said, yes, I have smoked crack cocaine. And it was -- it was like the air fell out of the room. People just started to shake. It was - it took everybody by surprise. And it almost -- you had to think that that actually just happened. He's been so vehemently denying that he has ever smoked crack. He made an apology on the weekend after the chief of police announced that they had this video that "The Star" had reported on and he apologized for his drinking. It's been rapidly advancing news.

BALDWIN: Let's talk about the video. You're, as I mentioned, one of two Canadian reporters to have seen this video. What did you see?

DOOLITTLE: Right. So this is a group of self-professed drug dealers in the north end of the city. And they secretly shot this video of the mayor. He's - it's shot on a -- it looked like it was shot on an iPhone. We watched it on an iPhone. So it's high definition. He's sitting up against a white wall. It's sunny. He's in a white dress shirt that's kind of unbuttoned around the top. And he looks completely out of it. He's jerking and bobbing around. He's slurring. His eyes are kind of fluttering. And he clearly smokes from -- out of what looks like a crack pipe. It doesn't look like a marijuana pipe. It's long and clear and black at the bottom. He also calls liberal leader Justin Trudoe (ph) a homophobic slur and he makes disparaging comments about minorities.

BALDWIN: Yet his -- thus far, his approval ratings have, in fact, increased. You have covered this mayor so much, you're writing a book on him. Knowing Toronto as well as you do, do you think that will change after today?

DOOLITTLE: It is worth noting his approval ratings are low. He's always -- he was elected with 47 percent of the vote. His approval rating has always been in and around 40 percent. So it's still in and around that range. It's not like 90 percent of the city is approving of him.

BALDWIN: Sure, but it's gone up some 5 percent through this whole thing.

DOOLITTLE: Right. No, and that is very consistent with what we've seen all along. When it - when news broke that he'd been charged with drunk driving in Florida in 1999, his approval rating went up. He is kind of a champion of the working guy. He -- it's the classic George Bush, I think I could have a beer with that guy, he's not going to judge me, he seems like one of the bros watching football. And, yes, I have - I - it's - it has a lot of people shocked that his approval rating has gone up. That's for sure.

BALDWIN: Robyn Doolittle, thank you so much, calling in from Toronto. A reporter with "The Toronto Star." We appreciate it very much.

Just ahead, what was a missing person's case is now a murder mystery as investigators recover the bodies of a missing family in Mississippi. We're on the case with those late developments.

Also some breaking news on CNN. Two inmates who have been on the run for more than a week have been captured. Those details, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BALDWIN: Breaking news here on CNN. Remember this story from last Sunday when those four inmates escaped through this detention facility in Oklahoma, climbing through the ceiling tile, down the piping and out of this detention facility? Two of these inmates had been caught, but for a number of days the other two have been on the lam until now. I want to bring in HLN law enforcement analyst Mike Brooks because we're now learning bits and pieces here, not a lot right now.

MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Right.

BALDWIN: Here's what we know. They were found in a private home in Oklahoma. It was all because of a tip that came into authorities this morning. And they were taken without incident.

BROOKS: Well, the first two, Irons and Brown, they were caught less than 20 miles from the prison, Brooke.

BALDWIN: They didn't get very far.

BROOKS: They didn't get very far at all. So these two, we're not sure exactly how far from the jail that they were caught. But, again, it came from a tip. So, you know, when you have escapees, especially in a rural area like this, they're going to go to either family, friends, associates. So, you know, it was just a - it wasn't a matter of if, it was a matter of when. And I knew they were going to get caught. But I'm glad to see they were caught from a tip.

BALDWIN: What happens in cases like this? Because you have to know police are thinking, OK, what's familiar territory for them? Let's reach out to family. Let's reach out to associates to see if they have made contact.

BROOKS: Right.

BALDWIN: Now, don't they know that the police are going to do that and that that's just not smart?

BROOKS: Sure they do.

BALDWIN: But I suppose breaking out of jail isn't smart to begin with.

BROOKS: That's not - that's not too bright either. So these aren't the brightest bulbs on the porch, that's for sure.

BALDWIN: Right. Right.

BROOKS: You know, and they check visitors logs and everything else. So they know exactly who their friends, who their associates are, who's been calling them, who's been visiting the jail. They know all of this. And that's where they start. And, you know, it's just - it's manpower. OK, do you have enough - do you have enough men, do you have enough marshals (ph), do you have enough people to go and sit on these places to see if they show up there. But in this particular case, it came from a tip. They went out, taken without incident.

BALDWIN: Not a matter of if, but when they get caught.

BROOKS: That's it.

BALDWIN: Mike Brooks, thank you very much.

BROOKS: Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: And after a strange series of events here, a family in Mississippi who mysteriously vanished has been found dead. Police in Copiah County say what they believe to be the bodies of a mother, her seven-year-old son, and the mother's husband have now been found. The family was last seen Friday in their car. Their vehicle was later found flipped upside down and in a ditch in the western part of this county.

So flash forward to yesterday. Investigators found bloody clothes in a dumpster at a gas station and linked them to this family. And CNN's Gary Tuchman joins me by phone from this county here in Mississippi.

So, Gary, tell me what you know right now.

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Well, Brooke, this is just so sad and mystifying and horrifying. A little boy, seven years old, his mother and his stepfather (ph) were all found shot to death four days after their empty SUV was found upside down on fire, as you were saying, in a rural area south of Jackson, Mississippi.

Now for four days they were missing. With their discovery now, an arrest has been made. And this is the weird part of the story. He's a 42-year-old man in Jackson. He's been arrested for arson, accused of causing the fire, and perhaps staging the accident. Why? The sheriff doesn't know. I've talked to him. He doesn't know the reason for that, but he has been arrested for arson. He also said, the sheriff, a person of interest in the shotgun killing of all three of these victims, little seven-year-old Jaidon Hill, his mother Atira Hill, and the husband, Laterry Smith, were shot to death.

Now, I talked to the family of the boy and his mother just a short time ago. They're devastated. They're stunned. They talk of a wonderful woman who recently got married and a very sweet little boy. And regarding a motive in this strange case, like I said, if the sheriff knows it, he isn't telling me. We just don't know why this happened, but a man is under arrest.

Brooke.

BALDWIN: Absolutely awful. Seven years of age, this little boy. Gary Tuchman, we'll being looking for those interviews and for your story tonight, "AC 360" at 8:00 p.m. here on CNN.

Coming up next, as President Obama essentially breaks his health care promise, CNN's senior White House correspondent Jim Acosta just got an interesting response here from the White House about that. This is really the closest the administration has come to admitting a big goof. Stay right here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)