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Philippines Hit by Typhoon; Vietnam Braces for Typhoon Impact; President Obama Apologizes

Aired November 09, 2013 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

FOUAD AJAMI, SENIOR FELLOW, STANFORD UNIVERSITY'S HOOVER INSTITUTION: I was at home watching you and I saw you had no tie, so I thought I would follow your example.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: It is the top of the hour. I'm Don Lemon. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM. A lot of news to get to.

Right now overseas everyone, an entire nation still in shock after one of the most powerful and destructive natural disasters ever recorded. I am talking about the Philippines where a massive typhoon ripped apart homes, flooded rivers and may have killed at least 1,200 people. The death toll will likely go up in the coming days as rescuers find more victims and the scope of the destruction nationwide becomes clearer. Communications lines are still down and reliable information is moving slowly.

But this storm is not deed. People of eastern Vietnam are bracing for what is left of the typhoon. It should hit on Monday and could bring up to 12 inches of rain. CNN has correspondents throughout the Philippine islands today. I want you to listen to Andrew Stevens describe what he experienced.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW STEVENS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The devastation in this city is staggering. No building escaping damage. The destruction caused by the super typhoon, Haiyan is everywhere. It left the city cutoff from the rest of the country. Its people increasingly desperate.

Roads are still impassable. All communications are down. Medical supplies are running out. Food and water are becoming scarce. And reports of looting are widespread.

It's impossible, at this stage, to estimate the costs in human lives. We have seen bodies on the streets and we have seen bodies washing up on the beaches. The Philippines in (INAUDIBLE) can only say the number of deaths will be high. It's estimated perhaps one million people live along the low lying coastline. The majority of them in rough build checks. Even if they could have with stood the wind, they would not have survived the storm surge, a huge, perhaps five meter wall of water that spread across the city of the storm at devastating speed.

The water receded as quickly as it came, leaving a trail of destruction. People have been warned to evacuate, but not everybody took the advice. The priority here is to clear the roads to the airport so relief supplies can start moving in. 24-hours after the storm, the first military helicopters began arriving. But it will be a messy task, bringing in food and supplies to so many. In the meantime, people of Tacloban city searched for food and water and for missing loved ones.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That was Andrew Stevens reporting. Remarkable images, some absolutely freighting emerging from the typhoon battered Philippines.

Storm chaser James Reynolds was with him and captured this video in the heart of the destruction. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. One more. One more in there, Josh?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One more?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, I think we got everyone.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. I can feel electricity in the water, guys. My legs are tingling.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, I talked to James Reynolds about the rescue with CNN's Andrew Stevens and I asked him to walk us through what happened. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES REYNOLDS, STORM CHASER: It came to our attention that one family trapped in one of the hotel rooms. They could make (INAUDIBLE) screaming desperately and smashing the glass windows in a desperate attempt to get out. And then a lot with that situation. One of my colleagues, Josh, we went out there trying to face another colleague, actually. We managed to get a mattress, I think, to float to get a family out. It included people who could not get out by themselves. And we both try saving life as we manage to put them on and get them to safety, Don.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: CNN i-reporters continue to send us images of the typhoon.

James Mirasol sent us several different videos from Cebu City. Hear them an anger river swollen by heavy rains has turned into a raging and murky mess running its banks and flooding parts of the city. Look at that video. Unbelievable.

Here is another view of the river. There is a few residents bravely the aftermath just come out and see the floodwaters from a bridge overhead. And one more view in Cebu City where heavy surf and huge waves slammed the coastline.

We continue on with this story now. The pictures we are seeing on the ground show the destruction the typhoon, Haiyan, left behind. But its massive scale is most apparent from another angle.

I want you to take a look at this striking photo, the killer storm as seen from space. NASA astronaut (INAUDIBLE) tweeted the picture on Saturdays as she passed over Southeast Asia onboard the international space station. And you can see that even in an orbit nearly 400 kilometers above the earth, Haiyan's clouds still fill nearly the entire frame of that photograph.

In other news now, the president says he is sorry. But, is that really good enough when the health care Web site is still a mess?

And later this hour, a CNN Special Report on the business of pot. You don't want to miss this. Legal marijuana among the fastest growing industries in the U.S. the billions of dollars it could bring in. The tax money that could be earned and the alcohol industry's biggest nightmare. Is it? We are going in-depth.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: The president says he's sorry. "Time" magazine calls New Jersey's governor the elephant in the room. It is not Sunday, but look who is here to talk politics. CNN political commentator, Ana Navarro, Republican strategist here in New York and in Chicago, CNN commentator Lz Granderson.

So, let's listen to the president apologize.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I am sorry that they are finding themselves in this situation based on assurances they got from me. We have to work hard to make sure that they know we hear them and that we are going to do everything we can to deal with folks who find themselves in a tough position as a consequence of this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I am sorry, then he moves on. The apology, that's it, Lz. But the Obamacare Web site is a mess. People are having trouble signing up. And not enough young people are signing up. How does he get out of this mess?

LZ GRANDERSON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: One, by fixing the Web site, of course. And two, by, you know, trying to be more forthright with the American people. Look, this could have been avoided awhile ago. We all know this. You know, had they told us weeks before the beginning date of Obamacare that, look, there is a possibility that once we open up the site could crash for various reasons, stay patient with us, but we plan on-going forward with it. Politically, it might not have been that great, it would have sent a narrative in a different direction. But at least in terms of trust worthiness, the American people would have felt he told the truth. He didn't do that, just like he didn't tell us about insurances has being canceled.

Now, there are various reasons why they are being canceled. And perhaps, if he told us the true reason why, that maybe, we wouldn't be so angry about this. I have to tell you, you know, there are quite a few things I have been disappointed in. This is by far the biggest disappointment I have had with his administration. Just blatantly keeping the truth from the American people because I don't -- he was not politically, you know, it wasn't right politically to tell us.

LEMON: You are saying a lot of people are mad at him. I'm going to get to you, Ana, but stand by. A lot of people aren't mad. There are still people who are making excuses for the president and you are going to get a lot of them on twitter because you just said that. People are making excuses going but, but, but, but.

GRANDERSON: You know what, there comes a time, now listen, again, there are definitely sound reasons why people are having their insurances canceled. And these reasons should be going back to the consumers asking the insurance companies why didn't you tell me this policy would not be valid come 2014? Why did you sell me a policy in 2011, 2012, 2013 that you knew would not be legal come 2014 because of the affordable care act? You can't tell me this.

So, while they definitely absorb the president for saying he could have kept your insurance, there's also some culpability with insurance companies for selling policies as they knew would not be up to code come 2014. So, there's a lot of blame to go around. I just go back to the president because look, you are with one that ran on the promise that we would be able to keep our insurance. You had information that negated that. You didn't tell us. You need to be held to the fire with that.

LEMON: You are saying the buck stops with him, as he would say as well.

Ana, is it possible a year from now the Web site works fine and more people are going to be insured as the rollout won't look as bad or whatever? Is this going to go down as read my lips, no new taxes or I'm not a crook or what do you think?

ANA NAVARRO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Or as Bill Clinton would say, that depend on your definition if you like your plan, you can keep your plan.

Look, we don't know. And at this point, there's no reason to have any credibility because we have seen one misrepresentation after the other. And really, I think what you are seeing is a result of a great deal of stubbornness and I would even say arrogance by the administration and the White House of not wanting to delay the launch. It would have been, yes, a small problem politically at the time, but it would have been relatively smaller than what they are facing right now, which is their signature plan is losing credibility in the eyes of the American people, of most people. I think it's going to continue to be a problem in the long term because, remember, Don, the corporate mandate was delayed by a year.

LEMON: Right. Right.

NAVARRO: So, in a year's time, you are going to hear a lot of people who are going to have been dropped from their insurance, who are, whose employers decide to play the fine and drop them into the exchange who don't want to be dropped on the exchange and they are going to be mad, too. So, I think the complaints on this are going to be long and there are going to be several.

LEMON: But let's get some -- because I'm going to take a break, then we come back. But just -- I want to get some truth though when it comes to dropping the whole insurance. Insurance companies drop people every single year. This is nothing new. Do you think people are using it to make political points?

NAVARRO: No, I think when you get dropped by your insurance company, you can go and you can look for similar policies. I think people are mad at the fact that it feels like big brother is watching, like big government is telling you what you must do. And that cuts against the grain of the American people.

LEMON: OK. Go ahead, Lz.

GRANDERSON: I was going to say, that's the real issue. It's not that, you know, what the president is involved with the something devious. I mean, insurance that people complaining because they are paying for things they wouldn't necessarily use. We knew that anyway of our insurances. When people complain about the fed that the government quote-unquote is making them buy insurance, you try to buy a car without insurance, you try to buy a home without insurance, it cannot happen.

So, these are elements of every day society we are not really used to. This is president set it up with his dialogue, with his rhetoric in such a way that made it sound way more pretty heavy than when it needed to. He just needed to be up front with us. I think there are plenty of people who are going to be around in here from now that is going to say thank God I have Affordable Care Act. That story might be out there as well. But this part a blemish on his record.

LEMON: Yes. You try to buy anything without insurance. I think some, for insurance, you can't do it. You cannot do it. There are huge penalties.

NAVARRO: The people that have these insurances that have been canceled are people that have made the choice to buy insurance and have looked into it.

LEMON: I got you. I feel what you are putting down.

OK. So, Ana and Lz, stick around because I want to talk to you about something else, another subject. And it is something that about the alleged abuse, the bullying and inside the NFL. We'll talk about that, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK, CNN commentators Lz Granderson and Ana Navarro are back right now.

Let's move beyond politics and talk about sports and society. Everybody is talking about the alleged bullying and abuse inside the Miami Dolphin's locker room. Their offensive lineman, Richie Incognito, number 68 in that photo got suspended from the team indefinitely, not long after fellow second year lineman Jonathan Martin, number 71, abruptly left the team last week.

There are multiple reports that Incognito and they be even other Dolphins players were trying to, quote, "toughen up Martin" and maybe the coaches asked Incognito to toughen up Martin.

OK. So, Lz, you write this week that this idea of making Martin tough or telling him to man up, to use the phrase is dangerous. Why is it dangerous?

GRANDERSON: Because it inquires us or asks man to dehumanize ourselves more and more. You know, for all the reports that have gone out there and I talked to other players, current players who is played with Martin, who know Martin, they all tell me that he is a very cerebral, he is a very (INAUDIBLE) kind of person, but he is also a very, very good football player to protect his quarterback (INAUDIBLE) while he was at Stanford.

So, we are not talking a soft individual in terms of his actual play on the field, we are talking someone whose personality may not necessarily be what other guys want it to be. In this notion of manning up, this notion of this is the way football players are supposed to act, where all he does is really inquires us to detach our emotions, detach our feelings and detach our hearts, make it more difficult for us to empathize and make it less, less more likely that would be to recognize when someone is in trouble when emotional and mental level.

LEMON: I did very similar commentary that I wrote for (INAUDIBLE). Basically, we are saying the same thing here Lz because you write that the phrase, man up, is only used in certain situations. In your words, it never win where suppressing sensitivity. It's only when we express a lack of connection with our feelings, hurts our ability empathize. And if we can't feel with others, how can we truly feel for others? And I think it is pretty self-explanatory. And it's not just in football. Everyone is like you need to man up. What? Men don't have emotions?

GRANDERSON: You know, there's so much more wrap into it. There is massage reference to it and homophobia wrap it to it. And it doesn't just have to deal with women and gay men. The kind of restraints that we put on heterosexual man in order to behave at certain way is not fair as well. And so, everyone is touched by this notion of manning up, this notion of this is the way a man is supposed to act. It doesn't just deal with the language around women. It's not just using gay slurs if you don't act in certain way. It is about also attacking a heterosexual man who doesn't want to hang out at strip clubs all night long. That doesn't make him less of a man who may not want to get into a fist fight result or conflict in their life. That doesn't make them less of man either. But because of this notion that this is the free dedicated way in which a man is supposed to behave, it forces, even heterosexual men to behave a way they don't feel comfortable behaving with it as well.

LEMON: Ana has a big smile on her face agreeing with Lz.

NAVARRO: I'm just thinking, I pity the fool who tells Lz Granderson to man up. That would not be a good picture.

LEMON: You live in Miami. I was in Miami a day before yesterday and everybody is talking about it. What are your thoughts on it?

NAVARRO: I think it is pathetic. I think it is embarrassing. Frankly, as a Miami and who has lived in Miami since 1980, it hurts me deeply to see what Steve Ross, the owner of the Miami Dolphins has done to (INAUDIBLE) team. I never imagine, just cannot imagine that this would have ever gone on in a Don Schuler locker room.

So, I would say to Steve Ross, the owner of the Dolphins, you are the one who needs to man up. You are the one that goes needs to go into that locker room, explain the buck stops with you. You are the one that needs to put the standards, set the standards, set the tone of what the Miami Dolphins should be like.

We have lost the people like Dan Merino. We have lots the people that were part of the community that were role models. That is what folks expect. That's why good football. They expect more in a community. And Steve Ross needs to stop asking me to pay for his roof on the stadium. Stop going after the legislatures who did not vote for it and start getting control of his football team, which is obvious to the entire country, he is not in control of.

LEMON: Yes. But you know, it's hard, guys, for people to understand especially when you are in a rough and tumble sport like, you know, football professional NFL that you can have this big guy and they think the way to deal with that it has become a bully himself. He was actually standing up for himself. He went to the right people and he said listen, I'm having trouble and then he left the team. That's actually standing up for yourself.

NAVARRO: And guess what, this is going to get -- it sounds to me like this could get very complicated and very expensive. There's going to be lawyers involved soon enough. If the allegations that the coaches had been the ones asking Incognito to toughen him up, this could get very expensive for the Miami Dolphins and very, very embarrassing.

LEMON: I have to run, guys. But this is probably, people should realize that the football field, the baseball diamond, the basketball court, even the locker room are workplaces and you have certain rules in work places and you cannot harass people regardless of where it is.

Thank you, guys. Appreciate it. See you soon. I will see you tomorrow. All right, news just into CNN, a 5.5 magnitude earthquake struck 25 miles northeast of Tokyo, Japan. The Japanese meteorological agency says was 37 miles deep. There are no fears of a tsunami and no tsunami warning has been issued. Witnesses in Tokyo say they felt some shaking, but there is no visible damage to the city. We'll keep you updated on that.

And let me update you now on the overwhelming recovery work that is just starting in the Philippines.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYING)

LEMON: A monster typhoon that is a pacific hurricane as big as Germany and triple the power of hurricane Katrina, storm shredded the island of the Philippines leading an estimated fault 100 people dead. About 350,000 people have no homes today across the country. The typhoon either tore those homes to pieces or wiped them out altogether. Eight agencies are mobilizing to help the victims of the typhoon. To find out how you can help, go to CNN.com/impact.

Next, a CNN Special Report you don't want to miss. The business of pot. Legal marijuana is the fastest growing industry in the U.S. billions of dollars it could bring in. The tax money that could be earned and the alcohol industry's biggest nightmare. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Welcome everyone.

First, I really want your feedback on this half hour special report that we are going to do. Go to @deonlemoncnn on Twitter and weigh in.

We are talking legal marijuana. Among the fastest growing industry in the U.S. It is out-phasing many technology and manufacturing sectors. The legal marijuana market is an industry with sky high potential. This year, U.S. sales of legal marijuana may be worth an estimated $1.5 billion. Next year, $3 billion. That's a 100 percent increase. That is serious money. And we are just -- we are just talking legal pot here. One economist estimates total spending on marijuana, legal and illegal sales could add up to anywhere from $45 billion to $110 billion a year. That's a possible gold mine.

In the next 30 minutes, you are going to hear from people who want to turn it into a reality. Here is why they think it's possible. In 1970, pot was illegal in every state. But look where we are today. Two states have legalized marijuana, Colorado and Washington. But many others have either legalized medical marijuana or decriminalized possession. But then, so investors are taking notice in trying to figure out how to make a different kind of green here -- money.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come January 1, we are entering a new era in Colorado. And we are going to be the test case for the rest of the nation and the world. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are seeing serious business money come in, Wall Street kind of money and corporate money and, you know, investment bankers. You know, of course, they weren't going to touch an industry like this even three years ago.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: And we hit a real tipping point last month. For the first time, more than half Americans told a Gallup poll that they think marijuana should be legalized. That is a 10 percent increase from just a year ago. It is a perfect pot storm growing accepted in a multibillion market out there waiting for the laws to catch up.

So, let's break it down. Let's break down the legal marijuana business with our guests. Steve DeAngelo is the president of Arc View Investor Network and a long time marijuana activist. He joins us via Skype. And then there is Jamen Shively, he is a former manager at Microsoft and the co-founder of Diego, a company aiming to be the Starbucks of pot. That is very interesting. I think you are going to be a very wealthy man. I'll tell you why in a minute. He joins us from Seattle. And then Kevin Sabet, he opposes legal pot. Kevin and I have spoken about this a number of times. We are getting to be old friends. And he worked as the drug policy advisor for the Obama, Bush and Clinton administrations.

Kevin, we have been doing this for quite a long time. I have been talking to you for about five years. He also wrote the book called "Reefer Sanity." He says he is not hearing anything and he joins us from San Francisco.

Jamen, first to you, you said pot will mint more millionaires than Microsoft. How do you think it will happen?

JAMEN SHIVELY, CO-FOUNDER, CEO, DIEGO PELLICER INC: Well, first of all, just look at the size of the industry. It's a multi-hundred billion dollar industry worldwide currently under a global regime of prohibition per the United Nations 1961 single convention treaty to which virtually every country in the world is a signatory, notable exceptions that just (INAUDIBLE) exist. And those actually point to the key to why prohibition is coming to an end a lot quicker than most people think.

LEMON: So then, what do we do with all the people who have been arrested for growing small amounts of marijuana or have you -- just, you know, I knew someone from one of my neighbors, this is quite honestly, in Atlanta last year was arrested and sent to jail for growing marijuana in his home. And just after that, there were many places or a number of places around the country that legalized it or legalized medical marijuana. What do you do with those people, Jamen?

SHIVELY: It's very simple. And the answer is very simple. There's a heck of a lot behind it, OK. But the answer -- and we need much more than a half hour to discuss why. But the answer is amnesty. And it's general amnesty all the way to the heads of the drug cartels in Mexico. And President Fox and I are exploring a model for Mexico, specifically for this. We'll entering the discussions in Columbia and other countries soon that general amnesty is actually the best solution as long as they lay down their arms and we end this drug war, then general amnesty will be the reward for those who choose peace. So, it has to be international across the board. If it's for possession of cannabis, amnesty.

LEMON: OK. So, Steve, listen. Who is going to back you? In the eyes of the fed, this is still illegal. Where will the money come from?

STEVE DEANGELO, PRESIDENT, ARC VIEW INVENTOR NETWORK: The Arc View group which we started three years ago. In our early years, we saw mostly cannabis insiders who were interested in other businesses in the industry. More and more, we are seeing investors, within lifelong investors, in some cases, they are just high net worth individuals and some cases, funds have been created specifically to invest in the cannabis industry.

LEMON: Are you in it for the weed or are you in it for the money?

DEANGELO: I have been doing this for 40 years. I fell in love with the cannabis plant and learned of its benefits. And my life's mission is to bring the truth about this plant to the world. I have spent more money doing activism than I will ever make on cannabis.

LEMON: OK. So, Jamen, if pot was made legal tomorrow -- can you hear me? He can't hear us. Kevin can't hear us. If pot was made legal, how long would it take before there's a marijuana store on every corner? Like you said, you want to be the Starbucks of marijuana.

SHIVELY: Look, I know you are speaking figuratively when you say on every corner because we will certainly never going to get that point. But if you want to talk about the level of --

LEMON: I disagree with you. I disagree with you. I think we will get to a point -- I think it will be -- we will get to a point with cannabis where it will be like alcohol. Like there will be a bar or someplace where you can go, a liquor store where you can find it on just about every corner. I have been saying it for five years here on CNN. A lot of people get upset with me. But I think that the way we look at marijuana, especially the reporting of it in the news industry is parochial 1950s and where the reality doesn't stack up. So, I disagree. I think there will be a day where marijuana will be similar to alcohol in this country.

SHIVELY: I would agree with that statement. And so, to reach -- to answer your question, to reach market saturation, I would say probably a good 24 months.

LEMON: Good 24 months before saturation? That soon?

SHIVELY: Well, look, when I say saturation, I really mean 80 percent, 90 percent. The saturation is the theoretical limit that's never reached. But Yes, it will be that soon. The stuff grows like a weed. There is a reason you call it weed. It is a weed. It grows like a weed. And the thing is, when I make the statement of what we can achieve in the next 24 months, I want you to keep in mind that I'm standing on the shoulders of giants and I'm honored to be on the same show as Steve Deangelo, who is the giant, who is let our industry up to this point.

We now have a platform on which we can expand very, very quickly responsively with regulation. But at the same time quickly. Because the sooner that we end the war on drugs, the sooner 40 innocent Mexicans a day stop getting executed. And that's just the beginning. That's Mexico. All countries in the world are suffering from prohibition.

LEMON: I think it is going take a good five to ten years before it starts to go the way of alcohol. But it is on that road.

Listen, Kevin who is not pro-marijuana, we are going to get him in after the break. We are having a bit of a technical issue here. We will make sure we got that voice in as well.

So stand by, everyone. One of the rallying cries of the marijuana advocate, it's really been, think of the tax money it will raise. States like Colorado hoping to tax it will be a way to fill up government coffers. But, can cities and states make big money taxes marijuana? We'll look at the numbers with our panel, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right, I appreciate all your responses on social media, @donlemoncnn if you want to weigh in on this. So, let's be honest. State governments are scrub. And some see legalize pot and revenue from potential taxes as a chance to get desperately need cash. And we are talking millions of bucks here. Some pot entrepreneurs say, go ahead, tax us. Be our guest. Just make selling marijuana legal.

This week, Colorado voters overwhelmingly approved a measure to impose a hefty tax on recreational marijuana. Let's talk about pros and cons of taxing marijuana with our panel. Steve DeAngelo, Jamen Shively and Kevin Sabet.

Kevin, you co-founded the group opposing the commercialization of pot, we are having a technical issue but we want to get you in here, along with the former congressman (INAUDIBLE) and you oppose that. Do you think governments may end up losing money if they have to pay more for things like drug abuse counseling or enforcing legal marijuana laws?

KEVIN SABET, DIRECTOR, SMART APPROACHES TO MARIJUANA: Yes, I mean, the issue is we are on the brink of creating, you know, today, big tobacco. We are talking about a multimillion dollar investors. You have two men who dedicated themselves to creating a multibillion dollar marijuana industry. I think, you know, a lot of people that wanted to legalize in the '70s or even now, they think of legalization is sounds like you said, Don. You know, my neighbor who grew a little bit doesn't go to jail or, you know, a small amount, I don't go to jail. That has nothing to do really with modern legalization. Today, legalization is about big money and big profit. And I will be at the expense of young people, just like big tobacco was. So, I would tell everybody that we are now looking at big tobacco today.

And for every dollar we get in alcohol or tobacco tax, we spend ten in social pot. So, you know, good luck with the idea of government trying to get money.

LEMON: Kevin?

SABET: Yes. Yes.

LEMON: Kevin? Kevin? Lottery is legal though. Alcohol is legal. People have worse issues with alcohol, the studies show than with marijuana. Listen. People alcoholic, drunk people are more rowdy, they cause more trouble than people who smoke marijuana.

SABET: Here is the issue, first of all --

LEMON: What's the deal? Why --

SABET: Well, the deal is it's an example of a legal addictive product. Alcohol and marijuana are almost equally addictive according to NIH. For secondly, the lottery is legal, you are right. And the lottery was sold for basically to fund public education, right? That's why states went ahead and legalized the lottery.

Well, how is that going for us? Have you solved our public education problem because of all the revenue? Of course not. The point is we are always going to be sold the sort of magical item whether it be marijuana now, the lottery in the past, alcohol and tobacco as a savior for our public budget. And the math never, ever adds up. So yes, alcohol is extremely harmful --

LEMON: OK, but --

SABET: It causes car crashes and hundreds of thousands of deaths. But marijuana is, too. And the study actually show that those who are heavy drinkers of alcohol and heavy marijuana users use them in complements --.

LEMON: I don't know if the Nih study really shows what you are saying because I don't know anyone --. I have never had a study that says marijuana is addictive. But here is the thing.

SABET: Oh, don, American medical association -- hold on. The American medical association, American society of addiction medicine, every major medical association, including the mayo clinic says marijuana can be addictive.

LEMON: Can be. Can be. Can be, but I don't know if there is enough evidence to show it is. There is no denying alcohol is an addictive substance. Tobacco is an addictive. It doesn't say alcohol can be addictive. It doesn't say that nicotine can be addictive. It says it is addictive. So, (INAUDIBLE). So, here is what I'm saying. If you talk about -- hold on. Hold on. I want to go to another point. If you talk about -- if you talk about lotteries and you go to states and you go to municipalities and you go to cities, even here in New York, you talk about tobacco, the tax on tobacco, the tax on the lottery system, the tax on Powerball, you ask those people if they want to make it illegal, if they want to make those things illegal and take away the tax base. You know, what those people will tell you, heck no, we don't want to do it.

SABET: The point is, these have been promised as saviors for public budgets and it is a wonderful argument for marijuana. The point is, it's not going to work with our history. We are on the brink of creating the new big tobacco. I could care a less, Don, if your neighbor or (inaudible) in prison. And frankly, those with the small amount are not being lock up.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: I have to get to a break. I'm not cutting you off. But I have to get to a break, seriously and then we will continue this. It is not about that. It's just about a double standard. That's what I'm trying to bring to light.

So, stand by. We'll talk more on the other side of the break. You have heard the argument. Pot isn't as bad as alcohol. I say that. A lot of people might be nodding their heads right now. But you know who isn't? Budweiser, Miller, PVR.

Panel stay there, we are going to talk about the beer industry. It has spoken out about pot and they are not happy. You want to hear this next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Thank you, everyone for your feedback on twitter @donlemoncnn. Every time we do this subject, I have been doing it now for five, six years. My twitter time line goes crazy.

Some say legal marijuana is the alcohol industry's biggest nightmare. Americans spent about $162 billion on beer, wine and liquor in 2011. I want to show you this CNN interactive graph from last night, OK? It compares mentions of get drunk and get high on facebook.

Apparently, 53 percent of the get drunk mentions are from women and the get high mentions, men take the lead with 54 percent. Now, I want you to look at this. The gender split is even, more pronounced when you compare the words marijuana and alcohol. Fifty-nine percent of alcohol mentioned were female, 60 percent of marijuana mentioned were male.

So, here is the panel right now. Jamen is back.

Jamen, listen. Should the alcohol industry worry about losing men to legal marijuana sales?

SHIVELY: Absolutely. We are going to have a devastating impact on alcohol. Can you hear me now?

LEMON: Go ahead. That's someone else. We are having all kinds of crazy issues.

SHIVELY: OK, great. So, the cannabis industry is going to have a devastating impact on revenues for the alcohol industry and for good reason. I used to drink probably an average of two or three, you know, beers or equivalent per day. Now I'm down to, you know, perhaps one beer once every couple weeks or so. I sleep much better. I'm much healthier. I think much better. I have much better creativity and I'm much, much happier. People are discovering that cannabis is a brilliant substitute for alcohol.

LEMON: Steve, are you there? Can Steve hear me? He can't hear me. OK.

So, I'm going to move on.

So, Kevin, listen. Some alcohol lobbyists believe it's totally unfair to compare alcohol to pot and the marijuana industry is picking on the booze industry. I mean, do you believe that?

SABET: Well, I think both industries really are not as good for America. We know from data that heavy drinkers can be heavy marijuana smokers. People are compliment -- in other words, marijuana and alcohol are compliments among people in treatment, among heavier users. And that is really I think what's important.

So yes, I mean, right now, there is this very strange, I think, logic of saying, you know, alcohol is more dangerous yet, you know, than marijuana, yet marijuana is the one that is illegal. Well, that's no good. I mean that's like saying, you know, my headlight is broken and to be, you know, consistent let's break the taillight, too as oppose, you know, fix the headlight. Alcohol does cause a lot of problems namely because it --

LEMON: Could it be that you are looking at -- could it be, Kevin, that you are looking at the negative instead of the positive when it come to this? And I can see, Jamen is like really wants to come in. So, listen. Hold on. We will take another break. I'm going to read comments -- hang on. I'm going to read some of the comment on social media and then we will talk to you guys, right after this quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right. So, I want to bring back my panel now, Steve DeAngelo, Jamen Shively and Kevin Sabet.

So Steve, first to you, people have tried to guess what kind of money this new legal pot industry will pull down. But, if instead of back allies, if pot can be sold in corner stores, will this impact people who may have never bought marijuana?

DEANGELO: Well, yes, it's certainly impacting people who never bought marijuana in their lives. In Oakland, which is had a cannabis tax for the past three years, (INAUDIBLE) health center, the dispensary and director is the second largest retail taxpayer in the city. We pay for the salaries of, you know, well over a dozen cops and teachers every year.

LEMON: Yes.

I wonder, Kevin, though, if we are looking at this, like marijuana and pot through the same eyes. And maybe we shouldn't because by all accounts, I'm just being honest. I'm just giving you the research here as a journalist. Alcohol is much worse for you than marijuana. So, maybe there shouldn't be a comparison and maybe that's why there's a negativity when it comes to marijuana.

SABET: Well, the question is, worse compared to what? And when it comes to I.Q. for young people, actually marijuana is worse than alcohol. When it comes to violence, alcohol is worse. So, why is one worse than the other? The point is, alcohol's legality is here to stay for cultural reasons. Why do we want to create the new big tobacco and a new alcohol industry now in the name of marijuana? Because that is exactly what is going to happen if we go down this.

LEMON: But what is the best way to keep it from young people, is to regulate it, would be to regulate it and make it legal? And then, so, you have to show an ID if you want to go into liquor store. If you are not 18 you can't buy it.

SHIVELY: Yes. How is that working?

SABET: Right, Don. Yes. How is that working for alcohol today? Kids aren't getting those drugs? Though, the point is, kids drink a lot more than they smoke marijuana because it's normalized, available and accessible. That doesn't mean kids can't get pot today. Of course, they can.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Go ahead, Steve. Go ahead, Steve.

DEANGELO: We don't have to guess about this. In the first five states that legalized cannabis for medical purposes, after five years, the rate of young people's arrest from impaired driving and young people's suicide went down between eight and 11 percent. Yes, young people do substitute cannabis for alcohol and yes --

LEMON: OK. Jamen, I have just a few seconds left. I will give you the final thought, Jamen. Go ahead.

SHIVELY: Yes, sure. First of all, I want to announce to those who haven't -- who don't know yet, prohibition is over. The herb land legal experts have done an extensive analysis and they have determined that they cannot simultaneously uphold their U.N. treaty obligations for human rights and prohibition. All countries in the world have a choice. Either you uphold human rights or prohibition which gets you nothing but more human rights. The answer is very clear. For more details go to howtochangetheworld.org. Prohibition is over. LEMON: OK. Thanks to all of you. We really appreciate it. And the best -- I wanted to read more on social media here. But the best one, I say this, Don, you and your panel should smoke a joint and talk about it. That was hilarious.

Thank you guys. Appreciate it. We will do it again.

I'm Don Lemon in New York. If news breaks, make sure you turn to CNN.

Stay tuned for CNN's "Inside Man" begins right now.