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Sources To CNN: Reid Will Likely Launch "Nuclear Option" On Filibusters Today; Korean War Vet Detained On Tour In North Korea; Stranded Jet To Attempt Takeoff; New Jersey's Christie Takes National Stage As Head Of Republican Governors Group

Aired November 21, 2013 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, first of all, we should say that it looks like it is all but certain that it is going to work. But because this is the Senate, and because deals are sometimes struck at the last minute or plans change at the last minute, it could change.

I was just told before coming on air with you that when the Senate convenes in half an hour that senators were asked to come to the floor to prepare for this vote, which could be an historic vote. And why this matters? It certainly sounds like maybe a process that people might not care about, but they should care.

As you said, this is about a very partisan place that could get even more divided and divisive, if you can even imagine that. The reason why, Harry Reid, the Democratic leader is making moves to make a change in the rules is because of frustration that, Republicans have been holding up the president's nominees. The straw that broke the camel's back is the fact that Republicans have been blocking three nominees to fill vacancies in a D.C. Circuit Court.

The reason Republicans are doing that is not because of the ideology, John, of these -- or even the qualifications of these particular judges. It's because they are concerned about stacking this court because it is currently evenly split. Pretty much evenly split between judges appointed by a Democratic president, judges who are appointed by a Republican president and they don't want to rock that boat.

It's certainly not the only reason Democrats are making this move but certainly is one of the most recent reasons. When I say "this move," it is to prevent Republicans from using the filibuster in a way that we have seen so many times. Right now, a filibuster needs 60 votes to overcome. And what this rule change would do would be to make it a simple majority, 51 votes. It would make the Democrats life a whole lot easier right now because they have a 55-vote majority.

The reason it's not done every time the Senate changes hands is because everybody has sort of tended to realize that they could be in the minority the next time around and there is a respect for that and respect for institution that the whole idea of it is to give the minority rights that they don't have in any other particular institution. JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, CNN's chief congressional correspondent, Dana Bash, thanks so much. As Dana said, this could happen at 10:30. So we will likely come back to Dana in a little bit because this could be history making. It sounds complicated, but the important thing to remember is it could change the already caustic situation in Washington to something even more caustic.

Joining me now to talk about all this is Gloria Marshall Brown. She is a constitutional law professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice. Good morning, Gloria. Thank you for joining us. I'm intrigued by the fact that you're a constitutional law professor because I'll ask you a trick question here. What does the constitution say about the so-called nuclear option to the current Senate rules?

GLORIA BROWN MARSHALL, CONSTITUTIONAL LAW PROFESSOR (via telephone): Believe it or not, in 1787, the framers didn't use the phrase nuclear option. They did have a device within the constitution, Article II, Section II Clause II, gives the president the power to nominate judges. However, it also -- put that power in this perspective. They would seek -- the president would seek the advice and consent of the Senate.

So therefore, time being what it is and the interpretations being what they are, it's been decided that this filibuster option, not in the constitution, has been created through rules of the senate to limit the presidential power in presenting those nominations. And, therefore, the Senate is supposed to based on the interpretation over time, give its advice and, therefore, if the advice is not what the president wants, it can halt nominations to be judges.

BERMAN: Gloria Brown-Marshall, it's tradition that's developed over the past 200 years to have this filibuster possibility in what the Senate majority leader might finally be willing to do is to remove that, advice and consent, to make it something that can happen with just a majority. Do you think this would somehow alter the power balance between the legislative and executive branch?

MARSHALL: That's a struggle that's been taking place well over 100 years. Henry Clay in the 1800s, during that time period of Woodrow Wilson and others, World War II that issue was whether or not the president was able to push through certain legislation the president felt was need. What it comes down to with these particular judges -- also, we have to keep in mind these judges for the D.C. Circuit are just a hair's breathe from the U.S. Supreme Court. This political argument has a long history of the struggle for political power.

And when the minority can use whatever options it has, then it's done so overtime. And I think that putting -- not just stacking the deck. I think it's also putting these people, these judges, very well qualified judges, in line to be U.S. Supreme Court judges. It's almost a pre-emptive strike versus the nuclear strike.

So the minority is trying to halt what they see is going to be an elevation of one of these three judges, all of whom are African- American, to the U.S. Supreme Court possibly during the second term of the president.

BERMAN: As you say, there are major stakes for all three branches of the U.S. government right now. You have a sense of history, U.S. history, and constitutional history. Is it your sense right now that the situation, the ire, the kind of caustic nature, that it's worse in Washington?

MARSHALL: I would say that it's not worse. I think that it comes like a roller coaster. You have certain peaks of animosity. This is one of those times in history. We'll look back on this 10 to 15 years from now. Look back during the time period leading into World War II and say, yes, this is a caustic time in history. If not more caustic, it is caustic. When those peak times happen, we wonder how our government will survive.

We need to know based on legal history, based on constitutional interpretation we will find a way. That's one of the marvelous things about our constitution and about the American spirit. Yes, we come to loggerheads, but it will resolve itself in probably one of the most unique ways possible. If this happens with the rule change today, it doesn't mean it will set in stone. As we can see, history five, ten years from now, it could be changed again.

BERMAN: Interesting as you say it's a roller coaster and not something permanent. It could make it particularly risky to change the conditions and rules now. Constitution law professor, Gloria Brown Marshall, thanks so much for being with us on this subject.

MARSHALL: Thank you.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: Another story we're following this morning, 85-year-old Korean War veteran has been detained in North Korea for almost a month now. Merrill Newman's son was on the plane home just moments away from leaving Pyongyang after visiting as a tourist when North Korean authorities hauled him away. The family has not heard from him since. His son spoke to our Anderson Cooper about why his father traveled there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEFF NEWMAN, FATHER DETAINED IN NORTH KOREA (via telephone): A couple of things. He's a curious cat and has had a long-standing and tremendously respectful interest in the Korean culture and the Korean people. And like the World War II vets who have had an interest in going back to Normandy, my dad, a veteran of the Korean conflict, wanted to go back to the northern part of the peninsula. He had been to the southern part of the peninsula before. And this was a lifelong dream of his.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: CNN's Jill Dougherty is at the State Department for us this morning. What do we know about his whereabouts? We know that the State Department says they're aware of the situation.

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: But they're not saying too much more, Christine. There's a reason because this is extremely delicate diplomatically. The North hasn't officially said that they are holding him. There's no detail exactly where he is and the official reasons. Why are they doing it are not clear. We do know he did all of the things that are correct. He went on an official tour. He had the right visa, according to his family. Everything was fine.

He goes, having a good time. Then it appears, according to his son, at the very end, officials from North Korea talked to him and it was not apparently a pleasant conversation. And then the next day when he was about to leave, as you said, they go on the plane, asked for his passport. Take him off and that's more than three weeks ago.

So right now, there are no relations between North Korea and the United States. The U.S. has to work through the Swedish diplomats. And they are working that. But there is real concern, because he is 85. He does have a heart problem. The family has given some medication through the Swedes, hoping it will get to him. There's no guarantee at this point.

ROMANS: So you've been to North Korea. Why do you think something like this could have happened? We know there's a history of this kind of stuff before with other countries, citizens. What happens from here?

DOUGHERTY: You know, I think -- I think and, of course, this is speculation, but anybody, let's say, who has fought against the North, even if it was a very long time ago during the Korean War, let's say that he had said something about fighting in the war. Some bureaucrat or person might take that as an attack on the nation, against North Korea. He is an enemy.

Also he apparently was studying Korean before he went. He wanted to be able to speak to people. That's also a red line because I can tell you, once when we traveled, there was a producer who spoke Korean who is not allowed to go. Both of those, putting both of those together with a paranoid mind, you might say he is a spy. That's entirely possible for the thinking that's going on, again, my speculation.

Don't forget just before this became public, there was a very serious warning from the State Department. Probably the most serious that I've seen about arbitrary arrests of Americans, warning Americans that even with the right credentials, et cetera, something can happen. So at this point, it's just a big effort to hopefully get him out. As his son said, that this is a misunderstanding, as they interpret it, and they want him home.

ROMANS: Jill Dougherty in Washington, thank you, Jill.

BERMAN: All right, still to come for us, Wichita, we have a problem. A huge plane stuck at a tiny airport.

ROMANS: We'll tell you how it ended up there and when they're going to get this big boat back in the air.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BERMAN: Welcome back, everyone. New this morning, officials now say a jumbo jet stranded overnight at a Wichita, Kansas Airport will be able to take off. This strange debacle started late last night when a massive cargo plane headed for a military based landed at a very small airport instead.

ROMANS: The Atlas 747 Dreamlifter was headed to McConnell Air Force Base, but ended up just shy, 10 miles way at the much smaller Jabara Airport. The FAA is now investigating.

BERMAN: Now officials had feared that the run way in Jabara was too short for the Dreamlifter to take off, but now officials tell CNN the plane will attempt to depart later today.

ROMANS: CNN correspondent Rene Marsh is following the story for us. Rene, how did this happen?

RENE MARSH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That is the big question this morning. Good morning, Christine and John. Major confusion in the cockpit and a huge embarrassment for these pilots. We don't know how it happened or even why at this point. That's what the FAA is trying to figure out. But listening to the pilots' conversation with the control tower, it is so clear that when they land they're not quite sure where they are. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED AIR CONTROLLER: Giant 4241 heavy, do you know which airport you're at?

UNIDENTIFIED PILOT: Well, we think we have a pretty good --

UNIDENTIFIED AIR CONTROLLER: Have you, roger. It appears that you are at Jabara --

UNIDENTIFIED PILOT: Say again.

UNIDENTIFIED AIR CONTROLLER: Giant 4241 heavy, it appears that you are at Jabara Airport.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MARSH: All right, well, the runway at Jabara Airport is reportedly half the length of the destination airport's runway and runway length is critical because of the load that this sort of plane is capable of carrying, up to a million pounds on takeoff. To get the lift that you need on that kind of plane, you need ample space on the runway. We should note, we're not quite sure how much cargo was on board that plane.

ROMANS: Long division trying to figure out if the size of plane can make it for the short length of the airport. They'll do a try-out later today. Rene Marsh, thanks.

BERMAN: This just in. Senators have been asked to come to the senate floor at 10:30. They've been asked to come and be ready to debate a likely vote on the so-called nuclear option. This would be a move that would prevent Republicans from blocking most of the president's nominees. Democrats would be able to get these nominees through with a simple majority vote not a filibuster proof majority.

Dana Bash is hearing from a couple of senators right now that Senate Majority Harry Reid might not put it to a vote today, but he will at least start the debate today on the so-called nuclear option. Whatever way, it is still an historic today in the Senate. Stay with us for that.

ROMANS: Still to come, Chris Christie will soon be back on the campaign trail as he tries to help his fellow Republican governors win their elections.

ROMANS: But will Christie's action help his own potential White House bid in a few years? We'll talk about this coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: All right, Republican governors gathering today kicking off with a helpful path to victory in next year's gubernatorial elections. Leading the group, New Jersey Governor Chris Christie, who becomes the leader of the Republican Governors Association this afternoon.

BERMAN: And there's talk about Christie's ambitions outside New Jersey continues, the governor insists he's taking his political future one year at a time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOVERNOR CHRIS CHRISTIE, NEW JERSEY: Great response from both donors and from my fellow governors. I'm looking forward to it. It's going to be a great year. Thirty six races will be fun.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: All right, CNN national political reporter, Peter Hamby is in Arizona for us this morning. Peter, this really feels like the next stop on the big Chris Christie publicity tour.

PETER HAMBY, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes, it really does, John. Look, Christie and his team, as he mentions, insists this is about 2014. As long as he and his fellow Republican governors do good in the midterm, the rest will take shape. Rick Perry has won the RGA twice. Now Christie gets to travel the country, campaign for Republican governors around the country.

Importantly, meet with major financial supporters and donors of the Republican Party, a resource he can tap later if he does choose to run for president and this is a high-profile gig. He will be on TV all over the country throughout the next year. It's only going to boost his already major profile done.

ROMANS: We've shown some of the places where he's going to be and they get pretty important in the months ahead.

BERMAN: Iowa, South Carolina.

ROMANS: South Carolina.

HAMBY: It's a really convenient thing for Christie. A governor's race that's competitive in Iowa, the first caucus state. There's potentially competitive race in South Carolina, the first in the south primary state and then big battleground states like Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida, all of these have signature gubernatorial races next year. Christie will be able to show up in these places, raise money. This will be a good year for him, guys.

ROMANS: All the while he can remain coy an whether he's running and just say he's doing the work of the Republican Governors Association.

BERMAN: I don't know how coy he is anymore. All right, Peter Hamby for us in Arizona. Great to see you, Peter. Thank you so much.

ROMANS: All right, still to come, a live report from Capitol Hill where senators are gathering right now for an historic vote that could conduct the way the upper chamber conducts its business.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ROMANS: It's 28 minutes after the hour. Happening right now, senators headed to the Senate floor to debate the nuclear option. Senate Democrats frustrated over what some say is the abuse of filibusters by Republicans. They're ready to pull the trigger and change the rules.

BERMAN: Sources telling CNN that Majority Leader Harry Reid is launching at least debate on the option today. This is a move that could have an impact on whatever party's in the minority. This honestly could have a huge impact on the way business is done, period, in Washington. Let's bring in CNN's chief congressional correspondent, Dana Bash on Capitol Hill right now. Dana, give us the latest.

BASH: Well, we're waiting for the Senate to convene. That should be happening any minute now. And when it does, we are going to certainly be listening to what the Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid does, what his move is going to be. I've been told by some Democratic senators that they have been asked to come to the floor to prepare for a debate on what you just described, what is known around here as the nuclear option.

And the reason it is called nuclear is because it is something that could explode when it comes to any kind of comedy, any kind of across- the-aisle discussion and negotiation on pretty much everything around here. And the reason is this. In the United States Senate, minority rights are considered pretty important because each party knows that at various times they're in the majority, they're in the minority.

Right now, Democrats say that they are fed up. Most recently because of the fact that Republicans have been blocking the president's nominees to the D.C. Circuit and Democrats say it's simply unfair for them to do that. So what we are likely to see today is Harry Reid, the Democratic leader, at least make a move to have a discussion about changing the rules so that Republicans don't have a 60-vote threshold that Democrats would have to overcome to break that filibuster, but rather a 51-vote simple majority.

Right now the way the balance of power in the senate is that Democrats have that. They have 55 votes. We're just talking about the president's nominees for the executive branch, for judges except not the Supreme Court. And those are the rules that they're talking about changing. Republicans are bracing for it.

The top two Senate Republicans just went onto the Senate floor. Our Senate producer Ted Barrett saw them, talked to John Cornyn, the number two Senate Republican, who said they do think Democrats are going to push this. They think it's unfortunate. They argue that Democrats are not accurate, that these times are not different than before, that Republicans are not holding up presidential appointments anymore than Democrats did when President Bush, for example, was in the White House.