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Chinese Satellite Spots Floating Object; Battery Life Dropping For Locator Beacon; Searching For Signs Of Flight 370; Families Could Bring Legal Claims To Court; Russian Troops Wait On Ukrainian Border

Aired March 22, 2014 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Randi Kaye in for Fredricka Whitfield. We are keeping a very close eye on the new developments on Flight 370 so let's get you caught up. A new object has been spotted in the Southern Indian Ocean, a Chinese satellite captured images of it four days ago. It's about 74 feet by 43 feet. You see it right there.

Right now China is sending ships to try to locate it and determine if it's wreckage from the plane. The object was found about 75 miles from two other floating objects spotted by a commercial satellite a week ago. Crews have been looking for the first two mystery objects for three days now, but haven't been able to find them. Today a few small items of debris were spotted including a wooden pallet. More ships and planes from several countries are headed to the search area. Australia which is leading the effort says the help is appreciated.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WARREN TRUSS, AUSTRALIA'S ACTING PRIME MINISTER: We welcome these additional assets including the Chinese aircraft. They have a capability that will be important also to the search. I'm told that they're a good platform for visual observations, and as I mentioned earlier, it is more likely that a pair of eyes are going to again identify something floating in the ocean and much of the detection equipment on board the aircraft.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KAYE: Let me bring our panel back in here. I'm joined again by CNN law enforcement analyst, Tom Fuentes, in Washington and by Rick Castaldo. He is an aviation surveillance engineer who spent 20 years at the FAA and also retired navy captain and diver, Bobbie Scholley. Welcome to all of you.

Bobbie, I'm going to start with you. If you were in charge of finding this airplane, what would you be doing right now?

BOBBIE SCHOLLEY, RETIRED NAVY DIVER: I'd be doing pretty much what they're doing, get as many resources as possible trying to look for surface debris, get resources in that might possibly be looking for that pinger, although that's a long shot right now because there's so much ocean to be looking for the pinger, and right now that's a very hard item to be looking for. So the satellite imagery, as many platforms, that includes ships and aircraft, looking for that debris, continue to look for the satellite imagery of anything floating on the surface, and then try to go backwards from that if they can find that debris, you have to work backwards from that to see if you can locate the aircraft point of entry into the ocean. But they have to verify that that is, in fact, aircraft debris.

KAYE: Right, and Rick, what do you make of the new satellite image?

RICK CASTALDO, AVIATION SURVEILLANCE ENGINEER: Well, frankly, I'm a little dismayed that it's taken China that long to release it. I'm not certain that's the best satellite image they have, as you may know, many organizations in different states in that part of the world do not want to reveal what their capabilities are, where they can see with what clarity. Looks like a bit of pixelization in the picture, difficult to tell with what it is. But I think the more important question is the lack of real surveillance data from some of the modern technologies that exist that would have provided a more accurate depiction of where the plane ended up.

There's certainly no guarantee it's in the water. There's been hypothesis that it flew somewhere else and the fact is there's not any really available real time surveillance data and tracking information from any of the countries around there that I believe is substantiated as accurate.

KAYE: And you're saying that's something that we need to make sure that this doesn't happen again. I mean, it's hard to believe that we can't find an airplane.

CASTALDO: Well, as you stated previously, it's a rather large ocean. It's many hundreds of thousands of square miles. Airplanes are fairly small. Even though it is a 777. But the availability of satellite technology and space-based surveillance that can track planes very accurately within a few meters with one second updates, far superior to these legacy radars that exist for both air defense and military uses for looking at hostile aircraft. I think one should recall that air traffic control is designed to look for airplanes that want to be seen.

And in the event of an accident or some nefarious plan by someone else, if you disable all the electronics, you are pretty much left with search radar. Search radar at some of these ranges isn't historically very accurate and may or may not provide altitude information and true speeds and velocities that allows a reasonable engineer to project where the plane would go.

KAYE: Let me bring Tom in, because we were talking about the new satellite image and of course, as we mentioned it took four days for the Chinese authorities to release this image. Help us understand, Tom, if you can, what's going on behind the scenes. I mean, obviously a lot can happen in the four days where this was spotted, given the ocean current so what's going on?

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Randi, as even our technicians experts in satellite technology have said, the satellites take thousands of pictures and it takes time on the ground downloading the pictures to look at every frame and try to analyze the thousands of frames to see if there is debris in one of them. The picture by the American company that was provided to the Australianss has was also four days old. So I don't criticize China for the picture being four days old. Apparently that's the way it is in trying to analyse the data once it's downloaded.

China in this case with so many anguished family members attending press conferences in Beijing and screaming at government officials that you're not doing enough, they're going to put out every picture they can as soon as they can put it out. They've already -- you know, so they're saying we have satellites over the possible crash area. We're downloading the pictures and providing them to the authorities as soon as possible, so the search can go on.

We have surface ships on the way. We have airplanes on the way, so China has a definite reason to try to convince their own people, particularly the family members in that airport in Beijing, that they're doing everything they can possibly do.

KAYE: And Bobbie, let me get back to you. Because they're now searching without the radar, but with their own eyes. What do you make of that and why would they do that?

SCHOLLEY: Well, the conditions there are very poor right now, the environmental conditions, and so they're using what they have, which is the best sensor possible which is your eyeball, and they're getting out there and looking with their eyes to see if they can find this debris. It's not going to be a fast search because you can only see so far, but that's the best way to verify that that is a piece of aircraft debris. If that's going to make it very long and tedious to find it.

KAYE: Yes, certainly so. Certainly very difficult for the families as well as they wait for some answers. Thank you all, Tom Fuentes, Rick Castaldo and Bobbie Scholley.

Spotting a piece of debris on a satellite image seems like a big step in the ongoing search for Flight 370, but with the currents moving so fast, can crews ever really find those objects? Why the search in this area of the ocean is so hard, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: The big development on the missing plane story today is an image from a Chinese satellite showing a piece of debris floating in the water, but this image was taken four days ago. An Australian official said today they searched the area where that picture was taken and they didn't find anything, but the object could have moved.

I'm joined by meteorologist, Jennifer Gray, in the Weather Center. Jennifer, nice to see you again. So how likely is it that the object has moved and how far might it have moved?

JENNIFER GRAY, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes, well it's definitely a possibility. You know, right now it's in an area where the currents aren't very strong, but it only has to drift a short distance for it to get caught in one of these stronger currents and we're talking about anything can cause these objects to drift. We're talking about wind. You're talking about a storm that moved through, high seas, anything like that can make something move out in the ocean.

And so here is the search area where you see that red dot and then just below it to the south, that's a very strong current, we're talking about anywhere from one foot per second possible is what we're talking about here. Let me show you on Google Earth, it's not only the currents that we're talking about, we're also dealing with these very small eddys within the area that we're watching and you see these arrows, these red arrows going down, these green and orange arrows going up, and then this circular motion right here. These are all eddys that can also drive objects out in the ocean at different locations as well.

So even though it's not caught in one of those stronger currents or if it's not caught in one of those stronger currents, some of these smaller eddys out in the ocean can definitely cause it to move, maybe not as fast of a pace as it would if it were in the south a little bit, but still cause it to move nonetheless.

KAYE: So say they spotted it and say this object or debris or whatever it might be sunk. How hard would it be to find something like that in that area?

GRAY: You're talking about, it depends on how far it has traveled. Say it has been caught in that West Australian current. We're talking about areas that could move miles. We're talking about weeks after the fact. And so this could have moved several miles, could have moved 100 miles or more out of the way, and so when you look at this search area, and then you look at all these different currents going around, and then not to mention all the smaller little eddys.

And then you take on top of that the storms that have possibly been in the area over the past couple of days, then you're talking about some major movement with these pieces and so that's why time is of the essence. We're talking about you need to get there as fast as you can because these objects are moving.

KAYE: Yes, what about the next few days? Obviously, these teams are going to keep going out. What can they expect?

GRAY: Yes, the next couple of days, if you can advance my graphic the next couple of days we are looking at possibly some rain pushing on in. Now this is an area that is known for very, very strong winds. It's not uncommon to get 40-mile-an-hour winds, 50-mile-an-hour winds in these areas. Roaring 40s, furious 50s, this is a spot where they're searching and considering what could be the forecast, these are really prime conditions.

We're seeing winds at 15 to 25, maybe 30, at times we'll see winds of 40 miles per hour, but considering this is an area that is very nasty, the Indian Ocean is not a calm ocean. So we're going to see conditions that are going to be the worst topping out at the end of the day tomorrow. So that's when conditions will be the worst. It's going to continue to intensify. The winds are going to continue to strengthen throughout the day tomorrow and so we're talking about anywhere from 40 to 50 mile per hour winds at the worst of it tomorrow. Like I said, Randi, the Indian Ocean is not forgiving. It's a very, very rough body of water and so that's why these search crews are having such a hard time.

KAYE: Yes. They're certainly learning that firsthand. Jennifer Gray, thank you very much for that.

With the plane missing for 15 days now, the battery life on the flight recorder is dwindling. That could spell trouble in this desperate search.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the message in a bottle collection. It's cool to find them. You never know where they come from, who they came from. This one is pretty cool from the '93 flood, had a flag on to. This is a bunch of lottery tickets, I don't know if they're winners or not. Obviously not. Here's one. This one is cool. Picture of Bill Clinton. Pretty neat. Some of them had been found three or four times and passed on and it will keep going down the river, down the river, people will sign them and date them.

This one had money in it with postage so you could send it back to them. Kind of cool. I haven't done that yet. Probably should. Stamps went up since this was sent. This is a voo-doo one. Better not be for me, but has like nails in it and it had a note in it with a string tied on it and said, you are bound now, you are bound now. Actually a lot of them that are pretty heavy that are written to a lost loved one.

I didn't want to keep it because it was meant not to be kept. It's just fun to find them. It's fun for the volunteers. But it's a pretty unique collection because I don't know who else finds this many messages in a bottle. So it's pretty cool.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: We are 15 days into the hunt for Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 and that means the battery that runs the pinging beacon device on the flight recorder has about half way run out now. When the battery life runs out completely, it will get significantly harder for searchers to find that airplane.

Fredricka Whitfield spoke with a man whose company designs and makes underwater locator beacons to get more insight on these devices.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANISH PATEL, PRESIDENT, RADIANT POWER CORPORATION: -- under water locator beacons we make them under the Dukane Seacom product line. I have one right here. They are rated to last for 30 days. That is demonstrated in task and using analytical models when the product was certified. There is some latitude in the design tolerance and when we spoke to the NTSB yesterday in regards to that latitude, we think we can get an additional three to five days of life before the battery starts to diminish to the point where the output signal will be below the minimums required.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: How durable are these batteries? We don't know how this plane went down, but if it crashed into an object or if it is in water. How durable, how can it withstand certain hits or submersions?

PATEL: Sure. I brought another unit, this one actually was in the Swiss Air 111 accident from 1998. As you can see the unit did take some damage, but it was used to locate the black boxes successfully in that incident. So the units are designed to withstand shock, impact, heat, and severe conditions such as an accident, and perform their duties when called upon.

WHITFIELD: And if it is in the depths of miles deep water, does it have a chance of living up to those kind of conditions?

PATEL: It is certified, the devices are certified down to 20,000 feet of vertical water depth. That's equivalent to about 8,700 psi. As I understand it, they're in very deep water. They are looking in very deep water, but the units are qualified and certified to those depths.

WHITFIELD: What are the conditions in which to hear the pings, to be able to detect whether that box recorder that, data box recorder is anywhere near where the searchers might be?

PATEL: Sure. You need to be within two nautical miles, maybe plus or minus a half a mile, depending on sea state, meaning what's the water conditions, is there a lot of ambient noise in the water, is there debris in the water, vegetation, other types of things, cliffs, other topology features underwater that could mask that signal, but in ideal conditions, two nautical miles, maybe 2.5 nautical miles.

WHITFIELD: What are the tools being used to locate it?

PATEL: There are several different types of locators mainly around what we call an underwater microphone or hydrophone that is tuned to the specific frequency, which is 37.5 kilohertz and they are listening for the one ping every second to identify and locate the devices.

WHITFIELD: If the battery is to go out, is there any other way in which to retrieve a flight data recorder?

PATEL: You'd have to visually spot them in the debris field. That's why they're painted that bright orange color. I know we call them black boxes, but they're actually a bright fluorescent orange so they stand out when light shine on them.

WHITFIELD: And are we talking about the battery when we say they are automatically activated over water?

PATEL: That's correct. When you look at these devices, they have a water switch, so when they are immersed in water, whether it's freshwater or saltwater, they will automatically begin to emit that ping.

WHITFIELD: And then generally what kind of information do we get from these flight data recorders?

PATEL: Well, the recorders are designed to just capture just a host of different data and different operating parameters from the aircraft. The specific data recorder manufacturers would be able to give you better information on that.

WHITFIELD: If the battery dies, that doesn't necessarily mean that all the information on the flight data recorder dies with it, correct?

PATEL: That's correct. The battery running out will not preclude the authorities from being able to extract that data. It is embedded into the system.

WHITFIELD: Anish Patel, thank you so much.

PATEL: Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: Very interesting conversation there.

More on today's developing news out of Beijing that a Chinese satellite spotted debris in the search for Flight 370.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: A new potential clue in the search for Flight 370. Here's what we know right now. A third object has been spotted in the Southern Indian Ocean. A Chinese satellite captured images of it four days ago. It's about 74 feet by 43 feet. The object was found about 75 miles from two other floating objects spotted by a commercial satellite a week ago, but search planes didn't spot anything today other than a wooden pallet. Crews have been looking for the first two mystery objects for three days now with no luck, but they'll soon get reinforcements.

Two Chinese patrol planes are joining the search tomorrow and a Japanese surveillance plane is expected to arrive a day or two later. More ships are also headed to that area. Crews continue searching in the northern corridor and seven countries in that area have told investigators they did not pick up any signals from the plane on their radars after it lost contact with ground control.

CNN's Tom Foreman has more now on the stretch, that specific stretch of the Indian Ocean that has drawn an international search effort.

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is a measure of how seriously the whole search team is taking this particular area that at least half if not more of the assets have now been redirected down to this area to take a look at this. There are ships out there. There are planes out there. They are bringing them all in about as quickly as they can and the most advanced equipment they have out there, all to try to find what's in those satellite images, to get a closer look at it. It might not look like it much here, but we would be led to believe by Digital Globe, the company that does this and by circumstances that these would be degraded images.

The images the searchers are using are probably have much higher quality and give them much more reason to be confident about that and this is really what this is about, isn't it? If you think about the equation here, what you're looking for first is whether or not there is some reason here to think this has credibility. The fact the prime minister of Australia got on board, other officials are on board and moving all these assets suggests there is.

Secondly, the question of size gives this credibility. Think about this. The piece we're talking about is somewhere around 24 meters in length, plane like this is around 61, 62 meters end to end, 61, 62 side to side so can you get a piece out of this that big? Yes, you can. The big puzzle, of course, is could it float that long? So that's one of the skepticisms out there about the issue of size.

And then, of course, there is a matter of location. This is the right location to find pieces. That's why when they found the pictures they became so excited. It's the right location based on the mathematics and probabilities of the search patterns. That said it's a difficult location to reach and once you get there on the water, big challenges. Any glare on the water, any white caps, any storms that come along make it harder for anyone to see beneath that surface, even a little bit, where this debris is supposed to be and if you're talking about it being much beneath the surface it gets a lot more complicated.

If we fly down into this area, you're talking about a depth here that may be anywhere from 3,000 to 4,000 meters to the bottom, and the bottom itself may be very filled with ridges and mountains and things that can interfere with this pinger on the data recorders down there. So even if they can find this debris on the surface, that would still mean just the beginning of a very arduous task of actually locating the rest of it.

KAYE: Tom Foreman in the virtual room for us today.

Families of those on the missing plane are desperate for any information, they're still holding out hope but some may also be thinking about legal action. Look at their options coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: New developments today in the search for Flight 370. A Chinese satellite captured an image of an object in the Southern Indian Ocean. Search planes are grounded for the night, but Chinese ships are headed to that area. As the mystery deepens over what happened to the plane, some are asking the difficult question, who pays for a missing plane? Alison Kosik explains how insurance works in this type of case.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The airline industry spends billions of dollars on planes, fuel, maintenance, and on insurance. As 777 like the Malaysia Airlines jet that disappeared likely carries about a $2 billion policy that insures the plane itself and also includes liability for passengers in case something happens. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KOSIK (voice-over): The 239 people aboard a giant aircraft that disappears into the night. Government officials still piecing together information. Family members are understandably outraged. But even if the victims are never found liability insurance can help their families, though, that process likely won't be easy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One is so ensure that in the event of a disappearance like this, there is a presumption of death, which is ruled by a court.

KOSIK: In some countries, that ruling could be difficult to get, but it's essential for the next step of filing a claim. Victims' families have protection under what's known in the aviation industry as the 1999 Montreal Convention. Malaysia signed on to that treaty. It outlines where liability claims can be brought including the airlines' country of operation, the location of its corporate headquarters, where the ticket was bought, a passenger's final destination, a passenger's permanent residence. Whether the victims are found or not, a basic cost of the disappearance will still be determined.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is not an unprecedented situation where an aircraft has not been recovered and indeed legal cases have been made up many times where the aircraft is not recovered and done through circumstantial evidence.

KOSIK: That evidence will point to one of two scenarios that the disappearance was caused by an intentional act, like terrorism or suicide or sabotage, experts say in that case Malaysia Airlines would likely be liable or that a mechanical or systems issue was to blame. If that happens Boeing and other manufacturers could be brought into the insurance claims, leading to an even bigger legal process. Lawyers say the claims must be filed on a passenger by passenger basis through a complex web of payouts, policies, possible lawsuits and legal obligations. Unfortunately, with the victims' families having already gone through so much at the center of it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOSIK: As far as lawsuits go, the amount a family can claim depends on everything from the age of the deceased to what the person earned to what country the case is filed in and there is no maximum amount a family can ask for in a lawsuit, but there is a time limitation. Families have up to two years to sue the airlines starting from the date from when the aircraft should have arrived.

KAYE: Alison, thank you very much. Well, those families of the passengers and crew aren't giving up hope that their loved ones will be found. A few of us can understand the anguish that they're experiencing right now. They're all desperate for word of any information no matter how small it might be.

Our legal guys are here to chat about this today, Avery Friedman, a civil rights attorney and law professor is here in New York, and Richard Herman, a criminal defense attorney and law professor joins us from Las Vegas. All right guys, we're going to talk about legal options that these families have and as we heard in Alison's report even though the plane hasn't been found, some insurance claims have already been paid out. Avery, let me start with you. Who is paying and exactly how does this work?

AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Well, Alliance which is one of the world's largest insurer, has actually made some preliminary payments to the families, that's probably how much of it is being underwritten and under the initial part of this Montreal Convention that was mentioned in Alison's report that provides the basis for recovering some money initially, in fact, up to about $176,000. And again, while much more remains to be done, we have no idea where the plane is, we know nothing about the cause, at least there is strict liability meaning that these families are preliminarily being taken care of.

KAYE: Do they have to proof liability?

FRIEDMAN: They do not. The burden actually is on the airline. So the individuals file the claim and as we learned more, that will impact and what kind of recovery these individuals will be able to obtain.

KAYE: So Richard, if family members want to bring a claim to court, what exactly do they have to do? How do they go about this?

RICHARD HERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Randi, you have the Montreal Convention, which was brought up in Alison's story before this, and there, they have a certain period of time to bring the claim, but they're capped like Avery said 176,000. That's the maximum they can recover and they will have to sign releases for everybody and it's over and out at that point in time. That's whether there's terrorism involved, or whether the plane is never found. Court will make an initial determination that there's a presumption of death and then they will get their claim. And it won't take that long to recover that.

However, if we can get any information about this and if, big i-f, there can be proven negligence on behalf of Malaysia Airlines, Rolls- Royce who made the engines or Boeing, that is the motherlode, as they say, because then per person, based on the criteria, the age of the person, their earning potential, who they're supporting, their lifespan, that can generate millions and millions of dollars in a wrongful death award.

KAYE: So Avery, as he's saying, terrorism doesn't change this at all?

FRIEDMAN: Terrorism may --

KAYE: If it turned out to be that.

FRIEDMAN: Terrorism may and again we have no evidence, but if there is, believe it or not, there is separate insurance provided by Lloyd's to cover those kind of damages and again Randi, that's literally millions and millions of dollars here. So we're going to have to see what happens. We don't have the facts. KAYE: Richard, yes?

HERMAN: Randi, under the Montreal Convention, if it was terrorism or the plane is never found, you can still recover. That's not a block to recovery. It's strict liability as Avery said. However, if you want to try to bring a separate action for negligence, then a terrorist action here would probably preclude you unless Malaysia Air was so reckless in their procedures --

FRIEDMAN: How do you show negligent terrorism?

HERMAN: No, negligent security. Negligent security by Malaysia Air. They'd have to try to find that.

KAYE: Which brings up the idea, Avery, you and I were talking about earlier about the two passengers who had their passports stolen.

FRIEDMAN: Holy smokes, I mean, from my perspective, what is the like -- what is the obligation, on the part of the airline, to investigate in-depth the validity of a passport. That's stretching the theory of liability. I understand it. I just don't accept it, it doesn't make any sense.

KAYE: Richard, what do you think on the flipside of that, what is the airline doing right now? I mean, they have to know that this could be coming, that lawsuits could be coming. What are they doing at this point?

HERMAN: You know, Randi, at this point in time, I think they're doing what everybody's doing, trying to find this plane or trying to determine whether or not it crashed or it's landed somewhere, and we've had a myriad of scenarios on CNN the last few days, everywhere from it's in Pakistan to -- I'm concerned that the transponders were physically turned off. To me that is bells and whistles going off. I don't know how they do that and I don't know how there's no form of -- we can land people on the moon, but we can't find this plane? It's unbelievable to me. It's incomprehensible.

KAYE: So how much money are we talking about, Avery?

FRIEDMAN: I think in a sense it's limitless. I think you're going to have an aviational expert coming up that will talk about possible caps on that coverage, but it seems to me that between Montreal Convention, between Allianz and Lloyds if there's terrorism involved it is a staggering amount of money.

HERMAN: Attorneys are projecting $500 million to $750 million in damages.

FRIEDMAN: Some are, right.

KAYE: Do you see a case like this actually going to court, Richard?

HERMAN: You know, Randi, it goes all the time. There are great aviation attorneys who bring these cases and defend them.

FRIEDMAN: That's right.

HERMAN: It's a mess. It's massive litigation and they go to court all the time.

KAYE: Well, most important thing here, though, I think you both would agree with me is that these families get some answers.

FRIEDMAN: Got to mention very quickly. Wolf Blitzer's birthday today, very important day.

KAYE: You want to sing?

FRIEDMAN: I don't know if it we should sing.

KAYE: I don't think we should sing. Kidding, we're not singing. Not singing. Thank you.

HERMAN: Feel better, Fred.

KAYE: Thanks again. The legal guys are here as you know every Saturday at this time to give us their take on the most intriguing legal cases of the day.

Still ahead more on the latest on the search for Flight 370 and next Ukraine's bases in Crimea are slipping from its control and why the Pentagon is worried Crimea is just the start for Russia.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: Welcome back, everyone. We'll have more on the search for Flight 370 in just a few minutes.

But first important new developments on the crisis in Ukraine. Two Ukrainian military bases in Crimea have fallen to pro-Russian forces. At the same time the White House is keeping a close eye on Russian troops massing at the Ukrainian border supposedly a part of training exercises that's according to Moscow.

We're joined now by CNN's Barbara Starr who is at the Pentagon for us today and Ivan Watson in the Ukrainian capital of Kiev. Hello to both of you. Barbara, I want to start with you. Does the U.S. think those troops on the border are part of another invasion?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, nobody is certain yet what the Russians are really up to, but I can tell you, Randi, here at the Pentagon, top officials starting with Defense Secretary Hagel are just a little bit skeptical of what future Russian intentions might be. Hagel talking to the Russian defense minister earlier this week and asking him point blank what the Russian intentions are on that border.

The 20,000 Russian troops now motorized, ready to move across the border if and when they get orders, the Russians told Hagel it was exercises, but across the highest levels of the Obama administration, concern really is growing, that the Russians are about to potentially, potentially make their next move, and they are so close to the border right now. There would be no advanced warning. They would just drive across and U.S. intelligence would likely see it as it's happening.

KAYE: Ivan, what is your take? Will Ukraine move to evacuate all the remaining troops from Crimea? I mean, aren't they in some pretty serious danger?

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They are. These troops are surrounded and the Ukrainian government hasn't really publicized a formal plan for what these soldiers should do. Aside from saying they are authorized to fire their weapons in self-defense, which doesn't seem to have been the case, so what we've had instead is one by one Russian forces and pro-Russian militia have surrounded these Ukrainian military installations and basically overrun them. What we've seen today at one of these bases is what clearly seemed to be Russian armored personnel carriers actually ramming through the gates of the Belbek military airbase.

And within some rather tense hours some warning shots were fired and the humiliating scene we hear from the Ukrainian ministry of defense that the local Ukrainian officers and soldiers are then escorted out of the base with their belongings, while still in uniform. You can imagine for a member of the military how humiliating and embarrassing this is, and it's due to two things.

Number one, Russia annexed Crimea, but the major problem of thousands of Ukrainian troops deployed stationed living there and on the other hand the Ukrainian government not coming up with any plan for how to move its troops out of a territory that it still claims is still Ukrainian -- Randi.

KAYE: And let me share this statement just coming in from the White House regarding this situation. Russia should immediately begin discussions with the Ukrainian government to ensure the safety of Ukrainian forces in the Crimean region of the Ukraine. Barbara, what does that tell you and what would be the Pentagon's next steps at this point?

STARR: Well, the language I'm not hearing there, maybe it is there, Randi, no U.S. call at this point for Russia to withdraw from Crimea. The U.S. military is not going to respond to this militarily, neither are the members of NATO, but the stakes could not be higher and more meaningful and it starts right in Moscow. The United States wants Russian cooperation on Syria, on Iran, all of that. That is not likely to happen now any time soon, because of these tensions there is political instability that could erupt in Eastern Europe if this situation is not stabilized, and that leads to economic and investment uncertainty.

Of course, the major Black Sea port of Sebastopol, a major area for commerce and trade going in and out of the Black Sea in and out of Ukraine. This is cascading effects. If it doesn't become resolved in some fashion could have some widespread long range implications across the board.

KAYE: Certainly not what anyone wants to see. Barbara Starr, Ivan Watson, thank you both very much. Well, we could have known days ago what happened to Flight 370 if it had a device already used in some airplanes. We'll show you that equipment coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: The mystery of what happened to Malaysia Flight 370 might have been solved days ago if the plane had been equipped with a high-tech data recorder. Laurie Segall takes a look at the technology that many airlines don't even use.

LAURIE SEGALL, CNN MONEY TECH CORRESPONDENT: Right now if a plane sinks to the bottom of the ocean, the flight data recorder goes with it. We spoke with one company that doesn't have to be the case and that we could have a lot more answers about the missing jet.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEGALL (voice-over): When Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 disappeared, the story of what went wrong vanished with it. The answers might be stuck in the flight data recorder, the so-called black box. What if we had those answers all along?

RICHARD HAYDEN, DIRECTOR, FLHYT AEROSPACE SOLUTIONS: We would know where the aircraft has gone, where it is, and we would have information on what happened in the meantime.

SEGALL: Canadian company, FLHYT makes live streaming data recorders that send information in real time. It's part of a satellite based system that monitors a plane's exact location, engine conditions and more.

HAYDEN: The system transmits every 5 to 10 minutes on a normal flight.

SEGALL: If something goes wrong like the plane deviating from its route the system will start streaming live second by second data.

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: That kind of information is not only lifesaving, but it adds a tremendous measure of security for our country.

SEGALL: There are several mechanisms that transmit a plane's data, but Hayden says unlike those systems, the technology behind FLHYT is more extensive, sharing a tremendous amount of information. So much information critics say it could be difficult to monitor and analyze if widely adopted. Right now, FLHYT's technology is only fitted to 350 planes run by 40 operators. It can be installed for about $100,000. Normal data transmission costs carriers between a few dollars to $15 per flight hour and goes up for continuous streaming in a rare emergency.

SCHIAVO: They're cost sensitive and they simply will not add additional safety measures unless mandated by the federal government.

SEGALL: As investigators look for high tech clues in the search for Flight 370, the high tech data recorder is getting a second look.

HAYDEN: The technology exists. It's in service. It's economical and the question now is how to get more widespread use of it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SEGALL: It's important to note that this technology might have been helpful if it had been in use, but like the transponder on Flight 370, it would have been possible for someone to turn it off. Laurie Segall, CNN, New York.