Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Grieving Families Demand Answers; Search Planes are back over Indian Ocean; Search Zone Weather to Deteriorate; Recovering from an Airline Tragedy; More Planes Searching for MH370; Search Still on in Mudslide

Aired March 30, 2014 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening, everyone. I'm Don Lemon. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. It is the top of the hour.

Six days remain before batteries may die on Malaysia Flight 370's black box data recorders. Well six days before the all important ping signaling, going its location fades away to silence (AUDIO GAP) a more extensive search is ramping up with ten planes, ten ships involved the goal find four mysterious orange objects spotted earlier. Those orange objects are called promising leads.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LT. RUSSELL ADAMS, ROYAL AUSTRALIAN AIR FORCE: We did encounter an area which are approximately five nautical miles which included at least four orange-colored objects greater than approximately two meters in size each. I must stress that we can't confirm the origin of these objects.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: But let's not get our hopes up just yet. Those very same orange objects could be called ocean trash when crews find them. Or they could be the huge break desperately needed to help solve the mystery of Flight 370. The whole world is watching and waiting for any physical evidence of Malaysia Flight 370. Desperate relatives of passengers say the truth needs to be revealed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We want Malaysia to apologize for the information that caused confusion in the first week which delayed the search mission. And we want the Malaysian government to apologize for irresponsibly announcing on March 24th that the plane had crashed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: And of course, our reporter and our experts are standing by, standing at the ready to bring us the very latest here. So let's get going right now here on CNN.

CNN's Sara Sidner joins me from Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. Sara, do we know how many search planes are heading out there? It is believed to be about ten. And is the main focus to relocate those orange objects?

SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes eight to ten planes are going up today. And now that it's light out, we do expect that the planes will be in the air shortly. We also know that the Prime Minister, Tony Abbott, is expected to visit the air base there.

The significance of that, we don't know. But obviously these objects that they are now looking at saying that they could potentially be something from Flight MH370, obviously giving a bit more urgency to trying to pinpoint, locate and pick those up.

But again, they stress, the last time that they found some of these objects, Chinese actually vessel picked them up, turned out to be ocean trash. So this time, they're again looking for these objects, saying that, you know, the color could indicate that they're from the plane.

But again, they're not sure a lot of this back and forth. And investigators say, you know, it's very, very difficult, obviously, trying to comb so much of this very vast and deep ocean. But for these families, it's been particularly difficult. Because every time they hear something, every time they get a word that there is something out there that might be or could potentially be part of Flight MH370, their hopes lift a bit. Trying to figure out, is this the day -- is this day we'll know more? And oftentimes, far too often over these 23 days, it has not turned out to be anything dashing their hopes, upsetting them, frustrating them more than anyone else. Because as you can imagine, they have gone on for nearly a month now not knowing what has happened to their loved ones -- Don.

LEMON: That's just unbelievable that it's almost been a month now. You're absolutely right, Sara. You know we have just learned as well that the Australian Prime Minister visited the air base just north of Perth. And we have been watching these search planes come and go. What's the significance of that visit?

SIDNER: Look, you remember back on March 19th when he made this announcement that there is a significant development that the Australians had seen satellite images of some debris, what they thought was debris in the ocean. That was back then. But he was the person that came and stood in front of cameras and told the world that they believe they saw something that was important. The most credible lead yet. You'll remember that because it turned out that they were unable to find that debris.

But again, now they're in another situation where they say, ok, look, we think we found something. Now we have to go actually physically see it and try to pick it up and bring it in. But of course, the search has been going on for so long. And some of this must be sort of a morale booster. It has to be incredibly frustrating for the search crews going out every day in what was quite difficult conditions for a while there with cyclone style winds that were blowing and making the seas very choppy, making the planes have to stay on the ground for a day or two.

But now the weather better, they're going back out there. And I think there's just a morale boost trying to hope that this is finally the day when we'll know more about what happened to that missing flight -- Don.

LEMON: Absolutely. I remember it well. You know, when he came out and said that. We were here until 3:00 in the morning because he said it was credible. This is the first credible bit of evidence that he believes that we have. So thank you, Sara Sidner and we'll check back with you throughout the evening. We'll be covering this all evening here on CNN.

So let's talk more about the search as we head into Monday morning off Australia. Joining us is our panel this hour. Mary Schiavo is a CNN aviation analyst and a former inspector general at the Department of Transportation; retired captain Bobbie Scholley is a former Navy diver; and Miles O'Brien, is of course a CNN analyst and licensed pilot. Good to see all of you. It's been such a long time since I've seen you guys.

So Mary, you know coming off a day when a search team reported promising leads, specifically the sighting of those orange objects, given your experience and from what we're being told do you see this as promising as well?

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, I hope to be able to say it's promising. The lights -- the chutes are yellow and the life rafts are usually yellow, and the vest, the life safety vests -- the life vests are usually yellow on the plane.

But they don't have to be yellow. And I'm just hoping that perhaps Malaysia had replaced them and theirs are orange and that's what this is. So I'm optimistic but I'm keeping my fingers crossed just in case that they have to keep looking elsewhere.

LEMON: Cautious optimism, I would imagine you're thinking there.

SCHIAVO: Yes.

LEMON: Bobbi, as a diver, what do you make of this new report? We're learning that there's so much trash and debris out there. Is it worth it to get our hopes up when we hear about something like this every single time?

CAPT. BOBBIE SCHOLLEY, U.S. NAVY (Retired): Well, we have to stay optimistic. Because those crews that are out there need to feel like there's a lot of hope that every time we find one of these sightings, that they need to go and investigate it. When they found the stuff that was referred to as ocean trash, we have to remember that a lot of things on this aircraft float.

Even little things that might even be considered ocean trash could be from the aircraft. They have to pick it up. They have to look at it. And so we want those crews to stay optimistic. And we want their morale to stay high. It really does get discouraging being out there on the water and when they're out there every day in these conditions. And they're working so hard. And they're getting tired. So this is -- this is optimistic, keep finding this stuff and going out there and checking it out, each piece.

LEMON: Yes.

SCHOLLEY: So I am optimistic that we're still finding things.

LEMON: Miles, you know, we also learned that they're going to head out today with a pinger locator onboard an Australian ship. It's going to take three days to get out to that search zone. And that signal is going to fade in a week or so if it hasn't faded already. Is it too much to say that locating the pinger could be our last chance for a long time to find this plane?

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: I don't think that's too much to say. Because if there isn't any luck hearing those pings in the time allotted, then they have to go into alternate means. You have to literally kind of map the ocean floor using sonar techniques. And that's a much more laborious process.

And you know, I keep going back to that Air France crash in 2009. It was two years before the black boxes were found. They did find them eventually. But they had to -- they had wait for the -- you know, the winter seasons and search at the appropriate time. And given the narrow window here with the weather, I think that's a scenario that's likely.

LEMON: Yes. I want you guys to take a look at this new video just in to CNN. And this is and you know of course, it's Monday morning in Perth w Where those planes are taking off and there is a new plane taking off. The Chinese search plane getting ready to go in the air. Of course, they start when it's dark because they want to be out there when the sun comes up to get as much time out there looking as possible.

You know, Mary, you know, you hate to ask this question. I've heard people ask it. And you want to do it as gently as possible. But how long can this go on if they continue day after day to find nothing as we watch this new Chinese search plane take off?

SCHIAVO: See, that's what I worry about. You know, one of the things I worry about a lot because it can't go on indefinitely. And I would imagine they would certainly keep it up until the 30 days or probably even a little more. I mean there have been cases where the pinger batteries lasted beyond 30 days. So I would imagine they'd keep it up at least through that time maybe up to 40 days.

But after that, I would assume they're going to -- they're going to have to start scaling back because it's tough on the searchers. It's tough on the airmen and women. It's tough on everybody. But I think there's no danger of that until well after the pingers would have stopped. LEMON: So -- so what happens here -- you know, Miles, I don't know if you want to answer this or if you want to defer to Mary. So then what happens? Who decides when it's time, you know, to start scaling back? And we're not saying that they're going to do it soon. And then is it a private search after that? Do they keep searching but in smaller, you know, with smaller search crews, with smaller apparatus? What happens here? Mary or Miles who can -- go ahead Miles?

O'BRIEN: Well I mean we -- maybe we can both take a whack at it. But I mean in this case, the Malaysian authorities are -- supersede all and run the investigation. But you have this component of the Australians who because -- by virtue of geography are taking a larger role in the active search and so that might come into play as well.

In the case of Air France there were private searches that were staged. There's a lot of entities that need to know an answer here including the airplane manufacturer, the airlines, the insurance companies.

So there's a lot of motivation to keep searching. The hard part is what do you tell the families? And when you say, you know, we're going to take a break. That's -- that's a difficult thing. That's a very bitter pill to swallow.

LEMON: Yes absolutely. Mary, go ahead.

SCHIAVO: Well, that's it. I mean at some point, you know, the Malaysian authorities are in charge. But Australia's in charge of the search effort. If Malaysia asked for help from pretty much any country, I'm sure they will give it. But after a while just, you know, out there basically mowing the ocean, that's going to be a hard thing for people to get up. It's also going to get expensive for some countries. I mean, not all countries have the budget or at least the deficit budget of the United States of America. And at some point countries simply can't afford to keep it up.

LEMON: All right. Thank you guys. Stay right there. Again, we want to say, we want to tell you ten planes, ten ships involved in the search today.

CNN has new video of a Chinese search plane just taking off. It's, of course, morning in Perth, Australia where this search is being headed up.

And still ahead here on CNN, we're going to talk with someone who was in a plane crash in San Francisco and lived to tell about it. He's going to join me live. Also his daughter is here to tell us what it was like to wait for any word from her father, about her father.

But next -- the important role of weather in this search in the Indian Ocean; what is the outlook for the area in the coming days? And how could that affect those planes looking for any sign of Flight 370? We're back right after this quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) LEMON: Welcome back to our special coverage of missing Flight 370. Let's talk more about the weather and the search effort with my panel now. Mary Schiavo, former inspector general at the Department of Transportation, retired navy diver Bobbie Scholley and CNN analyst -- aviation analyst Miles O'Brien.

So Miles, the weather really hasn't been much of an issue just for the past few days. There were concerns about it yesterday. But Alexandra Steele says that that's going to change. How does rough weather affect the search efforts and the potential debris field?

O'BRIEN: I was doing some conversion when Alexandra was talking about the potential sea state. And she was talking about routinely in the winter 12 foot seas. Now 12 foot seas, it's very difficult to operate. You can imagine a wave bearing down on you at that height trying to put in some sort of submersible device that would listen for a pinging noise. That's all but impossible.

That also, of course, makes it difficult for the air crews to, you know, identify anything in the churn, as it were. So it becomes, you know, pretty much impractical and really frankly dangerous to search under conditions like that. God forbid somebody gets hurt in the effort to find this wreckage.

There is a, you know, it's a difficult balance given the emotions and the stakes for the families. But at a certain point, Mother Nature is going to win.

LEMON: Yes. And, you know, Bobbie, it's not just what we see on the surface, right -- the rain and the clouds or whatever. It's below the surface. As a navy diver, what are your concerns at this point in the investigation? Is it simply the passage of time? Deterioration of potential debris? Is it, you know, weather, safety -- what are you concerns now?

SCHOLLEY: Well, right now it's the weather and the effect on the surface search. They're not going to be able to tow the -- the pinger locator if the weather gets too much worse. And at some point they're not even going to be able to leave the ship out there. They might be able to tow during some of this weather. And then pull the pinger back up on the ship if the weather gets too bad that they can't tow the pinger locator. And then stay out there and let the weather pass. And then put the tow pinger locator back in the water.

But then at some point the weather will get so bad that they'll have to bring the ships back in to Perth to wait out the bad weather. And then we're talking about pulling all the ships in until the season is over and then waiting until next season. But then if we even find the debris field and the weather is bad, and we want to put the ROVs into the water to start investigating the plane and look for the black boxes, we need the right weather to deploy the ROVs off of the ships.

So the weather is a huge factor in all phases of any search and recovery at this point. We do have underwater currents that we need to worry about. We're talking about a huge depth here -- 16,000 feet or greater. And you're going to have currents that are varying all the way through. You might have currents that are calm on the surface and then the currents will be too much to operate down at depth. Or you might have currents that are running on the surface and they're fine at depth. Or you might have all sorts of currents in between.

So the weather in that part of the ocean is going to be a huge factor from now on.

LEMON: Yes.

SCHOLLEY: So it's just -- it's really rough in this kind of scenario.

LEMON: Yes, it's just amazing because I mean it is unchartered territory in many ways. Even, you know, some of the areas of the ocean uncharted, unmapped. And Mary, by all accounts this is a pretty unusual investigation. It's had its problems as we all know but beyond the discovery of the black boxes and beyond the discovery of some confirmed debris, what would you like to see happen next in this investigation I mean if you can, you know, if you can assess that?

SCHIAVO: Well, actually, next or I hope it's going on right now, I think they need to keep refining that data. If we aren't finding wreckage at this location, it's got to be out there. And if we aren't finding it, I want the -- the think tank, the group of good minds that got together and had these new coordinates, keep going back over that data. If we're not finding it at these coordinates, then I want them to get the calculators out and calculate again.

LEMON: All right. All right. Standby, everyone. Miles, Bobbie, Mary Schiavo -- appreciate that. We'll get back to you.

Up next here on CNN, I'm going to speak to a man who survived a San Francisco plane crash; also joining me, his daughter. What was it like for her to wait for news, knowing that her father was on the plane? You don't want to miss this. We're back after a very quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Obviously, no aviation disaster is easy to move on from especially when you or your family member is the one on the plane. The loved ones on board Malaysia Flight 370 continue to wait for news. It's agonizing. They're hoping for a miracle here.

Eugene Rah can relate. He was aboard Asiana Flight 214. Remember this. That crashed just last summer in San Francisco. It is a day that haunts him still and many people who had family members on board that plane and many people who were on that plane.

Eugene and his daughter Eunice Bird Rah join me now. They are in Las Vegas. It's good to see you. I hope you guys are doing well.

I want to begin with you, Eunice. Much of this story centers on the grieving families waiting for news. What was it like for you waiting to hear from your dad after that Asiana crash?

EUNICE RAH, FATHER WAS ON ASIANA FLIGHT 214: Hi, Don. It was certainly one of the saddest experiences of my life. I remember watching from my balcony, you know, the smoke from the plane and just waiting to hear from him. I felt all life just leave my body. You know, it's a very horrifying experience. You want to hope for the best.

And the thing is, it's very difficult for me to say, but a little hope is a lot of hope. And when you have a little bit of hope in you, that's all you want to grab on to. And when you feel life just leaving your body like that, all you can hope for is that your loved ones are ok.

And you just lose all your senses. You can't think. You can't hear anything. You lose track of time. And all you're just focused on is waiting for that phone call or your text. It's a very frustrating and very confusing experience.

LEMON: Eugene, I'm watching your reaction there. This is still fresh and raw for you, isn't it?

EUGENE RAH, PASSENGER ON ASIANA FLIGHT 214: Yes, it is, in fact.

LEMON: When you hear -- when you heard about 370, does it bring it all back? What were your thoughts?

EUGENE RAH: Well, I mean, it was sort of shocking for me to find out there is another, I mean accident. Without knowing what happened to it. I was just -- just frozen for some -- you know, for a few minutes. All the memory came back and yes.

LEMON: What do these families have ahead for them, Eugene? As someone -- you know, I know it's rough to put it all into perspective. But at least, you know, you know -- you and your daughter know. But Eugene what do they have ahead of them? It's going to be a long road, correct?

EUGENE RAH: Yes. I -- I think so. And it's just really awful especially when you don't have a clue. You need to have a closure for you to move on. I mean in my case, it was just such a traumatic and severe experience that I wanted to -- you know, I mean overcome and move on with my life. And still, I mean, I had such a short moments of horrifying experience, but still it left me so much scars that I have to deal with.

But it's hard to imagine what those families are going through without knowing, you know, what happened to their loved one.

LEMON: Eunice, it was hours that you waited. These families have waited weeks now. And, you know, there's been criticism of Malaysia Airlines, of some of the government officials there for not being sensitive enough.

What could have helped you in that situation coming from officials or from the airlines that you can offer to the family members who are probably watching this and officials in Malaysia as well to help those families? What kind of support can they give those families as they wait here not knowing? EUNICE RAH: You know, at that point, like I said, when you lose complete sense of your mind and your normal life, the only thing you could really ask for is just human support. Just human, you know, kindness and just that humility.

I think during a crisis a lot of these airlines go into crisis management mode. And they're thinking legal things. They're thinking image. They're thinking so much out of what is really important. Which is we are all human and we're feeling -- you know, we have lost our, you know, loved ones or we've lost track -- we've lost contact with our loved ones. Please help us and communicate with us openly and be honest with us. Just work with us. And, you know, at least then we can work together.

Because when Asiana had happened we were so disconnected from the airline that it made it so difficult for the families to even trust the airlines. And I think for the Malaysian passengers and their family, it really just breaks my heart even seeing footage of the passenger families mourning and grieving so much.

And then on top of that, having Malaysia just so -- act so inappropriately. And, you know, honestly, it's -- it's very saddening. I can only imagine what they're feeling especially because they are waiting days and days and days. And when you're waiting that long and you're hanging on to hope like that, it really just takes so much life out of you.

LEMON: Yes. You know, of course the families want to hang on to hope. It's not a criticism of the families. But I've heard psychologists say that they fear that the families are losing perspective here and are somewhat becoming delusional because they think, you know -- thinking that maybe the families are alive somewhere.

But you -- one can understand that, right? Because you would hope against hope that your family member is alive no matter how odd or unusual the scenario -- either one of you can answer that.

EUNICE RAH: For me, you know, when I first heard about the Malaysian airline, I -- I wanted to tell the families to be strong because evidence is going to tell you that there's no hope. People and professionals and experts are going to tell you, the media is going to tell you there's no hope. But as a daughter to my dad, if I were to put myself in their situation, I would just hold on to hope.

And it's very, very difficult for me to say that to these families especially now, you know, seeing all the evidence and what's going on. But truthfully, you know, I would never give up on my dad. And if there was ever a moment when I didn't know if he was ok, I would never stop.

And for a psychiatrist to say the families are delusional, I mean they're supposed to be delusional. This is such a tragic event that you can only be delusional at a time like this -- so.

LEMON: Eugene, Eunice has offered some advice and some words of encouragement to the families. Your thoughts? Final? Your final thoughts?

EUGENE RAH: Well, I mean, Eunice spoke well which I totally agree with her. But I'd like to add just one comment I mean for the -- those Malaysian officials and airline people. Accidents happen. Saying sorry over and over again, it doesn't really help people. Imagine their families were in this crash. I don't know if they would act the way they've been treating the families of those passengers.

I feel that there is some barriers in between which has to be, you know, I mean break before any improvement in between. And they all need support emotionally, of course. But mostly they need transparent efforts from the Malaysian officials. Especially when the investigation -- the official owns the company, the airline itself, it creates a lot of, you know, uncertainties and doubt from family naturally and obviously which they have to be really transparent and, you know, care --

LEMON: Yes.

EUGENE RAH: -- from the heart.

LEMON: We appreciate your words of encouragement and your candor. And it's good to see you guys and continued good health and well being -- ok.

Thank you so much for joining us.

EUGENE RAH: Thank you, Don.

EUNICE RAH: Thank you.

EUGENE RAH: Thank you. Good to see you too.

LEMON: Good to see you as well.

Ok, coming up next here on CNN, planes are taking off from Perth, Australia to begin day 24 of the search for missing Flight 370. We're live in Perth in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Welcome back, everyone, our continuing coverage. It is daybreak, Monday morning, western Australia where the aerial search for Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 is beginning again. Planes loaded with high-tech scanning equipment will spend another day going over a remote area of the Indian Ocean. That's the best guess location for any parts of the airplane that might still be floating.

And another weekend, the heartbroken families of the 239 people on board that plane are hearing no information about the fate of their loved ones. Malaysian officials say there's simply nothing to tell them. It is late morning in Australia now. And planes are setting off, hoping this is the day that they will find a clue to Flight 370's fate.

Our Kyung Lah is at Pearce Air Base in Perth, Australia. So Kyung, how many planes again, ships involved? It changes from time to time. There's nine, there's ten, sometimes there's eight. What's going on now?

KYUNG LAH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we can tell you that the very first of the planes already in the air, zooming to the search area. Throughout the day there will be a total of 10 search planes that will be combing this region. It has been described by one of the pilots I spoke with as mowing the sea. They're going to go back and forth over this area looking for any sort of objects from the sky. At sea, 10 sea vessels.

That's an important distinguishing factor today, Don. There are more vessels at sea than ever before. They're very, very important. A very, very important piece of this puzzle. Because once items are spotted from the planes, it's the sea vessels that can go there, pick it up and determine if they're connected to the missing plane. So they're hoping to make more headway today, Don. The search just beginning for the day.

LEMON: Kyung, you know, we're keeping a close eye on the weather. Almost feel like a weather forecaster. That's really the key here as we look at this live radar. That's the key. Do we know if the weather is going to cooperate today?

LAH:: From what we're hearing, the weather forecast is generally fair. There are in some areas of the search expected to be some low clouds, some light rain. But generally the search is expected to continue. If the clouds are low, that's a real problem. Because they have to have good visibility from the air in order to spot any sort of objects, Don.

LEMON: All right. Kyung Lah, thank you very much. In Perth. We'll get back to you.

You know, each day brings new questions about the mystery of Flight 370. We're answering your questions with our expert panel now. And remember you can tweet us using, you can tweet us @donlemon on twitter. And use the hastag #370qs.

So here are our panel again. Miles, I want you to take the first question. How do searchers determine how fast the plane was flying?

O'BRIEN: Well, in this case, there's a lot of guess work involved. The speed estimate that they've used is based on basically the last speed that they recorded using primary radar tracks. Pretty much very close to Malaysia, essentially. And that put them in the - into the thinking that it was at or about, we believe, 12,000 feet. And that the red line speed for that is about 400 knots.

So here's the question. Was it flown in deliberately? That could be one speed. Or was it on autopilot and the engine starved. Did it pitch up violently and go into some sort of stall and spin. Which would change the speed at which it would hit the water. So that - in both of those cases, you have two separate scenarios for what the debris field might look like. So they really have to be looking for anything and everything. I think we can safely say, though, if this is the right place, if there were big pieces like a horizontal stabilizer or the vertical stabilizer of the tail, there's a good chance that would be picked up by now.

LEMON: And here's the thing. A lot of us, of course, we're sort of hypothesizing here. If they haven't found anything, I think the general consensus, Miles, and maybe Mary, is that the plane's - the engines stalled. Maybe the plane sort of drifted and just sort of did a soft landing into the ocean maybe there because they weren't looking in that particular area for a while. And maybe just it sank pretty much intact to the bottom of the ocean or in the ocean? Is that a fair assessment?

O'BRIEN: This assumption that it flew until the tanks were dry is at the core of why we're where we are. What if that wasn't the case?

LEMON: OK.

O'BRIEN:: What if this was some sort of deliberate act and the plane went into the drink far short of where they're looking? It's a possibility.

LEMON: All right. That's very good. OK. Mary, Steve asks, do we know if Malaysia Airlines has ever released the aircraft maintenance records on MH370?

SCHIAVO: They have not released them publicly. They certainly should have released them to the investigators. Under U.S. law had the investigation been taking place here, it is required by law.

LEMON: Yes. And Cindy asks this. How often do planes crash somewhere other than near their route? Because usually they're on course. How often has this happened, Mary, do you know?

SCHIAVO: Well, Cindy is absolutely right. Usually the crash is somewhere in the sequence, somewhere in the route that they're taking. Or if they have to do an emergency diversion to an emergency airport such as the crash of the plane in Sioux City back in the late '80s or early '90s, they had to divert to Sioux City. So usually it is, you know, on their route.

Frankly, in most of the accidents, a good probably 95 percent of the accidents are on takeoff or landing. So they're usually near an airport.

LEMON: OK. That's interesting. You know, Bobbie, there has been - you know, people have been asking about technology. This seems a bit farfetched. But here's what John asks. Could they use a helicopter to drag electromagnet over the area to pick stuff up? That's highly unlikely.

SCHOLLEY: No. We don't have anything that we use in the underwater search capacity that does that. I kind of know what he's talking about. Look for magnetic signatures under the water. But that's not a tool that we use in underwater search of this type. We have the towed pinger locator. And we have both the autonomous underwater vehicle on the ship which also has the towed pinger locator.

And the autonomous underwater vehicle is a side scan sonar that we would use. Once the pinger battery wears out, then we would use the AUV to search with the side scan sonar for the debris field. But, again, we need a much smaller area to start searching with. And then there's also a towed side scan sonar that would be towed behind the ship just like the towed pinger locater is towed behind the ship. And that also has a side scan sonar on it that would be used.

LEMON: All right. Bobbie, thank you very much. Miles as well. Mary, thank you. We'll see you in just a little bit.

Coming up, how the United States is helping with the investigation of the missing Flight 370.

But first, more than a week after a massive landslide, Washington's governor says he's still holding out hope for a miracle. Make sure you stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Back to our special coverage of missing Malaysia Air Flight 370 in just a moment.

But first, I want to give you - get you caught up on some of the other stories that we're following today.

Disease, contamination and death. That's what search crews and rescue dogs are encountering in Washington state. They're still hoping to find survivors from the devastating mudslide eight days ago.

CNN's Dan Simon near the scene now. Dan, what's happening?

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Don, first of all, let's talk about the list of those who are missing. At one point it was 90. Now it's 30. Authorities have really been trying to pin down who, in fact, is missing and who may have died in the landslide.

They've been cross checking all the names and they have been able to reduce that number to 30. That's still, of course, a lot of people. Crews are still working around the clock trying to find victims. You talk about it's basically a toxic sludge over there. You've got septic tanks. You've got oil and gas.

Now, the governor held a press conference just a little while ago. Don, at this point I don't think really anyone really thinks anybody could have survived now that we're a week since the event. That said, the governor said this is still being called a search and rescue mission. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. JAY INSEE (D), WASHINGTON: The families will, you know, they'll have their own feelings in their own hearts. And that's for them to decide. The family members that I have spoken to, I think, have a very mature, real sense of wanting to have hope and wanting to find that miracle. And we have provided them and are providing them every opportunity to find that miracle.

And we're looking for that miracle out there right now. I saw 400 or 500 people who are out looking for that miracle. If we don't find that miracle, they're also looking for the knowledge of the fates of their loved ones. And they're working real hard to do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIMON: As crews continue to work through the debris field, at times they are finding just body parts. That really tells you the grim nature of it all. And that tells you two things, Don. Number one, the incredible force of this landslide. And, second, that's going to make it really difficult for the medical examiner's office to identify bodies. Don.

LEMON: Oh, my goodness. You know, of course, as in the Malaysia story, this story, the weather is important as well. How is the weather today? How does it look for the next couple of days?

SIMON: It's supposed to be a little bit better tomorrow. Right now, it is not raining. But I should tell you, it's basically been raining throughout the weekend. The past 48 hours. And that's created puddles in the debris field. And crews have actually brought in pumps to drain the mud. But it's still very tough going. It's very difficult for crews to actually walk through all that mud, Don.

LEMON: All right. Thank you, Dan Simon. We appreciate it. Arlington, Washignton.

Moving on, lots of discussion but so far no action and no agreement. I'm talking about efforts to defuse the growing tension between Russia and Ukraine. Top diplomats from the U.S. and Russia went behind closed doors for four hours today in Paris.

Secretary of state John Kerry said it's not as easy as just ordering Russian troops on Ukraine's border to back down. CNN's Jim Bittermann is our senior international correspondent and he is in Paris. Jim?

JIM BITTERMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Don, after nearly four hours of discussions, secretary of state John Kerry and Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov did find some very general areas of agreement. But it's clear they did not get down to brass tacks on very specific items. John Kerry said in a news conference afterwards that there were two main things he was concerned about.

That is that the Ukrainians had to be involved in any kind of decision making about the Ukraine. And that the Russians had to de-escalate the situation by withdrawing troops from the Ukrainian border. According to U.S. intelligence forces, in fact the Russians have 40,000 troops now massed along the Ukrainian border. Here's what John Kerry had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JOHN KERRY, U.S. STATE SECRETARY: Both sides made suggestions today on how we can de-escalate the security as well as the political situation in and around Ukraine. And, yes, we talked very seriously and at length about the impact of the massing of troops and the importance of including the drawdown and - and redeployment of some of those troops with respect to the process moving forward.

We both made suggestions as to how that might be able to be achieved. And I will return to Washington to consult with President Obama about his choices with respect to that. But in the end, let's be clear. It is Ukrainians who have to ultimately agree to or make any decisions with respect to the road ahead. We're trying to find a way to defuse this. De-escalate it. Provide a climate within which good negotiations can take place regarding the other issues.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BITTERMAN: Don, both the Russians and the Americans said the talks should continue, but they did not say where or when. In fact, John Kerry said this was the start of a process to solve things diplomatically rather than militarily. Don?

LEMON: All right. Jim Bittermann, thank you very much. Appreciate that.

Later tonight a CNN original series I need to tell you about. It's a former police officer who was sent to prison in 1988, convicted of murdering an 11-year-old Florida girl. But James Duckett continued to maintain his innocence as he sat on death row for more than a decade. His story, tonight. Make sure you watch CNN's original series "Death Row Stories" tonight 9:00 Eastern right here on CNN.

Let me get back to our special coverage of missing Flight 370 in just a moment. How the United States is helping in the search, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: With each passing day the chance of finding the flight data and cockpit voice recorder from Flight 370 becomes slimmer and slimmer and without those black boxes we may never have an answer to what happened on that flight.

CNN's aviation correspondent Renee Marsh joins us now from Washington with more. So Rene, they were moving ahead because they haven't even found it. Let's say they do find these boxes. How will they analyze them and how long will that process take?

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: You know, we can tell you this. At this point we don't even know which country will get the recorders. Of course the Malaysian authorities will make that decision since they're in charge at this point. As far as the NTSB goes, it is very possible they could be asked to analyze these black boxes.

Again, we don't know if that will be the case. We have one of the most sophisticated lags. Because of that one-third of their work is for essentially, for foreign governments. How fast can they analyze it, Don? Well, the NTSB investigators could potentially once they get the black boxes get a read-out of that first critical data within 24 hours.

LEMON: So how exactly do they get the information off the boxes, Rene?

MARSH: So when they do, if and when they pull them out of the salt water, what they're going to want to do is place it in fresh water. And they will place it in that water for that trip to the lab. Once it gets to the lab, they flush it out with clean water to remove all that salt and the silt and then it is carefully dried.

Then you have a team of about three people who are sitting there and listening the cockpit data recorder, sometimes that group has expanded to six or eight people because they all have to come to a consensus as to what is the wording that they're hearing in each of these transmissions. Sometimes it is not audible so they all have to come to some sort of consensus that this is what we've heard on this cockpit data recorder. Don.

LEMON: So they want to get in and you said they put right into fresh water. Because they're trying to flush that salt water out as soon as possible. Is that right?

MARSH: Right. That's one of the ways, that's one of the methods they do to make sure they preserve it. But yes, as soon as it is pulled out of the salt water, when they transport it, let's say it is transported here to D.C., it will be put in a container with water since that's the condition it was in before. But again, that would be fresh water.

LEMON: All right. Rene Marsh, thank you. Interesting. Appreciate that.

Up next, a closer look at a brand new technology that could prevent a tragedy like this from happening in the future. What if a jet like Malaysian Air Flight 370 could be flown from the ground. If there was an emergency in the air, can you imagine that. That story is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: We're learning new details about the technology that could prevent another plane from suffering the same mysterious fate as Flight 370. It involves flying a passenger jet from the ground. Here's Brian Todd.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Signal, a vanished plane. On the ground a feeling of complete helplessness. But an idea has circulated to put auto pilot on passenger planes on remote control in stressful situations. In 2004, Boeing applied for a patent for a system referred to as Uninterruptible Auto Pilot.

MARK WEISS, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: The ground controller could now take control away from the pilots so that they wouldn't have control over the throttles or the yoke or the rudder pedals and now this would be handled on the ground. So everything now that the pilots would try to do would be inconsequential.

TODD: With this idea the pilots could flick a switch when under stress. Sensors in the cockpit could go off.

(on camera): Or the systems might even have had sensors on the cockpit doors that would have activated the auto pilot if a certain amount of force were used against the cockpit door.

(voice-over): Then ground operators could take control of the plane using radio or satellite signals and stir it to a predetermined airport. They'd be flying almost like a drone.

If Malaysian Airline Flight 370 was hijacked or if a member of the crew purposely did something to alter the path, could this have saved that plane?

WEISS: If in fact, they determined that it was a problem that and tried to get in touch with the pilot and the co-pilot and they couldn't, then if that system were in place, it seems as though the ground controller could then have landed this aircraft.

TODD: Right now auto pilot systems are manually switched on and off only at the discretion of the pilots in the air. And auto pilot cannot land or take off. This potential solution could also present a new problem.

This wouldn't necessarily be hack proof, right?

MARK BASCH, CYBER AND PRIVACY EXPERT: This system wouldn't necessarily be hack proof. And so terrorists might be able to get into this data stream and force the plane to land or do whatever they wanted it to do.

TODD: Has Boeing advanced this idea from 10 years ago? Is the company still testing it out or has it scrapped the idea entirely? We tried multiple times to get more information from Boeing on this project. The company wouldn't speak to us about it.

Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)