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GM CEO Testifies; Iranian Mother Mourns Son; Passengers Cleared; Retrieving Plane Wreckage from the Ocean Floor

Aired April 02, 2014 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: More now on the GM hearings. I want to bring in Poppy Harlow. She joins us from Washington. And CNN global economic analyst Rana Faroohar.

Welcome to both of you.

Poppy, I want to start with you. Mary Barra took questions from reporters after her testimony yesterday. She told you that General Motors is, quote, "moving toward a culture that is focused on the consumer." Read between the lines here. What is she really saying? That wasn't the case before?

POPPY HARLOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, yes. So much of the hearing focused on cost culture versus consumer culture. And here's a quote from her during her House testimony yesterday. "We," GM, "moved from a cost culture to a customer culture." She's talking about the quote/unquote, old GM pre-2009. You know, this is a decade ago. This is 2004 when the company knew that there was this problem and it never was told to the public. It never, they're saying, went up to the highest ranks at General Motors.

So why did it take a decade? She is talking about the difference in culture. I think the question is, this is also coming from a CEO who is not new to GM, Carol. She has been there for decades. She also was someone who worked leading product development and engineering. So a lot of people wanted to know - I just walked down the hall here talking to Senator Claire McCaskill, who's going to head the Senate hearing today, they want to know, how could you not have known or had any indication? You're not new to this company. They really want answers directly from her on that.

COSTELLO: And, Rana, when you hire someone like Ken Feinberg, like GM has, what does that tell you?

RANA FAROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST: Well, it tells you that the stakes are big. You know, this is someone who negotiated the payouts in the 9/11 settlements, the Gulf of Mexico spill. So it shows that they are thinking that there's going to be big money involved and that they're taking remuneration for the victims very seriously.

I think one thing that will be very interesting to see is whether or not you see payouts post-bankruptcy, which legally -

HARLOW: Yes.

FAROOHAR: Unless it's a criminal case, you wouldn't be forced to do.

HARLOW: Yes. I think, Carol, that's an really important point because technically, because GM went bankrupt and became a new company in 2009, they have no legal obligation to pay any civil penalties or fines out before that. But Mary Barra was asked in the questioning yesterday, will they? And she didn't directly answer, but she said, we have, quote, "moral and legal obligations." And, Rana, you know, I think the fact that they brought on Ken Feinberg, this is what he does. He deals with victim compensation.

FAROOHAR: Absolutely.

COSTELLO: All right.

FAROOHAR: And I think that this is part of that culture shift that she wants to engender at the company. She really, really wants to show that this is a new kind of company. That's what this crisis management hinges on.

COSTELLO: OK. So, Poppy, I'm just curious about something. I don't know if you know the answer to me -

HARLOW: Sure.

COSTELLO: But it seems to me Mary Barra, new to the job as CEO, so why not call the last guy to testify, the guy who was there and in charge?

HARLOW: Carol, you and I are on the same page on this one. That is the first question I had when I saw that she was coming to The Hill to testify. I said, wait, what about Rick Wagner who was CEO at GM from 2000 to 2009. And I just asked Senator Claire McCaskill and she said actually, surprisingly (ph), she said, no, we really -- Mary Barra's in charge. We really want to hear from her on this. So she didn't say they wanted to call any of the last four CEOs. This is a company that has had five CEOs in the last five years. I think, you know, a lot of lawmakers would like to hear from all of them.

COSTELLO: I would. Rana Faroohar -

FAROOHAR: Absolutely.

COSTELLO: Poppy Harlow, thanks so much. We're back in a minute.

FAROOHAR: Thank you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: So relatives of those messing on Flight 370 have mourned their loved ones at candlelight vigils and countless news conferences, but the family of one of those passengers, a man who bored the plane with a stolen passport and came under suspicion in the days after the plane went missing, has mourned in silence, staying away from the daily briefing and members of the press. The man has since been cleared of any wrongdoing. CNN's senior international correspondent Sara Sidner has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SARA SIDNER, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Of all the grieving families of missing Flight MH-370, the family of 18- year-old Pouri Nourmohammadi is suffering alone. Nourmohammadi and his friend, Delavar Seyed Mohammad Reza, were two Iranians on the flight. Nourmohammadi family has stayed away from the epicenter of information, not attending briefings or getting the counseling provided by Malaysian Airlines. In this case, the airline says it has not been in contact with the families. Their case, it said, is in the hands of investigators.

Nourmohammadi and Reza boarded Flight MH-370 with stolen passports, able to pass through security without a problem. At first, they came under suspicion, but they were cleared of having anything to do with the plane's disappearance. On FaceBook, his mother pours out her grief. "From the moment I became a mother," she says, "all I wanted and asked from God was to not see my children die before me, but of course that didn't happen."

We tried to talk to Nourmohammadi's mother, but she did not respond to our calls or e-mail. We managed to get in touch with Nourmohammadi's friend who said good-bye to him at the Kuala Lumpur airport on March 8th. He refused to show his face for fear he will be harassed by authorities when he travels to and from Iran. He says Nourmohammadi and his friend Reza are from Christian families, though Nourmohammadi was not particularly religious. Nourmohammadi's FaceBook message four days before he got on that plane shows him standing below the iconic Malaysian skyscraper with the words "feeling excited."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She (ph) was so sad. She (ph) was asking me when my son was there, he was happy, he was enjoying. I said, yeah, as I see, he was happy and he was enjoying. He was OK. Then she (ph) just say, thanks, God.

SIDNER: He says he saw the plane ticket with another man's name on it and questioned him Nourmohammadi about it. Ultimately, Nourmohammadi would only say he was trying to leave Iran forever to live with his mother in Germany.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He said, there is more freedom. There is more freedom there.

SIDNER: Instead, he disappeared with the other 238 people aboard Flight MH-370. His mother left these words for her missing son. "I dedicated my life to my son," she says, "and all I wanted was for them to be happy in life. I wanted them to live a free life. I had prayed that I would see them again, but that didn't happen. We will see each other in eternity now."

Sara Sidner, CNN, Kuala Lumpur.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: As I told you at the top of the show, Malaysian investigators have called the disappearance of Flight 370 a, quote, "criminal act." But they also added that they have cleared all 239 passengers on board that plane. They're centering their investigation now on the cockpit, on those two men at the controls. Dr. Mary Ellen O'Toole is a former senior FBI profiler. She joins me live from Washington.

Welcome.

MARY ELLEN O'TOOLE, FORMER SENIOR FBI PROFILER: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Does it seem unusual that Malaysian investigators have managed to clear all 237 passengers on board in three weeks?

O'TOOLE: Well, it depends on the amount of manpower that they had to conduct all the necessary investigations and then how long that it took for them to vet the information. So if they had enough investigators, which, you know, I'm sure that they did, then it's certainly possible they could have done that.

COSTELLO: And they're looking into the psychological backgrounds of all of these people. So can you kind of take us through what they look at specifically?

O'TOOLE: Sure. In terms of the psychological backgrounds, and that would include the mental health issues as well, they'd be looking for any kind of possible motive. And I would break it down into four categories, political, religious, the lone wolf, suicidal or homicidal. So they would be looking for issues in each passenger's background that would give them a sense as to whether or not a person had been generating some kind of ideation about political -- strong political motives or thoughts. The same with religious thoughts, of grievances. The same with kind of a lone wolf philosophy. They would be - and that would be apparent when they talked to people. That would be apparent when they would look at computers, journals, diaries, that sort of thing to see, are they really committed to some kind of a cause. They feel like they've been mistreated, that sort of thing.

And then they're also be looking for people that have been sort of considering a suicide and/or homicide. But all of that comes with not just talking to people, it comes from looking at their computers, their writings, talking to friends, but really getting into the nuances of what's been going on in their lives over the last say 24, 36 hours, and then going back over a period of time maybe to a month or two months. So that's kind of how they would probably vet those individuals.

COSTELLO: Right. So it seems as if investigators are focusing on who was in the cockpit. They're focusing on a person who would be expert at flying a 777, right? So they say that the plane did make that deliberate westward turn, right? And then it flew on for seven hours. And we really don't know what happened. But let's assume that a person in the cockpit did this knowingly, planned it? Is there a profile of such a person?

O'TOOLE: No. We can't profile an individual because of one particular criminal act. You have to go back and you have to look at, again, motivation and you break it into the category of political, religious, lone wolf, suicidal or homicidal. And in that category, that's where we see a lot of the mass murders today who feel that they've been wronged, treated poorly by maybe their employer, they have a view of the world where the world is against them and they decide to take some kind of action and they view other human beings as objects. So you look at it in terms of which one of those four categories is it most likely the person would fall into and then you go back in their background and you start looking for those themes.

COSTELLO: Right. Mary Ellen O'Toole, thank you so much for your insight. I appreciate it.

O'TOOLE: You're welcome.

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM, cockpit changes for Malaysia Airlines and new rules now in place after the disappearance of that flight. Martin Savidge is in our cockpit simulator to take us through.

Good morning.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

Yes, ever since 9/11, of course, the fear of fortifying this cockpit's been really primary. But what happens if the person in the cockpit goes rogue? We'll talk about that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM, cockpit changes for Malaysia Airlines and new rules now in place after the disappearance of that flight.

Martin Savidge is in our cockpit simulator to take us through. Good morning.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. Yes, ever since 9/11, of course, the fear of fortifying this cockpit has been really primary. But what happens if the person in the cockpit goes rogue? We'll talk about that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: In the wake of Flight 370, Malaysia Airlines is changing some of its security procedures inside the cockpit. That includes bringing in a senior cabin steward whenever the captain or the first officer leaves flight control, leave the cockpit. For more on these rules, let's head to our flight simulator. Martin Savidge is there along with pilot trainer Mitchell Casado. Welcome to both of you.

SAVIDGE: Good morning Carol.

COSTELLO: Good morning so take us through how these new rules will work.

SAVIDGE: Well, the interesting thing and Mitchell and I were discussing this Carol is that you know these new rules, they may be new rules for Malaysian Airlines, but actually they've been standard practice and procedure for a lot of domestic and even international carriers as far as making sure that the pilot or co-pilot are never alone inside the cockpit right?

MITCHELL CASADO, PILOT TRAINER, 777 COCKPIT SIMULATOR: That's absolutely correct. Yes.

SAVIDGE: How do they enforce it? What do they do?

CASADO: You know it's something that we as pilots we get together with the flight crew before -- the cabin crew before the flight and we talk about all of those procedures. And we just make sure that everybody is on the same page.

SAVIDGE: The way it would work as far as you know if a pilot has to get up, use the restroom or maybe wants to get a drink of some sort, then what would happen as is this is the case with Malaysian Airlines is senior flight attendant would step inside the cockpit to basically keep an eye on the other person there?

CASADO: That's absolutely right. Yes.

SAVIDGE: You want to make sure that they don't do any harm or do anything wrong while the other pilot is out of the cockpit. So that's step number one.

And the other step that Mitchell is referring to is that the whole crew is briefed on how to be secure. In other words, it's not just up to the pilot and co-pilot. The whole crew works at protecting this very space, Carol.

COSTELLO: But, still, once that cockpit door is closed, you know, and whoever is in there, the pilot, the co-pilot and somebody else, the people outside of that door still can't get in, right?

SAVIDGE: Right. There's no question that the doors were heavily reinforced after 9/11. They've become much stronger.

CASADO: That's right. It is impossible to get in if you're on the outside of that door.

SAVIDGE: On this particular aircraft is it an electronic lock or a physical lock system?

CASADO: There is a mechanical and electronic lock. So even with the door, there is backups, like everything else on the plane.

SAVIDGE: So you could, in essence, I know like on the -- on the dash right here, there is an electronic switch to lock the door.

CASADO: Yes sure.

SAVIDGE: And then there is also a bolting system as well.

CASADO: That's right yes.

SAVIDGE: But once a person is in, any way to get them out.

CASADO: If he had some kind of explosive, or maybe try that destroy the door with an explosive maybe but you'd be compromising the rest of the aircraft.

SAVIDGE: It is a real problem, that's trying to preserve the cockpit from anyone coming from the outside in. But still if somebody is in there, it does make it very hard to get them out.

COSTELLO: Martin Savidge and Mitchell Casado -- many thanks.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, how do you haul plane wreckage from the ocean floor? We'll take a look at how salvagers could bring up parts of Flight 370.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: If searchers are able to locate where Flight 370 went down, salvagers will take over sending a submersible to hopefully retrieve those black boxes. CNN's Randi Kaye has more for you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): This is what it looks like trying to recover an airplane in the ocean. You are watching a U.S. Navy salvage team gather pieces of TWA Flight 800 which went down off New York in 1996. Here divers are maneuvering among pieces of the twisted wreckage.

CAPT. RAYMOND SCOTT MCCORD, FORMER SUPERVISOR OF SALVAGE, U.S. NAVY (Ret.): The U.S. Navy actually has recovered an intact helicopter from about 17,000 feet. So they have the capability. They have done this before.

KAYE: Retired Navy Captain, Chip McCord, has been involved in at least 50 ocean salvage operations, including TWA 800 and Swiss Air Flight 111 which crashed in 1998 off the coast of Nova Scotia. Those were both in water much shallower than the Indian Ocean. But the Navy has remote underwater vehicles designed for deep water salvage operations.

They can go as deep as 20,000 feet. But the deeper the recovery, the slower the process.

MCCORD: It takes about an hour for every 1,000 feet that you need to descend. So if you are going to 11,000 feet, you can count on 11 hours to get down.

KAYE: At those depths, its pitch black. So the underwater vehicles are equipped with lights and cameras. They are also outfitted with sonar to scout for debris. They are steered by two operators on board the ship above who use instant feedback from the salvage vehicle cameras to direct the robotic arms.

MCCORD: They can hover, they can move left, right, forward, and aft and go to where they need, very carefully hover over a piece and pick it up if they need to.

KAYE: Remember Air France Flight 447 which crashed in the Atlantic Ocean in 2009 two years later an unmanned underwater vehicle found the debris field for that flight 13,000 feet beneath the surface. The engines were pulled from the ocean floor.

If Flight 370 is found, search teams are prepared to do the same.

MCCORD: If it is small like the black boxes, you can put a little basket and the ROV and the arm so the ROV can pick it up and put in the basket.

KAYE: But the remote underwater vehicle can only carry about 4,000 pounds. So anything heavier, like a large piece of the fuselage, will have to be attached to a cable and pulled to the surface by a crane on the ship.

(on camera): Keep in mind, this could be happening miles below the surface -- an incredibly difficult task. Still, no doubt, salvage teams will keep their eyes peeled for the black box, hoping to get some much-needed answers first.

Randi Kaye, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)