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Updates in the Search for Flight 370; Ukraine Sets Monday Deadline; Deadly Shooting in Kansas City; Russia Calls for Urgent U.N. Security Council Meeting; Search for Malaysia Flight 370
Aired April 13, 2014 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Don Lemon.
We are going to begin with two big breaking news stories tonight.
First, shots fired at religious community center outside Kansas City. And we are hearing now that three people are dead. I'm talking about Overland Park, Kansas at a Jewish community center of greater Kansas city. We don't have the many details yet. It only happened a short time ago.
I want to go straight to CNN's George Howell. He is here to tell us about this. He is watching this breaking developments here right now.
George, what have you learned?
GEORGE HOWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, keeping in touch with the sources, what we know at this point, again, as you mentioned, three people died in this series of shootings happened in two different locations. And this point, investigators have a person of interest. Taken into custody.
I want to point out that, Don, that this happened at the Jewish community center. And also an assisted living facility. And at the Jewish community center, we understand that a dance recital and dance competition was actually taking place at the time. There were several teenagers, a lot of people in the building. The building is on lockdown. It was told that to be put on lockdown and the teens were told, Don, to get on the ground, to go to the locker rooms, get on the floor, to seek shelter, to get the safety as the shots rang out. But again we're keeping in touch with the sources to find out more investigators could determine from this. Three people kill in the Overland Park area, a very busy part of Kansas city and one person of interest has been taken into custody.
LEMON: All right, George. And so, what do we know about this community center? Is it a very active place? There can't have been incidents there before.
HOWELL: Right. We don't know about incidents. We'll look into that as far as the history, the background there. But again, this happened on a weekend. A lot of people were there. And as I mentioned, you know, a dance recital, a dance competition was taking place at the time. We understand that a lot of people were in the building. All the teens basically had to get out of harm's way. They were all ushered into the locker rooms, told to seek shelter as the shooting took place.
LEMON: All right, George Howell joining us now with the latest information. We'll continue to follow this from Kansas. Rabbi Herbert Mandl is going to join us. He is the chaplain for the Overland Park, Kansas police department. He'll join us in just a little bit to talk about this.
But again, as George Howell said, three people involved in the shooting and they believe that a shooter is in custody right now. And this is obviously the eve of Passover beginning tomorrow when all of this is happening. It is very odd that this is happening now.
Again, we don't have many details. This is happening in just a short time ago. Shots fired in religious community center. And according to our George Howell, at least three people involved in this incident, three dead from this.
I want to join now Rabbi Herbert Mandl. What can you tell us?
RABBI HERBERT MANDL, CHAPLAIN FOR THE OVERLAND PARK POLICE DEPARTMENT (via phone): Well, unfortunately, three people have passed away that have been shot. At least one was a teenager from the Jewish community center who was in the theater when the first shooting took place. We know that there is a suspect in custody who reportedly was starting the Nazi (ph) slogan and he was being taken away by Overland Park police. Both accident scenes, both shooting scenes are now under control. There's nothing actively going on at this time. And that's all the information that we have at the moment.
LEMON: You said the --
MANDL: There's been a tremendous amount of security build-up across the Jewish community. The police is wonderful. I mean, there are police cars at every Jewish facility now as a precaution at this point until everything settles down.
LEMON: And you said he was uttering neo Nazi slurs as he killed the people?
MANDL: Yes. I was not at the scene but I have been told that he was yelling Heil, Hitler. He was being taken away in cuffs.
LEMON: Three dead, are they -- can you explain --
MANDL: In his 70s which is incredible.
LEMON: The suspect you believe is a senior in his 70s?
MANDL: That's what I have been told. I, again, was not at the scene. But he is apparent an older gentleman and asking people before he shot if they were Jewish or not. Person identified as the village Shilom as being Jewish, he then shot. This sounds like a very much like a hate crime. LEMON: Everyone, again, you know, the information is just coming in. You are getting it as we are. Speaking with Rabbi Mandl of the Overland Park, Kansas police department about a shooting at a Jewish community center.
Three people confirmed dead now. And according to the Rabbi on the phone, the man who is believed responsible for this went through the center asking people if they were Jewish. He says uttering neo-Nazi slurs to people and then shooting them.
Is everyone that was hurt, everyone involved in this, is it all in the same part of the community center, Rabbi?
MANDL: No, no, no. Two at the Jewish community center and he traveled about a mile to the Jewish retirement home village Shilom where the third individual was shot and then killed. Two different shooting scenes about a mile apart.
LEMON: Got you.
MANDL: He then took off and was arrested about a mile away and parking lot of an elementary school, all in Overland park.
LEMON: OK. I'm -- again, just getting this information as you're telling me here, yes. And so, there were teenagers at this community center when this happened.
MANDL: Correct. There was an audition for a play going on at the time. And I know at least one of the deceased is a teenage male.
LEMON: And this is the eve of Passover?
MANDL: Yes. Tomorrow night's Passover.
LEMON: Yes. What -- you know, it's just very strange that this would happen, and obviously, I don't know if it's -- if the Passover holiday has anything to do with it. But for someone running through the center and going back to the retirement home or to the retirement home and then killing someone as well is very odd. And you say this would appear in your estimation to be a hate crime, right?
MANDL: I only say that because of his uttering. Apparently quoted to him being arrested and point in that direction.
LEMON: Right. How many people were --
MANDL: -- before you shoot. That also sounds very much like a hate crime.
LEMON: Yes. How many people at the community center were the teenagers?
MANDL: I don't know how many people were there. Again, I was not at the scene. I don't know how many people. But apparently, sizable enough. And supposed auditions were going on. Somewhat of an attendance. In the theater of the community center. LEMON: Yes. And this is extremely out of the ordinary for the community?
MANDL: Unheard of. I've been in the community for 37 years and never had anything like this. Very settled, stable, friendly community. Very, very unusual for Kansas, the metro area, Overland park. Never anything like this in the area.
LEMON: And you say you believe the suspect is in his 70s. Do you have any idea who he is?
MANDL: No, no. That's not been released to anybody. I do not know and that, you know, again, I heard this from one of my dispatchers told me they heard it was a gentleman who was 74 years old who was making it even stranger.
LEMON: And you don't know if he has any connection to the center or to --
MANDL: No idea. No idea. It's too soon I think for the details to come out but the three people are deceased. That is definite now.
LEMON: How big of a Jewish community in the Kansas city, in this area?
MANDL: There are approximately 20,000 Jews in the metro area.
LEMON: And no recent incidents that would lead to this sort of thing? Nothing has happened?
MANDL: Nothing, never. A friendly, quiet, stable city. This s just like the Oklahoma city thing. They came out of left field. You know? Never would have predicted anything like that for our community.
LEMON: So, three people who are dead and you said you believe it's one of them is a teenager you know for sure. Correct?
MANDL: Yes, a male teenager who is I guess part of the audition program.
LEMON: And you don't know about the other two?
MANDL: Do not know. It was an older woman that I think was shot and killed at the retirement home, coming out when he came swinging by.
LEMON: And do you know about -- he was going -- yes. He was going into the -- so you left the auditions at the community center and was going into the retirement home.
MANDL: Correct.
LEMON: And on the way in you believe he shot what you believe is an older woman.
MANDL: That's correct. The Jewish retirement home is about a mile away from the community center. LEMON: And did you say that he was trying to drive away and that's when police caught up with him or did they catch him with --?
MANDL: I think there was a chase. I'm not sure. I just know that he was apprehended a mile away in the parking lot of an elementary school.
LEMON: Mile away at the parking lot in an Elementary school. OK. And what about the other injuries? I know that there at least two people injured?
MANDL: The two -- well, as far as I know -- I know the three fatalities. I'm not aware of anything else. One was seriously injured and apparently died. That was the one that was -- I don't know of any other injuries or anybody else. I don't know of anyone else in a life threatening situation I'm aware of.
LEMON: Can you give me a time --
MANDL: -- not released.
LEMON: Can you give me a time, Rabbi, when this started specifically?
MANDL: Yes. The shooting took place at the center almost exactly 1:00 and the second shooting was about 15 minutes later.
LEMON: 1:00 and then 1:15. Rabbi, don't go anywhere. I want to update our viewers here.
If you're just tuning in, there's been a shooting at a Jewish community center and also in Jewish retirement home in Overland park, Kansas. Here's what we know from the rabbi who's also part of the police department.
Apparently, this is according again to the gentleman we have on the phone. We are going to speak with him in just a little bit. There was a suspect he believes in the 70s, maybe 74 years old, went to a Jewish community center. There was an audition for a play, a number of teenagers, young people there. It is believed that he shot two people there and killed them. Got in the car and went to a Jewish retirement home on his way into that retirement home.
I am being told by the police now, the rabbi, he is on the phone that he shot an elderly woman it is believed and killed her. Three people here dead. Initially one of the people had very serious injuries and died from that. And according to, again, rabbi who's on the phone now, he got back into the car and apprehended at an elementary school.
Rabbi Herbert Mandl joining us now. He is a chaplain for the Overland park, Kansas police department.
Rabbi, update us again on this. I mean, this is a horrific event to happen on the eve of Passover, any time, as a matter of fact.
MANDL: Yes, the timing is terrible. Timing is awful. And I guess more details will, you know, come out over the next few hours, you know, to names and details and hopefully this is -- from what I understand from my contacts, this is a one person event and hopefully that's under control now with the person apprehended, the suspect.
LEMON: And Rabbi, you said that this guy was uttering allegedly uttering anti-schematic slurs, a neo Nazi slurs, as he went about his business of killing people.
MANDL: As he was being arrested.
LEMON: As he was being arrested. But didn't you say he was going through at one point asking people if they were Jewish before --
MANDL: That's correct. I understand, again, I was not on the scene. But I understand that he was in the JCC, the Jewish community center, he was asking if you're Jewish or not. And if you answered yes, he shot and he did the same thing as village Shilom at the retirement home.
LEMON: As a chaplain there, I would imagine that you are deeply connected to the community. How are people dealing with this?
MANDL: Well, you know, the community will come together. We've come together when there have been other crises in the community. It is a very tight community, it is a very close community. And you know, we will survive. This will move on.
LEMON: Rabbi, our thoughts are with you. Rabbi will join us throughout the evening here on CNN as he gets free. We know that he's very busy there.
But Rabbi, we appreciate it. Again, our thoughts with you here on CNN.
Three people shot and killed in Kansa City in Overland, Kansas, I should say there in Kansas city Overland Park where according to the police a man, they believe in his 70s, went into a Jewish community center, shot two people at an audition for a play. One of those young people is a teenager and then got into his car, went to a Jewish retirement home, shot another woman, initially. These are the initial reports in her 70s. Killed her and according to the police he was saying anti-schematic slurs and Heil Hitler as he went through asking people if they were Jewish and shooting them.
We are going to keep you updated on this breaking news story throughout the evening here on CNN.
We have another big breaking new story to tell you about, this one involves Ukraine and there is an emergency session of the United Nations security council that has been scheduled for tonight as a result. That story after a very quick break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: We are following breaking news on a number of different new stories. The first story I want to tell you about, this was coming from Overland Park, Kansas, a suburb of Kansas city. Three people shot and killed. Two of them shot at a Jewish community center. The other shot at a Jewish retirement home. Three people are dead at this point. According to the police, they believe it is a senior citizen who did the shooting. A man in his 70s they say, who was going about the community center and the retirement home asking people if they were Jewish before shooting them. Also, when he was apprehended later in an elementary school parking lot according to the police the man was repeating Heil Hitler.
We'll continue to following this breaking news story for you. We won't go far away from that.
We are also following a number of breaking developments out of Ukraine.
(VIDEO CLIP PLAYING)
LEMON: Weeks after pro-Russian forces seized buildings in Crimea. We are seeing a disturbingly similar pattern to a merging now in eastern Ukraine. Pro-Russian forces have seized government buildings in several cities across the east and just hours ago Ukraine's acting president set a Monday deadline for those pro-Russian militants to lay down arms or face a full-scale operation.
And then there's a video of northeastern Ukraine. It reportedly shows a Ukrainian citizen lying beaten at a subway station, pro-Russians are scene at the station attacking Ukrainian activists but CNN hasn't been able to authenticate this video.
United Nations will hold an emergency meeting on the crisis tonight at the request of Russia. We are going to have more on that and then reaction of the White House in a moment.
But first, we want to go straight to CNN's Nick Paton Walsh live in Donetsk, Ukraine.
So Nick, we have seen this before. What's going on now?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's been remarkable change in the tone of what's happening here in eastern Ukraine, in just the last 36 hours, Don.
We are now seeing a number of towns, if you look at the map, they form a circle around this, the main city of Donetsk isolating towards the Russian border. But in each of those towns, pro-Russian militants backed up by pro-Russian protesters is taking on the government buildings there, they are taking over police stations in (INAUDIBLE). The key players where a lot of the violence first started, where the police station and securities have including -- there was supposed to be an anti-terror operation according to the interior minister to remove those militants. But that really didn't seem to get much further than the outskirts where cross fire was exchanged with the Ukrainian security personnel they are trying to get in. One of them was killed, five of them injured. So, no real sign of the Ukrainian government inside that town or in another place we visited (INAUDIBLE), where also militants stormed the police station there too.
Many concern of this deadline. We have swiftly towards this 9:00 local time tomorrow morning. We have this emergency session of the U.N. Security Council being called in New York just hours from when I'm speaking now. That's obviously a chance for Russia to address its broader grievances. It says the west has found a way out of stopping Ukraine slipping in for civil war. It blames Ukraine for declaring war on its own citizens. A lot are very chance rhetoric here. And of course, Don, the key thing, put it out in Russian troops just on the other side of the Ukrainian-Russian border. Many concerned they may intervene if Ukraine's army felt in fact, finds the manpower and the motivation to move again the protesters here. Extraordinary tense hours ahead, Don.
LEMON: Absolutely.
Nick Paton Walsh, thank you very much for that.
We want to go now to Washington and CNN's Erin McPike joins me now live.
Erin, how's the White House responding to today's developments in Ukraine? Are they -- have they step up sanctions or stepped up sanctions likely?
ERIN MCPIKE, CNN GENERAL ASSIGNMENT CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, the Obama administration has been threatening increased sanctions. And officials more forceful about that this weekend.
U.S. ambassador to the United Nations Samantha Power on "ABC this week" and she address third degree.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SAMANTHA POWER, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UNITED NATIONS: I think we have seen that the sanctions can bite and if actions like the kind of a few days continue you see a ramping up of those sanctions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCPIKE: Now, U.S. secretary of state John Kerry has repeatedly warned his Russian counterpart Sergey Lavrov that Russia risks more prevailing sanctions if the Russian military does not pull back troops. And now, that U.S. officials are being vocal about blaming the government in Moscow for backing and even coordinating these attacks in eastern Ukraine, Kerry told Lavrov by phone late last night that if they don't stop, there will be additional consequences likely in the form of increased sanctions. But the White House has yet to issue its reaction to this new news of the U.N. security council meeting tonight. But the administration is stepping up the actions as Kerry is headed to Geneva to meet Thursday with Lavrov in person as well as leaders of the European Union so they can try to hammer out a diplomatic solution events though they haven't been able to do that yet. Now, the following Tuesday, Vice president Joe Biden will go to Kiev to meet with new Ukrainian government leaders to assist their preparations for those May elections. And he'll also provide council to Ukraine as they tries to resist what they see as sabotage from Russia in the efforts, Don.
LEMON: All right. Erin McPike, thank you very much. We appreciate that.
We'll have more on the breaking news coming up here on CNN.
Also. our panel of experts to weigh in on the missing plane, day 38 now for the search of missing flight 370. What should be next? And is failure an option? I'm going to ask my panel. Don't go anywhere.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Breaking news here on CNN.
Three people are dead at a shooting at a Jewish community center and a Jewish retirement home in Overland Park, Kansas. Overland park, Kansas, a suburb of Kansas city. We're hearing that the suspect, a man believed to be in his 70s, went into the community center where they were holding auditions for a play and shot and killed two people. One of them a teenager. Got into his car and then went to a Jewish retirement home and killed a woman on his way in there and then left and was apprehended by police at a parking lot of an elementary school yelling Heil Hitler. Also at the community center it is believed he went around asking people if they're Jewish.
We'll continue to update you on this story. Three people dead in Kansas. We will keep you updated on that.
Now, we want to get to the case of flight 370. The battery deadline, likely passed here. The black box pings, well, completely silent. The families living in limbo. But no one is ready to throw in the towel just yet.
Top Malaysian officials reaffirming today, we must find the black boxes if the mystery of the missing airliner is to be solved. Search teams took a different approach today increasing the search area significantly by almost 40 percent and in less than an hour planes will take to the skies yet again in the -- as dawn breaks in Perth, Australia.
And the search shifts from listening to looking, all right? So we are back now with the mystery of flight 370.
Our panel of experts is here. CNN's aviation analyst and pilot Les Abend. Also mission 31 expedition leader and ocean explorer, Fabien Cousteau, you may recognized obviously his last name and then CNN aviation analyst and pilot Miles O'Brien, CNN aviation analyst and former transportation department inspector general Mary Schiavo, and CNN and contributor for the "Daily Beast" and senior consulting editor for Conde Nast Traveler Clive Irving.
OK. I got that out.
Mary, why the larger search area today? Does that tell you anything about the people running the search?
MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, yes. It does. It tells me that they want to try just in a last couple of days of effort for a make one last big look to see if there's any hope whatsoever of finding wreckage.
These many days ended the search. Clearly, if there is even wreckage, it's spread even further than before. And before they put those Bluefins in the water to start mapping the ocean floor, I think it was one last-ditch effort to please, you know, send us some wreckage so we can, again, know we're in the right spot.
LEMON: OK. So I said that they increased the search area by 40 percent.
Fabien, how do they calculate the search area each day? What factors do they take into account?
FABIEN COUSTEAU, MISSION 31 EXPEDITION LEADER, OCEAN EXPLORER: Well, as far as the surface area of the water, they probably take into account, of course, the currents, the weather patterns and of course the wind and maybe carrying that debris that may be floating at the surface in different directions.
LEMON: OK. We have much more in a little bit here on CNN. But again, we are going o continue to follow this story and also the breaking news coming out of Kansas where three people have been shot at a community center. More on flight 370 in just a bit.
But first, bloody clashes are erupting in Ukraine. The U.N. security council will soon meet to talk it over.
Plus, there is a critical deadline set for tomorrow that could have big impact on the fragile nation's future.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Breaking news update for you right now. Three people are dead and a community is in shock after police say a gunman went on a shooting rampage. It is Overland Park, Kansas. It is a suburb of Kansas City. Witnesses say a man with a gun opened fire on people at a Jewish community center after asking them if they were Jewish. One of the people killed at the community center is a teenage boy.
And that's not all, the gunman then drove to a Jewish retirement home where police say he shot and killed an older woman. The suspect is in custody and witnesses say he is an older man who was shouting "Heil Hitler" while being arrested.
Make sure you stay with CNN for more developments. And again, here's a little bit more. We're getting more now from the Overland Park, Kansas, city hall. They posted this on their official Facebook page. They're giving us details saying it happened around 1:00. When Overland Park Police received multiple calls regarding a shooting on the campus of the Jewish community center giving the address of the community center, and then saying additional calls were received by police of another shooting at the Village Shalom Retirement Community Center.
The victims are confirmed deceased. A person of interest has been taken into custody at this time. There will be a news conference at 5:00 p.m. at the fire training center. And so if we get that news conference and the information from that we'll bring it to you.
But again three people are dead from a shooting in Overland Park, Kansas. Two people shot at a Jewish community center. The other person at a Jewish retirement home. We're following that.
Also, breaking news out of Ukraine to report. The U.N. Security Council will soon hold an urgent meeting at Russia's request. The unscheduled meeting comes after a sudden spike in bloodshed in the fragile nation. Ukraine's acting president sent a harsh warning to pro-Russia separatists. His message, back off by Monday or prepare for violence. Russia's Foreign minister says Ukraine authorities must stop the war against their own people.
I want to bring in our senior United Nations correspondent Mr. Richard Roth.
Richard, thank you so much for joining us. What are your sources telling you about this urgent U.N. Security Council meeting?
RICHARD ROTH, CNN UNITED NATIONS CORRESPONDENT: Well, there's been increasing concern for weeks about developments in Ukraine. Violence, takeovers of buildings by pro-Russian supporters as Ukraine soldiers stand by, now as you mentioned this deadline about the government ready to use force to stop them.
Who's backing who. The widening crisis in Ukraine. And so here at the U.N. in a few hours we're going to have an urgent Security Council meeting. Maybe behind closed doors. Some countries want it to be an open public session so they can publicly make their case and lodge accusations against other countries.
The U.N. has not been able to take any coordinated action in this affair because Russia is a permanent member of the Security Council and has a veto. So there is widespread interest in having this event. This could be like the tenth I think U.N. meeting over the last five weeks but it has not done anything to resolve this crisis.
The U.N. does provide a forum. Ukraine is pushing for this meeting to be held in a public forum. We'll see what the Russian ambassador says. Will Moscow verbally make its case for why it has to take action of its own? As we know there are thousands of tanks, planes and other armaments on the border for weeks now, and the U.S., as the ambassador, Samantha Power of the U.N. said Sunday morning in New York and Washington today that the trouble at a one Ukraine town was coordinated professional, Don, and it had all the earmarks of what Russia did in Crimea.
Back to you.
LEMON: What sort of sanctions could the council take? What are we looking at? Sanctions or troops?
ROTH: There's no way there's going to be any sanctions as long as Russia would have to approve. The Russian veto already used several weeks ago on a resolution which was milder than sanctions. As for troops, so far no country has been willing to have their own forces go to Ukraine in support. There have been many verbal promises of aid and tough, ugly consequences as Senator Kerry once put it, but nothing really happened the next day.
And then some feel that President Putin has been emboldened by that. The Russians have said they don't have any intent of going into eastern Europe -- eastern Ukraine. Let's see what happens in the next few days.
LEMON: All right. Thank you very much, U.N. correspondent Richard Roth.
Ukraine's president says he won't stand for another Crimea scenario inside his fragile nation. He says pro-Russia separatists in eastern Ukraine have until Monday to back down.
Is Ukraine on the verge of a bloody civil war?
Joining me now by phone is the "Daily Beast" senior national security correspondent Josh Rogin.
Josh, thank you so much for joining us. Do you think the U.N. Security Council will emerge with a tough action plan or just tough talk?
JOSH ROGIN, SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT, THE DAILY BEAST: The U.N. Security Council meeting is largely symbolic. The real action here is behind the scenes both inside the Obama administration and between the U.S. government and the EU. The Obama administration had previously been waiting until a Thursday meeting in Geneva between the U.S., the EU, Russia and Ukrainian governments. But now over the weekend they've shifted strategies, we've reported today in the "Daily Beast."
And now they are contacting their EU partners to try to ready new and tough sanctions to release against the Russians as early as Monday or Tuesday. This is a reflection of the grave and worsening situation in eastern Ukraine and also an acknowledgment by the U.S. government that they do believe that the forces are not only being aided by Russia but actually Russian special operations forces are inside eastern Ukraine, according to the State Department. wearing the same uniforms they wore in Crimea with advanced weapons, crossing another line that the Obama administration hope it is Russians would never cross.
LEMON: So, Josh, if -- Richard Roth said, you know, no sanctions probably. No troops definitely. So if nothing is going to happen, why even have this meeting? ROGIN: The meeting is a show of support in the international community. It's likely that almost all of the Security members -- Security Council members will condemn the Russian incursion into eastern Ukraine that is ongoing. They will not be able to produce a statement because that requires consensus. But it's one more way to put pressure on Vladimir Putin to reverse course.
Again, this is largely symbolic. We'll see whether the U.S. and the EU can agree to broad sanctions against sectors of the Russian economy. If the EU does not agree to that, the U.S. government is likely to move forward with more targeted sanctions against more Russian businessmen, politicians, and the institutions that they frequent. So this is an ongoing diplomatic game. It is playing out in real time. And it will play over the next few days.
LEMON: Josh Rogin of "The Daily Beast," thank you much -- thanks so much for that.
The plane mystery has sparked many rumors. Was it hijacked or is the plane on the ground in Afghanistan? And on and on. We're going to break down these conspiracy theories coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right. Breaking news update for you. Three people dead after police say a gunman went on a shooting rampage in Overland Park, Kansas, near Kansas City. Witnesses say a man with a gun opened fire on people at a Jewish community center after asking them if they were Jewish. And then one of the people killed at the community center is a teenage boy. The gunman then drove to a Jewish retirement home where police say he shot and killed an older woman.
The suspect now is in custody. Witnesses say he's an older man who was shouting "Heil Hitler" while being arrested.
Make sure you stay with CNN for this breaking news coverage. Also we're awaiting a news conference fairly soon. We'll update you on that as we get it.
You know, people have a tendency to try to explain the unknown. That's why the missing Malaysia Airlines jet has led to many conspiracy theories.
Here are just a few of them. The plane landed at a military base in Diego Garcia. Heard that a lot. Why aren't you reporting on that? It's on an -- it's an island located at the South Indian Ocean. The U.S. denies that claim.
Another theory, the plane and passengers are on the ground in Kandahar, Afghanistan. And everyone is alive. I've heard that, as well. A Russian newspaper says unknown terrorists are holding them hostages. And could this mystery be the world's first cyber hijack? An expert claims cyber terrorists hijacked the plane's security software and redirected the jet.
Radar engineer Rick Castaldo joins me now. Rick, what's your take on these conspiracy theories?
RICK CASTALDO, RADAR ENGINEER: Well, I think the argument that a cyber terrorist hijacked the plane is ludicrous. Those 777s, you are not allowed to upload anything from down on the ground. There is no data link that allows you to get directly into the FMS and hijack the aircraft. That's beyond the realm of possibility to me.
LEMON: The 777 pilot we have here as an analyst Les Abend is shaking his head in agreement saying, absolutely, right.
CASTALDO: Well, he's probably a very smart guy if he flies a 777.
LEMON: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
LES ABEND, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Thank you, sir.
LEMON: He would like to think so.
Anyway, and so what about the whole Diego Garcia thing?
CASTALDO: Well, you know, I was on a few weeks ago and I said do not discount the fact that the plane could have went north. The focus at that time was on a very poor picture from a Chinese satellite. Far away from what would have been the maximum extent the plane could have went with a full load of fuel. That would have required a trained pilot flying at the optimum altitude.
So after they took a look at the Inmarsat data and ping they looked at the north route and the south route, so frankly, I'm not -- you know, I haven't looked at Diego Garcia. Heavily with U.S. Navy, military base, I find it hard to believe that a 777 could land there without the Americans knowing about it.
LEMON: Yes. And we have looked into that and it's highly unlikely. Most people say impossible.
CASTALDO: Indonesia, Don, would be -- would be more likely as well as Pakistan. And the theory that the radars would have picked him up I disagree with. Vehemently.
LEMON: Really? So that --
(CROSSTALK)
CASTALDO: A trained pilot would know where to fly.
LEMON: That's your most logical explanation for the plane's disappearance other than that it's at the bottom of the ocean? Is that -- you said Pakistan and why don't you believe radar would have picked it up?
CASTALDO: Well, first of all, the radar infrastructure over in Asia is maintained terribly in my opinion. I find it hard to believe that an altitude scanning radar used for air defense or air traffic control is maintained to the same standard that we would in the United States.
I will remind you that we had airplanes in this country during 9/11, we have over 450 search radars and we lost them. These are first-rate maintained radars by FAA technicians and U.S. military so it's not unusual that an airplane could evade search radar.
LEMON: Yes. We lost him for a short period of time, though. I mean, this has been prolonged over -- go ahead.
CASTALDO: Yes. But -- but frankly, it was only lost for a short period of time over there. We -- what we don't know is whether or not the plane really made a left turn after it left Malaysian air space and contacted Hanoi control. We have one report from an undocumented source from somewhere in Malaysia from one radar. And frankly, I discount that.
LEMON: Yes. And so you're not believing this Inmarsat data, the guy who came up with the calculation of -- with a probably of where the plane went down. You're not -- you don't believe that?
CASTALDO: Well, I believe it's very difficult. It's not new math. It's a common processing technique, Doppler signature. But remember that geo stationery satellite is 24,300 miles up. Those air craft fly tangentially to that to record and decode Doppler signatures that give you direction, very difficult. And I frankly am a bit skeptical.
LEMON: All right. Rick, stick around. We want to talk more about this with our panel. That's coming up right after a quick break along with the latest on the shooting in Overland Park, Kansas, and the escalating crisis in Ukraine. All of that coming up in the newsroom after a very quick break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Welcome back, everyone. Don Lemon here. Breaking news update for you, three people are dead after shootings at two Jewish facilities in Kansas City -- in the Kansas City area. One of the people killed in the center, a teenage boy.
Overland Park Police news conference scheduled less than 10 minutes from now at the top of the hour. We're going to take that for you live. There they are preparing for that to update us on this horrific shooting in Overland Park, Kansas.
The meantime, our panel is back, our experts here to talk about Flight 370, and conspiracy theories and on and on. We've added Rick Castaldo, he's a radar engineer, Miles O'Brien is with us as well.
Miles, to you first, what's your reaction to these conspiracy theories? Do they have any legs? You heard what Rick said, he goes, hey, listen, Pakistan is a viable option here.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, here's the thing, if you buy into Inmarsat, which even though we haven't seen all the data, it proprietary, it's part of an investigation, it'd be nice to see a little bit of what underlies it, but if you -- if you buy into that Inmarsat, those rings, you're kind of limited as to where the plane might be.
You know, couple the rings with the pings and you're left with, I think, a pretty good case that the airplane is at the bottom of the sea. People continue with these theories, they will continue with these theories. We're still talking about the grassy knoll -- Don.
LEMON: Yes. Absolutely.
You know, Mary, I know you like to deal in facts. Very little -- the only fact that we know is the plane is missing. These are what we're dealing with those are mathematical probability here.
SCHIAVO: Right. Absolutely. But you know, but we have to deal with what we have. You know, conspiracy theories, no matter what happens in this country, we come up with conspiracy theories, there are still people -- you know, I get mail every day from people still saying we were wrong about September 11th.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Flight 800, remember? You and I were in the green room?
SCHIAVO: Yes.
LEMON: Remember we were in the green room, and there was a gentleman in there who just went on and on --
SCHIAVO: Right.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: -- about the conspiracy theorists for 800. And I wanted to sort of save you but I had to go on and do my show, but, yes.
SCHIAVO: So no, I mean that kind of thing goes on all the time. But what's important is for investigators to just, you know, you know, stick -- stay the course, stick to the straight and narrow and stick with the facts. And we do have some facts. Inmarsat, you know, the data are facts, the pings, they are facts, and they will eventually sort through all of facts and get to the bottom of it.
The conspiracy theories are, you know, they're sort of entertaining and they will make great books some day, novels, I might say, not factual books, but, no, I don't buy into the any of the conspiracy theories.
LEMON: Ok. So I'm going to get Rick back in here.
Rick, you don't seem to think that the Pakistan theory, you don't think it's a conspiracy theory. You think it's an option because what we have is just a mathematical possibility right now that we're going on all the searching is going on over.
CASTALDO: Well, I'm going to apologize for answering the question like an engineer.
(LAUGHTER)
You did not ask me about the pings, sorry. But if you have reliable ping data, in the general area from the southern route predicted by the Inmarsat data, that is absolutely viable and credible. If it's from a credible source. For instance, the Malaysians have given us different stories, the public, as well in their own country, and throughout the world on what happened. Frankly, I don't trust anything the Malaysian government says today.
LEMON: OK. All right. Let's move on now. I want to talk -- I want to talk -- get past the conspiracy theories because again we're working on the reality that we have, and what reality is that we do have is that the mathematical data from Inmarsat, which most people do believe here, and that search area has expanded now. We have sat here, you know, for days saying, all right, the search area is big. Now they've honed it and now they've honed it in.
Clive, what do you make of the expansion of the search zone now rather than -- rather than it condensing?
CLIVE IRVING, COMMENTATOR, THE DAILY BEAST: I think it's important to acknowledge that the -- in fact the search area is expanding and contracting at the same time. It's expanding in order to look for floating wreckage on the ocean and it's contracting as a result of the work being done on the Ocean Shield and what -- I think we have to accept now that the pings are probably over, but that's not too tragic, because after the all the information flight recorder will be preserved for at least two years.
And I think the other thing that's really fascinating about all this is the combination of the Ocean Shield and this British vessel HMS Echo, because HMS Echo is doing something that's really vital, which is it's mapping the ocean floor. There no accurate relief map of that ocean floor. So the combination of these two ships together, I think, has done more to advance the search in the last few day than anything else that's happened so far, and I think that we accept the Australian beacon, the (INAUDIBLE), and I think they don't believe that failure is an option or anyone should accept failure is an option.
This search has got to go on until the wreckage but that the wreckage include the black data recorder and anything else that's at the bottom of the ocean.
LEMON: All right. Clive Irving, Mary Schiavo, Rick Castaldo, thank you very much. Our other panelists will continue on with us.
Again, we're going to continue to follow, of course, the plane, but also we'll be following the breaking news coming out of the Kansas City area, three people shot and killed at two area Jewish facilities there. One of those shot and killed is believed to be a teenage boy.
We'll be back right after a quick break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Guess who is back on CNN tonight? Anthony Bourdain, with season three of "PARTS UNKNOWN." To kick things off, he's going to India.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTHONY BOURDAIN, CNN HOST, "PARTS UNKNOWN": Kesar da Dhaba, Dhaba, meaning side of the road food stall. And there are like countless dhabas to choose from in this town, but this one is legendary.
See Tony eat vegetables. Hmm. I like it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
