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Ferry Sinks Off South Korea: Four Dead, Hundreds Of Students Are Missing; Bluefin-21 Redeployed After Technical Glitch; Al Qaeda Leaders In Brazen, Public Meeting; Putin: Ukraine "On The Brink Of Civil War"

Aired April 16, 2014 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now on the NEWSROOM, desperate rescue.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: More than 450 people were aboard the ferry, 325 of them high school students.

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COSTELLO: The huge ferry sinking into the frigid waters in just hours. Passengers being air lifted.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's the actual search area?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's one of the search areas.

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COSTELLO: Aboard an American supply ship in the hunt for Flight 370.

And breaking news from Ukraine. Armed protesters taking over a mayor's office. Russian President Putin saying the country's on the brink of war.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This amateur video purports to show Ukrainian tanks and one local risking his life to slow their advance.

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COSTELLO: America watching with laser focus.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are prepared if and when Russia escalates its actions.

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COSTELLO: You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thanks so much for joining me. We begin this hour with a new search on the water a half a world away with the United States providing help again. A rescue operation underway for nearly 300 people, most of them students, the ferry they were on sank in the waters off of South Korea, triggering a massive sea and air response.

A U.S. Navy ship is en route to the area, some 164 people have already been rescued, but at least four are known to be dead. One rescued student said he heard a loud bump and then the ship started to list. He said everyone was ordered to put on life jackets and jump. Another student said he is afraid that many of his classmates may still be trapped on board that sinking ship.

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UNIDENTIFIED STUDENT (through translator): There was an announcement telling us to sit still on the ferry, but the ferry was already sinking. Some of the students were not able to escape. The ferry started to list so we asked if we should escape now, but the announcement kept telling us to stay still. I'm so worried about the other students in our room.

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COSTELLO: The ferry left from the port city of Inchon and was headed for the resort of Jeju before going down in the Yellow Sea. Water temperatures are in the 40s. CNN's Paula Chiou has more for you.

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PAULINE CHIOU, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A desperate rescue after a crowded passenger ferry suddenly began sinking off the coast of South Korea. More than 450 people were aboard the ferry, 325 of them high school students from just outside Seoul on a class trip to a nearby resort island. One student told the Korean news network, YTN, that he heard a loud bump before the ship started to sink.

Shortly after the boat issued a distress call, helicopters and boats including a ship from the U.S. Navy Seventh Fleet scramble to assist the frightened passengers clinging to railings waiting for help. These two passengers were lifted to safety in a helicopter basket. While dozens of others were pulled out of the frigid water by rescue boats, one passenger told, YTN, that they were told to jump into the sea as the ship began to sink.

Within hours, the ship was almost completely submerged. Only a small portion of the hull was visible above the water. The weather was clear at the time and authorities are still not clear on what caused the catastrophe.

(END VIDEOTAPE) COSTELLO: Pauline Chiou reporting this morning. Divers have been trying to get into the ship to search for survivors, but the ship is under water now. They are struggling against strong currents. We'll keep you posted.

The hunt to find Malaysia Flight 370 goes on. It's now in its 40th day and officials are awaiting the return of the Bluefin 21 submersible. A technical issue caused a lengthy delay earlier today, but researchers fixed that problem and they sent the submarine back down.

You remember the Bluefin had a shortened mission on its very first day after it went deeper into the ocean than its search parameters allowed. One Navy captain tells CNN those limits could be revised.

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CAPTAIN TIMOTHY TAYLOR, U.S. NAVY, UNDERWATER SEARCH EXPERT: It's been told by the programmers above not to go to a certain depth, not to do certain things, and the bottom just got deeper than it was supposed to there. I understand that it can go deeper, manufacturers are saying it can go a little bit deeper. A little bit past its rate of depth. So we have a potential to go deeper. But right now, it's doing what it's supposed to do.

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COSTELLO: In the meantime, 14 planes and 11 ships continue their efforts on the surface looking for any sign of debris. Joining in the hunt, a U.S. Navy ship, USNS Cesar Chavez. Miguel Marquez is in Perth, Australia. You boarded that ship, what was it like?

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's a massive supply ship that the U.S. is using out here. CNN got exclusive access to it and this as the search boat on the surface of the ocean and below it is heating up.

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MARQUEZ (voice-over): An all-out push in the search for any scrap of debris from Malaysian Flight 370.

(on camera): That's the actual search area.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is one of the search areas.

MARQUEZ (voice-over): Captain Rollin Belfi, captain of the U.S. Navy supply ship, Cesar Chavez, the only U.S. ship playing a role in the hunt for the missing plane.

(on camera): What is it like to be part of this mission that has gripped the world's attention?

ROLLIN BELFI, CAPTAIN, USNS CESAR CHAVEZ: Well, first of all, we're proud to play a part. I mean, there's many moving parts on this mission. MARQUEZ (voice-over): Another moving part in the search for debris, the highly sophisticated U.S. surveillance and reconnaissance Poseidon air graft, capable of taking pictures over enormous areas detecting tiny pieces of anything floating. Australia's HMAS Success is one of several ships investigating on the ocean's surface what the P-8 sees from the air. Now with the "Cesar Chavez" in play, the search can continue nonstop.

(on camera): You're here for the foreseeable future?

BELFI: We're here as long as we're tasked by the 7th Fleet. It's a 24/7 operation.

MARQUEZ (voice-over): Like a massive floating 7-11, the Cesar Chavez, already taking on thousands of gallons of fuel and supply only hours in port here before another thousand miles, three-day journey to keep the searchers searching.

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MARQUEZ: Now the Cesar Chavez is taking on fuel right now and food, it will head out in the next probably 12 hours or so, so they can resupply those ships out there. The Bluefin 21 is down now for its third attempt at a full day of searching down at the bottom of the ocean. If things go according to plan, it should come up in the next 10 hours or so here. It's will take several hours to download that data and hopefully we'll have a read on whether or not it saw anything -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Miguel Marquez reporting live from Australia this morning. Joining me now, CNN aviation analyst and former managing director for the NTSB, Peter Goelz, and Thomas Altshuler, vice president and group general manager for Teledyne Marine Systems, which specializes in data collection and communication products for remote environment. Welcome, Gentlemen.

Good morning. Peter, the Bluefin 21 came up early today with technical problems and then they sent it back down into the water. I assume all is well?

PETER GOELZ, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, you know, this is a complex piece of equipment in a very challenging environment. It's the third mission down. You've got to expect it's going to take them a little while to fully get the thing operating to its full extent. And, you know, I didn't see anything unusual about this. Once it gets going, it's going to do the job.

COSTELLO: Thomas, we know the water is deep in that search area, but a geologist told Reuters, the sea floor is actually covered with (inaudible) ooze and I'm probably mispronouncing that I know. In other words it's covered with sludge down there and he says that's a good thing because any shiny object would show up clearly? Do you agree with that?

THOMAS ALTSHULER, TELEDYNE MARINE SYSTEMS: The first thing to know, that sludge, that ooze, whatever we want to call it is not that deep. It's just, you know, a layer on the bottom. You know, a meter would be a deep, deep layer. It's hard to know what's going on in that part of the ocean. But what you're looking at is you're looking at a side scan sonar return. So you're looking at a bounce from an object.

So when that sound wave hits that ooze it diffuses out so you don't get a really strong return and that means a metal object or even a manmade object with corners is going to reflect the sound a lot better and so it's almost like what we call in radar, a corner reflector. It's quite obvious. So it does make the searching easier.

COSTELLO: I hope so. Peter, the air search will soon come to an end, maybe even tomorrow, is there any reason that kind of search should continue?

GOELZ: I don't think there is. First of all, these guys have been working around the clock for over three weeks, and that's tough duty, it's tough on them, it's tough on the aircraft. I think the searchers have realized that the opportunity to find the wreckage has passed, the combination of a slow start, and a tropical cyclone has just made it impossible. Time to focus on the bottom of the ocean.

COSTELLO: And, Thomas, that Bluefin could be searching the bottom of the ocean for two months. This operation is getting expensive. At what point should they consider scaling back the operation?

ALTSHULER: Well, it's probably not something that I really have a good feel for. That's a decision that really is something that the community and the Malaysian airlines needs to think about, but it does, you know, move to a fact that we really have not equipped the airplanes with the types of technology they need to be found in the deep ocean. The pinger technology, which is the cue where the airplane might be isn't designed to be detected in deep water over extended period of time. The pinger is most likely not operational and we have moved on to much more arduous search process with the Bluefin 21.

COSTELLO: Peter Goelz, Thomas Altshuler, thanks to both of you. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, a new video shows a bold meeting of al Qaeda's top leaders in public outdoors, it looks like they're having a lot of fun. It's very disturbing. How could this happen so publicly. We'll talk about that next.

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COSTELLO: A disturbing new video has surfaced showing what maybe the largest and most dangerous mass gathering of al Qaeda members in years. The video shown first on CNN shows al Qaeda's top leaders at a brazen public meeting including the terror group's crown prince. House Intelligence Chairman Mike Rogers says the outdoor event shows just how brazen the group has become.

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REPRESENTATIVE MIKE ROGERS (R), MICHIGAN: The al Qaeda threat today is more diverse and more aggressive with more threat streams than we have seen even before 9/11. So we think that they're feeling empowered. The less pressure you put on them, the more they take that as a victory. The more that they believe they can get away with plotting, planning, organizing, finance, training, all the things they would need to do to strike a western target. And they have new people that would device new devices that would try to get around security protocols in airports and other places.

COSTELLO: Well, let's talk more about this. Bob Baer is a CNN national security analyst and former CIA operative. Welcome, Bob.

BOB BAER, CNN TERROR ANALYST: Hi, Carol.

COSTELLO: OK, so how concerned should we be? I mean, Al Qaeda posted this on YouTube, seems like it's a big middle finger to the United States. But does it necessarily mean we should be really, really afraid? How concerned should we be?

BAER: I think there's a couple things going on, number one is the drone attacks have been pulled way back. That's obvious in Pakistan as well as Yemen. There's been so much political pressure that they're very, very selective. Number is that al Qaeda has apparently learned how to get around our intercept capabilities.

I would imagine that that gathering, there was no cell phones to pick up, they met very quickly in an act of defiance. And number three, as far as danger goes, yes, this is the most dangerous al Qaeda group. They can get through airport security. They can get bombs on airplanes, and it's a question of where they're going to try next, special command.

COSTELLO: You can see in that video. There are blurred faces, could that mean al Qaeda is preparing an attack? What does that say to you?

BAER: Well, I think the leaders don't mind their faces on television, but the rank and file, the operatives that maybe going into Europe or even the United States don't want their picture taken obviously. They're very media savvy, al Qaeda now, they're more selective in attacks. Which tells me they have free reign in Yemen and they can plan another attack.

COSTELLO: OK, with that in mind, Al Qaeda's top bomb maker does not appear in this video, does that say something to you that he would be missing from this meeting?

BAER: Not really. I think he's probably in hiding. He has the ability to take this very high explosive called PTN and hide it. He's a technician, a very, very good one, and they want to protect him at all costs. So him showing up at a meeting like this one would have no point at all.

COSTELLO: OK, so last question for you, is al Qaeda strong enough to attack the United States again because it has not been successful since 2001?

BAER: It's been fairly well defeated. I mean, we're aware of the threat, and I'm not particularly concerned about it. It can maybe get a bomb through, but the fact that there's only been a couple of text attacks since 2001.

COSTELLO: Bob Baer, thanks for your insight. We appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, anger, confusion, the growing possibility of civil war in Ukraine. We'll talk about that next.

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COSTELLO: The struggle between Ukraine and groups of pro-Russian supporters have the former Soviet Republic teetering on the brink of civil war. At least that's what Vladimir Putin says. Ukrainian tanks have now been spotted in towns and -- some supporting Ukraine, but others like this one, backing the Russians. Those are Russian flags.

We have been getting a lot of dramatic pictures, including these from a town in eastern Ukraine, 100 miles from Russia's border. You can see a local risking his life to keep tanks from getting further in. We can't confirm it, but it looks like this man tries to stop the tanks with his hands and then lies down in front of the tanks.

This is one of -- uprisings are taking place up and down eastern Ukraine, all about 100 miles from where Russian troops have amassed at the border. Nick Paton Walsh right now is at a standoff between Ukrainian forces and local residents. He joins us on the phone. Describe the situation for us.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): It's been a bizarre day in many ways, Carol, I'm standing -- I hear an aero jet passing over me. We have been looking at the Ukraine military for quite sometimes since the protest and militants uprisings began -- the last 48 hours, they have been emerging. But here in this village, a remarkable a scene because they seemed, according to the Ukrainian soldiers I spoke to, have been driving heading towards an airfield, which Ukrainian troops took over yesterday.

But they've stopped in this village by a large crowd of local residents who you just saw in that video, almost putting themselves between these Ukrainian armored vehicles and the path they were headed and now they're about 10 to 12 of them swamped by local citizens. They have kept them here for now, despite the fact that their commander of the Ukrainian troops has asked them to leave, they have kept them here until the army -- a tense Ukrainian soldiers, they said they just want to war carry on their way, perhaps go back the way they came.

We have seen a local police chief come over and speak to them. I'm now seeing over to one side, just about to drop behind a Hill, a Ukrainian helicopter circling as well. So it's clear there's Ukrainian military activity here. But the problem is when they move on the ground through local villages here, they run into these groups of residents that stop them in their tracks. To their credit, the Ukrainian mill -- not continuing this so-called anti-terrorism operation. COSTELLO: I just wanted to ask you a question about these residents, they do live in the town, because we always hear that Russia puts crowds of people up to this kind of action. Who are these people?

WALSH: For the most part, that I can see here, these are locals. There may be some who are organizing this activity, but what I'm seeing around here are for the most part, angry local residents. This is an impoverished part of Eastern Ukraine. This may be based on misinformation because a lot of pro-Russian information around here suggest that those in Kiev are somehow linked to far right extremists, which is the most powerful, pretty much -- there is severe reasons for them in their own minds to feel distrustful of Kiev and that manifests in the disruption we're witnessing here.

But it is peaceful, but it's not exactly what Kiev wanted to see tight when they sent their most elite troops in. They're unable to move because they're surrounded by angry residents who don't want them to be anywhere.

COSTELLO: Hard to rescue people who don't really want to be rescued. Nick Paton Walsh, thanks so much. For more on this, I'm joined by Christopher Hill. He's the dean of international studies at the University of Denver and a former ambassador to Iraq, South Korea and Poland. Welcome, Ambassador. Were you able to hear Nick Paton Walsh's report?

CHRISTOPHER HILL, INTERNATIONAL STUDIES DEAN, UNIVERSITY OF DENVER: Yes, I did. And that is a very common pattern, you move a U.N. Convoy through some Serb village and all the Serb villagers will be out there blocking the convoy and then the question was what to do after that. I mean, clearly these things are organized, but they are very much locally organized with some help from outside, and probably from the Russians themselves.

And it's also a very poor part of Eastern Ukraine and probably there are indeed people there who feel they would have a better economic future in Russia than in a pure past of Eastern Ukraine that does not trust Kiev. One of the narratives we have had is that Ukraine wants to join the west, because that's where a better economic future is, but in fact there are these parts of Eastern Ukraine, where they actually believe there is a better future with Russian.

COSTELLO: Which puts the United States in a tough spot. There's going to be a meeting tomorrow in Geneva with all the parties concerned, but not many people think anything is going to come of that meeting.

HILL: I think it's going to be tough to make any substantial progress. First of all, I think it's very good news that our president is in touch with Vladimir Putin. I suspect the conversations are not going very well. But I think it's very important to keep that communication.

I think the second thing that's been very important is there has been remarkable solidarity among the European allies and Europe Union members with the United States. I think the issue ahead is the United States has a tendency to want to push for more sanctions. The Europeans are not in that mode, so that is the kind of tension where I think the Europeans want the U.S. to, you know, thread a lightly on sanctions.

My own view is there needs to be continuation of the efforts that NATO's been engaged in, which is to shore up the eastern flank of NATO, make sure countries like Poland, the Baltic States, et cetera, really do feel like they're full-fledged members of NATO. And I think NATO is doing a very good job on that.

COSTELLO: General Mark Kimmit says that the United States and Europe is not showing a strong enough front. In fact they are allowing President Putin to bully them.