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Benghazi Panel; Obama on V.A. Problems; Pelosi Nominates Panel

Aired May 21, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf, thank you. Do not go too far. I want to bring you into this discussion, this breaking news here that we have at CNN.

After nearly two weeks of deciding whether or not they want to boycott this new committee to investigate the attack in Benghazi, the House Select Committee on Benghazi to be precise, the on that, of course, the attack that killed four Americans, we now know that Democrats are announcing they will participate.

So you see the live pictures. Any minute now we will see House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi step behind that podium and reveal specifically which Democratic lawmakers she will be appointing to this House Select Committee on Benghazi.

Let's have a huge discussion on this, the ramifications, politically, et cetera, with Wolf Blitzer, who's standing by, and also Mike Lillis, congressional reporter for "The Hill."

And, Mike, let me just begin with you. Do we know specifically what led to this decision on behalf of Leader Pelosi to say, yes, we will participate?

MIKE LILLIS, CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER, "THE HILL": Well, it had been a tough question for the Democrats. And, in the end, I think very simply they decided that they would rather have a seat at the table of this investigation than be on the sidelines. It had divided the caucus over the past two weeks. There was one camp that said, we have to boycott it. If we participate, we're legitimizing something that's essentially a witch hunt, that Republicans just want to embarrass the White House ahead of the elections. There was another camp that said, hey, wait a minute, this panel is going to have subpoena power, it's going to bring in witnesses, it could bring in Hillary Clinton. If we don't have Democrats at the table, some voice to defend our allies in the White House, the State Department, President Obama, then we really just seeded too much power and I think, in the end, Nancy Pelosi agreed and that's what we're about to watch.

BALDWIN: Wolf, as we wait to hear from Leader Pelosi, and specifically she will be naming names from members of Congress who will be sitting on this select committee, what kind of ramifications, if any, would there be for these members of Congress, politically speaking, sitting on this committee? WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST, THE SITUATION ROOM: Well, I don't think there are going to be any negative ramifications because these are all experienced Democrats who will be on the panel. There will be seven Republicans, there will be five Democrats. And if you take a look at the five Democrats, they've already released the list of who they will be, some are very experienced in these matters. Some have been involved in other hearings involving Benghazi. And you see the five up there. Elijah Cummings, for example, he's the ranking member on that House committee. Darrell Issa, the special government affairs committee that's been looking into Benghazi. And Elijah Cummings is from his perspective trying to keep Darrell Issa honest.

But take a look at some of the others. Adam Smith, ranking member of the Armed Services Committee, Adam Schiff, he's a key member of the appropriations subcommittee on state and foreign operations, a permanent member of the intelligence committee. Linda Sanchez, she's a member of the House Ways and Means Committee, the Subcommittee on Oversight. Tammy Duckworth, she's a member of the Armed Services Committee, also the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform.

So all of them are deeply experienced. They have all spent a lot of time looking into earlier investigations into Benghazi. And the argument, as Mike points out, was very simple, if you don't participate, the seven Republicans are going to do whatever they want. That won't be a defender, if you will, of Hillary Clinton when she comes to testify if they call her or others who come to testify. So, in the end, Nancy Pelosi decided, you know what, better to be at the table than to be away.

BALDWIN: Gentlemen, stay with me. I want to bring in one more voice, our chief congressional correspondent Dana Bash.

And, Dana, as we await Leader Pelosi to speak, we've now seen the faces of these different -- five different Democrats who will be sitting on this House select committee. Just -- do you agree that basically this is about having a seat at the table for the Dems?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's absolutely the reason that they made this decision. But I really can't emphasize enough how much of a rift there was within the House Democratic caucus about the strategy here. It has been going on for over two weeks. It lasted through the entire week last week when they were home on recess, trying to come to terms with exactly which way to go.

There's not a philosophical divide among House Democrats. They, almost to a person (ph), believe that the whole concept of this select committee on Benghazi is politically motivated. The question was political strategy, whether or not it was the right thing to do to get involved, whether that looks like a rubber stamp or blessing the idea of this committee, or to just boycott and risk, as others have said, not having a seat at the table and not participating.

The other thing that needs to be talked about here is Hillary Clinton because -

BALDWIN: Yes. Yes. BASH: Democrats on Capitol Hill think that it's about her and they don't want her to be out there perhaps without Democrats defending her.

BALDWIN: Can we talk about, though, as far as the investigation goes, and I want to hear from every single one of you -- Wolf, let me go back to you. And when it comes to this investigation, what are some of the unanswered questions as it pertains to Benghazi?

BLITZER: I think the major question that the Republicans want answered is, people at the White House, what was their direct involvement from the president, the vice president, the national security adviser and others on down. They've gotten a lot of information from what was going on at the State Department. They've gotten a lot of documents and information, what was going on at the U.S. military, the Pentagon, the Africa command and other U.S. military operations in the intelligence community, they've gotten significant information. But the Republicans believe there's still a lot of information out there that the administration has not made available, specifically information as to what the White House was doing, what the president of the United States specifically was doing. That's what they say they want, and that's presumably what they're hoping to get in the course of the select committee hearings.

BALDWIN: Mike, what else?

LILLIS: We had talked with Darrell Issa. Darrell Issa, of course, has been conducting a probe into this for over a year. He's the head of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee. And he has very much what Wolf just said, the focus is now shifting to the White House. There were four different committees in the House that had looked at it under their jurisdiction. But the sense was that after the Ben Rhodes e-mail came out, this damning e-mail where the accusation was they were coaching different officials to go on - on the air, on the Sunday shows -

BALDWIN: Uh-huh. The talking points.

LILLIS: The talking points issue. Once that e-mail came out, John Boehner, who had resisted the special committee for months and months and months, even in the face of conservative pressure, flipped the switch and said, now we've got to do it because the White House is involved and this committee is going to focus on the White House. I think Wolf was exactly right.

BALDWIN: OK. I'm keeping my eye on that podium. We're going to hit pause until we see Leader Pelosi. We want to move on because we have to talk about this other major story out of Washington. So just stand by to all of you. Stand by.

President Obama today finally responds to this alleged cover-up involving veterans medical care that CNN revealed. Listen, heads may roll over this. But for now, one of them will not be that of Veteran Affairs Secretary Eric Shinseki. The president, today, stood behind the embattled ex-general under fire after CNN reported 40 vets died while waiting for care at a V.A. hospital. And now you have -- look at the map, we'll show you -- 26 V.A. facilities nationwide now under investigation for allegedly faking wait lists or other records, all the while possibly risking the health of people who have dedicated their lives to this country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If these allegations prove to be true, it is dishonorable, it is disgraceful and I will not tolerate it, period. Here is what I discussed with Secretary Shinseki this morning. First, anybody found to have manipulated or falsified records at V.A. facilities has to be held accountable. The inspector general at the V.A. has launched investigations into the Phoenix V.A. and other facilities. And some individuals have already been put on administrative leave. I know that people are angry and want swift reckoning. I sympathize with that. But we have to let the investigators do their job and get to the bottom of what happened.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: And we have to talk about this. Mike Lillis, you're wearing a second hat for us here, we'll talk about this story, congressional reporter from "The Hill" rejoining us, and CNN's Drew Griffin live in Phoenix. It was Drew and this team that broke this story wide open.

So, Drew, just beginning with you. You know, President Obama, he says he will not stand for this. But we know that the White House has been aware of some of these problems for years. We knew he had to address this publicly, but what really did we learn today?

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Brooke, I think we learned that even though these delays in care and veterans death have been well documented, even though there have already been multiple investigations and reports that show manipulation of records and hidden wait times going on for years, and even though it's obvious, based on our current reporting, that the problems persist and may even be getting worse, the president, at least for now, is sticking by his man who for five years has failed to do anything about the problem. The president, I thought today, was echoing what Eric Shinseki told the Senate last week was, you know, I'm mad as hell, but have patience and we'll get to the bottom of it. Many veterans groups have simply run out of patience.

Brooke.

BALDWIN: He may be standing by his man, but, Mike, when we saw Obama today speaking before members of the press corps who was not there, was not, Secretary Shinseki, what's the significance in that, do you think?

LILLIS: Well, he doesn't want to float the guy out there. He's - he is the embattled one. He just testified before the Senate. So he's made some public statements but they weren't received very well. It certainly didn't appease any of the Republicans who immediately, after Obama was done speaking, were shooting out e-mail blasts to reporters saying, you know, too little, too late, this guy still needs to go. And so you're just not seeing - you know, he doesn't - he doesn't have the public face and Obama thought that this rose to the level where he has to finally address it.

I think interesting to note that he -- every time Obama said, you know, I - I still -- I'm still with - I'm still with Shinseki, he's still my guy, he's still interested in fixing the problem, but we're not ruling out, you know, getting rid of anybody who committed wrongdoing, as high as that is going to go. So he hasn't ruled out anything at all and we'll wait and see, but this guy's in trouble, I think.

BALDWIN: Drew, what about - speaking of Phoenix, you're in Phoenix, and that was the original location where you discovered - you and your reporting discovered that that's where these fake wait lists existed. And so now we have learned that the - you know, that the Phoenix V.A. director got a pretty nice bonus last month in addition to last year, correct?

GRIFFIN: Yes, that's right. I think this is what in D.C. they call bad optics. Out here in Phoenix, they call it disgusting. The director of the Phoenix V.A., in April, at the very same time the inspector general was out here investigating allegations of hidden wait lists and bad management, received an $8,500 bonus. This is just last month. The V.A. has explained this to Congress as some sort of a low-level clerical error. But, again, it is, as I said, Brooke, bad optics and, here, disgusting.

BALDWIN: Disgusting. It is disgusting.

Drew Griffin, thank you so much for your reporting. Mike Lillis, thank you. Stay with me. We'll keep a close eye on what we're seeing on Capitol Hill, watching and waiting for House Leader Nancy Pelosi to speak specifically about these Democrats named to the House Select Committee on Benghazi. That's ahead.

Also ahead, she says armed men killed her dad, her brother, burned down her church, burned down her school and today she is on American soil testifying about her encounter with the very same terror group responsible for kidnapping hundreds of school girls. You will hear directly from her.

Plus, any moment now, President Obama will be welcoming the Super Bowl champs to the White House. What will Richard Sherman say? Remember him? That's coming up next. Stay with me.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: All right. Here we go. Busting out of commercial break, taking you straight to Capitol Hill. House Leader Nancy Pelosi and those five Democrats that have now been selected to sit on that House Select Committee on Benghazi. Take a listen.

REP. NANCY PELOSI, MINORITY LEADER: To their families or our country. We had hoped that the House Republican leaders would not go down the path forming a select committee. We've already been there. Eight reviews have been conducted in House and Senate, 25,000 documents released, millions of taxpayer dollars spent. It was not necessary to put the families or our country through this partisan exercise once again.

Over the past two weeks, we have engaged in good faith discussions with Speaker Boehner on the shape and standards of the select committee. We had hoped for a level of fairness and transparency and balance, especially considering the subject matter. We were not able to reach any agreement. Regrettably, the Republican approach does not prevent the unacceptable and repeated abuses committed by Chairman Issa in any meaningful way. That is all the more reason for Democrats to participate in the committee, to be there to fight for fair hearing and process, to try to bring some openness and transparency to what's going on. What is the purpose of this investigation? What is the timetable? What are the milestones? What are they hoping to achieve?

I could have argued this either way. Why give any validity to this effort. But I do think it is important for the American people to have the pursuit of these questions done in as fair and open and balanced way as possible. That simply would not be possible leaving it to the Republicans. That's why I'm appointing my distinguished colleagues here today to serve on the select committee. I'm so proud of them and all that they do for the American people in the Congress of the United States and for their constituents at home.

Congressman Elijah Cummings will be the ranking member. He is the ranking member on the Committee of Oversight and Government Reform. Congressman Adam Smith, the ranking member on Armed Services Committee, has agreed to serve. Congressman Adam Schiff, Committee on Appropriations, Subcommittee on State and Foreign Operations, very important in this discussion, and is a member of the Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence. Congresswoman Linda Sanchez, on the Committee of Ways and Means, and on Subcommittee of Oversight, Congresswoman Tammy Duckworth, serving on the Armed Services Committee and the Committee on Government and -- Oversight and Government Reform, Mr. Cummings' committee. With their leadership and persistence, we will do right by the families of the victims.

And by the way, two families have communicated with us saying, don't take us down this path again. Why are they -- is this being done? We hope that we can shine a light on where our focus should be, preventing tragedy like Benghazi from ever happening again. I told the speaker in a phone call that I just had with him that I'm hopeful that Ranking Member Cummings and Chairman Gowdy can come to some better terms on how we proceed. And it is with that hope and his great leadership that I present the chairman, our ranking member on this committee, Mr. Cummings.

REP. ELIJAH CUMMINGS (D), : Thank you very much.

BALDWIN: All right, so, Gloria Borger and Dana Bash, let me bring both you in this.

And, Gloria, this whole issue -- we heard Leader Pelosi specifically say, she wants her five members, five Democrats to be there, to fight for this fair hearing and process. And that's the point of a column I just read of yours, right?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. BALDWIN: I mean they are calling this whole thing a witch hunt. That they don't want to legitimize the process. But if they're not there, to your point, they can't defend it.

BORGER: Right. And, in the end, you know, she said she could have argued it both ways. But in the end, she decided that she'd rather be inside the room than not inside the room. And this is really important, as Dana knows, which is that you want to have the access to documents. You want to be able to form your own narrative. You don't want any surprises, particularly when Hillary Clinton could be called to testify and she could be the Democratic nominee for president. She's a big girl. She can take care of herself. But better to have some people on the committee who can actually know what's going to occur, and also object on the part of the Democrats as things, you know, as thing move along, at least try and represent that point of view because what the Republicans are doing is trying to motivate their base to get out to vote and Benghazi's a big issue for them and the Democrats feel, now that they have to be there to represent their point of view for their voters.

BALDWIN: Republicans still have a lot of questions as we were discussing just a little while ago.

BORGER: Sure. And they're real questions. Yes.

BALDWIN: Absolutely.

And, Dana, just - and we're also looking at these five members of -- these are veteran members of Congress, correct, who will be sitting on this committee? When will they sit? When will these hearings begin? Do we even know?

BASH: We don't know the answer to that. It's a great question. A lot of it depends on the chairman of the select committee, Trey Gowdy, when he decides things are going to get going. They are likely going to use staff, which is a critical part of all these investigations, staff that have already been a part of the four committees that have already been investigating in the House.

But, you know, to Gloria's point about Hillary Clinton, I know I keep going back to this, but I can't underscore enough how much Democrats on Capitol Hill think that this is -- that's what this is all about. Look, you asked what else they can look into, what are they looking at? Certainly a big part of it is what they allege as a cover-up in the White House, but the other is an alleged cover-up or inability to do the right job at the State Department.

And it's certainly about wounding Hillary Clinton for 2016. And that is why the Democrats who are going to be in there, the Democrats that they chose, are not considered flame-throwing partisans, even though they're going to have to put partisan hats on at times, they're considered serious, substantive people. And that was a big part of the decision making in choosing these people. There's no question about that in talking to Democratic sources on Capitol Hill.

BORGER: You know, and one way or another, Benghazi's going to come up because, as you know, Hillary Clinton has a book that's coming out in mid-June.

BALDWIN: A memoir, right.

BORGER: I find it hard to believe that she wouldn't address Benghazi in some detail, in some personal detail in that book. And so it even makes it more likely that they would call her particularly since she'll be - since she'll be writing about it. But you will know in advance some more details that we didn't know before these hearings get started.

BALDWIN: OK. All right, ladies, thank you so much.

BORGER: Sure.

BALDWIN: We have to go from you to another event happening not too far away at the White House. President Obama, flanked by your latest Super Bowl champions, the Seattle Seahawks. Let's eavesdrop.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: A quiet, reserved bunch called the Seattle Seahawks. World champions. Best football team in America. I considered letting Sherman up here to the podium today, giving him the mic, but, you know, we've got to go in a little bit.

Obviously we've got some big Seahawks fans here today. That includes - I know there's some members of Congress here who are huge Seahawks fans. We've also got the secretary of interior, Sally Jewell, who's a big Seahawks fan. We've got Seattle's mayor, Ed Murray, in the house, a big Seahawks fan.

I want to congratulate Coach Pete Carroll for his outstanding leadership. I think those of us who, you know, are in leadership positions across disciplines, we're always looking at folks who do things the right way. I think it's pretty clear that Coach Carroll does things the right way and we're very proud of him.

Seahawks owner Paul Allen, who has done a great job. Congratulations to him. We've got General Manager John Schneider, who put together this outstanding organization. But I'm curious where the championship belt is today, John.

We are - we are here to celebrate - we're here to celebrate the first Super Bowl victory for the city of Seattle. During the regular season, the Seahawks tied for the best record, suffocating defense led to -- led the league in points allowed, yards allowed, interceptions, takeaways, turnover margin. They beat the rival 49ers. I knew - I knew you guys would clap on that one. In the NFC championship game. And then dominated one of the best offenses in the NFL, beating the Broncos by 35 points.

Of course, I don't need to tell you how outstanding the Seahawks are because they did a pretty good job of describing themselves as outstanding during the year. You may have heard about the legion of boom. You know, Richard Sherman and Earl Thomas, Kam Chancellor and Byron Maxwell, who combined to form the best secondary in football. You had a dominating defensive line with guys like Michael Bennett, Red Bryant, Brandon Mebane and Brandon Mebane's belly roll dance, you know, all combining to -- we can't do that here in the White House.

There's Super Bowl MVP Malcolm Smith. We've got breakout star Percy Harvin. He's not here today, but we've got to give props to beast mode, Marshawn Lynch. I am sorry that Marshawn's not here because I just want to say how much I admire his approach to the press. I wanted to get some tips from him. It's about the action.

And then there's Russell Wilson, who you may not recognize because his lochs are shorn. He has cut his hair. Where's Russell?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right here.

OBAMA: There he is. I was telling him he looks OK this way, too, you know. He doesn't have a peanut head or anything, but - so Russell has won more games through his first two seasons than any quarterback in history. (INAUDIBLE). He also became only the second African-American quarterback ever to win a Super Bowl. And the best part about it is nobody commented on it, which tells you the progress he has made over (INAUDIBLE).

And part of the reason that I think Russell inspired a lot of folks is he's been proving the doubters wrong for a very long time. For years folks said he would be too short to succeed as quarterback in the NFL. Five quarterbacks were drafted ahead of him, which is a familiar story for a lot of these Seahawks. You've got three starters in the secondary who were taken fifth round or lower. Nineteen players on the roster weren't drafted at all. Last year, a pundit had the gal to call the receiving core "pedestrian," which I heard made angry Doug Baldwin even angrier.

So let me just say, as a guy who was elected president named Barack Obama, I root for the underdogs. And - and so - so seeing folks overcome the odds excites me. But it also excites me when you see the whole being greater than the sum of its part. And that's what team is all about. And this is a team. And it's not just about football. These guys have been overcoming adversity off the field as well.

You've got fullback Derrick Coleman, who's been legally deaf since he was three years old. You know, I joke about Richard Sherman, but, you know, he grew up in Compton amid some wonderful people, but also gangs and drugs and guns. His dad has to wake up before 4:00 a.m. every day to drive a garbage truck. But because of his dad's hard work and his family and his mom and, you know, Richard ended up earning a 4.2 GPA in high school. Won a scholarship to Stanford. You know, he showed kids from his neighborhood that they could make it. And, you know, if he seems a little brash, it's because you've got to have attitude sometimes if you are going to overcome some of this adversity. And the fact that he still goes back to inspire high schoolers for higher goals and making better choices, you know, that's all-star behavior.

And he's not the only one giving back. You know, Russell spends every Tuesday, even during the season, visiting sick kids at the Seattle Children's Hospital. Coach Carroll's Better Seattle and the Better L.A. Organization works to keep at-risk youth away from drugs and violence. Paul Allen's Family Foundation has given millions of dollars for medical research into traumatic brain injuries, which obviously is a concern in the NFL, but also is a concern to our troops, and people all across the country.

As a team, the Seahawks raised more than $700,000 this year for causes like supporting our troops and strengthening our schools. And that spirit of working hard and giving back has endeared this team to its fans in a way that most cities can't replicate. Now, part of it is you all have that stadium that is kind of cheating because it's so loud. You know, you hired some physicist to make it so - you know, (INAUDIBLE) you know, there are a lot of really smart people, you know, at Microsoft and up in those places that can design these things.

So we can't talk about the Seahawks without talking about the 12th man. And, you know, last season, the 12 set a record, not once but twice for the loudest crowd noise in history. Now, history is a long time, so that's really loud. So loud on multiple occasions they've actually created minor earthquakes, which is disturbing and you should think about that.

After the Super Bowl, when they had the chance to celebrate, they let loose in true Seattle style. And while some got a little carried away, there's actually video of a huge group of Seahawks fans interrupting their celebration to wait for the walk sign before crossing an intersection. So, that's Seattle for you.

So congratulations to the 12s, congratulations to the players, the coaches, the staff, the owners. Congratulations to the Seattle Seahawks and the whole city for an outstanding season.